I started playing Eve 2 days ago and today I was chased by a guy through 8 different systems in low sec (I started by being a industrial / miner) and it was one of the most thrilling experience of gameplay I had in like... a year lmao. And I know it's just the beggining, I already love this game and in a sense, i'm almost looking forward to see how I will lose my ship (I almost did) for the first time
Impressive you managed to survive! I lost my first ship after 10 minute sin low-sec mining kernite, then got a friendly message with a link to a d-scan youtube video :)
Agree with the whole video.. although i think saying playing solo is playing wrong isnt the case.. i only play solo and i absolutely love learning to succeed on my own. I love being the slippery explorer in all parts of volatile space
@@mjashmore1 I'm not entirely sure I agree there. It absolutely can be, for sure, but I think some of the most fun I've had PvPing are roams with my corp, Faction Warfare with a militia fleet, and hunting with Bombers Bar! That said, I've had some amazing solo experiences too. Point I'm getting at is that I don't think one or the other is better. I think they're both different, and naturally, some folks are going to end up preferring one over the other - which is fine! What's your proudest kill?
I’ve had the most fun flying together with a friend I made in game, that said 99% of my time is solo because I can’t dedicate the time that most corps require to be accepted. I may find opportunity to play for a week or month and then not play for several months due to irl demands. Starting the Cruzakh challenge has really reinvigorated my solo play style.
I think it’s similar to life, having no friends sucks, trying to be shallow friends with absolutely everyone is also a bad idea. Find your Eve group and make close friends that you truly enjoy doing things with.
Surviving a highsec gank 1 jump from Jita in my badger, with 2.5bil in my hold and only 15% hull left... gets my blood pumping like no other games and that alone makes EvE fun for me. I wouldn't even be mad if I had lost it since I got lucky and I was careless but it was fun to see those tornados get murdered to death by Concord XD.
You are right, it's basic economics, things explode and get more expensive. Also, yeah EVE is a PVP niche full loot hardcore game and should keep being that way. But I think many times when people are complaining about ganking they are not necessarily looking through that point of view or ignoring those very valid reasons that you are right about. (I also work in the games industry but I don't think that should weight on my reasoning being right or wrong, just consider my reasoning and not who I am) We can increase costs pulling many levers on the economy and we can make the game risky in many ways. The problem I see here is what levers and in what ways the game is 'dangerous'. Making transport more costly will make things cost more, sure, BASIC ECONOMICS. But it's also basic economics knowing that the effect of costly/risky transport is going to be freezing people and assets in certain areas making many parts of space more empty because moving ends up not being worth it or too much of a hassle. We can increase costs in other ways so players move and make the universe more populated, making the game better with better content and also making people who like pvp search for more interesting and challenging content instead of camping a gate and "mining salt". I think reducing any complaints about ganking as "waaaahh I am too bad! I like Sonic this game EVE is too hard for me", is making a bad faith simplification of a problem that is not so simple and easy to solve, proof of that is that we have many 10+ year veterans that still play and love EVE and are against ganking too. 'basic economics' is a term used frequently but economics is far from a simple subject and any change on any lever has a chain of effects that comes from it good and bad.
i see a lot of games run into these problems and im not sure why the PVP is so necessary as to punish the other parts of the game that people seem to want to play. i can sum this up pretty easily as i have for past games by just saying... "if they allow people to just avoid pvp too many will" notice this is something that doesnt apply to actual pvp games like mobas, arena, RTS games as everybody is there for pvp. this argument comes into play when some people are there for pvp and need to disallow anybody else to avoid it. the simple fact that if they allowed people to avoid pvp they would, means that more people are on my side of this. edit - they could have a specific area for pvp that way pvp is consensual...but for some reason the people who claim to love pvp are strongly against this. because they dont want pvp they want squash matches to laugh about in discord.
@@suzukisixk7 Exactly. I play mostly in WormHoles and I love EVE for 10+ years now. So this game is for me and I like the dangerous hardcore aspect of it. BUT at the same time I dislike ganking and I think it's bad for the game in general. Completely opting out of PVP might not be for EVE but I think at least some aspects of it could be tunned in for the health of the game.
@@spaceghost8891 ill start accepting arguments like in this video when EVE starts making youtube adds about gate camping.... until then everybody pretending thats a great part of the game is just self justifying
@@suzukisixk7 true, also when people justify it by saying the game should have risk and danger... what is the risk gankers have? Losing some catalysts? Please.
Back when Warhammer Online was still alive a guy would randomly join our team speak now and then and play up recorded snippets of EVE online players and then leave. We all got the impression that they must have been very special players in that game.
“Stop trying to solo EVE Online, this is not a solo game. Even if you’re a multi-boxer it is still better to have real people around you too … You are playing EVE wrong - if you want a solo online experience, EVE Online is not it.” 🤮 If I had an ISK for every time I’ve heard this! I’ve been playing EVE solo since 2013 (with some long breaks of course) and I love this game. There’s been absolutely nothing in EVE that I’ve ever wanted to do or accomplish that I haven’t been able to do because I was playing solo.
Also this: “These are Truths. I don’t want to hear like your opinion that I’m wrong about this. Because categorically - I know it sounds arrogant, I really know this sounds arrogant - but in this case it’s true. These aren’t opinions, right? If you disagree with any of these points, that’s not your opinion man, that’s just you being wrong.” Not arrogant at all! - just a wonderful example of misunderstanding truth, knowledge, facts, and opinions. You may be playing EVE “right,” but your epistemology is a train wreck! 🤣
Nah, I'm just spitting facts that people want to misinterpret or misunderstand ☺️ glad you're having fun, but being solo as a new player is a bad way to try and learn the game, and you're missing out on most of what makes EVE special. That said, if you're having fun, awesome, I'm genuinely glad that you've found your fun. But it's a very niche and difficult way to play that I would never recommend for a new player
@@captainbenzie Jesus, you're like a textbook delusional EVE player. "I am right, if you think I'm wrong, you're just dumb and wrong." It's like nullblock propaganda, but in youtube comments.
@@captainbenzie I totaly agree I would never recommend EvE for solo Players who want to start with a new game. But you can have fun at doing so. So if you ment “These are Truths. I don’t want to hear like your opinion that I’m wrong about this." only on the 3 main truths I would agree. But the solo vs multiplayer part is obviously an opinion and you CAN have a different opinion on that. All Games have ONE main purpose: to have FUN. It doesn't matter how you achieve this. But yes 90% or more of EvE is more fun to do in a group. But if you like the other 10% more and you are a solo Player, why not doing it?
Got eve in a box .and keep coming back. Probly spent 80% of my time solo if you can find a good Corp its grate but that's hard to do plus you can make isk faster solo
As a new playe, I set my sights on a sweet exploration ship. I mined for over a month to get the ISK to afford it, and I had to travel through low-sec to pick it up and fit it. On the eay back to my "home space" I was jumped and the brand new ship destroyed - and it wss the worst thing that ever happened to me. I logged off in rage and despair and couldn't bring myself to log on for days after. But after awhile, the pain subsided and I began thinking sttategically tathrr than emotionally. I realized that the worst had happened and it wasn't - actually - THAT bad. It began to take its place as a learning experience.
you don't need to travel through ls for ship, and if you need, go first with shuttle to see is anyone on the gates, and do that when there are no too many players, like eu time 5 in the morning, and put low modules for fast align time, and first warp 100km of the gate, cloak or do the mwd trick, put and one w.stab... Check zkill for that systems, see who is regular killer, watch local chat, or find wh's to skip ls... And most important, fly ships that you got money for at least 10 of them, and skills for at least lev.4 on most important skills for that ship. And make few alpha players, for scanning, scouting, ded ratting, trading and hauling. Don't go through faction war ls.
I used thousand of Skill points when i started to learn and acquire a porpoise industrial command ship, costing 200 mil, not realizing its true purpose, and lost it first trip out in HIGH sec at an asteroid belt. 200m and countless SP wasted because I LEARNED never fly what you cant afford to.
Original alpha Cult of Cthulu player from June 03 just came back today and started looking for tutorials. I've been in and out over the years but recently been out for 6 years. Boy it has changed. So much new for me to learn on this latest journey. I've not un docked yet as I'm trying to find where all my stuff is still LOL. Like your content a lot.
Great video. I find myself thinking these things occasionally, but I’ve had experiences that make me realize I wouldn’t be playing this if it didn’t have this realism. It was only by losing a ship and finding that I could learn how to avoid it that I had fun. It has been years since a game provided me an experience like this and it’s worth having, worth keeping. Thanks for your videos.
Thanks for this video Cap. I lost a brand new cyclone i just bought, along with about a billion isk worth of ships, lost drugs, etc. just fighting in a fw system this week, and was feeling kind of down after i got spearfished and killed by a gang of frigates off the dock with my buddy 300m away helplessly watching as they killed me pretty pitifully. Ive been playing the game a few months, and though ive learned alot i was feeling pretty bad. someone else there in system gave me some similiar advice, and honestly up until that point i had a lot of fun with the other fights, but it sucks when you think you know enough to make a decent fit, and are confident in it just to be blown to hell in 4 seconds and youre back to being broke lol. really its just bittersweet and thats why this video was perfect timing. Thanks for all the content. i know i have to get better if this game is going to remain fun for me
Great talk. Twenty years ago, I played another "niche" game and I was completely hooked. Over the years, that particular game completely lost it's appeal to me because the developers did just what you described; they tried to make the game appeal to everyone. Eve definitely has the right recipe for success. For years I avoided playing Eve because I did not like the idea of permanent ship loss. Now that I play Eve and have totally fallen in love with it, I understand why permanent ship loss is central to the game mechanics and economy, plus since I spend a good bit of my time mining tritanium producing ore, I'm perfectly fine with players blapping each other's ships day after day. 🤣😂
100% on all your points, thanks for breaking this down for the non dedicated players that just don't understand. Took me a few years to get used to the fact that loss is indeed necessary, that's not to say it's easy, but learning to cope, and purposely feeding yourself to the wolves to get a true feel of it really helps desensitize yourself to the loss. I good rule of thumb I use when playing eve is, the ship I undock is already destroyed, docking back up safely is just an unexpected bonus. Also never fly what you can't afford to lose, if you spend all your isk on a blinged out ship and get ganged, that's on you, should have flown cheaper, now you have to start way back to catch back up to where you were.
The reason I enjoy this game is that Risk that you have because the game is at it's at it's core a pvp game. When go into a wormhole in an exploration ship, knowing my ship has no teeth and no tank, hitting Data and Relic sites and avoiding folks who are trying to kill me is EXCITING!! Look at other MMO's that are safe after EVE and I find myself getting so bored and start nodding off.
I fully agree with you Benzie , but what i would say is that , this game still has so much more potential and so much it can still be added to it , But i would love the game till my last breath on this earth . Time invested game !
Agree so much on the specialized games. I understand developers want to cover as much of a market as possible, but their games just get forgotten as they don't stand out. I would rather have 10 completely different games so i can choose one, instead of 10 clones. Better to be a big fish in a small pond than a small fish in a big pond :)
I've been following your posts on TH-cam for quite a while now. I am (like many of your other fans, most likely) thrilled by your way of accompanying this unique "niche game" with such enthusiasm, almost autobiographically. Now to the actual point. Yes, I agree with you on all three of your points! The game is and remains a unique gem among MMO games in the context of space simulation. It is a pure PVP game and thrives on a few players willing to invest. I've been playing since 2008, and in my early days, I had a few problems understanding the game in its entirety - I've started to enjoy the game's many nooks and crannies. Despite my resilience in the face of the usual "problems", a few points drive me crazy! Firstly, the killboard-junkie attitude ... I have often experienced how, during various short talks, the self-inflicted bad scoring in this meta-crawler is taken as an opportunity to make fun of players, even though (according to your explanations) it shouldn't matter. On the other hand, many players see this game as a kind of Second Live, especially those who want to play CEO in a smaller corporation. That's one of the biggest problems in the game. Anyway, I just wanted to "vent". Thanks for your great videos-please keep them coming!
Thank you ☺️ and yes, I agree about the Kill boards. I lost the first Mamba to PvE and was heavily mocked for it, despite it being because I had the balls to push an expensive new ship to its limits to see what it could do. Over the years, I've had numerous people use my Zkillboard as a "gotcha", which is just weird. 😂
Talking to yourself about EVE while spinning your ship in station is peak EVE gameplay. Sillyness aside, you make some great points here. Especially about the longievity of mass-market titles vs. niche games that lean into their theme v. hard.
I played another pvp-oriented game that suddenly flipped to actively discouraging pvp to keep new players interested. Newer people stayed longer but about half of the established playerbase quit on the spot 😶🌫️ I got into eve shortly after and have been having a great time!
I started playing Eve the same year that Chamber of Secrets came out. Within a year of that, when Eve was released, a battleship would be the equivalent of an expensive carrier these days, give or take. My group had trapped an enemy battleship who decided to make his way to a safe spot but didn't log off. He just sat there. This was before probes and being able to warp to people. But we still had dscan and some brains. This was also before they stopped letting you put multiple mwds and abs to ships. I made some safe spots as close to where he was as possible, got a ship that could go ludicris speed, and spent a couple hours flying towards him until he finally appeared on grid. He didn't even fight back. Prolly wasn't near the screen. But I do wonder if he said omg wtf when he got back. I wonder if he still plays. But that was fun and there are hundreds more of those types of moments as time goes on. I still "play" this spreadsheet, though.
Was that a challenge you issued at the beginning of the video? :) I think you overlooked a truth about EVE Online that for you probably is very uncomfortable. While EVE may be a PvP game, PvE players pay the bills. Just look back to the summer and fall of 2019. During the Chaos Era CCP decided to make it easier for PvP-focused players to hunt by removing local in null sec. Once it was clear local wasn't coming back, so many "carebears" told CCP to go take a hike, unsubbed, and went to play WoW Classic. CCP quickly brought back local within a few weeks. CCP's revenue really took a beating in the second half of 2019. In fact, you have to go back to 2008 to see CCP's yearly revenue below 2019's $51.1 million. And the financial records show it hasn't dipped to within 10% of that since.
quite literally a steam game that is eve offline, plenty of space games that dont have pvp, you people are such 1st dimension thinkers, all of those games are dead because without the pvp pilots there isnt much of an end game to the grind. Stop wanting your cake and eating it to, you either want your actions to matter even if they are non violent or you want to play a game where no one can be violent to you. except you dont want that game because you play eve and your not playing all the versions of space games that you claim to want. Ying and yang, push and pull, I enjoy almost all activities in eve and watching the two sides of the players base dividing themselves as enemies when no one told them to is hilariously brain dead, everyone matters, take one aspect of the playerbase out and the game will cease to function, we turn off pvp for 1 day and the economy would stop moving.
to be clear you are also correct, without the sheep the wolves starve and die, and without the wolves the sheep over populate like drones with no limits until the place they inhabit is dead. Quite literally a universal truth of biological beings even when they are simply projecting there will into a virtual space.
Something that you may have overlooked in saying that “because local in null was removed the bears left and CCP took a hit and had to reverse…”. Is the fact that without local it would make the ability to bot and script significantly more difficult thus not economical to use that method for fully plexing all your accounts.
Cap'n B, a really good job here so thanks. My guess is that something like my experience is really rare across gaming. Played intensely for about 5 years, waking up in middle of night to check skill queue and all, not that I still didn't, well, suck, at it . . . Then, IRL had the audacity to mess with me and I faded away. And now, over 7 years later, I decided to come back. How often does that happen in gaming? Not rhetorical--you know, I don't. And when I came back, CCP just friggin' restored everything I had spread all over New Eden. I'm very impressed. But I'm also a bit scared--when I played before I was a busy working person, but now, I-socalled-RL, I'm retired and there's no real limit, no reason to ever log out. So, even though I'm embarrassed by how bad I am at the core pvp, the recognition I'll probably never be even adequate, no less elite, I still really wanna get . . . better. I like this niche.
I liked this video, thanks for sharing your perspectives, ... sorry: absolute truths. I've played solo, which is a lot of fun, just cruising around, comparing spreadsheets, ... IN SPACE! and I've teamed, which is fun, too. I do love how Eve is Eve, and it's uncompromising in its Eve-ness. I respect this game for what it is, and that it doesn't try to pander. "This is the game. You play it this way." and doing so just works. Oh: and sad-face gif 😥 because I listened to your whole video.
The game may not be designed for solo, but that doesn't mean it's not possible to solo and to have a tonne of fun doing so 😉 it's just not usually the best course for a newer player trying to learn the game. I'm glad you've found your fun though!!
Sir, you get a like and a sub purely for the passion in your voice when you talk about Eve! 😀 It’s great to see/hear, and makes me want to jump back in (again) to the void! Keep up the awesome content mate 👍
😂 I found my round hole lol. I’m loving this type of content. I moved to null so I don’t have to worry about checking this screen and I can just listen. Also totally agree with you.
I love gankers trying to kill my abyssal ship only for their coercers to be greeted by my two alts brick tanked 1000 dps suicidal brutixes which promptly suicide gank their entire fleet of ganking coercers. Survive better, gank the ganker 😂😊 Not even gankers are safe!
I love this game! I started playing years ago and then I stopped for RL issues. Lately, I find myself wanting to play. While some live to kill, which is great, I love being able to get away or sneak around the opposition as a PI and industrialist. The cat and mouse is a great challenge. If there wasn't a REAL chance of getting blown up, it would barely be worth playing.
I play Eve sporadically and I play it like a survival Game. Dayz in space. I play solo. How long can I survive. That’s my fun. Someone or something must have triggered you bud. Love the videos btw.
Playing EVE Online while listening to these "talking points" videos is a really interesting way to play lol I agree with everything said including the round hole... I've also had the most fun in the game when the stakes are the highest, exe. going into wormholes with ships worth almost 100mil. I've also had a load of fun as part of a corp. but it's sooo hard finding a good corp anymore.. I enjoy all aspects of the game from the PVE to the PVP I've gotten pretty good at evading other players but never dabbled too much in actually sticking around to finish the fight. In my personal experience with EVE (off and on for 15 years) I've had more luck in PVE than PVP. In my case everyone has to find their niche within a niche game. very good points in here and very well said.
Talk about adrenaline... having a full Hauler in null-sec and having all the 'correct' modules that allow you to just barely slip through gankers fingers. Popping out a gate... Cloaking up... watching them scramble around trying to decloak you... as you align.... drop cloak... interdiction nullifier and warp core stabilizers running as they try and target you and whoosh you are gone... watching them jump to the next gate .... where you did NOT jump to LOL what a rush.
based vid! 4th unpopular truth would be that eve players in general aren't as good or as smart as they think of themselves, and there are highsec miners and F1 monkeys who unironically look down on other MMO's while in reality what they do in EVE is not too different to games our grandparents play via facebook
Great job of setting these truths in plain sight. I agree with everything you’ve said. I hope it has helped folks to save time and money in deciding whether they are going to stay or leave.
😊Been playing a month, joined EH corp.. Had soooo much fun found a relic site yesterday that was littered with Mines.. Lost my astero in the blink of an eye 😅 good times :)
I totally agree with you but, yeah playing since 2005 and I've allways meet some great pilot, pvp or pve, and they teach me how to not lose your ship because it's hard earned isks, even a cruiser back in the days was a big thing, then killboard came in, and corporation didnt want us to lose to much isk, so after all this I fly very carefully and still hurt me when losing a ship. I got more fun since I care less about blowing up but I was used to follow the no lose doctrine and it was something good to learn some good way of playing, but yeah, maybe a bit boring sometimes. After all, everyone play like he want to, and I think that's the more important, you're right, but the pve player has his point of view too and from there he's right too...
I am a PVE player, not a PVPer. Thing is, in EVE, everything is PVP. You may not be hunting, but you are still prey to PVPers. You have to accept that and also understand that the risk is what makes you profitable. Ship loss needs to happen to keep materials etc in demand, the trick is to not be the one losing ships. Ships are ammo. Don't fly what you can't afford to lose, and always have spares for when you inevitably do lose one.
Another fantastic video. I love that you call these uncomfortable truths but after nearly 20 years in EVE I'm thinking... no. No I'm quite comfortable with these truths hah, these are the rules of the universe I love more than ours 😅
I just love the ships design and all the complicated stuff for it to work. I need to upgrade my PC so I can use Windows 10 optimally and then come back to Eve Online.
Started EVE a few days ago and I've had a good time completing enforcer missions and hunting pirates solo. Currently browsing corps to find people to play with occasionally, but my solo experience so far has been pretty good!😊
CCP only went plus 2023 by cryptocurrency sale outside of Eve. Right now Eve is not profitable. It's a sinking ship, saved only by pearl abyss. While i don't think Eve should change its identity. It is clear that it struggles immensely to attract new players and retain returning ones. And that's counting in the effects of the ludicrous price hike of Omega. The old dogs of EVE and CCP themself can resist change all they want. A large number of players want change, and there's a huge market out there to appeal to while still retaining the spirit off EVE and its niche. There's a large spectrum, not a binary scale in which EVE can evolve within. Or CCP can remain Impervious to any and all change and in a few years i'll watch the Benzie youtube video about EVEs greatest moments before the server closed down... for good.
Are the changes you want to make going to attract and keep enough players to offset the losses in dedicated players who've spent a lot of money and time that like the game more the way it is? This is the dilemma every MMO faces long-term. Watch Josh Strife Hayes re: how MMO's generally are not a profitable model in the 2020's - Eve is a niche market within a niche market. I love it but it will only ever appeal to thousands, not millions. They can bend the revenue curve by changing pricing, subscription terms etc... It does not require changing the gameplay in radical ways to chase mass appeal.
"Right now Eve is not profitable" - eve online as a standalone product is profitable. CCP itself isn't profitable because they've invested a lot of money into new IP (like the new shooter, new beta test this weekend)
I start Player EVE online yesterday. I saw benzies Videos why he leave Eve Echos and opened my eyes. Eve online is After years of updates so a good Game. I used the ref link :P thank u for your Support for the ppl
I remember years ago(not long after player-built stations were added) my corp spent months building and transporting a station to null-sec and setting it up in ZMV-9. We gathered the minerals, built the parts, and scouted it down in a freighter. Within a few months it was traded with the neighbouring alliance we were at war with, behind our corp's back. A while later (after those stations became fully destructable) my corp (me included) were in one of the fleets that blew it up! Even as a very PvE-centric player (in general, not just EVE), I get why EVE is the way it is. The only time it's a problem is when there is a major system change that affects the risk-reward balance; when NPCs stopped stocking shuttles, drakes went from 30mil to 60mil, and suddenly whelping 5 full fleets of them in a single engagement became punishingly expensive. It took a while for the rewards for holding space to match the risks of holding it, but it did happen.
My love for PvP has been the reason I've chosen to only train subcap ships. It provides me a flexible arsenal of inexpensive PvP ships to play with and learn with.
That’s why I love industry. Always hated losing ships, but I love creating them and giving them to people who love to get out there all for a good amount of ISK and a sense of reliability when they need another fitted ship.
I would not mind more instanced content like deadspace but even then when you pop out of the last room, you can still be killed that's part of the game.
I do agree to these facts. Started playing in 2020 and had a pause of 2 years. The fact that destruction and all those things to it affects most is necessary for everyone to succeed.Nowadays I do Wh stuff with a fleet of friends.
When I first joined a nullsec alliance and we went out and got jumped by Carriers and then more people came and it escalated to absolute mayhem was a lot of fun. However, the most astonishing part and the part that has remained in my memory for so long is after the fight, where everyone was - thank you, good fight, lets do it again tomorrow, awesome job team and so on. There was no anger or crying or copmplaining about what was lost, it was pure fun and everyone wanted to do it again. Thats EVE!
The best description I ever heard of Eve Online is "It's not the kind of game to smack the cookie from your hand. It's the kind of game to knock the cookie from your hand, grind it slowly into the dirt and then laugh at you while staring into your eyes."
I have played solo since 2015 I would maybe 2016 and I’m not a fan of PVP but I have to give props to the most exhilarating experience I had in the game. I wanted to do the pirate story that takes you to low sec I think for the missions. So anyway i fit a minamatar destroyer with a cloaking device because I wanted to get to the mission agent undetected. So just as I entered the low sec system I noticed the gate camp and immediately turned in the cloak and aligned to the next gate and I had to navigate around the gate camp that knew I was there but didn’t knew here I was so they began to fly around erratically to bump me but usinga the grid I was able to get around them and past them but all the while you experience to a sensation of excitement and danger from the pilots trying to figure out where I went so they can get the kill mail. Anyway it was exciting and heart is pounding. Just never felt an experience like that in any other game. Long story short I was able to outmaneuver them and get away to when they were no longer on grid and warped to the next gate. It was the most fun I have ever had in any game. Wormhole space is kinda like that because at any moment you could be scanned down while running the sites and that lurking danger that can happen gives a feeling of urgency. Higher sense of danger that can come from anywhere. I absolutely love eve online. But back to the pirate mission. I was able to get to the mission agent and accept the mission completed one mission but died in the very next one. But I didn’t mind it because I outflew some seasoned pvp players and I take pride in it as an accomplishment even though pvp isn’t really my thing. It was a blast.
I agree even though I've spent the majority of my time playing solo. I first subbed back in 2009. I got into mining and moved to an 06 system bordering low-sec - Teonusude. Didn't really understand what the game was about at that point. I skilled myself into a Retriever mining barge and promptly got ganked. That's when I realised just how dangerous eve was and I loved that. It changed my path as I needed to adapt. I didn't mine again until I was able to fly a hulk with the skills to tank it. Yes I lost some yield, but so what. It's what I had to do to survive. I got myself an alt and began skilling her into an orca with command link skills. I've never lost a barge since. Gankers could have killed me. They only needed to bring a few more ships, but there were so many miners favouring yield over safety they didn't need to. Every attack on me failed. Probably less than 10 attempts over the years as those paying attention would move on to the next target. I love the danger in eve. That I needed to change my gameplay to survive. To be a less attractive target than everyone else. I salute the lawless pirates of eve for causing me genuine anxiety. It adds so much to the experience O7 In return I have provided many kills for them. Although I enjoy combat PvP I'm not too good at it. If we meet in combat you will win! While I agree eve is better played with others, I've been a solo player most of the time. I'm a bit of a low confidence type person that struggles with initial interactions with others. It doesn't help that I don't need interaction in life so I don't always push myself to overcome, but when I have it has been a great experience with some great people. I would highly recommend joining a corp, but it is possible to enjoy eve as a solo player. I have no choice but to run solo atm, but I do hope to fleet up with others again in the future. One last thing. After coming back to eve recently, and being a little rusty and not paying proper attention I lost two prowlers and three pods in one day! Terrible piloting, but happy to add to the economy and my fellow players enjoyment.
It's not setting myself up to get infallible, it's the info. I'm stating facts, not opinions. It's not my opinion that the game was designed for group play, that's the development team.
Its true, i life in wormholes and have for a very long time. Yes i have taken breaks because we all need to but its a very fun game. I have niche toons for either wormhole life and recently working on a mission runner. All aspects of the game is extremely fun to me and I will always play but with breaks here and there.
Killing is just a means of communicaaaaatshuuuuuunn...(Thank you for using this anniversary edition memorygram! Please deposit 5 billion isk now to continue experiencing.)
Nothing says that someone lacks the confidence in their arguments more than saying "don't argue with me bro, just trust that I'm right!". Especially odd to make that claim and then proceed to make a number of errors talking about economics and game design. A true high sec for those that wanted it, as well as providing a chill space for more PvP orientated players to occasionally just relax in would be fine. The opinions of gankers -- who make a big deal about "nowhere should be risk free" while trying to engage in what is some of the lowest risk gaming in EVE -- can safely be ignored. Far too many sad acts playing EVE who think their version of fun should be the only acceptable method.
You've missed the points profoundly. If you have an argument about farming, do you listen to the farmer, or the guy who lives next to a farm? There's a fine line between arrogance and expertise. I'm not confident enough to be arrogant, but I do know this shit. And you're 100% wrong about Hisec. Tomorrow's video addresses that. Anyone making the argument that "Hisec could be completely safe and it would be fine" does not understand the game at all. We have seen exactly that experiment play out in EVE, and it ABSOLUTELY FUCKED the game totally. Tune in tomorrow and I'll explain fully.
@@captainbenzie No it's you who is taking it too far. The effect on the economy all of high sec has is next to none. The real isk is made in null and everybody knows that. Majority of price hikes and inflation in the game were caused by optimised c5 ratting/abyss/escalation 10 running and just plain botting. Some dudes farming l4 in peace in high sec isn't even close to being a dent on the economy, same as some other dudes in 5 mill fits insta popping these newbies carrying 150 mil to jita ALSO has next to no effect on the economy besides making that new player quit the game and never come back. I don't get how can people still be making these points, like a guy making something like 25 mill an hour in high sec is somehow a threat to the economy and inflation, while another guy making 1.2+ bill per hour or even more solo perfectly save in corp space in null is not, like what. You can have 40 newbies farming eyes closed and they still won't even match this other guy in Null. I'm NoT ArRoGaNt aM RiGHt. If you have to say it, you most certainly are :) You make some fair points, but also some that aren't at all. High sec never had a high influence of eve economy as a whole. Never.
"while trying to engage in what is some of the lowest risk gaming in EVE -- can safely be ignored. " you reside in a single slice of an entire pie and the result is you think this is the the form of pvp people choose, I cant even explain why you cant see beyond that because you literally lack knowledge found in the rest of the pie. So leave your wormy little safe zone, join a corp and ask how do I kill people, then go see how easy and risk free it is kid.
Like the points, like the analysis. Dont like the aggression. I know its emotional for you as it was for me with a core pvp player in world of tanks. But as much as you want to tell them to accepts the ways of the game and it dont changes, It would count the same for you. These ppl will not change and will not stop to be unhappy. And this is a good thing. It makes your circle of friends a more valuable thing. You in eve, the others who do not understand. happy vibes in the wormhole boy! I heard after the last patch sleepers deal more damage the more unhappy you are 😊
Please don't mistake passion for aggression or sadness 😁 I'm happy with people feeling however they feel, the aim of this video was simply to state "This is how it is" and maybe get some folks thinking about the "why" and "how to engage with that"
I played EVE literally 10 years ago. My favorite memory is doing a race through low and null sec space with my corpies. We all took Tristans, a planned route, first one back to Hi Sec won a ship. I won, somehow. Everyone else got ganked. I made sure to dodge the interdiction bubbles by bouncing off random moons before warping to the next gate.
EVE is a niche game that should remain PVP-focused but shouldn’t be stagnant. It should always adapt. You used Fortnite as an example. It remained PVP-focused but removed building and to much appreciation by many. Allowing more people to see how great EVE as a game is can only be good. More players add a lot to a pvp-focused game.
Well one thing is for sure eve is the most "valid game".... if you play aoe 4 or sc2 you will face map hackers if you play Rust, Cod, Tarcov, Dark and darker will face wall hackers and aim bot if you play if you think your safe playing wow nope watch pika hell show you many top level games vs players using bots and scripts.... In moderen online games cheating has basically ruined the validity every time you die or losse you wonder and wondering is bad... Eve is good because theres no map hacks wall hacks or aim bots when i die in eve i know its my fault and that is good because i know it was me.
Go find your round hole!! love it, but sound advice summed up well, hard for allot of people to hear but if they could follow your advice everyone would be happier, well done
100% agree. What he is talking about is the equivalent of a person starting to play Age of Empires saying "this should have first person WOW mechanic combat"... or going to WOW and saying "This game needs hardcore survival mechanics" .... etc etc. Play the games that you like playing.... not all games will be what you like... so either dont play them... or go into them with the mindset that you want to try to embrace something new.
The two most amazing things that ever happened to me in Eve were: a) soloing a blaster Hecate and his tackle Condor with my alpha clone Magnate. I had 49 hull hp at the end of the fight. b) The first fleet I ever commanded was an armor timer in a wormhole. I had a Magnate Navy leading 2 Blaster Punishers, a kitey Hookbill, and an Inquisitor. We killed 7 Oracles and 9 Augorers without losing a single ship. The entire fleet cost 80 mil and we killed 970m.
I enjoy EVE Online solo, but then again I also enjoyed getting 99 mining and woodcutting in Old School RuneScape so I'm definitely not the typical case.
Im an New to eve, I love it !!! Ist Like real Life!!! But Virtual, Like you Said learn, and get competent, and provoke mistakes to master them and knowing how to even use a mistake to get better.
"... Eve is dying, It's been dying since 2003..." Yep, I've been hearing that since 2013, still hear it 'til this day and yet it keeps moving along and is still here and I will probably be here with it until the end (either mine or the games). Granted, i may not play all the time or consecutively in any meaningful stretches but I am still here. Love the creator content and all you hard work. Keep it up and I hop to see tons more. Ciao for now and fly safe Captain. o7
Your big 3 points are 100% correct. I do have some small criticisms but it doesn't detract from the big 3. 1. Eve can be a solo game. I've been an on again off again player since 2009. The vast majority of my time was solo-ish. But as a solo player you are mostly going to be in the "prey" role, not predator. And that's totally fine. Edit: I want to clarify I'm not saying you don't interact with other players as a solo player. But it's very much a You against the world experience. If you enjoy being a small fish in a big pond, then Eve is a great solo game. 2. I would argue some losses are unavoidable. The VAST majority are not, but sometimes you WILL lose a ship even if you play perfectly. That doesn't mean you rage at the game, but I've seen arrogant players who think they have no risk because of their skill lose VERY expensive ships. Off the top of my head, cloaky smartbomb proteus in wspace doesn't really have a counter if you're in an explo frig, especially if they scanned the system before you arrived. Risk assessment and risk to profit analysis is a skill, because you might just get unlucky. If nothing else, you're only human and you'll eventually make a mistake, so plan accordingly! 3. I do think you downplay some of the reason why older players are a bit, well, bitter. It's not because Eve isn't for them, but rather that Eve changed in ways that are contrary to the old guard of certain groups. My big "calling" in Eve was 3 things: Wspace PvE, Ninja Looting/Mission Ganking, FW PvP. 2 of them are doing great. But the fact that Abyssals are instanced, Wardec mechanics have changed to encourage highsec blocs, and a bunch of other small changes over time means that highsec griefing is in a really bad place. I am NOT saying we should remove ganking or anything like that. Rather, I'm saying it's bad for the game that suicide ganking and camping Jita with 60+ wardecs is the only viable highsec PvP left. I'm angry at CCP for making highsec too safe, and nerfing into the ground *many* playstyles which made highsec PvP so fun. It's not all bad. The changes to remote assistance are a great change imho. But a lot of the more subtle or nuanced forms of PvP such as baiting, 1 man corp wardecs, stalking players over the long term, simply aren't a thing anymore. In short, I agree Eve is a PvP game and a very hostile game. I disagree that CCP is doing a great job on that front. Highsec needs another overhaul of crimewatch, wardecs, and Abyssals to encourage more types of highsec PvP. Because Suicide ganking is dreadfully boring. Necessary, to be sure. I don't want it nerfed. But I'd like other options buffed to viability again.
Boy, I was PISSED losing my first OMEN. I'm out for revenge (which is best served COLD) but I'm taking my time - cool, calm, and collected - I guess that's what your video elaborates upon.
It's High Security, not Total Security. We saw this in EVE Echoes where you cannot shoot other players in Hisec. A large community forms where they farm entirely safely. They never have to buy anything, replace anything. They have their ship and they just grind isk like a high score. This floods the game with ISK, with Hisec ores, with modules etc. those ores and modules become saturated and worthless. ISK deflates in value dramatically, which in turn causes PLEX to skyrocket in price, making Omega near impossible to PLEX. You end up making it impossible to Omega without swiping, players leave, and CCP loses money because the PLEX market is what makes the most cash for them. It utterly destroyed Echoes
Thank you for this video I came back to eve to try it again and this video gave me a different perspective than what I was playing years ago now I get it Eve is a pvp game 😅 I think it should even be on their logo instead of it saying Eve online it should say Eve PvP😂 with a slogan "no one is safe"
Just recently came back to eve, I've never gotten very far in it (mainly because every time I end up starting a new character to re learn how to play lol) but I always enjoy it. I find it funny that the two games I play the most right now are eve online and elite dangerous, two games that are old as hell. Lol
I was a invested player for about 10 years and CCP made a lot of money off me. One thing CCP needs to be careful about is burning the loyal player. When I quit it was done in a way that I would never be tempted to ever come back.
Holy crap this video is super contentious and preachy. It's like this dude was in the boards and lost an argument on what Eve online is as a game. I mean he is mostly correct but dude if someone plays the game another way this guy is going to pop a vain.
Wow did you misunderstand me. I'm happy for people to play however they want - but that doesn't mean the game was designed for that. People solo EVE, and do well solo. They have a great time being alone in New Eden. The Devs have absolutely stated that the game is designed around group play. That's my point. So if someone is soloing the game and complaining that they're struggling, that's why. Also, if you quit in such a way that you will never be tempted to come back... How "loyal" are you? Point here is that labels like "loyal customer" don't matter. The game stopped being for you, and that's fine. Find your fun, whether it's in EVE or some other game. No point playing something you don't enjoy.
@@captainbenzie I didn't misunderstand as I said you are mostly right. You just got very worked up. I played the game to have fun and fun I had. It was not any kind of loyalty towards CCP. The developers and mods play favorites and do some dirty things most players don't know about. Events can play out so badly that a hardcore player like me that was on top of the Eve world calls it quits. I ended up Biomassing all my characters and gave what was probably was close to $10,000 USD in ISK to my buddy a high ranking member of Imperium AKA (Goonswarm). I can tell you for sure I will never play the game again. And that is probably for the best . But the game is absolutely my kind of game.
Loosing ships gives points to the AIR carrier program. EVE is quiet comfortable nowadays: I remember times we lost skill points by getting podded if used the wrong clone, or loosing skill points by loosing strategic cruisers - times pass by...
Is eve online worth getting into in 2024? Ive tried to get into it a few times before but the time gated progression trough tech levels is one of the biggest turn offs for me along with having to pay a monthly subscription to be actually able to play the game.
tbh with you, yes, this is the best time to try eve. Not because of the reasons people will tell you... The reason is the new player experience inproved so freaking much over the past few years... You never feel lost, there is always something to do and the tracking of it is crazy... Then and then you can find what tickles your mind, be it industrialism, pve, pvp, exploration... that kind of thing... The only real "gate" that I consider now is the industrial one, but for a good reason: Today you cannot be really competitive nor profitable by trying to create stuff, otherwise the economy would go to sh* :D all other "professions" in game you can kinda grasp, and homefront ops are a good way to start. My goto for new players: 1- do the carreer missions, 2- do the sister of eve epic arc 3- get into a corp to do homefront ops :) after that the game is yours
honest answer, probably not. The only way you would ever "enjoy" it is you instantly join some of the bigger alliances/corps in null, rush into their space, start farming drone escalations and selling them. Imho but it's the only realistic way to somewhat learn eve without getting popped the moment you gather the smallest amount of isk for basic ship progress. There's so many people out there who have been skilling for decade that in this rock/paper/scissors pvp and ganking game you don't really stand a chance for a very extended period of time without some real protection. High sec just is both boring AND very dangerous
Eve is a great game, but it's not really a game designed for casual players. Everything in the game takes time be it gathering resources, progressing skills, or building ships and items. But I will tell you that with the right group of people it's an absolutely awesome experience. Give it a shot. Find a corp see if it clicks with you. If not, try another. Eventually you'll find something you enjoy.
It took me 3 previous attempts where I didn't really get past or used to the UI. The 4th time was around September last year. Spent about 2000 hours playing since. Once you find what you like to do and a group to roll with it's a fantastic game. For me this was a smaller group in low sec that offer a large amount of things to do be it ratting, mining, small and large group PvP, scanning and hacking. Sure it's not the null battles with trillions of isk in losses but those can be a bit overwhelming for someone new. I would definetly say its never to late to start. ❤
bro, i joined last month and played for a month with omega. u need a whole fleet to even move 500M between Jita and a hisec, plus the time sink, isn't a game for a guy that works and has just 2 or 3 hours to play the lack of solo content made me unsub
fully agree, eve online will always struggle to grow when "noob" high sec is straight the worst place imaginable for new players to ever play the game in. It just makes no sense that some gankers in a few million isk whatever builds can just alpa one shot kill you as you warp in and the structure isn't even loaded yet, as new player over and over for no other benefit to themselves other than kekw ezpz pirate life yo. I've had several friends who I tried to get into the game just plain quit it because how are they going to learn basics and grow confidence if whenever they save up for their vexor or whatever they just get ganked doing basic high sec escalations / mining or even just l2-l3 missions. I honestly just plain despise people that get some sick pleasure out of one shot-ing new players for genuinely zero benefit. Entire corps exist that do nothing but sit in empty space for hours on end doing nothing but drink on voice and wait for easy prey. Like, I get it, I enjoyed ultima online, i've been in pvp corps and roaming fleets, and solo, but I think there should be a place for people to learn basic ropes, otherwise community will just never grow. It's like if you put kids into some sports like football and then make them play against 18 y olds that have been doing it for the last 10 years, and when they lose those 18 yolds are jumping sending them mail and texts how it was so easy and exciting to them. It'll just never grow and that sucks, eve is an amazing game and the more players play it the more content and actually fun events there are in the universe. It's awesome to have pvp in games, even if when not both parties want to engage into it, making safe hauling or farming pve part of the risk you take. BUT, if a new person is saving for weeks for some basic ship only to then lose it approaching Jita or Dodixie or whatever to sell his new loot than idk, it just sucks imho that it's a thing. Like the game tells him "high sec" is high security zones. As it is by far the most sensible thing for new players to do is joining some large null sec corp and just legging it there naked and starting the game there. Kinda illogical
One of the biggest delusions that a lot of die hard eve players have, as illustrated in this vid, is this idea that having a super safe high sec for new players would kill the game. It wouldn't. Everyone fucking knows it wouldn't. It's just a verbal diehard chunk who cling to this obsession of nowhere being safe.
@@bouncingboredom EVE Echoes abso-fucking-lutely proved it kills the game. You get the majority of players just sitting in Hisec grinding ISK non stop, never needing to replace a ship, continually flooding the game with more ISK and modules etc. It absolutely breaks the game because ISK and those modules all devalue, let alone Hisec ores etc... and if you don't understand this, you simply do not understand the inner mechanism of what makes EVE tick.
If you play eve solo you either know what you do, are new and should be told to Corp up or your new and have ignored the previous one There is no excuse for being bad if information is just seconds away, if you struggle getting information for your own benefit your in the wrong game or have a challenge ahead to overcome, thats the reality
It's probably the one of few games closest to real life and world's economy.. everyone getting up in the morning to go to a job/their own business, every time they leave the house, they become a target, if one lose their ship, there's that, gone for good.. so on and so forth.. only the concept of death is what separates the game from real life, probably
For those that don't want to look another video: Clarelam is what we call a highsec island in EE, a high security system (no PvP) that's isolated from the others by 2 low sec jumps, because of this, all the high security missions from the faction spawn inside of it and you can just farm them easily without risk, adding this with the "AI" nanocore = isk for no effort or risk.
I have been playing on and off since 2006. I'm not sure how much $$, I've spent on it. I've loved it. The first real ship I lost angered me greatly. So much so that I hired a merc group with rl money to hunt them repeatedly for a month. Ohh that was expensive. Could have bought hundreds of the ship I lost cheaper.
Ah, the modern issue of "everyone's opinion counts and is equal". When asking questions about how a car works, do you trust a mechanic or some random guy from next door? Expertise counts. And this is an area in which I have expertise.
@@Megagon10k That one is NOT an opinion, I have to give him that! However from reading comments it DOES sound like he gets into opinions and his description of what a niche game is was absolutely garbage! No game is liked by EVERYONE and NEVER will be!
Hi, nice Video. I play EVE-Online over 19 years, and Yes, You will lose Ships. I agree in all your points, only not in one of them. After a certain period of time, a lot of experience and sufficient skills (lets say min 150 Mil points or more) You can play this game also mostly alone too. Because all your friends, or most of them, who play this game round about the same amount of time, are meanwhile 'adults' or even older, some of them have something like a RL, or are somewhe in the 0.0, or a WH or somehow to far away. I tink I don't need to say to anybody here how much I hate and love this game in the same time. And here my Golden Rules of EVE 1. Trust no one (There is no "right" or "wrong". Only profits of various kinds) 2. Read the pop up messages before clicking OK 3. Fly only what you can afford to loose!! (you will loose ships) 4. Insurance, buy it! (See Rule3) 5. (Get and keep a clone upgraded.) deprecated 6. EvE is about Risk Vs. Reward. Think about that with every action. (See Rule3) 7. Avoid Lowsec Space (0.1-0.4). Stay in 0.5-1.0 or move to 0.0 (See Rule6) 8. Being in Empire Space (0.5-1.0) does not mean you are safe. 9. If you lose stuff, it's ALMOST ALWAYS YOUR FAULT. Really, only yours. 10 Just because you CAN fly something doesn’t mean you SHOULD. 11 If everyone says “train for this ship” or “module”, ignore them! It will be nerfed. 12 TRUST NO ONE! (EVE is full of people wanting your death or your ISK)
If you want a "solo EVE Online experience" then play Astrox Imperium. That said, I mostly play solo, but the experiences I have as a solo pilot are NOT things I could have in a fully NPC-driven game. I absolutely love X4 Foundations, but find myself bouncing between it and EVE Online because, between the two of them, I get most of my space game fill in. I really do miss Westwood's Earth and Beyond though.
I can easily agree with the three unconfortable truth you talk about. Personally my only problem is the fact that the game request too much of my lifetime to earn enough to buy ships I lost and plex the omega account. It's a kind of second work I don't want and can't do. I'm desperatly searching for a good solution to earn enough but if it simply doesn't exist I think I have to give up with Eve after almost eight years and this make me really sad
Started EVE 2003/09/09 and never cared much about the pvp, but after moving to my new home in null i do take part a lot more in home defense at least, not so much going out hunting. Will a round Womhole work? :)
Lost a 600m Gila in an abyssal because my internet took a dump, that one wasnt my fault. That being said thats 1 case of many where they have been my fault. Good video
I started playing Eve 2 days ago and today I was chased by a guy through 8 different systems in low sec (I started by being a industrial / miner) and it was one of the most thrilling experience of gameplay I had in like... a year lmao. And I know it's just the beggining, I already love this game and in a sense, i'm almost looking forward to see how I will lose my ship (I almost did) for the first time
Impressive you managed to survive! I lost my first ship after 10 minute sin low-sec mining kernite, then got a friendly message with a link to a d-scan youtube video :)
I knew it was a difficult game so I started while following a quick guide. It helped a lot!
Next level ganker actually saying what to not do to die next time🎉@@Aseroidify
hope its fun for you, and its not just a suicide gate kill via somebody playing several accounts. i too love pvp, but thats not pvp
u playing this game the right way, learn then play.
no dont find your round hole just get a bigger hammer trust me any size peg will fit with a big enough hammer.
😂😂
Agree with the whole video.. although i think saying playing solo is playing wrong isnt the case.. i only play solo and i absolutely love learning to succeed on my own. I love being the slippery explorer in all parts of volatile space
A solo kill is so much more satisfying than a kill as part of a large fleet.
To clarify, I should have said "Playing solo when you're new" is a bad idea 😅
@@mjashmore1 I'm not entirely sure I agree there. It absolutely can be, for sure, but I think some of the most fun I've had PvPing are roams with my corp, Faction Warfare with a militia fleet, and hunting with Bombers Bar! That said, I've had some amazing solo experiences too.
Point I'm getting at is that I don't think one or the other is better. I think they're both different, and naturally, some folks are going to end up preferring one over the other - which is fine!
What's your proudest kill?
I’ve had the most fun flying together with a friend I made in game, that said 99% of my time is solo because I can’t dedicate the time that most corps require to be accepted. I may find opportunity to play for a week or month and then not play for several months due to irl demands. Starting the Cruzakh challenge has really reinvigorated my solo play style.
I think it’s similar to life, having no friends sucks, trying to be shallow friends with absolutely everyone is also a bad idea. Find your Eve group and make close friends that you truly enjoy doing things with.
Surviving a highsec gank 1 jump from Jita in my badger, with 2.5bil in my hold and only 15% hull left... gets my blood pumping like no other games and that alone makes EvE fun for me. I wouldn't even be mad if I had lost it since I got lucky and I was careless but it was fun to see those tornados get murdered to death by Concord XD.
This. This is the feeling that makes EVE amazing and unique.
Why were you flying a badger with 2.5bil in it? 😅
@@MetaGuideMedia Because someone has to do it.
Just wait till you're mapping route through j-space and hauling 6 billion isk worth of loot
You are right, it's basic economics, things explode and get more expensive. Also, yeah EVE is a PVP niche full loot hardcore game and should keep being that way.
But I think many times when people are complaining about ganking they are not necessarily looking through that point of view or ignoring those very valid reasons that you are right about. (I also work in the games industry but I don't think that should weight on my reasoning being right or wrong, just consider my reasoning and not who I am)
We can increase costs pulling many levers on the economy and we can make the game risky in many ways.
The problem I see here is what levers and in what ways the game is 'dangerous'.
Making transport more costly will make things cost more, sure, BASIC ECONOMICS. But it's also basic economics knowing that the effect of costly/risky transport is going to be freezing people and assets in certain areas making many parts of space more empty because moving ends up not being worth it or too much of a hassle. We can increase costs in other ways so players move and make the universe more populated, making the game better with better content and also making people who like pvp search for more interesting and challenging content instead of camping a gate and "mining salt".
I think reducing any complaints about ganking as "waaaahh I am too bad! I like Sonic this game EVE is too hard for me", is making a bad faith simplification of a problem that is not so simple and easy to solve, proof of that is that we have many 10+ year veterans that still play and love EVE and are against ganking too.
'basic economics' is a term used frequently but economics is far from a simple subject and any change on any lever has a chain of effects that comes from it good and bad.
i see a lot of games run into these problems and im not sure why the PVP is so necessary as to punish the other parts of the game that people seem to want to play.
i can sum this up pretty easily as i have for past games by just saying... "if they allow people to just avoid pvp too many will"
notice this is something that doesnt apply to actual pvp games like mobas, arena, RTS games as everybody is there for pvp. this argument comes into play when some people are there for pvp and need to disallow anybody else to avoid it.
the simple fact that if they allowed people to avoid pvp they would, means that more people are on my side of this.
edit - they could have a specific area for pvp that way pvp is consensual...but for some reason the people who claim to love pvp are strongly against this. because they dont want pvp they want squash matches to laugh about in discord.
@@suzukisixk7 Exactly. I play mostly in WormHoles and I love EVE for 10+ years now. So this game is for me and I like the dangerous hardcore aspect of it. BUT at the same time I dislike ganking and I think it's bad for the game in general. Completely opting out of PVP might not be for EVE but I think at least some aspects of it could be tunned in for the health of the game.
@@spaceghost8891 wormholes should be hardcore, the gate to sell your loot from that very activity shouldnt be.
@@spaceghost8891 ill start accepting arguments like in this video when EVE starts making youtube adds about gate camping....
until then everybody pretending thats a great part of the game is just self justifying
@@suzukisixk7 true, also when people justify it by saying the game should have risk and danger... what is the risk gankers have? Losing some catalysts? Please.
Back when Warhammer Online was still alive a guy would randomly join our team speak now and then and play up recorded snippets of EVE online players and then leave.
We all got the impression that they must have been very special players in that game.
There's an old EVE Online saying: "When an EVE player quits to join another game, the average IQ of both games goes up"
“Stop trying to solo EVE Online, this is not a solo game. Even if you’re a multi-boxer it is still better to have real people around you too … You are playing EVE wrong - if you want a solo online experience, EVE Online is not it.” 🤮
If I had an ISK for every time I’ve heard this! I’ve been playing EVE solo since 2013 (with some long breaks of course) and I love this game. There’s been absolutely nothing in EVE that I’ve ever wanted to do or accomplish that I haven’t been able to do because I was playing solo.
Also this:
“These are Truths. I don’t want to hear like your opinion that I’m wrong about this. Because categorically - I know it sounds arrogant, I really know this sounds arrogant - but in this case it’s true. These aren’t opinions, right? If you disagree with any of these points, that’s not your opinion man, that’s just you being wrong.”
Not arrogant at all! - just a wonderful example of misunderstanding truth, knowledge, facts, and opinions.
You may be playing EVE “right,” but your epistemology is a train wreck! 🤣
Nah, I'm just spitting facts that people want to misinterpret or misunderstand ☺️ glad you're having fun, but being solo as a new player is a bad way to try and learn the game, and you're missing out on most of what makes EVE special.
That said, if you're having fun, awesome, I'm genuinely glad that you've found your fun. But it's a very niche and difficult way to play that I would never recommend for a new player
@@captainbenzie Jesus, you're like a textbook delusional EVE player. "I am right, if you think I'm wrong, you're just dumb and wrong." It's like nullblock propaganda, but in youtube comments.
@@captainbenzie I totaly agree I would never recommend EvE for solo Players who want to start with a new game. But you can have fun at doing so. So if you ment “These are Truths. I don’t want to hear like your opinion that I’m wrong about this." only on the 3 main truths I would agree. But the solo vs multiplayer part is obviously an opinion and you CAN have a different opinion on that. All Games have ONE main purpose: to have FUN. It doesn't matter how you achieve this. But yes 90% or more of EvE is more fun to do in a group. But if you like the other 10% more and you are a solo Player, why not doing it?
Definitaly agree, I have been playing solo since 2010, only now I am thinking about joining a corp
Got eve in a box .and keep coming back. Probly spent 80% of my time solo if you can find a good Corp its grate but that's hard to do plus you can make isk faster solo
As a new playe, I set my sights on a sweet exploration ship. I mined for over a month to get the ISK to afford it, and I had to travel through low-sec to pick it up and fit it. On the eay back to my "home space" I was jumped and the brand new ship destroyed - and it wss the worst thing that ever happened to me.
I logged off in rage and despair and couldn't bring myself to log on for days after.
But after awhile, the pain subsided and I began thinking sttategically tathrr than emotionally. I realized that the worst had happened and it wasn't - actually - THAT bad.
It began to take its place as a learning experience.
Exactly this. It sucks, but once you've experienced it, it becomes part of the experience. That risk is what makes the game worthwhile.
you don't need to travel through ls for ship, and if you need, go first with shuttle to see is anyone on the gates, and do that when there are no too many players, like eu time 5 in the morning, and put low modules for fast align time, and first warp 100km of the gate, cloak or do the mwd trick, put and one w.stab... Check zkill for that systems, see who is regular killer, watch local chat, or find wh's to skip ls... And most important, fly ships that you got money for at least 10 of them, and skills for at least lev.4 on most important skills for that ship. And make few alpha players, for scanning, scouting, ded ratting, trading and hauling. Don't go through faction war ls.
I used thousand of Skill points when i started to learn and acquire a porpoise industrial command ship, costing 200 mil, not realizing its true purpose, and lost it first trip out in HIGH sec at an asteroid belt. 200m and countless SP wasted because I LEARNED never fly what you cant afford to.
@@NNiolet if you learned, then it wasn't wasted 😊
Use filaments....eve this days is very easy compared to what used to be
To finding our round hole! 😥 🍻....Also, only Sith deal in absolutes...Great video as always!
Original alpha Cult of Cthulu player from June 03 just came back today and started looking for tutorials.
I've been in and out over the years but recently been out for 6 years.
Boy it has changed. So much new for me to learn on this latest journey. I've not un docked yet as I'm trying to find where all my stuff is still LOL.
Like your content a lot.
Glad you're enjoying and hope you can find your feet soon!
Great video. I find myself thinking these things occasionally, but I’ve had experiences that make me realize I wouldn’t be playing this if it didn’t have this realism. It was only by losing a ship and finding that I could learn how to avoid it that I had fun. It has been years since a game provided me an experience like this and it’s worth having, worth keeping. Thanks for your videos.
Thanks for this video Cap. I lost a brand new cyclone i just bought, along with about a billion isk worth of ships, lost drugs, etc. just fighting in a fw system this week, and was feeling kind of down after i got spearfished and killed by a gang of frigates off the dock with my buddy 300m away helplessly watching as they killed me pretty pitifully. Ive been playing the game a few months, and though ive learned alot i was feeling pretty bad. someone else there in system gave me some similiar advice, and honestly up until that point i had a lot of fun with the other fights, but it sucks when you think you know enough to make a decent fit, and are confident in it just to be blown to hell in 4 seconds and youre back to being broke lol. really its just bittersweet and thats why this video was perfect timing. Thanks for all the content. i know i have to get better if this game is going to remain fun for me
That does suck, and I've been there myself 😅 that said, I agree, accept that it happens, and try again 😉
@@captainbenzie I can relate. I was knocked out after a couple month's of playing as well - went away for 1 entire year, and is now back :-)
"This game was made for a very specific kind of person." That's refreshing to hear for once!
The Devs have outright said it repeatedly
Was ment for 40 year old virgins..
Great talk. Twenty years ago, I played another "niche" game and I was completely hooked. Over the years, that particular game completely lost it's appeal to me because the developers did just what you described; they tried to make the game appeal to everyone. Eve definitely has the right recipe for success. For years I avoided playing Eve because I did not like the idea of permanent ship loss. Now that I play Eve and have totally fallen in love with it, I understand why permanent ship loss is central to the game mechanics and economy, plus since I spend a good bit of my time mining tritanium producing ore, I'm perfectly fine with players blapping each other's ships day after day. 🤣😂
100% on all your points, thanks for breaking this down for the non dedicated players that just don't understand.
Took me a few years to get used to the fact that loss is indeed necessary, that's not to say it's easy, but learning to cope, and purposely feeding yourself to the wolves to get a true feel of it really helps desensitize yourself to the loss.
I good rule of thumb I use when playing eve is, the ship I undock is already destroyed, docking back up safely is just an unexpected bonus. Also never fly what you can't afford to lose, if you spend all your isk on a blinged out ship and get ganged, that's on you, should have flown cheaper, now you have to start way back to catch back up to where you were.
The reason I enjoy this game is that Risk that you have because the game is at it's at it's core a pvp game. When go into a wormhole in an exploration ship, knowing my ship has no teeth and no tank, hitting Data and Relic sites and avoiding folks who are trying to kill me is EXCITING!! Look at other MMO's that are safe after EVE and I find myself getting so bored and start nodding off.
Exactly this. The thrill of being hunted ♥️
I fully agree with you Benzie , but what i would say is that , this game still has so much more potential and so much it can still be added to it , But i would love the game till my last breath on this earth . Time invested game !
Oh yeah, definitely loads that can be added but within that niche design goal
Greeting from a South African neighbour! Used to watch your Echoes videos a few years back, loving your Eve Online vids man
Glad you like them!
Agree so much on the specialized games. I understand developers want to cover as much of a market as possible, but their games just get forgotten as they don't stand out. I would rather have 10 completely different games so i can choose one, instead of 10 clones.
Better to be a big fish in a small pond than a small fish in a big pond :)
Exactly this
I've been following your posts on TH-cam for quite a while now. I am (like many of your other fans, most likely) thrilled by your way of accompanying this unique "niche game" with such enthusiasm, almost autobiographically. Now to the actual point. Yes, I agree with you on all three of your points! The game is and remains a unique gem among MMO games in the context of space simulation. It is a pure PVP game and thrives on a few players willing to invest. I've been playing since 2008, and in my early days, I had a few problems understanding the game in its entirety - I've started to enjoy the game's many nooks and crannies. Despite my resilience in the face of the usual "problems", a few points drive me crazy! Firstly, the killboard-junkie attitude ... I have often experienced how, during various short talks, the self-inflicted bad scoring in this meta-crawler is taken as an opportunity to make fun of players, even though (according to your explanations) it shouldn't matter. On the other hand, many players see this game as a kind of Second Live, especially those who want to play CEO in a smaller corporation. That's one of the biggest problems in the game. Anyway, I just wanted to "vent". Thanks for your great videos-please keep them coming!
Thank you ☺️ and yes, I agree about the Kill boards. I lost the first Mamba to PvE and was heavily mocked for it, despite it being because I had the balls to push an expensive new ship to its limits to see what it could do. Over the years, I've had numerous people use my Zkillboard as a "gotcha", which is just weird. 😂
Talking to yourself about EVE while spinning your ship in station is peak EVE gameplay. Sillyness aside, you make some great points here. Especially about the longievity of mass-market titles vs. niche games that lean into their theme v. hard.
Thank you 😊 honestly, I figured it would be easier to focus on my notes if I wasn't trying to rat or PvP 😂
I played another pvp-oriented game that suddenly flipped to actively discouraging pvp to keep new players interested. Newer people stayed longer but about half of the established playerbase quit on the spot 😶🌫️
I got into eve shortly after and have been having a great time!
Exactly what would happen here too. Which game btw?
I started playing Eve the same year that Chamber of Secrets came out. Within a year of that, when Eve was released, a battleship would be the equivalent of an expensive carrier these days, give or take. My group had trapped an enemy battleship who decided to make his way to a safe spot but didn't log off. He just sat there. This was before probes and being able to warp to people. But we still had dscan and some brains. This was also before they stopped letting you put multiple mwds and abs to ships. I made some safe spots as close to where he was as possible, got a ship that could go ludicris speed, and spent a couple hours flying towards him until he finally appeared on grid. He didn't even fight back. Prolly wasn't near the screen. But I do wonder if he said omg wtf when he got back. I wonder if he still plays. But that was fun and there are hundreds more of those types of moments as time goes on. I still "play" this spreadsheet, though.
Was that a challenge you issued at the beginning of the video? :)
I think you overlooked a truth about EVE Online that for you probably is very uncomfortable. While EVE may be a PvP game, PvE players pay the bills. Just look back to the summer and fall of 2019. During the Chaos Era CCP decided to make it easier for PvP-focused players to hunt by removing local in null sec. Once it was clear local wasn't coming back, so many "carebears" told CCP to go take a hike, unsubbed, and went to play WoW Classic. CCP quickly brought back local within a few weeks.
CCP's revenue really took a beating in the second half of 2019. In fact, you have to go back to 2008 to see CCP's yearly revenue below 2019's $51.1 million. And the financial records show it hasn't dipped to within 10% of that since.
quite literally a steam game that is eve offline, plenty of space games that dont have pvp, you people are such 1st dimension thinkers, all of those games are dead because without the pvp pilots there isnt much of an end game to the grind.
Stop wanting your cake and eating it to, you either want your actions to matter even if they are non violent or you want to play a game where no one can be violent to you.
except you dont want that game because you play eve and your not playing all the versions of space games that you claim to want.
Ying and yang, push and pull, I enjoy almost all activities in eve and watching the two sides of the players base dividing themselves as enemies when no one told them to is hilariously brain dead, everyone matters, take one aspect of the playerbase out and the game will cease to function, we turn off pvp for 1 day and the economy would stop moving.
to be clear you are also correct, without the sheep the wolves starve and die, and without the wolves the sheep over populate like drones with no limits until the place they inhabit is dead.
Quite literally a universal truth of biological beings even when they are simply projecting there will into a virtual space.
Something that you may have overlooked in saying that “because local in null was removed the bears left and CCP took a hit and had to reverse…”. Is the fact that without local it would make the ability to bot and script significantly more difficult thus not economical to use that method for fully plexing all your accounts.
Cap'n B, a really good job here so thanks. My guess is that something like my experience is really rare across gaming. Played intensely for about 5 years, waking up in middle of night to check skill queue and all, not that I still didn't, well, suck, at it . . . Then, IRL had the audacity to mess with me and I faded away. And now, over 7 years later, I decided to come back. How often does that happen in gaming? Not rhetorical--you know, I don't. And when I came back, CCP just friggin' restored everything I had spread all over New Eden. I'm very impressed. But I'm also a bit scared--when I played before I was a busy working person, but now, I-socalled-RL, I'm retired and there's no real limit, no reason to ever log out. So, even though I'm embarrassed by how bad I am at the core pvp, the recognition I'll probably never be even adequate, no less elite, I still really wanna get . . . better. I like this niche.
I liked this video, thanks for sharing your perspectives, ... sorry: absolute truths. I've played solo, which is a lot of fun, just cruising around, comparing spreadsheets, ... IN SPACE! and I've teamed, which is fun, too. I do love how Eve is Eve, and it's uncompromising in its Eve-ness. I respect this game for what it is, and that it doesn't try to pander. "This is the game. You play it this way." and doing so just works. Oh: and sad-face gif 😥 because I listened to your whole video.
The game may not be designed for solo, but that doesn't mean it's not possible to solo and to have a tonne of fun doing so 😉 it's just not usually the best course for a newer player trying to learn the game. I'm glad you've found your fun though!!
Sir, you get a like and a sub purely for the passion in your voice when you talk about Eve! 😀 It’s great to see/hear, and makes me want to jump back in (again) to the void! Keep up the awesome content mate 👍
Spinning an Ishtar with a short point on it is the best content in Eve.
😂 I found my round hole lol. I’m loving this type of content. I moved to null so I don’t have to worry about checking this screen and I can just listen. Also totally agree with you.
Glad you've found your fun!
@@captainbenzie 2 years and running. No plans on leaving. love your content dude! Keep at it! :)
I love gankers trying to kill my abyssal ship only for their coercers to be greeted by my two alts brick tanked 1000 dps suicidal brutixes which promptly suicide gank their entire fleet of ganking coercers. Survive better, gank the ganker 😂😊 Not even gankers are safe!
Amen to this!!
@@captainbenzie Yep, if they bring Taloses to gank, then Nagas will be their hosts.
HELL YES!!!!!!
I love this game! I started playing years ago and then I stopped for RL issues. Lately, I find myself wanting to play. While some live to kill, which is great, I love being able to get away or sneak around the opposition as a PI and industrialist. The cat and mouse is a great challenge. If there wasn't a REAL chance of getting blown up, it would barely be worth playing.
Exactly, yet there are still many who want that safety 😅
I play Eve sporadically and I play it like a survival Game. Dayz in space. I play solo. How long can I survive. That’s my fun.
Someone or something must have triggered you bud.
Love the videos btw.
The last video of his I watched(I think it was the one where he's complaining about multi-boxing) felt a lot like this too.
Playing EVE Online while listening to these "talking points" videos is a really interesting way to play lol I agree with everything said including the round hole... I've also had the most fun in the game when the stakes are the highest, exe. going into wormholes with ships worth almost 100mil. I've also had a load of fun as part of a corp. but it's sooo hard finding a good corp anymore.. I enjoy all aspects of the game from the PVE to the PVP I've gotten pretty good at evading other players but never dabbled too much in actually sticking around to finish the fight. In my personal experience with EVE (off and on for 15 years) I've had more luck in PVE than PVP. In my case everyone has to find their niche within a niche game. very good points in here and very well said.
Talk about adrenaline... having a full Hauler in null-sec and having all the 'correct' modules that allow you to just barely slip through gankers fingers.
Popping out a gate... Cloaking up... watching them scramble around trying to decloak you... as you align.... drop cloak... interdiction nullifier and warp core stabilizers running as they try and target you and whoosh you are gone... watching them jump to the next gate .... where you did NOT jump to LOL
what a rush.
Amen to this!!
based vid! 4th unpopular truth would be that eve players in general aren't as good or as smart as they think of themselves, and there are highsec miners and F1 monkeys who unironically look down on other MMO's while in reality what they do in EVE is not too different to games our grandparents play via facebook
Oof, truth 😅
Great job of setting these truths in plain sight. I agree with everything you’ve said. I hope it has helped folks to save time and money in deciding whether they are going to stay or leave.
Thank you for your shared enthusiasm Captain!
Thank you so much for your support!! 🚀♥️
😊Been playing a month, joined EH corp.. Had soooo much fun found a relic site yesterday that was littered with Mines.. Lost my astero in the blink of an eye 😅 good times :)
Oof! I do love those sites but that still stings!
"Get better!" lol - yeah, exactly. That's why I watch your vids man!
😂
very good and honest talk! as a 12 year old eve player, i agree with everything.
Thank you 😊
I totally agree with you but, yeah playing since 2005 and I've allways meet some great pilot, pvp or pve, and they teach me how to not lose your ship because it's hard earned isks, even a cruiser back in the days was a big thing, then killboard came in, and corporation didnt want us to lose to much isk, so after all this I fly very carefully and still hurt me when losing a ship. I got more fun since I care less about blowing up but I was used to follow the no lose doctrine and it was something good to learn some good way of playing, but yeah, maybe a bit boring sometimes. After all, everyone play like he want to, and I think that's the more important, you're right, but the pve player has his point of view too and from there he's right too...
I am a PVE player, not a PVPer. Thing is, in EVE, everything is PVP. You may not be hunting, but you are still prey to PVPers. You have to accept that and also understand that the risk is what makes you profitable. Ship loss needs to happen to keep materials etc in demand, the trick is to not be the one losing ships.
Ships are ammo. Don't fly what you can't afford to lose, and always have spares for when you inevitably do lose one.
😂 Yes Benzie, this is absolutely true. I enjoyed and this needs to be learned!
Thank you
Another fantastic video. I love that you call these uncomfortable truths but after nearly 20 years in EVE I'm thinking... no. No I'm quite comfortable with these truths hah, these are the rules of the universe I love more than ours 😅
Glad you enjoyed it
I just love the ships design and all the complicated stuff for it to work. I need to upgrade my PC so I can use Windows 10 optimally and then come back to Eve Online.
Started EVE a few days ago and I've had a good time completing enforcer missions and hunting pirates solo.
Currently browsing corps to find people to play with occasionally, but my solo experience so far has been pretty good!😊
Glad you're enjoying! Do feel free to check out Catskull, as we may be a group you'd enjoy!
CCP only went plus 2023 by cryptocurrency sale outside of Eve. Right now Eve is not profitable. It's a sinking ship, saved only by pearl abyss. While i don't think Eve should change its identity. It is clear that it struggles immensely to attract new players and retain returning ones. And that's counting in the effects of the ludicrous price hike of Omega.
The old dogs of EVE and CCP themself can resist change all they want. A large number of players want change, and there's a huge market out there to appeal to while still retaining the spirit off EVE and its niche. There's a large spectrum, not a binary scale in which EVE can evolve within.
Or CCP can remain Impervious to any and all change and in a few years i'll watch the Benzie youtube video about EVEs greatest moments before the server closed down... for good.
Are the changes you want to make going to attract and keep enough players to offset the losses in dedicated players who've spent a lot of money and time that like the game more the way it is?
This is the dilemma every MMO faces long-term. Watch Josh Strife Hayes re: how MMO's generally are not a profitable model in the 2020's - Eve is a niche market within a niche market. I love it but it will only ever appeal to thousands, not millions.
They can bend the revenue curve by changing pricing, subscription terms etc... It does not require changing the gameplay in radical ways to chase mass appeal.
"Right now Eve is not profitable" - eve online as a standalone product is profitable. CCP itself isn't profitable because they've invested a lot of money into new IP (like the new shooter, new beta test this weekend)
you doing realise as well that being profitable also means being taxable and therefore most companies do not aim to be profitable intentionally.
I start Player EVE online yesterday. I saw benzies Videos why he leave Eve Echos and opened my eyes. Eve online is After years of updates so a good Game. I used the ref link :P thank u for your Support for the ppl
Well said! And welcome home!
I remember years ago(not long after player-built stations were added) my corp spent months building and transporting a station to null-sec and setting it up in ZMV-9. We gathered the minerals, built the parts, and scouted it down in a freighter. Within a few months it was traded with the neighbouring alliance we were at war with, behind our corp's back.
A while later (after those stations became fully destructable) my corp (me included) were in one of the fleets that blew it up!
Even as a very PvE-centric player (in general, not just EVE), I get why EVE is the way it is. The only time it's a problem is when there is a major system change that affects the risk-reward balance; when NPCs stopped stocking shuttles, drakes went from 30mil to 60mil, and suddenly whelping 5 full fleets of them in a single engagement became punishingly expensive. It took a while for the rewards for holding space to match the risks of holding it, but it did happen.
My love for PvP has been the reason I've chosen to only train subcap ships. It provides me a flexible arsenal of inexpensive PvP ships to play with and learn with.
Exactly this! I also have no use for caps in anything else
That’s why I love industry. Always hated losing ships, but I love creating them and giving them to people who love to get out there all for a good amount of ISK and a sense of reliability when they need another fitted ship.
Exactly. Losing your own ships can suck, so the trick is making sure you don't lose yours - not making the game safer!
I would not mind more instanced content like deadspace but even then when you pop out of the last room, you can still be killed that's part of the game.
Exactly, and high risk too
im a full time miner in high sec, and really I fully agree with you, but steady action brings steady rewards
I do agree to these facts. Started playing in 2020 and had a pause of 2 years. The fact that destruction and all those things to it affects most is necessary for everyone to succeed.Nowadays I do Wh stuff with a fleet of friends.
When I first joined a nullsec alliance and we went out and got jumped by Carriers and then more people came and it escalated to absolute mayhem was a lot of fun. However, the most astonishing part and the part that has remained in my memory for so long is after the fight, where everyone was - thank you, good fight, lets do it again tomorrow, awesome job team and so on. There was no anger or crying or copmplaining about what was lost, it was pure fun and everyone wanted to do it again. Thats EVE!
OMG - bestest, funniest, most LOL-worthy video about Eve Online I've ever come across. Please continue, and don't change a thing!
Haha thank you
Great thoughts Benzie, been following you since eve echoes - love your vision of this game
Much appreciated!
The best description I ever heard of Eve Online is "It's not the kind of game to smack the cookie from your hand. It's the kind of game to knock the cookie from your hand, grind it slowly into the dirt and then laugh at you while staring into your eyes."
Accurate 😂
this is the best for sure
I have played solo since 2015 I would maybe 2016 and I’m not a fan of PVP but I have to give props to the most exhilarating experience I had in the game. I wanted to do the pirate story that takes you to low sec I think for the missions. So anyway i fit a minamatar destroyer with a cloaking device because I wanted to get to the mission agent undetected. So just as I entered the low sec system I noticed the gate camp and immediately turned in the cloak and aligned to the next gate and I had to navigate around the gate camp that knew I was there but didn’t knew here I was so they began to fly around erratically to bump me but usinga the grid I was able to get around them and past them but all the while you experience to a sensation of excitement and danger from the pilots trying to figure out where I went so they can get the kill mail. Anyway it was exciting and heart is pounding. Just never felt an experience like that in any other game. Long story short I was able to outmaneuver them and get away to when they were no longer on grid and warped to the next gate. It was the most fun I have ever had in any game. Wormhole space is kinda like that because at any moment you could be scanned down while running the sites and that lurking danger that can happen gives a feeling of urgency. Higher sense of danger that can come from anywhere. I absolutely love eve online. But back to the pirate mission. I was able to get to the mission agent and accept the mission completed one mission but died in the very next one. But I didn’t mind it because I outflew some seasoned pvp players and I take pride in it as an accomplishment even though pvp isn’t really my thing. It was a blast.
This is exactly the point with EVE, that consequence of real loss makes these encounters all the more meaningful and pulse pounding! Well done!
I agree even though I've spent the majority of my time playing solo.
I first subbed back in 2009. I got into mining and moved to an 06 system bordering low-sec - Teonusude. Didn't really understand what the game was about at that point. I skilled myself into a Retriever mining barge and promptly got ganked. That's when I realised just how dangerous eve was and I loved that. It changed my path as I needed to adapt. I didn't mine again until I was able to fly a hulk with the skills to tank it. Yes I lost some yield, but so what. It's what I had to do to survive. I got myself an alt and began skilling her into an orca with command link skills. I've never lost a barge since.
Gankers could have killed me. They only needed to bring a few more ships, but there were so many miners favouring yield over safety they didn't need to. Every attack on me failed. Probably less than 10 attempts over the years as those paying attention would move on to the next target.
I love the danger in eve. That I needed to change my gameplay to survive. To be a less attractive target than everyone else. I salute the lawless pirates of eve for causing me genuine anxiety. It adds so much to the experience O7
In return I have provided many kills for them. Although I enjoy combat PvP I'm not too good at it. If we meet in combat you will win!
While I agree eve is better played with others, I've been a solo player most of the time. I'm a bit of a low confidence type person that struggles with initial interactions with others. It doesn't help that I don't need interaction in life so I don't always push myself to overcome, but when I have it has been a great experience with some great people. I would highly recommend joining a corp, but it is possible to enjoy eve as a solo player. I have no choice but to run solo atm, but I do hope to fleet up with others again in the future.
One last thing. After coming back to eve recently, and being a little rusty and not paying proper attention I lost two prowlers and three pods in one day! Terrible piloting, but happy to add to the economy and my fellow players enjoyment.
I agree but setting yourself up to be infallible on the topic to begin with doesn’t help support your arguments.
It's not setting myself up to get infallible, it's the info. I'm stating facts, not opinions. It's not my opinion that the game was designed for group play, that's the development team.
Its true, i life in wormholes and have for a very long time. Yes i have taken breaks because we all need to but its a very fun game. I have niche toons for either wormhole life and recently working on a mission runner. All aspects of the game is extremely fun to me and I will always play but with breaks here and there.
Killing is just a means of communicaaaaatshuuuuuunn...(Thank you for using this anniversary edition memorygram! Please deposit 5 billion isk now to continue experiencing.)
😂😂😂 I miss Permaband.
Nothing says that someone lacks the confidence in their arguments more than saying "don't argue with me bro, just trust that I'm right!". Especially odd to make that claim and then proceed to make a number of errors talking about economics and game design. A true high sec for those that wanted it, as well as providing a chill space for more PvP orientated players to occasionally just relax in would be fine. The opinions of gankers -- who make a big deal about "nowhere should be risk free" while trying to engage in what is some of the lowest risk gaming in EVE -- can safely be ignored.
Far too many sad acts playing EVE who think their version of fun should be the only acceptable method.
You've missed the points profoundly. If you have an argument about farming, do you listen to the farmer, or the guy who lives next to a farm?
There's a fine line between arrogance and expertise. I'm not confident enough to be arrogant, but I do know this shit. And you're 100% wrong about Hisec. Tomorrow's video addresses that. Anyone making the argument that "Hisec could be completely safe and it would be fine" does not understand the game at all. We have seen exactly that experiment play out in EVE, and it ABSOLUTELY FUCKED the game totally. Tune in tomorrow and I'll explain fully.
@@captainbenzie No it's you who is taking it too far. The effect on the economy all of high sec has is next to none. The real isk is made in null and everybody knows that. Majority of price hikes and inflation in the game were caused by optimised c5 ratting/abyss/escalation 10 running and just plain botting. Some dudes farming l4 in peace in high sec isn't even close to being a dent on the economy, same as some other dudes in 5 mill fits insta popping these newbies carrying 150 mil to jita ALSO has next to no effect on the economy besides making that new player quit the game and never come back.
I don't get how can people still be making these points, like a guy making something like 25 mill an hour in high sec is somehow a threat to the economy and inflation, while another guy making 1.2+ bill per hour or even more solo perfectly save in corp space in null is not, like what. You can have 40 newbies farming eyes closed and they still won't even match this other guy in Null. I'm NoT ArRoGaNt aM RiGHt. If you have to say it, you most certainly are :) You make some fair points, but also some that aren't at all. High sec never had a high influence of eve economy as a whole. Never.
"while trying to engage in what is some of the lowest risk gaming in EVE -- can safely be ignored. " you reside in a single slice of an entire pie and the result is you think this is the the form of pvp people choose, I cant even explain why you cant see beyond that because you literally lack knowledge found in the rest of the pie.
So leave your wormy little safe zone, join a corp and ask how do I kill people, then go see how easy and risk free it is kid.
*grabs a popcorn*
Hisec gankers are an important part of the game. Just git gud bro.
Like the points, like the analysis. Dont like the aggression. I know its emotional for you as it was for me with a core pvp player in world of tanks. But as much as you want to tell them to accepts the ways of the game and it dont changes, It would count the same for you. These ppl will not change and will not stop to be unhappy. And this is a good thing. It makes your circle of friends a more valuable thing. You in eve, the others who do not understand. happy vibes in the wormhole boy! I heard after the last patch sleepers deal more damage the more unhappy you are 😊
Please don't mistake passion for aggression or sadness 😁 I'm happy with people feeling however they feel, the aim of this video was simply to state "This is how it is" and maybe get some folks thinking about the "why" and "how to engage with that"
I played EVE literally 10 years ago. My favorite memory is doing a race through low and null sec space with my corpies. We all took Tristans, a planned route, first one back to Hi Sec won a ship. I won, somehow. Everyone else got ganked. I made sure to dodge the interdiction bubbles by bouncing off random moons before warping to the next gate.
EVE is a niche game that should remain PVP-focused but shouldn’t be stagnant. It should always adapt. You used Fortnite as an example. It remained PVP-focused but removed building and to much appreciation by many. Allowing more people to see how great EVE as a game is can only be good. More players add a lot to a pvp-focused game.
Oh absolutely should not stagnate, but it must remain within the tight confines of what makes the game unique
Well one thing is for sure eve is the most "valid game".... if you play aoe 4 or sc2 you will face map hackers if you play Rust, Cod, Tarcov, Dark and darker will face wall hackers and aim bot if you play if you think your safe playing wow nope watch pika hell show you many top level games vs players using bots and scripts.... In moderen online games cheating has basically ruined the validity every time you die or losse you wonder and wondering is bad... Eve is good because theres no map hacks wall hacks or aim bots when i die in eve i know its my fault and that is good because i know it was me.
I agree absolutely
Go find your round hole!! love it, but sound advice summed up well, hard for allot of people to hear but if they could follow your advice everyone would be happier, well done
100% agree.
What he is talking about is the equivalent of a person starting to play Age of Empires saying "this should have first person WOW mechanic combat"... or going to WOW and saying "This game needs hardcore survival mechanics" .... etc etc.
Play the games that you like playing.... not all games will be what you like... so either dont play them... or go into them with the mindset that you want to try to embrace something new.
Exactly this, thank you!!
The two most amazing things that ever happened to me in Eve were:
a) soloing a blaster Hecate and his tackle Condor with my alpha clone Magnate. I had 49 hull hp at the end of the fight.
b) The first fleet I ever commanded was an armor timer in a wormhole. I had a Magnate Navy leading 2 Blaster Punishers, a kitey Hookbill, and an Inquisitor. We killed 7 Oracles and 9 Augorers without losing a single ship. The entire fleet cost 80 mil and we killed 970m.
That's amazing 😂
I enjoy EVE Online solo, but then again I also enjoyed getting 99 mining and woodcutting in Old School RuneScape so I'm definitely not the typical case.
Lmao wow 😂
Im an New to eve, I love it !!! Ist Like real Life!!! But Virtual, Like you Said learn, and get competent, and provoke mistakes to master them and knowing how to even use a mistake to get better.
"... Eve is dying, It's been dying since 2003..."
Yep, I've been hearing that since 2013, still hear it 'til this day and yet it keeps moving along and is still here and I will probably be here with it until the end (either mine or the games). Granted, i may not play all the time or consecutively in any meaningful stretches but I am still here.
Love the creator content and all you hard work. Keep it up and I hop to see tons more.
Ciao for now and fly safe Captain.
o7
Thank you ☺️
Lol I love your passion for this game. Keep up the great work.
Thank you
Your big 3 points are 100% correct. I do have some small criticisms but it doesn't detract from the big 3.
1. Eve can be a solo game. I've been an on again off again player since 2009. The vast majority of my time was solo-ish. But as a solo player you are mostly going to be in the "prey" role, not predator. And that's totally fine.
Edit: I want to clarify I'm not saying you don't interact with other players as a solo player. But it's very much a You against the world experience. If you enjoy being a small fish in a big pond, then Eve is a great solo game.
2. I would argue some losses are unavoidable. The VAST majority are not, but sometimes you WILL lose a ship even if you play perfectly. That doesn't mean you rage at the game, but I've seen arrogant players who think they have no risk because of their skill lose VERY expensive ships. Off the top of my head, cloaky smartbomb proteus in wspace doesn't really have a counter if you're in an explo frig, especially if they scanned the system before you arrived. Risk assessment and risk to profit analysis is a skill, because you might just get unlucky. If nothing else, you're only human and you'll eventually make a mistake, so plan accordingly!
3. I do think you downplay some of the reason why older players are a bit, well, bitter. It's not because Eve isn't for them, but rather that Eve changed in ways that are contrary to the old guard of certain groups. My big "calling" in Eve was 3 things: Wspace PvE, Ninja Looting/Mission Ganking, FW PvP. 2 of them are doing great. But the fact that Abyssals are instanced, Wardec mechanics have changed to encourage highsec blocs, and a bunch of other small changes over time means that highsec griefing is in a really bad place.
I am NOT saying we should remove ganking or anything like that. Rather, I'm saying it's bad for the game that suicide ganking and camping Jita with 60+ wardecs is the only viable highsec PvP left. I'm angry at CCP for making highsec too safe, and nerfing into the ground *many* playstyles which made highsec PvP so fun. It's not all bad. The changes to remote assistance are a great change imho. But a lot of the more subtle or nuanced forms of PvP such as baiting, 1 man corp wardecs, stalking players over the long term, simply aren't a thing anymore.
In short, I agree Eve is a PvP game and a very hostile game. I disagree that CCP is doing a great job on that front. Highsec needs another overhaul of crimewatch, wardecs, and Abyssals to encourage more types of highsec PvP. Because Suicide ganking is dreadfully boring. Necessary, to be sure. I don't want it nerfed. But I'd like other options buffed to viability again.
Boy, I was PISSED losing my first OMEN. I'm out for revenge (which is best served COLD) but I'm taking my time - cool, calm, and collected - I guess that's what your video elaborates upon.
Exactly!
i didnt see the other vids and i dont see a reason to call it high sec if its not and why would it ruin the game?
It's High Security, not Total Security.
We saw this in EVE Echoes where you cannot shoot other players in Hisec. A large community forms where they farm entirely safely. They never have to buy anything, replace anything. They have their ship and they just grind isk like a high score.
This floods the game with ISK, with Hisec ores, with modules etc. those ores and modules become saturated and worthless. ISK deflates in value dramatically, which in turn causes PLEX to skyrocket in price, making Omega near impossible to PLEX.
You end up making it impossible to Omega without swiping, players leave, and CCP loses money because the PLEX market is what makes the most cash for them.
It utterly destroyed Echoes
@@captainbenzie ok, thx for your explaination
Thank you for this video I came back to eve to try it again and this video gave me a different perspective than what I was playing years ago now I get it Eve is a pvp game 😅 I think it should even be on their logo instead of it saying Eve online it should say Eve PvP😂 with a slogan "no one is safe"
EVE is often considered to be short for "Everyone VS Everyone"
I loved this rant. It’s exactly how I feel about EVE.
o7
Just recently came back to eve, I've never gotten very far in it (mainly because every time I end up starting a new character to re learn how to play lol) but I always enjoy it. I find it funny that the two games I play the most right now are eve online and elite dangerous, two games that are old as hell. Lol
Welcome home!!
I was a invested player for about 10 years and CCP made a lot of money off me. One thing CCP needs to be careful about is burning the loyal player. When I quit it was done in a way that I would never be tempted to ever come back.
Holy crap this video is super contentious and preachy. It's like this dude was in the boards and lost an argument on what Eve online is as a game. I mean he is mostly correct but dude if someone plays the game another way this guy is going to pop a vain.
Wow did you misunderstand me. I'm happy for people to play however they want - but that doesn't mean the game was designed for that.
People solo EVE, and do well solo. They have a great time being alone in New Eden. The Devs have absolutely stated that the game is designed around group play. That's my point.
So if someone is soloing the game and complaining that they're struggling, that's why.
Also, if you quit in such a way that you will never be tempted to come back... How "loyal" are you? Point here is that labels like "loyal customer" don't matter. The game stopped being for you, and that's fine. Find your fun, whether it's in EVE or some other game. No point playing something you don't enjoy.
@@captainbenzie I didn't misunderstand as I said you are mostly right. You just got very worked up. I played the game to have fun and fun I had. It was not any kind of loyalty towards CCP. The developers and mods play favorites and do some dirty things most players don't know about.
Events can play out so badly that a hardcore player like me that was on top of the Eve world calls it quits. I ended up Biomassing all my characters and gave what was probably was close to $10,000 USD in ISK to my buddy a high ranking member of Imperium AKA (Goonswarm).
I can tell you for sure I will never play the game again. And that is probably for the best . But the game is absolutely my kind of game.
Loosing ships gives points to the AIR carrier program. EVE is quiet comfortable nowadays: I remember times we lost skill points by getting podded if used the wrong clone, or loosing skill points by loosing strategic cruisers - times pass by...
Started almost a month ago and had my first pvp today while ratting in null sec lost my ship. This video made that loss a lot easier to swallow.
Well done! The first is always the worst and it'll get easier!
Is eve online worth getting into in 2024? Ive tried to get into it a few times before but the time gated progression trough tech levels is one of the biggest turn offs for me along with having to pay a monthly subscription to be actually able to play the game.
tbh with you, yes, this is the best time to try eve. Not because of the reasons people will tell you... The reason is the new player experience inproved so freaking much over the past few years... You never feel lost, there is always something to do and the tracking of it is crazy... Then and then you can find what tickles your mind, be it industrialism, pve, pvp, exploration... that kind of thing... The only real "gate" that I consider now is the industrial one, but for a good reason: Today you cannot be really competitive nor profitable by trying to create stuff, otherwise the economy would go to sh* :D all other "professions" in game you can kinda grasp, and homefront ops are a good way to start. My goto for new players: 1- do the carreer missions, 2- do the sister of eve epic arc 3- get into a corp to do homefront ops :) after that the game is yours
honest answer, probably not. The only way you would ever "enjoy" it is you instantly join some of the bigger alliances/corps in null, rush into their space, start farming drone escalations and selling them. Imho but it's the only realistic way to somewhat learn eve without getting popped the moment you gather the smallest amount of isk for basic ship progress. There's so many people out there who have been skilling for decade that in this rock/paper/scissors pvp and ganking game you don't really stand a chance for a very extended period of time without some real protection. High sec just is both boring AND very dangerous
Eve is a great game, but it's not really a game designed for casual players. Everything in the game takes time be it gathering resources, progressing skills, or building ships and items. But I will tell you that with the right group of people it's an absolutely awesome experience. Give it a shot. Find a corp see if it clicks with you. If not, try another. Eventually you'll find something you enjoy.
It took me 3 previous attempts where I didn't really get past or used to the UI. The 4th time was around September last year. Spent about 2000 hours playing since. Once you find what you like to do and a group to roll with it's a fantastic game. For me this was a smaller group in low sec that offer a large amount of things to do be it ratting, mining, small and large group PvP, scanning and hacking. Sure it's not the null battles with trillions of isk in losses but those can be a bit overwhelming for someone new.
I would definetly say its never to late to start. ❤
bro, i joined last month and played for a month with omega.
u need a whole fleet to even move 500M between Jita and a hisec, plus the time sink, isn't a game for a guy that works and has just 2 or 3 hours to play
the lack of solo content made me unsub
fully agree, eve online will always struggle to grow when "noob" high sec is straight the worst place imaginable for new players to ever play the game in.
It just makes no sense that some gankers in a few million isk whatever builds can just alpa one shot kill you as you warp in and the structure isn't even loaded yet, as new player over and over for no other benefit to themselves other than kekw ezpz pirate life yo. I've had several friends who I tried to get into the game just plain quit it because how are they going to learn basics and grow confidence if whenever they save up for their vexor or whatever they just get ganked doing basic high sec escalations / mining or even just l2-l3 missions. I honestly just plain despise people that get some sick pleasure out of one shot-ing new players for genuinely zero benefit. Entire corps exist that do nothing but sit in empty space for hours on end doing nothing but drink on voice and wait for easy prey.
Like, I get it, I enjoyed ultima online, i've been in pvp corps and roaming fleets, and solo, but I think there should be a place for people to learn basic ropes, otherwise community will just never grow. It's like if you put kids into some sports like football and then make them play against 18 y olds that have been doing it for the last 10 years, and when they lose those 18 yolds are jumping sending them mail and texts how it was so easy and exciting to them. It'll just never grow and that sucks, eve is an amazing game and the more players play it the more content and actually fun events there are in the universe.
It's awesome to have pvp in games, even if when not both parties want to engage into it, making safe hauling or farming pve part of the risk you take. BUT, if a new person is saving for weeks for some basic ship only to then lose it approaching Jita or Dodixie or whatever to sell his new loot than idk, it just sucks imho that it's a thing. Like the game tells him "high sec" is high security zones.
As it is by far the most sensible thing for new players to do is joining some large null sec corp and just legging it there naked and starting the game there. Kinda illogical
They said all this at Fanfest too. Best thing to do is reach out and corp up asap.
Just don't be bad. Eve is easy game.
One of the biggest delusions that a lot of die hard eve players have, as illustrated in this vid, is this idea that having a super safe high sec for new players would kill the game. It wouldn't. Everyone fucking knows it wouldn't. It's just a verbal diehard chunk who cling to this obsession of nowhere being safe.
@@bouncingboredom EVE Echoes abso-fucking-lutely proved it kills the game. You get the majority of players just sitting in Hisec grinding ISK non stop, never needing to replace a ship, continually flooding the game with more ISK and modules etc. It absolutely breaks the game because ISK and those modules all devalue, let alone Hisec ores etc... and if you don't understand this, you simply do not understand the inner mechanism of what makes EVE tick.
If you play eve solo you either know what you do, are new and should be told to Corp up or your new and have ignored the previous one
There is no excuse for being bad if information is just seconds away, if you struggle getting information for your own benefit your in the wrong game or have a challenge ahead to overcome, thats the reality
It's probably the one of few games closest to real life and world's economy.. everyone getting up in the morning to go to a job/their own business, every time they leave the house, they become a target, if one lose their ship, there's that, gone for good.. so on and so forth.. only the concept of death is what separates the game from real life, probably
For those that don't want to look another video: Clarelam is what we call a highsec island in EE, a high security system (no PvP) that's isolated from the others by 2 low sec jumps, because of this, all the high security missions from the faction spawn inside of it and you can just farm them easily without risk, adding this with the "AI" nanocore = isk for no effort or risk.
I have been playing on and off since 2006. I'm not sure how much $$, I've spent on it. I've loved it. The first real ship I lost angered me greatly. So much so that I hired a merc group with rl money to hunt them repeatedly for a month. Ohh that was expensive. Could have bought hundreds of the ship I lost cheaper.
Oof 😂
I couldn't agree with you more. The risk is what makes the game even worth playing
Amen to that!!
If you disagree with my opinion it's fact and your wrong even if you disagree... let's get started
Ah, the modern issue of "everyone's opinion counts and is equal".
When asking questions about how a car works, do you trust a mechanic or some random guy from next door? Expertise counts. And this is an area in which I have expertise.
@captainbenzie you are spouting OPINION, as a software engineer and game designer I believe I am capable of speaking as the expert on this topic.
@@captainbenzie I didn't invalidate your opinion, I only stated it's an opinion :-)
@@captainbenzie for what it's worth I agree with the opinion that Eve is currently a niche game
@@Megagon10k That one is NOT an opinion, I have to give him that! However from reading comments it DOES sound like he gets into opinions and his description of what a niche game is was absolutely garbage! No game is liked by EVERYONE and NEVER will be!
So true.. but i still hate when i lost my Gilas....
btw.. what is the most popular ship in your opinion?
!!! Great Videos !!!
Ishtar, as far as I can tell.
Good video, someone had to say this stuff!
Glad you liked it!
Love your vids... ty for what you do...
Really glad you're enjoying 😊
I think its why i am liking the game so much, that its doing its thing, and no apology given
Exactly this!
Hi, nice Video.
I play EVE-Online over 19 years, and Yes, You will lose Ships. I agree in all your points, only not in one of them.
After a certain period of time, a lot of experience and sufficient skills (lets say min 150 Mil points or more) You can play this game also mostly alone too.
Because all your friends, or most of them, who play this game round about the same amount of time, are meanwhile 'adults' or even older, some of them have something like a RL, or are somewhe in the 0.0, or a WH or somehow to far away.
I tink I don't need to say to anybody here how much I hate and love this game in the same time.
And here my Golden Rules of EVE
1. Trust no one (There is no "right" or "wrong". Only profits of various kinds)
2. Read the pop up messages before clicking OK
3. Fly only what you can afford to loose!! (you will loose ships)
4. Insurance, buy it! (See Rule3)
5. (Get and keep a clone upgraded.) deprecated
6. EvE is about Risk Vs. Reward. Think about that with every action. (See Rule3)
7. Avoid Lowsec Space (0.1-0.4). Stay in 0.5-1.0 or move to 0.0 (See Rule6)
8. Being in Empire Space (0.5-1.0) does not mean you are safe.
9. If you lose stuff, it's ALMOST ALWAYS YOUR FAULT. Really, only yours.
10 Just because you CAN fly something doesn’t mean you SHOULD.
11 If everyone says “train for this ship” or “module”, ignore them! It will be nerfed.
12 TRUST NO ONE! (EVE is full of people wanting your death or your ISK)
If you want a "solo EVE Online experience" then play Astrox Imperium. That said, I mostly play solo, but the experiences I have as a solo pilot are NOT things I could have in a fully NPC-driven game. I absolutely love X4 Foundations, but find myself bouncing between it and EVE Online because, between the two of them, I get most of my space game fill in. I really do miss Westwood's Earth and Beyond though.
I can easily agree with the three unconfortable truth you talk about. Personally my only problem is the fact that the game request too much of my lifetime to earn enough to buy ships I lost and plex the omega account. It's a kind of second work I don't want and can't do. I'm desperatly searching for a good solution to earn enough but if it simply doesn't exist I think I have to give up with Eve after almost eight years and this make me really sad
This comes with time. Nowadays, I'm playing a few hours here and there and still earning my ship costs within an hour.
@@captainbenzie is it possible to know how?
@@alessandrocrea3737 for me, through C3 ratting or Abyssal Deadspaces.
Started EVE 2003/09/09 and never cared much about the pvp, but after moving to my new home in null i do take part a lot more in home defense at least, not so much going out hunting.
Will a round Womhole work? :)
22 days in, and im hooked!
Welcome aboard!!
Lost a 600m Gila in an abyssal because my internet took a dump, that one wasnt my fault. That being said thats 1 case of many where they have been my fault. Good video