KAWHI LEONARD is NOT a TOP 10 Small Forward All-Time
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ก.ย. 2024
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You can argue Kawhi is a top 5 SF , so not having him top 10 is crazy
The Kawhi disrespect is TERRIBLE. Regardless if Kawhi is healthy or not I’m taking Kawhi over Wilkins, Havlicek, Barry, and Dantley. You can even say as a talent he’s better than Scottie. Kawhi as a player is better than most people realize. He can score just as good as anyone in his prime and on top of that give you one of the greatest defensive performances you’ll ever see
Kawhi is better but he’s always injured. He can’t be top 1 playing half of the games.
Bro. It’s not. Disrespect. Kawhi better. It’s frustrating low. Just denies. Everything. Lol😂
@@mojokojak7994 I never said Kawhi is the best SF. All I’m saying is as a player he’s better than those guys mentioned. He can score as well as those guys and give you one of the greatest defenses on the other side.
Not better than pippin at all
@@Weirdwalker87yes he is. Pippen couldnt lead a team.
The fact they come for kawhi for being injured despite the fact he is still 2x champ 2x dpoy 2x fmvp..his career still clears
Clears who Nigga?
Not getting injured in multiple major playoff runs lol
@@Thanosdidtherighthing still got 2 rings 2fmvps 2dpoys..more than most..and if he didn't get hurt would have even more..clown
@@dceltics2461 Yea he’s a beast no doubt but last playoffs was the end of the Kawhi train.
@@Thanosdidtherighthing lmaoo. I promise you kawhi makes all his haters look foolish next season
Kawhi is hella injury prone , but not TOP 10 ???? Horrible take .
Extremely horrible take
That's your opinion.
Your opinion.
@@Doknot-tb9eyThat’s a FACT. Man uh Drop 30, 40 on Ya Head, as well as take the initiative to Clamp yo ass Down💯 Yall casual ahh fans let dem injuries Foo yall🤦🏽♂️
@@KINGBatman333Exactly.
People don’t realize how good Kawhi is. He’s freaking insane lol.
he plays 30 games a year.
@@aMenace2S Cool. He’s still amazing and is one of the best players to ever play the game.
@@ryanmccrary1880He doesn’t play
Low is the prime example of someone who thinks he’s the smartest in the room but shines the dumbest
Its a reach but he does come off pretentious sometimes
kawhi is for sure a top 10 small forward common now hes peak is too high not to have him in there it literally does not matter if he just starts putting up 10 pts a game from now on hes for sure a top 10 sf
Damn, I wish I hadn't cut Marz off at 9:12, he pretty perfectly explains LOWs confusion, but most people probably missed it due to me talking over half of it.
No way people think kawahi isn’t a top 10 Small forward due to injury cause in that case D-Wade isn’t top 5 magic isn’t the best point guard of all time and bird isn’t a top 3 small forward cause they’re carrers we’re messed up due to injury as well but the difference is kawahi is still active like what are we doing people just be talking on this panel
Get Kawhi’s but out of your mouth. You didn’t name a single player who played less than Kawhi. Larry had the shortest career of the 3 and has played about 350 games more than Kawhi 😂
@@smbenga2 you don’t understand where I’m coming from if we’re using the longevity argument against him then apply it to everyone and regardless of that as a talent he’s Top 5 imo top 3 at the small forward position
@@WrestlingisaW He has the least longevity out of all of them. That not his fault, he was born with degenerative knees, but it’s also reasonable to take that into account when ranking him
@@smbenga2y’all praise jordan for getting it done in short amount of time but not kawhi?
@@smbenga2 yeah when I rank a player injuries are the least ranked cause it’s out of their control but I get it when someone uses it but to keep him out the 10 is disrespectful
Paul Pierce over Kawhi is crazy
Not fr
Bro, I don't have Pierce over Kawhi. I have Kawhi at 12 SF and Pierce at #17 SF. This is what happens when people don't listen in good faith, you hear what you want to hear. I didn't even bring up Pierce, LOW did in a vain attempt, and somehow you heard Pierce being over Kawhi.
Name 16 sf above Pierce
@@piratemccallpaul pierce number 17?!?!?!?!?
This is crazy 😂 The Truth was real y'all niggas tripping😂😂
@1:48 That's literally the way LOW debates in a nutshell. LOW's also not very consistent with his own lists as evidenced with his top 5 when he had that conversation with KD. LOW said that playoffs success was why his list was the way it was, while one dude he had on his list literally missed the playoffs and the other was bounced by an 8th seed in the 1st round.
No he didn’t . That was Swipa’s argument for embiid being out the top 5 and then low brought up AD’s defense
@@dontcallmeblerd3371 He literally named his top 5 to KD. His reasoning was playoffs success. Luka was on that list and he didn't even make the playoffs. Giannis was on that list and KD went farther in the playoffs than he did. Not to mention Giannis was clapped by an 8th seed in the first round.
@@smoothsavage2870 I’ll listen back but Lula and Giannis have been better in the playoffs than KD the last 3 years as a whole even if luka missed the playoffs he’s been good every year before then
@@dontcallmeblerd3371 How you better but you losing to an 8th seed because you cant hit FTs? And LOW's list was based on THIS year's postseason, so we're not even considering the past 3 years based on his argument.
I thought I’d never see the day low get cooked 😂😂😂😂
Marz no way you hitting a dab bro 😂
Dominique in his prime was putting up 40s points on great teams like Boston Celtics and in his Era he had to go thru the Celtics/bird , pistons / Isaiah , bulls /MJ , 76ers w/ Dr.J , Moses and the Milwaukee bucks w/ Sidney Moncrief ** he balled out just lost to better teams
If Jordan didn't exist Dominique would have like 4 scoring titles.
@@TrollinThruand another dunk title lol, jordan had no business winning that over Wilkins lol. But he was next up , NBA had to Market they next superstar (which worked out great)
Marz randomly dabbing is insanity
Low got smoked
Low got ethered
PIRATE MADE LOW WALK THE PLANK LETS GOOOO
Low intentionally confused the discussion. I bet this dude's list would be different is he had to the Top 10 SF strictly based off efficiency alone. He's ranking Nique based off more than just his efficiency.
Low is cooking himself and it feels necessary.
Yes, thank you. It's wild that some people hear you say you factor efficiency, and immediately convert it to "your criteria is efficiency" if my criteria were purely efficiency, I'd simply copy and paste the 100 most efficient players, which would be a pretty boring list.. this should be fairly obvious to anyone listening in good faith.
Low met his match as far as debating with pirate 😂
Top 10 Small Forwards:
Lebron James
Larry Bird
Kevin Durant
Julius Erving
Scottie Pippen
John Havlicek
Elgin Baylor
Rick Barry
Paul Pierce
Kawhi Leonard
Kawhi's peak is just too high to not have in the Top 10. Though he does get injured way too much to have him ahead of players like Pierce or Rick Barry.
And No, High Volume/Low Efficiency Scorers who were poor passers and negative defenders like Carmelo & Dominique don't belong that high.
Melo averages less turnovers off passes than Paul Pierce and Kawhi’s peak lasted longer than Paul’s did. He was all nba a year more and was all defensive team for 7 years to Paul’s zero.
@@pandabear1576 lool yet another youngin pierce hater. You can def argue pierce is a top 10 sf. I do think kawhi is higher, even though Kawhi is such a weird anomaly. But if we talking about better player vs Carmelo or Pierce, its close. But im taking pierce
@@pandabear1576Melo's Prime years were '05/'06 through '12/'13.
During that 8yrs stretch in the Regular Season Carmelo finished 60% at the rim 0-3FT from the basket.
In the Playoffs during that same 8yr stretch he finished a woeful 50% from 0-3FT from the basket.
Carmelo Anthony's Career Defense Adjusted True Shooting Percentage is -2.3% BELOW average.
Carmelo was a poor rim finisher where he took 30-35% of his shots at.
He was an egregious ball stopper which made it easier for Defenses to collapse on him.
Not to mention Carmelo's atrocious Defense, Jayson Tatum in his last 3 years has played better than Carmelo ever has in his career.
Paul pierce above kawhi is nuts.
I understand he’s been injured a lot lately but goddamn 😂😂
Haveliceck always played 2 he is not a SF
Is LOW just trying to not understand? The last 20% wasn’t just how good Pirate thinks a player is from his eye test, it’s also intangibles and how you would do in different situations and Pirate said that Kawhi was in great situations. And the best 3 year stretch isn’t automatically Kawhi either, it would only be if you skip 2018 or skip another year. If you actually look at the 3 year stretch then his team was paying Kawhi and had him on the roster and he couldn’t play. That’s not just a neutral where you add no value, that’s a negative
@christophergooding9820
Yeah bro, it's pretty wild how far some people go to not listen in good faith. Pretty much 99% of the time when you hear someone say "by your logic..." A bad faith, incorrect analysis is sure to follow.
Bro really changed his criteria 3 times to avoid getting cooked
Bro, my criteria is MULTI-LAYERED, and because I don't value a particular player in a particular spot that you do, you simply can not listen to what my personal criteria is in good faith, so it really doesn't matter how deeply I explain it. It's a pretty weird thing in the basketball fan community. Simply put, I'm not upset if you have different opinions and evaluation, I'll listen and try to understand, but a lot of you guys simply don't roll that way.
@@piratemccall you lost your argument when you directly said that your list is inconsistent and no list should be. Like what do you mean being consistent is impose?
@@audriclloyd8947
Again, you hear what you want to hear. I never said "inconsistent", you desperately want it to be inconsistent, so that's what you heard. I said "anyone who believes they have an absolute criteria is full of hubris and pride." The only lists you could possibly make based on absolute criteria would be based on univariate absolute fact, such as "the criteria for this list is most career points" then you would simply list off the top 100 in career points. Anything beyond anything beyond requires subjective evaluation. If my subjective evaluation differs from your own, that does not make it inconsistent, it makes it different.
@@piratemccall if something isn’t absolute than what is it? If I’m not perfect I’m imperfect if I’m not consistent than I’m inconsistent and if you’re criteria isn’t absolute that is a failure on you not on other people it is entirely capable of making a list that adheres absolutely to your criteria it’s the fact that you are inconsistent that leads to your list having these holes nothing more nothing less
@@audriclloyd8947
Right.. ok, please enlighten me with YOUR top 100 list that is 100% absolutely "correct" and, in your terms "consistent".
Kawhi is easily a top 10 SF of all time in spite of his injuries. IMO, he's top 5 SF of all time. He's a 2x Champion, 2x Finals MVP, 2x DPOY, one of only 2 men to hit a series-winning buzzer beater in a win-or-go-home game, a better playoff performer, and a clutch player. Kawhi has singlehandedly won his team some critical playoff games when they needed him the most.
He’s a Top 10 small forward. At his peak, he’s a Top 15 (I’d say Top 10) player all time.
Kawhi was locking up KD in the Suns series. He was shutting down his half of the court and he was guarding KD straight up. I haven’t seen nothing like that since MJ & Pip.
Top 10 SF is fine. But top 10 let alone 15 is seriously pushing it
He guarded KD so hard that he broke down
Kawhi is all time talented but hasn’t been able to carry that talent healthy throughout a season NEARLY enough. Plain and simple.
I mean bro he still has better career than mostly anybody in the last 25 yrs in that short time 2 finals Mvp and 3x dpoy I don’t think they’re been player that’s offence just as good as his defence
Kawhi is 7th best SF imo. LeBron, Bird, KD, Dr J, Elgin Baylor, Rick Barry then Kawhi Leonard. The man has 2 finals MVP's! I think you could argue Dominique but I think Kawhi outside the top 10 SF's is crazy.
Low can’t stump this dude at all 😂
Kawhi is at least top 8. He’s *elite* on both sides of the ball. The only other small forwards we can say that for are Lebron and Havlicek
KD is up there too, people just refuse to give him credit for it. He was at one point in DPOY conversations.
When the last time he stopped anybody. That wave was over years ago.
@@smoothsavage2870Only because of the warriors system was he in that convo. Without that he’s not close
@@DontAdoreYou Not really. KD still plays good defense. But yall just try to diminish his defensive contributions. He was even good on defense on the Thunder.
Only counting the finals run year and afterwards, KD was number 1 in defensive win shares on the Thunder from 2011-2014, was out in 2014-2015, but came back in 2015-2016 and was only 2nd to Russ that season.
From 2011-2014, the Thunder were never lower than 11th in defense, and had a top 10 defense along with a top 5 defense for 2 seasons during that stretch.
@@smoothsavage2870never made an all defense team. He’s a good help defender and has the height and length to contest anyone’s shot but was never elite on D
Low got flamed in this one
Man what happened to pirate? He was great on the show.
LOW got cooked. Not going to lie lol
Based off his criteria I understand the ranking… I do think it’s safe to say Kawhi is better than Dominique, Dantley, Havlicek etc.
It’s sad people don’t ACTUALLY watch kawhi play. Quite literally no weaknesses in his game. Bro is one of the few players in history to make basketball look effortless but he’s not flashy so people don’t understand that the game is that easy to him. Bro just can’t stay healthy would easily be top 10 all time maybe the 6-7 range😔
@nolanauthorlee
Bro, out of the thousands of men who have played SF, you think he's 6-7, I have him at #12, despite all the missed games. Seems we're splitting hairs, we both obviously think he's a great player and are just valuing a few things differently.
He’s cookin tf out low bruh keep tryna find a crack in his theory 😂😂
The Len bias comment was crazy
Pirate is goofy AF in this video
Kawhi a top 4 sf
Facts pippen bron kd klaw
Fr he 4
Oh hell no what
Kawhi is probably the hardest player to rank. Great peak, great talent, but dude is literally a part-timer.
Whoever is making this take doesn’t watch basketball or know basketball. Kawhi is top 5, no argument. I’m not watching this video because y’all trolling right now
The game kawhi got hurt in he was destroying the kd warriors team. Then he came back and win a ring
Bron
Bird
KD
Kawhi
Pippen
This pirate dude can’t debate, why they got him in here 😂😂
kawhi is for sure a top 10 sf of all time. 2x Champ 2x fmvp 2x dpoy steal leader 7 all def team 5x All first team what are we talking about
@dapoole2014
* In your opinion. People have different opinions. You think he's top 10, I have him #12, out of the THOUSANDS of men to play SF 😂
You need to do super mental gymnastics to put together an argument that Dominique is better than Kawhi lmao
Pirate be frying
I think after Bird, LBJ and Durant is so subjective. You can argue Mark Aguirre. 20ppg, 2 rings, 48% for his career . And numbers higher if he stayed in Dallas versus going to Detroit to win his rings.
My favorite player in 2019 simply isn’t healthy enough and able to play through the chronic conditions he does have to be put in these conversations.
Man he can retire rn and he’s top 10 stop it 😂
@@DonyeWhite He had missed over 40% of his career. It’s disrespectful for those who played. His talent is no question top 10. That’s not what I’m arguing. I hold longevity in a high regard and his body is betraying him. He simply doesn’t play enough to properly rate him without saying “If he’s healthy” or “When he plays”. It’s sad but it’s how I feel personally. Trust me I’d like to put him in convos such as KD vs Kawhi. But I can’t 🤷🏾♀️
@@Satsuionlylongevity is extremely important.But you can definitely still compare and KD at their best.Let’s not forget how injury prone KD has been recently.Obviously not to the level of kawhi but u get what I mean
@@von1626 Yea of course I do we can compare Peaks but that convo isn’t a great representation of what Kawhi is as a player because we run into the longevity problem. He hasn’t done it long enough at a high enough level to put forth a great argument of who he is as a player. KD post Achilles injury has been less durable by far, but he had multiple MVP level seasons before the injury to fall back on. the fact that Kawhi’s game got better over the years in the nba, into the deadly efficient two-way player he is at his best. It’s as if in curry’s 2015 season the problem with his ankle were deemed chronic and a career long problem that had him out majority of the seasons to come. Because we wouldn’t have seen him for full seasons at length and deep enough post season runs he wouldn’t be high as he is today even though he has missed games over the years after 2015 his ankles weren’t nearly as bad like when he first came into the league. I do understand your Argument for Kawhi’s peak. I believe his peak year is borderline a perfect player and my favorite player by far man just can’t stay healthy. Unfortunately 😖
low is completely out of his element in here he lacks basketball knowledge to argue about hoops with person who can all he does is argue semantics yells use big words when he feels he has nothing to say of substance he wants to look good and be 'right'. pirate is right all low does is tries to twist your argument against yourself by looking at gaps in your logic and being pedantic plus he struggles to present his own opinion when asked. this is not person who argues in good faith the more you see of him the worse it gets. if you know manipulative person like that dont let them get you to their level just ignore them have some respect for yourself.
Any time I hear ‘out of his element cause he don’t know ball’ especially over all time lists let’s me know there is no point responding but I’ll break it down. low is saying, pirates biggest issue for AI was efficiency. But Pirate excused Dom’s efficiency for talent. This is illogical because AI clears most SGs talent wise. Regardless Low was arguing Pirates bias.
He’s definitely manipulative but low was definitely correct here. The other guy argument was all over the place. Too many holes, too much personal and recency bias. Not enough facts.
we should ignore you, because you clearly don't understand the concept of debating
@@oluwatadefalade4690low is also inconsistent in his rankings all the time so either way he’s being a hypocrite and trying to critique
@oluwatadefalade4690 thank you but i know context of discussion. i dont care about all time lists they could've argued over which vegetable is easier to eat that was not the point. the point is low doesnt care to argue in good faith all he wants is look good you shouldnt even entertain person like that by responding. the fact his knowledge is limited is secondary to that.
The guy saying Kawhi ain’t top 10 has no athletic bone in his body. Plus his criteria is horrible
Pirate hate iverson for non basketball reasons. Bro just finding any excuse to knock him. Bro said AI could’ve been a 20/10 player and he was not a 30 ppg SG. It’s funny cuz he made the finals, won MVP, scoring titles and all nba selections being a 30 point SG. Being a 20.10 player would’ve helped AI win 3 mores games and win a championship???? No! Don’t trust any man that calls himself a pirate
@greatest515
Bro, I am an AI fan. I bought his jersey, I paid to watch him play live, I watched hundreds of his games. The fact the you really think I "hate" AI simply because I don't appraise his career is really telling. That's not reality. Reality is I REALLY LIKE AI, if I made a list of my 100 FAVORITE players, he would be on it.. so please, try to get beyond that and consider the actual reality, I like AI, I don't think he was suited to be a high volume SG. If you disagree, that's fine, that's your opinion, but at least don't create motives that don't exist. Take care 🙏
Saying you value multiple things 20% etc etc then when questioned on why is Paul pierce not better then someone and only harping on 1 point of talent which is only 20% of ur criteria makes no sense when he clears Dominique in the rest of the 80%
😂😅😂 who is this guy cuz the two clips y’all had him in he sounds like he doesn’t know basketball. Dominique Wilkins over kawhi is just disgusting and the reasons he’s picked him over kawhi is dumb. Even with him not playing you take his 7 year peak and his entire career plus eye test and everything else involved there is absolutely no way you can argue Wilkins over kawhi oh boy. Hope this guy doesn’t become a staple on these shows cuz bruh 😭😭
@officialKidlso
The fact you think it's "just dumb" for people to have different opinions based on criteria and opinion you simply don't want to factor is really telling.
Here, just for you: New list, the criteria is ONLY pure basketball talent. Now I've got Kawhi over Nique... Is your day better now?
@@piratemccall but even career wise based on your standards the only reason you would have Dominique Wilkins over Kawhi is bias. Career Achievements personal accolades peak. Even factoring in the injuries Dominique played more and accomplished less in an era with less talent in his era.
@@piratemccall And the reason I said it’s just dumb is because using your logic having Dominique over Kawhi doesn’t make any sense.
1. Bron
2 .Bird
3. KD
4. Erving
5. Baylor
6. Pippen
7. Havlicek
8. Barry
9. Kawhi
10. Dominique
After the king,Larry legend, doctor j, and the slim reaper, it's all hands on deck in the small forward position kawhi Leonard I'd definitely a top ten NBA small forwards especially when you're a finals mvp in two different ororganizations and won dpoy 2x and more importantly under the influence of kobe he became a much polished offensive player also
I hate the way low argues like bruhh lol
so, you have an issue with proper debating?
@@theofficialonceits not proper debating when its being pedantic and playing word games. Just because you value efficiency highly doesnt mean a player with lower efficiency cant be a better player... i value rings, that doesnt mean i cant put lebron over kobe
@@bboywolf Challenging someone else's logic or questioning their consistency is a part of debating. Also, this clip obviously has a lot of context missing so none of us even understand the entire conversation unless you watched the stream with full context applied. On top of that, you proved my point. In theory, if he values efficiency, having a player who is less efficient over a player who is more efficient is possible. However, with pirate, he clearly penalized AI for lacking efficiency, but wouldn't do the same for Dom. In addition to that, the reasonings he gave for Dom being above Kawhi(for example) didn't even make sense or were blatantly incorrect. Even if they were correct or sensible, those same reasonings can be applied to AI, but he chose not to do it. That's called inconsistency. I'm sure you've noticed by now, LOW doesn't deny or challenge people's opinions, he questions whether that opinion and the logic it's built upon is consistent for all spectrums.
@@bboywolf Semantics is also a part of debating. Being pedantic is purposely done to apply pressure to people defending their stance, often times like on the panel, people say outlandish shit and get away with it because no one even tries to challenge them. LOW doesn't do that, he will pressure you into defending your stance because he knows the foundation of it is weak and can't be logically justified. Perfectly explains why most people fall apart when debating LOW. Pirate didn't fall apart so people think he cooked LOW, but no, pirate fell into the same trap of inconsistency and tried to move the goalpost to save himself. That calm demeanor and commanding tone makes pirate sound confident in what he's saying, but if you listen to him it's no different than someone like Instagram champagne who is also extremely inconsistent.
@@theofficialonce watched the stream. Pirate calls out low a second time and predicts the attack low likes to use with mars defending pirate and agreeing. So why youre speaking i have no clue since you didnt watch.
Second, each position has their role and he ranks them based off that role. Why are you talkings about 3s when iverson is a 2? The general criteria included health/availability so his reasoning made sense even if i think its wrong. This is a favorite of LOWs which you did as well. Take one point and make it the only point while trying to apply it to separate situations with different context. Why am i applying standards between ai vs ray allen to kawhi vs dominique? He's not arguing in general as a player/talent. But even if he was, every player has a different resume/case outside of the general rings/mvps/stats etc. Why bird is great is different to why dr j was great. Youre forcing perfect and exact consistency into things that cannot be perfect or exact. There is no way to score greatness. You can only make better or worse arguments
Damn the Len Bias comment was crazy
Low got cooked😂😂😂
Is this the lowe guy that said John Stockton is not a top 5 point guard of all time? you see nick Wright and max Kellerman did to sports all they do is talk about stats for God's sake stats doesn't tell the whole story eye test and end result does the nerve of these experts
Kawhi does not have enough full seasons . He peaked several years into his career. 3 playoff runs cut short by injury. 2 full seasons missed due to injury. Multiple seasons with fewer games played due to more injury and load management. Bounced in 2020 by the nuggets. He is a great player and used to be a top 3 player in the league when healthy. But the resume of things going against him, he cannot he compared to some of the greats who have had fuller careers.
Low got cooked feelsgoodman
Small Forward is the deepest position of all time greats imo:
1. Bron 2. Bird 3. Hondo 4. KD 5. Elgin 6. Dr. J 7. Barry 8. Kawhi 9. Pip 10. Pierce
there's no way Pierce is over Nique.
@remnant8898 I could make a case for Nique, but dude never even got passed the 2nd round. The East was loaded during his prime, so I could give him a pass for that, but Nique wasn't anything more than an athletic freak who could score. Not a playmaker. Not a defender. Not a guy you could give the ball to at the end of games and rely on. I think it's close, but I'll take Pierce.
Kawhi isn't over Scottie I'm not saying Scottie is better but he barely plays whether he's injured or not
@zuimoney3751 I won't argue with that. I could easily be talked into Scottie over Kawhi because of Kawhi's lack of availability to his team. I was looking at it as Kawhi in his prime was a number 1 option for title teams, and he's arguably the best on-ball perimeter defensive player of all time. Pip is arguably the greatest second option ever, and arguably the greatest perimeter defensive player ever - BOTH on and off ball - but he was never going to be a number 1 on a title team. I don't think he was good enough offensively for that, and I don't think he was mentally wired for it. That being said, the totality of Pip's career may trump Kawhi's peak 🤷♂️
@@Nootz23I’m sorry but who’s Hondo
Kawhi is definitely a top ten sf
The main thing is that Kawhi Leonard has not played enough, games in his career. The championship San Antonio is on the Hall of Fame team. Then load management took over. Injury prone his last five years and he’s impact on the team has been negligible.
Dominique Wilkins is a dominant player for his team for a decade an all star over a decade. And his recognition by his peers is evident. Under intangible Dominic’s impact on the game is formidable Dominique is the player that put Atlanta on the map he’s a player that other teams had to stop. Your dominance and leader ship cannot be qualified by a number.
Kawhi Leonard is not played enough games.
If were looking at small forwards i can see why someone would not consider him top 10 with lebron bird kd dr j Baylor then hondo barry who had no 3 point line in there time pippen english wilkins pierce carmelo and so on plus his injury history. But I can also see why you would consider him top 10 too as well.
Speaking of "advantageous moments" in career. Kawhi's career is actually a sad tragedy. We're robbed of his greatness.
Unfortunately he cooked low
8:30 Low be tryna act too smart sometimes and it bite him in the ass
LOW got bodied
Larry bird not in the top ten is mind blowing to me
anyone who doesn't have Bird in the top 10 doesn't know basketball..
@k.s.b.fulton7474
Good Lord. Bird was #2 😂 Honestly, it's crazy how people hear what they want to hear sometimes.
Ok bet I didn’t hear him clearly
Honestly I’m talking kawhi over everyone but lebron
Wooooooe Dominique was not a poor defender ask Larry bird!!!!!!!! He wasn’t great at it but above average
I don’t know how ppl saying kawhi getting disrespected when his whole career he was injured and load management. Kawhi would be the best player in the league better then Lebron but being injured and load management your whole career is crazy
kawhi is dope but he’s been extremely hurt during his peak yrs..dominque was also a great player
In your opinion 😂
How have Kawhi over kd Both have two championships and finals mvps but in my opinion 2 dpoys is better than 1 mvp
Kawhi not effing with Nique
Damn LOW got cooked. All you can eat buffet.
Crazy
low is tweakin and hes just trying to force pirate into a gotcha moment because he doesnt agree but cant convince anyone else hes right so he wants pirates to poke holes in his own thinking hoping people question it more
Deff top 10 not even a question
Marz starting to be a Kawhi Hater now
My top 10 SFs of all-time in order are:
1. LeBron (Biggest all-time dbag in the NBA)
2. Bird (Highest bball IQ ever, extremely high impact franchise turnaround player, and was the greatest shooter of all-time until Curry came along. His defense was solid in his first 6-7 seasons)
3. Dr J (Great scorer, solid rebounder, good ball thief, underrated defender, could turn any franchise around in terms of winning, finances, and popularity. Best shot blocking SF of all-time possibly)
4. KD (Top 5 all-time scorer, defensively limited, and has never proven he can LEAD a team to a title. However, his offensive talent and consistency cannot be denied)
5. Baylor (Tremendous athletic scorer that dominated in points and rebounds, but could not win a title)
6. Kawhi (Proven championship impact player that is one of the all-time two way wings. His longevity really hurts him, but there's nobody that wouldn't want him on their all-time starting 5. He's that great when healthy, really has no virtual weaknesses besides health and limited vision out of double team traps at times)
7. Barry (Underrated great scorer that led the GSW to their first ever title. Very efficient shooter, but a terrible defender and teammate lol)
8. Havlicek (Numbers are eerily similar to Kobe, and was able to win as a role player and lead man of the Celtics, with and without Russell)
9. Dominique (Incredibly consistent and proficient scorer before and after what was supposed to be a career ending achilles heel injury. If not for Bird, could have made some Finals out of the east)
10. Pippen (Only SF on this list to never be the consistent #1 on his team, the only robin, but very impactful. Was very limited as a scorer in the half court)
Low got cooked
1 .Lebron james
2.Larry bird
3.kd
4.dr j
5.Elgin baylor
6.Rick Barry
7.kawhi
8. Scottie pipen
9. Dominique Wilkins
10. James worthy
Paul pierce over James worthy is crazy
@@MCFC-m7k I forgot him
@@MCFC-m7k Lol no it isnt what so ever. Worthy played on a dynasty of a laker team never averaging over 22 points. Pierce was a better scorer, rebounder and playmaker. With worthy being a slightly better defender (more versatile). In no universe is JW better than PP and the PP hate is really showing in this era of basketball XD
Nique was definitely a better defender than Dantley and A. I.
It is what it is.
Losing brain cells I see
This is a silly argument. The dude mentioned Kawhi in his top 10. It doesn't matter what number he is in.
dis is nasty
Kawahi is better defensively and became a better shooter , Dominique Was a slasher with way better athletic ability not even closed his nickname to human highlight**
bron Kd bird kawhi dr j Baylor Paul pierce Scottie pippen Rick Barry. That’s the right order
Dub is a goof
Kawhi is without a doubt a top 10 SF of all time, this too easy a baby can do it. Now put that in your pipe and smoke it 🤷🏿♂️
Low is so annoying, he just mad pirate cooked him on AI. I don't agree with Kawhi not being top 10 either, but his reason is fine.
Bron kd bird kawhi dr j pippen melo pierce elgin Dominique that’s 10 kawhi is in there
1. It's amazing and sad how emotional and illogical some people get over lists. These are PERSONAL OPINIONS AND EVALUATIONS. To actually get upset that other people would dare to have a different opinion than your own ends any good faith conversation before it can begin.
2. It's amazing and sad that some people purposely confuse multi-variable evaluation with inconsitentcy simply because they want the result of any list to match their own ranking and what they believe their own evaluation to be. Multi layered evaluation requires explanation, clarification and HONEST discussion. To simply try to shut down HONEST discussion by using the faulty rhetoric of "you said you valued this, but now you're valuing that!" Is insincere.
3. I try to follow the creed of the open hand. In discussion or debate, I'm trying to LISTEN to what the other person says and EXTEND the conversation in GOOD FAITH to a fruitful conclusion.
That is simply not how some of you wish to converse. Your goal is simply to SHUT DOWN any opinion that differs from your own as quickly as possible via some "inconsitency" that logically does not even exist, but because you don't want clarification in the first place, and are far more concerned with "being right" than honestly discussing different opinions, your happy to end coversation as quickly as possible and go on believe people who disagree with you are "stupid and don't know ball." If your the type of person looking to end debate as quickly as possible by saying things like "conversation over, your cooked" I hate to break it to you, what you think logic is, it is not that.
4. ENJOY THE GAME MORE. This is all OPINION, hate to break it to you. If any two people are having a discussion on basketball, it's because they both LIKE BASKETBALL. FOCUS ON THAT, TRY being friendly because you both share a common interest. I'm not hurt or offended if you think Kawhi is #1 SF all time. That's YOUR OPINION. You NEED me to put Kawhi higher?? You NEED other people to have your criteria?? Here: I'll make a DIFFERENT list based on pure basketball talent. Now Kawhi is higher... Are you happy? Is your day better because I changed my criteria to more match your own? This isn't personal. I don't hate Kawhi because I dare rank him lower in a TOP 100 PLAYERS OF ALL TIME LIST! I'm not offended or upset that you obviously rank guys I have higher lower, don't worry, Kawhi is going to be fine. It's just a list.
Lol relax bro barely anybody was emotional all they did was disagree with you 😂some people feel like it’s a bad take (me also) but that’s yo opinion not sure why you feel the need to type paragraphs on multiple comments 😭it’s okay bro you can have him at 12 while we disagree respectfully 🤝and have him top 10 also I did like your criteria roughly
@@Seem612
Ha, thanks bro. I'm a writer, I pump out paragraphs pretty fast 🤣 I'm not tripping, it's the internet, it is what it is. It's just a bit fascinating how many people relish negativity. I just like basketball and enjoy friendly convos about basketball. I also like logical and good faith conversations, so the combination of negative, illogical, bad faith conversations.. it is what it is. We're all entitled to our opinion. I just like PC and want to talk basketball.
@waseemahmed3097
You're right though. Investing much in internet comments is a fool's errand. Part of what drew me to PC was the "haters ball" aspect, everyone gets criticized constantly, it's all good. Thanks for the reminder bro. No need to comment much on comments. 👍🙏
@@piratemccall yessir good debate fasho🤝
Lmao ANYWHO?!
Wow more disrespectful Kawhi takes
@RealNPoetic
Man, SO disrespectful to have Kawhi #12 ALL TIME out of the THOUSANDS of men to play SF in the NBA 😂
@@piratemccall Stop the cap. Kawhi is definitely in the top 10.
@RealNPoetic
Convincing argument 🤣
Bruh, I've got a guy who missed half his games #12 all time, I OBVIOUSLY think he's a tremendous talent. The fact that you think there is no criteria that would ding a guy for literally missing almost half his career yet STILL ranking him #12 ALL TIME vs the thousands of men to play SF is wild and pretty emotional.
@@piratemccall Kawhi being top 10 is like 2 + 2 = 4 it’s facts, their shouldn’t be much of an argument otherwise. You can’t name 5 great defenders that were also great offensive players on that list. Kawhi can do everything on the court at a good to elite level outside maybe passing. You bring up injuries but you forget Wilkins had a torn acl and injuries would disqualify wade from being a top 5 sg. You bring up advantageous situations but that would also disqualify lebron, bird, magic and others from all time lists. You changed your argument so many times so low wouldn’t expose you and your flawed perspective.
@RADIOACTIVEYOUTH
Bro, there's something about this conversation I'd love for you to take a moment to HONESTLY consider:
I RESPECT your opinion. These are all just OPINIONS. I can make 100 lists and Kawhi and everyone else will be in different spots. I said IN THIS VERY VIDEO, I believe Kawhi is the better raw talent. So there you go, if you need to hear me say Kawhi is better, there is the list. I made a list based on pretty complex multitude of factors as I see the game. I factored availability. Just because you don't want to factor availability, that's cool, these are all perspectives, but it's not "stupid" or "inconsistent" and ranking NBA players is most definitely not 2+2=4. I can have 100 lists that rank Kawhi 100 different ways, I'm not smarter when I mention a list that has him at a number you like and dumber when He's not where you like. Kawhi was constantly, chronically injured throughout the majority of his career, and, all in all, I STILL rank him as one of the greatest to ever play.. this isn't a war bro, and no matter what your take god isn't going to come down and say "you're right!" It's just basketball talk my man. If you have Kawhi higher than me, that must mean you have some of my guys lower, right? But I'm not tripping. That's your opinion based on what you've seen and what you value. It's all good.
Take care
He’s not though