The problem is we are using only thinking about replacing gasoline vehicles with EVs. We need to also build robust electrified transportation infrastructure like urban rails and intercity rails. Many parts of the world - Asia and Europe are leaders in building convenient and robust rail system to solve traffic congestion. If we are building EVs so we have all sit in traffic just like before, we haven't solved anything.
I can't remember the last time I watched a corporate news piece that was this well researched and informative. this is the role that press really need to leverage, access to these people and players in the real world.
"The mining and manufacturing of batteries is indeed not a very friendly activity" (5:10) Indeed, a 2017 study from Sweden pointed out that a new Tesla already is responsible for more CO2 being emitted than a Camry will in its lifetime. This is not counting the CO2 the electric power plants will emit while charging Tesla's batteries. How again is this saving the planet from excessive CO2 emission?
I have to give credit where it's due... I love the fact that you guys are producing and posting videos that dive deep into the granular details related to complex issues like electric vehicles, energy storage etc... *I have been so fed up with so many channels that post 2-3 minute videos covering stuff like this that simply cannot adequately cover all of the details!
Our municipal trash processing needs to get up to speed. Instead to making us sort recycling they should simply sort on a large scale at the landfill. With some real engineering everything going into the landfill could be sorted into categories and either sold or safely handled.
@Block Lord That is pretty reductionist to assume that the quality of one brand or even country immediately translates to another brand. CATL is a pretty well known company. Even Tesla uses CATL to supply LFP batteries in China, and they have even shipped many of those vehicles to Europe. LFP batteries are inherently safer and less likely to combust. This has almost nothing to do with whether they are Chinese or not. It has much to do with the chemistry of the battery.
@@geordonworley5618 Unlike Oil. There is not enough lithium-iron-phosphate (LFP) on the planet to power all the cars in the world. Just like Wind and Solar can not replace Coal for 1.4 billion people energy needs in China. All electric cars , there is no way it's just a matter of numbers.
@@Crashed131963 Where are you getting that from? There is a trivially large amount of lithium and iron on the planet. Unlike cobalt and nickel chemistries, LFP is the one chemistry I would easily make the claim that we have plenty of resources to make enough for the whole world. The primary issue is production and allocation of human labor to this task.
At the moment over half of all Tesla cars being sold contain LFP batteries. Their disadvantage is a lower energy density so ideal for the lower range and cheaper vehicles. Their advantage is that they take fewer or no damages when supercharging or charging to 100%.
@@WhittyPics yea, my community has electronic recycling events once every 3 months. And I live in Los Angeles! Also tried to recycle my old phones at Walmart. But they wouldn't take it!
And copper. Each EV uses 200 pounds or more of copper. Improved generation and transmission of electricity will add more to the demand for copper. More lithium, more cobalt, more nickel, more copper all require more mining, never mind the recycling. Recycling is good, but woefully insufficient to the need.
@Peter Hicks These arguments about the amount of materials used for EV is our self serving for the fossil fuel industry only. Are we doing a direct comparison between a gas car and EV? If we did that then we would have to will over 35,000 kg of carbon dioxide and 500 kg of nitrous oxides where the EV doesn’t produce any. EV should last choices long. It is don’t require any oil changes. The first maintenance on my Tesla model three is four years after my purchase date. most importantly is that when we support fossil fuel companies we support the corruption of every government on earth and the cause of pretty much every war that is happening now and will happen in the future. We simply cannot afford to use fossil fuels even if they cost a lot more but in fact they don’t.
@Peter Hicks you sound like a shill for the Fossil Fuel industry. You know very little about EVs and don’t seem to want to learn any more except to accelerate your confirmation bias. You simply trot out all the Fossil Fuel talking points; you know they spend 100s of millions each year on deluding people?
There needs to be a world standard that all batteries are made to be easily recyclable. This would speed the recycle process and reduce/prevent toxic substances going to landfills.
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When I was born in 1948 there were 2 billion people. Now there's 8 billion. Demand for everything is excessive Demand for many products and materials will continue to exceed supply
Because of waterproofing, dust protection, and they don't need to install consumer grade rigid was on the battery if it's glued into the back. I'm not defending the practice. Buying a new battery extends tech life, but I understand why they do it. Extending tech life isn't really compatible with capitalism. The goal is extermination of life on earth, not extending it! Your profits can't exploit and preserve simultaneously. Profits > life. Once life ceases to exist , profits do as well Greed is the prize that infects their minds...
@@Tripskull The first 2 are pure BS and Samsung knows it because they made the S5 just that, everything else is correct however. It also doesn't help when people out there keep buying the stuff, if people stop buying it they will be forced to change. Now if only someone with enough push would start said change, even if it was in China... On a side note, buying a phone with a large battery, small pixel push count and low refresh rate (75 or less) will help extend the life of a phones battery, you don't really need 120fps 4K to watch TH-cam or TikTok... Let alone play most games, talk, text and surf the web. I own a nearly 2 year old phone (May 2020) and the battery is still good on it, not the best but works the whole day without issue still, but it's not a flagship phone, but it does have a 5000 mah battery in it. I typically replace my phone every 1.5 years due to the battery, but right now even tho I really want to replace it (EOL for Android OS updates outside of security patches(?), no 12 for me) I equally can't justify doing it because it "still works" lol... Plus my phone has the ability to unlock its boot loader, which I might do.
@Egg-Roll I said "I'm not saying I agree with it." Also I was only referring to personal tech devices. What John deer is doing to farmers or what McDonald's is doing to franchisees, amongst others, is just wrong. On tech gear, yes the seal and the super glue they use definitely contribute to water resistance. Idk how the s5 is special. Personally I'd trade the water resistance for the ability to add a new battery. You're right about the end for sure. I have an S21 ultra. The screen is huge. I have nothing to do, so tha screen is on the.majoirty of the dsy (all night too cuz it keeps youths in Asia away). Wow, it's amazing how long the battery lasts compared to every other phone I've had... I wonder how much is down to the new chip. .
@@Tripskull The reason why I said the first 2 are BS and Sammy knows it is because the S5 was both water and dust resistant while having a removable battery, I owned the S4 and it died from work dust, while if I waited for a few months I could have had the S5 preventing said issue... How effective it was (S5) not sure but it still existed nonetheless, only thing it was missing to a todays flagship is wireless charging, and how many actually use that feature? I frequently flog the dead horse called the S5 to point out we can in fact have our cake and eat it too, the people I do this too somehow think spending $80 for a $20 battery is logical. For battery life I would say it comes down to 2 things, chip tech and screen tech, my phone runs LCD not OLED like yours but mine also doesn't push as many pixels, mine also has a 12nm chip vs your 7 or 8nm (smaller = better), my next phone will likely have OLED not because I want it but OLEDs have finally started to become cheaper. My approach for phones is don't spend $1000 on one, $400-$500 max this way if it breaks my pocket isn't crying (wasted money is still wasted money), plus modern chips even in midrange can handle most stuff (don't get screwed with 2/3gb ram however, 4 min) for the common end user. My phone cost me $400 with 6gb it doesn't chug choke or hang under most situations (extreme weather excluded) and its chip is equal to the S9's so a little dated but still a good chip (Helio G90T, MediaTek). And yes I buy my phones outright no contracts, for me at least it ends up being cheaper, unless I replaced my phone yearly, which only happened once for LTE. What JD/McD are doing should be downright illegal and thankfully it has triggered action against them, as it hurts everyone down the line.
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This is actually similar to what has been done with 12 volt car batteries for decades. That's the reason there's a "core" fee when you buy a new battery every 4+ years.
I pay 90€ for a car battery, the Tesla battery is 20.000 and often does not reach 8 years, just politics want to give the cars a planned obsolescenz that is why government enforce the end of the high efficient diesel that lives 20(+ years, so you buy 3 cars instead of one and China makes more money and Germany less.
@@marbella-elviria and over the course of a vehicles lifetime you'll spend over $20,000 for 200k miles. Whereas an EV will last over 300k miles and costs much less to charge, closer to $3,000 for the same 200k miles.
The problem with this...article... is that it only talks about EVs. The effects of the pandemic is affecting ALL manufacturers - both on a minerals and parts supply side. There's a huge demand for materials used in catalytic converters that there' far more thefts coming off of vehicles on the street. Do EVs need to figure out the recycle issues? Absolutely, but so does the rest of the industry. Oh, and don't forget that lithium is abundant and that the amount of that material being used is decreasing as newer chemistries are being worked through.
Did you even watch the video? They mentioned recycling all of the other minerals beyond just lithium. Also you think there's not economic incentivization to recycle platinum or palladium from catalytic converters. I guarantee you almost none of those make it past a scrap yard. They're too valuable
@@Cameronmid1also forgets to note the recycled minerals are not as good as new and live a shorter life it why it’s limited in the amount added to new virgin cells
29:35 This chart is confusing. How is it possible that LFP batteries are only 6% of the BEV market when China uses mainly LFP batteries for their cars and they were 50% of the EV market in 2021?
The secret to the recharging problem is not individual charging stations, but to to have solar powered stations where you drive in insert your credit card and the robotic machine pushes in a universal new battery pack which pushes the spent one into the recharging station on the opposite side. 5 minutes max, and the customer pays for the charge like paying for gas. And it would be quicker than filling with gas. Why hasn't anyone figure this out yet?
That system requires 5 plus times as many batteries. We already will be short on material in a few years as nickel mines for example take years sometimes 10 plus years to start producing.
That dude is so right, I have so much old junk tech laying around and it seems wasteful to throw it away but idk what to do with it either, will look into those places they said though
It's true I took all my old batteries laptops tablets electric bikes a threw them all into my truck and put some wires on them I was able to drive to Ohio
Are you guys kidding me? Educating the public is your first step. You're right about one thing and that's people don't know what to do. Most people throw electronic waste away and that's problematic
Exactly, going from worrying about fuel shortages to worrying about natural mineral shortages needed to produce batteries. Trading one problem for another.
We as humans on this earth have a Expiration date to sustain ourselves on this earth. This is the first step to stripping the earth of all its natural resources and causing the new issues. Transportation isn't the lead in climate change it's industry.
@@CobraHigh We are going from freedom to totalitarian control over our vehicles, that are soon not to be our own at all. Pure dystopian crap. EV's are cool and smart, but it's not why they are pushed for at all.
Lithium mines waste copious amounts of water. For water strapped Nevada. Wildlife. Land deformation? They gonna drain aquifers mining out that lithium. Crazy.
Everything is a problem. You want to produce goods but at the same time produce no wast or anything harmful to the environment? You'd be better off trying to divide by 0
Another problem is how do they expect people living in apartment complexes and vast majority of city row homes with no driveways or garages be able to charge EC 's. A local Wawa is going to install 4 charging stations in one of their parking lots. Great. You drop off your EV plug it in walk 15 minutes to where you live then 4,5, or 6 hours later walk 15 minutes to get your EV and pray that the charger did not encounter any problems. We have 2 EV charging stations at work and one trips the 30 amp circuit breaker several times a year.Company that made the charger no longer in business. Good luck locating Chargers while on vacation.
The wisest thing that should be on every wise individual's list is to invest in different stream of income and don't depend on the government to bring in money especially now the pandemic is hitting the economy
I have dealt with Litium Ion batteries in a small scale for a long time. I have found that CHARGING CYCLESare critical. Like NiCad cells they want to be run down fully and have traditionally not handled well being charged from 30% or so, especially when you first get them. They memory quite noticeably after awhile. Energy density is real important in EV technology, range before needing to recharge. This is traditionally now handled by AERODYNAMICS, reducing drag coefficient and improving tire technology. There are some interesting new designs such as Solid State batteries that appear promising
Given the geopolitical ramification of having the worlds largest Li-ion mine in the USA, I'm shocked that this isn't being pushed ahead at light speed. If America could revive it's auto-industry, this time as an EV-auto industry, without losing money to oil producing countries or China's lithium industry, wouldn't that be a monstrously huge deal?
Thank you for saying this. The obsession with profit is ruining a lot of aspects of our society. Capitalism is nice but it needs to have more societal obligations.
Heavy metals are lead, cadmium, mercury, thallium, arsenic, iron maiden, and black sabbath. There's are no heavy metals in lithium ion battery, li-ion has nickle, aluminum, lithium and cobalt, none of which are heavy metals, and aren't particularly rare or toxic either.
@@0hypnotoad0 "Heavy metals are defined as metallic elements that have a relatively high density compared to water" wow that was difficult, I used google.
People doing van/RV conversions these days are following a trend of spending 10,000 or $20,000 on a solar/power/lithium ion battery system so they can cook and heat and do everything with electricity and they badmouth propane like it’s very very dangerous, but all you need to do is look at the drone shot to see how they’re storing these used batteries on pallets spaced far apart to know that they are big fire hazards.
the battery cells don't have any plastic and they can remove the cells from the battery pack before shredding, the metals can all be separated chemically but you can't recover 100% of them
Where is all the electricity going to come from to charge all the batteries? Burning coal or natural gas isn't going to work and wind or solar is expensive. Nuclear power is being abandoned to our detriment! Fuel must be reprocessed!
True, Nuclear power is needed, but wind and solar will be cheaper, just not reliable enough yet, especially without batteries. The real problem is ICE cars.
Coal was down to 19% of US electrical generation in 2021, renewables were at 20%. On that grid mix, an EV is unquestionably better for the environment over its lifetime. Go read the Lazard economists' Levelized Cost of Energy report, wind and solar are the cheapest form of new generation. That's why they are the majority of new generation in the USA in the world (so EVs will only get cleaner). Nuclear costs five times as much and takes 10 times longer, so no electric utility will build another plant until the cost and time comes down. Maybe some version of molten sodium modular thorium small reactor blah blah will deliver.
Yeah, but most of the batteries DO go to landfills in the form of AA and AAA. No one is trying to solve the BIG problem. This is the high profit easy fix, as usual. In the meantime, our landfills ARE toxic. We need battery disposals everywhere batteries are sold, like Wal-Mart's. We need to put a recycle incentive like 5 cents per battery.
There are several other companies getting into the battery recycling business as well. This is critical because mining supply can't scale fast enough. Even with the addition of recycled battery metals the industry is going to be limited by supply. This is why it's insane to say we need high oil prices to hasten the transition to EVs. That's why it's so offensive when Biden says, "just buy and EV" to the poor and middle class people who are being hurt the most by insanely high fuel prices. And by the way, the 9000 existing leases they tell you about are useless without the access permits and drilling permits that are being denied by this administration.
@@celdur4635 It is only not true if demand is weak. But if you want to scale their production up as fast as the EU and California want to do, then, no, mining can't keep up with demand. And some of these minerals are likely to become so depleted before the number of EV's aspired to are hit that they become for all practical purposes exhausted. All mine production follows a rough bell curve, and after you pass the peak, extraction becomes slower, and slower, and slower. Production becomes rate limited.
@@michaels4255 Not really bro, you forget that to improve production you not only expand existing mines, you open up new ones, the ramp up can be exponential... if we want to, if there is money for it. I come from a premiere mining country you won't believe how many deposits we DON'T mine, and we are already top producers of several materials and 2nd in copper, with 95% of our mining potential untapped still. NOT counting new deposits that can be found and exploited with new tech in the near future. Specially Lithium, its 100% a myth, propaganda really, this factoid the press bandits about that there isn't enough of the stuff, when in fact there's LOADS of the thing, its one of the most common elements on the universe, literally. My country hasn't even began to exploit its reserves, because demand isn't strong enough yet. I'm not saying we shouldn't find for ways to extract resources without harming the environment, just that we -can- mine our way out of this problem. Helium is the only resource we should really be worried about. That and the fact that it does take a couple of years to get a mine running, pending on the type of geology. As it stands now, until we get 10k USD or at least 20k USD e-cars, electric is a very, very niche product. Not to mention very few millions of cars are being produced right now, mostly Tesla and chinese, but for the next 10 years? yeah, the mines will be up and running, no problem to replace 50% of the world's cars.
@@michaels4255 Who's geologists, ppl have opinions man. U can find anyone you want to support your message. I tend to rely more on, well, reality, and in this particular case i just know how much mineral riches that are still untapped.
owning a tesla is literally a 20,000 dollar subscription fee every 3 years if you own the car. versus about 3,000 dollars to replace a blown engine in a gas car and that only happens extremely rarely. meanwhile the battery will deplete over time even if you dont drive it. yikes-
Did your thought come from experience of possibly Fossil Fuel disinformation? My 2015 Tesla battery lost 5% in 6 years so at that rate would be good for about 40 years. Where did 3 years come from?
Did your thought come from experience of possibly Fossil Fuel disinformation? My 2015 Tesla battery lost 5% in 6 years so at that rate would be good for about 40 years. Where did 3 years come from?
Well, tesla usually starts with 120% of the advertised battery amount to adjust for efficiency losses and to out perform competitors claiming the same battery size. So yours actually went down around 25%. Lith ion batteries are usually good for about 10 years then cells go out or it dies altogether.
@@hebson21 Are you saying Tesla’s 80 kWh battery is actually 96 or their 300 mile range is actually 360 miles but they don’t let you go the full 360 miles at first so they can maintain 300 miles later? How does this work? How do you know they do this?
@@colingenge9999 you know something Colin you better start saving up for a new car because you know it and I know it things aren't always what they seem
@@arlenmargolin4868 Thanks for your concern. Can you predict how long my new Tesla Model 3 will last? What it costs to operate and maintain? What would your qualifications be for your predictions?
@@colingenge9999 you know if you do the right thing by that car and charge it the way they tell you in the manual that thing's going to be a good vehicle for you let's face it Tesla has probably the best EV in the world today you couldn't have done any better by buying this vehicle and you are indeed lucky for another reason think about how much less maintenance you've got to do especially when you think about what we used to have to do to vehicles when I first started to drive I was constantly having my vehicle tuned up rebuilt you name it we had a baby our cars in those days and even these days cars require a decent amount of maintenance but not near as what a Tesla's got to keep it in tip top shape no you're going to have a long ride with that you really will
Excellent report! This type of information is typically so obscure or hidden from average consumers. It is so helpful to be educated on the effects and options we have using products. At least this way we can make more informed and intelligent decisions. Thank you CNBC!
I think recycling all the materials around a battery should also play a big part in recycling. Plastic will play a BIG part in this, from holders to frame work. All parts of a battery are recyclable. Hell the boxes the batteries are shipped in is recyclable. In fact please name any part of a battery that cannot be used again.
It has to make sense -- if the transportation, logistics, energy input, cost are not accounted for or optimized, recycling doesn't always make sense. i.e. Recycling 10 grams of low quality cardboard might require a disproportionate amount of carbon, electricity, and clean water to not justify the effort on a monetary or environmental level. The math has to work.
We have been lied to about the recycleability of plastic. Only a couple CAN be recycled and it degrades very quickly. That symbol on all plastics? Yea it's a plastic industry creation. They call it a resin code. They appropriated and changed the free use recycling symbol. ♻️ means recyclable. Put a number in it and all it means is what kind of resin it is. Corporations have a history of these things. Like "Carbon Footprint" and "Litterbug" a creation of Keep America Beautiful, which consisted of single use container corporations.In essence, Keep America Beautiful managed to shift the entire debate about America’s garbage problem. No longer was the focus on regulating production-for instance, requring can and bottle makers to use refillable containers, which are vastly less profitable. Instead, the “litterbug” became the real villain, and KAB supported fines and jail time for people who carelessly tossed out their trash, despite the fact that, clearly, “littering” is a relatively tiny part of the garbage problem in this country (not to mention the resource damage and pollution that comes with manufacturing ever more junk in the first place).
Carbon footprint is being pushed by fossil fuel companies. Trying to make regular ppl feel guilty for something caused by the most profitable companies of all time. They could have done something 30, 40 years ago, but record profits every quarter are more important than ppl or the earth...
@Tony Duncan no. It's not that kind of radiation. It's became heat energy. Not light energy it didn't let loose a stream of ultra low frequency photon radiation. Electromagnetic energy usually becomes kinetic energy...
*As an MIT Electro-Chemical engineer it would be simpler to spend 35% more $$$$$ to make a battery that can last 50 years. That Technology is here today. To bad people don't see the value in it!*
Whatever happened to the 1990s' 3 R's of Recycling : "REDUCE, Reuse, recycle" Am I the only who who wonders this when I buy an object the size of my thumb yet it's surrounded by 10x that of UnRecylable Plastics?? In Other words: why is my LED light-fixture unservicable. Yet EV Cars are a Priority? DIdn't we simply create a NEW Problem WITHOUT solving the Previous??
Corporation wont allow that cos it damage revenues. That's why companies like starbuck push all these campaigns like using paper straw, while the true environment friendly thing to do is stop buying coffee or make it yourself. The lie here is you dont have to reduce if u can recycle :)
Because it turns out it's not profitable and what we really were doing was selling our trash to places around the world that just dumped it. Here in my city they are trying to cancel our recycling program bc all it does is double the cost of waste to have two trucks ( one to "recycle") when it turns out that recyclable trash goes to the dump bc no one wants to spend the money to actually recycle it. We used to hide this problem bc poor countries bought it. Now those countries don't want this trash so the fake recycling scam is up. We don't need to recycle what we don't need. There is no reason to plastic wrap everything at the grocery store. There's absolutely no reason an apple or pineapple should be plastic wrapped but Americans are germ phobic about thier food.
In what sense are you asking? For replacing cars and appliances, the environmental cost of replacing something from the 90s (or even late 2000s in some cases) with something new may be less than keeping the old thing running. Financially, this is often true even without subsidies. For plastic packaging- it's for shipping and loss mitigation. Retail runs on very thin margins; either the product would be sold with the same packaging at a higher price, or it wouldn't be sold at all. This has little to do with EVs, however. You'll have to be more specific when you talk about an unserviceable light fixture. At a guess- the diodes are not a separate part; it would be like asking why you couldn't just replace the filament in a light bulb.
don't make electric vehicles compete with bigger or more powerful gas vehicles, it will only increase the problems of safety and access to every kind of road. all personal vehicles need their speed mechanically and electronically limited, even on highways. this will allow any kind of motor driven vehicle to drive together. and if you're late, you're late, time doesn't matter, only safety and cooperation.
How much does it cost to recycle this material? How much emissions are produced to make/recycle these materials with the big lie that this is saving the environment?
what would be better is to reduce consumption, reuse products for a longer time (via refurbishment) and then recycle what is left. Why make more cars when we can make more e-bikes, more e-buses, electric trams etc. 1,500-3,000kg to transport one person is beyond insane at this point. It is absurd.
I agree, but we have to do both, because most people won't give up their personal transport. No manufactured 2-ton product is good for the environment, but if you're going to drive, an EV is unquestionally better for the environment then blowing up tons of filthy fossil fuel driving a conventional car.
California's lithium valley is enough to make USA an ev powerhouse. Best part is the lithium is a byproduct from pumping out salt brine so it will be fairly easy to produce.
@@spl1011 The water is coming from the salton sea as they mentioned in the video. There is the salton sea itself, and that region of california already has a lot of geothermal plants as they mention in the video.
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Part of the problem with recycling materials, I keep hearing "valuable resource" and then I hear "you can drop this off". They aren't paying for this recycle, yet keep touting how much wealth there is in this market. I'm not hearing "You can get money for bringing in your old consumer electronics". It was briefly mentioned "in some cases we're paying people for their batteries", so rarely they do pay people to take it off the hands. That needs to change and become the norm before it will be condusive to having people trade items in in a timely manner. If I spent $1000 on a machine, and then a recycling company wants me to pay $25 to take it and then extract minerals and then make money from that. Idk I'm not hearing any condusive reasons / encouraging direction from these recyclers to encourage the recycling from consumers. What I am hearing is consumers will get exploited and tricked into feeling good about it.
Your $1,000 machine was never more than $25 in materials. So if you expect to get paid $800 for an old used iphone you're delusional. But there are companies which pay you to shred your documents for free because the paper recycling for pulp means they have an incentive to pay companies to cheaply give them paper. I have a friend who own a company that does this. It's a win/win. Companies get their documents securely shredded, and he gets to haul away a bunch of raw materials to sell to paper plants.
I believe that $335 million in funding for lithium-ion battery recycling is included in the 2021 infrastructure law! I am looking at a goldmine, that has already been mined! From what I heard, recycled Lithium has a more ordered crystalline structure and makes for a slightly better battery. Eventually, recycling will be the primary source of all battery manufacturing in the next 10 years.
Imagine if batteries were replaceable and manufacturers provided SW support or at least didn't ban the devices from their services... planned obsolescence is what killing it. You are expected to replace your phone each 3 years despite being totally fine.
@@jedburnell9046 Sure dude. Go ahead and try to supply the entire US with power from solar. Total power consumption in the US in 2021 was almost 4 Trillion kWh. Think about how many solar panels you are going to need and how much land will have to be used to do this. Not to mention the maintenance of those solar farms, the environmental damage they will cause along with the toxic hazardous waste produced by obsolete and retired solar panels. It turns into another whole recycling problem. First batteries then solar panels. Oh and let's not forget what they do with worn out wind turbine blades. The majority of them are just buried.
The Salton sea lithium mining underground sounds like a good idea. Will take up less space. I hope this income can be reinvested in Niland California, and help those residents suffering from asthma due to the salty dust near the shrinking Salton sea.
13:20 It has always confused me when people said recycling is too expensive to be sustainable, while here this man is saying recycling is more efficient, uses less energy, materials, reagents etc...It seems the only hurdle is the initial investment into the recycling setup, which gov'ts and big money were unwilling to invest in.
Watching a video from the US is always like a peep into the future and past at the same time. Everything is full of cool tech stuff, but you still have landfill 😂
They just aren't good enough and when I tow the livestock trailer the range mileage is poor. Back to diesel now and normally restored and no more long stops drinking coffee and extended breakfast!!
because people like myself don't feel safe riding Los Angeles public transit during a pandemic, being stuck in an enclosed space with a bunch of strangers and vagrants carrying who knows what kind of diseases.
There will be many " Tesla Killers" , but Tesla will be King for a long long time as Tesla will be the leader when it comes to producing battery cells, the Tesla made 4680 cells will be in a class by itself , in scale and density.GO Long TSLA!
Whenever someone invokes the term "Tesla Killers," what they don't want to admit, but actually is implicit in the word, is that Tesla is The Leader in the field. Nobody says, "GM Killer," or "VW Killer." Toyota, GM, VW have been the top car makers for decades. But nobody compares electric vehicles to their cars. They always say "Tesla Killer."
@@gmv0553 Tesla still leads in total production and sales of BEV worldwide, keep dreaming that others will catchup , not to mentionits software advantage and profitability,, but yeah GM is numerous in Mary Barras and Bidens minds🤣😂
There's also lithium in ocean water. The technology for filtering/extracting this has been researched (and patented), and is being put into practical use. That said, I think the patent should be bought by the government and put into the public domain. Eventually, when almost all vehicles are electric, enough lithium batteries will be recycled yearly to not, or barely, need this extraction. Anyway, lithium is always trickling into the oceans by streams and rivers leeching it from mountains and rocky land, along with some unknown amount from volcanic eruptions, so it's not like we would ever exhaust this supply. If we ever did manage to bring down the concentration in ocean water to a small fraction of what it currently is, extraction would become too expensive, and would stop.
There's all sorts of minerals in sea water, even gold. The tech is there but its not economically feasible to scale it for industrial hydrometallurgical extraction. Recycling is the future.
But with that being said, & being how responsive Americans are to advertisements & how easily influenced they’ve become… I don’t see why more of an urge to recycle our electronics isn’t advertised or put out there.
salt and lithium are two of some of the most abundant resources, and can be used to make batteries.. also, their source can be tied together. desalinization plants for the salt, and the brine supplies lithium as well. sodium batteries are coming either this year or next.
I'm glad JB Straubel decided to tackle this problem before it becomes a ongoing catastrophe It's curious that Elon Musk isn't talking about this or isn't a co-founder of this or any recycling startup
Lith batteries still arent recycled, its too time intensive and costly for anybody to legitimately do it. They might make a big rebrand and claim they can be recycled super easily all of a sudden. Given lith batteries have been around since the 70's and are still not recycled, my moneys on marketing smoke and mirrors.
@@hebson21 it's strange you say that they're not recycling the lithium but unless it's my ADD kicking in I could have sworn I heard them saying they're recycling these batteries I probably have the same problem I had back in 7th grade
@@thesauce1682 From day one most of America's e waste has been shipped to Africa. I guess it's economical to send trash to other countries instead of taking responsibility.
If you don't have to drive 2 hours to work research and build yourself an ebike of 48v 1000w or higher. You'll be glad you did. It's a pricey start up but trust me, it'll be the best decision you ever made. Pay 300- 500 on a battery once every couple years compared to $3-5 a gallon gas, $600-$4000 a year for insurance, pricey repairs, ect. They can easily carry a 250lb human with speeds between 28 mph- 35 mph. That's 45kph+. You can ride both roads and side walks. Upgrade with larger batteries, bags, lights and more. I had mine a year and a half and saved $12000 so far.
While there will be an increase in the number of EVs we’ve seen that lightweight vehicles have become much more popular. Sales of e-bike has gone up significantly. They require much less materials per vehicle. Smaller vehicles like e-bikes don’t require as much space to store at home or on the road. Bike lockers at work can also fit many e-bikes in less space so parking spaces are not used up. The amount of energy needed to recharge them is also much less. This is the way we can transition to EVs without expanding mining and production capacity as quickly.
Sorry for this tasteless joke, but given our country’s obesity problem, I don’t see the e-bike becoming ubiquitous. We also have to consider that a significant amount of people don’t even believe that climate change is real, which was the primary reason why EV’s were manufactured in the first place. Sadly, I think many conservatives will purposely hold off on touting EVs on principle (not all of them of course). I know a car is obviously different from a mask or vaccine, but the underlying political ideology is the same and that doesn’t bode well for “green” anything. I realize that I’m way off the point you were making, which was a good and informative one. Electric vehicles will become a symbol of one’s political affiliation. If you’re driving an EV, you probably care about the planet; however, many can care less. Anyway, I know that was a little wordy and offhand, but I think you get my point. And I realize there are many other factors that need to be considered before real progress is made, not the least of which is convincing major oil-producing countries and corporations to forego crude oil production. Take care.
@@joegagliardi3984 nothing wrong with evolving tech for efficiency sake, but we've gotten to a point where actual science has plateaued and tech/marketing has been selling the future for future sake. Like lithium ion batteries were invented in the 1970's and still arent recycled, cause its such a time intensive and costly process. The gov didnt start caring for the environment all of a sudden, its a good bipartisan issue for the public to argue about and focus on. There are massive corporations and lobbying budgets behind most governments. The only way an ev is actually green is if its painted green. If you drive one you want people to think you care about the planet, if you take public transit/bike/walk you actually care. Its not that climate change isnt a thing, but its impossible to actually chart/predict how, given weathers immense variability. The data, region, time span and filters used could easily change the results to whatever said individual wants it to be, as a result many are misleading and improperly biased. When questioned on heavily biased data, the honest people will admit it and say people need to believe there is a massive problem before they will adopt change or do anything about it. Then you get into the "telephone" phenomenon like kids used to play. So and so read an article and had a hot take on twitter to which many others post their opinions on opinions of opinions, eventually making wild accusations nowhere near the original story. I hear all the time, the ocean is going to raise 10 feet in 10 years...... no, no its not. Nasa claimed a high estimate, higher than any data yet observed, would result in a few inches of rise in 100 years. People overlook the fact that while glaciers thaw in summer, they refreeze in winter (the news doesnt report that part). That and many glaciers already displace water, paired with the world being over 70% covered in water... All in all, the market should expand hybrid cars with ni cad batteries (easily recyclable and can handle many charge cycles) that can power the car around 40 miles with a standard 120v plugin. Instead of the gov paying 20k off every tesla, they should rebate the 3k hybrid option for vehicles...
@@hebson21 I have been involved in putting out fires on aircraft with overheating Ni-Cad batteries. Lithium was not the original culprit in that category. No thanks!
@@joegagliardi3984 More e-bikes were sold in 2021 than EVs, so it does not matter if a high percentage of Americans are overweight or don’t believe climate change is real. They can see gas prices are now extremely high and many can decide for most of their trips an e-bike will be great. It is also very easy when your bike has a motor to assist. And little by little it does burn enough calories to make a difference.
Take a longer view, the cost of electric cars is dependent on many things. The cost of electricity has historically gone down, not up. Economies of scale mean the price of electricity will go down, price of fuel will go down as the fuel is changed to less costly fuels like sunlight and wind, eventually Fusion power.
So many people are convinced we will solve this, simply because we must. I think we will find a better way than electric vehicles or perhaps a better way to store electricity than batteries.Grapite, graphene, carbon fiber nano tubes and advanced circuits may make slow discharge capacitors a practical reality. Molten metal batteries are far to heavy & that may be insurmountable but there are other potential storage devices using the same principle. And no. We have not exhausted all the sources of low polluting high energy fuels from bio diesel to liquid hydrogen gas. And that's just for electric vehicles. Consumer electronics are another high demand on the same resources. Recycling is demanded but is not yet easy or widely available.
@@marcschaeffer1584 meanwhile on the actual earth, some of us realize coal, oil, are far to valuable to burn. Coal & oil are far to expensive to burn if the secondary environmental costs per gallon was part of the price per gallon
@@mccormyke what cost? There are only benefits. Growing plants, increased access to areable land, increased rainfall. The planet is exploding with plant life, "greening" nasa says. There Is no problem.
All vehicles have a supply problem. Most products have a supply problem because suppliers are not raising prices fast enough to keep up with runaway inflation.
Are the people against this development the same as the ones opposing the oil sands? Will this mine be operated solely using electric and battery operated machinery and vehicles? Is there enough electric power available in that area to actually power the equipment needed to operate the mine with clean energy?
@@philmanke7642 but it actually does not. many places experience long periods of clouds, fog, snow, rain and night time. also solar panels are expensive, hard to maintain and cant be recycled. they dont just simply last forever, they degrade and lose efficiency over time just like batteries. if you run everything off of panels you will need storage for excess power also (lots of big batteries) I know people have been made to think everything is simple and has no nuance but unfortunately this is not the world we live in. what sounds good on paper does not usually work as well in reality, especially when profits and politics get in the way
How much are they paying people is the question. You aren't just giving them trash anymore. I am willing to bet they don't give you a deal on the end product, knowing you have given them materials.
I'm saddened that he didn't throw some shade on manufacturers that make battery extraction and exchange a chore with the objective of making repair impractical.
Hopefully the components that make the batteries are harvested on mass to avert supply shortages. Hopefully we accrue more of them than gold, with the same kind of desperation and tenacity that we we go after gold with.
Lithium mining is not environmentally friendly either. They take TONs of water to mine and also leak toxic materials during the mining process. Also the largest lithium mine in America sits on reservation land and will disrupt the ecology on the area.
@@braddahjosh808 Ehh so... The footage of the largest mine in America is of a goddamn desert... No one in their right mind cares about deserts, tear it to pieces I'd say not that that ever does a dent to deserts. The most stubborn and resilient environment on earth. If a couple of bird species die, well as long as they're not essential to life in the region, let the mine rip and tear till there is nothing left.
So, you want to savage the earth to pull a pound lithium or cobalt out of forty tons of earth. Hmmmmmmmmmm that makes sense. Since it was never about the environment. So finally you get your batteries how you gonna charge them ? The US has not built a new power plant in over forty years and cannot keep up with current electric demand as is. How are we gonna charge 20, 30, 40.... million electric car batteries ?
This report did not aged well in a year time ... EV market growth was 40% while total car market shrinked ... and most batteries produced todays are nikkel and cobalt free ( lithium iron are the present and sodium batteries are the tomorrows winner in the industry) so 90% of the video is FUD today...
16:30 One of the speakers, Steve Moore, Benchmark Materials said, we won't be able to use the lithium recycled in batteries. What? Really? Did I misunderstand what he said? I kind of feel like they dropped the ball there. Please explain if that is true or false. If it's true, why are they recycling batteries? Where is the recycled lithium going to be used??? The Redwood guys seem to be saying they want to move towards a "closed-loop system," meaning -- it seems to be implied -- that you would not need mining any longer; that you would just be able to get all the raw materials you need from recycling suppliers. I feel like they dropped a bomb Benchmark Materials are experts in this field, but I feel like they should have followed up more thoroughly on that. Why did he say that? Does everyone agree on that? Does he just mean at the moment? But he said, "never."
Regarding quantity- pretty sure they were assuming a constant growth in the demand for Li+ batteries. Because of that- even assuming a 100% recycle rate- the demand for new lithium would always exceed supply of old. Regarding quality- tests have been done and new batteries made from old. However, Li in batteries exists in reactive compounds and have casings that Li can also react with, making recycling difficult. The metals may also exist in concentrations lower than in natural ores, and are likely more complex chemically than even lower-quality ores.
2 of the first 3 quotes are over blown and misleading , lithium battery recycling not really a problem yet , possibly ever, because they can be recycled, just waiting on economies of scale to ramp up, and EVs catch fire at a much lower rate than ICE vehicles, where’s the outrage about the hundreds of thousands of ICE fires per year… a lot of F.U.D. In the first 30 second alone 🤦♂️
The US has been programmed by its media into FUD throughout. Some people there need to be the first forever, and yet never seem to get themselves properly locked away.
34:00 "It is never possible to decarbonize the fossil fuels that are used to run internal combustion engines." Not true. We have the technology to create synthetic fuel. It's already used on nuclear aircraft carriers to create aviation fuel for its aircraft.
2 problems... First, even synthetic fuels require tons of energy to produce. Second, you have the same problems with scaling up production. It's all well and good that synthetic fuel makes up a tiny proportion of the Navy's aviation fuel. (Far less than 1%). Try scaling up to the entire fuel supply for the world's aviation industry. You'll run into worse supply limitations than the EV industry.
Synthetic fuel generation losses around 80% of the energy + Combustion engines are only 20-25% efficient, so lucky to get 5% of the original energy to drive the wheels, Compared to an EV that is around 75% efficient from the original energy to driving the wheels, plus can gain 5% back from regen braking. Basically takes at less 15 times the generated energy for synthetic fuel over EV's. But Synthetic fuel will have uses where batteries cant be used, like aircraft on carriers where efficiently is irrelevant!
Our community has a large electronics recycling/refurbishing center. It is volunteer based and diversified into crop gleaning, thrift store, and materials recycling. They even sell worm castings made from composted spoiled produce. I am glad to see this be taken seriously. Thank you, I hope you are rewarded financially as well as constructively.
But did you realize that without recycling, it is ALL waste product? A tiny amount of waste is preferable to all of it being waste. Also, with battery recycling, the chemically reactive portions are what is sought, the waste is mostly inert components like casings and insulators that are not very toxic.
Excellent work! Thank you. One of the reasons we waited to have solar power with battery backup for over 15 years because the technology hasn’t improved until Tesla came and now innovation of recycling batteries are here now. Thank you. We need people like JB and others .We use so much batteries than ever and now 2022 the supply chain broken with the political uncertainties.
JB Straubel, former Tesla CTO and co-founder as well as founder of battery recycling company Redwood Materials and the guy featured in the interview for the first half of this video. Morons.
@@vissitorsteve I guess you must be a die hard trying to support a very bad voting decision. What's political? Who opened our borders at Mexico? Who shut down the keystone pipeline? Who shut down our economy because of covid? Who made people quit jobs because of a vaccine mandate (w/o long term testing? Who made it possible for those same people that quit to make more money than work? Science or political 🤔
The problem is we are using only thinking about replacing gasoline vehicles with EVs. We need to also build robust electrified transportation infrastructure like urban rails and intercity rails. Many parts of the world - Asia and Europe are leaders in building convenient and robust rail system to solve traffic congestion. If we are building EVs so we have all sit in traffic just like before, we haven't solved anything.
Damn. If only we had a train that could run off electricity by collecting it from wires above it
that's not true and a very shallow statement lol
@@tickyotacky It's called a trolley. They've been used as city wide transportation since the 1920s. Look into it
Remote work will solve that issue
I dont use car, sometimes uber. I live in downtown in europe. I have electric bike, but usually just walk.
I can't remember the last time I watched a corporate news piece that was this well researched and informative. this is the role that press really need to leverage, access to these people and players in the real world.
@@metaparcel he said corporate... i agree with him
Who's the narrator? Is it the same person that researched and wrote this story?
This is an advertisement for Redwood Materials...
comes of as a full feature commercial for me
Well there we have it the EV isn't green at all quite the opposite 😅
"The mining and manufacturing of batteries is indeed not a very friendly activity" (5:10) Indeed, a 2017 study from Sweden pointed out that a new Tesla already is responsible for more CO2 being emitted than a Camry will in its lifetime. This is not counting the CO2 the electric power plants will emit while charging Tesla's batteries. How again is this saving the planet from excessive CO2 emission?
I have to give credit where it's due...
I love the fact that you guys are producing and posting videos that dive deep into the granular details related to complex issues like electric vehicles, energy storage etc...
*I have been so fed up with so many channels that post 2-3 minute videos covering stuff like this that simply cannot adequately cover all of the details!
This is a bunch of dumb happy-talk with no numbers.
Independent journalists and youtubers in general started this as a trend, and networks are only just catching up lol
11am qq!!!q
It’s not easy to dispose of old batteries. I wish I can place in Trash cans and they take it away for recycling.
Battery recycling has been solved. Check out Redwood Industries. It is in this video.
@@donbakerseattle That’s what I was watching. Disposing of batteries was what I was talking about.
Our municipal trash processing needs to get up to speed. Instead to making us sort recycling they should simply sort on a large scale at the landfill. With some real engineering everything going into the landfill could be sorted into categories and either sold or safely handled.
@@donbakerseattle Not exactly solved , there is more work that has to be done.
@@dougcox835 Someday.
There is such a thing as LFP Lithium Iron Phosphate Battery from CATL and BYD. Its Cobalt and Nickel Free. Its safer too.
@Block Lord That is pretty reductionist to assume that the quality of one brand or even country immediately translates to another brand. CATL is a pretty well known company. Even Tesla uses CATL to supply LFP batteries in China, and they have even shipped many of those vehicles to Europe. LFP batteries are inherently safer and less likely to combust. This has almost nothing to do with whether they are Chinese or not. It has much to do with the chemistry of the battery.
@Block Lord wait u endian
@@geordonworley5618 Unlike Oil. There is not enough lithium-iron-phosphate (LFP) on the planet to power all the cars in the world.
Just like Wind and Solar can not replace Coal for 1.4 billion people energy needs in China.
All electric cars , there is no way it's just a matter of numbers.
@@Crashed131963 Where are you getting that from? There is a trivially large amount of lithium and iron on the planet. Unlike cobalt and nickel chemistries, LFP is the one chemistry I would easily make the claim that we have plenty of resources to make enough for the whole world. The primary issue is production and allocation of human labor to this task.
At the moment over half of all Tesla cars being sold contain LFP batteries. Their disadvantage is a lower energy density so ideal for the lower range and cheaper vehicles. Their advantage is that they take fewer or no damages when supercharging or charging to 100%.
Easy solution, offer to pay people for their old electronics if they're that valuable to you
The video was about how there needs to be more recycling capacity. Supply of waste batteries is not the bottleneck.
I would turn in what I have for free if they made it easy and accessible. They can't make it a pain in the ass
@@WhittyPics yea, my community has electronic recycling events once every 3 months. And I live in Los Angeles!
Also tried to recycle my old phones at Walmart. But they wouldn't take it!
@@efonwang People pay for broken phones for recycling on eBay.
@@laserlemons1577 And? This would be an incentive and business model to make it feasible.
Interesting...my Best Buy wouldn't accept my battery for recycling. I was told that Best Buy doesn't participate in the recycling of batteries anymore
There you go... my point has been made by your post. If they all start doing this, we're in deep sh*t!
@@Xeather we've been in deep s*** since we started s*******
lol
And copper. Each EV uses 200 pounds or more of copper. Improved generation and transmission of electricity will add more to the demand for copper. More lithium, more cobalt, more nickel, more copper all require more mining, never mind the recycling. Recycling is good, but woefully insufficient to the need.
Where then are metals for gas cars mined?
@Peter Hicks These arguments about the amount of materials used for EV is our self serving for the fossil fuel industry only. Are we doing a direct comparison between a gas car and EV? If we did that then we would have to will over 35,000 kg of carbon dioxide and 500 kg of nitrous oxides where the EV doesn’t produce any. EV should last choices long. It is don’t require any oil changes. The first maintenance on my Tesla model three is four years after my purchase date. most importantly is that when we support fossil fuel companies we support the corruption of every government on earth and the cause of pretty much every war that is happening now and will happen in the future. We simply cannot afford to use fossil fuels even if they cost a lot more but in fact they don’t.
@Peter Hicks you sound like a shill for the Fossil Fuel industry. You know very little about EVs and don’t seem to want to learn any more except to accelerate your confirmation bias. You simply trot out all the Fossil Fuel talking points; you know they spend 100s of millions each year on deluding people?
There needs to be a world standard that all batteries are made to be easily recyclable. This would speed the recycle process and reduce/prevent toxic substances going to landfills.
Keep dreaming in green washing that psychopaths, narcissist in government going to solve some problems
Have you question why the Tesla cars gets bigger and bigger. What kind of green is this?
Sounds like a great idea!
A few minutes
A few minutes
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SCAM
When I was born in 1948 there were 2 billion people.
Now there's 8 billion.
Demand for everything is excessive
Demand for many products and materials will continue to exceed supply
Make device manufacturers make the batteries removable by the consumer, that simplifies recycling straight away!
Because of waterproofing, dust protection, and they don't need to install consumer grade rigid was on the battery if it's glued into the back. I'm not defending the practice. Buying a new battery extends tech life, but I understand why they do it. Extending tech life isn't really compatible with capitalism. The goal is extermination of life on earth, not extending it! Your profits can't exploit and preserve simultaneously. Profits > life. Once life ceases to exist , profits do as well
Greed is the prize that infects their minds...
I agree if it doesn't say waterproof at 20 ft underwater then the back of the phone should be removable and Battery replaceable
@@Tripskull The first 2 are pure BS and Samsung knows it because they made the S5 just that, everything else is correct however. It also doesn't help when people out there keep buying the stuff, if people stop buying it they will be forced to change. Now if only someone with enough push would start said change, even if it was in China...
On a side note, buying a phone with a large battery, small pixel push count and low refresh rate (75 or less) will help extend the life of a phones battery, you don't really need 120fps 4K to watch TH-cam or TikTok... Let alone play most games, talk, text and surf the web. I own a nearly 2 year old phone (May 2020) and the battery is still good on it, not the best but works the whole day without issue still, but it's not a flagship phone, but it does have a 5000 mah battery in it. I typically replace my phone every 1.5 years due to the battery, but right now even tho I really want to replace it (EOL for Android OS updates outside of security patches(?), no 12 for me) I equally can't justify doing it because it "still works" lol... Plus my phone has the ability to unlock its boot loader, which I might do.
@Egg-Roll I said "I'm not saying I agree with it." Also I was only referring to personal tech devices. What John deer is doing to farmers or what McDonald's is doing to franchisees, amongst others, is just wrong.
On tech gear, yes the seal and the super glue they use definitely contribute to water resistance. Idk how the s5 is special.
Personally I'd trade the water resistance for the ability to add a new battery.
You're right about the end for sure. I have an S21 ultra. The screen is huge. I have nothing to do, so tha screen is on the.majoirty of the dsy (all night too cuz it keeps youths in Asia away). Wow, it's amazing how long the battery lasts compared to every other phone I've had... I wonder how much is down to the new chip. .
@@Tripskull The reason why I said the first 2 are BS and Sammy knows it is because the S5 was both water and dust resistant while having a removable battery, I owned the S4 and it died from work dust, while if I waited for a few months I could have had the S5 preventing said issue... How effective it was (S5) not sure but it still existed nonetheless, only thing it was missing to a todays flagship is wireless charging, and how many actually use that feature? I frequently flog the dead horse called the S5 to point out we can in fact have our cake and eat it too, the people I do this too somehow think spending $80 for a $20 battery is logical.
For battery life I would say it comes down to 2 things, chip tech and screen tech, my phone runs LCD not OLED like yours but mine also doesn't push as many pixels, mine also has a 12nm chip vs your 7 or 8nm (smaller = better), my next phone will likely have OLED not because I want it but OLEDs have finally started to become cheaper. My approach for phones is don't spend $1000 on one, $400-$500 max this way if it breaks my pocket isn't crying (wasted money is still wasted money), plus modern chips even in midrange can handle most stuff (don't get screwed with 2/3gb ram however, 4 min) for the common end user. My phone cost me $400 with 6gb it doesn't chug choke or hang under most situations (extreme weather excluded) and its chip is equal to the S9's so a little dated but still a good chip (Helio G90T, MediaTek). And yes I buy my phones outright no contracts, for me at least it ends up being cheaper, unless I replaced my phone yearly, which only happened once for LTE.
What JD/McD are doing should be downright illegal and thankfully it has triggered action against them, as it hurts everyone down the line.
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This is actually similar to what has been done with 12 volt car batteries for decades. That's the reason there's a "core" fee when you buy a new battery every 4+ years.
34:12 Danger, Will Robinson. Danger
just the 12v car battery is a fraction of kilos what EV have
@@marbella-elviria - also a led battery cost $150 and the ev batter is $3000
I pay 90€ for a car battery, the Tesla battery is 20.000 and often does not reach 8 years, just politics want to give the cars a planned obsolescenz that is why government enforce the end of the high efficient diesel that lives 20(+ years, so you buy 3 cars instead of one and China makes more money and Germany less.
@@marbella-elviria and over the course of a vehicles lifetime you'll spend over $20,000 for 200k miles. Whereas an EV will last over 300k miles and costs much less to charge, closer to $3,000 for the same 200k miles.
PLEASE recycle your used lithium ion batteries! Its crazy how much of the battery can actually be used to make new batteries
The problem with this...article... is that it only talks about EVs. The effects of the pandemic is affecting ALL manufacturers - both on a minerals and parts supply side. There's a huge demand for materials used in catalytic converters that there' far more thefts coming off of vehicles on the street. Do EVs need to figure out the recycle issues? Absolutely, but so does the rest of the industry. Oh, and don't forget that lithium is abundant and that the amount of that material being used is decreasing as newer chemistries are being worked through.
Did you even watch the video? They mentioned recycling all of the other minerals beyond just lithium. Also you think there's not economic incentivization to recycle platinum or palladium from catalytic converters. I guarantee you almost none of those make it past a scrap yard. They're too valuable
@@Cameronmid1also forgets to note the recycled minerals are not as good as new and live a shorter life it why it’s limited in the amount added to new virgin cells
29:35 This chart is confusing. How is it possible that LFP batteries are only 6% of the BEV market when China uses mainly LFP batteries for their cars and they were 50% of the EV market in 2021?
The secret to the recharging problem is not individual charging stations, but to to have solar powered stations where you drive in insert your credit card and the robotic machine pushes in a universal new battery pack which pushes the spent one into the recharging station on the opposite side. 5 minutes max, and the customer pays for the charge like paying for gas. And it would be quicker than filling with gas. Why hasn't anyone figure this out yet?
That system requires 5 plus times as many batteries. We already will be short on material in a few years as nickel mines for example take years sometimes 10 plus years to start producing.
Great respect to you for helping people you are honest and good person
That dude is so right, I have so much old junk tech laying around and it seems wasteful to throw it away but idk what to do with it either, will look into those places they said though
It's true I took all my old batteries laptops tablets electric bikes a threw them all into my truck and put some wires on them I was able to drive to Ohio
Are you guys kidding me? Educating the public is your first step. You're right about one thing and that's people don't know what to do. Most people throw electronic waste away and that's problematic
I get the feeling that by swapping to EV's we are just swapping one problem for another!
Exactly, going from worrying about fuel shortages to worrying about natural mineral shortages needed to produce batteries. Trading one problem for another.
We as humans on this earth have a Expiration date to sustain ourselves on this earth. This is the first step to stripping the earth of all its natural resources and causing the new issues. Transportation isn't the lead in climate change it's industry.
👍
I totally agree with you.
@@CobraHigh We are going from freedom to totalitarian control over our vehicles, that are soon not to be our own at all. Pure dystopian crap. EV's are cool and smart, but it's not why they are pushed for at all.
Lithium mines waste copious amounts of water. For water strapped Nevada. Wildlife. Land deformation? They gonna drain aquifers mining out that lithium. Crazy.
Everything is a problem. You want to produce goods but at the same time produce no wast or anything harmful to the environment? You'd be better off trying to divide by 0
get rid of 1/2 of the population, then 1/2 of the problems are gone
Ok, you first
@@0hypnotoad0 All people forgetting the Golden Rule should apply.
Another problem is how do they expect people living in apartment complexes and vast majority of city row homes with no driveways or garages be able to charge EC 's. A local Wawa is going to install 4 charging stations in one of their parking lots. Great. You drop off your EV plug it in walk 15 minutes to where you live then 4,5, or 6 hours later walk 15 minutes to get your EV and pray that the charger did not encounter any problems. We have 2 EV charging stations at work and one trips the 30 amp circuit breaker several times a year.Company that made the charger no longer in business. Good luck locating Chargers while on vacation.
I believe the idea is low power chargers will be ubiquitous so you’ll charge when at work in the car park.
The wisest thing that should be on every wise individual's list is to invest in different stream of income and don't depend on the government to bring in money especially now the pandemic is hitting the economy
you are definitely right , waiting on the government is a big waste
Investments are the stepping Stones to success especially if you been guided by a professional
Investing is good but investing in the right thing is the actual key to success . who is your pro ?
There are so many investment out there but if profits must be considered then not all investments are good to go into.
i trade with TERESA JENSEN WHITE
I have dealt with Litium Ion batteries in a small scale for a long time. I have found that CHARGING CYCLESare critical. Like NiCad cells they want to be run down fully and have traditionally not handled well being charged from 30% or so, especially when you first get them. They memory quite noticeably after awhile. Energy density is real important in EV technology, range before needing to recharge. This is traditionally now handled by AERODYNAMICS, reducing drag coefficient and improving tire technology. There are some interesting new designs such as Solid State batteries that appear promising
Great reporting. Thank you!
True recycling is significant in future. EV are supposed to reduce pollution and recycling is absolute necessity
Given the geopolitical ramification of having the worlds largest Li-ion mine in the USA, I'm shocked that this isn't being pushed ahead at light speed. If America could revive it's auto-industry, this time as an EV-auto industry, without losing money to oil producing countries or China's lithium industry, wouldn't that be a monstrously huge deal?
Think about it, who WOULDNT want this to happen? ( other than Indians ) Big oil funds oppositional groups.
The USA has a big deposit of litium in the NEVADA the SALT LAKE. it is almost like in IYUNI in SOUTH AMERICA..
A lot of batteries contain heavy metals that are toxic and recycling is fundamental even if it is not economically viable.
Thank you for saying this. The obsession with profit is ruining a lot of aspects of our society. Capitalism is nice but it needs to have more societal obligations.
I always say. EV just your 3rd or 4th car. cant be use for primary. we just to early for that kind tech
Socialism is fine, until you run out of other people's money.
Heavy metals are lead, cadmium, mercury, thallium, arsenic, iron maiden, and black sabbath. There's are no heavy metals in lithium ion battery, li-ion has nickle, aluminum, lithium and cobalt, none of which are heavy metals, and aren't particularly rare or toxic either.
@@0hypnotoad0 "Heavy metals are defined as metallic elements that have a relatively high density compared to water" wow that was difficult, I used google.
Did this video say the lithium can't be put back into batteries? What else is lithium used for?
lubricants, Pottery and ceramics Manufactuing, Used in Nuclear Reactors, Military Weapons, Medical uses
People doing van/RV conversions these days are following a trend of spending 10,000 or $20,000 on a solar/power/lithium ion battery system so they can cook and heat and do everything with electricity and they badmouth propane like it’s very very dangerous, but all you need to do is look at the drone shot to see how they’re storing these used batteries on pallets spaced far apart to know that they are big fire hazards.
How is the electricity that charges these rigs produced?
Renewable energy!
This didn't age too well.
Excellent program. Would like to know what happens to the shredded battery case materials which are mixed plastics and metals.
“ mixed metal sulfate product” was the label on a bin.
Can be easily separated, e.g, by using magnets or in water where the plastic swims on top.
the battery cells don't have any plastic and they can remove the cells from the battery pack before shredding, the metals can all be separated chemically but you can't recover 100% of them
@@givanildosouza6904 - video said 80% , so mining the earth must continue
It'll be recycled into chemtrails. I had some earlier
Where is all the electricity going to come from to charge all the batteries? Burning coal or natural gas isn't going to work and wind or solar is expensive.
Nuclear power is being abandoned to our detriment! Fuel must be reprocessed!
True, Nuclear power is needed, but wind and solar will be cheaper, just not reliable enough yet, especially without batteries. The real problem is ICE cars.
@@tedmoss Diesel freight trucks are a bigger problem, electric trucks are far too heavy
Coal was down to 19% of US electrical generation in 2021, renewables were at 20%. On that grid mix, an EV is unquestionably better for the environment over its lifetime.
Go read the Lazard economists' Levelized Cost of Energy report, wind and solar are the cheapest form of new generation. That's why they are the majority of new generation in the USA in the world (so EVs will only get cleaner). Nuclear costs five times as much and takes 10 times longer, so no electric utility will build another plant until the cost and time comes down. Maybe some version of molten sodium modular thorium small reactor blah blah will deliver.
Yeah, but most of the batteries DO go to landfills in the form of AA and AAA. No one is trying to solve the BIG problem. This is the high profit easy fix, as usual. In the meantime, our landfills ARE toxic. We need battery disposals everywhere batteries are sold, like Wal-Mart's. We need to put a recycle incentive like 5 cents per battery.
There are several other companies getting into the battery recycling business as well. This is critical because mining supply can't scale fast enough. Even with the addition of recycled battery metals the industry is going to be limited by supply. This is why it's insane to say we need high oil prices to hasten the transition to EVs. That's why it's so offensive when Biden says, "just buy and EV" to the poor and middle class people who are being hurt the most by insanely high fuel prices. And by the way, the 9000 existing leases they tell you about are useless without the access permits and drilling permits that are being denied by this administration.
Who is propagating this myth that Mining can't keep up with demand? its obviously not true.
@@celdur4635 It is only not true if demand is weak. But if you want to scale their production up as fast as the EU and California want to do, then, no, mining can't keep up with demand. And some of these minerals are likely to become so depleted before the number of EV's aspired to are hit that they become for all practical purposes exhausted. All mine production follows a rough bell curve, and after you pass the peak, extraction becomes slower, and slower, and slower. Production becomes rate limited.
@@michaels4255
Not really bro, you forget that to improve production you not only expand existing mines, you open up new ones, the ramp up can be exponential... if we want to, if there is money for it.
I come from a premiere mining country you won't believe how many deposits we DON'T mine, and we are already top producers of several materials and 2nd in copper, with 95% of our mining potential untapped still. NOT counting new deposits that can be found and exploited with new tech in the near future.
Specially Lithium, its 100% a myth, propaganda really, this factoid the press bandits about that there isn't enough of the stuff, when in fact there's LOADS of the thing, its one of the most common elements on the universe, literally.
My country hasn't even began to exploit its reserves, because demand isn't strong enough yet.
I'm not saying we shouldn't find for ways to extract resources without harming the environment, just that we -can- mine our way out of this problem.
Helium is the only resource we should really be worried about.
That and the fact that it does take a couple of years to get a mine running, pending on the type of geology.
As it stands now, until we get 10k USD or at least 20k USD e-cars, electric is a very, very niche product.
Not to mention very few millions of cars are being produced right now, mostly Tesla and chinese, but for the next 10 years? yeah, the mines will be up and running, no problem to replace 50% of the world's cars.
@@celdur4635 Why do geologists seem to be far less optimistic than you are?
@@michaels4255
Who's geologists, ppl have opinions man. U can find anyone you want to support your message.
I tend to rely more on, well, reality, and in this particular case i just know how much mineral riches that are still untapped.
owning a tesla is literally a 20,000 dollar subscription fee every 3 years if you own the car. versus about 3,000 dollars to replace a blown engine in a gas car and that only happens extremely rarely. meanwhile the battery will deplete over time even if you dont drive it. yikes-
Did your thought come from experience of possibly Fossil Fuel disinformation? My 2015 Tesla battery lost 5% in 6 years so at that rate would be good for about 40 years. Where did 3 years come from?
Did your thought come from experience of possibly Fossil Fuel disinformation? My 2015 Tesla battery lost 5% in 6 years so at that rate would be good for about 40 years. Where did 3 years come from?
Well, tesla usually starts with 120% of the advertised battery amount to adjust for efficiency losses and to out perform competitors claiming the same battery size. So yours actually went down around 25%. Lith ion batteries are usually good for about 10 years then cells go out or it dies altogether.
@@hebson21 Are you saying Tesla’s 80 kWh battery is actually 96 or their 300 mile range is actually 360 miles but they don’t let you go the full 360 miles at first so they can maintain 300 miles later? How does this work? How do you know they do this?
@@colingenge9999 you know something Colin you better start saving up for a new car because you know it and I know it things aren't always what they seem
@@arlenmargolin4868 Thanks for your concern. Can you predict how long my new Tesla Model 3 will last? What it costs to operate and maintain? What would your qualifications be for your predictions?
@@colingenge9999 you know if you do the right thing by that car and charge it the way they tell you in the manual that thing's going to be a good vehicle for you let's face it Tesla has probably the best EV in the world today you couldn't have done any better by buying this vehicle and you are indeed lucky for another reason think about how much less maintenance you've got to do especially when you think about what we used to have to do to vehicles when I first started to drive I was constantly having my vehicle tuned up rebuilt you name it we had a baby our cars in those days and even these days cars require a decent amount of maintenance but not near as what a Tesla's got to keep it in tip top shape no you're going to have a long ride with that you really will
Excellent report! This type of information is typically so obscure or hidden from average consumers. It is so helpful to be educated on the effects and options we have using products. At least this way we can make more informed and intelligent decisions. Thank you CNBC!
😊😊😊😊😊
sadly, it is not true info
I think recycling all the materials around a battery should also play a big part in recycling. Plastic will play a BIG part in this, from holders to frame work. All parts of a battery are recyclable. Hell the boxes the batteries are shipped in is recyclable. In fact please name any part of a battery that cannot be used again.
It has to make sense -- if the transportation, logistics, energy input, cost are not accounted for or optimized, recycling doesn't always make sense.
i.e. Recycling 10 grams of low quality cardboard might require a disproportionate amount of carbon, electricity, and clean water to not justify the effort on a monetary or environmental level. The math has to work.
We have been lied to about the recycleability of plastic. Only a couple CAN be recycled and it degrades very quickly. That symbol on all plastics? Yea it's a plastic industry creation. They call it a resin code. They appropriated and changed the free use recycling symbol. ♻️ means recyclable. Put a number in it and all it means is what kind of resin it is. Corporations have a history of these things. Like "Carbon Footprint" and "Litterbug" a creation of Keep America Beautiful, which consisted of single use container corporations.In essence, Keep America Beautiful managed to shift the entire debate about America’s garbage problem. No longer was the focus on regulating production-for instance, requring can and bottle makers to use refillable containers, which are vastly less profitable. Instead, the “litterbug” became the real villain, and KAB supported fines and jail time for people who carelessly tossed out their trash, despite the fact that, clearly, “littering” is a relatively tiny part of the garbage problem in this country (not to mention the resource damage and pollution that comes with manufacturing ever more junk in the first place).
Carbon footprint is being pushed by fossil fuel companies. Trying to make regular ppl feel guilty for something caused by the most profitable companies of all time. They could have done something 30, 40 years ago, but record profits every quarter are more important than ppl or the earth...
The energy it carried through its lifetime? That's been radiated to space by now.
@Tony Duncan no. It's not that kind of radiation. It's became heat energy. Not light energy it didn't let loose a stream of ultra low frequency photon radiation. Electromagnetic energy usually becomes kinetic energy...
*As an MIT Electro-Chemical engineer it would be simpler to spend 35% more $$$$$ to make a battery that can last 50 years. That Technology is here today. To bad people don't see the value in it!*
Whatever happened to the 1990s' 3 R's of Recycling : "REDUCE, Reuse, recycle"
Am I the only who who wonders this when I buy an object the size of my thumb yet it's surrounded by 10x that of UnRecylable Plastics?? In Other words: why is my LED light-fixture unservicable. Yet EV Cars are a Priority? DIdn't we simply create a NEW Problem WITHOUT solving the Previous??
Corporation wont allow that cos it damage revenues. That's why companies like starbuck push all these campaigns like using paper straw, while the true environment friendly thing to do is stop buying coffee or make it yourself. The lie here is you dont have to reduce if u can recycle :)
Because it turns out it's not profitable and what we really were doing was selling our trash to places around the world that just dumped it. Here in my city they are trying to cancel our recycling program bc all it does is double the cost of waste to have two trucks ( one to "recycle") when it turns out that recyclable trash goes to the dump bc no one wants to spend the money to actually recycle it. We used to hide this problem bc poor countries bought it. Now those countries don't want this trash so the fake recycling scam is up.
We don't need to recycle what we don't need. There is no reason to plastic wrap everything at the grocery store. There's absolutely no reason an apple or pineapple should be plastic wrapped but Americans are germ phobic about thier food.
I really don't think about it.
@@vietvipp except recycling is a fraud, look up how much plastic is ACTUALLY recycled even after collected. Almost none, no $ in it.
In what sense are you asking? For replacing cars and appliances, the environmental cost of replacing something from the 90s (or even late 2000s in some cases) with something new may be less than keeping the old thing running. Financially, this is often true even without subsidies.
For plastic packaging- it's for shipping and loss mitigation. Retail runs on very thin margins; either the product would be sold with the same packaging at a higher price, or it wouldn't be sold at all. This has little to do with EVs, however.
You'll have to be more specific when you talk about an unserviceable light fixture. At a guess- the diodes are not a separate part; it would be like asking why you couldn't just replace the filament in a light bulb.
man cnbc make some of the best documentary/reporting on so many topics. Keep going dudes!
don't make electric vehicles compete with bigger or more powerful gas vehicles, it will only increase the problems of safety and access to every kind of road. all personal vehicles need their speed mechanically and electronically limited, even on highways. this will allow any kind of motor driven vehicle to drive together. and if you're late, you're late, time doesn't matter, only safety and cooperation.
How much does it cost to recycle this material? How much emissions are produced to make/recycle these materials with the big lie that this is saving the environment?
what would be better is to reduce consumption, reuse products for a longer time (via refurbishment) and then recycle what is left. Why make more cars when we can make more e-bikes, more e-buses, electric trams etc. 1,500-3,000kg to transport one person is beyond insane at this point. It is absurd.
I agree, but we have to do both, because most people won't give up their personal transport. No manufactured 2-ton product is good for the environment, but if you're going to drive, an EV is unquestionally better for the environment then blowing up tons of filthy fossil fuel driving a conventional car.
How is battery power vs hydrogen fuel cell with regards to the environment?
California's lithium valley is enough to make USA an ev powerhouse. Best part is the lithium is a byproduct from pumping out salt brine so it will be fairly easy to produce.
Where's the water coming from?
Yeah... Not that easy.
@@spl1011 The water is coming from the salton sea as they mentioned in the video. There is the salton sea itself, and that region of california already has a lot of geothermal plants as they mention in the video.
@@spl1011 From Fairy dust
@@SalivatingSteve Wow, the magic Kool Aid :D
@@SalivatingSteve not at Thacker, the largest deposit. As mentioned in the video.
It is better to invest now. You will never be younger than you are today and there will never be a perfect time to invest. Due to compounding, which Einstein called the 8th wonder of the world, you can get rich slowly from investing if you do it from a young enough age.
Investing in cryptocurrency now should be in every wise individuals list, in some months time you'll be ecstatic with the decision you made today
I heard a lot about Mrs Bonnie Berville and how good she is, please how safe are the profits?
Wow I'm just shocked you mentioned and recommended Mrs,Bonnie Berville thought people don't know her..
I have also been trading with her, The profits are secured and over a 100% return on investment directly sent to your wallet. I made up to $360,000 in 2months trading with her
Mrs. Bonnie Berville , is a great broker, his market analysis never fails. I have been trading with him for 3 years. started trading with him with 3 BTC. Now in my tenth transaction with him, my wallet is worth over 40 BTC.
Sooooo....which countries are gonna be invaded to steal precious minerals??
Well there are plenty in Russia and Ukraine....
The CIA already tried to do this in Bolivia
Your empty skull.
Chile, Bolivia, Argentina, Peru, Mexico... and counting
@@asajayunknown6290should've pushed through. Bolivia is nothing without US
they also have a huge hypocrisy problem.
Part of the problem with recycling materials, I keep hearing "valuable resource" and then I hear "you can drop this off". They aren't paying for this recycle, yet keep touting how much wealth there is in this market. I'm not hearing "You can get money for bringing in your old consumer electronics". It was briefly mentioned "in some cases we're paying people for their batteries", so rarely they do pay people to take it off the hands. That needs to change and become the norm before it will be condusive to having people trade items in in a timely manner. If I spent $1000 on a machine, and then a recycling company wants me to pay $25 to take it and then extract minerals and then make money from that. Idk I'm not hearing any condusive reasons / encouraging direction from these recyclers to encourage the recycling from consumers. What I am hearing is consumers will get exploited and tricked into feeling good about it.
Data too
Your $1,000 machine was never more than $25 in materials. So if you expect to get paid $800 for an old used iphone you're delusional. But there are companies which pay you to shred your documents for free because the paper recycling for pulp means they have an incentive to pay companies to cheaply give them paper. I have a friend who own a company that does this. It's a win/win. Companies get their documents securely shredded, and he gets to haul away a bunch of raw materials to sell to paper plants.
I believe that $335 million in funding for lithium-ion battery recycling is included in the 2021 infrastructure law! I am looking at a goldmine, that has already been mined! From what I heard, recycled Lithium has a more ordered crystalline structure and makes for a slightly better battery. Eventually, recycling will be the primary source of all battery manufacturing in the next 10 years.
Imagine if batteries were replaceable and manufacturers provided SW support or at least didn't ban the devices from their services... planned obsolescence is what killing it. You are expected to replace your phone each 3 years despite being totally fine.
Where does the energy come from that goes into charging the batteries?
The Sun.
@@jedburnell9046 You sure about that lol.
@@jedburnell9046 Sure dude. Go ahead and try to supply the entire US with power from solar. Total power consumption in the US in 2021 was almost 4 Trillion kWh. Think about how many solar panels you are going to need and how much land will have to be used to do this. Not to mention the maintenance of those solar farms, the environmental damage they will cause along with the toxic hazardous waste produced by obsolete and retired solar panels. It turns into another whole recycling problem. First batteries then solar panels. Oh and let's not forget what they do with worn out wind turbine blades. The majority of them are just buried.
The Salton sea lithium mining underground sounds like a good idea. Will take up less space. I hope this income can be reinvested in Niland California, and help those residents suffering from asthma due to the salty dust near the shrinking Salton sea.
Very simple but HIGHLY EFFECTIVE strategy!
13:20 It has always confused me when people said recycling is too expensive to be sustainable, while here this man is saying recycling is more efficient, uses less energy, materials, reagents etc...It seems the only hurdle is the initial investment into the recycling setup, which gov'ts and big money were unwilling to invest in.
Watching a video from the US is always like a peep into the future and past at the same time. Everything is full of cool tech stuff, but you still have landfill 😂
Switching to EV has created more problems than benefits.
They just aren't good enough and when I tow the livestock trailer the range mileage is poor. Back to diesel now and normally restored and no more long stops drinking coffee and extended breakfast!!
Why are we NOT discussing electrifying the rail lines and interstate highway system?
because people like myself don't feel safe riding Los Angeles public transit during a pandemic, being stuck in an enclosed space with a bunch of strangers and vagrants carrying who knows what kind of diseases.
because it cost too much and no one can profit off of it..
If you don’t live under powerlines why would you drive a electric car
There will be many " Tesla Killers" , but Tesla will be King for a long long time as Tesla will be the leader when it comes to producing battery cells, the Tesla made 4680 cells will be in a class by itself , in scale and density.GO Long TSLA!
Whenever someone invokes the term "Tesla Killers," what they don't want to admit, but actually is implicit in the word, is that Tesla is The Leader in the field.
Nobody says, "GM Killer," or "VW Killer."
Toyota, GM, VW have been the top car makers for decades. But nobody compares electric vehicles to their cars. They always say "Tesla Killer."
Long live the King!
Only in your world!
@@gmv0553 Tesla still leads in total production and sales of BEV worldwide, keep dreaming that others will catchup , not to mentionits software advantage and profitability,, but yeah GM is numerous in Mary Barras and Bidens minds🤣😂
OHHH YEA! GO LONG AN OVER PRICED STOCK! YEA, BABY! YEA!
Great job on this production team!
There's also lithium in ocean water. The technology for filtering/extracting this has been researched (and patented), and is being put into practical use.
That said, I think the patent should be bought by the government and put into the public domain.
Eventually, when almost all vehicles are electric, enough lithium batteries will be recycled yearly to not, or barely, need this extraction.
Anyway, lithium is always trickling into the oceans by streams and rivers leeching it from mountains and rocky land, along with some unknown amount from volcanic eruptions, so it's not like we would ever exhaust this supply.
If we ever did manage to bring down the concentration in ocean water to a small fraction of what it currently is, extraction would become too expensive, and would stop.
There's all sorts of minerals in sea water, even gold. The tech is there but its not economically feasible to scale it for industrial hydrometallurgical extraction. Recycling is the future.
But with that being said, & being how responsive Americans are to advertisements & how easily influenced they’ve become… I don’t see why more of an urge to recycle our electronics isn’t advertised or put out there.
There's nickle, manganese, and cobalt on the sea floor too - manganese nodules, half a trillion tons of them.
We can't do that any more than we can recover gold or uranium from seawater. Impossibly expensive.
"Eventually, when almost all vehicles are electric..." And the infrastructure to recharge all those batteries will appear just as magically.
salt and lithium are two of some of the most abundant resources, and can be used to make batteries.. also, their source can be tied together. desalinization plants for the salt, and the brine supplies lithium as well. sodium batteries are coming either this year or next.
I'm glad JB Straubel decided to tackle this problem before it becomes a ongoing catastrophe
It's curious that Elon Musk isn't talking about this or isn't a co-founder of this or any recycling startup
Lith batteries still arent recycled, its too time intensive and costly for anybody to legitimately do it. They might make a big rebrand and claim they can be recycled super easily all of a sudden. Given lith batteries have been around since the 70's and are still not recycled, my moneys on marketing smoke and mirrors.
@@hebson21 it's strange you say that they're not recycling the lithium but unless it's my ADD kicking in I could have sworn I heard them saying they're recycling these batteries I probably have the same problem I had back in 7th grade
@@hebson21 How much will cost to recycle than to mine it and refine from rocks?
@@hebson21 is there a link you can provide for your evidence? thanks in advance!
@@thesauce1682 From day one most of America's e waste has been shipped to Africa.
I guess it's economical to send trash to other countries instead of taking responsibility.
If you don't have to drive 2 hours to work research and build yourself an ebike of 48v 1000w or higher. You'll be glad you did. It's a pricey start up but trust me, it'll be the best decision you ever made. Pay 300- 500 on a battery once every couple years compared to $3-5 a gallon gas, $600-$4000 a year for insurance, pricey repairs, ect. They can easily carry a 250lb human with speeds between 28 mph- 35 mph. That's 45kph+. You can ride both roads and side walks. Upgrade with larger batteries, bags, lights and more. I had mine a year and a half and saved $12000 so far.
Just make better public transport intercity and intracity
... Electric TRAIN....
Else just sit in EV traffic jam
Im not recycling anything unless I am paid.
While there will be an increase in the number of EVs we’ve seen that lightweight vehicles have become much more popular. Sales of e-bike has gone up significantly. They require much less materials per vehicle. Smaller vehicles like e-bikes don’t require as much space to store at home or on the road. Bike lockers at work can also fit many e-bikes in less space so parking spaces are not used up. The amount of energy needed to recharge them is also much less. This is the way we can transition to EVs without expanding mining and production capacity as quickly.
Sorry for this tasteless joke, but given our country’s obesity problem, I don’t see the e-bike becoming ubiquitous. We also have to consider that a significant amount of people don’t even believe that climate change is real, which was the primary reason why EV’s were manufactured in the first place. Sadly, I think many conservatives will purposely hold off on touting EVs on principle (not all of them of course). I know a car is obviously different from a mask or vaccine, but the underlying political ideology is the same and that doesn’t bode well for “green” anything. I realize that I’m way off the point you were making, which was a good and informative one. Electric vehicles will become a symbol of one’s political affiliation. If you’re driving an EV, you probably care about the planet; however, many can care less. Anyway, I know that was a little wordy and offhand, but I think you get my point. And I realize there are many other factors that need to be considered before real progress is made, not the least of which is convincing major oil-producing countries and corporations to forego crude oil production. Take care.
@@joegagliardi3984 nothing wrong with evolving tech for efficiency sake, but we've gotten to a point where actual science has plateaued and tech/marketing has been selling the future for future sake. Like lithium ion batteries were invented in the 1970's and still arent recycled, cause its such a time intensive and costly process.
The gov didnt start caring for the environment all of a sudden, its a good bipartisan issue for the public to argue about and focus on. There are massive corporations and lobbying budgets behind most governments. The only way an ev is actually green is if its painted green. If you drive one you want people to think you care about the planet, if you take public transit/bike/walk you actually care.
Its not that climate change isnt a thing, but its impossible to actually chart/predict how, given weathers immense variability. The data, region, time span and filters used could easily change the results to whatever said individual wants it to be, as a result many are misleading and improperly biased. When questioned on heavily biased data, the honest people will admit it and say people need to believe there is a massive problem before they will adopt change or do anything about it.
Then you get into the "telephone" phenomenon like kids used to play. So and so read an article and had a hot take on twitter to which many others post their opinions on opinions of opinions, eventually making wild accusations nowhere near the original story. I hear all the time, the ocean is going to raise 10 feet in 10 years...... no, no its not. Nasa claimed a high estimate, higher than any data yet observed, would result in a few inches of rise in 100 years. People overlook the fact that while glaciers thaw in summer, they refreeze in winter (the news doesnt report that part). That and many glaciers already displace water, paired with the world being over 70% covered in water...
All in all, the market should expand hybrid cars with ni cad batteries (easily recyclable and can handle many charge cycles) that can power the car around 40 miles with a standard 120v plugin. Instead of the gov paying 20k off every tesla, they should rebate the 3k hybrid option for vehicles...
@@hebson21 hit the nail on the head
@@hebson21 I have been involved in putting out fires on aircraft with overheating Ni-Cad batteries. Lithium was not the original culprit in that category. No thanks!
@@joegagliardi3984 More e-bikes were sold in 2021 than EVs, so it does not matter if a high percentage of Americans are overweight or don’t believe climate change is real. They can see gas prices are now extremely high and many can decide for most of their trips an e-bike will be great. It is also very easy when your bike has a motor to assist. And little by little it does burn enough calories to make a difference.
I'm glad that your video helps us develop in the field of trade. Your explanations and advice are always very clear, understandable and helpful.
The cost of ev's is quickly rising, not dropping.
as is electricity to charge them
Take a longer view, the cost of electric cars is dependent on many things. The cost of electricity has historically gone down, not up. Economies of scale mean the price of electricity will go down, price of fuel will go down as the fuel is changed to less costly fuels like sunlight and wind, eventually Fusion power.
@@tedmoss - cost of electric power is up, California shutting down power plants cuts supplies. Solar panels dont cover that
Your tutorial is really great! Continue in the same spirit!
So many people are convinced we will solve this, simply because we must. I think we will find a better way than electric vehicles or perhaps a better way to store electricity than batteries.Grapite, graphene, carbon fiber nano tubes and advanced circuits may make slow discharge capacitors a practical reality. Molten metal batteries are far to heavy & that may be insurmountable but there are other potential storage devices using the same principle.
And no. We have not exhausted all the sources of low polluting high energy fuels from bio diesel to liquid hydrogen gas. And that's just for electric vehicles. Consumer electronics are another high demand on the same resources.
Recycling is demanded but is not yet easy or widely available.
There's a fluid that solves all our problems and the only byproducts are fertilizers and water...
It's called oil.
@@marcschaeffer1584 meanwhile on the actual earth, some of us realize coal, oil, are far to valuable to burn.
Coal & oil are far to expensive to burn if the secondary environmental costs per gallon was part of the price per gallon
@@mccormyke what cost? There are only benefits.
Growing plants, increased access to areable land, increased rainfall. The planet is exploding with plant life, "greening" nasa says.
There Is no problem.
@@marcschaeffer1584 You are overestimating the capacity of plants to absorb CO2 versus how much freaking C02 is released.
@@mahikannakiham2477 I hope your right!
All vehicles have a supply problem. Most products have a supply problem because suppliers are not raising prices fast enough to keep up with runaway inflation.
Are the people against this development the same as the ones opposing the oil sands? Will this mine be operated solely using electric and battery operated machinery and vehicles? Is there enough electric power available in that area to actually power the equipment needed to operate the mine with clean energy?
Last time I checked, the sun shines everywhere.!.!.!.!.
@@philmanke7642 but it actually does not. many places experience long periods of clouds, fog, snow, rain and night time. also solar panels are expensive, hard to maintain and cant be recycled. they dont just simply last forever, they degrade and lose efficiency over time just like batteries. if you run everything off of panels you will need storage for excess power also (lots of big batteries)
I know people have been made to think everything is simple and has no nuance but unfortunately this is not the world we live in. what sounds good on paper does not usually work as well in reality, especially when profits and politics get in the way
How much are they paying people is the question. You aren't just giving them trash anymore. I am willing to bet they don't give you a deal on the end product, knowing you have given them materials.
did not seem to effect Tesla, a few friends and acquaintances had their delivery dates a couple months sooner since they ordered.
They will need 80 percent of the global supply of lithium by 2030, that is 1.5 million tons of lithium. That is ridiculous
Lithium is highly toxic and unstable in high temperature environments. We have to discover a different technology to power our vehicles!
more batteries would be recycled if people knew where to recycle them
Great job, the author definitely knows his stuff.
I'm saddened that he didn't throw some shade on manufacturers that make battery extraction and exchange a chore with the objective of making repair impractical.
Where are we getting all the electricity to charge these batteries without any realistic or reliable new generation?
you don't need new generation right now, but we will anyway in the future for other uses.
Hopefully the components that make the batteries are harvested on mass to avert supply shortages. Hopefully we accrue more of them than gold, with the same kind of desperation and tenacity that we we go after gold with.
Lithium mining is not environmentally friendly either. They take TONs of water to mine and also leak toxic materials during the mining process. Also the largest lithium mine in America sits on reservation land and will disrupt the ecology on the area.
@@braddahjosh808 Ehh so...
The footage of the largest mine in America is of a goddamn desert...
No one in their right mind cares about deserts, tear it to pieces I'd say not that that ever does a dent to deserts. The most stubborn and resilient environment on earth. If a couple of bird species die, well as long as they're not essential to life in the region, let the mine rip and tear till there is nothing left.
It's only pollution if a green is around to say it's pollution. Otherwise it's not pollution.
So, you want to savage the earth to pull a pound lithium or cobalt out of forty tons of earth. Hmmmmmmmmmm that makes sense. Since it was never about the environment. So finally you get your batteries how you gonna charge them ? The US has not built a new power plant in over forty years and cannot keep up with current electric demand as is. How are we gonna charge 20, 30, 40.... million electric car batteries ?
This report did not aged well in a year time ...
EV market growth was 40% while total car market shrinked ... and most batteries produced todays are nikkel and cobalt free ( lithium iron are the present and sodium batteries are the tomorrows winner in the industry) so 90% of the video is FUD today...
Reposting old videos together as one big video does not equal new content :/
Right? I was like I'm sure I've seen this before lol
they wanted to participate in recycling so they recycled their video's
16:30
One of the speakers, Steve Moore, Benchmark Materials said, we won't be able to use the lithium recycled in batteries.
What? Really? Did I misunderstand what he said?
I kind of feel like they dropped the ball there. Please explain if that is true or false. If it's true, why are they recycling batteries? Where is the recycled lithium going to be used???
The Redwood guys seem to be saying they want to move towards a "closed-loop system," meaning -- it seems to be implied -- that you would not need mining any longer; that you would just be able to get all the raw materials you need from recycling suppliers.
I feel like they dropped a bomb
Benchmark Materials are experts in this field, but I feel like they should have followed up more thoroughly on that. Why did he say that? Does everyone agree on that? Does he just mean at the moment? But he said, "never."
Regarding quantity- pretty sure they were assuming a constant growth in the demand for Li+ batteries. Because of that- even assuming a 100% recycle rate- the demand for new lithium would always exceed supply of old.
Regarding quality- tests have been done and new batteries made from old. However, Li in batteries exists in reactive compounds and have casings that Li can also react with, making recycling difficult. The metals may also exist in concentrations lower than in natural ores, and are likely more complex chemically than even lower-quality ores.
2 of the first 3 quotes are over blown and misleading , lithium battery recycling not really a problem yet , possibly ever, because they can be recycled, just waiting on economies of scale to ramp up, and EVs catch fire at a much lower rate than ICE vehicles, where’s the outrage about the hundreds of thousands of ICE fires per year… a lot of F.U.D. In the first 30 second alone 🤦♂️
🙌🏻
The last figure I saw was that ICE are 11x more likely to catch fire.
The US has been programmed by its media into FUD throughout. Some people there need to be the first forever, and yet never seem to get themselves properly locked away.
Awesome broadcast. I learnt a lot
34:00 "It is never possible to decarbonize the fossil fuels that are used to run internal combustion engines." Not true. We have the technology to create synthetic fuel. It's already used on nuclear aircraft carriers to create aviation fuel for its aircraft.
You aren’t saying it IS possible to decarbonize fossil fuels…
2 problems...
First, even synthetic fuels require tons of energy to produce.
Second, you have the same problems with scaling up production.
It's all well and good that synthetic fuel makes up a tiny proportion of the Navy's aviation fuel. (Far less than 1%).
Try scaling up to the entire fuel supply for the world's aviation industry. You'll run into worse supply limitations than the EV industry.
Synthetic fuel generation losses around 80% of the energy + Combustion engines are only 20-25% efficient, so lucky to get 5% of the original energy to drive the wheels,
Compared to an EV that is around 75% efficient from the original energy to driving the wheels, plus can gain 5% back from regen braking.
Basically takes at less 15 times the generated energy for synthetic fuel over EV's.
But Synthetic fuel will have uses where batteries cant be used, like aircraft on carriers where efficiently is irrelevant!
Our community has a large electronics recycling/refurbishing center. It is volunteer based and diversified into crop gleaning, thrift store, and materials recycling. They even sell worm castings made from composted spoiled produce. I am glad to see this be taken seriously. Thank you, I hope you are rewarded financially as well as constructively.
When recyclers do not freely and openly discuss the waste products produced and how they're disposed of, it's traditionally been a red flag.
mainly i guess cause they resell the scrap for the materials its made from if it can be extracted or goes to landfill
But did you realize that without recycling, it is ALL waste product? A tiny amount of waste is preferable to all of it being waste. Also, with battery recycling, the chemically reactive portions are what is sought, the waste is mostly inert components like casings and insulators that are not very toxic.
Nice one Redwood materials, you deserve to succeed and not just because you business model looks a viable one.
Excellent work! Thank you. One of the reasons we waited to have solar power with battery backup for over 15 years because the technology hasn’t improved until Tesla came and now innovation of recycling batteries are here now. Thank you. We need people like JB and others .We use so much batteries than ever and now 2022 the supply chain broken with the political uncertainties.
JB as in Joe Biden???? lmfao!! He is destroying the U.S.
Equity for all.
Joe Biden
JB Straubel, former Tesla CTO and co-founder as well as founder of battery recycling company Redwood Materials and the guy featured in the interview for the first half of this video. Morons.
@@donmiller6435 Your comment is based on politics, NOT science.
@@vissitorsteve I guess you must be a die hard trying to support a very bad voting decision.
What's political?
Who opened our borders at Mexico?
Who shut down the keystone pipeline?
Who shut down our economy because of covid?
Who made people quit jobs because of a vaccine mandate (w/o long term testing?
Who made it possible for those same people that quit to make more money than work?
Science or political 🤔
@D R this guy is getting rich off of government subsidys
EV batteries are an environmental nightmare.