Although I talk about the advantages of CCD vs CMOS I didn’t make it clear that CMOS is really catching up and because of huge consumer smartphone demand the technology is improving! It won’t be long before CMOS will reach scientific grade stability and quality for photometry etc. and certain CMOS cameras on the market are already better than many CCDs in many ways.
Dylan O'Donnell I am glad you posted this as cmos osc cameras have come a long way and CCD is a dieing technology. Your information you give in the video was accurate 10 years ago but not anymore. You should consider redoing this video with more updated information.
A modern OSC CMOS will still perform worse than a modern mono CCD .. but I agree, a more up to date video will need to be done as the technology progresses. There are still updates to CCD tech but CMOS will outpace it.. this has only just started to happen this year so the first gen are ... ok... but they will take over in the next couple of years for sure. :)
Dylan, that was an excellent description of the two different sensor technologies, thanks much. I just had my Sony A7S astro modified by Kolari in New Jersey. I'm still learning how to shoot it, but the H emissions are clearly more pronounced. Not shooting DSO yet, and still using non-guided tracking systems, but I can see myself evolving into that arena. More gear and investment. Oh dear!
Hey thanks! CCD is the mature technology and CMOS is burgeoning. CMOS will probably take over but it's a really close race right now at this point in the market (2018)
This video is EXTREMELY helpful, thank you for doing it. I'm 61 and just now getting into trying digital astrophotography. My plan is to get a live stacking type setup.
I started as as a visual astronomer, I have a 9.25inch SCT. Recently bought a planetary camera ZW0ASI178. It is brilliant I have taken pictures of M87 jet and Quasar 3C273. Proper Astrophotography with all that processing to me heads in the direction of art. I find that the camera gives me a new dimension to see fainter objects and structure in Galaxies. I'm not after pretty pictures but pushing the boundaries of limiting magnitude... to see more. Some of the tips of astrophotographers serves me well. Binning for example is another useful tool. The ZWOASI178 has pushed my telescope limiting magnitude to about 16 now..WoW. Next trick is to use my barlow lens and binx2 to see if I can go further and deeper into space. Lol so much for it being just a planetary camer. I owe this channel alot for tips. The binning process allows me to brighten objects without long exposures which is useful for star hopping to objects like 3c273
Thanks so much Dylan, well crafted and clear, especially for us newbs. I'd be really keen on a revised version particularly given the changes in the market. I'm just starting my journey into deep space astroimaging and keen to get a mono camera and would welcome some guidance.
Dylan, you did a GREAT job of explaining and identifying pros and cons! I'm just researching all of my "stuff" to begin AP now, so when I'm ready to pull the trigger I am well informed. And YOU are one of the guys that is educating me on this EXPENSIVE hobby! Thanks and clear skies!!!
Great work Dylan, thank you very much. My initial foray into astrophotography will be with my Nikon D7100. I shot a few still pics of the moon the other night at prime (well Cassegrain) focus on my 8" SCT and I was pretty stunned by the results. I had always used my SCT purely visually - same goes for my 5" Mak (which, annoyingly, has a 1.25" visual back). Of course, I do not expect to see remotely similar quality on the planets - still less DSO's, but I do appreciate your insights with respect to more advanced astrophotography.
AntPDC thanks Ant! Scts are really good for dsos and planets too but they are spectacular with a dslr for moon portraits huh. You can still do dsos though with a dslr to great effect as long as the tracking and calibration is good!
Worked as outreach to public on Kitt Peak NOAO. I found that answered many questions I still had about astrophotography that I hadn’t heard the answers to. Thanks for all the information and clarity.
Many great tips , You are so correct about making sure you choose the right Camera for your Telescope/Target Choice - I look forward your discussion on Monochrome versus OSC (One Shot Colour) ps: Canon SDK being available to developers from the beginning always meant Nikon was on the back foot from day one with Astrophotography Software.
Thanks John.. the topic is so broad any aspect could've taken longer to explain with better details but hopefully it's a decent springboard for the current market and options for a beginner astrophotographer. Colour video coming soon! (I hope).
Dylan, I'm just starting out with astrophotography and so am really appreciative of your work and the advice available through your channel. I've made a few small purchases and am in the research phase for various bits and pieces and bigger purchases so really appreciate the honest and well considered advice you provide. Also must say, it's good to get an Aussie perspective as most info seems to be from o/s, and although it all helps not everything is relevant to us in this part of the world, however your info definitely is. Cheers, Don.
Thank you so much for the clarification Dylan. For an astrophoto beginner like me... I learnt a lot on the difference between CCD and CMOS and what they are best at. Currently, I'm using a modified Canon 500D (removed IR filter ) on an old newtonian 120/720 mm to shoot at deep sky objects with some growing success... Now, I understand better what can be my next acquisition!
I'm trying to learn all I can about cameras, so I can get the right one. I was looking at the Revolution r2 the one with the CD and hooks up directly to a laptop and powerd by the laptop, for around 300.00 dollars,, it it any good???
Great Video Dylan! If only you would made it 5 years ago. I started off with Nikon but then switched to Canon for the same reasons you mentioned. - Cheers
Sully Grills hey thanks! My sub count literally just rolled over 2,000 as I filmed it. If this was you, thanks! If not, thanks for your kind words regardless!
As a lifetime Nikon shooter considering some *low budget* astrophotography you're right about Canon's well earned dominance in that arena. They (Canon) were 'wise' enough to release Software Development Kits (ie SDKs) pretty much from the jump. This gave them a likely insurmountable advantage in those terms. ps: My Nikon buds will ostracize me tout suite if I don't mention still being a diehard Nikon terrestrial photographer. ;) Great channel!!! Cheers!
You get it Joe! Yep.. I used Nikon for ages and loved it, nothing to complain about *except* for the lack of firmware SDK support. Thanks for the kind words man :)
I'm pretty new to the scene but thus far the only issue I've come across as a Nikon owner is the distinct lack of clip in filters but tbh that's really not a big deal. I use Backyard Nikon for control and erm, sequence generating I suppose that would be called? and it's a really decent program. They released the SDK a while back now, at least as far as I know to O'Telescope. I'm not sure if was made widely available now but I don't think budget togs entering the deep sky community should feel put off so much any more or feel overly pressured into changing brands to suit the hobby.
Good video Dylan. Worth a part 2 for our integrated cameras like the ATIK One 9.0 and maybe worth mentioning that QSI is back in business and I love my QSI 690 with integrated filters and OAG. Good job. That was a lot to cover. Sean
good job, on this for me as not having a lot of experience it helps to hear from guys thats been there and done that makes things go faster and better which in turn saves time and money for guys like me moving into this exciting time to be involved with this. thanks very much
Dunno how old you are Dylan but I used to do Astro Photography with a Minolta SLR camera using black and white Kodak Tech Pan 2415 film. This was before the internet, no GOTO mounts or Autoguiding. We used to hand guide the scope with a simple hand controller and an illuminated reticle eyepiece. Backbreaking to do a 15 minute shot. We had a Darkroom and after an imaging session would stay up and develop the Negatives and then print out photos using the projector and various chemicals. You'd walk out of the Darkroom at sunrise. It's a lot easier now.
Sure is! Sounds like a lot of effort that I would most certainly have been too lazy for. There is still effort now, but it's mostly digital. That last image I posted took more hours to process than to capture, but I'm comfortable with computers. I'm pretty sure I would've killed myself or burnt the building down with darkroom chemicals. I'm 42 and did a pre-digital photography minor at uni so am familiar with the process BUT I skipped all the chemical stuff and did experimental stuff with digital scanners instead, long before digital cameras were a thing.
Top video, thanks Dylan. I’ve just started astronomy with the aim of moving into astrophotography when I have a bit more knowledge, but thanks to your vid camera choice is a no brainer - DSLR it will be! I only wish I’d watched your ‘which first telescope to buy’ video before I bought me scope! 🙄
Thank you for the great video. I am just getting started and am trying to figure what camera to get and the information you provide is really helpful. That Bintel Astronomy Calculator is really great. I love that little backyard observatory in your intro with your great little helper :-),
Fwiw, the Fujifilm cameras with the X-Trans sensor do not have a low pass filter, so they will produce pinky red nebulosity straight out of the camera.
Hey Dylan, great info, a bewildering subject made a bit simpler. A few requests... 1. Could I suggest you put a link to your calculator on the Bintel site? Takes quite a bit of digging to find it. 2. Can I request a blog post or video on “binning” and “drizzling”? So many Astro sites talk about them, I’m still struggling to understand... 3. I love your definition at 8:04 of “very very cheap” QHY CCD cameras...cheapest one I can find is well over $2k, ranging waaay above $4k. Think I’m looking at CMOS on that point alone.
All good suggestions! Thanks for the feedback :) Yeh QHY is cheap as far as CCD's go in general so it's a relative term. The fast CMOS's are definitely a good option for a cheaper option.
Very informative I appreciate your hard work to bring this information in a very understandable way. I have always wanted to do astrophotography and am gearing up for that now. How much has the technology changed since you produced this video. Is our best as a beginner to just start with adslr? Should it be the astrophotography dedicated body, and can that still be used for day to day? Keep up the great work .
Alrighty, so you’re firmly in the Canon camp, but inquired minds want to know ... Fender vs Gibson, where do you stand there? Being an Epiphone guy is tough. 😉. Good summary! Thanks Sir!!
Hah, it's funny cause in my previous job during failure analysis I used to use a CCD camera to image CMOS chips! Another excellent video Dylan. Also, #CanonMasterRace
Just getting into the astrophotography game, although, I've been into astronomy for around 30-Years now. I do plan on buying a DSLR camera as well as a CCD, but I'm having issues making up my mind in what Canon camera to buy, I'd want it to be best suited for a Celestron 11069 NexStar 8 SE Computerised Telescope. I'm going for a Un-Modded DSLR and a Canon, more lens. P.S. SUBBED.
Since I'm your above neigbour from "Up top" and don't have easy access to any astro gear except the cheap end stuff and eye-pieces being the most advandaged accessories I get in the stores here ( I blame the extremely small markert because of population problems ) I would really like to see the differnence in comparison of these cameras you mentinoned in the video (ccd, cmos, mono and dslr ) like with the details and pixelsize comparison, probably plenty time and effort that would go into it for example compare the deepspace cameras on lunar/planets and vice versa and on the same targets and the over and undersampling... But like I said would be a cool video... Keep up the excellent work Dylan... Best regards from "Up Top" here in the isle of Ice Iceland. Kristinn Ingi Þórarinsson.
Hi Iceland! I recommend watching my video about Why Astronomers Use Black and White cameras and also trying the Astronomy Calculator I developed with your gear and any camera you are considering. www.bintel.com.au/tools/astronomy-calculator/ Video : th-cam.com/video/lD0ZH2doSlk/w-d-xo.html
Great video Dylan. It would be great if you could make another video especially for Astronomy video (deep sky) and the cameras that are best suited for this.
Thanks for all of the hard work and sharing with this community. I sent you a message on FB because I'm looking for your opinion on a camera from your extensive experience.
Dylan this was a great video. It was a great refresher course to pick a lot of stuff I had either forgotten or did not know. Any chance you might do a part 2? I'm thinking about adding a 16200 sensor to my QSI 690 and 683 collection and would love to hear your thoughts on these cameras. I'm leaning towards the Moravian G3 or QHY but this video taught me some things about QHY that I didn't know, thus now leaning harder to Moravian. I hear QSI is about to release a 16200 camera. Maybe I ought to wait. Sean
Hey Dylan. Great vid man, I just came across your channel a couple of days ago so am a new subscriber. Lol all the way up in the NT. Good to see an Aussie doing so well! I'm a photographer who has just recently discovered a new interest in Astrophotography. I'd be keen to hear your thoughts on what might be achievable with the setup I have. I haven't invested in a proper telescope yet, but I ordered the iOptron Skyguider Pro with iPolar a couple of days ago so looking forward to having a play with that. This will be my first time with tracking and autoguiding. So far it's just been single exposures on a tripod. I'm using a Sony A7Riii, and for deep sky I'll be using the 200-600 f5.6/6.3, also mounted on a 2.0x tele. I took some shots with the moon, also cropped in to APS-C, giving me a total reach of 1800mm, and I was quite impressed with the result. I know generally zoom lenses aren't ideal, but have you had any luck using a similar setup? Cheers Kev.
Kevin Pattemore welcome mate! Good to have more aussies on the chan (it’s like 90% yank friends). See my video on piggyback astrophotography that might help!
@@DylanODonnell cheers man will have a look. P.S. I think I'm lucky where I am too, being that I go out into my front yard and the skies are pitch black, as my place is in Bortle Class 2. A phrase I'd never even heard of until Trevor Jones's videos.. Anyway, cheers, look forward to all the learning to come 👍
Good. I did the right thing. A friend of mine offered a Canon dslr to me as a step into AP, which I accepted. So in the near future I'll be posting my own attempts at AP :)
Great video on cameras to used. I think I will look at the Canon Astrocamera first and then maybe accd camera. I presently own a Orion g3C camera but I have not use it yet.
Well that makes it “ok” for ha emission but ruins truecolour, isn’t as sensitive as a mono cam and doesn’t have cooling. It’s ok but not the best for deep space imaging imho
Dylan, I'm subscribing to your channel. 4 reasons: I love Macs, I just bought a Celestron 925HD, I love Canon, and finally.. I'm just starting. Need input..
Thanks Dylan- a first timer to you and Astro photography, but the way you’ve demystified this CCD vs CMOS is great for me, as about as novice as novices come! But Fascinating!!.. and I’m simply fascinated by the complexity of all this. Now the other burning question is, what software?..have a 800 XLT Celestron CTC series BUT these long time exposures, with these cameras, how do you control the motion of the telescope for Astro photography? Software I’m guessing, but how to choose? Anyway love your videos! I’ll keep on watching! Thanks
3:52 How about a video comparing your photos 5 years ago with now, how much better they've gotten, and how you you did it. ...Including getting focus so much better with EdgeHD now than this old M42. I think you even had EAF back then, right?
Hey Dylan, just stumbled across your channel and have watch a few of your videos. Great work man! i am relatively new to astrophotography and have found some of the things you have covered on your channel very helpful. I have a question about the DSLR option, i know you said it is middle of the pack but for me now that's all i am after for now, what i wanted to know was is the process of connecting a mirrorless camera the same as for my DSLR?
Dylan, I have a Nikon D810 DSLR and was thinking of a CCD camera for deep space AP. I have 11" Edge HD and CGX-L mount, now on a cement pier. I'm trying to avoid buying a CCD and was wondering if I shoot the D810 in mono mode (with a filter wheel eventually), am I getting closer to the quality of a CCD? I'm very new to AP and have seen quite a bit of you videos, great job BTW! Also, what about cooling the DSLR? I assume most of my deep space shots will be done in winter time, but is it worth it to reduce the noise or can I pull it out in post? Any thoughts would be appreciated. Jim
Also interested as I have the D5600 and D810, doing some night photos and basic Milky Way but want to get a bit more involved without selling the house lol. Using cheap Meade ETX80 atm been taking photos with 14mm wide angle and also 400 mm telephoto. Want to take it up a level.
Really enjoyed the video. Care to share your camera settings for your ISS transit photo? Transits don't happen very often and I don't want to spend months of trial and error. BTW my CGX should be here in 2 days so I hope you get a commission
That topic deserves it's own video! But the setting that matters is 1/1600th of a second shutter speed :) Hey congrats on the CGX! I was so pumped when I got mine. (still am really heh)
Thanks I appreciate the info. I was having a lot of problems with a CPC 925 on a wedge and Starsense, it would align but never calibrate even remotely close so it quit being enjoyable. I went with your recommendation on the CGX assuming I might still have problems. but not that one.
I can attest to the Canon\Nikon choice for astrophotography. I love my Nikon D5500 so I bought a Nikon D3300 and sent it off to have it modified (ir filter replacement) at Lifepixel (great service by the way) but the Nikon has horrendous software support and none of the common utilities (even the ones that boast Nikon support) work with my camera. Do your support research before investing in a DSLR to make sure the manufacturer & model support the broadest range of software.
Yes! It's a real issue isn't it? Which is a shame because the cameras are just as good (or better) but the UI design and software / firmware is just better on Canon.
Dylan, Your video largely discusses cameras in terms of planetary vs deep space. However let's say you are solely looking to discover comets and asteroids. Which is better then - ccd v cmos? And which is better monochorome or color? And is Ha wavelength any advantage?
Hah you know what? There was an issue with my camera and imovie back in those days that slowed the footage down by a small % which is why the intro is slower and my voice is lower .. people keep wondering why my intro sped up but I didn’t … I just fixed the error 😆
Hi Dylan great video. I also have a 9.25 and have been using a dslr. I'm ready to make the move to a neximage camera. What beginner cam do you recommend is the best to start with. Thanks
Great vid. My Samsung can see ir but my daughters iPhone can't see ir. At times I've used my phone attached to our portable scopes and we see odd objects in the sky.!
hey Dylan, great video, if you had to choose the best camera for 10" RC Telescope, would a older camera like the SBIG STL11000M be a good choice? I've heard that RC telescopes or any longer focal length telescope requires a large pixel size, would love to hear your thoughts.
Cannot afford an expensive planetry camera, had a nextimage 5, had to take it apart as had some dead insect in there, been sitting around for years, buggered the sensor up, trying to clean it, seems impossible to get all the dust off. Going for the ASI120MC-S (color) instead as I heard its a better camera anyway
Hey Dylan I recently found your vids and I’ve got to say, they are the best Ive seen. Good information and super useful! I was wondering if you can give me some suggestions on what cameras I should use? I have a edge hd 11 but can’t find anything that isn’t over sampled. If you can I would like one for planetary with a Barlow lens and one for DSO possibly under 1200us dollars, keep the vids coming dude.
Get the 0.7x reducer for that Edge HD 11 and I think you'll find your options open up! Long focal lengths just oversample really. Thanks for the kind comments!
Thanks for a useful video, Dylan. If you explained why a higher frame rate is useful for planetary photography, I missed it. Does it have to do with taking a number of shots and looking for one with low atmospheric distortion?
Curious: I just got an ASI294MC Pro, rather than modify my Nikon D5300 (love it), but now I read about people inserting an IR cut filter for the 294. What?
Had been looking at the QHY183C Not for astrophotography , but EAA, so as its live stacking not astrophotography and more related to video astronomy, works on an Alt Alz fine. Working it out on my Evo 9.25 SCT its ever so slight Over sampling 1 green tick . If I bin 2X2 Very good and that's with a 0.5X reducer. Almost full moon according to your scale. I would imagine a bigger sensor and higher res you have more binning options, so could drop or increase binning according to atmosphere. Using astronomy tools which takes atmospheric conditions by adjusting binning works well according to that program on ok, good and expectational conditions.. I am surprised doing your calculations on my Scope the ASI224 on the planets was well over sampled I know EAA is laughable compared to astrophotography, but still goes way beyond the human eye can ever see and helps cut through light pollution, but with moern cameras EAA is becoming a viable option and can be done on a much cheaper budget . EAA is like a halfway point between visual and Astrophotography and nearer to video astronomy as you are doing it near live. Guess binning on a larger Higher res chip you have more to play with, like if you photo in Hi res, you have more to play with when you crop.
I just got a ZWO asi2600mc-Pro, but I’ve found with my AsiAir that has failed while under warranty, both ZWO and the reseller OptCom are giving me basically zero support for the warranty item So I don’t expect my expensive asi2600mc-Pro is supported any better then my AsiAir. Gonna send the asi2600mc-P while I can’t. Not work having something that expensive when the warranty is useless.
What are your thoughts on the Celestron NexImage cameras? Currently using a Celestron 8SE, but hoping to upgrade soon to a CPC 1100. I’m mostly visual, but would like to try planetary and lunar imaging...
Hi Dylan, thank you for informative video. I need your help based on your expert knowledge. I want to do crescent imaging (which is immediately after sunset for 30 to 60 minutes) through Telescope, which camera do you suggest? 1-CCD or CMOS ? 2-Detailed Spec please I have a Celestron Omni XLT 120mm f/8.3 Refractor telescope with equatorial manual mount. It has Aperture of 120mm and a Focal Length of 1000mm. Appreciate your quick and detailed reply. Thank you in advance.
Query - I have read many folk like ZWO because of its extremely low read out noise, coupled to its fast USB3 read out pathway allows one to take hundreds of images and stack the data to get image quality comparable to CCD but at a much better price point for the same targets total imaging time. ZWO state that once you are stacking 50 plus frames their native 12 or 14 bit cameras one fully recovers 16 bit image quality. Does this argument make sense to you for Deep space / low light targets? I have seen videos where roughly over an hour 148 x 30 second ZWO images of the faint bubble nebulae where captured and stacked and they look really good once processed. I would have expected 3-5 minute subs where required, but the really low read out noise means the data quality really is there even on short subs. I know from signal to noise mathematics having a really high number of frames really helps S/N provided there is good data - Signal - in each of your frames. Many thanks Matthew
Yeh the 12 bit basically requires a portion of extra subs you wouldn’t need with 16bit chips. The return on time investment slows down after 40-50 frames certainly. I wouldn’t say that stacked short subs are a replacement for long ones though, not entirely.
Very useful info, thanks for that.But may i say that you are wrong about the infrared filter about the phones.Bc all of my previous phones and the one that i am using now can see infrared lights of the remotes.And those were HTC, Samsung, Asus and now a Xiomi.Is there a prolem about yours?Bc that one should see the IR too.
Really helpfully video! I’m a beginner and I’m looking for a good planetary camera for my 900/80 refractor. What cam would you recommend me? Some people recommended me the ZWO ASI120MC-S, so I want to know your opinion. Thanks!
How about! great video by the way …I was thinking about the Revolution Imager R2 with color video 7” Monitor V.S. ZWO ASI290MM mono chrome cmos camera For My 114MM Newtonian Reflecter telescope f9 1000 FL please advise
Can we attach an astrophotography Camera, either CCD or CMOS, to a standard telelens like Canon 100-400 mm lena? If so which would be the drawback for doing that?
Although I talk about the advantages of CCD vs CMOS I didn’t make it clear that CMOS is really catching up and because of huge consumer smartphone demand the technology is improving! It won’t be long before CMOS will reach scientific grade stability and quality for photometry etc. and certain CMOS cameras on the market are already better than many CCDs in many ways.
Dylan O'Donnell I am glad you posted this as cmos osc cameras have come a long way and CCD is a dieing technology. Your information you give in the video was accurate 10 years ago but not anymore. You should consider redoing this video with more updated information.
A modern OSC CMOS will still perform worse than a modern mono CCD .. but I agree, a more up to date video will need to be done as the technology progresses. There are still updates to CCD tech but CMOS will outpace it.. this has only just started to happen this year so the first gen are ... ok... but they will take over in the next couple of years for sure. :)
Dylan, that was an excellent description of the two different sensor technologies, thanks much.
I just had my Sony A7S astro modified by Kolari in New Jersey. I'm still learning how to shoot it, but the H emissions are clearly more pronounced.
Not shooting DSO yet, and still using non-guided tracking systems, but I can see myself evolving into that arena. More gear and investment. Oh dear!
Dude, I have got to say. You have a gift for explaining things.
Ahh thanks man, Makes me want to make more videos! thanks.
Totally agree!
I agree with you on that very educated
I'd never considered CCD cams as I thought they were out of date. Thanks for correcting this misconception.
Hey thanks! CCD is the mature technology and CMOS is burgeoning. CMOS will probably take over but it's a really close race right now at this point in the market (2018)
This video is EXTREMELY helpful, thank you for doing it. I'm 61 and just now getting into trying digital astrophotography. My plan is to get a live stacking type setup.
58 and fighting to understand what I am doing.
I started as as a visual astronomer, I have a 9.25inch SCT. Recently bought a planetary camera ZW0ASI178. It is brilliant I have taken pictures of M87 jet and Quasar 3C273.
Proper Astrophotography with all that processing to me heads in the direction of art. I find that the camera gives me a new dimension to see fainter objects and structure in Galaxies. I'm not after pretty pictures but pushing the boundaries of limiting magnitude... to see more. Some of the tips of astrophotographers serves me well. Binning for example is another useful tool. The ZWOASI178 has pushed my telescope limiting magnitude to about 16 now..WoW. Next trick is to use my barlow lens and binx2 to see if I can go further and deeper into space. Lol so much for it being just a planetary camer.
I owe this channel alot for tips. The binning process allows me to brighten objects without long exposures which is useful for star hopping to objects like 3c273
Thanks so much Dylan, well crafted and clear, especially for us newbs. I'd be really keen on a revised version particularly given the changes in the market. I'm just starting my journey into deep space astroimaging and keen to get a mono camera and would welcome some guidance.
You are perfect at explaining things in simple, yet detailed way. I will learn from you a tons of things!
As a newb it helped a quite a bit but also created more questions. Such is life eh? Thank you.
Dylan, you did a GREAT job of explaining and identifying pros and cons! I'm just researching all of my "stuff" to begin AP now, so when I'm ready to pull the trigger I am well informed. And YOU are one of the guys that is educating me on this EXPENSIVE hobby! Thanks and clear skies!!!
Hey I’m glad it helped mate :)
Great work Dylan, thank you very much. My initial foray into astrophotography will be with my Nikon D7100. I shot a few still pics of the moon the other night at prime (well Cassegrain) focus on my 8" SCT and I was pretty stunned by the results. I had always used my SCT purely visually - same goes for my 5" Mak (which, annoyingly, has a 1.25" visual back). Of course, I do not expect to see remotely similar quality on the planets - still less DSO's, but I do appreciate your insights with respect to more advanced astrophotography.
AntPDC thanks Ant! Scts are really good for dsos and planets too but they are spectacular with a dslr for moon portraits huh. You can still do dsos though with a dslr to great effect as long as the tracking and calibration is good!
Worked as outreach to public on Kitt Peak NOAO. I found that answered many questions I still had about astrophotography that I hadn’t heard the answers to. Thanks for all the information and clarity.
Many great tips , You are so correct about making sure you choose the right Camera for your Telescope/Target Choice - I look forward your discussion on Monochrome versus OSC (One Shot Colour) ps: Canon SDK being available to developers from the beginning always meant Nikon was on the back foot from day one with Astrophotography Software.
Thanks John.. the topic is so broad any aspect could've taken longer to explain with better details but hopefully it's a decent springboard for the current market and options for a beginner astrophotographer. Colour video coming soon! (I hope).
Dylan, I'm just starting out with astrophotography and so am really appreciative of your work and the advice available through your channel. I've made a few small purchases and am in the research phase for various bits and pieces and bigger purchases so really appreciate the honest and well considered advice you provide. Also must say, it's good to get an Aussie perspective as most info seems to be from o/s, and although it all helps not everything is relevant to us in this part of the world, however your info definitely is. Cheers, Don.
The Don hey Don ! Welcome to the club :) thx for your kind words .. I’m glad the channel is of any use to anyone 😊🇦🇺🍻
EXCELLENT video!
You explained the pros and cons of each tech (CCD vs CMOS) brilliantly.
PS: Hang on to those "Liitle Black Things". LOL
Thank you so much for the clarification Dylan. For an astrophoto beginner like me... I learnt a lot on the difference between CCD and CMOS and what they are best at. Currently, I'm using a modified Canon 500D (removed IR filter ) on an old newtonian 120/720 mm to shoot at deep sky objects with some growing success... Now, I understand better what can be my next acquisition!
I'm trying to learn all I can about cameras, so I can get the right one. I was looking at the Revolution r2 the one with the CD and hooks up directly to a laptop and powerd by the laptop, for around 300.00 dollars,, it it any good???
Excellent news! I'm glad it helped and thanks for the kind feedback! Good luck with the modded camera. I wish I had one of those! :)
3 years later, when you have the motivation and time this would be a great topic to revisit! Great video as always !
True !
Thanks for this video, I appreciated the referral to the Bintel Astronomy calculator. I will use it often.
Great Video Dylan! If only you would made it 5 years ago. I started off with Nikon but then switched to Canon for the same reasons you mentioned. - Cheers
Dylan,
Great job, this is the first time I can say I understood astro cams.
Mike
Sully Grills hey thanks! My sub count literally just rolled over 2,000 as I filmed it. If this was you, thanks! If not, thanks for your kind words regardless!
Wow. Great video! Thanks for the info. As the previous commenter said, you have a real gift for presenting information in an understandable way.
Cheers Monte!
Awesome video. Cheers. I know a lot of work goes into your YTV. Very much enjoy StarStuff! ✌️
Hey thanks Mate! You’d be surprised how *little* work goes into these videos. It’s a very quick and dirty solo side project 😆
A great heads up on whats best/better in the way of cameras for all things Astro.....
Another great tutorial! You really are on a roll! Many thanks, Dylan.
As a lifetime Nikon shooter considering some *low budget* astrophotography you're right about Canon's well earned dominance in that arena. They (Canon) were 'wise' enough to release Software Development Kits (ie SDKs) pretty much from the jump. This gave them a likely insurmountable advantage in those terms.
ps: My Nikon buds will ostracize me tout suite if I don't mention still being a diehard Nikon terrestrial photographer. ;)
Great channel!!! Cheers!
You get it Joe! Yep.. I used Nikon for ages and loved it, nothing to complain about *except* for the lack of firmware SDK support. Thanks for the kind words man :)
I'm pretty new to the scene but thus far the only issue I've come across as a Nikon owner is the distinct lack of clip in filters but tbh that's really not a big deal. I use Backyard Nikon for control and erm, sequence generating I suppose that would be called? and it's a really decent program. They released the SDK a while back now, at least as far as I know to O'Telescope. I'm not sure if was made widely available now but I don't think budget togs entering the deep sky community should feel put off so much any more or feel overly pressured into changing brands to suit the hobby.
Good video Dylan. Worth a part 2 for our integrated cameras like the ATIK One 9.0 and maybe worth mentioning that QSI is back in business and I love my QSI 690 with integrated filters and OAG. Good job. That was a lot to cover. Sean
Heh this topic could be a whole series! Thanks man :)
good job, on this for me as not having a lot of experience it helps to hear from guys thats been there and done that makes things go faster and better which in turn saves time and money for guys like me moving into this exciting time to be involved with this. thanks very much
Oh that's good to hear! It pays to know some of the fundamentals when choosing a camera.
Thanks Dylan. An excellent video. Very clear and suitably concise. Would love to see an annual update.
Dunno how old you are Dylan but I used to do Astro Photography with a Minolta SLR camera using black and white Kodak Tech Pan 2415 film. This was before the internet, no GOTO mounts or Autoguiding. We used to hand guide the scope with a simple hand controller and an illuminated reticle eyepiece. Backbreaking to do a 15 minute shot. We had a Darkroom and after an imaging session would stay up and develop the Negatives and then print out photos using the projector and various chemicals. You'd walk out of the Darkroom at sunrise. It's a lot easier now.
Sure is! Sounds like a lot of effort that I would most certainly have been too lazy for. There is still effort now, but it's mostly digital. That last image I posted took more hours to process than to capture, but I'm comfortable with computers. I'm pretty sure I would've killed myself or burnt the building down with darkroom chemicals. I'm 42 and did a pre-digital photography minor at uni so am familiar with the process BUT I skipped all the chemical stuff and did experimental stuff with digital scanners instead, long before digital cameras were a thing.
11:20 I feel you. I got a "Little black things" shelf as well. xD
Top video, thanks Dylan. I’ve just started astronomy with the aim of moving into astrophotography when I have a bit more knowledge, but thanks to your vid camera choice is a no brainer - DSLR it will be! I only wish I’d watched your ‘which first telescope to buy’ video before I bought me scope! 🙄
Thanks so much for the video. Just getting into Astrophotography and appreciate your insight.
Ryan B thanks Ryan!
Thank you for the great video. I am just getting started and am trying to figure what camera to get and the information you provide is really helpful. That Bintel Astronomy Calculator is really great. I love that little backyard observatory in your intro with your great little helper :-),
Thanks Dylan. Most of my questions answered in one video. Thanks.
Rob Kenning I’m glad it helped! Thanks!
Fwiw, the Fujifilm cameras with the X-Trans sensor do not have a low pass filter, so they will produce pinky red nebulosity straight out of the camera.
Which models of Fuji have that sensor?
Just watched this video for the first time. Wow things have changed since you made this.
Sure have!
Hey Dylan, great info, a bewildering subject made a bit simpler. A few requests...
1. Could I suggest you put a link to your calculator on the Bintel site? Takes quite a bit of digging to find it.
2. Can I request a blog post or video on “binning” and “drizzling”? So many Astro sites talk about them, I’m still struggling to understand...
3. I love your definition at 8:04 of “very very cheap” QHY CCD cameras...cheapest one I can find is well over $2k, ranging waaay above $4k. Think I’m looking at CMOS on that point alone.
All good suggestions! Thanks for the feedback :) Yeh QHY is cheap as far as CCD's go in general so it's a relative term. The fast CMOS's are definitely a good option for a cheaper option.
Very informative I appreciate your hard work to bring this information in a very understandable way. I have always wanted to do astrophotography and am gearing up for that now. How much has the technology changed since you produced this video. Is our best as a beginner to just start with adslr? Should it be the astrophotography dedicated body, and can that still be used for day to day? Keep up the great work .
Alrighty, so you’re firmly in the Canon camp, but inquired minds want to know ... Fender vs Gibson, where do you stand there? Being an Epiphone guy is tough. 😉. Good summary! Thanks Sir!!
Hah, it's funny cause in my previous job during failure analysis I used to use a CCD camera to image CMOS chips! Another excellent video Dylan. Also, #CanonMasterRace
One of your best, Dylan! Thanks heaps 😋
Just getting into the astrophotography game, although, I've been into astronomy for around 30-Years now. I do plan on buying a DSLR camera as well as a CCD, but I'm having issues making up my mind in what Canon camera to buy, I'd want it to be best suited for a Celestron 11069 NexStar 8 SE Computerised Telescope. I'm going for a Un-Modded DSLR and a Canon, more lens.
P.S. SUBBED.
Since I'm your above neigbour from "Up top" and don't have easy access to any astro gear except the cheap end stuff and eye-pieces being the most advandaged accessories I get in the stores here ( I blame the extremely small markert because of population problems )
I would really like to see the differnence in comparison of these cameras you mentinoned in the video (ccd, cmos, mono and dslr ) like with the details and pixelsize comparison, probably plenty time and effort that would go into it for example compare the deepspace cameras on lunar/planets and vice versa and on the same targets and the over and undersampling...
But like I said would be a cool video...
Keep up the excellent work Dylan...
Best regards from "Up Top" here in the isle of Ice Iceland.
Kristinn Ingi Þórarinsson.
Hi Iceland! I recommend watching my video about Why Astronomers Use Black and White cameras and also trying the Astronomy Calculator I developed with your gear and any camera you are considering. www.bintel.com.au/tools/astronomy-calculator/ Video : th-cam.com/video/lD0ZH2doSlk/w-d-xo.html
I bought yours!
I'm still using it 😀
Stand-by for camera selfie at 1:40
Nice!
Great video Dylan. It would be great if you could make another video especially for Astronomy video (deep sky) and the cameras that are best suited for this.
Thanks for the suggestion and kind words!
Awesome video, Dylan, thanks for posting!
Hey no problem :)
Thanks for all of the hard work and sharing with this community. I sent you a message on FB because I'm looking for your opinion on a camera from your extensive experience.
Dylan this was a great video. It was a great refresher course to pick a lot of stuff I had either forgotten or did not know. Any chance you might do a part 2? I'm thinking about adding a 16200 sensor to my QSI 690 and 683 collection and would love to hear your thoughts on these cameras. I'm leaning towards the Moravian G3 or QHY but this video taught me some things about QHY that I didn't know, thus now leaning harder to Moravian. I hear QSI is about to release a 16200 camera. Maybe I ought to wait.
Sean
Hey Dylan. Great vid man, I just came across your channel a couple of days ago so am a new subscriber. Lol all the way up in the NT. Good to see an Aussie doing so well!
I'm a photographer who has just recently discovered a new interest in Astrophotography. I'd be keen to hear your thoughts on what might be achievable with the setup I have. I haven't invested in a proper telescope yet, but I ordered the iOptron Skyguider Pro with iPolar a couple of days ago so looking forward to having a play with that. This will be my first time with tracking and autoguiding. So far it's just been single exposures on a tripod.
I'm using a Sony A7Riii, and for deep sky I'll be using the 200-600 f5.6/6.3, also mounted on a 2.0x tele. I took some shots with the moon, also cropped in to APS-C, giving me a total reach of 1800mm, and I was quite impressed with the result. I know generally zoom lenses aren't ideal, but have you had any luck using a similar setup?
Cheers Kev.
Kevin Pattemore welcome mate! Good to have more aussies on the chan (it’s like 90% yank friends). See my video on piggyback astrophotography that might help!
@@DylanODonnell cheers man will have a look.
P.S. I think I'm lucky where I am too, being that I go out into my front yard and the skies are pitch black, as my place is in Bortle Class 2. A phrase I'd never even heard of until Trevor Jones's videos..
Anyway, cheers, look forward to all the learning to come 👍
Good. I did the right thing. A friend of mine offered a Canon dslr to me as a step into AP, which I accepted.
So in the near future I'll be posting my own attempts at AP :)
Welcome to the club :)
Always useful, always clear and fun! Thanks a lot!
Thanks Dylan. That was short but very informative. Well done because it saves a lot of time and money.
Cheers Dino!
I switched to Canon too. Magic Lantern is really a great help for astro photography.
Huuuuuge mistake, the Nikon has an insanely better sensor for deep darks at low iso. It's night and day better.
Great video on cameras to used. I think I will look at the Canon Astrocamera first and then maybe accd camera. I presently own a Orion g3C camera but I have not use it yet.
But if you get your dslr modified specifically your deep sky imaging, it should give you any problem, shouldn't it?
Well that makes it “ok” for ha emission but ruins truecolour, isn’t as sensitive as a mono cam and doesn’t have cooling. It’s ok but not the best for deep space imaging imho
Dylan, I'm subscribing to your channel. 4 reasons: I love Macs, I just bought a Celestron 925HD, I love Canon, and finally.. I'm just starting. Need input..
David Grass welcome and congratulations! My apologies to your family.
😂 your cryptic sense of humour is refreshing! Merry Christmas my friend.
Thanks Dylan- a first timer to you and Astro photography, but the way you’ve demystified this CCD vs CMOS is great for me, as about as novice as novices come! But Fascinating!!.. and I’m simply fascinated by the complexity of all this. Now the other burning question is, what software?..have a 800 XLT Celestron CTC series BUT these long time exposures, with these cameras, how do you control the motion of the telescope for Astro photography? Software I’m guessing, but how to choose? Anyway love your videos! I’ll keep on watching! Thanks
Terrific video and channel. I'm very glad to subscribe. Many thanks for the great content presented in such a clear and entertaining way.
Jeffrey Shokler hey thanks for taking the time to say as much Jeff!
I was hoping to find a remake ur updated video here. It's now 2.5 years later.
3:52 How about a video comparing your photos 5 years ago with now, how much better they've gotten, and how you you did it. ...Including getting focus so much better with EdgeHD now than this old M42. I think you even had EAF back then, right?
Hey Dylan, just stumbled across your channel and have watch a few of your videos. Great work man! i am relatively new to astrophotography and have found some of the things you have covered on your channel very helpful. I have a question about the DSLR option, i know you said it is middle of the pack but for me now that's all i am after for now, what i wanted to know was is the process of connecting a mirrorless camera the same as for my DSLR?
Dylan, I have a Nikon D810 DSLR and was thinking of a CCD camera for deep space AP. I have 11" Edge HD and CGX-L mount, now on a cement pier. I'm trying to avoid buying a CCD and was wondering if I shoot the D810 in mono mode (with a filter wheel eventually), am I getting closer to the quality of a CCD? I'm very new to AP and have seen quite a bit of you videos, great job BTW! Also, what about cooling the DSLR? I assume most of my deep space shots will be done in winter time, but is it worth it to reduce the noise or can I pull it out in post? Any thoughts would be appreciated.
Jim
Also interested as I have the D5600 and D810, doing some night photos and basic Milky Way but want to get a bit more involved without selling the house lol. Using cheap Meade ETX80 atm been taking photos with 14mm wide angle and also 400 mm telephoto. Want to take it up a level.
Really enjoyed the video. Care to share your camera settings for your ISS transit photo? Transits don't happen very often and I don't want to spend months of trial and error. BTW my CGX should be here in 2 days so I hope you get a commission
That topic deserves it's own video! But the setting that matters is 1/1600th of a second shutter speed :) Hey congrats on the CGX! I was so pumped when I got mine. (still am really heh)
Thanks I appreciate the info. I was having a lot of problems with a CPC 925 on a wedge and Starsense, it would align but never calibrate even remotely close so it quit being enjoyable. I went with your recommendation on the CGX assuming I might still have problems. but not that one.
I can attest to the Canon\Nikon choice for astrophotography. I love my Nikon D5500 so I bought a Nikon D3300 and sent it off to have it modified (ir filter replacement) at Lifepixel (great service by the way) but the Nikon has horrendous software support and none of the common utilities (even the ones that boast Nikon support) work with my camera.
Do your support research before investing in a DSLR to make sure the manufacturer & model support the broadest range of software.
Yes! It's a real issue isn't it? Which is a shame because the cameras are just as good (or better) but the UI design and software / firmware is just better on Canon.
Great video Dylan! Looking forward to more!
Cheers Butzkrieg !
Dylan, Your video largely discusses cameras in terms of planetary vs deep space. However let's say you are solely looking to discover comets and asteroids. Which is better then - ccd v cmos? And which is better monochorome or color? And is Ha wavelength any advantage?
Watching this 5 year old video vs your new videos… young become so much more comfortable in front of a camera
Oh man .. I don’t .. maybe I should. I will cringe hard.
Hah you know what? There was an issue with my camera and imovie back in those days that slowed the footage down by a small % which is why the intro is slower and my voice is lower .. people keep wondering why my intro sped up but I didn’t … I just fixed the error 😆
Hi Dylan great video. I also have a 9.25 and have been using a dslr. I'm ready to make the move to a neximage camera. What beginner cam do you recommend is the best to start with. Thanks
I think the ZWO range is pretty solid! I'd try the 1600MM (mono) with filters .. then you can do narrowband :)
Great advice Dylan 👍👌
Great vid. My Samsung can see ir but my daughters iPhone can't see ir.
At times I've used my phone attached to our portable scopes and we see odd objects in the sky.!
How interesting!
Thanks , great vid.
Really useful info, thanks Dylan!
neil cooper glad it helped !
Very good and fair overview.
Thx James !
hey Dylan, great video, if you had to choose the best camera for 10" RC Telescope, would a older camera like the SBIG STL11000M be a good choice? I've heard that RC telescopes or any longer focal length telescope requires a large pixel size, would love to hear your thoughts.
The thread is *not* 2", it is a T-thread (M42x0.75).
Cannot afford an expensive planetry camera, had a nextimage 5, had to take it apart as had some dead insect in there, been sitting around for years, buggered the sensor up, trying to clean it, seems impossible to get all the dust off.
Going for the ASI120MC-S (color) instead as I heard its a better camera anyway
just started in the hobby, thank you for this resource. I subscribed. smash like NOW!!
Would a cmos camera be better for Jupiter and Saturn? They spin like a top.
Hello again, Dylan. How good is the Nexstar 8SL to explore close-up the moon mountains.
Hey Dylan I recently found your vids and I’ve got to say, they are the best Ive seen. Good information and super useful! I was wondering if you can give me some suggestions on what cameras I should use? I have a edge hd 11 but can’t find anything that isn’t over sampled. If you can I would like one for planetary with a Barlow lens and one for DSO possibly under 1200us dollars, keep the vids coming dude.
Get the 0.7x reducer for that Edge HD 11 and I think you'll find your options open up! Long focal lengths just oversample really. Thanks for the kind comments!
Thanks for a useful video, Dylan. If you explained why a higher frame rate is useful for planetary photography, I missed it. Does it have to do with taking a number of shots and looking for one with low atmospheric distortion?
Check my 20 tips for planetary astrophotography video :)
Aha. Lucky imaging, or lucky^2 imaging. Thanks.
The bintel calculator doesn't offer a celestron ota in conjunction with hyperstar, shame.
Curious: I just got an ASI294MC Pro, rather than modify my Nikon D5300 (love it), but now I read about people inserting an IR cut filter for the 294. What?
Excellent video Dylan, thanks for your time. Do you have an opinion about the Mallincam products?
Thanks! Never used em I'm afraid.
Excellent Info Dylan Thanks
Had been looking at the QHY183C Not for astrophotography , but EAA, so as its live stacking not astrophotography and more related to video astronomy, works on an Alt Alz fine. Working it out on my Evo 9.25 SCT its ever so slight Over sampling 1 green tick
. If I bin 2X2 Very good and that's with a 0.5X reducer. Almost full moon according to your scale. I would imagine a bigger sensor and higher res you have more binning options, so could drop or increase binning according to atmosphere. Using astronomy tools which takes atmospheric conditions by adjusting binning works well according to that program on ok, good and expectational conditions.. I am surprised doing your calculations on my Scope the ASI224 on the planets was well over sampled
I know EAA is laughable compared to astrophotography, but still goes way beyond the human eye can ever see and helps cut through light pollution, but with moern cameras EAA is becoming a viable option and can be done on a much cheaper budget . EAA is like a halfway point between visual and Astrophotography and nearer to video astronomy as you are doing it near live.
Guess binning on a larger Higher res chip you have more to play with, like if you photo in Hi res, you have more to play with when you crop.
I just got a ZWO asi2600mc-Pro, but I’ve found with my AsiAir that has failed while under warranty, both ZWO and the reseller OptCom are giving me basically zero support for the warranty item So I don’t expect my expensive asi2600mc-Pro is supported any better then my AsiAir. Gonna send the asi2600mc-P while I can’t. Not work having something that expensive when the warranty is useless.
What are your thoughts on the Celestron NexImage cameras? Currently using a Celestron 8SE, but hoping to upgrade soon to a CPC 1100. I’m mostly visual, but would like to try planetary and lunar imaging...
Hi Dylan, thank you for informative video. I need your help based on your expert knowledge. I want to do crescent imaging (which is immediately after sunset for 30 to 60 minutes) through Telescope, which camera do you suggest?
1-CCD or CMOS ?
2-Detailed Spec please
I have a Celestron Omni XLT 120mm f/8.3 Refractor telescope with equatorial manual mount.
It has Aperture of 120mm and a Focal Length of 1000mm.
Appreciate your quick and detailed reply.
Thank you in advance.
Great informative video. Thanks. Liked and subbed.
Hey thanks for taking the time to say so! Welcome aboard!
Can we get a new video on this topic again pleaseeeeeeee
Query - I have read many folk like ZWO because of its extremely low read out noise, coupled to its fast USB3 read out pathway allows one to take hundreds of images and stack the data to get image quality comparable to CCD but at a much better price point for the same targets total imaging time. ZWO state that once you are stacking 50 plus frames their native 12 or 14 bit cameras one fully recovers 16 bit image quality. Does this argument make sense to you for Deep space / low light targets? I have seen videos where roughly over an hour 148 x 30 second ZWO images of the faint bubble nebulae where captured and stacked and they look really good once processed. I would have expected 3-5 minute subs where required, but the really low read out noise means the data quality really is there even on short subs. I know from signal to noise mathematics having a really high number of frames really helps S/N provided there is good data - Signal - in each of your frames.
Many thanks Matthew
Yeh the 12 bit basically requires a portion of extra subs you wouldn’t need with 16bit chips. The return on time investment slows down after 40-50 frames certainly. I wouldn’t say that stacked short subs are a replacement for long ones though, not entirely.
Thanks, great information
Very useful info, thanks for that.But may i say that you are wrong about the infrared filter about the phones.Bc all of my previous phones and the one that i am using now can see infrared lights of the remotes.And those were HTC, Samsung, Asus and now a Xiomi.Is there a prolem about yours?Bc that one should see the IR too.
I also have a Nikon and am having that dreaded software issue or lack thereof. Thanks
Really helpfully video! I’m a beginner and I’m looking for a good planetary camera for my 900/80 refractor. What cam would you recommend me? Some people recommended me the ZWO ASI120MC-S, so I want to know your opinion. Thanks!
How about! great video by the way …I was thinking about the Revolution Imager R2 with color video 7” Monitor V.S. ZWO ASI290MM mono chrome cmos camera For My 114MM Newtonian Reflecter telescope f9 1000 FL please advise
Can we attach an astrophotography Camera, either CCD or CMOS, to a standard telelens like Canon 100-400 mm lena? If so which would be the drawback for doing that?
Superb presentation thank you
I probably have the wrong telescope for Jupiter its not slow enough. I reckon a F20 Dall-Kirkham would give better results than an F5 newtonian