I think the first problem is a lot of the original masters of famous albums are not been preserved and stored properly by music labels. The second problem is when a studio decides to remaster an album they don't give it the love and attention it deserves. Music companies will have to wake up to the fact that the is a huge demand for high resolution music and high quality analogue music that is remastered properly. Studios should preserve the source material with a lot of love and care so future generations can enjoy it
Do you know that most master tapes are wandering in some flea markets. all around the world... and do you know most master tapes already are just trash. sadly but true.
By analysing the linked files and comparing the spectral fingerprint of background noise in the LP and Tape versions we could speculate whether this claimed Legacy Master is merely a copy of the last generation tape used for mass production instead of the real 1st generation master tape. This hypotesis might also be supported by the fact that the CD version, being declared to be AAD, does not show that nasty level of noise that the Legacy Master does. Anyway, we cannot exclude that some sort of digital hiss removal filter had been used in the CD production.
it's about expectations ................the format and the pricetag............yeah one may have those expectations !...................but those do not allways fullfill what you dreamed about ...... Clearly track 2 was for me the better but not up to the point to let the others miles behind ( at least on YT )...........For the financial investment I would be dissapointed also.....but still tape runs the show by a margin varying between subtle and dramaticly superior . Some time ago I repaired my PR99 and get a go with a reel I reecorded from my turntable in the eighties on a B77 II.............4 decades later to become alive again and I kept on listening with amazement of the forgotten beauty .............yes , it is still something real on a reel ! Happy to never have sold my tape machines collection ...............G36 ( tubes and amazing sounding machine ) some B77 II , the PR99 and K7 Nackamichi CR7E...........they give a happy feeling when pushing the button PLAY even after the format is forgotten .....
Just listened these tracks once, I like the track 2 (tape) sound the best. It has more soundstage depth and width and each instrument is crystal clear compared to the other tracks. And follows the track 3 (CD), it has dynamics. Least favorite is the track 1 (LP), somehow it’s flat. But they are all digitized, compressed, and streamed through TH-cam. And converted back to analog, amplified and played by speakers in my room. Everyone has different gear and settings. So, it’s just my opinion.
There is the risk there is with Sony Music because there was a person at that record company who said that there is no difference in the sound That the digital copy sounds the same
You got it right! Thank you for the video! You start with the session tapes, mix them to other tapes. Then splice them all together and then make an album master tape. 3 generations right there! No matter the speeds of the tapes, with each successive generation adds the previous tapes hiss to the next tape(s). By the time you get the tape you got, it's a 3rd or 4th generation copy. You also have to take into consideration the quality of the tape formula used. For starters, CBS was re-recording over the session tapes, so the original session tapes don't exist anymore. Then you have to consider the degradation of the master tapes over the years, and, yes, magnetic recording tape degrades.
@@theonl1128 Whatever decrading is? Or maybe not paying attention to that wonderful computer feature call spell-check? Assuming you were trying to spell degrading, tape degradation can be affected by what the tape was made out of and how it was stored. Everytime a tape is played, a few magnetic particles are rubbed off the tape. Should the tape heads be carrying a magnetic charge, the information on the tape can get scrambled a little bit. This is why the Beatles' master tapes have remained in the vault and digital copies have been used to make new records and CD's plus the finished product can be streamed. I personally know of master tape which have degraded so much, in maybe 20 years, that they are no longer useable.
Great comparison! I had them right. LP: i heard that typical roughness of vinyl, the roughness you have most at the innergrooves. It was slight but was there audible in tje voice Tape: a slightly duller/softer for my feeling CD: was the cleanest. It was as bright as the LP but without that slight roughness All slightly, no big obvious problems To be honest and non popular opinion, but if the CD comes from the same master tape, I doubt there is much information lost. Playing reels on the other hand is a magical experience just because the feel of it!
While listening to the blind test I guessed No. 2 correctly as the tape, because it sounded the best. But guessed 1 and 3 wrong. To me No 1 sounded the worst so I assumed it must be the CD! And I was sure No 3 is the LP... It's amazing how your own bias can change your perception.
Interesting comparison again. I downloaded the files and listened to them. To my ears the vinyl and tape are extremely close with only a small hint of extra detail in the tape. The CD does sound a little brighter or 'colder' to me (some might say 'more digital'), although at the same time it did seem to have just a little bit more detail in the highs, but then again lost in warmth and depth of the bass compared to both the vinyl and tape. Overall I did find the tape to sound the most pleasing, but if the arguable small difference with the vinyl copy is worth the high price is questionable. Another observation was that the vinyl copy and your turntable have such high quality, that i really couldn't spot that this was the sound of the vinyl. I did correctly guess listening to the examples on youtube which one was the CD however. Apart from all of this, I did actually found all of them to sound pretty good and what I would expect from a recording of this time period.
A great comparison. Those large reels are sexy! It takes me way back to 60s when my dad had a Grundig R2R. An audiophile and his money are easily parted.... I know I am one! Seriously, this highlights just one of the many rabbit holes audiophiles can fall into. The cost of that reel is just outrageous. Any perceptible improvement in the sound - real or imagined- from the vinyl to the CD and the Reel is certainly not worth an additional $400. Anyone who thinks it is has more money than sense. Of course there are lots of factors at play- the quality of equipment- turntable, cd player reel 2 reel amp and speakers is key. The quality of the original recording and the mastetapes. One major factor often overlooked is the quality of the listeners HEARING! I'm 62, I still have good hearing but I'm aware that hearing deteriorates with age. Audiophiles are on a continuous journey towards perfection. Perfection is forever just a few steps ahead in the near future tantalisingly just out of reach. There is so much snake oil and BS floating around in audiophile circles from those who can smell an analogue recording from 100 paces after hearing just a few bars... until they were humiliated and exposed by MoFi Gate.Its easy to forget to ask that basic question- are you listening to the quality of the music or the quality of the system. I admire your common sense and honesty in these reviews.
Isn't it ironic that your system upgrades all the time, but your hearing DEgrades in the same time? If only I had the money when I was young.. Still, I WOULD like to hear the difference with tape (and MAN, does it look cool, a set of big reels running on a machine..) and, say, streaming. Whether it is worth $450? Don't know, for me, probably not. But to experience it? Perhaps? Still, what if you wanted to get the same quality in streaming? Buy a dCS Vivaldi? Sure, from then on, it's just subscriptions to the providers, but that's a LOT more expensive... And it's just fun. Although I think more and more companies figure that they can indeed earn more from audiophiles. Sad...
That is why I learn to be content with a not so pricy stereo system that plays CD and Records. I know when I get old, my hearing will get less... by the way, the LP sounds best compared to the master tape copy and cd of Dalla.
@@bpabustan Yep, I chose the (much more expensive) alternative option: keep upgrading as my hearing gets worse as to keep the experience and enjoyment on a similar level. In hindsight, yours is probably the smarter choice.... And the album is from 1980, so the odds of the LP being better was pretty high... Even though I prefer all 1970s and 1980s Dire Straits albums on LP, even Brothers In Arms which should have been the perfect example of CD's superiority. I bought the CD in 1987, but I own both now, and prefer the LP version 😂
@@erwindewit4073 but you know at the end of the day, we are just nitpicking as what is the superior format when what what really matters most isTHE MUSIC.
@@bpabustan Yep. Effectively, I don't really care what bitrate something is. If I want to listen to it, I will. Even if it is 96 kbps MP3 (my lowest bitrate file). Or a radio station with a very low bitrate. Don't care. I still play minidiscs. That's not going to be perfect either. Or cassettes. But who cares! It's fun and sounds nice....
Agreed. Number 2 was the worst. For me, number 3 (CD) was the best, and number 1 (vinyl) was second. The CD stood out because it sounded the most dynamic, clear and sharp, particularly the voice.
I thought so at first too, same ranking, but I was cleaning the room. Upon close listening, I find 3 more punchy and less detailed. It's tough on youtube and over airplay however
Thanks for this video, really interesting. I think we all would love to get a version of a favourite album that is comparable to the studio master to hear that extra dimension etc. I have used inexpensive through to moderately expensive equipment and the thing is this. I would love to have a 50k system, but like many that is just a dream, so it leaves me with one truth. Find the music you love, in a version you love and just enjoy the music. I will never get to hear the studio master from Queen’s News of the World or ABBA’s The Visitors - and that is OK. I resign myself to finding the best I can and enjoying it. How many times have I run down a rabbit hole (yes DSD, MQA) only to find disappointment? Too many times! And don’t get me started on “Remastered” versions that tend to be universally terrible! Enjoy your music now and stop chasing what might well be something that is not attainable (or possible real). If only I had a Time Machine to go back to the days in the studios to hear The Police, The Who, Queen, Eric Johnson etc at full resolution! That would be great, but day dreaming again!!!
Great song! In sound quality to me is clear: Best one is the LP version, the second goes to CD and third the tape. It can happen because it's a third generation of an old degraded tape. I think that a DSD file from the first tape generation with some digital restoration would sound best (and waaaay cheaper).
Thanks man, I love these blind test sessions. I am always amazed by the difference between YT and the digital downloads - they are really needed to compare. Have a nice weekend
I’m really surprise, I just did one listening. And my preference order is : Sample 1, sample 3, sample 2. So when you gave the results I was really surprised. First, once again, the LP, a mechanic medium, not expensive, is impressive. And a CD, from a good master, with a properly trained engineer for analog to digital conversion can be great. But obviously the guitar at the intro and the bass are the best on the LP, to my ears and brain …
Thank you for this interesting comparison! I compared the three examples, using the downloads, listening via headphones. My conclusion is that the LP and the Copy Tape sound very, very similar. Buy a Mint or Near Mint LP edition and you will have the sound of the Copy Tape. The CD sounds a bit louder, although you normalized it, and in my opinion is mastered somewhat differently. You can see that in a spectrogram. I softened it a bit and suddenly I prefer the CD version, it sounds really nice. Before that I preferred the LP/Copy Tape version. So I guess, it is all in the mastering. But the most important thing is that you do not have to buy a Copy Tape to get close to the original sound, if you find a well mastered edition on CD or LP.
Thanks for your input. I must disagree on the last part. Everytime I am able to put my hands on a quality tape copy of an album the difference in quality is huge. Nevertheless, this could be that rare case in which that is all the tape has to offer.
@@anadialog I see the problem here with the Record Labels. If you transfer one of your Tapes into the digital domain and use a good Digital Recorder, I am sure the sound of the Digital Copy will be almost 100% identical to the sound of the Tape. If Record Labels would offer us musiclovers Hi-Res downloads of 1:1 transfers of certain Master Tape Copies (instead of offering expensive Tapes, like Sony does here) musiclovers would finally realize how nice the "Originals" sound, if certain Mastering engineers stop compressing/destroying music they master for CD.
Using a working copy is general practice. No one is going to let you run the master copy hundreds of times. For one reel, it is a little pricey. Lpr35 is the same as sm911 formula but the duration is not as long. Better to use 2 sm900 or sm911 reels.
Indeed, didn't say the opposite. But I think it is important to underline it since many don't know and the tile Master Tapes could create ambiguities. For instance in the Quality Certificate I show it says "Direct Copy from the Master Tapes" and that is simply not true.
As Maestro would say: “Provvidenza!” Wow I guessed 100% correct on the first listen! Like you said I could sense greater resolution, space between the notes, in track #2.
I must admit that the difference between the Master Tape and the two others is not apparent contrary to your full test of "Dark side of the Moon" where the Master Tape was cleary above all of the others.
As always you keep it interesting. This is a project I was not aware of and as you stated not a real success. I thank you for your channel and the approach on music and equipment
El numero uno se lleva el premio para mis oidos, aunque las frecuencias medias y altas me resultan similares en los tres, el sonido de los bajos resulta mas envolvente y de mayor riqueza en el vinilo. Muchas gracias por la comparativa.
I tried the download. I liked the reel and cd; both sounded pretty good. The tape had a good lead. Also I was amazed that the LP sounded as good as it did. I bet a hi res digital download dubbed to 15 ips .50 track would sound just as good.
Nice video 🙂.1 seemed to be the vinyl due to a slight scratch at 7:17 on the left channel, but on re-listening the fault is present on the other tracks. 2, with the earphones and the treble a little pushed, we feel the hint of breath from the tape with the impression also of a minimal distortion. On number 3, the dynamics stand out as the drums progress. Hello from Belgium 🙋♂️
Hello there, at very first glance I felt I slightly preferred n.2 over n.1 and 3 feeling a little less captivating. So I guess it kind of reflects expectations. In any case a few days ago I listened to both albums "Lucio Dalla" and "Dalla", I have them both first pressings, hadn't listened to them in a long time. I have to say after listening to "Lucio Dalla" "Dalla" felt a bit underwhealming in terms of sonics, not as clear or punchy, not by a lot but it was perceivable. I don't know if it's to do with my particular copies but perhaps "Dalla" is not the most hi fi record of his, though as I said I might be wrong. Anyhow I think if you think it sounds better than the Vinyl and the CD you shouldn't be too bummed out, in the end is a great album and now you have the best copy of it on the market.
@@anadialog I'm sorry to hear, as I said it might be that the original master in this case isn't that spectacular to begin with, or that the pressing is really good and therefore there's very marginal differences.
From my end, just listening on a very good quality Hi Fi sound bar: #1 sound quality is the tape, followed closely at #2in sound quality by the CD and in #3 is the LP. My experience is that a master tape copy always wins against any other format. Even when a tape is transferred "as is" to a digital medium it usually wins out . Thanks for the comparisons. And salutations from Canada my Italian brother! 🥳
I actually liked the CD as the best. Tape second. LP third so go figure! Just to be clear, this is as presented in this video and through my MacBook Pro. So not exactly the best way possible. I may download the files and have a proper go with those through the main rig. Cheers! Oz LTBS
The LP sounded best. The CD sounded second best, although I could hear a bit of harshness from the CD. The master tape was the worst of all. I too would be disappointed. Keep in mind that the tape may be a direct transfer with no mastering. LP's and CD have improvements added in general.
For me the CD sounded best ... the voice. But then there is the equipment I'm listening with), the equipment used to play the files on (your site) and at last our ears. So this is complex, but I agree that the tape does not stand out in any way.
If you put in the description of the video an index like this: 6:35 track 1 7:53 track 2 9:11 track 3 It is clickable. It is easier to skip to the tracks to do a comparison.
Yes, I always do that if you check my other similar videos. I had to edit and publish this while traveling. Completely forgot. Now solved. Thanks for pointing that out!
For many people who don't have lp or cd playback gear anywhere near the quality of yours Guido, they might be really impressed by the sound of tapes such as this. It's all relative I guess. Sony didn't take you up on your offer. I wonder if DS Audio would let you review their top of the line light beam phono cartridge. It costs $60,000 the last I heard. It works without any magnets or coils. The bottom of the line light beam cartridge which costs under $3,000 has had reviews, I would say pretty good reviews. After the Mofi scandal, you would think Mofi would have changed to making analog instead of DSD copies of masters. I will say that my cd playback is sounding SO analog like these days. I keep working on it. The other day I greened the outer perimeter of a cd. It's like the last tiny vestiges of digital sound totally disappeared. Sweeter and more natural, less edge, more open. The last time I greened a cd, my system was not as good. It made the same kind of improvements; but by about 5% instead of the near 10% I heard the other day. What is it about tape that always seems to have warmth galore?
Could be...I would love to test one of them. I am surprised about the greening, people get they knives as soon as you mention that. If you like CDs and have time to optimize for a further 10% you should get the Auric illuminator (perhaps you already have it). Here is a video I made on CD tweaks: th-cam.com/video/8CTD6EgKG5s/w-d-xo.html
i new that no. 2 is the master tape! :-) the track 1 sound good. the cd track 3 sound afoul! little bass, a bit compressed. overall the master tape sound very good! don't be disappointed!
I like the second track a little more than the first, and I didn't like the third one at all (the stage is too narrow and there is not enough low frequencies).
I personally know the man who's behind this reissue operation. He is not a Sony employee but an external wealthy amateur and definitely mediocre technician. A lot of people here in Italy curse the day that they asked him to overhaul their Studers. I am definitely not surprised that the result is mediocre as well.
I consider myself a gentleman and I did not want to use my channel to talk negatively about someone "because I can" but I can say that I know exactly who you are talking about since he did a disaster with one of my machines as well. Terrible rude person.
@@anadialog I have to be honest and say that, at first sight, I was very tempetd to buy this tape, expecially after the test published on a famous italian HiFi magazine, where it was played on a Studer A810. Fortunately, when I found out who it was from, my base instincts chilled out.
The vinyl was distinct, but I thoght the second was the CD because it sounded more compressed. The third option sounded clearer (through TH-cam anyway). May be the masterings were the differences, but a "Master Tape" shouldn't.
What a surprise I must say. For me order is CD, vinyl and tape . The tape just sounds very flat in my ears. Really disappointing indeed, but big thanks to you to save us all the 450 euro we would have spent 😀 Love your channel, keep up the good work!
Oof. My ranking best to worst was 3-1-2. I was shocked to find #2 was the master tape. I really appreciate that you do these blind tests, when so many others just tell us their opinion and we are forced to use our imagination if we would agree or not.
Hello Sir, I did found the Tape being more detailed than the LP and CD. Not sure if it should be more than that though. Always fun those comparison. Can you recommend some other Italian artist you like, I need some gift for my Italian dad. Thank you
My blind preference was Track 2, then 1, and finally 3. To my ear track 3 (CD) was substantially inferior to the other two. Vinyl and tape were close but I immediately noticed more details in the lower registers on track 2. Definitely enjoy the blind tests, unfortunately I didn’t use my main listening system, so that deserves an asterisk, but I’ll try it that way next time. Interesting to consider how one can judge analog audio quality via a compressed audio TH-cam stream. I’m sure we can’t appreciate all the subtlety but some differences do seem to remain. Enjoying your content.
No I guess you just misunderstood my words. In the first sentence I said my preference was 2, which is tape, then 1 (vinyl) and finally (inferior) the lowest preference is track 3. So it does say what I intended. Thanks
Interesting. On the iPad, the differences were evident. I’d have rated them 2, 3 then 1. 1 sounded too hot, 2 was smoothest. Old ears, TH-cam and cheaper equipment…. What cartridge was used when playing the LP?
Funny, I thought, listening to the clips via the TV speaker: I preferred no2, but it was very close. And indeed, I wondered whether that was all tape could do... (I only have streaming, vinyl, minidisc and cassette in use).
The Reels maybe sexy as someone else commented but in this case the LP sounded much better. It was more open, had better instrument separation, sounded more live. The Reel was muffled. I bet you are quite disappointed, more then you led on I suspect. I too would be disappointed especially because of the cost of the reel.
Track 2 was the best for my ears, followed by track 1 and track 3. As soon I listened to the second track, I felt that this was a tape, and I liked the tape's unique delicacy. Of course, listening to TH-cam directly on the iPad may not be accurate.
Yep, even listening on TH-cam (I didn't bother this time to download the lossless versions) and through my secondary system, to me it was very clear that the 2nd file you played did not have any where near the dynamics or the sound extension of the 1st or 3rd one. Interestingly, I found when the piano came in more strongly in the intro, the CD or 3rd file actually had a bit more punch, a bit of a surprise. But, yes, the reel to reel was by far the inferior copy. Sorry you put out the money for it Bro 😕 But, by contrast, the one you did a video one previously from the Italian company, wow, that one you could hear the excellent quality. I was actually quite surprised by that one.
Thanks for sharing your analysis! The CD has some emphasis on the higher notes that some like and some dislike...I find it also a little dry but overall is quite good.
The CD sounds best, ar least in my sistem. I was surprised the tape was the worst sounding as it normaly should sound the best. In 1980 the CD wasn't comercial yet, so this album must have been recorded in tape in the studio. The LP and CD were produced based on the original tape. They should sound less good then the LP and CD. The only way a "master tape copy" când sound worse then the other media, is by using a worse copy as a working copy to multiply.
I think the tape is clearly better, the vinil is bit dull, the cd lacks resolution but hides it with powerful presentation, the tape has good start stop and natural clean dynamics, also more resolving power.
A reasonable request. Who follows me knows but I understand. R2R: Studer A810 LP: Kuzma Staby R table with 4point 9 arm and currently using the Stratos cart I recently reviewed fed into the Audirorium 23 hommage step-up transformer which then goes on an Audia Flight FL phono preamp. CD: I bit-perfect ripped the file. All fed to my Mastersound Spettro preamp and then recaptured (analog signals) with my Blacklion Revolution soundcard (nothing amazing but decent). Cables are all OCC copper or OCC silver.
@@anadialog Thank you for the info. It is remarkable that, to achieve the results you recorded, the front end investments vary from almost nothing to 25k€! If you take this in account, the digital files have an unbeatable performance to price ratio! (Don’t get me wrong, I’m a vinyl lover myself, too)
@@epaminondasgaveras8717 I see your point! But I think it's actually a proof that all versions are at their limit, the same limit. If "more" was on the LP and tape it would have came out.
Thanks for introducing Lucio Dalla, the album “Dalla” oozes the 1980’s. Being Dutch I cannot understand a word, but the compositions and voice is beautiful. Going to order the CD and make my own copy on a B77.
I'd love to hear in a studio the difference between the Master, Working Copy and the Final Tape. Seems to me flat would be better for an audiophile version because if they made it louder at all audiophiles wouldn't like it as much.
Grazie Guido, è stato un video molto interessante davvero, ma ormai il tuo canale è sempre una garanzia! Meno male che almeno in Italia non c'è stato blocco Copyright
Thanks for the nice test! I played the files trough my Mytek Brooklyn, and the cd was the most dynamic. This is also visible when opened in Sound Studio. On Tidal the album is available in MQA 24bit 44.1khz , but I wonder what the source is? According the album art, it is the cd. What cartridge and preamp was used on the turntable?
Not all tape recorders sounds good. In my opinion last good sounding studers was A80 & B62. A800 series has very flat and simlified percussion and brass sounds, so for good copy better use A80 or B62. And even better - to use external tube play (and record) electronics without feedback.
Did i win something? I guessed it all!! Naturally by a listening via YT there is a certain tolerance but the feeling i had it’s that the CD AAD it’s a winwin facing the other two cause it has the original analog sound but more fresh and fast, but the sensation i had about the second it’s kind of boxer sound in the middle frequencies, lows similar, not better than vinyl, high near to the Cd version, first listening not deep and concentrate. Nice the reels but at that price i would get a higher performance.
I did guess the tape. It was the bass that gave it away. Could your disappointment come from the others being so good that the tape copy is unable to wow you as expected?
Being English I don't know much about Italian popular music but I discovered Stadio a few years ago and there are similarities with Lucio Dalla in the vocal sound.. is there any link between the two?
Indeed. Storia di un minuto is very good. Italian Prog Rock is among the best out there. I am afraid we are better off with a good LP version though....but you never know. If Sony wants to convince me they just need to send some tapes for evaluation.
@@anadialog I hope to gain access to those recordings here in our country. A lot of stuff that is so common in US and Europe is quite a challenge to find here in the Philippines.
So, let's see: Sony could have made a digital copy of the true master tape and released it on cd. The price of the cd would have been perhaps 10€. To most audiophile listeners the cd would have sounded identical to the original master. Perhaps the cd in this video was it? But what we have here are third generation analog copies of the original, each analog generation adding noise and distortion inherent in any analog technology. And we are supposed to pay 45 times more money for it. What am I getting wrong?
You should simply ask Sony Music if the tape is from an analog master or if it is from a digital copy. An interview with the person responsible for publication perhaps
Bummer. Ha ha, i am trying to fix my old reel to reel, but it does not take ten inches, only seven, i would be happy if i can make it work again, and tape my vinyls. Then i would probably share my paternal grandfathers shared hobbies, sadly he passed away, years ago, when i was kid. He had only like mine. 😢❤
Excelente video, seria bueno que dijeras en que tocadiscos y con que capsula se reprodujo el disco de vinyl igual con el Reel to Reel y el CD Player. Yo se se que posees muy buenos equipos. A mi también me parece así, los primeros CD que salieron sonaban mucho mejor, que las versiones mas nuevas.
A reasonable request. Who follows me knows but I understand. R2R: Studer A810 LP: Kuzma Staby R table with 4point 9 tonearm and currently using the Stratos cart I recently reviewed fed into the Audirorium 23 hommage step-up transformer which then goes on an Audia Flight FL phono preamp. Speakers: GoldenEar Triton Reference CD: I bit-perfect ripped the file. All fed to my Mastersound Spettro preamp and then recaptured (analog signals) with my Blacklion Revolution soundcard (nothing amazing but decent). Cables are all OCC copper or OCC silver. These are the main elements tied to the tape.
@@anadialog Yo te sigo desde hace algún tiempo, soy fanático de los Deck, y te ubique cuando hiciste el review del Nakamichi Dragon y el Revox B215, también soy fanático de los tocadiscos, no me gustan mucho los CD. Pero si tengo mis cuantos discos. Gracias por tu respuesta. Gran canal.
Yes. But you can use a VPN, there are also free versions if you hunt...but I don't recommend the purchase. Other people who bought other tapes told me they are even worse.
@@anadialog yes, but I don't think they ship to the US. Anyway, I'm just curious about the PFM edition. Those records have a great sound! Thanks, and please keep posting these videos.
A modern DAC and a well mastered digital source will do it all. Physical media are for pleasure, but won't guarantee any better sound quality. Just record your own tape on a reel-to-reel, and you'll save 400$...
Funny thing the 3 rd track started my foot tapping and I started to enjoy the track any more detail is for me not required to enjoy the music so don`t get obsessed with "detail " it is a trap thanks for making this vid! Yes non remastered CD´s sound very good . I thought that all Sony master tapes are stored as DSD files now are they trying to squeeze the last money out of their written of copy masters?
How do you keep these tapes stored? One of the things that I'm afraid of with jumping back to cassettes and tapes is past experience with them being so sensitive to environment conditions that I had a whole lot of them unplayable years ago. Reading on google, it seems that in good conditions they should last about 30 years but can at any point become unplayable. What do you do to mitigate this in a home environment?
You must avoid moisture and clearly extreme temperatures. That it is why it's a good idea to keep them in plastic bags IF they don't present any problems, otherwise they will get worse. 30 years? The tape of the 50's are perfect!
i didint guess quite right , 1-for me was best (was thinking its cd), 2 - i know it its tape i had no doubt it was worst from all 3 , 3- i was thinking its viyl , i had my doubt 1 and 3 , i lisen to song again and in my mind i told myself ,1cd,2tape,3vinyl , but was wrong switched cd and vinyl with places, u think u can make your own copy from that vinyl or flac of this song on lpr 90 and it will dound better , that this ''master tape''
A reasonable request. Who follows me knows but I understand. R2R: Studer A810 LP: Kuzma Staby R table with 4point 9 tonearm and currently using the Stratos cart I recently reviewed fed into the Audirorium 23 hommage step-up transformer which then goes on an Audia Flight FL phono preamp. Speakers: GoldenEar Triton Reference CD: I bit-perfect ripped the file. All fed to my Mastersound Spettro preamp and then recaptured (analog signals) with my Blacklion Revolution soundcard (nothing amazing but decent). Cables are all OCC copper or OCC silver. These are the main elements tied to the tape.
Bit of an off topic question but i was wondering if you had any idea where i could order parts for my r2r from, I got an old grundig tk-41 and well the rubber drive wheel i think it's called decided to crumble so yeah lol. Would be great to have another one to get this machine running
Hard to say ,plus I live in Italy so my labs and people are more local but in any case it's hard to find replacements of lesser known models. Labs (good ones) have more chances.
Right. Listening only on YT I heard this slight advantage of the Reel. Than I would choose the CD over the LP. But you are absolutely right. 450 Euro? Sadly, doesn’t seem to be worth the afford.
It's funny because everyone is saying that the CD is louder while I normalized the perceived loudness, which means that the treble is a little to emphasized
If this spool is a flat transfer then it's going to sound close to the cd esp a cd of that era that would have been taken from the same source the duplication tape for the cd is probably 1 fro the master maybe 2 depending on where the cd was encoded and pressed. An unmastered tape will sound flat compared to a mastered album that you would have been used to. The bottom like here is that 450 euros on a tape Sounds no different to a 10 euro cd. Save your money is the moral of this story. Who knows the person dubbing the tape might just be using a cd and not telling anyone. I mean nobody noticed mfsl were using digital masters until it got out :)
Yes, several are saying this bit in my experience a goodbtape copy is very different not just better, and much more dynamic. MOFI? May be a coincidence but I have around 6 or 7 lps and most of those are old. I just don't like MOFI's sound. Nevertheless, a quality digital copy can be amazing. I have no problems in stating that especially if a flat trasfer as you correctly pointed out.
I though the best track was the last. I only heard once. Maybe the cd plays better on a digital platform like TH-cam. I honestly don’t see the advantages of R2R but in any case if you pay 450 dollars for “audiophile” material it should sound at least! as good as 45 rpm audiophile vinyl. Also if it’s only 3rd gen from the master it shouldn’t cost that much IMO. What’s so hard in coping a tape ? Cheers
I can only add that, as others have pointed out, when doing copies that always use a working copy so they minimize the wear on the original and it makes sense for preservation.
to me clearly the vinyl sounded the worst by far. Saying that, i couldn't tell the difference between the cd and the tape, so... cd is the best in test considering the price, i guess. Interesting test though.
Maybe it's because it's from a digital source? the risk is there because someone at Sony Music thought that there is no difference in the sound of analogue or digital. Such thinking can have consequences
I've picked tracks 1, 3 and 2. Too much nitpicking, too much hair splitting. For the "actual" sonic difference on these 3 sources, the CD is enough. C'mon, 450 euros for something just as good (or insignificantly better), it's a non-brainer. In these situations, making some charity, help other people out or help the animals will make you feel a whole lot better.
This launch made me think: if there is still production of magnetic tapes of this size then is it also possible to produce blank compact cassette tapes? Greetings from Seoul, Tito Questo lancio mi ha fatto pensare: se c'è ancora la produzione di nastri magnetici di queste dimensioni allora è possibile produrre anche cassette compatte vergini?
![ANA[DIA]LOG](http://yt3.ggpht.com/50CpmGNilS8aoMlarZVhI_GxRDoZdbj4ZgwCMZXg-Rq2PrEvCytlE6RVyLUrNY-rwE_sAlZ1Zw=s48-c-k-c0x00ffffff-no-rj)
I think the first problem is a lot of the original masters of famous albums are not been preserved and stored properly by music labels. The second problem is when a studio decides to remaster an album they don't give it the love and attention it deserves. Music companies will have to wake up to the fact that the is a huge demand for high resolution music and high quality analogue music that is remastered properly. Studios should preserve the source material with a lot of love and care so future generations can enjoy it
Absolutely agree!
Do you know that most master tapes are wandering in some flea markets. all around the world... and do you know most master tapes already are just trash. sadly but true.
By analysing the linked files and comparing the spectral fingerprint of background noise in the LP and Tape versions we could speculate whether this claimed Legacy Master is merely a copy of the last generation tape used for mass production instead of the real 1st generation master tape.
This hypotesis might also be supported by the fact that the CD version, being declared to be AAD, does not show that nasty level of noise that the Legacy Master does. Anyway, we cannot exclude that some sort of digital hiss removal filter had been used in the CD production.
it's about expectations ................the format and the pricetag............yeah one may have those expectations !...................but those do not allways fullfill what you dreamed about ......
Clearly track 2 was for me the better but not up to the point to let the others miles behind ( at least on YT )...........For the financial investment I would be dissapointed also.....but still tape runs the show by a margin varying between subtle and dramaticly superior .
Some time ago I repaired my PR99 and get a go with a reel I reecorded from my turntable in the eighties on a B77 II.............4 decades later to become alive again and I kept on listening with amazement of the forgotten beauty .............yes , it is still something real on a reel !
Happy to never have sold my tape machines collection ...............G36 ( tubes and amazing sounding machine ) some B77 II , the PR99 and K7 Nackamichi CR7E...........they give a happy feeling when pushing the button PLAY even after the format is forgotten .....
Just listened these tracks once, I like the track 2 (tape) sound the best. It has more soundstage depth and width and each instrument is crystal clear compared to the other tracks. And follows the track 3 (CD), it has dynamics. Least favorite is the track 1 (LP), somehow it’s flat. But they are all digitized, compressed, and streamed through TH-cam. And converted back to analog, amplified and played by speakers in my room. Everyone has different gear and settings. So, it’s just my opinion.
I thought the same as you. 👍
Agree fully. Both in description and ranking.
There is the risk there is with Sony Music because there was a person at that record company who said that there is no difference in the sound That the digital copy sounds the same
You got it right! Thank you for the video! You start with the session tapes, mix them to other tapes. Then splice them all together and then make an album master tape. 3 generations right there! No matter the speeds of the tapes, with each successive generation adds the previous tapes hiss to the next tape(s). By the time you get the tape you got, it's a 3rd or 4th generation copy. You also have to take into consideration the quality of the tape formula used. For starters, CBS was re-recording over the session tapes, so the original session tapes don't exist anymore. Then you have to consider the degradation of the master tapes over the years, and, yes, magnetic recording tape degrades.
But decrading takes a long time, 30 - 50 years and I know....I play already 60 years all kinds of tapes on very good machines. 😊
@@theonl1128 Whatever decrading is? Or maybe not paying attention to that wonderful computer feature call spell-check?
Assuming you were trying to spell degrading, tape degradation can be affected by what the tape was made out of and how it was stored.
Everytime a tape is played, a few magnetic particles are rubbed off the tape. Should the tape heads be carrying a magnetic charge, the information on the tape can get scrambled a little bit. This is why the Beatles' master tapes have remained in the vault and digital copies have been used to make new records and CD's plus the finished product can be streamed.
I personally know of master tape which have degraded so much, in maybe 20 years, that they are no longer useable.
Great comparison!
I had them right.
LP: i heard that typical roughness of vinyl, the roughness you have most at the innergrooves. It was slight but was there audible in tje voice
Tape: a slightly duller/softer for my feeling
CD: was the cleanest. It was as bright as the LP but without that slight roughness
All slightly, no big obvious problems
To be honest and non popular opinion, but if the CD comes from the same master tape, I doubt there is much information lost. Playing reels on the other hand is a magical experience just because the feel of it!
While listening to the blind test I guessed No. 2 correctly as the tape, because it sounded the best. But guessed 1 and 3 wrong. To me No 1 sounded the worst so I assumed it must be the CD! And I was sure No 3 is the LP... It's amazing how your own bias can change your perception.
Interesting comparison again. I downloaded the files and listened to them. To my ears the vinyl and tape are extremely close with only a small hint of extra detail in the tape. The CD does sound a little brighter or 'colder' to me (some might say 'more digital'), although at the same time it did seem to have just a little bit more detail in the highs, but then again lost in warmth and depth of the bass compared to both the vinyl and tape. Overall I did find the tape to sound the most pleasing, but if the arguable small difference with the vinyl copy is worth the high price is questionable. Another observation was that the vinyl copy and your turntable have such high quality, that i really couldn't spot that this was the sound of the vinyl. I did correctly guess listening to the examples on youtube which one was the CD however. Apart from all of this, I did actually found all of them to sound pretty good and what I would expect from a recording of this time period.
Thanks for the analysis and for downloading. That is surely the way to go.
A great comparison. Those large reels are sexy! It takes me way back to 60s when my dad had a Grundig R2R. An audiophile and his money are easily parted.... I know I am one! Seriously, this highlights just one of the many rabbit holes audiophiles can fall into. The cost of that reel is just outrageous. Any perceptible improvement in the sound - real or imagined- from the vinyl to the CD and the Reel is certainly not worth an additional $400. Anyone who thinks it is has more money than sense. Of course there are lots of factors at play- the quality of equipment- turntable, cd player reel 2 reel amp and speakers is key. The quality of the original recording and the mastetapes. One major factor often overlooked is the quality of the listeners HEARING! I'm 62, I still have good hearing but I'm aware that hearing deteriorates with age. Audiophiles are on a continuous journey towards perfection. Perfection is forever just a few steps ahead in the near future tantalisingly just out of reach. There is so much snake oil and BS floating around in audiophile circles from those who can smell an analogue recording from 100 paces after hearing just a few bars... until they were humiliated and exposed by MoFi Gate.Its easy to forget to ask that basic question- are you listening to the quality of the music or the quality of the system. I admire your common sense and honesty in these reviews.
Isn't it ironic that your system upgrades all the time, but your hearing DEgrades in the same time? If only I had the money when I was young..
Still, I WOULD like to hear the difference with tape (and MAN, does it look cool, a set of big reels running on a machine..) and, say, streaming.
Whether it is worth $450? Don't know, for me, probably not. But to experience it? Perhaps?
Still, what if you wanted to get the same quality in streaming? Buy a dCS Vivaldi? Sure, from then on, it's just subscriptions to the providers, but that's a LOT more expensive...
And it's just fun.
Although I think more and more companies figure that they can indeed earn more from audiophiles. Sad...
That is why I learn to be content with a not so pricy stereo system that plays CD and Records. I know when I get old, my hearing will get less... by the way, the LP sounds best compared to the master tape copy and cd of Dalla.
@@bpabustan Yep, I chose the (much more expensive) alternative option: keep upgrading as my hearing gets worse as to keep the experience and enjoyment on a similar level. In hindsight, yours is probably the smarter choice.... And the album is from 1980, so the odds of the LP being better was pretty high... Even though I prefer all 1970s and 1980s Dire Straits albums on LP, even Brothers In Arms which should have been the perfect example of CD's superiority. I bought the CD in 1987, but I own both now, and prefer the LP version 😂
@@erwindewit4073 but you know at the end of the day, we are just nitpicking as what is the superior format when what what really matters most isTHE MUSIC.
@@bpabustan Yep. Effectively, I don't really care what bitrate something is. If I want to listen to it, I will. Even if it is 96 kbps MP3 (my lowest bitrate file). Or a radio station with a very low bitrate. Don't care. I still play minidiscs. That's not going to be perfect either. Or cassettes. But who cares! It's fun and sounds nice....
Agreed.
Number 2 was the worst.
For me, number 3 (CD) was the best, and number 1 (vinyl) was second.
The CD stood out because it sounded the most dynamic, clear and sharp, particularly the voice.
I thought so at first too, same ranking, but I was cleaning the room. Upon close listening, I find 3 more punchy and less detailed. It's tough on youtube and over airplay however
Thanks for this video, really interesting. I think we all would love to get a version of a favourite album that is comparable to the studio master to hear that extra dimension etc. I have used inexpensive through to moderately expensive equipment and the thing is this. I would love to have a 50k system, but like many that is just a dream, so it leaves me with one truth. Find the music you love, in a version you love and just enjoy the music. I will never get to hear the studio master from Queen’s News of the World or ABBA’s The Visitors - and that is OK.
I resign myself to finding the best I can and enjoying it.
How many times have I run down a rabbit hole (yes DSD, MQA) only to find disappointment? Too many times! And don’t get me started on “Remastered” versions that tend to be universally terrible!
Enjoy your music now and stop chasing what might well be something that is not attainable (or possible real).
If only I had a Time Machine to go back to the days in the studios to hear The Police, The Who, Queen, Eric Johnson etc at full resolution! That would be great, but day dreaming again!!!
I hear ya!
Great song! In sound quality to me is clear: Best one is the LP version, the second goes to CD and third the tape. It can happen because it's a third generation of an old degraded tape. I think that a DSD file from the first tape generation with some digital restoration would sound best (and waaaay cheaper).
Thanks man, I love these blind test sessions. I am always amazed by the difference between YT and the digital downloads - they are really needed to compare. Have a nice weekend
Thx!
I’m really surprise, I just did one listening. And my preference order is : Sample 1, sample 3, sample 2.
So when you gave the results I was really surprised. First, once again, the LP, a mechanic medium, not expensive, is impressive. And a CD, from a good master, with a properly trained engineer for analog to digital conversion can be great.
But obviously the guitar at the intro and the bass are the best on the LP, to my ears and brain …
Thank you for this interesting comparison! I compared the three examples, using the downloads, listening via headphones. My conclusion is that the LP and the Copy Tape sound very, very similar. Buy a Mint or Near Mint LP edition and you will have the sound of the Copy Tape. The CD sounds a bit louder, although you normalized it, and in my opinion is mastered somewhat differently. You can see that in a spectrogram. I softened it a bit and suddenly I prefer the CD version, it sounds really nice. Before that I preferred the LP/Copy Tape version. So I guess, it is all in the mastering. But the most important thing is that you do not have to buy a Copy Tape to get close to the original sound, if you find a well mastered edition on CD or LP.
Thanks for your input. I must disagree on the last part. Everytime I am able to put my hands on a quality tape copy of an album the difference in quality is huge. Nevertheless, this could be that rare case in which that is all the tape has to offer.
@@anadialog I see the problem here with the Record Labels. If you transfer one of your Tapes into the digital domain and use a good Digital Recorder, I am sure the sound of the Digital Copy will be almost 100% identical to the sound of the Tape. If Record Labels would offer us musiclovers Hi-Res downloads of 1:1 transfers of certain Master Tape Copies (instead of offering expensive Tapes, like Sony does here) musiclovers would finally realize how nice the "Originals" sound, if certain Mastering engineers stop compressing/destroying music they master for CD.
Using a working copy is general practice. No one is going to let you run the master copy hundreds of times. For one reel, it is a little pricey. Lpr35 is the same as sm911 formula but the duration is not as long. Better to use 2 sm900 or sm911 reels.
Indeed, didn't say the opposite. But I think it is important to underline it since many don't know and the tile Master Tapes could create ambiguities. For instance in the Quality Certificate I show it says "Direct Copy from the Master Tapes" and that is simply not true.
As Maestro would say: “Provvidenza!” Wow I guessed 100% correct on the first listen! Like you said I could sense greater resolution, space between the notes, in track #2.
Bravo!
I must admit that the difference between the Master Tape and the two others is not apparent contrary to your full test of "Dark side of the Moon" where the Master Tape was cleary above all of the others.
As always you keep it interesting. This is a project I was not aware of and as you stated not a real success. I thank you for your channel and the approach on music and equipment
El numero uno se lleva el premio para mis oidos, aunque las frecuencias medias y altas me resultan similares en los tres, el sonido de los bajos resulta mas envolvente y de mayor riqueza en el vinilo. Muchas gracias por la comparativa.
I tried the download. I liked the reel and cd; both sounded pretty good. The tape had a good lead. Also I was amazed that the LP sounded as good as it did. I bet a hi res digital download dubbed to 15 ips .50 track would sound just as good.
WOW! I picked the LP as best. The master may be worn or the Sony equipment is out of wack. Way too much money for the tape.
Nice video 🙂.1 seemed to be the vinyl due to a slight scratch at 7:17 on the left channel, but on re-listening the fault is present on the other tracks. 2, with the earphones and the treble a little pushed, we feel the hint of breath from the tape with the impression also of a minimal distortion. On number 3, the dynamics stand out as the drums progress. Hello from Belgium 🙋♂️
Thanks for your analysis!
Sorry that you were disappointed. It should have had that 'wow' factor in accordance with the promise and the price
Hello there, at very first glance I felt I slightly preferred n.2 over n.1 and 3 feeling a little less captivating. So I guess it kind of reflects expectations.
In any case a few days ago I listened to both albums "Lucio Dalla" and "Dalla", I have them both first pressings, hadn't listened to them in a long time. I have to say after listening to "Lucio Dalla" "Dalla" felt a bit underwhealming in terms of sonics, not as clear or punchy, not by a lot but it was perceivable. I don't know if it's to do with my particular copies but perhaps "Dalla" is not the most hi fi record of his, though as I said I might be wrong.
Anyhow I think if you think it sounds better than the Vinyl and the CD you shouldn't be too bummed out, in the end is a great album and now you have the best copy of it on the market.
Yes, it's better, but for the price it's just not worth it. Other editions on r2r that I have blow me out of the water they are so much better!
@@anadialog I'm sorry to hear, as I said it might be that the original master in this case isn't that spectacular to begin with, or that the pressing is really good and therefore there's very marginal differences.
From my end, just listening on a very good quality Hi Fi sound bar: #1 sound quality is the tape, followed closely at #2in sound quality by the CD and in #3 is the LP. My experience is that a master tape copy always wins against any other format. Even when a tape is transferred "as is" to a digital medium it usually wins out .
Thanks for the comparisons.
And salutations from Canada my Italian brother! 🥳
This video already debunk your claim, tape better than lp.
@@user-jn9dl9px6r Only if the tape is no longer in pristine condition, because tapes deteriorate over time...
Hi, I thought 1 was richer sound then 2 and 3, maybe I’m getting used to the sound of vinyl more and not as familiar or forgot the sound of tapes.
I actually liked the CD as the best. Tape second. LP third so go figure! Just to be clear, this is as presented in this video and through my MacBook Pro. So not exactly the best way possible. I may download the files and have a proper go with those through the main rig.
Cheers!
Oz
LTBS
The LP sounded best. The CD sounded second best, although I could hear a bit of harshness from the CD. The master tape was the worst of all. I too would be disappointed. Keep in mind that the tape may be a direct transfer with no mastering. LP's and CD have improvements added in general.
For me the CD sounded best ... the voice. But then there is the equipment I'm listening with), the equipment used to play the files on (your site) and at last our ears. So this is complex, but I agree that the tape does not stand out in any way.
If you put in the description of the video an index like this:
6:35 track 1
7:53 track 2
9:11 track 3
It is clickable. It is easier to skip to the tracks to do a comparison.
Yes, I always do that if you check my other similar videos. I had to edit and publish this while traveling. Completely forgot. Now solved. Thanks for pointing that out!
@@anadialog happy to help
For many people who don't have lp or cd playback gear anywhere near the quality of yours Guido, they might be really impressed by the sound of tapes such as this. It's all relative I guess. Sony didn't take you up on your offer. I wonder if DS Audio would let you review their top of the line light beam phono cartridge. It costs $60,000 the last I heard. It works without any magnets or coils. The bottom of the line light beam cartridge which costs under $3,000 has had reviews, I would say pretty good reviews. After the Mofi scandal, you would think Mofi would have changed to making analog instead of DSD copies of masters. I will say that my cd playback is sounding SO analog like these days. I keep working on it. The other day I greened the outer perimeter of a cd. It's like the last tiny vestiges of digital sound totally disappeared. Sweeter and more natural, less edge, more open. The last time I greened a cd, my system was not as good. It made the same kind of improvements; but by about 5% instead of the near 10% I heard the other day. What is it about tape that always seems to have warmth galore?
Could be...I would love to test one of them. I am surprised about the greening, people get they knives as soon as you mention that. If you like CDs and have time to optimize for a further 10% you should get the Auric illuminator (perhaps you already have it). Here is a video I made on CD tweaks: th-cam.com/video/8CTD6EgKG5s/w-d-xo.html
i new that no. 2 is the master tape! :-) the track 1 sound good. the cd track 3 sound afoul! little bass, a bit compressed. overall the master tape sound very good! don't be disappointed!
I like the second track a little more than the first, and I didn't like the third one at all (the stage is too narrow and there is not enough low frequencies).
I personally know the man who's behind this reissue operation. He is not a Sony employee but an external wealthy amateur and definitely mediocre technician. A lot of people here in Italy curse the day that they asked him to overhaul their Studers.
I am definitely not surprised that the result is mediocre as well.
I consider myself a gentleman and I did not want to use my channel to talk negatively about someone "because I can" but I can say that I know exactly who you are talking about since he did a disaster with one of my machines as well. Terrible rude person.
@@anadialog I have to be honest and say that, at first sight, I was very tempetd to buy this tape, expecially after the test published on a famous italian HiFi magazine, where it was played on a Studer A810.
Fortunately, when I found out who it was from, my base instincts chilled out.
The vinyl was distinct, but I thoght the second was the CD because it sounded more compressed. The third option sounded clearer (through TH-cam anyway).
May be the masterings were the differences, but a "Master Tape" shouldn't.
I bet if they bring you out the original copy from the vault, you all still not be happy, LOL!
What a surprise I must say. For me order is CD, vinyl and tape . The tape just sounds very flat in my ears. Really disappointing indeed, but big thanks to you to save us all the 450 euro we would have spent 😀
Love your channel, keep up the good work!
Thanks Daan!
Oof. My ranking best to worst was 3-1-2. I was shocked to find #2 was the master tape.
I really appreciate that you do these blind tests, when so many others just tell us their opinion and we are forced to use our imagination if we would agree or not.
Hello Sir, I did found the Tape being more detailed than the LP and CD. Not sure if it should be more than that though. Always fun those comparison. Can you recommend some other Italian artist you like, I need some gift for my Italian dad. Thank you
I am planning to do a dedicated video! Can't go wrong with DeAndre, Battiato or early Branduardi.
I couldn’t really tell a difference…but I like the song! Too bad Lucio didn’t break here in America with the track as is…or at all.
My blind preference was Track 2, then 1, and finally 3. To my ear track 3 (CD) was substantially inferior to the other two. Vinyl and tape were close but I immediately noticed more details in the lower registers on track 2. Definitely enjoy the blind tests, unfortunately I didn’t use my main listening system, so that deserves an asterisk, but I’ll try it that way next time. Interesting to consider how one can judge analog audio quality via a compressed audio TH-cam stream. I’m sure we can’t appreciate all the subtlety but some differences do seem to remain. Enjoying your content.
You have your numbers mixed up and you might have meant superior not inferior? either way your numbers are jumbled
No I guess you just misunderstood my words. In the first sentence I said my preference was 2, which is tape, then 1 (vinyl) and finally (inferior) the lowest preference is track 3. So it does say what I intended. Thanks
Ohhh yes sorry...i thought you kep changing your mind and settled on 3 (cd) lol
Thanks! :-)
Interesting. On the iPad, the differences were evident. I’d have rated them 2, 3 then 1. 1 sounded too hot, 2 was smoothest. Old ears, TH-cam and cheaper equipment…. What cartridge was used when playing the LP?
The Pure Fidelity Stratos I recently reviewed
I was looking at the link below the video. Has Sony Italia stopped producing the Legacy master tapes? I can't find them anymore
Omg! You're right! I haven't noticed it. I am afraid the video gave them the coupe de grace!
Funny, I thought, listening to the clips via the TV speaker: I preferred no2, but it was very close. And indeed, I wondered whether that was all tape could do... (I only have streaming, vinyl, minidisc and cassette in use).
The Reels maybe sexy as someone else commented but in this case the LP sounded much better. It was more open, had better instrument separation, sounded more live. The Reel was muffled. I bet you are quite disappointed, more then you led on I suspect. I too would be disappointed especially because of the cost of the reel.
☹️
Track 2 was the best for my ears, followed by track 1 and track 3. As soon I listened to the second track, I felt that this was a tape, and I liked the tape's unique delicacy. Of course, listening to TH-cam directly on the iPad may not be accurate.
Yep, even listening on TH-cam (I didn't bother this time to download the lossless versions) and through my secondary system, to me it was very clear that the 2nd file you played did not have any where near the dynamics or the sound extension of the 1st or 3rd one. Interestingly, I found when the piano came in more strongly in the intro, the CD or 3rd file actually had a bit more punch, a bit of a surprise. But, yes, the reel to reel was by far the inferior copy. Sorry you put out the money for it Bro 😕 But, by contrast, the one you did a video one previously from the Italian company, wow, that one you could hear the excellent quality. I was actually quite surprised by that one.
Thanks for sharing your analysis! The CD has some emphasis on the higher notes that some like and some dislike...I find it also a little dry but overall is quite good.
The CD sounds best, ar least in my sistem. I was surprised the tape was the worst sounding as it normaly should sound the best. In 1980 the CD wasn't comercial yet, so this album must have been recorded in tape in the studio. The LP and CD were produced based on the original tape. They should sound less good then the LP and CD. The only way a "master tape copy" când sound worse then the other media, is by using a worse copy as a working copy to multiply.
I think the tape is clearly better, the vinil is bit dull, the cd lacks resolution but hides it with powerful presentation, the tape has good start stop and natural clean dynamics, also more resolving power.
Hi, relevant to my opinion is not only the cost of the medium itself, but also the cost of the reproducing front end. Could you give us a comparison?
A reasonable request. Who follows me knows but I understand.
R2R: Studer A810
LP: Kuzma Staby R table with 4point 9 arm and currently using the Stratos cart I recently reviewed fed into the Audirorium 23 hommage step-up transformer which then goes on an Audia Flight FL phono preamp.
CD: I bit-perfect ripped the file.
All fed to my Mastersound Spettro preamp and then recaptured (analog signals) with my Blacklion Revolution soundcard (nothing amazing but decent). Cables are all OCC copper or OCC silver.
@@anadialog Thank you for the info. It is remarkable that, to achieve the results you recorded, the front end investments vary from almost nothing to 25k€! If you take this in account, the digital files have an unbeatable performance to price ratio!
(Don’t get me wrong, I’m a vinyl lover myself, too)
@@epaminondasgaveras8717 I see your point! But I think it's actually a proof that all versions are at their limit, the same limit. If "more" was on the LP and tape it would have came out.
Thanks for introducing Lucio Dalla, the album “Dalla” oozes the 1980’s. Being Dutch I cannot understand a word, but the compositions and voice is beautiful. Going to order the CD and make my own copy on a B77.
Glad to hear that!
I'd love to hear in a studio the difference between the Master, Working Copy and the Final Tape. Seems to me flat would be better for an audiophile version because if they made it louder at all audiophiles wouldn't like it as much.
Unless you meant flat pitch. I was thinking you meant flat EQ.
Yes of courses! We don't want eq. Flat I mean no depth and soundstage and homogeneous dynamics (pitch as you said)
Grazie Guido, è stato un video molto interessante davvero, ma ormai il tuo canale è sempre una garanzia! Meno male che almeno in Italia non c'è stato blocco Copyright
Grazie! Blocco no ma come sempre perdo tutta la monetizzazione...ma va bene così
Why can't you hear the rustle of the stylus on the LP version?
Because the LP is in great condition and my system is up to it...but it's rare.
@@anadialog Thank you for the response.
I have the feeling that the tape was recorded from digital, a lossy one, it has more basse, but on the high frequency range it sucks...
I preferred the tape, followed by the CD. The main differences seemed to be in the kick drum and the bass guitar.
Thanks for the nice test! I played the files trough my Mytek Brooklyn, and the cd was the most dynamic. This is also visible when opened in Sound Studio. On Tidal the album is available in MQA 24bit 44.1khz , but I wonder what the source is? According the album art, it is the cd. What cartridge and preamp was used on the turntable?
Thank YOU! The Stratos recently reviewed, an amazing cart, with yhe Auditorium 23 hommage step-up transformer with a Audia Flight FL phono preamp.
Not all tape recorders sounds good. In my opinion last good sounding studers was A80 & B62. A800 series has very flat and simlified percussion and brass sounds, so for good copy better use A80 or B62. And even better - to use external tube play (and record) electronics without feedback.
FYI - there's a blip in the recording at the 00:00:10.664 mark. Most noticeable on the CD and vinyl version but also present on the tape too.
Interesting
My order was Tape LP and CD so I was surprised by that
For me, number 3 is the best you say it is the CD ! Wow
Clearly the second sounded much better. The third has some ringing at the back. Listening from tablet and headphones.
Did i win something? I guessed it all!! Naturally by a listening via YT there is a certain tolerance but the feeling i had it’s that the CD AAD it’s a winwin facing the other two cause it has the original analog sound but more fresh and fast, but the sensation i had about the second it’s kind of boxer sound in the middle frequencies, lows similar, not better than vinyl, high near to the Cd version, first listening not deep and concentrate. Nice the reels but at that price i would get a higher performance.
Oh this brought back memories my sister brought his albums back from Italy after being there for a year. We wore them out!
I did guess the tape. It was the bass that gave it away. Could your disappointment come from the others being so good that the tape copy is unable to wow you as expected?
Could be, but as I mentioned any inherent case I recall, when you get a copy of a copy of the source the jump is nothing less than huge.
perhaps would compare with the oldest source with the recording, for example on vinyl
I did! The video includes a comparison with the original LP and old CD!
Being English I don't know much about Italian popular music but I discovered Stadio a few years ago and there are similarities with Lucio Dalla in the vocal sound.. is there any link between the two?
Several! They supported Lucio in several tours and the musicians played with Lucio a lot.
What I am interested to hear is Premiata Forniera Marconi. I read in an article of Steve Stevens in Guitar World recommending this band.
Indeed. Storia di un minuto is very good. Italian Prog Rock is among the best out there. I am afraid we are better off with a good LP version though....but you never know. If Sony wants to convince me they just need to send some tapes for evaluation.
@@anadialog I hope to gain access to those recordings here in our country. A lot of stuff that is so common in US and Europe is quite a challenge to find here in the Philippines.
So, let's see: Sony could have made a digital copy of the true master tape and released it on cd. The price of the cd would have been perhaps 10€. To most audiophile listeners the cd would have sounded identical to the original master. Perhaps the cd in this video was it? But what we have here are third generation analog copies of the original, each analog generation adding noise and distortion inherent in any analog technology. And we are supposed to pay 45 times more money for it. What am I getting wrong?
I agree, LP and CD all day long...
Blind test on my hifi:
First choice was #2
Second choice was #1
You should simply ask Sony Music if the tape is from an analog master or if it is from a digital copy. An interview with the person responsible for publication perhaps
They have already stated that it is from analog and apart from that, after my video (and other people complaining) they closed the production!
Bummer. Ha ha, i am trying to fix my old reel to reel, but it does not take ten inches, only seven, i would be happy if i can make it work again, and tape my vinyls. Then i would probably share my paternal grandfathers shared hobbies, sadly he passed away, years ago, when i was kid. He had only like mine. 😢❤
Excelente video, seria bueno que dijeras en que tocadiscos y con que capsula se reprodujo el disco de vinyl igual con el Reel to Reel y el CD Player. Yo se se que posees muy buenos equipos. A mi también me parece así, los primeros CD que salieron sonaban mucho mejor, que las versiones mas nuevas.
A reasonable request. Who follows me knows but I understand.
R2R: Studer A810
LP: Kuzma Staby R table with 4point 9 tonearm and currently using the Stratos cart I recently reviewed fed into the Audirorium 23 hommage step-up transformer which then goes on an Audia Flight FL phono preamp.
Speakers: GoldenEar Triton Reference
CD: I bit-perfect ripped the file.
All fed to my Mastersound Spettro preamp and then recaptured (analog signals) with my Blacklion Revolution soundcard (nothing amazing but decent). Cables are all OCC copper or OCC silver.
These are the main elements tied to the tape.
@@anadialog Yo te sigo desde hace algún tiempo, soy fanático de los Deck, y te ubique cuando hiciste el review del Nakamichi Dragon y el Revox B215, también soy fanático de los tocadiscos, no me gustan mucho los CD. Pero si tengo mis cuantos discos. Gracias por tu respuesta. Gran canal.
It seems these tapes are only available in Italy. From the US, where I am, I can{t reach the Sony Italy website...pity.
Yes. But you can use a VPN, there are also free versions if you hunt...but I don't recommend the purchase. Other people who bought other tapes told me they are even worse.
@@anadialog yes, but I don't think they ship to the US. Anyway, I'm just curious about the PFM edition. Those records have a great sound! Thanks, and please keep posting these videos.
A modern DAC and a well mastered digital source will do it all. Physical media are for pleasure, but won't guarantee any better sound quality. Just record your own tape on a reel-to-reel, and you'll save 400$...
i prefered the n2,sorry ...take care buddy!
Me too, but not as much as it should be.
Funny thing the 3 rd track started my foot tapping and I started to enjoy the track any more detail is for me not required to enjoy the music so don`t get obsessed with "detail " it is a trap thanks for making this vid! Yes non remastered CD´s sound very good . I thought that all Sony master tapes are stored as DSD files now are they trying to squeeze the last money out of their written of copy masters?
🤷♂️
CD slightly louder, otherwise not much difference, I imagine the CD is the cheapest, thats fine with me, (sennheiser 650s used)
The vinyl sounded best to me (headphones, at 2160p). The CD second best.
How do you keep these tapes stored?
One of the things that I'm afraid of with jumping back to cassettes and tapes is past experience with them being so sensitive to environment conditions that I had a whole lot of them unplayable years ago. Reading on google, it seems that in good conditions they should last about 30 years but can at any point become unplayable. What do you do to mitigate this in a home environment?
You must avoid moisture and clearly extreme temperatures. That it is why it's a good idea to keep them in plastic bags IF they don't present any problems, otherwise they will get worse. 30 years? The tape of the 50's are perfect!
i didint guess quite right , 1-for me was best (was thinking its cd), 2 - i know it its tape i had no doubt it was worst from all 3 , 3- i was thinking its viyl , i had my doubt 1 and 3 , i lisen to song again and in my mind i told myself ,1cd,2tape,3vinyl , but was wrong switched cd and vinyl with places, u think u can make your own copy from that vinyl or flac of this song on lpr 90 and it will dound better , that this ''master tape''
Thank you, always great to hear your thoughts on everything your review and discuss.
you didnt say what gear your system is made up of, what deck did you play it on? what is your Amp/pre amp etc?
A reasonable request. Who follows me knows but I understand.
R2R: Studer A810
LP: Kuzma Staby R table with 4point 9 tonearm and currently using the Stratos cart I recently reviewed fed into the Audirorium 23 hommage step-up transformer which then goes on an Audia Flight FL phono preamp.
Speakers: GoldenEar Triton Reference
CD: I bit-perfect ripped the file.
All fed to my Mastersound Spettro preamp and then recaptured (analog signals) with my Blacklion Revolution soundcard (nothing amazing but decent). Cables are all OCC copper or OCC silver.
These are the main elements tied to the tape.
Bit of an off topic question but i was wondering if you had any idea where i could order parts for my r2r from, I got an old grundig tk-41 and well the rubber drive wheel i think it's called decided to crumble so yeah lol.
Would be great to have another one to get this machine running
Hard to say ,plus I live in Italy so my labs and people are more local but in any case it's hard to find replacements of lesser known models. Labs (good ones) have more chances.
HERE TO SUPPORT YOUR CHANNEL,GUIDO 👍🤗💚💚💚
Thanks ad always but I hope you truly enjoy the content!
@@anadialog 🤗👍MOST OF IT …not everything is in my budget 😁💚💚💚
Right. Listening only on YT I heard this slight advantage of the Reel. Than I would choose the CD over the LP. But you are absolutely right. 450 Euro? Sadly, doesn’t seem to be worth the afford.
BUT!!!! "Dalla" is great !
Give a try to battisti, to me is a superior experience and definitively the best edition of il mio canto libero.
👍
Track 2 was a tape in my mind, on the end it was true, best sound is on tape, track 3 was a CD in my ears. CD is some how to loud...
It's funny because everyone is saying that the CD is louder while I normalized the perceived loudness, which means that the treble is a little to emphasized
what do they mean when they say tape is tensilized?
I think it's referred to scotch tape
If this spool is a flat transfer then it's going to sound close to the cd esp a cd of that era that would have been taken from the same source the duplication tape for the cd is probably 1 fro the master maybe 2 depending on where the cd was encoded and pressed. An unmastered tape will sound flat compared to a mastered album that you would have been used to. The bottom like here is that 450 euros on a tape Sounds no different to a 10 euro cd. Save your money is the moral of this story. Who knows the person dubbing the tape might just be using a cd and not telling anyone. I mean nobody noticed mfsl were using digital masters until it got out :)
Yes, several are saying this bit in my experience a goodbtape copy is very different not just better, and much more dynamic. MOFI? May be a coincidence but I have around 6 or 7 lps and most of those are old. I just don't like MOFI's sound. Nevertheless, a quality digital copy can be amazing. I have no problems in stating that especially if a flat trasfer as you correctly pointed out.
I though the best track was the last. I only heard once. Maybe the cd plays better on a digital platform like TH-cam. I honestly don’t see the advantages of R2R but in any case if you pay 450 dollars for “audiophile” material it should sound at least! as good as 45 rpm audiophile vinyl. Also if it’s only 3rd gen from the master it shouldn’t cost that much IMO. What’s so hard in coping a tape ? Cheers
I can only add that, as others have pointed out, when doing copies that always use a working copy so they minimize the wear on the original and it makes sense for preservation.
Thanks for this review
Thank YOU
to me clearly the vinyl sounded the worst by far. Saying that, i couldn't tell the difference between the cd and the tape, so... cd is the best in test considering the price, i guess. Interesting test though.
No 2 is very good. LP is very disappointing. Balla Balla.
I agree with you. The trackk number 2 - from tape - is quit poor. I hear that clearly. :/
Maybe it's because it's from a digital source? the risk is there because someone at Sony Music thought that there is no difference in the sound of analogue or digital. Such thinking can have consequences
Could be!
I've picked tracks 1, 3 and 2. Too much nitpicking, too much hair splitting. For the "actual" sonic difference on these 3 sources, the CD is enough. C'mon, 450 euros for something just as good (or insignificantly better), it's a non-brainer. In these situations, making some charity, help other people out or help the animals will make you feel a whole lot better.
Charity aside, that is the point of the video
Awesome video 👍
I like the number 3 the most
This launch made me think: if there is still production of magnetic tapes of this size then is it also possible to produce blank compact cassette tapes?
Greetings from Seoul, Tito
Questo lancio mi ha fatto pensare: se c'è ancora la produzione di nastri magnetici di queste dimensioni allora è possibile produrre anche cassette compatte vergini?
Yes there is and of very high quality by Recording the Masters, tape snd cassette.