Top 5 Best Siege Weapon Civilizations | AoE2
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 มิ.ย. 2024
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00:00 Intro
00:25 5
01:32 4
02:50 3
03:44 2
04:49 Honorable Mentions
07:30 1
09:02 Final Talk & Outro
Edits by / @k1aoe - เกม
4:53 Look at Hera's reaction while he's destroying his own SO, 😂
For Bohemians, dont forget the ability to research chemistry in castle. The ability to build bombard cannons as soon as you hit Imperial can be absolutely huge.
Probably not enough too move them up the list, but definitely noteworthy.
Plus hussite wagons are technically siege weapons !
Turks get that shizzle for free
Can verify, Koreans had 12 range SO back in the day. Source: Me, I'm old.
Taking down castles, and the rest of the town, with an SO ball is one of the most satisfying things to do in the history of the game. It was the closest thing we got to a Power washer simulator mod.
It was +1 siege engineers, +1 team bonus, the unique tech +1(also towers +2??), and another +1 by default civ stat? Something like that, but yeah, it could outrange castles for sure (not teutons). I spent a lot of time having fun with them many years ago :)
The UT was +2 upon release, but was quickly patched to +1. That is why no one remembers.
Im also old and can confirm the same
Old is an understatement dude, you're ancient😂😂
Since you did this one, maybe you could also do a Top 5 tips for Siege Players video, in the vein of the ones you've done previously for archers, cavalry and infantry? I've always felt incapable of trading better than 1 for 1 and usually much worse whenever I try a siege push that isn't supported by knights or crossbows.
An idea for a new series of top 5 videos: Top 5 counter civs. Which civs are the best counters against a scout rush, against a monk+siege push, against mass archers (separate top 5 for all these scenarios), etc. focusing on how good a counter they are against such a strategy, especially countering civs which are the best at those strategies.
Talking about Korean mangonels, you should have also mentioned the Korean team bonus (mangonel line minimum range reduced).
Ethiopian siege rams are affected by torsion engines. SOTL showed it in a video and it's true that they are very good lol
In theory they’re mental, that can do 3 tiles of damage in front. But no pro actually goes three layer walls or build AI base.
@@baverskalle in maps like arena or BF it can have its uses
How about petards? 11
"It got a buff recently, or maybe a couple years ago." Hera's sense of time is skewed. It's confirmed: Hera is an elf.
Did we have Romans and their insane Heavy scorpions in the video or i missed it? Worth mentioning imo.
yeh fr an what about the khmer
The problem with scorpions is they die incredibly hard to onagers or bombard cannons, and unlike archers are so slow that escaping bad engagements is often impossible. Combine that with Romans' lack of their own bombard cannons and they're unlikely to win many pure siege fights.
Homestly both of those civs fall a bit short of the others imo. Khmer no bbc romans no bbc
@@HeraAgeofEmpires2But the ballista elephants can endure several siege onager shots before they fall, and do plenty of damage in the process. But still, while I love playing Khmer, I had serious trouble trading well when fielding ballista elephants plus cavalry against Celt siege onagers plus halberdiers.
Scorpions are the worst siege unit, and Romans get no BBC or siege onager so they aren't top 5 by any means.
It's a real good thing that Celts don't have Bombards, because they would be actually nuts if they did.
Hot take: Celts with bombards would actually be one of the answers to aoe2 prayers to nerf the Britons. BC vs longbow is a great trade I reckon
@@212mochaman I don't think that helps at all, actually. Faster fire rate is only beneficial if you stand still to get multiple shots off, not when you need to dance in and out of the enemy's own range and they're also dodging. You're better off with the increased blast radius of Ethiopians or Bohemians to fight longbows.
@@teddyhaines6613 Fair point. I just get the impression the main reason why they don't work on longbows is that they're too easily dodged. Incredibly hard/impossible to dodge them when shot as quick as Celts can shoot
If Dravidians had Siege engineers they'd be top 5 for sure. full siege workshop paired with the cheaper siege on top of that.
OG Koreans SOs outranged standard castles with bracer if I recall correctly. So yeah, 12 range sounds right to me. I just checked and the deal was that the team bonus was +1 range and the UT was +2 range, and then siege engineers for another +1 gave 12.
From the looks of things, this was reduced even in patch 1.0b from 2001. The fact I remember playing AOEII back then suddenly makes me feel very old. I still suck at the game, but slightly less than twenty years ago haha
This request for top 5 is probably due to me still learning all the civs unique stuff, but would love a top CA civs.
on Celts: A while ago I tinkered with the thought if any other civ could get Capped Rams in Castle age. And with a little bit calculation I found out that Celts basically have Capped Ram in Castle Age for free. And as far as building damage is concerned their Mangonels also "eat TC" like Onagers.
I feel like celts are number one because you don't have to research anything and sometimes the game doesnt even get to imperial so you fully use their bonuses
I think you have been influenced by the overall performance of mongols, placing them over celts. Maybe post imp mongol siege is better but for me the fact that you get the celts faster fireing siege and faster working workshops for straight in castle age. For me its the teuton though because my bombard canons die to light cav all the time and ironclad helps the best with that but i would love for the upgrade to give piercearmor aswell. Also underrated: Ironclad in s bombard canon fight, since the radius st wich you get 1 shot or 2 shot is smaller.
I feel like in treb/bombard cannon wars,the Portuguese unique tech makes it so much better for them. Maybe deserving of a top 10 because organ guns are still siege
Kinda was expecting Cumans and Portuguese as honorable mentions.
Lacking Siege Engineers really sucks but Rams in Feudal and Capped Rams in Castle can completely catch players off guard and is so powerful in specific situations.
And Portuguese's Organ Gun reputation + cheaper BBCs that are fully upgraded should be included in the discussion for me. Is just so powerful
Also Bohemians definitely are higher than that now imo. Hussite Wagons are just so, so strong and should have been mentioned.
Imo Ethiopian seige is also the most practical to use since Arbalast+halb is the most effective and easy to get to support composition. (compared to mangudai+hussar from mongols or infantry from celts.)
Good list! I was waiting for Romans or Khmer also
Maybe a silly comment, but what about Khmer with ballista elephants? An honorable mention?
Is this a post imp siege tier list? Hera not even mentioning Celts have faster working siege workshops or woodcutting bonus 11.
Hey Hera, i just wanted to let you know that i pretty enjoyed that twist at 1:20🙂💪🏻
Love the vid, keep it up.
1:53. I had AOE2: The Conquerors 1.0 and FU Siege Onager of Koreans had 12 range. +1 range from team bonus and +2 range from Unique Tech. It was fun to kill Castles with them because they outranged Castles. Game balance at that time was absurd.
The Saracens 15% extra attack can be be amazing when taking down castles
Bohemians having Chemistry available in Castle Age is very nice to because you can make 2 siege workshop in Castle/on your way to Imp, research chemistry in Castle Age and so you can start producing BBC right when you reach Imp and your second workshop can research Houfnice right away as well. This way, you can have crazy strong siege in early Imp
Romans and Portuguese deserve a honorable mention imo
I'm going to take a moment to say I think people are sleeping on Italians BBC.
It's just the one thing, and they miss siege engineers, so of course they won't make a top 5 siege civs. But they save money on imp, save money on chemistry, and then save on each bombard. When I see pros (rarely) go for it, suddenly they have like 5-6 bombards vs their opponents 1-2 and a treb or two. And it quickly spirals out of control in a siege vs siege battle.
There is some civ who has a lot of potentiel in early castle age and it could be mentionned i think. For an exemple in black forest or arena game as flank, you are gujaras, elephant siege and monk push could be so deadly. The siege benefit of 30% bonus damage and can get healed by monk. But i get it the video is more about, potentiel late game strength.
Portugese should also be a honorable mention. Their BBC gets balistics, they have siege engineers and all their units get a discount.
Personally the discount on slavs is one of my favourite just make it easy for field alot of SO nothing more scary than a big army of SO moving against your army 😅
I am guessing you got a lot of heat not placing the Celts number one :). I agree with your top 2, love the Ethiopian siege. So strong and versatile at the same time. With the Mongols, my favorite in the Siege Ram. Garrison 6 infantry in one and they are crazy fast. Which means, when they destroy one building the get to the next so much sooner. I think the Bengali Siege Elephant may be worth an honorable mention too with a faster attack and taking less bonus damage.
always love your videos hera but i disagree. Celts/Ethiopians/Portugese/Mongols/Turks would be my list. Its one thing having a great variety (Ethipoians, Saracens etc) but when a specific Siege Weapon is so absolutely core to a civs composition (eg Turks) it cannot be downstated. Its like saying Franks lack Camels and Hussar, but theyre still a top 5 cav civ....btw you also forgot celts faster creation speed....Now to not even mention Portugese is mindboggling to me. They save so much gold on their units and also have ballistics for bbc. Just my opinion and given specific match ups these could all be in a different order. Ethipoians and Celts is very close. Nonetheless, keep on making vids. I always enjoy your content. Much love :)
Great input and great points my brother 👍
Ethiopians with Torsion Engines were missing from the honorable mentions, so I guess them?
Good stuff
You also forgot Khmer and Romans for their Scorps, definitely honerable mentions - and potentially BBC from Burgundians (unterrated) with the +25% attack.
I guessed right on the number one pick :D
ethiopian tech also works on rams . They can take 3 wall put together and behind
It is very strange. It made me remember my old days with FN map. My friends, still remember me?AOE4Fun.
Guess: Etheopians for there amazing AOE and full Siege Workshop.
Edit: Oh Yeah!
I'm a bit surprised Portuguese Ballistics BC and Khmer and Roman scorps didn't get a shout in the honorable mentions (granted, it was already a long list). I was fairly certain Ethiopians would be top from the beginning and seeing Mongols at 2nd clinched it for me.
Hey Hera, a wacky idea from me. Maybe you can make a civ tierlist assuming the game settings has no imperial age? (Only upto castle age)
Poles, Cumans and Spanish seem like they'd be incredibly dominant with their knight spam, capped rams and conqs/castle drops, respectively. In general the meta would probably be dominated by castle drops because there's no longer the option to push them back with trebs or bombard cannons.
@@teddyhaines6613 Malians sound good as well
Doesn't Bohemians' hussite wagon count as siege weapons?
yup, used to be 12 range onagers for koreans, able to outrange castles with bracer, it was broken and alot of fun to abuse vs AI
Can u pls do top 5 elephant civs?
@hera no khmer in top 10 ?
I like cheap roman scorpions with ballistics
My guess is Ethiopians #1 from the beginning of the video.
It was probably for the best the Koreans don’t have their previous 12 range. Can you imagine a group of those just out-ranging a Castle with Bracer in a tournament game? Lol.
Spanish for the Cannon Galleons... No it would be Portugese due to Arquebus unique tech because they'd get to accurately destroy any Super Engines and so on, just like Warwolf... except war gets range, but is stationary (has AoE too) - whereas Portugese gets mobility with a reduced range. They do still get siege engineers though.
P.S. I just like arguing from the underdog's position! It's much less stuffy down here.
Much respect for you man, good videos.
Although it really bothers me when you say CA (cavalry archer)
TC (town center) etc
I just think it's so cringe to pronounce the letters instead of the words haha
Lol its just AoE2 lingo honestly the most funny is bbc like bombard is 2 words 😜
Bohemia is not a one trick pony anymore. Hussite wagons are very tricky to deal with if the civ doesn't have redemption.
Don't think Dravidians siege bonus was mentioned in the honourable mentions
Ethiopians, I am sure. But for me personally, Bohemian clown wagon should buy them first place.
I think the Dravidian siege weapons are the best in the game :p (a coin in the machine ;)).
Damn Dravidians didn't get an honourable mention rip
For non pros, mongols all the way. That speed boost helps so much
When I saw the video, I expected Mongols at #1
Bulgarians, Teutons, Slavs even Portuguese feel better than Bohemians
You forgot dravidians 😂
ethiopians i remember was your favourite
No Roman Skorpians?
Ethiopeans should be No. 1. Only civ with full siege tech tree.
Turk with no bonus damage from SE :(
suprised khmer is not mentioned but hey what i know 🤣
Khmer and Roman's oddly missing here.
For a moment I thought you'd put Tatars and the flaming camel in number one.
Best siege civ must be Ethiopians. Very weird to not see them anywhere on the list until now...
About 12 ranges koreans SO you can check out the video from Spirit of the Law, the title is “througt the age: koreans” if i’m not mistaking
Worth noting that out of the top 5, Koreans don't get heresy meaning that they're somewhat vulnerable to redemption monks. Teutons otoh not only get heresy but are harder to convert off the bat (plus they can go redemption bp monks themselves). And while range>melee armour for SO, the melee armour affects all the SW units and is fantastic on rams.
profit for hera
I miss long range onagers. Koreans should lose access to siege onager but instead get this extra range. Onagers with 8+3 range were awesome.
Also I wish in return of Rome DLC devs disable this sick ballistic for siege units. This is ridiculous catapults know better where your units are going before you do. Because of that fact more siege units from aoe2 can’t make it to the return of Rome because there is just no sense. Siege towers and rams are at this point meaningless with this old OP feature. Siege with ballistic should be a bonus for some civ with poor siege to balance it. Giving balistic for siege to all civs makes return of Rome just “world of tank: ancient edition” in the last game. I’m really happy that devs decided not to give this outrageous feature to aoe2.
Buff the celts plis
Where are ballista elephants? 😢
No honor for dravidian, even with cheaper siege
pretty sure that unique tech used to be +3, but remember when blacksmith upgrades affected scorpions, that was back in aok. remember pushing with teuton tcs and scorps and it was just stupid and couldnt be beaten lol
UTs were introduced in The Conquerors, so it does not matter for AoK balance. Moreoever Scorpions were only affected by archer attack upgrades, not armor.
The unique tech was +2 and the team bonus was +1 range.
The tech got nerfed with the first patch in AoC and the team bonus was changed to -1 minimum range in The Forgotten (the first new expansion).
teutons not even in the honorable mentions? come on teutons are great
Hi Hera, I got an idea. Why wouldn't take the save middle of game ~500 elo and continue playing from this?
it's like you're driving your younger brother out of the chair and to show him how to do it right 😅
#1 Romans, 40 scorpions for 1200 gold ;)
beest siege civ i'd say ethiopians for aoe bonusses
Cries is 33% wood savings.
I have guessed the ethiopiens of course, I think personnally they have better BBC than bohemiens beacause it's cheaper to upgrade and more effective, and also the ethiopiens bbc is for me the best counter against longbow.
I think I still prefer Houfnice because of access to Wagenberg tactics. That extra speed makes it really hard to ever take good trades with your own BBC even if you have the same range on paper because they can just dodge your shots.
Despite some civs have a bit better version of each siege unit , Ethi flexibility makes them #1. Just need to choose what unit is needed in current situation.
Yes the ethiopnas siege ram have more area effect damage and deal damage to multiple layers of walls.
Just think about filling a Drill Siege Ram with Spearmen and how fast you can rush with that
siege tower goes hillariously fast. I think it's the fastest unit in the game 11
@@LokirofRoriksted Actually, thanks for saying that. I remember that, and just realised how freaking fast can a Drill Siege Tower be
Dravidians ?
Hera conviniently 'forgetting' Dravidians here 😂
33% off wood for each siege weapon is VERY good. Not enough for top 5, but definitely an honorable mention (like Slavs got)!
Ethiopians!
on the koreans: their teambonus during "The Conquerors" was Mangonel line +1 range so yeah they had 11 range...
they had 12 range dude.
@@umutakdemir442then tell me where does this 1 additional range come from?
@@Eisenkrone5000I think the unique tech used to be 2 range.
@@chronographer dayum so even stronger then...
Ethiopians siege should be nerfed. They already have the strongest archers in the game, with their siege they become too strong in late.
I like portugese bbc with ballistics because i can't micro 😅
Ethiopian siege onager go brrr
My guess is Ethiopian
Hera, what about Vietnamese? I know they don't get the last tier for Scorpions, Onagers and Rams, but they have Siege Engineers BBC and nice Trebuchets, and on top of that a good wood+gold eco (--less costing archers,-- Paper Money). They deserve a honorable mention.
There's a lot of civs with siege engineers and bombard cannons, including but not limited to Portuguese (who also get Arquebus and cannons that cost less gold), Hindustanis, Franks, Poles (who also get Siege Ram), Berbers and Burmese. Vietnamese don't have anything that stands out too much compared to all of those.
Also, their archers have more HP. It's the Mayans who have cheaper archers.
Ok ig
Completely ignored Bohemian food truck
plzzzz when 1v4 ? are they on twitch? plzzzz someone respond
Kinda weird to not know all the bonuses of ur 1st pick civ.
❤
Ethiopians easy
ethioapians
#1 Celts without watching the video.