Nice one Jon! My favurite game :D Also, the Solo game is awsome, the automa deck is made by automa factory who made the system for Schyte, viticulture also. But here it is 2 cards instead of 1 every round, might not sound that different but its a HUGE improvment! So I recommend you try it out! Also solo is nice cause of no downtime right ;)
Excellent review! Sounds like quite a few people agree with your sentiments. Brilliant thought about the Transmogrifiers being part of an expansion. I know I underutilized them my first play as well.
4 players in gp is probably less restrictive than TM, thanks to the 2 ways to wildcard your way out- a cube strategy to gaia your way out, or a power strategy to transdim your way out. Springing for a terraforming track is much more rewarding with the various rewards that scale up on a per planet type basis too. Easy fix for teaching players about transdims is to just force terrans on them. With all of the prep work out of the way, the internal thought process becomes "ok, I have this, I'm obligated to find a good way to use it".
The issue with the fourth player being at a disadvantage is somewhat overcome by using the setup variant wherein the player who will choose last gets to rotate the game tiles freely before anyone chooses. That way, if the setup seems to favor one faction heavily, the last player can alter the board to remove any apparent biases. Of course, this doesn't help a group of new players very much, as they'd likely not have a firm grasp on which factions might be favored. Furthermore, being the first one to choose a round booster is also a significant advantage for the last player. The problem with 2 out of 4 players necessarily being adjacent on the planet wheel is a concern, but with the gaia and transdim planets being independent of the color wheel, this is less problematic than it was in Terra Mystica. Some of the factions simply don't care about the color wheel as much as others (both of the blue factions, for instance).
@Jon Thanks for the idea of using the 2p board on 3p games. I felt the same. I'm probably going to start a few house rules on items, because it seems like the action you want is always just out of your range. QIC and range just always seem to be too hard to get until the later rounds (or if you have the right faction). If there were one less tech track to worry about, I think the game would be much better. I'm sure a lot of these concerns would go away if I played 20-30 games, but until then I'll need to make resources easier to get since I am still new to the game.
Regarding the smaller map, the one I'm refering to isn't quite the 2p map. There is a 3p smaller map variant in the back of the rulebook that has you use 2 less boards than the standard 4p set instead of the 3 less for 2p.
Thanks for the review. But honestly. I disagree on yr command. This is just a great satisfying big strategic game. And needs a lot of plays to figure iT all out. But all the Tracks en gaia planets just needs to be in This game right away. Its a game you need to play Often to let iT Shine to the max! Dont be afraid to go heavy!
I knew that my opinion wouldn't be held by all, especially people who lean towards heavier games vs medium weight ones. Believe me, it has nothing to do with fear and everything to do with fun which is subjective and different for each person. I'd love to play this one often but it's length and crunchiness get in the way for us, those I play games with area not often in the mood for a 3+ hour brain burn even if it's an amazing game like this one is.
my friends owns a copy and, i feel the game does scares ppl away to play it a second time like evry one says, this is a game definitely need more plays to figure out a right path, but my group was like only meet once or twice per week (and sometimes dont), gaming session is short too, i can see is hard to bring the game again on table despite the fact you cant get anything right in first playing, not to mention there are so many stuffs and icon to look out for that said, i willing to play it again if give me some time to play few solos and understand the whole game, figure a best way to explain the game and find the correct person to play with for me this is a heavy game definitely dedicated to those hardcores only
This was both a fantastic rules explanation and a great review. Liked and subscribed. I just got this game recently and played one game with my wife so far, and we didn't even touch the gaiaformers, lol. I do think any racial imbalance can be fixed with bidding.
You are likely right about bidding once a group is experienced, and it's possible that simply being experienced will make the reverse draft of races good enough to balance things out too I suppose.
I won't rule it out, but I don't have any current plans. If I do it will likely be a 2p game, and even then I worry that it'll likely turn into one of the longest recording sessions I've done due to the amount of analysis needed. I'd certainly like to, but I've prioritized getting 2-3 other videos out in the time it'd likely take to get one Gaia playthrough done. I may put it up for the vote next month and see if my patrons want it the most, in which case I'd obviously make the time.
Thank you so much for this analysis! I was about to buy it by looking at other reviews and just the amount it has to offer. I still think this game is very appealing in many ways but it is definetly not for me. 60 bucks saved.
I haven't gotten this one played in years unfortunately, but we still have it in our collection. I think I still enjoy it more than Terra Mystica (which I also haven't played in years) and would like to get it played again at some point soon. So many games, so little time.
Agree about the Gaia Project / Transdim terraforming mechanic. I have actually played several games without utilizing it because it feels so clunky and tacked on.
Here's an idea from your first negative point: in a game with new players, during setup just cover all the transdim planets with a gaia planet tile. Then everyone can ignore gaiaforming, and still can build on the "wild" green planets. To do this, you would have to make sure no one plays the Terrans, but maybe that is a good idea anyway.
That is an interesting idea, though I imagine balance would still be seriously off since some of the factions make green cubes far easier than others (one doesn't make any at all).
It would make QIC too strong tho... especially if there would be gaia scoring end game condition. Personally, I did not found Transdim mechanic to be so confusing. I mean, there is still a lot of rules, but it doesn't extra popped for me as being very hard to understand. For me the most convoluted thing, was whole technology tiles vs advancing on tech track. Especially how to get advanced technology.
To a certain degree, yeah heavy games are all about making you think hard which can take time. That being said, I feel like there's a limit to how much AP is socially acceptable and some games seem to make it easy for me and other people I play with get right up to that line (and sometimes over it).
About Terra Mystica's Cults: you are inaccurate when you say something along the lines of "the cults just give points". Nope. They also dictate round income and give immediate power, all which can really influence the game outcome massively. About negative number 1... I agree it isn't the simplest mechanic, but transdim and gaia planets (or something like them) are a necessary mechanic in order to have more planets generally available for the players. So this had to be here, otherwise the map would need to be more packed with planets and the game would be EXACTLY like Terra Mystica in a lot more ways (besides being a "more symmetric version of Terra Mystica" in a lot of ways). I think that is more of a different (and less intuitive) than a negative. The real negative that could be still be argued here is that the game is HARD to teach - because there is too much going on, which is undeniable - and the gaiaformation doesn't help here and a lot of stuff is hard to remember - especially forming federations and getting advanced techs. There is just too much detail to everything. The game is heavy for a lot of reasons and that is just one of them. There is only so much that can be streamlined. And how hard (and sometimes not intuitive) the game is is the only real negative I have for this game. About negative number 2... Yeah, that is just you playing badly. I'm sorry. I've won at times after being 30+ points behind; this isn't really the biggest issue the game has. This is an issue of your planning/lack of experience, aka, you perceive an issue where there is none. And that is OK, the game is too hard to be understood easily for the first ~10 plays. Besides I can feel that your group doesn't use the Gaiaformation technology properly, since you report Terrans always winning (they ARE a solid top half faction, but they aren't generally considered the best, while being one of the easiest and one of the most plastic ones). It is the single most important tech bump, besides having at least 2 for range. You should try to think more about scoring bug in the last 3 rounds (SPECIALLY the last round). Also about 4 players... You are right. The fourth player has quite a bit of a disadvantage. Is that VERY BAD? Not really, but it'll show in competitive settings for sure.
I wasn't particularly impressed with Clans of Caledonia. It is more like Terra Mystica light, plus a market mechanism, and that isn't really what I was looking for.
'I am always playing with myself.' Lol.
Nice one Jon! My favurite game :D Also, the Solo game is awsome, the automa deck is made by automa factory who made the system for Schyte, viticulture also. But here it is 2 cards instead of 1 every round, might not sound that different but its a HUGE improvment! So I recommend you try it out! Also solo is nice cause of no downtime right ;)
Excellent review! Sounds like quite a few people agree with your sentiments. Brilliant thought about the Transmogrifiers being part of an expansion. I know I underutilized them my first play as well.
Great stuff, loved the in depth review.
nice review. helped me have a better idea of the game
4 players in gp is probably less restrictive than TM, thanks to the 2 ways to wildcard your way out- a cube strategy to gaia your way out, or a power strategy to transdim your way out. Springing for a terraforming track is much more rewarding with the various rewards that scale up on a per planet type basis too.
Easy fix for teaching players about transdims is to just force terrans on them. With all of the prep work out of the way, the internal thought process becomes "ok, I have this, I'm obligated to find a good way to use it".
The issue with the fourth player being at a disadvantage is somewhat overcome by using the setup variant wherein the player who will choose last gets to rotate the game tiles freely before anyone chooses. That way, if the setup seems to favor one faction heavily, the last player can alter the board to remove any apparent biases. Of course, this doesn't help a group of new players very much, as they'd likely not have a firm grasp on which factions might be favored.
Furthermore, being the first one to choose a round booster is also a significant advantage for the last player.
The problem with 2 out of 4 players necessarily being adjacent on the planet wheel is a concern, but with the gaia and transdim planets being independent of the color wheel, this is less problematic than it was in Terra Mystica. Some of the factions simply don't care about the color wheel as much as others (both of the blue factions, for instance).
@Jon Thanks for the idea of using the 2p board on 3p games. I felt the same.
I'm probably going to start a few house rules on items, because it seems like the action you want is always just out of your range. QIC and range just always seem to be too hard to get until the later rounds (or if you have the right faction).
If there were one less tech track to worry about, I think the game would be much better. I'm sure a lot of these concerns would go away if I played 20-30 games, but until then I'll need to make resources easier to get since I am still new to the game.
Regarding the smaller map, the one I'm refering to isn't quite the 2p map. There is a 3p smaller map variant in the back of the rulebook that has you use 2 less boards than the standard 4p set instead of the 3 less for 2p.
Thanks for the review. But honestly. I disagree on yr command. This is just a great satisfying big strategic game. And needs a lot of plays to figure iT all out. But all the Tracks en gaia planets just needs to be in This game right away. Its a game you need to play Often to let iT Shine to the max! Dont be afraid to go heavy!
I knew that my opinion wouldn't be held by all, especially people who lean towards heavier games vs medium weight ones. Believe me, it has nothing to do with fear and everything to do with fun which is subjective and different for each person. I'd love to play this one often but it's length and crunchiness get in the way for us, those I play games with area not often in the mood for a 3+ hour brain burn even if it's an amazing game like this one is.
my friends owns a copy and, i feel the game does scares ppl away to play it a second time
like evry one says, this is a game definitely need more plays to figure out a right path, but my group was like only meet once or twice per week (and sometimes dont), gaming session is short too, i can see is hard to bring the game again on table despite the fact you cant get anything right in first playing, not to mention there are so many stuffs and icon to look out for
that said, i willing to play it again if give me some time to play few solos and understand the whole game, figure a best way to explain the game and find the correct person to play with
for me this is a heavy game definitely dedicated to those hardcores only
Great review. This game looks amazing, but my probably a little too hardcore for my game group.
This was both a fantastic rules explanation and a great review. Liked and subscribed. I just got this game recently and played one game with my wife so far, and we didn't even touch the gaiaformers, lol. I do think any racial imbalance can be fixed with bidding.
You are likely right about bidding once a group is experienced, and it's possible that simply being experienced will make the reverse draft of races good enough to balance things out too I suppose.
tbh..best playthroughs online. Please do Mage Knight Extended
Jon, any chance you will do a full play through of Gaia project?
I won't rule it out, but I don't have any current plans. If I do it will likely be a 2p game, and even then I worry that it'll likely turn into one of the longest recording sessions I've done due to the amount of analysis needed. I'd certainly like to, but I've prioritized getting 2-3 other videos out in the time it'd likely take to get one Gaia playthrough done. I may put it up for the vote next month and see if my patrons want it the most, in which case I'd obviously make the time.
I hope this can happen in the near future :)
@@GettingGames Chess clock... 🤔🤣
Great video! Thanks so much!
Thank you so much for this analysis! I was about to buy it by looking at other reviews and just the amount it has to offer. I still think this game is very appealing in many ways but it is definetly not for me. 60 bucks saved.
What is your opinion on the game after all this time? Do you like it more or less than you did initially?
I haven't gotten this one played in years unfortunately, but we still have it in our collection. I think I still enjoy it more than Terra Mystica (which I also haven't played in years) and would like to get it played again at some point soon. So many games, so little time.
Agree about the Gaia Project / Transdim terraforming mechanic. I have actually played several games without utilizing it because it feels so clunky and tacked on.
Here's an idea from your first negative point: in a game with new players, during setup just cover all the transdim planets with a gaia planet tile. Then everyone can ignore gaiaforming, and still can build on the "wild" green planets. To do this, you would have to make sure no one plays the Terrans, but maybe that is a good idea anyway.
That is an interesting idea, though I imagine balance would still be seriously off since some of the factions make green cubes far easier than others (one doesn't make any at all).
It would make QIC too strong tho... especially if there would be gaia scoring end game condition. Personally, I did not found Transdim mechanic to be so confusing. I mean, there is still a lot of rules, but it doesn't extra popped for me as being very hard to understand. For me the most convoluted thing, was whole technology tiles vs advancing on tech track. Especially how to get advanced technology.
Still playing TM, then Fire&Ice then I hope for price to drop to get the Gaia
Isn't having close encounters with AP is the objective of heavy board gaming?
To a certain degree, yeah heavy games are all about making you think hard which can take time. That being said, I feel like there's a limit to how much AP is socially acceptable and some games seem to make it easy for me and other people I play with get right up to that line (and sometimes over it).
About Terra Mystica's Cults: you are inaccurate when you say something along the lines of "the cults just give points". Nope. They also dictate round income and give immediate power, all which can really influence the game outcome massively.
About negative number 1... I agree it isn't the simplest mechanic, but transdim and gaia planets (or something like them) are a necessary mechanic in order to have more planets generally available for the players. So this had to be here, otherwise the map would need to be more packed with planets and the game would be EXACTLY like Terra Mystica in a lot more ways (besides being a "more symmetric version of Terra Mystica" in a lot of ways).
I think that is more of a different (and less intuitive) than a negative.
The real negative that could be still be argued here is that the game is HARD to teach - because there is too much going on, which is undeniable - and the gaiaformation doesn't help here and a lot of stuff is hard to remember - especially forming federations and getting advanced techs. There is just too much detail to everything. The game is heavy for a lot of reasons and that is just one of them. There is only so much that can be streamlined. And how hard (and sometimes not intuitive) the game is is the only real negative I have for this game.
About negative number 2... Yeah, that is just you playing badly. I'm sorry. I've won at times after being 30+ points behind; this isn't really the biggest issue the game has. This is an issue of your planning/lack of experience, aka, you perceive an issue where there is none. And that is OK, the game is too hard to be understood easily for the first ~10 plays. Besides I can feel that your group doesn't use the Gaiaformation technology properly, since you report Terrans always winning (they ARE a solid top half faction, but they aren't generally considered the best, while being one of the easiest and one of the most plastic ones). It is the single most important tech bump, besides having at least 2 for range. You should try to think more about scoring bug in the last 3 rounds (SPECIALLY the last round).
Also about 4 players... You are right. The fourth player has quite a bit of a disadvantage. Is that VERY BAD? Not really, but it'll show in competitive settings for sure.
In your conclusion - if you want Terra Mystica "refined", that would be Clans of Caledonia.
I wasn't particularly impressed with Clans of Caledonia. It is more like Terra Mystica light, plus a market mechanism, and that isn't really what I was looking for.
your complaint about race choosing is easily fixed by making people pick their race before revealing the scoring bonuses
brain melting, no thanks. Played gaia once, finished at 98 points. I still struggle winning with V:EE (Viticulture Essential Edition).