Those 4% Protestant of Dublin should give one of their two cathedrals back to the Catholic Church who built them. A fine ecumenical gesture that would be.
Catholic churches in England the same, Anglicanism forced on English Catholics who apostasized for temporal, nationalistic rulers contradicting the apostles who founded the Church solely on the Kingdom of Christ.
They have actually made that offer. But the Roman Catholic hierarchy has never responded to it. Old cathedral buildings are marvelous objects to claim to be denied of, but horrendously costly to own & care for. Someone has decided there's more mileage to gained in complaining than maintaining.
Canada here. My Irish Catholic ancestors found an answer 200 years ago when they immigrated to Canada. They could be free, own their own land, and live on their own terms. My family, despite the hardships of a pioneer beginning, has prospered here.
@@genevievedolan1288You don’t own anything you cannot defend - as the Irish found out to their cost, and wisely chose not to repeat in the Canadian and American colonies. My ancestors were one family that came this way - and I’m not the slightest bit sorry.
Yes, members of my Irish family are nearly all gone from their homeland. They were either transported or migrated to mostly Australia and Canada, with a smaller number going to the USA. There are over 100 million members of the Irish diaspora worldwide. If all of us had been welcome to stay part of the UK and given food and equal rights instead of bigotry and starvation, we might be the majority there now. 😁☘
For many years the Catholic Archdiocese of Dublin owned the park of Merrion Square. It once planned to build a cathedral there. However, it was always fairly clear that it was not a suitable site. A cathedral there would have ruined the integrity of the Georgian square. The Archdiocese later presented the park to the city and it is now a public park.
Dubliners are justly proud of the Roman Catholic pro- cathedral. It is a beautiful neoclassical Doric temple of restrained dignity with acoustic properties ideal for the Palestrina Palestrina
I have been to Dublin in 1996 and (being a Lutheran myself) was stunned by the fact that both cathedrals are Anglican (euphemism: Church of Ireland). Even more appalling I found the Union Jack battle flags decoration in the interior of St Patricks. Clear relics of the British suppression of the Irish nation.
The flags are the regimental colours of Irish Regiments in the British Army, When colours are retired they are usually displayed in the appropriate local cathedral, a long standing tradition. We Irish have a proud history of service in the Armed Forces of the UK, as far back as the 100 Years War.
@@paulkelly8456Well said , the Irish are our fellow brethren under God , King & country If they choose to rebel against the true teachings of the Christian faith & Gods appointed king then they only bring harm amongst themselves
@@paulkelly8456 😂, that's a laughable circular reasoning. If anything that's gives a sad extra illustration of the points in the video. "Retired to", makes the Church an appendage of the military & the secular. A neutral memorial of those who fought to free is far more respectful and appropriate.
The elephant in the room that has gone unmentioned here is the emergence of the many stories of abuse of one sort or another that have emerged in Ireland since the early 1980s, many of them involving the Catholic church, or people embedded within it. That is the predominant fact that has led to the collapse in churchgoing in recent decades. That the church was so powerful in Irish society, only seems to have made instances of abuse more widespread, and the desire to shield the church from scandal led to massive coverups. This is a pivotal reason for the growing secularisation in Ireland.
The mistreatment of the Irish resulted in a form of spirituality that helped them survive, a severe, penitential faith. American Irish liberals arrived, a new freedom now for the Irish, a healing, but likewise breakdown of family and love of all human life.
indeed and the Irish Times will not report abuse in Smylie's protestant homes and the latest inquiry is solely into abuse in schools run by catholic religious orders as if it did not happen in Protestant schools. That is the anti Catholic elephant in the room.
True, but abuse is found everywhere: other denominations, professions and institutions that put predators in close proximity to children and other vulnerable victims, etc. But the current culture is virulently anti-Catholic, so the Catholic Church is singled out as THE villain.
The state church in Scotland is the Presbyterian Church of Scotland. Presbyterians do not worship in Cathedrals. In Ireland dissenting Presbyterian s were also discriminated against with their meeting houses being built on the outskirts of cities. The church of Ireland was the Anglican church of Ireland and Anglicans were the dominant group over both Roman Catholics and dissenting protestants. The church of Ireland and the Roman Catholic Church have Archbishops of Armagh as their Primates, Armagh was the place chosen by St Patrick to become the centre of celtic Christianity in Ireland. The Archbishop of Armagh has the title of Archbishop of Armagh and Primate metropolitan within the church of Ireland. Armagh is also seen as the ecclesiastical capital of Ireland and the Archbishop of Dublin is second in rank under the Archbishop of Armagh. When the Normans came to Ireland they built cities and lived separately from the gaelic irish. When Archbishop Richard Fitzralph was consecrated as Archbishop of Armagh at Exeter Cathedral this followed by a procession through the streets of Exeter. Archbishop Richard Fitzralph consecration as Archbishop of Armagh was supported by the Pope at that time whose 'seat' was at Avignon in France. Once Archbishop Richard Fitzralph came to Ireland the 'chapter' or governing clergy of the Cathedral at Armagh refused to recognise him. He was 'recognised' by the Pope but not recognised by the Gaelic Irish 'chapter' or priests that administered the Cathedral at Armagh. Archbishop Richard Fitzralph subsequently established his 'Cathedral' at the town of Drogheda which was still within the province of Armagh. The preaching friars then tried to get rid of Archbishop Richard Fitzralph and they accused him of many things because Archbishop Fitzralph had highlighted the fact that they had taken a vow of poverty yet they were getting money from the people in order to say 'masses' for them in their friary while the local priest was not getting to say the funeral Mass for the people. The local priests also had a poor education simply because the friars with all their money were able to 'buy up' all the theology books. Archbishop Richard Fitzralph was subsequently accused of many things and had to 'give account' of himself before the Pope whose 'seat' was then at Avignon. Archbishop Richard Fitzralph then went to Avignon in France and lived under house arrest under the supervision of the Pope. He was still allowed to preach sermons at masses attended by the Pope and ultimately his 'trial' never took place as Archbishop Richard Fitzralph died at Avignon before this could happen. Persecution in Ireland has happened to numerous groups and not just those of the Roman Catholic faith. You could say that Archbishop Richard Fitzralph was persecuted out of Ireland by the preaching friars. The history of Ireland is far more complicated than what you might expect. Presbyterian persecution meant that even total communities emigrated to the new world in 17th century in order to have religious freedom and to practice their form of worship without being under the control of Bishops or Archbishop. Each Presbyterian congregation is a totally separate unit and appointments its own minister who is referred to as the 'teaching elder'. Its interesting that Archbishop Richard Fitzralph organised a grain shipment to go to Exeter during the time of the black death as the black death was rampant in England before it came to Ireland. The black death literally wiped put whole communities all over Europe. The Ireland of today be it either the Republic of Ireland or Northern Ireland are totally different places from those of the past. Everyone now has access to education and there is also a national health service in Northern Ireland were Doctors appointments are free and most drugs and prescriptions are free also. The majority of people in Northern Ireland do not have health insurance through their employer and you can pay for private health insurance but most do not. There are many excellent universities in Ireland including University College Dublin and Queens University in Belfast etc. Technical education is also open to all through regional colleges and training schemes. Ireland is a totally changed place now to live and prosperity is available for all and no one church has dominance over anyone. I trust that you come and visit both the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland and see what life is like all over Ireland.
There is no state church in Scotland (as stated on its website). The Church of Scotland has the traditional status of "national church" but church and state are completely separate (neither interferes with the other) unlike in England where the monarchy, government, Parliament and the Church are politically connected.
What about the inquisition in Spain? Also France persecuted Protestants. Burned and tortured to death..The Roman Catholic Church has lots to answer ..I pray for peace and The King of Kings to soften hearts on all sides..Unite and pray together in Jesus name .❤
@warrenpaine Catholics were not allowed to build Catholic Churches, until the 1800's. The English (Angle, Jute (from Denmark), Saxon (from North Germany) and "Normans" (originally from Denmark)), have a lot to answer for.
Interesting question at the end. Part of my family came from Dublin. They did not betray their faith. We have never been a particularly religious family and I did not go to church for many years, but when I tried to answer the question honestly, I found that I could not betray the faith. I would try to keep it in spite of the difficulties. But and it is a large but, whether I have the courage to keep that resolution in the face of execution is questionable. I am what I am. I was born Manx and a Catholic in a very Protestant island so I faced minor discrimination as a child.
My maternal great-great-grandmother, as a young woman. Carried stones in her apron (as did other people). To fend of attackers. When they went to Mass, at a Mass rock.
Repetitive. Ireland has been a Republic for 100 years. If the Catholic Church had really wanted a national cathedral in Dublin, there would’ve been one. I was told that in the early 1920s, the Church of Ireland offered ONE of the two Dublin Anglican cathedrals. The Roman Catholic Cardinal passed on the offer.
This didn't really answer the question. I knew all the historical information given but why after gaining independence didn't the new Irish government not just reassign either Christchurch or St Patríck's to be the Catholic cathedral of Dublin once again. Even if this wasn't done immediately when maybe provoking the British might not have been top of the agenda why wasn't it done say when the Republic of Ireland came into being decades later? This wasn't answered.
Also I find it a little off using what I can only assume it's an AI generated voice of Sir David Attenborough. I won't be subscribing to the channel for this reason.
There would have been a huge hullabaloo if the state had taken one denomination's property and handed it to another. Especially at the time when the young state was anxious to show how even handed it was to different religions. Even the voting system was designed to favour widely dispersed minorities (like the protestants in the south) and president and Taoiseach attended the investiture of the chief rabbi from early days.
We have Rights and Laws etc. But they mean nothing if people dont actually realise they have them and use them. You dont need a lock on a cell door if the prisoner inside is convinced its locked tight. They wont try n open it. Likewise, if the majority of church going catholics arent aware that their Cathedral isnt actually catholic, then it presents no problems. So why waste money on a Cathedral they dont need. Although on the other hand, if it had been a significant problem since 1922, then maybe a new one would have been built.
For various reasons it would not have been proper for the Irish government to do this but I'm wondering why the Church of Ireland itself didn't assign just one of the great Dublin churches to the RCC. I also don't know if the RCC asked for this?
@@louisfinegan4546 I would agree if there wasn't another cathedral within easy walking distance protestants could go to. I'm not Catholic but I find this situation very odd. I also find it odd that it wasn't done because after reading one of Fintan O'Toole's books and having done some recent historical research I didn't realise how the Catholic church in Ireland was so intertwined with politics in many nefarious ways and basically ran the country for many years without actually being rejected to do so. Would it, apart from the initial outcry, have caused that much of a problem to revert one of the two cathedrals back to being a Catholic one. I think building a new one would be completely unfeasible and costly.
A bit one-sided. Do you not know about the horrors of the Church of Rome in the UK under "Bloody Mary"? She had over 300 people burned at the stake for religious errors, whereas from my recollection, the figures for other monarchs of her era were in single digits. Besides, Ireland has had full legislative independence since 1931, so if they had wanted a Church of Rome cathedral in Dublin, my guess is they would have built one by now.
I'm trying to figure out how to get this guy's videos off my recommendation list. Several of his Irish videos were ridiculously one-sided and negative, and he selectively quotes research if he bothers with research at all.
@@themaskedman221 I thought there was some sort of button. If nothing else, you could do a thumbs-down when you have opened something, but otherwise not open any of his videos. The algorithms will eventually stop bothering, as I understand them.
Wow. Two hundred for Elizabeth is hardly "single digits." And let's not forget everyone Henry VIII killed including one of the finest men the world has ever produced: Sir/St. Thomas More. This is also rather personal as I was a Carthusian and May 4 is the feast of the Carthusian Martyrs. Henry was so vicious that he couldn't even leave contemplative monks alone. This, of course, was in advance of his suppression of the monasteries, but at least then he did not kill all the monks and nuns, just banished them so that he could give their property to his friends. Rather than being "one-sided" this video does not tell the half of it.
@ValorandVice Dreadful and cynical abuse of Sir David Attenborough’s voice with AI.. This abuse of people’s voices needs to be stopped immediately. (And .. David would never spell Valour as Valor ! ) Unsubscribed
@@Mancozeb100 I paid for it fairy and squarely, and it wasn’t advertised to me as his voice, but one of a certain British man and I liked it. And know many voice actors who sound like him for pay and I respect their hustle. If it happened to sound like that of a rich British aristocrat, he can sue my provider. Outside that, we little guys will use the best voice for our work as I am not his serf so owes him nothing.
There are less than 2 million Episcopalians (formerly Anglicans) in the entire USA, but the so-called "National Cathedral" in Washington DC is Episcopalian.
It was named the National Cathedral by the Episcopalians themselves. It has no official status outside of the Episcopal Church. State funerals are often held there because it's the only Protestant church in DC that's big enough
We have more capacity in Cathedrals and Churchrs in Ireland than we have people attending. In fact, we have way too many. A church is not built on stone or rock but on people. On this rock, I will build my church, referred to Peter. More than eight centuries ago, St. Francis heard the Lord's call to “rebuild my Church.” The saint quickly realized this commission was much bigger than bricks and stones. It meant caring for the poor, reigniting people's faith, and spreading the Gospel in a world fallen into disrepair. That calling is still very much alive today in the universal (Catholic) church. The people are the Church, always have been, always will.
Ironically, after independence the Catholic church continued the oppression of the English occupiers, especially in the areas of social and family life, dictating how people should live and behave, punishing them if they broke the unwritten rules. The Catholic church became a law unto themselves, creating a country that could not move forward either socially, politically or economically. It wasn't until the 1980s until the realities of the horrors of the Catholic institutions began to be exposed as many of the victims whose lives had been devastated started to speak out. They were joined by the hundreds of thousands who had remained silent all those decades as they had lived in fear of retribution from those institutions. Finally, the country united as a democracy against the evils of the church and voted with its feet to become the progressive, inclusive and economic powerhouse it is today.
Whereas many Irish Church officials committed grave sins against many people in Ireland, leaving the Church is apostasy and those who have done so are at great risk of losing their salvation.
Why is there no mention of Prime Minister Gladstone's liberal UK government DISESTABLISHMENT of the Anglican Church of Ireland in 1869-71? The oppressive tithes were stopped, and the Church of Ireland's wealth was CONFISCATED and ploughed into big national road-building and infrastructure projects in Ireland. The Anglicans were allowed to keep their buildings, but that of course was a mixed blessing, they need upkeep. This video gives the impression that these oppressions continued until the 1970s Troubles. Strange omission, no?
The faithful Irish (Catholics) had two fine Cathedrals alright built and consecrated, only to have both confiscated at sword and gunpoint for use by the Protestant defectors. Having an enduring faith in God's Divine Providence, the Catholics endured the loss, suffering and dispossession, living in hope of the rightful return of these buildings to Dublin's true faithful.
@@kc8485 A bit exaggerated there. The reason why the Catholic faith survived in Ireland is because it wasn't nearly as suppressed as people like you seem to think.
The Church of England doesn’t exist outside of England (every country gets its own standalone Anglican or Episcopal Church). The Church of Ireland is the Anglican church in both the Republic and Northern Ireland. According to another commenter, above, the C of I made the offer to the Roman Catholic hierarchy of one of the cathedrals (a wonderful gesture, IMHO-why would the C of I need two cathedrals in the same city?), but the hierarchy hasn’t taken them up on the offer. I’m sure the Catholic faithful would love to have an old historic cathedral back (or else construct a proper new one)-what will the “Notre Dame of Dublin” be in the future (to reference another historic cathedral whose recent renaissance thrilled the world!)? 😊
They could just drop the "pro" from St. Mary's and make it the cathedral. The cathedral is wherever the archbishop officially places his seat. Both the RC and Anglican churches are in serious decline in Ireland and perhaps have more serious things to worry about. Like spreading the gospel.
Your narration neglects to mention that Roman Catholics all over the British Isles were treated as second-class Citizens...not just on the Island of Ireland...and it is convenient in the current 'climate' for Dublin NOT to have a permanent Cathedral...who wants to be reminded of the abuse of countless young people by Clergy operating within the RC Church Establishment and the fearsome abuse meted out by sadistic Nuns on unmarried mothers as recently as 30years ago...dgp/uk
Interestingly, Catholics in the newly acquired “Province of Quebec” were the first in the British Empire to gain official status. In 1774, as troubles were brewing in the 13 Colonies, the British were afraid of losing all possessions in North America. So they tried a gamble: they gave Catholics in the Province e of Quebec (formerly the “Canada” part of New France) the right to practice their faith, and the Catholic Church could claim the tithe, establish schools and seminaries, and ordain new priests and bishops. This was the Quebec Act of 1774. (This law also gave a legal status to the French language, which is the reason French is still spoken in Eastern Canada. Also, it enlarged the province to include also the Ohio Valley - which was a way to control colonists from the 13 Colonies and it became a reason why these colonies seceded.)
Thank you for this. It has always bothered me that you have to pay to enter these buildings held by Protestant Churches. These buildings still hold ownership of great Catholic icons. At least give the Catholic Church back these icons including the ancient baptismal founts and stone Bishop chairs. That is what I pray for. They are making big money on the literal bones in the ground. I read the comments, about abuse, etc, as if abuse is only a Catholic issue. So many beautiful Catholics who love their faith, their Sacraments, and Jesus Christ, King of Kings, how about supporting them. In the end, it is not about the buildings, but the faith inside. Possibly the Catholic Church doesnt even want them back, who knows. But the icons are precious. They hold the spirits of our Catholic ancestors who endured through struggle both inside and outside their ancient Catholic Faith. Thank you.
One of the churches in my Parish is St. Lawrence O'Toole in Ironton. That Saint was the Archbishop of Dublin. Of course most Irish Catholics are in the US now. I am one of them.
Despite the unfair treatment visited upon the Catholics, I can't help but think about what the Catholic Church did to non-Catholics as a result of the Protestant Reformation. The Inquisition that engulfed Jews and Muslims, who had nothing to do with the Reformation, yet they were forced to convert, tortured or expelled from Spain and later Portugal and the Inquisition did not officially end for nearly 500 years. I don't support the mistreatment of any group, but the things that went on at the hands of the Church, make it a little more difficult to feel too much sympathy when their actions came around to bite innocent Catholics in the behind. I can sort of understand why Protestant denominations might have felt such strong emotions against the Catholics. It's not right, but human emotions don't usually cause us to act rationally. As an atheist, I would probably have fallen under their reign of terror.
You're confusing the Spanish Inquisition, under the "Catholic Monarchs", with the Roman or Catholic Inquisition, under the direction of the Church. Curiously, many of today's descendants of early Spanish colonists in modern-day New Mexico have Semitic DNA, not sure if it's from Spanish Jews or Moors.
Technically you are right. But there is St Mary's Procathedral in Marlborough Street in the city centre which is a lovely classical building and certainly fit for an Archbishop. Also denominations are far less important today than they were. While a Catholic, I graduated from the nominally protestant Trinity College and I do like to listen to Anglican evensong when I can as the music is so lovely and more to my taste than the modern music you get in so many Catholic churches (including St Mary's procathedral). My preference is attend mass with no music so I can concentrate on the sacrament and word.
I was keen to watch this but between the awful background music and the speed of the narration I couldn't get past the first couple of minutes. I don't understand why so many TH-camrs insist on unnecessary distracting background noise.
Why is this story being narrated by a man with an English RP accent? As he's telling us, the English are the ethnic group that ruled and oppressed Ireland for over eight centuries? Odd.
Not quite true the word tithe is misleading the tax to the Deanery was only for ground rent if your cottage was built on church land, payments in church was a convenient way of collecting the rent, but some landlords were entitled to be paid rent if they owned land, but this narrative has been used by the labour party to say that is exactly the reason that the Welsh rejected Christianity because they didn't want to put money in the church collection box but it paid for their local schools and adminstration and when David Lloyd George abolished the church in Wales they had already rejected it in the 9th century and were paying "tythes" they were paying council taxes they used the word tythes because the Welsh felt that they were tied to us and resented it.
It is surprising the opportunity to build a mega cathedral was not taken during the post WW2 era of RC fanaticism viz. JC McQuaid and Galway's Taj. The bubble burst with a vengeance. Good luck trying to build a small hut now.
and think of all the Dublin male children that escaped sexual abuse and/or rape. Even considering the protestants had their own share of the same in their churches I suspect this is a significant positive of historical events for the city. Long live the continuance of the transformation1
Catholics CAN and DO pray anywhere. That's not the point. The point is that Anglicans stole Dublin's Catholic Cathedrals and haven't returned them. Shouldn't that upset anyone concerned with social justice?
Thanks. Fascinating - I can't recall this being discussed. Years ago I was at an event in St.Mary's Pro-cathedral, wow, it was really crappy in a congested part of Dublin if I recall correctly. I assume the Church of Ireland has jurisdiction - I wonder if they ever considered relinquishing just one of the 2 great cathedrals in Dublin or if the RCC ever asked for this? Of course, there is the beautiful St, Mary;s Cathedral in Limerick dating I think from the 12thC also Church of Ireland.
Since the Reformation, all the Medieval pre-Reformation Churches and Cathedrals have been Protestant. With the Disestablishment of the Anglican Church (1871), there was a flurry of Catholic Church building in Ireland. I was in Norwich Cathedral Norfolk England Summer 2024. The wonderful tour guide brought to life what the Cathedral looked like before the Reformation. Beautiful Protestanism Grey Catholism Colour. I have never heard a tour guide mention this in either of the Dublin Medieval Cathedrals. Back in the Day the Reformers smashed and dashed what they considered to be Catholic, pure vandalism.
The reason why the RCC haven't demanded their cathedrals be returned to them is the fact that they are damned expensive to run. Both cathedrals are now only kept going by their use for events, concerts, tourism etc. Their parishioners are not large and not wealthy. The RCC don't want any more expense after all the compensations they have to pay out to their child abuse victims.
@MV12379 that just is not true. Dublin, for instance, was founded in 988, though there are reports dating back to the 2nd century when it was known as Eblana. Are you one of those idiots who insists that colonisation was a good thing, glossing over the misery and hardships it caused all over the world? The British education system has a lot to answer for!!
Have we really 'advanced' that much as a result of the the clear decline of Religious Devotion in Ireland. The number of murders, especially of woman in Ireland over the past few years is truly shocking
You do realize you're quoting religions, right? And then contradicting yourself? Why make any moral assertions if all efforts at morality are corrupt? Why tell other people to "do no harm" or "love their neighbors" if each individual is their own power and authority? I think you've been misled by people who are either simple-minded, sinister, or both. I will pray that you find your way out of the mental and spiritual wilderness.
This is based on the assumption that the Protestant Reformation was a nationalist and colonial movement, when in fact it was intended to be an improvement of a corrupt faith. Every Irish person had the same opportunity as everybody else to convert. But you characterize that decision as traitorous. It didn't have to be that way.
You obviously were never told that the Catholics had to pay fees to the head protestant churches in Ireland. The laity didn't know it but, the local Priests had to pass the money over. Protestant Ledgers have recorded these funds.
So....the Pro cathedral does not exist, plus the Arch bishop of Dublin's parish church is the oh so small church on Westland Row, but it's much more important to push this bs, well done.
Far to much "religion" in Ireland .. and it's brought nothing but pain and misery to millions of Irish people. And now we have invited in another one which is arguably the worst of all of them .... we never learn.
The protestants have two cathedrals, let them give or return one to the Catholic religion. Better still let them share the cathederals. The 500 schisim is a nonsense.
The Catholic church is estimated to have slaughtered circa fifty million souls. No wonder Christians recognise papacy as anti Christ, stained with the blood of the martyred saints.
@@exercisethemind Ireland's curse was that it was dominated by two foreign powers the Church of Rome and England. England killed millions of Irish bodies through war and famine and Rome destroyed millions of souls. I'm glad Ireland is free of the UK and getting free of Rome.
This is fascinating, I am Catholic,but I attend an Episcopal Church, I listen to Pope Francis for guidance on TH-cam, I love the Modern-day Catholic Church
This is crammed full of hyperbole and bias. What is worse is that inaccuracies abound and there is not a single mention of the building of Irish Catholic Cathedrals in Victoria's reign. Some of these (and there are many) are noted for their size, lavish equipage and fine acoustics. Perhaps the writer ought to visit towns and cities outside The Pale. We have treasures he/she/it needs to see. In a mere 20 years, however, the key deity worshiped here is the Euro with 'celebrities' in the media and booze being next. I am old now and would not have believed that a small pseudo-nation like this Rep of Ireland could become so venal and immoral, so violent, uncaring and unjust. We lost democracy in the process and would not qualify for EU were an application being made now instead of 1973. We vote but votes are directed by a perverted system of transferred votes. The church leaders are, sadly, part of the top elite echelon. DO VISIT.
Wrong... There is a Mary's Catholic Cathedral in the City centre in Dublin and many more all over Ireland. Get your facts right. Ballaghaderreen County Roscommon has a large Catholic Cathedral. Just saying! It's posh to be a Catholic.
I think they are hanging their hat on the fact that St. Mary's is a Pro-Cathedral meaning it is temporary or standing in for the real cathedral. I think that stems from the fact that both St. Patrick's and Christchurch were originally dedicated as RC Cathedrals. The church probably felt it shouldn't accept the "taking" of the already invested cathedrals. Give them a chance it's only been 500 years or so.
Marys is a pro cathedral, that just means it's where the Arch Bishop of Dublin is based. It would loses it pro cathedral status if the Arch Bishop moves to a different church, and it would just become a normal church. This almost happened last year.
Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways submit to him, and he will make your paths straight. -Proverbs 3:5-6
Yes you would be wrong. You are confusing politics with religion. When young one tends to be more left wing and as one gets older one tends to drift to the right. As one gets older one tends to take matters of faith more seriously.
Chris Hitchens was an over rated old drunk. He was good at pointing out the faults of religious people and they are many but he could never disprove the existence of God. No one can.
@@exercisethemind Wrong, we found out about all the Churches crimes, then the Church left the Irish state to pay out over 2 Billion to the Churches victims and the people walked away from the Church
Christ church cathedral is dublins catholic cathedral Henry the eight of England broke away from Rome and he confiscated the cathedral for his new prodiseant religion
In the 1920s, the Catholic church was given its choice of sites on O'Connell St. in Dublin to build its cathederal. They said: *No, we want the Protestant cathederals or nothing.* In the end, they got nothing.
I lived near Christ Church Cathedral in Dublin and I'm not religious but, I got a shock its o.k. to enter but a tour of the basement where Strongbow Richard De Clare is buried one must pay. 5 euros I remember maybe more now.
@@janettedavis6627 I'm descended from Strongbow & his wife, the daughter of King Dermot McMurrough, but I'm not too crazy about the idea of paying to visit their crypt. Should I ever visit Dublin, shall settle for a visit to the burial spot in St. Patrick's Cathedral of Dean Swift, my sixth great-grandmother Anne Swift Perry's first cousin.
Protestants are sectarians. It's in the name. But you are welcome to return to the one holy catholic and apostolic faith. We love you and pray for your redemption.
Thomas Cromwell became a multi-billionaire overnight in today's money by stealing Catholic lands in England and all his future heirs continued the theft of catholic lands, especially his tyrannical murderous great, great grandson Oliver Cromwell who murdered and enslaved millions of Irish Catholics. The greatest transfer of wealth in British history occurred from Catholics to a few prominent 'Protestants' in the 16th and 17th centuries. English Catholics were always Roman Catholics but the Irish were Irish Catholics until English control of Ireland. So England bends the Irish Catholics to become 'Romanised' and then they want to steal their lands because they are not 'Protestant'. LOL
Oliver Cromwell went to Ireland to steal all Catholic lands. He was a 'Puritan' protestant, anti-King created the first Republic and hated Christmas. That's why the Puritans who migrated to America banned the celebration of Christmas for nearly a hundred years.
You are so confused. The word Roman was added to Catholics by the Anglicans as they wanted to claim they were Catholic as well. It was a way to differentiate them from Anglicans.
David is a bit confused. Ulster scots led by england ' confiscated' native land instead of behaving as immigrants and respecting local people and culture.
Those 4% Protestant of Dublin should give one of their two cathedrals back to the Catholic Church who built them. A fine ecumenical gesture that would be.
Catholic churches in England the same, Anglicanism forced on English Catholics who apostasized for temporal, nationalistic rulers contradicting the apostles who founded the Church solely on the Kingdom of Christ.
They have actually made that offer. But the Roman Catholic hierarchy has never responded to it. Old cathedral buildings are marvelous objects to claim to be denied of, but horrendously costly to own & care for. Someone has decided there's more mileage to gained in complaining than maintaining.
Canada here. My Irish Catholic ancestors found an answer 200 years ago when they immigrated to Canada. They could be free, own their own land, and live on their own terms. My family, despite the hardships of a pioneer beginning, has prospered here.
American Irish Catholic here. I'm happy to hear that. And I won't make any cracks about making Canada the 51st state.
Unfortunately it was someone else’s land
@@genevievedolan1288You don’t own anything you cannot defend - as the Irish found out to their cost, and wisely chose not to repeat in the Canadian and American colonies. My ancestors were one family that came this way - and I’m not the slightest bit sorry.
@@genevievedolan1288 As it is where you live as well.
Yes, members of my Irish family are nearly all gone from their homeland. They were either transported or migrated to mostly Australia and Canada, with a smaller number going to the USA. There are over 100 million members of the Irish diaspora worldwide. If all of us had been welcome to stay part of the UK and given food and equal rights instead of bigotry and starvation, we might be the majority there now. 😁☘
For many years the Catholic Archdiocese of Dublin owned the park of Merrion Square. It once planned to build a cathedral there. However, it was always fairly clear that it was not a suitable site. A cathedral there would have ruined the integrity of the Georgian square. The Archdiocese later presented the park to the city and it is now a public park.
Cathedrals have.been built in Georgian surroundings. There seems to be no intrinsic logic to your comment. Perhaps it just needs clarification?
Dubliners are justly proud of the Roman Catholic pro- cathedral. It is a beautiful neoclassical Doric temple of restrained dignity with acoustic properties ideal for the Palestrina Palestrina
Interesting Prime Minister Benjamin Diisrailis father converted from Judaism to Protestantism because of upward mobility in Victorian England
It is unlikely Disraeli would have been Prime Minister of the UK in the nineteenth century if he were a practicing Jew.
I have been to Dublin in 1996 and (being a Lutheran myself) was stunned by the fact that both cathedrals are Anglican (euphemism: Church of Ireland). Even more appalling I found the Union Jack battle flags decoration in the interior of St Patricks. Clear relics of the British suppression of the Irish nation.
The flags are the regimental colours of Irish Regiments in the British Army, When colours are retired they are usually displayed in the appropriate local cathedral, a long standing tradition. We Irish have a proud history of service in the Armed Forces of the UK, as far back as the 100 Years War.
@@paulkelly8456You certainly do as well as well as rebuilding Britain after WW2.
@@paulkelly8456Well said , the Irish are our fellow brethren under God , King & country
If they choose to rebel against the true teachings of the Christian faith & Gods appointed king then they only bring harm amongst themselves
Go and study the real history.
@@paulkelly8456 😂, that's a laughable circular reasoning. If anything that's gives a sad extra illustration of the points in the video. "Retired to", makes the Church an appendage of the military & the secular. A neutral memorial of those who fought to free is far more respectful and appropriate.
The elephant in the room that has gone unmentioned here is the emergence of the many stories of abuse of one sort or another that have emerged in Ireland since the early 1980s, many of them involving the Catholic church, or people embedded within it. That is the predominant fact that has led to the collapse in churchgoing in recent decades. That the church was so powerful in Irish society, only seems to have made instances of abuse more widespread, and the desire to shield the church from scandal led to massive coverups.
This is a pivotal reason for the growing secularisation in Ireland.
The mistreatment of the Irish resulted in a form of spirituality that helped them survive, a severe, penitential faith.
American Irish liberals arrived, a new freedom now for the Irish, a healing, but likewise breakdown of family and love of all human life.
indeed and the Irish Times will not report abuse in Smylie's protestant homes and the latest inquiry is solely into abuse in schools run by catholic religious orders as if it did not happen in Protestant schools. That is the anti Catholic elephant in the room.
@@MavourneenKathleen-l5j'American Irish liberals'? Really? Really?
True, but abuse is found everywhere: other denominations, professions and institutions that put predators in close proximity to children and other vulnerable victims, etc. But the current culture is virulently anti-Catholic, so the Catholic Church is singled out as THE villain.
The state church in Scotland is the Presbyterian Church of Scotland. Presbyterians do not worship in Cathedrals. In Ireland dissenting Presbyterian s were also discriminated against with their meeting houses being built on the outskirts of cities. The church of Ireland was the Anglican church of Ireland and Anglicans were the dominant group over both Roman Catholics and dissenting protestants. The church of Ireland and the Roman Catholic Church have Archbishops of Armagh as their Primates, Armagh was the place chosen by St Patrick to become the centre of celtic Christianity in Ireland. The Archbishop of Armagh has the title of Archbishop of Armagh and Primate metropolitan within the church of Ireland. Armagh is also seen as the ecclesiastical capital of Ireland and the Archbishop of Dublin is second in rank under the Archbishop of Armagh.
When the Normans came to Ireland they built cities and lived separately from the gaelic irish. When Archbishop Richard Fitzralph was consecrated as Archbishop of Armagh at Exeter Cathedral this followed by a procession through the streets of Exeter. Archbishop Richard Fitzralph consecration as Archbishop of Armagh was supported by the Pope at that time whose 'seat' was at Avignon in France. Once Archbishop Richard Fitzralph came to Ireland the 'chapter' or governing clergy of the Cathedral at Armagh refused to recognise him. He was 'recognised' by the Pope but not recognised by the Gaelic Irish 'chapter' or priests that administered the Cathedral at Armagh. Archbishop Richard Fitzralph subsequently established his 'Cathedral' at the town of Drogheda which was still within the province of Armagh. The preaching friars then tried to get rid of Archbishop Richard Fitzralph and they accused him of many things because Archbishop Fitzralph had highlighted the fact that they had taken a vow of poverty yet they were getting money from the people in order to say 'masses' for them in their friary while the local priest was not getting to say the funeral Mass for the people. The local priests also had a poor education simply because the friars with all their money were able to 'buy up' all the theology books.
Archbishop Richard Fitzralph was subsequently accused of many things and had to 'give account' of himself before the Pope whose 'seat' was then at Avignon. Archbishop Richard Fitzralph then went to Avignon in France and lived under house arrest under the supervision of the Pope. He was still allowed to preach sermons at masses attended by the Pope and ultimately his 'trial' never took place as Archbishop Richard Fitzralph died at Avignon before this could happen. Persecution in Ireland has happened to numerous groups and not just those of the Roman Catholic faith. You could say that Archbishop Richard Fitzralph was persecuted out of Ireland by the preaching friars.
The history of Ireland is far more complicated than what you might expect. Presbyterian persecution meant that even total communities emigrated to the new world in 17th century in order to have religious freedom and to practice their form of worship without being under the control of Bishops or Archbishop. Each Presbyterian congregation is a totally separate unit and appointments its own minister who is referred to as the 'teaching elder'. Its interesting that Archbishop Richard Fitzralph organised a grain shipment to go to Exeter during the time of the black death as the black death was rampant in England before it came to Ireland. The black death literally wiped put whole communities all over Europe.
The Ireland of today be it either the Republic of Ireland or Northern Ireland are totally different places from those of the past. Everyone now has access to education and there is also a national health service in Northern Ireland were Doctors appointments are free and most drugs and prescriptions are free also. The majority of people in Northern Ireland do not have health insurance through their employer and you can pay for private health insurance but most do not.
There are many excellent universities in Ireland including University College Dublin and Queens University in Belfast etc.
Technical education is also open to all through regional colleges and training schemes.
Ireland is a totally changed place now to live and prosperity is available for all and no one church has dominance over anyone. I trust that you come and visit both the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland and see what life is like all over Ireland.
That was a really interesting read although your depiction of Ireland today is too rosy.
There is no state church in Scotland (as stated on its website). The Church of Scotland has the traditional status of "national church" but church and state are completely separate (neither interferes with the other) unlike in England where the monarchy, government, Parliament and the Church are politically connected.
What about the inquisition in Spain? Also France persecuted Protestants. Burned and tortured to death..The Roman Catholic Church has lots to answer ..I pray for peace and The King of Kings to soften hearts on all sides..Unite and pray together in Jesus name .❤
According to Google there are currently 27 Roman Catholic Cathedrals across Ireland.
Yes. And non in Dublin. And pro cathedral are temporary locations, not real cathedrals.
Uniformly ugly! No St.Patrick's, Christchurch..for sure.
@@ValorandVice How many Catholic Churches in Dublin?
@warrenpaine Catholics were not allowed to build Catholic Churches, until the 1800's.
The English (Angle, Jute (from Denmark), Saxon (from North Germany) and "Normans" (originally from Denmark)), have a lot to answer for.
@@ValorandVice Oh the oppression. No Catholic cathedrals in Dublin, yet 27 across Ireland, and numerous Catholic churches in Dublin.
Interesting question at the end. Part of my family came from Dublin. They did not betray their faith. We have never been a particularly religious family and I did not go to church for many years, but when I tried to answer the question honestly, I found that I could not betray the faith. I would try to keep it in spite of the difficulties. But and it is a large but, whether I have the courage to keep that resolution in the face of execution is questionable. I am what I am. I was born Manx and a Catholic in a very Protestant island so I faced minor discrimination as a child.
My maternal great-great-grandmother, as a young woman. Carried stones in her apron (as did other people). To fend of attackers. When they went to Mass, at a Mass rock.
Repetitive.
Ireland has been a Republic for 100 years. If the Catholic Church had really wanted a national cathedral in Dublin, there would’ve been one.
I was told that in the early 1920s, the Church of Ireland offered ONE of the two Dublin Anglican cathedrals. The Roman Catholic Cardinal passed on the offer.
They would not match the standard of Zacchaeus the Tax Collector huh?
No longer Catholic Ireland
@@Polfeck21 they should have become Protestants
God Bless the Catholic Church
This didn't really answer the question. I knew all the historical information given but why after gaining independence didn't the new Irish government not just reassign either Christchurch or St Patríck's to be the Catholic cathedral of Dublin once again. Even if this wasn't done immediately when maybe provoking the British might not have been top of the agenda why wasn't it done say when the Republic of Ireland came into being decades later? This wasn't answered.
Also I find it a little off using what I can only assume it's an AI generated voice of Sir David Attenborough. I won't be subscribing to the channel for this reason.
There would have been a huge hullabaloo if the state had taken one denomination's property and handed it to another. Especially at the time when the young state was anxious to show how even handed it was to different religions. Even the voting system was designed to favour widely dispersed minorities (like the protestants in the south) and president and Taoiseach attended the investiture of the chief rabbi from early days.
We have Rights and Laws etc. But they mean nothing if people dont actually realise they have them and use them. You dont need a lock on a cell door if the prisoner inside is convinced its locked tight. They wont try n open it. Likewise, if the majority of church going catholics arent aware that their Cathedral isnt actually catholic, then it presents no problems. So why waste money on a Cathedral they dont need. Although on the other hand, if it had been a significant problem since 1922, then maybe a new one would have been built.
For various reasons it would not have been proper for the Irish government to do this but I'm wondering why the Church of Ireland itself didn't assign just one of the great Dublin churches to the RCC. I also don't know if the RCC asked for this?
@@louisfinegan4546 I would agree if there wasn't another cathedral within easy walking distance protestants could go to. I'm not Catholic but I find this situation very odd. I also find it odd that it wasn't done because after reading one of Fintan O'Toole's books and having done some recent historical research I didn't realise how the Catholic church in Ireland was so intertwined with politics in many nefarious ways and basically ran the country for many years without actually being rejected to do so. Would it, apart from the initial outcry, have caused that much of a problem to revert one of the two cathedrals back to being a Catholic one. I think building a new one would be completely unfeasible and costly.
You never mentioned that Dublin used to be at least 1/3 Protestant and that most of them had to leave because of ethnic cleansing.
Go back to bed, only ethnic cleansing that ever happened in Ireland was at the hands of Protestants or British.
Where is your evidence of Etnic Cleansing in Dublin.
@@triestodrum2215 why lie. Only documented cases of ethnic cleansing happened at the hands of Britain, Protestants and the orange order
A bit one-sided. Do you not know about the horrors of the Church of Rome in the UK under "Bloody Mary"? She had over 300 people burned at the stake for religious errors, whereas from my recollection, the figures for other monarchs of her era were in single digits.
Besides, Ireland has had full legislative independence since 1931, so if they had wanted a Church of Rome cathedral in Dublin, my guess is they would have built one by now.
I'm trying to figure out how to get this guy's videos off my recommendation list. Several of his Irish videos were ridiculously one-sided and negative, and he selectively quotes research if he bothers with research at all.
@@themaskedman221 I thought there was some sort of button. If nothing else, you could do a thumbs-down when you have opened something, but otherwise not open any of his videos. The algorithms will eventually stop bothering, as I understand them.
Wow. Two hundred for Elizabeth is hardly "single digits." And let's not forget everyone Henry VIII killed including one of the finest men the world has ever produced: Sir/St. Thomas More. This is also rather personal as I was a Carthusian and May 4 is the feast of the Carthusian Martyrs. Henry was so vicious that he couldn't even leave contemplative monks alone. This, of course, was in advance of his suppression of the monasteries, but at least then he did not kill all the monks and nuns, just banished them so that he could give their property to his friends. Rather than being "one-sided" this video does not tell the half of it.
Her Father had about ten more executed including three of his wives.
@ValorandVice
Dreadful and cynical abuse of Sir David Attenborough’s voice with AI..
This abuse of people’s voices needs to be stopped immediately.
(And .. David would never spell Valour as Valor ! )
Unsubscribed
It isn’t his voice, and the American spelling is more aesthetically appealing and commonplace, but thanks.
Surely it’s an AI version of his voice … is it your voice then ??
@@Mancozeb100 I paid for it fairy and squarely, and it wasn’t advertised to me as his voice, but one of a certain British man and I liked it. And know many voice actors who sound like him for pay and I respect their hustle. If it happened to sound like that of a rich British aristocrat, he can sue my provider. Outside that, we little guys will use the best voice for our work as I am not his serf so owes him nothing.
@ 🤦♂️ Contradiction Overload !! Bye!
There are less than 2 million Episcopalians (formerly Anglicans) in the entire USA, but the so-called "National Cathedral" in Washington DC is Episcopalian.
It was named the National Cathedral by the Episcopalians themselves. It has no official status outside of the Episcopal Church. State funerals are often held there because it's the only Protestant church in DC that's big enough
@@kevinmorgan8534 It's very impressive and beautiful. A fitting "National Cathedral" for America.
But isn't the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception, also in DC, the largest church structure (albeit Roman Catholic) in the United States?
@@warrenpaine Curiously, the only US President entombed in the "National Cathedral" is Woodrow Wilson, a Presbyterian.
@@BenjaminHawkins-gk8wnYes.
We have more capacity in Cathedrals and Churchrs in Ireland than we have people attending. In fact, we have way too many. A church is not built on stone or rock but on people. On this rock, I will build my church, referred to Peter. More than eight centuries ago, St. Francis heard the Lord's call to “rebuild my Church.” The saint quickly realized this commission was much bigger than bricks and stones. It meant caring for the poor, reigniting people's faith, and spreading the Gospel in a world fallen into disrepair. That calling is still very much alive today in the universal (Catholic) church. The people are the Church, always have been, always will.
Ironically, after independence the Catholic church continued the oppression of the English occupiers, especially in the areas of social and family life, dictating how people should live and behave, punishing them if they broke the unwritten rules. The Catholic church became a law unto themselves, creating a country that could not move forward either socially, politically or economically. It wasn't until the 1980s until the realities of the horrors of the Catholic institutions began to be exposed as many of the victims whose lives had been devastated started to speak out. They were joined by the hundreds of thousands who had remained silent all those decades as they had lived in fear of retribution from those institutions. Finally, the country united as a democracy against the evils of the church and voted with its feet to become the progressive, inclusive and economic powerhouse it is today.
Whereas many Irish Church officials committed grave sins against many people in Ireland, leaving the Church is apostasy and those who have done so are at great risk of losing their salvation.
Why is there no mention of Prime Minister Gladstone's liberal UK government DISESTABLISHMENT of the Anglican Church of Ireland in 1869-71? The oppressive tithes were stopped, and the Church of Ireland's wealth was CONFISCATED and ploughed into big national road-building and infrastructure projects in Ireland. The Anglicans were allowed to keep their buildings, but that of course was a mixed blessing, they need upkeep. This video gives the impression that these oppressions continued until the 1970s Troubles. Strange omission, no?
Across the water is Liverpool another
Irish catholic majority city with both a protestant and catholic cathedral
What's the problem? Build one FFS
Catholics already did. They were stolen.
Why bother, the Church cannot fill a Church on a Sunday anymore let alone a Cathedral
The faithful Irish (Catholics) had two fine Cathedrals alright built and consecrated, only to have both confiscated at sword and gunpoint for use by the Protestant defectors. Having an enduring faith in God's Divine Providence, the Catholics endured the loss, suffering and dispossession, living in hope of the rightful return of these buildings to Dublin's true faithful.
Liverpool East of Dublin.
@@kc8485 A bit exaggerated there. The reason why the Catholic faith survived in Ireland is because it wasn't nearly as suppressed as people like you seem to think.
St. Patrick’s Cathedral should be returned by The Church of England.
The Church of England doesn’t exist outside of England (every country gets its own standalone Anglican or Episcopal Church). The Church of Ireland is the Anglican church in both the Republic and Northern Ireland. According to another commenter, above, the C of I made the offer to the Roman Catholic hierarchy of one of the cathedrals (a wonderful gesture, IMHO-why would the C of I need two cathedrals in the same city?), but the hierarchy hasn’t taken them up on the offer. I’m sure the Catholic faithful would love to have an old historic cathedral back (or else construct a proper new one)-what will the “Notre Dame of Dublin” be in the future (to reference another historic cathedral whose recent renaissance thrilled the world!)? 😊
@
The Church the British created - England conquered and killed so many people.
St. Mary’s, pro cathedral is Dublin’s catholic cathedral
They could just drop the "pro" from St. Mary's and make it the cathedral. The cathedral is wherever the archbishop officially places his seat. Both the RC and Anglican churches are in serious decline in Ireland and perhaps have more serious things to worry about. Like spreading the gospel.
It's not a cathedral.
Your narration neglects to mention that Roman Catholics all over the British Isles were treated as second-class Citizens...not just on the Island of Ireland...and it is convenient in the current 'climate' for Dublin NOT to have a permanent Cathedral...who wants to be reminded of the abuse of countless young people by Clergy operating within the RC Church Establishment and the fearsome abuse meted out by sadistic Nuns on unmarried mothers as recently as 30years ago...dgp/uk
Interestingly, Catholics in the newly acquired “Province of Quebec” were the first in the British Empire to gain official status. In 1774, as troubles were brewing in the 13 Colonies, the British were afraid of losing all possessions in North America. So they tried a gamble: they gave Catholics in the Province e of Quebec (formerly the “Canada” part of New France) the right to practice their faith, and the Catholic Church could claim the tithe, establish schools and seminaries, and ordain new priests and bishops. This was the Quebec Act of 1774. (This law also gave a legal status to the French language, which is the reason French is still spoken in Eastern Canada. Also, it enlarged the province to include also the Ohio Valley - which was a way to control colonists from the 13 Colonies and it became a reason why these colonies seceded.)
Thank you for this. It has always bothered me that you have to pay to enter these buildings held by Protestant Churches. These buildings still hold ownership of great Catholic icons. At least give the Catholic Church back these icons including the ancient baptismal founts and stone Bishop chairs. That is what I pray for. They are making big money on the literal bones in the ground. I read the comments, about abuse, etc, as if abuse is only a Catholic issue. So many beautiful Catholics who love their faith, their Sacraments, and Jesus Christ, King of Kings, how about supporting them. In the end, it is not about the buildings, but the faith inside. Possibly the Catholic Church doesnt even want them back, who knows. But the icons are precious. They hold the spirits of our Catholic ancestors who endured through struggle both inside and outside their ancient Catholic Faith. Thank you.
Love the name of the channel lol
WRONG! We have St Mary's Pro Cathedral.
As I understand it, a cathedral is just the Bishop's church. I could well be wrong.
Why is it still called a pro-cathedral and not a cathedral?
One of the churches in my Parish is St. Lawrence O'Toole in Ironton. That Saint was the Archbishop of Dublin. Of course most Irish Catholics are in the US now. I am one of them.
Despite the unfair treatment visited upon the Catholics, I can't help but think about what the Catholic Church did to non-Catholics as a result of the Protestant Reformation. The Inquisition that engulfed Jews and Muslims, who had nothing to do with the Reformation, yet they were forced to convert, tortured or expelled from Spain and later Portugal and the Inquisition did not officially end for nearly 500 years. I don't support the mistreatment of any group, but the things that went on at the hands of the Church, make it a little more difficult to feel too much sympathy when their actions came around to bite innocent Catholics in the behind. I can sort of understand why Protestant denominations might have felt such strong emotions against the Catholics. It's not right, but human emotions don't usually cause us to act rationally. As an atheist, I would probably have fallen under their reign of terror.
You're confusing the Spanish Inquisition, under the "Catholic Monarchs", with the Roman or Catholic Inquisition, under the direction of the Church. Curiously, many of today's descendants of early Spanish colonists in modern-day New Mexico have Semitic DNA, not sure if it's from Spanish Jews or Moors.
@@BenjaminHawkins-gk8wnCorrect. Catholic Confessional States. I wish we had them today.
Technically you are right. But there is St Mary's Procathedral in Marlborough Street in the city centre which is a lovely classical building and certainly fit for an Archbishop. Also denominations are far less important today than they were. While a Catholic, I graduated from the nominally protestant Trinity College and I do like to listen to Anglican evensong when I can as the music is so lovely and more to my taste than the modern music you get in so many Catholic churches (including St Mary's procathedral). My preference is attend mass with no music so I can concentrate on the sacrament and word.
I thought there was a Presbyterian cathedral in Edinburgh. But Presbyterians don’t generally have cathedrals.
I was keen to watch this but between the awful background music and the speed of the narration I couldn't get past the first couple of minutes. I don't understand why so many TH-camrs insist on unnecessary distracting background noise.
Why is this story being narrated by a man with an English RP accent? As he's telling us, the English are the ethnic group that ruled and oppressed Ireland for over eight centuries? Odd.
Not quite true the word tithe is misleading the tax to the Deanery was only for ground rent if your cottage was built on church land, payments in church was a convenient way of collecting the rent, but some landlords were entitled to be paid rent if they owned land, but this narrative has been used by the labour party to say that is exactly the reason that the Welsh rejected Christianity because they didn't want to put money in the church collection box but it paid for their local schools and adminstration and when David Lloyd George abolished the church in Wales they had already rejected it in the 9th century and were paying "tythes" they were paying council taxes they used the word tythes because the Welsh felt that they were tied to us and resented it.
Very sad now that lots of Irish people have abandoned their faith and values. that so many Irish people died and were martyred for what.
I didnt know there was any such thing as a "Protestant Cathedral". I always thought Cathedrals were all Catholic, hence the "Cath" in Cathedral.
lol.
Some Protestant churches like Anglican Church does have cathedrals. It’s usually the high churches though.
the Cath in Chathedral means Chair I.e. the seat of Bishop
I presume that's supposed to be a joke!
@@michaelmccarthy9411 These days it's hard to tell.
It is surprising the opportunity to build a mega cathedral was not taken during the post WW2 era of RC fanaticism viz. JC McQuaid and Galway's Taj. The bubble burst with a vengeance. Good luck trying to build a small hut now.
and think of all the Dublin male children that escaped sexual abuse and/or rape. Even considering the protestants had their own share of the same in their churches I suspect this is a significant positive of historical events for the city. Long live the continuance of the transformation1
were you at the rock ? , those who believe do not need cathedrals to pray, and believe , in true cristianty!
Catholics CAN and DO pray anywhere. That's not the point. The point is that Anglicans stole Dublin's Catholic Cathedrals and haven't returned them. Shouldn't that upset anyone concerned with social justice?
Well i have been wrong for all these years. I thought that the Pro Cathedral was Catholic. Please enlighten me, i really want to know.
And today the Irish people are abandoning the Roman Catholic Church.
Thanks. Fascinating - I can't recall this being discussed. Years ago I was at an event in St.Mary's Pro-cathedral, wow, it was really crappy in a congested part of Dublin if I recall correctly. I assume the Church of Ireland has jurisdiction - I wonder if they ever considered relinquishing just one of the 2 great cathedrals in Dublin or if the RCC ever asked for this? Of course, there is the beautiful St, Mary;s Cathedral in Limerick dating I think from the 12thC also Church of Ireland.
Since the Reformation, all the Medieval pre-Reformation Churches and Cathedrals have been Protestant. With the Disestablishment of the Anglican Church (1871), there was a flurry of Catholic Church building in Ireland. I was in Norwich Cathedral Norfolk England Summer 2024. The wonderful tour guide brought to life what the Cathedral looked like before the Reformation. Beautiful Protestanism Grey Catholism Colour. I have never heard a tour guide mention this in either of the Dublin Medieval Cathedrals. Back in the Day the Reformers smashed and dashed what they considered to be Catholic, pure vandalism.
The reason why the RCC haven't demanded their cathedrals be returned to them is the fact that they are damned expensive to run. Both cathedrals are now only kept going by their use for events, concerts, tourism etc. Their parishioners are not large and not wealthy. The RCC don't want any more expense after all the compensations they have to pay out to their child abuse victims.
@@2learn4ever Not surprising that many of their parishioners are not wealthy, but have no idea how large they are.
@@BenjaminHawkins-gk8wn Hah! I meant in numbers, not their body shape!! 😁
Tell the Church of Ireland to give back Christchurch Cathedral
St Mary's is a regular working Catholic Cathedral, isn't it ?
In the 1800 Dublin had the most Orange Lodges in Ireland and was 80% Protestant up to 1900 w
yep, cos it was also under british rule til then is why
It was never 80% protestant. Where did you get that figure? Maybe from the people who could vote?
Complete nonsense. Dublin was always majority catholic
The Irish didn't have cities.
It was the British who built them.
@MV12379 that just is not true. Dublin, for instance, was founded in 988, though there are reports dating back to the 2nd century when it was known as Eblana. Are you one of those idiots who insists that colonisation was a good thing, glossing over the misery and hardships it caused all over the world? The British education system has a lot to answer for!!
Shrewsbury in England’s has a catholic cathedral but is not a city any reason why ????
Have we really 'advanced' that much as a result of the the clear decline of Religious Devotion in Ireland. The number of murders, especially of woman in Ireland over the past few years is truly shocking
There are two cathedrals in Dublin, both stolen by the English.
Religions have a lot to answer for time to grow up take our power and do no harm and love thy neighbour as yourself.
You do realize you're quoting religions, right? And then contradicting yourself? Why make any moral assertions if all efforts at morality are corrupt? Why tell other people to "do no harm" or "love their neighbors" if each individual is their own power and authority? I think you've been misled by people who are either simple-minded, sinister, or both. I will pray that you find your way out of the mental and spiritual wilderness.
protestants, historically speaking, have been always vampires
if it has no cathedral, its a town, not a city.
This is based on the assumption that the Protestant Reformation was a nationalist and colonial movement, when in fact it was intended to be an improvement of a corrupt faith. Every Irish person had the same opportunity as everybody else to convert. But you characterize that decision as traitorous. It didn't have to be that way.
But it was all of that and more.
It is a subtle genocide
That sound like what extremist groups will say to so called unbelievers. I can’t believe someone still holds that view today.
You obviously were never told that the Catholics had to pay fees to the head protestant churches in Ireland. The laity didn't know it but, the local Priests had to pass the money over. Protestant Ledgers have recorded these funds.
So....the Pro cathedral does not exist, plus the Arch bishop of Dublin's parish church is the oh so small church on Westland Row, but it's much more important to push this bs, well done.
Was it sold to pay off abuse claims?
No, the Irish State paid most of those, 2 Billion or so, the Church in comparison paid pocket change
Hmmm very interesting 🧐🤨
Due to forced uk CofE 🤦♀️
St Patrick's should be handed back to the Catholic church, or at least used for ecumenical services.
Far to much "religion" in Ireland .. and it's brought nothing but pain and misery to millions of Irish people.
And now we have invited in another one which is arguably the worst of all of them .... we never learn.
It sounds like you prefer the worship of the Golden Calf.
The protestants have two cathedrals, let them give or return one to the Catholic religion. Better still let them share the cathederals. The 500 schisim is a nonsense.
No the Church of Ireland is Protestant and stands against Popery.
Sharing, a good & Christian idea. I like it.
Talking about Dublin yet shows a picture of Armagh COI cathedral 🤔
Yes. Listen to the segment and see that the context fits.
Dry your eyes
It was a better faith anyway what did the catholic church do to Ireland why don't you talk about the English Catholics who was slaughtered
Yes, the inheritance of Jesus Christ and his successor St. Peter saves. The inheritance of Henry VIII and Cromwell only destroys.
The Catholic church is estimated to have slaughtered circa fifty million souls.
No wonder Christians recognise papacy as anti Christ, stained with the blood of the martyred saints.
@@exercisethemind Ireland's curse was that it was dominated by two foreign powers the Church of Rome and England. England killed millions of Irish bodies through war and famine and Rome destroyed millions of souls. I'm glad Ireland is free of the UK and getting free of Rome.
This is fascinating, I am Catholic,but I attend an Episcopal Church, I listen to Pope Francis for guidance on TH-cam, I love the Modern-day Catholic Church
Is there a Catholic Church anywhere near you brother?
That Jesuit pope is not a true prince of rome
@@darylshanley2674 He is the Vicar of Christ.
Read your Bible, "you will know the truth and the truth will set you free."
You love the modern day Catholic Church but go to an Episcopal Church? Okay.
This is crammed full of hyperbole and bias. What is worse is that inaccuracies abound and there is not a single mention of the building of Irish Catholic Cathedrals in Victoria's reign. Some of these (and there are many) are noted for their size, lavish equipage and fine acoustics.
Perhaps the writer ought to visit towns and cities outside The Pale.
We have treasures he/she/it needs to see.
In a mere 20 years, however, the key deity worshiped here is the Euro with 'celebrities' in the media and booze being next.
I am old now and would not have believed that a small pseudo-nation like this Rep of Ireland could become so venal and immoral, so violent, uncaring and unjust.
We lost democracy in the process and would not qualify for EU were an application being made now instead of 1973. We vote but votes are directed by a perverted system of transferred votes.
The church leaders are, sadly, part of the top elite echelon.
DO VISIT.
Reparation anyone!
10:34 It’s a bastion of idolatry.
Well, what are you doing to do about it? Shouldn't you evangelize?
ALL organized Religion is Idolatory
@@exercisethemind To which sect? There are an estimated 30,000 various Protestant sects.
The seat of papacy is indeed the seat of anti Christ
@@exercisethemind I could pray about it. Because everything in the physical world is dictated by whatever happened in the spiritual world.
Wrong... There is a Mary's Catholic Cathedral in the City centre in Dublin and many more all over Ireland. Get your facts right. Ballaghaderreen County Roscommon has a large Catholic Cathedral. Just saying! It's posh to be a Catholic.
I think they are hanging their hat on the fact that St. Mary's is a Pro-Cathedral meaning it is temporary or standing in for the real cathedral. I think that stems from the fact that both St. Patrick's and Christchurch were originally dedicated as RC Cathedrals. The church probably felt it shouldn't accept the "taking" of the already invested cathedrals. Give them a chance it's only been 500 years or so.
Did you watch the video? It’s a pro cathedral, not a cathedral. There is no Catholic Cathedral in Dublin.
All dumps! Name one worth a visit!
Medieval Cathedrals the ones you mention are later.
Marys is a pro cathedral, that just means it's where the Arch Bishop of Dublin is based. It would loses it pro cathedral status if the Arch Bishop moves to a different church, and it would just become a normal church. This almost happened last year.
My...freakin... gawd....these folks couldnt catch a break...
😬🥺😨😢
Don't worry, England will be overun my muslims in 50 years😅
Why is this TH-cam channel portraying Roman Catholicism as innocent, when the Bible calls her the mother of harlots?
in which bible? yours is heretic
The Bible says that Peter is the successor of Christ and that he presided over the Council of Jerusalem.
In Acts 15, James, the brother of Jesus, is shown as presiding over the council in Jerusalem.
That’s a lie. The Holy Bible does not call the Catholic Church ‘the mother of harlots’. The Catholic Church compiled the Holy Bible in 382AD.
@@exercisethemind Show me in scripture, or are you lying to justify idolatrous Catholic culture?
Would i be wrong to say when your young you support the woke when your old you dont bother with religion just common sense
Trust in the Lord with all your heart
and lean not on your own understanding;
in all your ways submit to him,
and he will make your paths straight.
-Proverbs 3:5-6
Yes you would be wrong. You are confusing politics with religion. When young one tends to be more left wing and as one gets older one tends to drift to the right. As one gets older one tends to take matters of faith more seriously.
@@LookEye-sl7rc Left wing and right wing are just different versions of Satan’s agenda to lead souls to hell.
Yes you would probably, if I could understand your message!
Amadan
Pray for our island and a return to the true Catholic faith.
Religion poisons everything -- Christopher Hitchens
Chris Hitchens was an over rated old drunk. He was good at pointing out the faults of religious people and they are many but he could never disprove the existence of God. No one can.
Chris Hitchens was a plummy voiced contrarian who drank himself to death.
So sad.They were at the pub all day .
No, what happened in the last 13 years is that they got RICH and became nihilists. And yes that IS very sad.
@@exercisethemind Wrong, we found out about all the Churches crimes, then the Church left the Irish state to pay out over 2 Billion to the Churches victims and the people walked away from the Church
Christ church cathedral is dublins catholic cathedral Henry the eight of England broke away from Rome and he confiscated the cathedral for his new prodiseant religion
In the 1920s, the Catholic church was given its choice of sites on O'Connell St. in Dublin to build its cathederal.
They said: *No, we want the Protestant cathederals or nothing.*
In the end, they got nothing.
Nonsense history from above. Ireland is a tolerant country, most others would have taken over the protestant cathedrals
You mean they asked for the Catholic Cathedrals built by Catholics to be returned to them and were denied.
They view the protestant cathedrals as property that was stolen from the church. It is the principle of the thing.
I lived near Christ Church Cathedral in Dublin and I'm not religious but, I got a shock its o.k. to enter but a tour of the basement where Strongbow Richard De Clare is buried one must pay. 5 euros I remember maybe more now.
@@janettedavis6627 I'm descended from Strongbow & his wife, the daughter of King Dermot McMurrough, but I'm not too crazy about the idea of paying to visit their crypt. Should I ever visit Dublin, shall settle for a visit to the burial spot in St. Patrick's Cathedral of Dean Swift, my sixth great-grandmother Anne Swift Perry's first cousin.
Pure bullshit
Southern Ireland does not need more Catholic buildings, at least, not more buildings used for conducting mass.
We call ourselves the Republic of Ireland, there is no "southern ireland". The most northerly county on the island is in the Republic.
@paulkelly8456 You're talking to an Irishman 😉
@@paulkelly8456 True enough, Donegal.
The Irish are Romans Catholics not catholics and both oppressed the Ulster Scots its the reason Cromwell went to Ireland
Protestants are sectarians. It's in the name. But you are welcome to return to the one holy catholic and apostolic faith. We love you and pray for your redemption.
Thomas Cromwell became a multi-billionaire overnight in today's money by stealing Catholic lands in England and all his future heirs continued the theft of catholic lands, especially his tyrannical murderous great, great grandson Oliver Cromwell who murdered and enslaved millions of Irish Catholics. The greatest transfer of wealth in British history occurred from Catholics to a few prominent 'Protestants' in the 16th and 17th centuries.
English Catholics were always Roman Catholics but the Irish were Irish Catholics until English control of Ireland.
So England bends the Irish Catholics to become 'Romanised' and then they want to steal their lands because they are not 'Protestant'. LOL
Oliver Cromwell went to Ireland to steal all Catholic lands. He was a 'Puritan' protestant, anti-King created the first Republic and hated Christmas. That's why the Puritans who migrated to America banned the celebration of Christmas for nearly a hundred years.
You are so confused. The word Roman was added to Catholics by the Anglicans as they wanted to claim they were Catholic as well. It was a way to differentiate them from Anglicans.
David is a bit confused. Ulster scots led by england ' confiscated' native land instead of behaving as immigrants and respecting local people and culture.