My power goes from 10c+ VAT for 2-4am to 17c+ VAT for 11pm to 8am to 35c+ VAT for 8am to 11pm. My 2013 Mac Pro runs at 100w so, it’s off most of the time. Ireland isn’t the cheapest for power but not the most expensive either. I like that your focussing on power draw, most of the US based TH-camrs make little to no reference to it. Thank you 🙏
The shelves for your workbench @ 13:55 grabbed my attention. I've just started setting up a dedicated space using a 48x24-inch motorized desk and had been mulling over how to attach storage space to it. Preferably pegboard and not involving much engineering on my part to make it sturdy and stable. If I've worked out the dimensions of those 2x4basics brackets correctly, I could add some beams across the back to attach 32-inch horizontal Wall Control pegboard panels between the vertical studs and it ought to fit my desk's width near enough exactly. Thanks for the inspiration!
regarding the U.2 Kioxia SSD mount - if those drives are anything like WD U.2 drives, they can generate a decent amount of heat, and mounting them close together and vertically, I'm afraid that 1 of the 2 might heat up without any air flowing over it (it might be totally fine as well - you can usually check temperatures via `smartctl`). For those that don't have motherboards with SlimSAS (or similar) PCIe ports, there's relatively cheap 1-drive U.2 to PCIe slot adapters...which can be wasteful plugging into x16 or x8 slots (the drives are only 4 lanes), but might be the only solution for many server chassis.
you say that m2 drives are expensive, showing 8TB for not the whole $1k... and then you show that a great solution will be to use Kioxia SSD? where one 15TB costs $2.5k-3k?? For this I need x4 pcix4?? Great idea!! You could have skipped half the video and just said "I got 30TB from the producer"! :D
Heh, this video isn't about those Kioxia drives though; and you can get CD6 for 'cheapish' (for the performance/endurance, compared to other NVMe drives), and CD8 drives in lower capacity are attainable, if still 'enterprise expensive'. The CD8s are mostly meant for testing as a network video editing array-as I slowly migrate my video editing process to being centralized (someday maybe I can have an editor help out, ha!), I need faster central storage that everything can connect into for the edits. The hard drives are okaaaay... but (a) loud under that kind of load, and (b) seek latency isn't wonderful, especially on a complex timeline.
sorry to hear that, you have been asleep for 26 years. good news The Lunar Prospector spacecraft is launched into orbit around the Moon, and later finds evidence for frozen water....
Also yes, a deeper dive explaining those Ansible playbooks would be awesome Jeff! I'd watch that thing even though I don't know a lot about storage itself.
Power prices is why I've decomissioned my Intel server. The twin Ivy Bridge Xeons are still beasts, but the switch to a single Skylake Xeon 4108 has saved a bunch of power.
See i like these projects a lot. I like to have 3:2:1 style backups, but with my limited budget i have internal disk, external disk, and cloud. I could definitely build something like this and get more reliability, and cloud savings. Space is at a huge premium almost as big as budget, so i know i could have a cheap NAS done myself, but a cheap and tiny NAS is what i need.
@JeffGeerling Hey I have the same configuration, from the day you uploaded your first video about it and I am very satisfied with it. My old 4 Bay Synology NAS uses about 39 Watts and this only 9-10 Watts. I now turned over to use this as my personal cloud and do the backups of it to my old Synology NAS, by waking it up via WOL, doing the backup and then shutting it back down.
I saw another TH-camr get a cheap tape drive do periodic offsite backups. Write to tapes mail to friend or put in another safe place like a fireproof safe. Tape sits there no power consumption holds loads of data and in the right conditions will stay that way for 50+ years. Rotate with a second set of tapes each week or month and you got yourself apocalypse level protection. House burns down, you just need to restore from the tapes and you don't pay export fees from offsite cloud, though you would need to find another tape drive if you house burned down, nothing is perfect.
I have considered tape archive in the past, the annoying part is how manual/physical the process is. But when I was younger, I was in charge of the weekly tape backup rotation between two radio stations. Was a fun and easy task to do every Friday :)
Tapes sound great until you have to do restores... Even "enterprise" backup software can be buggy (database corruption, etc), and LTO drives only offer 1-2 generations of backward compatibility. And if your tape robot fails after 10 years, you're at the whim of what might be available on eBay as a replacement. HDDs aren't perfect either, but a heck of a lot easier to just plug a drive into 3.5" hot-swap bay or even a SATA-USB adapter. LTO-9 tapes (18TB) are about half the price of HDD, but you also have to factor in the cost of the LTO-9 tape drive (usually thousands of $, not even counting an auto-loader). Lastly, if you're storing tapes (or HDDs or even SSDs) in fireproof safe, make sure to pack and maintain desiccant (larger gun safes can get powered dehumidifier accessory) - this is why off-site storage facilities like Iron Mountain use old mines - basically free climate control underground.
@@jasonboles1526 Production database backups are a surprisingly difficult challenge especially with a "slow" backup device, since there are probably writes happening when the backup is in progress. Probably best to use a file system that supports snapshots, then backup strategy is to tqke a snapshot then send that to the backup device.
Also yes, a deeper dive explaining those Ansible playbooks would be awesome Jeff! I'd watch that thing even though I don't know a lot about storage itself.
@@joelv4495 I wasn't referring to backing up a database... I was referring to the internal db (tape library inventory, metadata, etc) that a particular enterprise backup "solution" software was using internally. If that software's db got corrupt, then you don't know where anything is on any of the tapes, and the differentials are useless. (this was 20 years ago, I'm sure such software is better now, and there's also several open source software nowadays as well)
Rather than putting a rtc on the pi to turn on scheduled backups. Set backups to run on boot, and shut down after, then use an Home Assistant automation to send a WOL packet. Then super easy to adjust schedule, even with the pi off
True; the only downside is if I want to boot it up for debug, I'd have to set some sort of trap I could escape the backup. Maybe a hotkey to hold or something.
@@JeffGeerling get HA to monitor disk activity, set the automation in HA to start shut down when disk activity under threshold for 5 mins. Shut down precedure can check a flag in HA you set to keep it online. So for debug set "keep lil NAS" online to true, it won't shut down. When HA detects the server stays shut down for 5 mins auto clear the flag. Then to boot and change things, set the flag to true, boot server, do what you need, 5 Min shut down grace let's you restart without clearing the flag, when your done changing stuff shut down, will auto clear the flag, ready for the automation to automatically shut down next time. Will let you adjust the schedule easily in HA and do more advanced scheduling, let's you keep it online as needed for debug. Should give you the best of both worlds.
@@JeffGeerling you could stop the auto backup by adding a 30 sec delay to the start script, checks for user interactions and won't start if the user interaction is present. Or just check for a file exists, so you can just touch a file in home to stop script from starting
@@JeffGeerling Haha, for a second historical event, this is the first time a creator has replied to my comment, so we're busting records left and right here! Love the video btw (now having actually taken the time to watch it!) I'm very tempted to build a pair of lil nases and hide one of them in my parents' utility room, they aren't using their 500/500 fiber for anything, so I might as well finally have the "1" in 3-2-1! (I've heard that the attic doesn't count!)
Its always nice to have a NAS with auto backup set up. I use a WD My Cloud EX2 Ultra and I like the My Cloud software. The only issue I have had was one of the drives in a Raid 1 configuration failed last week (WD Gold 16TB drive).
I didn't even know that industrial micro sd cards exist, very cool. Edit: they use TLC nand, so they are better then some SSD's (only endurance, not speed).
Transcend makes them (and ssd's that have power loss protection, the real kind), it's just a pain in the butt to find a place to buy them. Under the Embedded category if you ever look, not consumer.
My approach is to have multiple NAS boxes for different use cycle. Smaller, power-efficient boxes that are on 24/7 for the active files. Big boxes with the massive storage capacity for lesser used files and backups, that I power up only when needed.
Haha so true. I regret throwing out a box of old SCSI, parallel and serial cables when I moved to college. Some adapters I had in there cost $50+ to get a beat up used replacement nowadays.
Cool, love the content and especially the details of the power consumption of the different NAS now that I've moved in with a girl who's _Very_ conservative with power usage at home. But we both are in need of local backups at home and Lil NAS would be perfect, so I'm going to build my own with inspiration from you (not the first time)! BTW, I wasn't aware of the third chanel and it was really hard to hear you say the name of it, so took me a while to find it. You should definitely market it a bit more, bcs we're so many people that get excited every time you post some new content ❤
0.13 USD per kWh? (laughs in Quebec) Consider moving to Montreal just for the 0.067 CAD (0.048 USD) per kWh. Come for the electricity prices, stay for the university tuition for your kids (5300 CAD per year, or about 3900 USD). EDIT: And the A&W is actually good here, as we discussed previously.
I know you wrote 'Not a server' but still please emphasize that backups are NOT safe on non-ecc based computers. Even though it does not happen often with that limited amount of memory it still does not induce 'piece of mind'. I love your videos! Thanks Jeff! 🙂
For a secondary NAS/backup, using ZFS and scrubbing gives me more peace of mind than ECC. I would like full ECC on cheaper devices but it probably won't happen any time soon. The LPDDR4x has built-in ECC mostly to help with the fact it needs it internally, but I'm less worried about that for my data (especially video, which can deal with a flipped bit every now and then, with no noticeable artifacts). If I were storing financial data or databases, I would be a lot more concerned, though! Or if I had a photo library I wanted to preserve for the next 10,000 years. As it stands, ECC is too expensive for me to want to put it in every system I build.
This! Spray of soapy water makes it a breeze. It also lets you slide the sticker around in case it gets misaligned. Push all the water out from center to edges once you're done. Used this for large 8 sqft stickers!
Man that HL-15 is such a beautiful case but $799 for a case and backplane is nuts when you can buy a Meshify 2 or Define 7 and miniSAS breakout cables that holds as many drives for 1/8th the price
Yeah; it's a premium case, with a premium price. I hope these show up on the used market at some point since the cases are so versatile, and will probably outlast the ATX standard and 3.5" drive production!
Wish this stuff was actually available. Same with the board Linus showed. You just can't buy this stuff in Europe or they are sold by weird shops asking 2x the price. At which point getting a Synology is cheaper😅
Please, pleeeeaseeee show us the add-on card with the four M.2 SSDs! I will also equip my Mixtile Cluster with such drives, as the backplane has M.2 slots on the back, one for every node.
Knowing how often Jeff's bars are seen in the videos, he probably came up with this title months ago giggling to himself and now he finally has the chance to post it 😂
Rsync syncs deltas by default too. I know you mean that ZFS just sends the differences for each snapshot. Also, I know there are many ways to do things and I love watching your videos and hearing how you do stuff, but surely a one time ZFS send | ZFS recv was all that was required right? I could be wrong about that.
True true; in terms of the zfs send/recv, that's basically what sanoid does under the covers, it just helps set up a periodic job and prunes things up nicely.
With two locations (home and office) I guess the question is do you ditch Amazon glacier and just replicate home->work and vice versa for your off-site?
Sadly, home is within a nuclear blast radius of the office, so if one went down, both would go down. But the 'undisclosed TH-camr' is far outside the blast radius, so I hope to work on that later this year :)
@@JeffGeerling Same situation with my work/home but I figure I'm not really that important, so I'm allowing the nuclear blast as a reasonable excuse for then deciding to retire from TH-cam... 😆☢
Regarding your Comment on the Prices of SSDs increasing, I remember reading (a while ago, mind you, but not more than a year ago) that Samsung and other Flash Storage Manufacturers reduced their production due to a massive glut of Flash storage and dropping prices, I guess this is an after effect that got ya.
So those Samsungs do read zero after trim? Did not know any consumer drives did that. Or if not, how do you deal with that whole situation? Tyan board just got delivered. The last piece of new Siena NAS. Time to see if those Phoronix numbers are real or not.
@@JeffGeerlingThank you for always being so open to sharing your knowledge Jeff! 😊 I absolutely appreciate it, and have learnt a lot from your videos.
Great video and thank you for sharing your updates @JeffGeerling As far as your RPi5 SATA Hat update where you show you are using a USB3 2.5Gb Ethernet adapter. Where did you get it? I didn't see a link in the description for the newer hardware used. :) Thank you for the update that you have a second channel. I just subscribed to that one. :) Keep up the good work @JeffGeerling ! :D
@@JeffGeerling Thank you sir I found it and just put it in my cart to order. I am trying to get that SATA hat right now, but seems to be out of stock right now. I would really like to try out the ZFS stuff on a Raspberry Pi :)
I never use long direct attach cables, I find it much easier to use fibre SFP+ adapters at each end, because fibre patch cables are pretty cheap and available in any length.
I recently upgraded my nas from 6 1tb drives to 4tb ones, and while they are a bit louder, they also draw in total 20w less under max load than old ones And now i can use the old drives to build an offsite backup location I just need a 4g/lte router as there are no isps nearby
@@JeffGeerlingI plan to make the first backup over LAN, then move the nas to the offsite location I spotted a 100GB/~5$/mo. plan from one of the providers, and I don't think I'll be using anything close to the limit, so I think I should be fine in that regard
I had 4 Sata SSD shoved into my Dell Optiplex SFF - it used like 20 watts most of the time. The SATA card was my choke point. But I only had 1TB ssd so - limited to 3tb of space.
Somewhere in Europe 2017: Yay, bought used HP DL360 g6 to run NAS and everything else… Same place in Europe 2021: Dang, used HP DL360 g6 decommissioned due to insane energy price hike… Also same place in Europe 2024: A Pi4, a 1-litre PC, an underpowered ex-office PC clustered. Energy bill forced homelab rethink…
apalrd uses Proxmox Backup Server running ZFS. Then, he connects an LTO tape drive and manually backs that up to tape (supported feature in PBS). He sends those tapes to a family member. I am considering this because I cant run another ZFS server to replicate to offsite.
Is the 4x NVME hat actually of any real use on a Raspberry Pi 5? Sure it would be smaller but performance wise and cost wise, the 4x SATA hat with SSDs would be better I assume?
build that all in a case and populate with data, then hand over and wait for it to sync home , and think remote sites. I have always thought a friends network where u build/buy, setup knowing target networ settings, archive
Don't understand the second backup location problem when you have servers at home and at your company. Also, how important is fast storage when in most setups the network connection or the other hardware will limit the transmission speeds. I mean as a second backup, it might be not important how fast it is, as long as it gets the job done.
Lil NAS is the perfect name for your rap career
Hmm...
Just add an x to the end
@@Napert Naw.... Lil NAS-ZFS
Epic rap battle! BIG NAS vs little nas.
@@JeffGeerling you can tour with your partner Udot2
These two NASes have big "Don't talk to me or my son ever again!" energy.
Let’s start a buddy backup system!
Y2Y P2P backups for TH-camr-to-TH-camr
@@JeffGeerling Wendell from level1 wanted to do this since ages, he even made room for a rack in his basement for this reason
@@JeffGeerling let’s trade terabytes!
Not a bad idea, perfect for 3-2-1 rule
I’m in
"100W idle, in europe, thats 260€ a year" *Looks at HPE Proliant G9 under the desk* Yeah, ofc i need that performance... XD
"This is the way"
Perhaps you're rich or you like energy companies - who am I to judge you 🤣
My power goes from 10c+ VAT for 2-4am to 17c+ VAT for 11pm to 8am to 35c+ VAT for 8am to 11pm. My 2013 Mac Pro runs at 100w so, it’s off most of the time. Ireland isn’t the cheapest for power but not the most expensive either. I like that your focussing on power draw, most of the US based TH-camrs make little to no reference to it. Thank you 🙏
@@igordasunddas3377 Luckly got a 5KW solar power system on the roof, so that helps a bit XD
Hm. One Xeon workstation. One Xeon server. And a Threadripper machine. The RPi consumptions tends to hide in the decimal expansion.
Hell yeah, pi5 nas comparison information is exactly what I need right now
My finger is hovering over the 'Buy RPi 5 now!' button...
How did I miss the Level 2 channel???? Subscribed.
Well now you don't miss it!
The shelves for your workbench @ 13:55 grabbed my attention. I've just started setting up a dedicated space using a 48x24-inch motorized desk and had been mulling over how to attach storage space to it. Preferably pegboard and not involving much engineering on my part to make it sturdy and stable. If I've worked out the dimensions of those 2x4basics brackets correctly, I could add some beams across the back to attach 32-inch horizontal Wall Control pegboard panels between the vertical studs and it ought to fit my desk's width near enough exactly.
Thanks for the inspiration!
Of course, we would greatly appreciate a video on that other NVMe small NAS Jeff! Love this video ❤
regarding the U.2 Kioxia SSD mount - if those drives are anything like WD U.2 drives, they can generate a decent amount of heat, and mounting them close together and vertically, I'm afraid that 1 of the 2 might heat up without any air flowing over it (it might be totally fine as well - you can usually check temperatures via `smartctl`). For those that don't have motherboards with SlimSAS (or similar) PCIe ports, there's relatively cheap 1-drive U.2 to PCIe slot adapters...which can be wasteful plugging into x16 or x8 slots (the drives are only 4 lanes), but might be the only solution for many server chassis.
That's not a bad option; if I do see them getting over 50C or so I may consider, because PLA can warp
you say that m2 drives are expensive, showing 8TB for not the whole $1k... and then you show that a great solution will be to use Kioxia SSD? where one 15TB costs $2.5k-3k?? For this I need x4 pcix4?? Great idea!! You could have skipped half the video and just said "I got 30TB from the producer"! :D
Heh, this video isn't about those Kioxia drives though; and you can get CD6 for 'cheapish' (for the performance/endurance, compared to other NVMe drives), and CD8 drives in lower capacity are attainable, if still 'enterprise expensive'.
The CD8s are mostly meant for testing as a network video editing array-as I slowly migrate my video editing process to being centralized (someday maybe I can have an editor help out, ha!), I need faster central storage that everything can connect into for the edits. The hard drives are okaaaay... but (a) loud under that kind of load, and (b) seek latency isn't wonderful, especially on a complex timeline.
When you said HL 15 my brain briefly went" Half-Life 15!? how long have I been asleep!?"
sorry to hear that, you have been asleep for 26 years.
good news The Lunar Prospector spacecraft is launched into orbit around the Moon, and later finds evidence for frozen water....
HL15 CONFIRMED
Once Gabe's consciousness is uploaded to a server he may consider HL15 in about 12,000 years.
Also yes, a deeper dive explaining those Ansible playbooks would be awesome Jeff! I'd watch that thing even though I don't know a lot about storage itself.
Your big NAS power draw exactly as same as my whole lab =)) 3 NUC + 1 DS920 NAS + 1 PI and some APs/Router at 100W
i picked up the pimoroni NVMe base Duo for my Pi5, got 2x 2TB drives from Lexar and its going to become my new OMV/Jellyfin box, I'm very excited
YES PLEASE to all of those extra topics on the extra channel. Thanks!
lil nas jeff is my favorite recording artist
Power prices is why I've decomissioned my Intel server. The twin Ivy Bridge Xeons are still beasts, but the switch to a single Skylake Xeon 4108 has saved a bunch of power.
See i like these projects a lot. I like to have 3:2:1 style backups, but with my limited budget i have internal disk, external disk, and cloud. I could definitely build something like this and get more reliability, and cloud savings.
Space is at a huge premium almost as big as budget, so i know i could have a cheap NAS done myself, but a cheap and tiny NAS is what i need.
@JeffGeerling Hey I have the same configuration, from the day you uploaded your first video about it and I am very satisfied with it.
My old 4 Bay Synology NAS uses about 39 Watts and this only 9-10 Watts.
I now turned over to use this as my personal cloud and do the backups of it to my old Synology NAS,
by waking it up via WOL, doing the backup and then shutting it back down.
More like "Left ARM, Right ARM" amirite? 😄
I remember when I had a nas in my home. Good times. Thanks for the trip down memory lane.
I saw another TH-camr get a cheap tape drive do periodic offsite backups. Write to tapes mail to friend or put in another safe place like a fireproof safe. Tape sits there no power consumption holds loads of data and in the right conditions will stay that way for 50+ years. Rotate with a second set of tapes each week or month and you got yourself apocalypse level protection. House burns down, you just need to restore from the tapes and you don't pay export fees from offsite cloud, though you would need to find another tape drive if you house burned down, nothing is perfect.
I have considered tape archive in the past, the annoying part is how manual/physical the process is. But when I was younger, I was in charge of the weekly tape backup rotation between two radio stations. Was a fun and easy task to do every Friday :)
Tapes sound great until you have to do restores... Even "enterprise" backup software can be buggy (database corruption, etc), and LTO drives only offer 1-2 generations of backward compatibility. And if your tape robot fails after 10 years, you're at the whim of what might be available on eBay as a replacement. HDDs aren't perfect either, but a heck of a lot easier to just plug a drive into 3.5" hot-swap bay or even a SATA-USB adapter. LTO-9 tapes (18TB) are about half the price of HDD, but you also have to factor in the cost of the LTO-9 tape drive (usually thousands of $, not even counting an auto-loader). Lastly, if you're storing tapes (or HDDs or even SSDs) in fireproof safe, make sure to pack and maintain desiccant (larger gun safes can get powered dehumidifier accessory) - this is why off-site storage facilities like Iron Mountain use old mines - basically free climate control underground.
@@jasonboles1526 Production database backups are a surprisingly difficult challenge especially with a "slow" backup device, since there are probably writes happening when the backup is in progress. Probably best to use a file system that supports snapshots, then backup strategy is to tqke a snapshot then send that to the backup device.
Also yes, a deeper dive explaining those Ansible playbooks would be awesome Jeff! I'd watch that thing even though I don't know a lot about storage itself.
@@joelv4495 I wasn't referring to backing up a database... I was referring to the internal db (tape library inventory, metadata, etc) that a particular enterprise backup "solution" software was using internally. If that software's db got corrupt, then you don't know where anything is on any of the tapes, and the differentials are useless. (this was 20 years ago, I'm sure such software is better now, and there's also several open source software nowadays as well)
"undisclosed TH-camr" there's only a few people it could be. Linus, Wendell, the other Jeff
How many times can you plug your third channel in one video?
Jeff: Yes.
Hey did you know I have a third channel now?
@@JeffGeerling No I didn't whats it called? lol
@@Ficles81125 Level2Jeff haha
Rather than putting a rtc on the pi to turn on scheduled backups. Set backups to run on boot, and shut down after, then use an Home Assistant automation to send a WOL packet. Then super easy to adjust schedule, even with the pi off
True; the only downside is if I want to boot it up for debug, I'd have to set some sort of trap I could escape the backup. Maybe a hotkey to hold or something.
@@JeffGeerling get HA to monitor disk activity, set the automation in HA to start shut down when disk activity under threshold for 5 mins. Shut down precedure can check a flag in HA you set to keep it online. So for debug set "keep lil NAS" online to true, it won't shut down. When HA detects the server stays shut down for 5 mins auto clear the flag.
Then to boot and change things, set the flag to true, boot server, do what you need, 5 Min shut down grace let's you restart without clearing the flag, when your done changing stuff shut down, will auto clear the flag, ready for the automation to automatically shut down next time.
Will let you adjust the schedule easily in HA and do more advanced scheduling, let's you keep it online as needed for debug. Should give you the best of both worlds.
@@JeffGeerling you could stop the auto backup by adding a 30 sec delay to the start script, checks for user interactions and won't start if the user interaction is present. Or just check for a file exists, so you can just touch a file in home to stop script from starting
First time in all my years of watching youtube where I came across a video 30 seconds after upload, while it still having "no views!" Awesome!
I am honored to be in this moment of history.
764 views, classic youtube bug
you did it all wrong.. your supposed to say first!
@@JeffGeerling Haha, for a second historical event, this is the first time a creator has replied to my comment, so we're busting records left and right here! Love the video btw (now having actually taken the time to watch it!) I'm very tempted to build a pair of lil nases and hide one of them in my parents' utility room, they aren't using their 500/500 fiber for anything, so I might as well finally have the "1" in 3-2-1! (I've heard that the attic doesn't count!)
@@Pytte yeah but then I'd end up being third, and cringe.
I dare you to name the next one “little NAS 10, Roman Numeral Edition”
Its always nice to have a NAS with auto backup set up. I use a WD My Cloud EX2 Ultra and I like the My Cloud software. The only issue I have had was one of the drives in a Raid 1 configuration failed last week (WD Gold 16TB drive).
I think my dad had that old Sony Camcorder and G4 Tower 14:25. Those memories came flooding back!
Such a great little camera (Canon GL1). I also have an old Sony FD-Mavica now too :)
Those Apple speakers were made by Harmon Kardon, they also made the glass soundstick speakers for Apple.
I think Jeff might have a third channel.
I'd LOVE a video about 3D printing that Lil Nas Case!
brb, just renaming my server to lilnas
I love your videos Jeff. Keep doing what you're doing.
That Lil NAS is so beautiful
I didn't even know that industrial micro sd cards exist, very cool.
Edit: they use TLC nand, so they are better then some SSD's (only endurance, not speed).
Transcend makes them (and ssd's that have power loss protection, the real kind), it's just a pain in the butt to find a place to buy them. Under the Embedded category if you ever look, not consumer.
My approach is to have multiple NAS boxes for different use cycle. Smaller, power-efficient boxes that are on 24/7 for the active files. Big boxes with the massive storage capacity for lesser used files and backups, that I power up only when needed.
Wish the mini PC manufacturers would get into the Tiny NAS space. Something the size of a Mac Studio with 4 2.5" bays would sell like hot cakes
with a nas like that, the world is yours
15:09 keep that cable as you never know, you may need it in the future if it didn't
Haha so true. I regret throwing out a box of old SCSI, parallel and serial cables when I moved to college. Some adapters I had in there cost $50+ to get a beat up used replacement nowadays.
I love sanoid/syncoid I use it all of the time for zfs replication
Although I consider myself fairly tech-savvy, I am consistently humbled when I drop in to see what Jeff is up to on his channel(s).
3rd channel called Level2Jeff promoted on 13th moving vlog, makes sense, lol.
Cool, love the content and especially the details of the power consumption of the different NAS now that I've moved in with a girl who's _Very_ conservative with power usage at home. But we both are in need of local backups at home and Lil NAS would be perfect, so I'm going to build my own with inspiration from you (not the first time)!
BTW, I wasn't aware of the third chanel and it was really hard to hear you say the name of it, so took me a while to find it. You should definitely market it a bit more, bcs we're so many people that get excited every time you post some new content ❤
Very interesting is also UPS power consumption. There are huge differences if you care about each 10W.
0.13 USD per kWh?
(laughs in Quebec)
Consider moving to Montreal just for the 0.067 CAD (0.048 USD) per kWh. Come for the electricity prices, stay for the university tuition for your kids (5300 CAD per year, or about 3900 USD).
EDIT: And the A&W is actually good here, as we discussed previously.
Indeed, I kinda miss actual poutine
I know you wrote 'Not a server' but still please emphasize that backups are NOT safe on non-ecc based computers. Even though it does not happen often with that limited amount of memory it still does not induce 'piece of mind'. I love your videos! Thanks Jeff! 🙂
For a secondary NAS/backup, using ZFS and scrubbing gives me more peace of mind than ECC. I would like full ECC on cheaper devices but it probably won't happen any time soon. The LPDDR4x has built-in ECC mostly to help with the fact it needs it internally, but I'm less worried about that for my data (especially video, which can deal with a flipped bit every now and then, with no noticeable artifacts).
If I were storing financial data or databases, I would be a lot more concerned, though! Or if I had a photo library I wanted to preserve for the next 10,000 years. As it stands, ECC is too expensive for me to want to put it in every system I build.
I‘m really honored to be in your video. 😅
Really like your Videos BTW.
Please do a level 2 Jeff video on setting up the your playbook for ZFS. This would help! 🙏
Molex To Sata, Lose All Your Data.
Sata To Molex, What Rhymes With Molex?
It's probably my Rolex 😊
Jk., I don't have that and if I did, I'd sell it and buy things I actually care about.
If you spray the window with water before applying the decal it's much easier to get bubbles out.
D'oh! Will try next time.
This! Spray of soapy water makes it a breeze. It also lets you slide the sticker around in case it gets misaligned. Push all the water out from center to edges once you're done. Used this for large 8 sqft stickers!
In the nearly 10 years they've been in service, my molex to SATA adapters have never been a problem 🤣
You don’t need a rtc battery if you keep the pi 5 connected to power. The RTC will stay on during sleep as long as usb-c power is applied
True; just easier if there is an outage, or if I need to move the Pi somewhere and Internet is down when it boots.
Man that HL-15 is such a beautiful case but $799 for a case and backplane is nuts when you can buy a Meshify 2 or Define 7 and miniSAS breakout cables that holds as many drives for 1/8th the price
Yeah; it's a premium case, with a premium price. I hope these show up on the used market at some point since the cases are so versatile, and will probably outlast the ATX standard and 3.5" drive production!
I think it would be neat if you did a solar power + battery for the Pi backup server.
10:17 it would be good if you did show how you made it on 3d software and printing it off
Love this great content @Jeff, please keep it going!!
I can't wait for my Radxa Penta SATA Hat! It finally has a status of ready to ship from Arace tech. Love the videos as always!
ARACE has been busy; I just got shipment notification for two other Radxa boards I ordered in March, hopefully they're here soon!
Wish this stuff was actually available. Same with the board Linus showed. You just can't buy this stuff in Europe or they are sold by weird shops asking 2x the price. At which point getting a Synology is cheaper😅
Mine say out for delivery
Just received mine. Can’t wait to build it now!
Damn didn't think I'd make it here so early. Always love these kinds of videos!
Please, pleeeeaseeee show us the add-on card with the four M.2 SSDs! I will also equip my Mixtile Cluster with such drives, as the backplane has M.2 slots on the back, one for every node.
Oh my gosh, I just realized that Lil Nas is Lil Nas X.
Time to store a bunch of rap musics on my NAS.
Nice thing about the Pi Nas no moving parts to worry about.
13c/kWh... my last (South Australian) power bill was at AUD$0.64/kWh, around USD0.42.
like, just because of thumbnail alone 😂❤
Knowing how often Jeff's bars are seen in the videos, he probably came up with this title months ago giggling to himself and now he finally has the chance to post it 😂
Hehe... I can confirm this.
Talk of dimming the lights. Reminds me of VGG or Mustie1 when their compressors go on.
Hey, we're men with diverse interests. 🙂
Rsync syncs deltas by default too. I know you mean that ZFS just sends the differences for each snapshot.
Also, I know there are many ways to do things and I love watching your videos and hearing how you do stuff, but surely a one time ZFS send | ZFS recv was all that was required right? I could be wrong about that.
True true; in terms of the zfs send/recv, that's basically what sanoid does under the covers, it just helps set up a periodic job and prunes things up nicely.
With two locations (home and office) I guess the question is do you ditch Amazon glacier and just replicate home->work and vice versa for your off-site?
Sadly, home is within a nuclear blast radius of the office, so if one went down, both would go down.
But the 'undisclosed TH-camr' is far outside the blast radius, so I hope to work on that later this year :)
@@JeffGeerling Same situation with my work/home but I figure I'm not really that important, so I'm allowing the nuclear blast as a reasonable excuse for then deciding to retire from TH-cam... 😆☢
@@Wordsnwood Heh, true.
Regarding your Comment on the Prices of SSDs increasing, I remember reading (a while ago, mind you, but not more than a year ago) that Samsung and other Flash Storage Manufacturers reduced their production due to a massive glut of Flash storage and dropping prices, I guess this is an after effect that got ya.
lil nas x 🔥name
So those Samsungs do read zero after trim? Did not know any consumer drives did that. Or if not, how do you deal with that whole situation? Tyan board just got delivered. The last piece of new Siena NAS. Time to see if those Phoronix numbers are real or not.
Excellent video. Do you have your frigate config in your github? I couldn't find it there.
Yes! It's under pi-nvr-just did a video on it "I spy with my little Pi" :)
@@JeffGeerlingThank you for always being so open to sharing your knowledge Jeff! 😊 I absolutely appreciate it, and have learnt a lot from your videos.
I have that exact USB 2.5Gb Network Adapter. I bought it years ago and it's currently plugged into my MacBook Pro.
It's plenty reliable. Gets a little hot but it's perfectly adequate for most users who need more than 1 Gbps
8:52 considering the NAS project Linus is backing?
WIth the AI "gold rush" I don't know if I would trust the cloud as a backup anymore.
True true.
I generally agree, but something a colleague mentioned to me the other day is you could simply zip + password protect your cloud backups
@@boneappletee6416 sure but this mentality is the same reason why we have to lock and tie everything down these days
Great video and thank you for sharing your updates @JeffGeerling
As far as your RPi5 SATA Hat update where you show you are using a USB3 2.5Gb Ethernet adapter. Where did you get it? I didn't see a link in the description for the newer hardware used. :)
Thank you for the update that you have a second channel. I just subscribed to that one. :)
Keep up the good work @JeffGeerling ! :D
It's a Pluggable 2.5G USB 3 adapter (works great on my Mac, Pi, and Windows!).
@@JeffGeerling
Thank you sir
I found it and just put it in my cart to order.
I am trying to get that SATA hat right now, but seems to be out of stock right now.
I would really like to try out the ZFS stuff on a Raspberry Pi :)
Really pushin level2jeff in this one!
I never use long direct attach cables, I find it much easier to use fibre SFP+ adapters at each end, because fibre patch cables are pretty cheap and available in any length.
I recently upgraded my nas from 6 1tb drives to 4tb ones, and while they are a bit louder, they also draw in total 20w less under max load than old ones
And now i can use the old drives to build an offsite backup location
I just need a 4g/lte router as there are no isps nearby
Backups over 4G can be pricey, unless you get a good wireless ISP!
@@JeffGeerlingI plan to make the first backup over LAN, then move the nas to the offsite location
I spotted a 100GB/~5$/mo. plan from one of the providers, and I don't think I'll be using anything close to the limit, so I think I should be fine in that regard
@@Napert Ah, not bad at all then! I'm just thinking of how I do a video project every week, almost every one is 50-80 GB of footage nowadays :O
Level 2 Jeff subscribed! 😁
I had 4 Sata SSD shoved into my Dell Optiplex SFF - it used like 20 watts most of the time. The SATA card was my choke point.
But I only had 1TB ssd so - limited to 3tb of space.
Molex to sata, lose all your data 😄 great.
I really like the electronics workbench
Definitely looking forward to the Radxa case for Lil NAS, didn't see it linked or is it not actually available yet?
It's on GrabCAD, I didn't remember to paste the link in the description.
lil nas lol....that alone deserves a subscription
i'm new to nas land... but ONE of those ssd's are going for $625 on amazon right now. And you have four of them 🤯
Somewhere in Europe 2017: Yay, bought used HP DL360 g6 to run NAS and everything else…
Same place in Europe 2021: Dang, used HP DL360 g6 decommissioned due to insane energy price hike…
Also same place in Europe 2024: A Pi4, a 1-litre PC, an underpowered ex-office PC clustered. Energy bill forced homelab rethink…
Yea I'd be interested in a 4 nvme pi
apalrd uses Proxmox Backup Server running ZFS. Then, he connects an LTO tape drive and manually backs that up to tape (supported feature in PBS). He sends those tapes to a family member. I am considering this because I cant run another ZFS server to replicate to offsite.
Four shout-outs to St. Louis if you include the shirt.
12:41 "You know what they say" - Nope, I've literally never heard that before.
Well now you know what they say!
Lil NAS X will be the tenth iteration.
If I remember correctly, Kyoxia decided to make less flash NAND this year so SSD prices have gone way up
Damn.
Still keen on that rpi sata hat buy still out of stock everywhere...
BIG NAS, LITTLE NAS, CARDBOARD BOX!
(those that know, know)
Is the 4x NVME hat actually of any real use on a Raspberry Pi 5? Sure it would be smaller but performance wise and cost wise, the 4x SATA hat with SSDs would be better I assume?
Great Stuff Sir! ✌🏽😎
This is awesome Jeff I want to learn anisble now
I hope you're still Jeff Geerling next time we catch up
build that all in a case and populate with data, then hand over and wait for it to sync home
, and think remote sites. I have always thought a friends network where u build/buy, setup knowing target networ settings, archive
Am I the only person who wants to build a Raspberry Pi NAS with 3.5" HDD's?
Don't understand the second backup location problem when you have servers at home and at your company.
Also, how important is fast storage when in most setups the network connection or the other hardware will limit the transmission speeds. I mean as a second backup, it might be not important how fast it is, as long as it gets the job done.