🐻Dangerous Animal Protection?💥💥 .357 Mag VS 10mm VS .44 Mag💥💥
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ก.ย. 2020
- Doing a ballistic test against to see which cartridge is best against a "dangerous animal" (unspecific) between the .357 Magnum, 10mm auto and .44 Magnum. Ammunition used is all Buffalo Bore hard cast ammunition. The .357 Magnum is a 180 gr flat nose bullet, the 10mm auto is a 220 gr flat nose bullet and the .44 Magnum is a 255 gr semi wadcutter bullet. Testing with my "dangerous animal" ballistic pack consisting of 3.5" of bologna covered by a layer or thick carpet backed by 5/8" of plywood and into water jugs. Always appreciative of any channel help :) www.patreon.com/user?u=5828221
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VERY IMPORTANT, read this before you watch!
I get the "limp wrist" comment nearly daily in one video or another with this pistol, but from people who haven't a clue what they are talking about, so I urge you not to jump to conclusions. Most of the issue with malfunctions is the feed ramp, the Lone Wolf AlphaWolf CONVERSION barrel I use has a very thin feed ramp, not wide and loose chamber like a stock Glock feed ramp/chamber. Also, in this video I was not using a 10mm extractor in the conversion, so that didn't help. If you still do not believe me, I did a study of all of the hollow point ammo tests I did with this Glock 41 pistol in both the stock and the conversion setup. Why this is important is because I tested SEVERAL .45 ACP+P rounds that were well over the typical energy level of 10mm, as well as at or above typical 10mm bullet weight, and I never once had a jam in those rounds. Here is the study of just the Glock 41 portion:
Glock 41 (.45 ACP)
Shots Fired: 93
Malfunctions: 1
Malfunction Rate: 1.1%
Glock 41 (10mm Conversion)
Shots Fired: 102
Malfunctions: 23
Malfunction Rate: 22.5%
Glad you figured out whats wrong with your pistol. Now stop limp wristing.
I have seen some really bad designs on aftermarket barrels,straight narrow feedramps that are not flared and cause nose up failure to feed.
@Rom vin those 180 357 would drill deep and allow fast follow ups, the video is not about rifles.
I was going to ask if it was a factory barrel. I have a kkm in my Glock 20 I don’t have feed ramp issues but the clearance is so tight certain rounds don’t run good. S&B run the best through my Glock 20 and the cheapest out there. Zero complaints for S&B.
@Rom vin Sure
I used the .44 mag for several years in grizzly country. The older I got, the less accurate I was in multiple firings. I blame it on the 44's recoil. I went back to the .357 mag. The reasoning was that I could put more lead into the animal with the better control. Yes, I use Buffalo Bore. I might also add, depending on the situation (like accompanying my son on his elk hunt), I often carry a 12 gauge with slugs and prefer this combo over any handgun on a grizzly.
Hi, .357 can do the job, Regards.
Well hell yeah, I'd prefer my 12 guage as well. But there is something to be said for a small firearm that packs a punch. But you already know all that, you carried for years you said, and still do.
Wife and I rock a S&W 686 (357 mag.) and a Glock 22 (.40 cal). Plenty of extra mags and ammo.
💯 i use 3 inch slugs in my 12 . Stevens gd ole 67e
@@ryanjordan7268 I like adding the 40 semi-auto Ryan I think that's a good idea as a backup gun of course but yes good idea!! That's just my opinion of course.
I love revolvers cause I can clear a failure to feed or stove pipe just by pulling the trigger again 😎😳🤣✌💥
Auto's jam that's why revolvers are my choice in a animal attack protection weapon
When it comes to large critters in the wilderness I would go with either of the 357 magnum or the 44 magnum. Yes when it comes to large animals in the sticks I would prefer a revolver
You can’t go wrong with the.357. Hunting, or self defense, the.357 can do the job.
The same with the.10mm , as long as you have the right platform and ammunition to fire it from.
The .44 magnum also a good performer with the right ammunition.
I would probably go with the .357 for its versatility.
We live here in Wyoming and when we go for a walk in the boonies, I carry nothing but Buffalo Bore ammo! .357 Mag, to be exact. Their 180 grain hard cast flat point gas checked round at 1400 fps gives me 783 ft/lbs energy, and far superior penetration to anything a 10mm can deliver. I'm working on getting a .44 mag and will carry Buffalo Bore rounds in that, as well. We have our share of critters here in Wyoming with teeth, claws and power and we love 'em all, but not wanting to get eaten, we protect ourselves! God bless!
Thanks for watching. Coming away from this video I agree the .357 is great. I got right around rated velocity and the recoil was no greater than a 125 gr full house .357 Magnum, at least that's what it felt like to me. So a lot of power and penetration, low recoil and accurate. It works.
Great out of a levergun too!
Are you deaf? The 10mm just spanked the .357 180 grain in the penetration test.
@@garysarratt1 Yes, but all semi-autos can have a hang-up. Some are due to the gun and some are due to poor technique of the shooter. Most experts on the subject still recommend a revolver over a semi-auto for dangerous game. Also, more people can learn to shoot a 357 mag well over even a 44 mag. In general, the fixed barrel of the revolver is more accutate than a semi-auto. The 1911 platform is the primary exception. That would be the only semi for me in 10mm.
I trust my model 28 when I go hiking....we dont have Grizzlies in upstate ny but alot of black bears!!!
No, no. For killer rabbits you use the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch. :-p
And they feasted upon .... sloathes, orangutans, breakfast cereals, fruit bats...
And what are you going to do if they are OUT of grenades?.. That is what this test proves! A suitable alternative good Knight!
Oh Lord, bless this thy holy hand grenade, with which we may blow thy enemies into tiny bits ....... in thy mercy.
I’ve been waiting with my 44 for an animal to attack me for 50 years! Hasn’t happened yet but my 44 and 50 BAR are ready!
This video shows why a revolver in the back country is always a better option. When a dangerous animal is charging, you don’t have time to think about a jam.
Thanks for this comparison between these heavy hitters. As an owner of .357 magnum revolvers I'm pleased to see your positive results. I've mentioned this before but my first personal handgun was a Colt Trooper .357 magnum that I purchased for boarding parties in Vietnam.
Thanks for watching. The .357 and also this revolver are just a great match. I seem to shoot it better than any other handgun.
@@GunSam That's saying a lot. I have to say it's a great cartridge. I prefer to fire from a 4" barrel L-frame but also have one in a 2.5" k-frame.
Keep in mind, it's up against a handicapped 'low recoil' 44 mag round. Who would choose such a cartridge for the 'dangerous game' in the video's title?
Bet that colt trooper is beautiful. Id love to hqve one in a 6 inch bore
Surprised that you were allowed to do that. Was it sufficient for the task?
Hardcast rules for sure. I like the HSM Bearload 200gr in 357.
The 430 grain in the 45-70 is a great load for HSM too.
@@johnmccracken7194 heck yea man I use the HSM .44 magnum bear loads 300gr, it’s a heavy round😱
Your 10 mm makes me happy that I have a Ruger 357mag with a 6-inch barrel. Always goes bang. The 6-inch barrel gives me a little more velocity and longer site radius.
I have a simple 357 model 66 from Taurus-- it looks EXACTLY like a model 19 S/W --that my ex-wife stole from me--i just love it! 4"barrel,it will definitely get me back to my truck or bike that gets me home to my REAL artillery😉great video tho
👍. 357 is pretty versatile and it's hard to beat as an all round defensive weapon
@@leeriutzel4780
Actually that glock should not even been in the equation. I have seen other 10mm 1911 flow flawless.
@@efrayim100 even if the weapon never jams up due to its design, the ammo could still cause a misfire. If the ammo doesn't go off properly, you're going to have to rack it and clear that round in order to fire again whereas the revolver only requires another trigger pull
The winner in this test was the old and venerable 357 mag. What a wondeful round made by BB. Just awesome. 10mm was also an incredible contender. Lots of power and penetration but in a dangerous scenario I would use a revolver any day vs semi auto (ruger, S&W and some others make excellent 10mm revolvers) And finally the 44 mag showed the tremendous power factor but also heavy recoil: You need to be Mr Miculek to use properly heavy loads in a 44 mag. :-) Thanks a lot for the vid.
Thanks for watching. I saw a video of Jerry with this revolver and even he seemed to struggle a tad to land the shots quickly.
He’s also shooting the 44s out of a model 69, which is lighter L frame. It would probably be better through the heavier N frame.
And this is why I count on the 44mag. A 10mm is not as reliable as a revolver in not needing rounds matched to recoil springs or feed ramps. Also this applies to guard dogs!
357 best revolver, agreed for general protection of dangerous game IMO
I think I would go with the .357 also, plenty enough power and quicker follow up shots which comes in handy when dispatching a charging big game bologna pack!
I'd go with my glock 20 All day
357 ain't plenty for a charging grizzly.
@@edbukowski5952 ya while it's plenty for me and on my hip on many occasions here in Alabama I'd probably carry my Ruger Super Redhawk in 44mag in grizzly territory. Maybe something bigger even. I'm not a fan of 500 but in bear country I might be.
@@edbukowski5952 Did you not just watch the video clearly it is I suppose you're the guy who thinks Is a 30-30 won't shoot a 100 yd
@@edbukowski5952 only 4 States with Grizzlies, three of which are in the lower 48. Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, and Alaska. Grizzlies used to be in Washington, Oregon, and California, but were wiped out by the 1920s. The forest services keep an eye out for them, but so far they haven't returned to those States.
For the rest of the 45 States, a .357 is plenty for black bear, mountain lions, coyotes, and wolves. But you pick what you want and practice. That's all that matters.
Just found your channel. Love your great ammo review. 👍🇺🇸
The .44 magum was the clear winner. With penetration being approximately equal, you have to consider how much energy was delivered to the target. The .44 magnum generates considerably more energy.
@@brendaandjohn1416 Honestly a Glock 20 is probably the way to go. Not a conversion though. 😉
I want to stop the charging animal...hunting with my .44 mag, (using H110; 265 JHP; 629 8 3/8") I have flipped running deer, cutting across in front (left to right) of me @ 35 yards away. Of course you got to hit them, (yes it takes 2 or 3 shots) and you aim for the neck of course.
I started hunting with .357 mag. You really need to place your shot Hit a doe ( doe season) once broad side, 15 yds away.
No doubt penetrate both lungs; blood on the ground but deer just jumped, turned around and ran 100 yards to the water and we lost her. .44 at that distance when I'm 15-20 ft up a tree, has pinned most deer to the ground. Started hunting with 240 grain 22.7 grains H110- shifted to 265 grains (max load) bc it's a flatter trajectory but recoil tougher to handle. Leaned against a tree. Now at 67yrs old I'm back shooting 240 grain H110 22.7. Gr. at targets 15 yds away. I'm still able to hit a gal milk jug.
I'll be going into valdez alaska and denali alaska with a glock 20 gen 5. I think it'll do
@@williammarsh1964 Sounds great for deer but is the hollow point the right choice for tough skin dangerous animals like grizzly bears? Wouldn't hard cast or FMJ be better choices?
Your passion for everything you do is amazing!
Thanks. This is why people watch I think, and the advice I give for people making videos. It doesn't matter what you film or even how you do it, it matters that you like doing it and people see that and seem to like watching that. I'd probably still be doing these videos even of there was no TH-cam. Just to keep record of the fun.
Interesting, not the outcome I anticipated. Thanks for experimenting and the ride along.👍🏽
Story time. I carry the same load in my 6" GP100 357 mag. I actually had a serious encounter with a roughly 200lb mother black bear with 3 cubs 4yrs ago. I was deer hunting with my son trying to get him his first buck. He was carrying my 243. Anyway we sat next to a ravine/creek. We saw the bear and 3 cubs in tow traveling up the ravine. Wouldn't you know it she came out and up exactly where we were sitting,,couldn't of walked by of course,,....She was less than 10ft. face to face with us. Ears back, teeth clacking, making low woofing sounds. She was not backing off. I grabbed the rifle and had it aimed at her head, but with a scope I was just pointing it at that range. Even if she charged and I fired chances are I would of shot over her as fast as they can charge. Luckily I jumped up and yelled and fired the rifle in the ground and she retreated, and the cubs all went up the nearest trees..lol!..Lesson learned to carry my revolver at all times up in my deer woods. As a last resort my handgun on my side could be utitilized if the bear had actually attacked and gotten on top of me..The rifle would of been useless at that point in my scenario. Been carrying that revolver up there ever since. She is still happily living in my woods..sidenote it was the last day of black bear as well but i didn't have a tag. Of course other guys first words..You should of shot it I would of tagged it....smh...that guys luckily isn't on my property anymore..Thanks for the upload..
Thanks for the story and watching. Black bears are rare in my area, but they have been seen before within a half mile of where I shoot. So, I always keep my normal carry gun on me even when I film with other guns. From my understanding, black bears typically retreat when shot with anything, but I suppose a mother bear might not.
@Stu650Zuk Would you have used bear spray if you had a can on your hip?
@@exothermal.sprocket To try to stop an attack I would use anything for sure. Never looked into bear spray before. Just glad all parties went their separate ways with no injured parties.
Remember that you can always give a black bear a warning shot and they will typically be gone. Where I live we have plenty of black bears. Most of the time they move off before we see them. A mother bear and her cubs is a different story. I would still give her the benefit of a warning shot in the dirt if she was close enough to scare me. I would only shoot the bear if I had no other option. In my state a warning shot for a human can yield an attempted murder charge. So I always tell my son when he is in the woods - bears get the warning shot, but if a bad person is trying to do you harm it must go to center mass. Wild hogs are our greatest threat. If they are in range and not moving away you are in danger. We know of more people who have been hurt or killed by wild hogs than bears.
10ft away face to face!?? Holy crap, that is crazy!!
. 357 still holds up for versatility. I do not think you could have pulled a hip shot with the .44 as you did with the .357. Also what you said in general about reliability about revolvers, as to why they are still used. Liked your demonstration.
180 grn 357 all you need brother, great vid keep up the good work, and God bless!
Thank you. Yes that .357 was pretty good.
For big bears....44 all day over 357
All I can say is, its a hell of a waste of bologna 😎
.44Mt Mag, 240 gr solids ,you can never have to much power, when facing danger ! Great vid thx👌
Thanks for the test. Exactly what I was looking for.
Another great video!
Lots o penetration with those hard cast projectiles, impressive.
Keep the 44 mag stuff coming.
Thanks. I have another one filmed with Hydrashok .357 and .44 Mag. Very interesting results!
I really like your practical application ballistic tests. I carry a 4.2" 7 shot GP-100 in a Kenai chest rig loaded with Underwood 180 gr. hard cast on most outings into the bush. I did my own head to head testing with Buffalo Bore and the Underwood ammo always edges out BB by a narrow margin. That might be an interesting video. A hard cast shootout. In Griz country, I step up to my SRH Toklat loaded with Underwood 325 gr. hard cast .45 Colt +P. I get around 1300 FPS and 1200 ft. lbs. with this round. I am much more accurate with .45 Colt than I am with the .454 Casull version. Thanks for producing very useful videos.
As I’m watching your videos I’m really appreciating my Ruger Security six more and more. I really got the security six just to plink with learn and get comfortable with reloading & casting. But now I’m starting to think this revolver is a real SHTF deal. From what I’m seeing yeah you only have 6 shots but those 6 shots are extremely reliable and extremely devastating.
After once putting 3 357's into a venison which proceeds 150 yards .
I found something a bit bigger was in order ...
29 Smith. With good rubber grips ...
@@williamcollins4082 a bigger caliber is no replacement for shot placement. If you would of put 1 of those 3 shots into the correct places the animal wouldn't of moved let alone went 150yards. It's not the caliber it's the hunter.
Wow… you put a lot of work into that. Thanks!
With the price of ammo these days, revolvers just got even more practical.
Thanks for doing this! I've been waiting on a .357 mag, 10mm Buffalo boar test. I thought the .357 mag would outclass the 10mm, but it was closer than I would have guessed. Awesome!
Thanks for watching. I actually have identical bullet weights/shape in the Underwood version too, 180 gr vs 220 gr .357 and 10mm. It will be interesting to see how Underwood stacks up.
@@GunSam Can't wait! It will be interesting to see whose got the edge velocity wise...Underwood or Buffalo Boar.
@@Hoodyhoo2121 What I have seen in the past is that Underwood and Buffalo Bore load similar velocity semi auto cartridges, but Underwood is usually slower with revolver cartridges.
10mm usually edges the 357 out in penetration tests from what I've seen. Though they are ballistically speaking pretty comparable.
@@deathtdow correct I am aware of that I am a HUGE 10mm aficionado!!!
I recently started training with and carrying my Ruger Police Service Six for many reasons, despite acquiring it as a "collectors" item as mine was made the same year I was born, yet sat in a safe its entire life until I acquired it. She's perfect. Over the years, collecting .38 special, .38 special +p, and .357 magnum rounds, with the current state of affairs ammunition-wise, It only makes sense to me.
If anything this video made a great case for a revolver. Last thing you need in a dangerous animal encounter is an ammo finicky semi auto.
👍 yes I agree the 357magnum won this contest and thank you this is one of your best reviews..taking all into consideration power, accuracy, recoil, follow up shots the 357 would seem to be your best choice to survive an attack!
However an Underwood 10mm 220 grain hard cast from a reliable 6 inch pistol is almost unbeatable for protection against (lions, tigers, and bears Oh! My) but it has to be Proven reliable.... my yeahbut is in reality a head shot from any of these will drop anything on the continent.
Thank you. Hopefully I can figure out this reliability issue. It's probably mainly the tight chamber, but I might have to look into extractors as that's the one thing I never changed that some people say you should for conversions.
Oh, and I have that Underwood round. Was delivered yesterday. Same bullet shape, weight and rated velocity as this BB round but with the high tech coating. Hopefully that will slick it up enough to be more reliable.
The Predator part 2 line from Agent Keyes.
In a revolver the 357 is my favorite round and I wouldn't hesitate to use it for dangerous game. However in semiautomatic handguns the 10mm hands down is my favorite. And again I wouldn't hesitate to use it for dangerous game. But I feel the 45 win mag would be an amazing choice. I enjoy your videos.
I did a test like this, including the rounds you ran (except for the .357 Magnum), and I was shocked that my .357 Sig handloads, consisting of a 125gr flat point FMJ at 1,550fps and a 147gr flat point FMJ at 1,400fps gave the most penetration of all, beating even the 10mm. That is what my wife and I carry now when fishing in grizzly/mountain lion/black bear/wolf country in Wyoming, Idaho, and Montana.
I appreciate this comparison. Thanks! I live in Idaho and fly fish in areas bears and cougars roam. Since I’m in and from time to time fall in the water, is there a problem with any of these getting wet and still performing? Also will be holstering at the chest and I’m a left handed. How’s that for a combination?!
Great video. My first gun was a 6” Model 686. That’s what I would have with me. I have a Model 29 as well but under stress I’d rather have the 686. Could get off more shots with better accuracy I think.
I like the 'animal/dangerous game' bologna pack! The carpet is a nice touch!
The 44mag 255gr hard cast keith load by buffalo bore is what i carry in my S&W 329pd! Its the limit on what my hand can handle in that gun. Lol
That’s why you don’t hunt werewolves with a Glock, stick to the revolver, just ask Yankee Marshal he knows all about that 🤣
YAS! Exactly my thought!
Anthony Guidas Or don’t use a conversion. Silvertips are probably more appropriate for werewolves, anyhow.
Or when you're old wear a silver mullet. Smack, they run when they see that. The embellished war stories and history of their 84 Bronco is enough awkward anxiety to cause a heart attack.
@@GunSam hey now...
Excellent work sir!
Even though I'm a revolver guy, I'm going to say that a good 10mm that's reliable and with high capacity might be the best option. It's a tough call though. The 357 is second, but only if you have a 7 or 8 round cylinder. Being attacked by a wild animal will give you little time to react and cause you to panic, so having higher capacity to counter the mistakes involved in that will help tremendously. Third is the 44 mag. Only 6 rounds causes an issue with being effective against predatory animals. You only have a short time to make effective shots, especially if you were stalked and pounced upon. 44 mag is probably the best option against a kodiak or a grizzly bear, because it has enough power and weight to crack open the skull, but considering all the wild animals that can attack you, the other guns will probably be better because of capacity.
Just my thoughts on the matter.
Great comparison. I'm a .357 mag guy, but I also love my 44.
I choose the 357 Magnum, mainly because I already have a couple, but also because I don’t really appreciate anything that recoils harder than that. That said, I had fired a friend’s S&W 629 Performance Center four inch with a comp. Even with 240 grain magnums, the comp made the recoil feel not much worse than a stout 357. Nothing wrong with the 10mm, but just not that interesting to me at the moment. Excellent and informative video.
The over the jugs shot was really cool!
I was impressed with that too, a lot of work goes into these videos.
I have a stock G20SF and have experienced the exact same issue as you did with yours when firing hardcast bullets. I moved to Underwood's Xtreme Hunter rounds instead, and have never had a failure. They feed just like ball. I'd love to see you do the test again with each handgun using one of these modern hunting/defense rounds.
Good to know, thanks for sharing
I have been holding on to the 357 mag Outdoorsman for about 3 years now always super curious how it would perform. Looks like it did its job perfect. Great video thanks a lot Sam
Thanks for watching. I know the feeling. Now days it's easier to get ammo for myself due to the channel doing okay, but at one time I would be hesitant to try stuff like this.
Dont want a jam when the heats on. Big revolver for me!
He used a conversion set-up instead of a proper 10mm hand gun. Not a real comparison.
@@masterkeep
And he was limp wristing the Glock.
Or 1911 10mm
ok, no conversions, don't limp-wrist, lift your left foot, touch your nose.....What else needs to be done before a bear eats you, to get a 10mm to shoot? SMH
@@timothyparks2531 I've never had my Glock 20SF to malfunction in the 7 years I've owned it regardless what brand of ammo I used. Anything from Buffalo Bore, Blazer, Sig Sauer, Remington, or Federal.
I have no experience with 10mm, but .357&.44mag pretty much have my full confidence...(so far as leaving an impression on whatever the target happens to be)
Great test! Been waiting for something like that.
The bottom line to me is a hard cast flat nose at 1200 FPS will work if the bullet is placed right.
I carry the 180 grain BB in both my 4 inch Colt Python & my 3 inch Ruger SP101. It was really good to see both the chronograph readings & penetration tests!
In my S&W 2.5” PC 629 .44 mag. I have been carrying BB Heavy 255 grain SWC .44 specials. I will now try some of those BB .44 mag loads that you tested. Never quite trusted a semi for a dangerous game back up. I have read to many accounts of the handgun barrel being buried in the animal with the hunter/ hiker pinned to the ground. Hard to beat a revolver!
Thanks. I have the Underwood version of that .44 Special load i'm going to test, got their 255 gr .45 auto load to compare it to, interesting they have the same weight.
Gun Sam _Revolver Aficionado_ Can’t wait! I’ve also carried 1911 .45’s many a hiking trail mile. This will be interesting & fun!
All hail to the king! .357
@Robb CoochiesIayer Wow you are macho. lol
@@samhotstick13.28 all hail the mighty 44mag. I love, use, and carry a .357mag. But neither it nor the 10mm can equal the power of the 44magnum. It just is what it is.
This was a good one Sam...glad to see you still making vids....357 is my choice too!
A very, very cool test. Thanks.
Thank you, thanks for watching.
Another great video!
Thanks!
I love the 10mm and use a S & W 610 for big animal protection. It seems to have less recoil than the .44 mag. Where I live the .357 mag makes the most sense. I did carry the 10mm on my trip to Alaska. You might want to consider getting a 610 or Ruger revolver chambered in 10mm for testing.
I'm going to try a 10mm extractor next. I'm betting that's why it jams, got the stock 45 extractor in it
My first six gun was the S&W Mountain Gun 44magnum. For dangerous game with BBore or Underwood ...for dangerous humans 44 special. Cannot be beat in the city or the country. In real world you would not use less recoil 44 Mag.
The 629 mountain gun is simply awesome. I like them so much, I have one for each hand!
Thanks for another good and informative video. I think condition of the shooter is also a factor to consider. I am old and cannot shoot the big bore pistols and auto guns quickly and accurately any more. A good .357 is about my limit . A good pump shotgun with rifled slugs is my trail buddy for the past decade or so.
Outstanding job!
Thank you.
Try Garrett Cartridges of Texas 44 magnum 300 grain bullet made for 4 inch barrel revolvers.
I shoot 320gr hard cast LFN out of a 2-3/4” snubby. The fireball usually guarantees I get my own table at the range.
I have been waiting for a test like this. Thank you so much for doing it. The only other round I would have like to have seen compared would be the buffalo bore .45acp 255grain hard cast. I live in MT and grizzlies are always a concern and for a few years I carried that in my 1911 because that is what I had. Then I got the S&W 66 and now carry that with the 180gr Buffalo Bore you tested here. But almost everyone I see seems to be carrying the Glock 20 and it had me wondering if I should make the change to 10mm. After watching this I feel much better about my .357. Thanks!!
255 grain in .452 is a flying pancake, sectional density wise. There are better options for grizz.
@@imissyoumom7644 better than nothing lol, and .45 will still pack a punch enough for the animal to fuck off
@@imissyoumom7644 I’d carry magnums though. .357 or .44 just a preference. Won’t ever jam or light strike, easiest to shoot in my opinion for the power. I prefer heavier 357s too like a python or anything with a full length metal under barrel like the gp100.
Great vid , no jam with my 686 Smith and Wesson 4" , Carry's well and never fails with buffalo bore ,hits likes sledgehammer.
Awesome test
It looks like the .44 is a S&W 69. It would have been interesting to compare it with a 629 for recoil management.
great video. i like my .357 180 gr for dangerous game. but was told you need 10mm, or 44 mag, which i have the .44mag but on second shots,not too accurate. thanks for this video.
Thank you. From what i'm seeing while testing, I feel like the .357 Mag is just as good as the .44 Mag or 10mm.
The .357 mag is actually more powerful than the 10mm- and I don't mean in just this test. Max load .357 mag beats 10mm in the power category.
Great review! You have come this far go all the way with some .45 Super and some .450 SMC. Economical Glock conversion.
Agreed. .450 SMC is great and safer to shoot because of the primer size.
I mean safer than SUPER.
Another great video, thanks.
Awesome test. All three are great calibers.
I would tend to agree that the 357 won this test, if for no other reason than it was probably a little cheaper to buy than the other two.
The ballistic performance was surprisingly similar but I think the jug or not shows that the 44 magnum is in a class of its own. I feel like that particular load was middle of the road for power for a 44 and the 357 and 10mm were pretty high end for caliber, and it clearly did more damage, even out of a 4” barrel.
As far as accuracy goes the 10 looked better on paper but I feel like that was more to do with the gun malfunctions than anything. On the “charge”test the 357 was the clear winner.
Good test. I have 4” 686+ and 69 too. I love them. Keep it up. I look forward to more test involving the model 69 especially.
Thank you. I got the model 69 to use in a ton of videos to come.
.357 for the win. Best overall handgun round
Yet the only unsuccessful bear defense from a study of bear defense with handguns was from a .357. Granted two other defenses with .357 were successful, by that one .357 failure was the only failure. 🤷🏼♂️
Probably Byler choice, but worth mentioning.
Good test. Thanks
That was the closest test I have seen for a grizzly bear defensive shooting. I was planning on getting a single action 44mag. But, might go with a S&W 629. I would take that and my Henry carbine 44mag into the woods. Even though I would only encounter black bear.
Thanks. I just figured one would be still while shooting anyways. Over on either Alaskan Ballistics or Chukes outdoor adventures, or both I don't recall, they did a thing with a bear simulation with a fake bear charging. It was pretty interesting.
That's why I don't like or carry semi-autos, I love my revolvers.
Especially in an emergency situation, I love my glock but I’d almost rather carry my .38 with +p all day
I've shot several thousands of rounds in several of my semi autos and the only jammers were in 22 rifles (so far). Glock, Smith and Wesson, Ruger, Sig have never failed me. I hope if things get sticky it continues. I have 2 EDC Cold Steel 6" folders that I hope I never have to resort to but I'm ready if it does.
That would suck standing there in front of a changing Bear 🐻 with a jammed up Glock. 🥶😟
Change out the barrel to stainless steel for Glock because glock's factory barrels are not designed for hard cast bullets.
@@142321243913 I personally would stick to my Ruger 44 magnum
Lighter rounds are prone to tumble. For .44 mag hardcast, I'd go with a heavy grain at least 255 grain and 300 if your handgun will do it. I've seen demonstrations with those going into douglas fir boards with no tumble (went through 8 2" boards - impressive). I actually used to carry a .357 S&W Model 66 snub nose as my woods gun but felt it was a bit light against large black bears (400+ lbs). I upgraded to .44 mag and use 255-305gr hardcast WFN-GC. I found my .44 mag has very manageable recoil (Taurus M44SS 4") and I'm not a big guy/middle-aged man. I've never known anyone to die from recoil anyway, lol - always make that first shot count. People say if you miss the first shot, well 99% of the time if you miss the first shot the second is going to be 5X's as rushed and just as prone to a miss as the first. That's how I see it but go with the gun you are most comfortable with.
I'd choose the 10mm just because it's semiautomatic.
Interesting. Thanks. I carry a Springfield 10mm loaded with Underwood Xtreme Penetrators into the woods with me but have been considering a .357 lately. I've been thinking I likely won't need 15 rounds of 10mm. 7 rounds of .357 would prolly be plenty and I wouldn't have to worry about jams or the slide going out of battery if for some crazy reason the gun is pressed against the bear.
Get a compensator/standoff device that attaches to the Glock accessory rail, which cures your out of battery hypothetical situation. As for the jams, actual 10mm glocks really don't jam like the conversion kit gun in the video. If a bear is on me, I'd definitely want 15 rounds instead of 6 or 7 😬
@@SomeGuy-vo7we I've got a Springfield XDM. Lots of rounds - which was one of the a reasons I bought it. But the more I learn about bear attacks from reports and personally from folks who have had to shoot one, it happens so fast that you're not gonna get more than 3 or 4 rounds off and the bear is literally on you. Not interested in adding a comp or anything to the XDM that'd change its geometry. And aside from the very real out of battery potential with the 10 semi auto, I'd be more comfortable with the potentially harder hitting hot .357 stuff and potentially great reliability of a wheel gun.
I have read what handguns were successful in bear attacks and 357 was the only caliber that failed from 9mm; .40; .45; and 44 mag. I cannot recall if the 454 was included. However, the 357 users were injured or killed by the bear. Google it.
@@mutlee299 Ballistically that's a head scratcher but I'll Google it. I'm not hard over on replacing the 10mm because of ballistics - I'm loaded with Underwood Xtreme Penetrators and feel confident in them - but because of the potential for out of battery issues if the bear ends up on top of me.
I've got the 6.5" taurus 627 and it's great. 7 shots of .357 feels like plenty. The barrel shroud jacket w/e isn't steel so it's much lighter than it looks but has porting so it still shoots like it's heavy. Got mine for a song and dance but you can still find them for $475. Probably the best and cheapest red dot host option out there with the rock solid weig-a-tinny mount that replaces the rear sight. $50 for the mount and $50 for the bushnell clone red dot is a drop in the bucket compared to getting a slide cut for $200 and a slide ride micro red dot for $250. Batteries are $1 so it's no big deal to turn the sight on at the beginning of a hike, camping trip, ect. and turn it back off later.
Great test, what fun. Love the idea of the charging beast test, but if it were me I would likely be shooting as I ran away. You can imagine the result
Thanks lol. Yeah the whole running thing. I watched a show forever ago about real world police work type thing. Two friends ran away from this guy shooting at them with a 9mm, one friend pulls his .25 auto and fires behind himself as he runs. Friend 2 never made it away and it was assumed he was shot by the aggressor but the autopsy pulls out a .25 caliber slug. The first friend was never charged with a crime as he didn't know he had shot his friend.
@@GunSam You don't need to out run the bear , you just need to out run your friend !
Awesome as always
Thanks!
I had the same problem with my conversion barrel. I would use the 10 mm Glock stock barrel with underwood or Buffalo bore hard penetrators (not hard cast) and/or send the conversion barrel back to the factory to have the loading ramp polished. I have had zero issues with my conversion barrel since I sent my barrel back. Just my 2 cents. 😎
Yeah I been debating that. While I could care less about 10mm or testing it, (only doing it as I was asked to), I would like a solution to not have to deal with the trolling some people give over it.
When you absolutely positively have to stop it - accept no substitute!!!!
I'll assume this means .44 Magnum lol.
@@GunSam yes or AK-47 whichever is available.
If everyone followed that logic, we'd all be lugging around Barrett 50 cal rifles loaded with high explosive tips.
Raufoss rounds
yeah those haha
My glock 20 also jams with that same load, even with a 20lb guide rod spring. I carry 180 grain xtp handloads at 1300 fps.
So far the only ammo that has been jam-free for me has been Speer Gold Dot and Winchester Defender.
It's the grip, I've run the 220 B.B cast through my stock G20 no problem.
Underwood Extreme Penetrator or 200-220 hard cast.
I am a huge fan of all three of these calibers! I own a 686 s&w talo and have carried it with complete confidence that it is completely capable of stopping virtually any north American predator especially after seeing this video. It's too pretty to be packing in the woods though. after the 2018 hunting season i decided i wanted something that i could feel as confident and comfortable carrying in the woods, after months of research i choose a glock g20 gen 4 over a ruger redhawk .44 mag. After watching this video and reading the reason for your malfunctions i am even more pleased with my decision. I have put a good 500+ rounds through the gun with zero issues and 50rds of extreme penatraror. My choice to go with the glock came down to solely capacity. Though cost difference between the glock and redhawk are pretty hefty too. Love your videos, Thank you !
Very cool! Thanks for making the videos. Someday I'll have s backyard range
Thanks for watching. I hope you do.
also, regarding 10 mm feeding problems they are irrelevant, after all this was a conversion gun.....the results otherwise are pretty good.
its a glock and thats the problem with it just junk living on a name . Glock will get you killed
Rundown of my velocity compared to Buffalo Bore's rated velocity: The 357 Magnum- test gun 4-inch S&W L frame Mt. Gun 1,375 FPS, (my velocity from a 4" S&W 686 1,387 FPS). The 10mm Auto- test gun Colt Delta Elite 5-inch barrel
1,175 FPS Para Ordnance 1911 with Nowlin 5-inch barrel 1,201 FPS, (my velocity with 5.3" barrel G41 Conversion 1,226 FPS). The .44 Magnum- test gun 4" S&W 329 PD 1,254 FPS (my velocity with 4.25" S&W model 69 1,251 FPS).
Great Stuff Sam. All rounds definitely performed. I’m partial to the .357 magnum though. 750+ ft lbs from a 4”. Yep that will get the job done. And Buffalo Bore velocities are pretty much take it to the bank when it comes to velocities listed. They may be the only manufacturer that when they tell you a velocity you can believe it. Keep up the great vids.
@Azaziz Donasdogamatastos Most of the pressure from revolver ammo is expressed on the top strap, forcing cone and that area. The side walls are not a big deal. But that being said, there's no reason to think it wouldn't handle it. Like I try to explain often, lead or hard cast lead has less friction going down the bore than jacketed, so what you will see is if you loaded this round with a jacketed bullet, you would get maybe 1,225 FPS instead of approaching 1,400 FPS. So, basically when you see hard to believe numbers with .357 Magnum hard cast, it's actually barely hotter than a standard charge, but the faster velocity on account of the reduced bore drag from the lead bullet, is deceiving.
@@GunSam the 10mm could also be because you need a stiffer magazine spring.
Always a good and interesting video. Looks like all of those would the job and then some! Thanks for sharing and take care.
Thank you and thanks for watching.
In this test I think I’d prefer the 10mm because I liked the penetration and it hold more rounds so when high stress situations if you miss a few your not reloading. Great video 👍🏼
Love this comparison. I was surprised buy the 10mm penatration . I know that the 41 mag is not a popular round but I'm guessing it will out perform the 44 mag with less recoil. But who knows for sure. Thanks for the video. Best
Thanks for watching. My guess would be it would be difficult to determine a huge difference between .357 44 and 41 mag.
You know the Glock fan Boy’s hate this video 😂
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Bears love it.
You can’t run high powered 10 mm out of a Standard Glock barrel and you’re not supposed to use cast lead in a Glock barrel
@@theonesolrac9888 I've tested numerous 220 out of my stock G20 and it jams like crazy. Tried the 200 gr and it feeds with no issues. About 10 rounds each..
@@lookoutnow4996 the 220s are a little bit longer and I’m Assuming flat point. The Glock Barrels have an unsupported chamber which can cause problems in higher pressure rounds.And the way the rifling on the Glock Barrels is designed it clogs up with Lead when you shoot cast Bullets which can cause higher pressures
Really depends on how each bullet reacts after shooting the first layer of the target, how much it begins tumbling etc.
So here's my question: whats the best semi-auto that isn't a 10mm? I submit 357 sig with Underwood FMJ. They load one with Montana Gold fmj bullets, which are brass jacket over a linotype-like lead core. Thoughts?
.44 Mag🏴☠️
Nice. I carry a 7 round 357 loaded with Federal Big Game 180grainl JHP for black bear. A momma with cubs can be aggressive, and it's strictly for defense in the event of an attack. Have you made a video with those rounds?
I have tested 180 gr semi jacketed hollow points before with Federal, but just their blue box stuff.
Looks fun!!! I wish I had a place I could do a test like this.
Thanks for watching. I have been doing stuff like this my whole life and assumed everyone in the country did this. It wasn't until being on TH-cam that I realized how lucky I was because so many people cannot do this.
Interesting video. Impressive. Ok, so, I have a 90s made American Arms single action 44 magnum that I understand was made by uberti back then. It’s in excellent shape. So, will it handle those low recoil Buffalo bores? Or should I stick with tried and true Keith load?
Very nice presentation. I’m glad I subbed.
Thanks! I actually had a guy earlier today give a long rant of why he's glad he's unsubscribing lol, so it's good to hear i'm not hated by everyone!
@@GunSam Said like Arnold " he'll be back " !!
That particular 10mm pistol makes me very happy with my .44Sp revolver!
I really enjoyed this test. Thank you. Any chance you will be testing the 9mm Outdoorsman Ammo in your dangerous game set-up?
Thanks for watching. I guess I hadn't thought about it, but maybe I will!
Yes Sam! Please do. I’m curious as well
Any questions why I carry a S&W 686 w/4 inch barrel? It does everything to a high degree of competence, or just plain excellence.
Dangerous game had some tiny heads. 😉 In reality that cardboard is about the size of a Grizzly's head. If you could get the 10mm running reliably it would be the best to me. I love .44 magnum but the recoil is too punishing for me. I usually shoot .44 special in my .44 magnum. Keep up the good work.
Thanks. I will, I have a lot more similar test coming!
I was impressed with that 357( my favorite and most accurate caliber)----I value your thoughts ....I picked up some Hornady 147 XTP 9mm...I never re-loaded or shot 147as I use 124 but things are hard to find so I took them ...do you have any recipes for them...many thanks ...stay safe and free
Thanks for watching. I don't think I ever hand loaded the 147 gr XTP and haven't hand loaded 9mm at all in several years. On the Hodgedon website there's a ton of data on the 147 gr XTP. www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/pistol
@@GunSam thanks so much ....I never loaded 9mm much either but I have tons of FMJ heads and will start now along with HP
Good demonstration of the power of these rounds. I have a Colt King Cobra 3”, and .357’s are hard on the hands