🚀 Do you want help finishing Infinite Jest? Or want a complete guide to follow while reading? Join my Infinite Jest Course and Book Club here: writeconscious.substack.com 📚 Explore over 400 of Wallace’s favorite books in my free guide to his favorite books Access here: writeconscious.ck.page/8956ce90fc 📖 Want to WRITE better? Join my free writing school: www.skool.com/writeconscious Insta: instagram.com/writeconscious 📕My Best Books of All-Time List: writeconscious.ck.page/355619345e 🔥Want to READ my wife’s fire poetry? Go here: marigoldeclipse.substack.com 🤔David Foster Wallace’s Favorite Book on Writing amzn.to/4eVmjAI
00:01 Writing is a communication to another human being 01:54 Authors must build trust with readers to engage them in their work. 03:35 Consider the reader's perspective and engagement while writing. 05:15 Writing for the average reader requires proper accommodations 06:45 Authors in literary fiction aim to emotionally engage the audience. 08:28 Include symbolism but don't make it a major part of the story. 10:07 Focus on revising with slight changes to enhance creativity. 11:40 Finding inspiration from everyday experiences can lead to effortless storytelling.
Being pretentious is only the greatest crime because it is failure of an attempt of being relatable, what a fine line the writer has to dance. Great video as always!
Nothing is so terrible as a pretentious movie. The filmmaker's greatest horror is to be pretentious. So here you are on one hand trying to aspire to really do something, and on the other hand you're not allowed to be pretentious. And finally you say Fuck it! I don't care if I'm pretentious or not pretentious or I've done it or I haven't done it. All I know is that I am going to see this movie and for me it has to have some answers and by answers I don't mean just a punchline. I mean answers on about 47 different levels. And it's very hard to talk about these things without being very corny - Francis Ford Coppola [while making Apocalypse Now]
Wonderful work, as always. This is not meant as pressure, but I eagerly await the day I can read a novel written by yourself. I am so curious what kind of story you'll have for us, and what kind of approach you'll choose.
Poetry books will be released sooner than novels. Probably 3-5 more years for a novel as I don't feel any pressure in terms of time to finish! But, it will be a psychedelic southwestern novel set in 1910 Tucson!
@@WriteConscious Poetry is difficult for me. I feel like I don't understand the form, or forms. The prettiness of Byron's verse totally works for me, but I know I am in need of education.
I do a movie history podcast and for that reason, I try to always keep that rule in mind, When I don't, I end up having to rewrite during the recording stage, which interrupts things. By following this rule, I now do a more thorough proofreading than I had when I was younger.
Really nice video. I heard that quote before, but I'm not sure when or where. It's great wisdom to keep in mind. Yeah I think it's always important to imagine someone else reading your work. I have friends who read drafts of my stories and scripts I'm writing to get feedback. It's great to know if something is not working, or if the whole thing is resonating. But I also believe that they need to be people you trust who will be honest about both the bad and good. I had one of my best friends read my script for a short film, and he told me it was the best thing he had read of mine. And it was only about 5.5 pages at the time. I was blown away because I didn't really have much thought on it either way. So it was nice to know that something that just flowed, and came out without too much thought, was actually working. I truly believe that trying to write in a trance-like state, as George Martin says, is the best approach to writing. You try to get into a groove until you're not thinking so much as the story is living in your mind, and you're transcribing it as it happens. Which is a topic Stephen King talks about in his book "On Writing." Great stuff.
I would say that this applies quite a bit more to the 2nd and 3rd drafts. The first draft is expressing the concept in as raw a form as possible, the following drafts translate it for an audience.
My motto: write first and foremost for yourself, edit & revise with an audience in mind. I believe it allows the passion to really shine through in the writing.
Hey, Ian. Another great vid! Would you consider doing a video recommending your favorite writing guides? Would love to hear which ones you think are worth buying
Anyone else feel this advice is hard to take coming from DFW? I agree with it, and while some pieces I’ve read from him are at a master level, a lot of what I’ve experienced reads like a court transcription. I’ve got nothing against a learning curve with certain writers but DFW seems less considerate of his audience than most.
For sure. Even The Broom of the System has the hospital forms of new characters (who have almost zero relationship to the plot) 200 pages in. Like, WTF.
Iam, first time caller... I thoroughly enjoy your videos. I am ashamed to admit that I went these last 61 years before being introduced to who David Foster Wallace is and appreciate how you bring his insights and yours to us. Though I have done a lot of writing, I have just recently decided to put my thoughts and stories into a publishable form, so forgive me if this is a naive or stupid question from a neophyte. Can you explain to me if this first rule from David is in contrast with Hemingway's Iceberg Theory, am I missing the fine line one should walk between the two philosophies, or am I just uninformed and misunderstanding disparate concepts? Thank you in advance. My friends call me Sluggo. You may as well.
They work hand in hand. Hemingway's iceberg theory is just a rejection of interiority. Hemingway is a clear writer, however, and even without characters thoughts, he is following the first rule most of the time. He understands his novel is a communication to the reader.
The first point is the most difficult to master, I'm allergic to exposition in anything, its quite patronising and I find most modern writing full of it. The flipside of that is when I'm writing it's hard to know what the reader can surmise themselves and what needs to be more explicit.
Great point. And the flip side may be true as well. Don't share everything in your mind. This is the reason why I put down The Fellowship Of The Rings and still 50 years later have not read the series other than The Hobbit. So many passages seemed like a rabbit trail of back story which halted the story from moving forward. I'm not trying to troll Tolkien fans. If you enjoyed this aspect of his writing I'm happy for you. I just found it frustrating.
Does anyone else prefer the shorter fiction of writers like Wallace and Pynchon? Especially DFW, I've tried to read Infinite Jest but I'm so bored right from the beginning, but when I read his short stories he hooks me within a paragraph if not the first few words.
Your words on grammar resonate. I'm a selfpubber, and I feel my grammar, i.e. punctuation, is good to pretty good, but my reedsy/fiverr editors didn't think so. Much of my work was going through my manuscript trying to square my punctuation with my editors'. That's okay b/c it made me look real close at my work. I hate it when people say they have an ideal reader in their mind like their damn wife or child. Because we don't. We only write for ourselves b/c we're in our own heads. Anything else is stupid sentimentalism. However "your reader is not a mind reader" is a something to remember.
the interesting thing about rules is that someone else came up with them. so, where was the rule before that? rules are guidelines - not absolutes: 'don't get stuck in someone else's cul-de-sac.' that should be a good rule. 😉
McCarthy spent a ton of time revising and when you read the letters with his editor he had the reader in mind. They toiled (funny fact, McCarthy almost called The Orchard Keeper "Toilers at the Kiln" lol) sometimes for years about how to present certain information. He just had very high expectations for his readers until he pivoted with the Border Trilogy lol
Umberto Eco--'nuff said. Now that that's out of the way, here are a few book recommendations: Umberto Eco (non-fiction): The Role of the Reader. Robert Graves & Alan Hodge: The Reader over Your Shoulder. Stanley Fish: How to Write a Sentence (& How to Read One) I prefer books I have to work at, ones that don't tell me everything, expecting me to discover the link between all the pieces that are being laid out. Give me some ambiguity in a novel, as though the steam & smoke from a train at a station is obfuscating some of the words on the page. Grammar in fiction should be used to control the readers' pace & attention, thus long, highly subordinated sentences slowing the reader, making them work to figure out what action, done by who to whom, in thought provoking loops that will expose the interiority of the characters. Short ones are fast. Racing forward! And then. And then. Each should be used according to the rhythm of the scene. Dashiell Hammett's works are almost all dialogue, which makes for a very fast read. Thomas Mann's Magic Mountain is diametrically opposed. Use both in their proper places to propel the reader forward & then reel them back in.
Would you really not support me writing under a pseudonym if the writing was compelling? And I must say that Kierkegaard wrote under a pseudonym for some time--and actually used multiple. If my language does not communicate my sincerity and trustworthiness, I have failed. And knowledge of my name would not remedy this failure.
I would support you, but tell me and everyone else what you're scared of? Who are you scared of? Mom? Your Boss? Wife? Fame? No one will care lol. You won't be killed. Most likely only a couple thousand of people will buy your book if you are in the top 3%. You aren't Kierkegaard and we live in a time where you can write almost anything and won't be cancelled over it. And if your job or social circle will cancel you it's time to leave those toxic relationships/situation. If you make it big dawg, am I going to interview you with a voice changer?? Are you going to be wearing a mask on the show 🤣
@@WriteConscious Maybe I'm paranoid. I'm not saying I'm Kierkegaard, but I don't get why it's so important to reveal yourself. The writing is what matters--that's what you're interacting with. What does it matter who I am?
@@WriteConscious As you highlight, Wallace said: "the reader cannot read your mind." We cannot sit with the reader and explain ourselves either. Even if your writing is made painstakingly clear and direct by you, there will be readers who misunderstand you. Maybe I am afraid of being misunderstood. Maybe I am afraid of losing anonymity. Maybe I should let go. I'm just not very interested in personal attention. I appreciate the dialogue on writing--that's what I'm interested in.
I'm still asking who are you scared of? There has to be a psychological reason you are scared to stand behind your work. I think the whole you're letting them focus on the work is a weak excuse. Sounds like you're scared to stand beside your work if it fails. You aren't going to be some famous author like Stephen King. No one is showing up at Neal Stephenson's house or William T Vollman's house and harassing them. Little to no one outside of niche circles is probing into their lives. No one is going to lose the meaning of your book with your biographical details when it most likely will never sell more than 5000 copies. Maybe 100 authors have the power behind them to warrant that type of personal attention. And, you can be like McCarthy or Wallace and avoid the attention entirely by just not engaging with modern media. Even if you sold 1 million copies of a book, it will be rare for people to stop you in public.
@@WriteConscious No you're misunderstanding me man. I'm not afraid to stand behind my work, but why should I forsake my privacy? Just because you are comfortable being on TH-cam doesn't mean everyone has to go that route. I don't expect to draw a bunch of attention anyway--I hear you, I'm not proclaiming my genius and acting like once I reveal myself I'll shoot to superstardom--I'm not that naive or conceited. I'm not a fiction writer--the things I write aren't gonna reach a mass audience anyway. If you think I'm making excuses--so be it. That's not my view. Just because I don't want to put my face all over the internet shouldn't be viewed as an excuse. But you're entitled to view it as you will.
(Tug's forelock) Ooh arr. Excuse me, your worship. Just a lowly genre writer who invaded your ivory tower by happenstance. Won't happen again, I'm sure.
Lol, genre writers are who need writing tips from literary fiction the most. Just as literary fiction authors need the ambition, world-building, and characterization skills that genre writers have more than anything else.
I was just editing a scene and had this exact epiphany. There are pivot points where the reader needs a little clue, a little extra sumn. ALSO HI CRYPTONOMICON DID YOU STEAL MY COPY, IAN? BC I CANT FIND IT. AND I LIKED THAT VELLUM WRAP.
🚀 Do you want help finishing Infinite Jest? Or want a complete guide to follow while reading?
Join my Infinite Jest Course and Book Club here: writeconscious.substack.com
📚 Explore over 400 of Wallace’s favorite books in my free guide to his favorite books
Access here: writeconscious.ck.page/8956ce90fc
📖 Want to WRITE better? Join my free writing school: www.skool.com/writeconscious
Insta: instagram.com/writeconscious
📕My Best Books of All-Time List: writeconscious.ck.page/355619345e
🔥Want to READ my wife’s fire poetry? Go here: marigoldeclipse.substack.com
🤔David Foster Wallace’s Favorite Book on Writing amzn.to/4eVmjAI
00:01 Writing is a communication to another human being
01:54 Authors must build trust with readers to engage them in their work.
03:35 Consider the reader's perspective and engagement while writing.
05:15 Writing for the average reader requires proper accommodations
06:45 Authors in literary fiction aim to emotionally engage the audience.
08:28 Include symbolism but don't make it a major part of the story.
10:07 Focus on revising with slight changes to enhance creativity.
11:40 Finding inspiration from everyday experiences can lead to effortless storytelling.
Being pretentious is only the greatest crime because it is failure of an attempt of being relatable, what a fine line the writer has to dance. Great video as always!
Thanks brotha!
Nothing is so terrible as a pretentious movie. The filmmaker's greatest horror is to be pretentious. So here you are on one hand trying to aspire to really do something, and on the other hand you're not allowed to be pretentious. And finally you say Fuck it! I don't care if I'm pretentious or not pretentious or I've done it or I haven't done it. All I know is that I am going to see this movie and for me it has to have some answers and by answers I don't mean just a punchline. I mean answers on about 47 different levels. And it's very hard to talk about these things without being very corny
- Francis Ford Coppola [while making Apocalypse Now]
@@Ruylopez778 Love that!
Keep up the good work, Ian. I'm a novelist who writes under a pen name, and I learn something new from each of your videos. Thank you.
Thanks brotha!
This was killer brother. Hope you do a lot more videos like this one.
Thanks!
I love your videos, man! Keep up the good work! 🙏
Wonderful work, as always. This is not meant as pressure, but I eagerly await the day I can read a novel written by yourself. I am so curious what kind of story you'll have for us, and what kind of approach you'll choose.
Poetry books will be released sooner than novels. Probably 3-5 more years for a novel as I don't feel any pressure in terms of time to finish! But, it will be a psychedelic southwestern novel set in 1910 Tucson!
@@WriteConscious Poetry is difficult for me. I feel like I don't understand the form, or forms. The prettiness of Byron's verse totally works for me, but I know I am in need of education.
I do a movie history podcast and for that reason, I try to always keep that rule in mind, When I don't, I end up having to rewrite during the recording stage, which interrupts things. By following this rule, I now do a more thorough proofreading than I had when I was younger.
Really nice video. I heard that quote before, but I'm not sure when or where. It's great wisdom to keep in mind.
Yeah I think it's always important to imagine someone else reading your work. I have friends who read drafts of my stories and scripts I'm writing to get feedback.
It's great to know if something is not working, or if the whole thing is resonating. But I also believe that they need to be people you trust who will be honest about both the bad and good.
I had one of my best friends read my script for a short film, and he told me it was the best thing he had read of mine. And it was only about 5.5 pages at the time.
I was blown away because I didn't really have much thought on it either way. So it was nice to know that something that just flowed, and came out without too much thought, was actually working.
I truly believe that trying to write in a trance-like state, as George Martin says, is the best approach to writing.
You try to get into a groove until you're not thinking so much as the story is living in your mind, and you're transcribing it as it happens. Which is a topic Stephen King talks about in his book "On Writing."
Great stuff.
I would say that this applies quite a bit more to the 2nd and 3rd drafts. The first draft is expressing the concept in as raw a form as possible, the following drafts translate it for an audience.
My motto: write first and foremost for yourself, edit & revise with an audience in mind. I believe it allows the passion to really shine through in the writing.
Hey, Ian. Another great vid! Would you consider doing a video recommending your favorite writing guides? Would love to hear which ones you think are worth buying
Anyone else feel this advice is hard to take coming from DFW? I agree with it, and while some pieces I’ve read from him are at a master level, a lot of what I’ve experienced reads like a court transcription. I’ve got nothing against a learning curve with certain writers but DFW seems less considerate of his audience than most.
For sure. Even The Broom of the System has the hospital forms of new characters (who have almost zero relationship to the plot) 200 pages in. Like, WTF.
Iam, first time caller...
I thoroughly enjoy your videos.
I am ashamed to admit that I went these last 61 years before being introduced to who David Foster Wallace is and appreciate how you bring his insights and yours to us.
Though I have done a lot of writing, I have just recently decided to put my thoughts and stories into a publishable form, so forgive me if this is a naive or stupid question from a neophyte.
Can you explain to me if this first rule from David is in contrast with Hemingway's Iceberg Theory, am I missing the fine line one should walk between the two philosophies, or am I just uninformed and misunderstanding disparate concepts?
Thank you in advance.
My friends call me Sluggo. You may as well.
*Ian, my bad. These old eyes and fat thumbs don' twork well on my phone. My apologies!
They work hand in hand. Hemingway's iceberg theory is just a rejection of interiority. Hemingway is a clear writer, however, and even without characters thoughts, he is following the first rule most of the time. He understands his novel is a communication to the reader.
@@WriteConscious thank you for the speedy and concise response.
The first point is the most difficult to master, I'm allergic to exposition in anything, its quite patronising and I find most modern writing full of it. The flipside of that is when I'm writing it's hard to know what the reader can surmise themselves and what needs to be more explicit.
Great point. And the flip side may be true as well. Don't share everything in your mind. This is the reason why I put down The Fellowship Of The Rings and still 50 years later have not read the series other than The Hobbit. So many passages seemed like a rabbit trail of back story which halted the story from moving forward. I'm not trying to troll Tolkien fans. If you enjoyed this aspect of his writing I'm happy for you. I just found it frustrating.
New Sub, Great Vid!
do you teach classes like how to write a fiction?
Does anyone else prefer the shorter fiction of writers like Wallace and Pynchon? Especially DFW, I've tried to read Infinite Jest but I'm so bored right from the beginning, but when I read his short stories he hooks me within a paragraph if not the first few words.
Your words on grammar resonate. I'm a selfpubber, and I feel my grammar, i.e. punctuation, is good to pretty good, but my reedsy/fiverr editors didn't think so. Much of my work was going through my manuscript trying to square my punctuation with my editors'. That's okay b/c it made me look real close at my work.
I hate it when people say they have an ideal reader in their mind like their damn wife or child. Because we don't. We only write for ourselves b/c we're in our own heads. Anything else is stupid sentimentalism. However "your reader is not a mind reader" is a something to remember.
What's the rule?
Also if by crazyhorse you mean moulin rouge then yes we your viewers are part of that 10%
Cryptonomicon is awesome
Yes!
That book was trash
@@Birdsummit39 nope
the interesting thing about rules is that someone else came up with them. so, where was the rule before that? rules are guidelines - not absolutes: 'don't get stuck in someone else's cul-de-sac.' that should be a good rule. 😉
It's weird how much this guy looks like Wallace. Doppelganger level stuff
I don’t trust that tule after reading the Infinite Jest
Word up, ha ha...
Aspiring to be one of those strange hooded figures that inspire you to go home a write about it.
Sounds like the opposite of Cormac McCarthy
McCarthy spent a ton of time revising and when you read the letters with his editor he had the reader in mind. They toiled (funny fact, McCarthy almost called The Orchard Keeper "Toilers at the Kiln" lol) sometimes for years about how to present certain information. He just had very high expectations for his readers until he pivoted with the Border Trilogy lol
Umberto Eco--'nuff said.
Now that that's out of the way, here are a few book recommendations:
Umberto Eco (non-fiction): The Role of the Reader.
Robert Graves & Alan Hodge: The Reader over Your Shoulder.
Stanley Fish: How to Write a Sentence (& How to Read One)
I prefer books I have to work at, ones that don't tell me everything, expecting me to discover the link between all the pieces that are being laid out. Give me some ambiguity in a novel, as though the steam & smoke from a train at a station is obfuscating some of the words on the page. Grammar in fiction should be used to control the readers' pace & attention, thus long, highly subordinated sentences slowing the reader, making them work to figure out what action, done by who to whom, in thought provoking loops that will expose the interiority of the characters. Short ones are fast. Racing forward! And then. And then. Each should be used according to the rhythm of the scene. Dashiell Hammett's works are almost all dialogue, which makes for a very fast read. Thomas Mann's Magic Mountain is diametrically opposed. Use both in their proper places to propel the reader forward & then reel them back in.
Would you really not support me writing under a pseudonym if the writing was compelling? And I must say that Kierkegaard wrote under a pseudonym for some time--and actually used multiple. If my language does not communicate my sincerity and trustworthiness, I have failed. And knowledge of my name would not remedy this failure.
I would support you, but tell me and everyone else what you're scared of? Who are you scared of? Mom? Your Boss? Wife? Fame? No one will care lol. You won't be killed. Most likely only a couple thousand of people will buy your book if you are in the top 3%. You aren't Kierkegaard and we live in a time where you can write almost anything and won't be cancelled over it. And if your job or social circle will cancel you it's time to leave those toxic relationships/situation. If you make it big dawg, am I going to interview you with a voice changer?? Are you going to be wearing a mask on the show 🤣
@@WriteConscious Maybe I'm paranoid. I'm not saying I'm Kierkegaard, but I don't get why it's so important to reveal yourself. The writing is what matters--that's what you're interacting with. What does it matter who I am?
@@WriteConscious As you highlight, Wallace said: "the reader cannot read your mind." We cannot sit with the reader and explain ourselves either. Even if your writing is made painstakingly clear and direct by you, there will be readers who misunderstand you. Maybe I am afraid of being misunderstood. Maybe I am afraid of losing anonymity. Maybe I should let go. I'm just not very interested in personal attention. I appreciate the dialogue on writing--that's what I'm interested in.
I'm still asking who are you scared of? There has to be a psychological reason you are scared to stand behind your work. I think the whole you're letting them focus on the work is a weak excuse. Sounds like you're scared to stand beside your work if it fails. You aren't going to be some famous author like Stephen King. No one is showing up at Neal Stephenson's house or William T Vollman's house and harassing them. Little to no one outside of niche circles is probing into their lives. No one is going to lose the meaning of your book with your biographical details when it most likely will never sell more than 5000 copies. Maybe 100 authors have the power behind them to warrant that type of personal attention. And, you can be like McCarthy or Wallace and avoid the attention entirely by just not engaging with modern media. Even if you sold 1 million copies of a book, it will be rare for people to stop you in public.
@@WriteConscious No you're misunderstanding me man. I'm not afraid to stand behind my work, but why should I forsake my privacy? Just because you are comfortable being on TH-cam doesn't mean everyone has to go that route. I don't expect to draw a bunch of attention anyway--I hear you, I'm not proclaiming my genius and acting like once I reveal myself I'll shoot to superstardom--I'm not that naive or conceited. I'm not a fiction writer--the things I write aren't gonna reach a mass audience anyway. If you think I'm making excuses--so be it. That's not my view. Just because I don't want to put my face all over the internet shouldn't be viewed as an excuse. But you're entitled to view it as you will.
On your behalve i bought circle
(Tug's forelock) Ooh arr. Excuse me, your worship. Just a lowly genre writer who invaded your ivory tower by happenstance. Won't happen again, I'm sure.
Lol, genre writers are who need writing tips from literary fiction the most. Just as literary fiction authors need the ambition, world-building, and characterization skills that genre writers have more than anything else.
I was just editing a scene and had this exact epiphany. There are pivot points where the reader needs a little clue, a little extra sumn. ALSO HI CRYPTONOMICON DID YOU STEAL MY COPY, IAN? BC I CANT FIND IT. AND I LIKED THAT VELLUM WRAP.