All the current ones, yes. But it would be possible to make a really useful scope in this format - it will never replace a desktop scope but there are lots of times a small, light one would be very useful.
Possibly, although soft cores are quite expensive in silicon area on an FPGA. The only thing that may take significant space is character sets, esp. Chinese, however it may be that the graphics chip has internal fonts - I didn't read the datasheet - easy to find by googling the part number. They could also store fonts in unused space in the FPGA config memory.
that is a blacktopped and remarked ad converter if you ever can't tell just look in the dimple for pin one and if it's not flat on the bottom then you have a blacktopped part other test you can do is swab a bit of acetone on it and see if it dissolves the coating/lettering
Not seen it - I quite like their newer portable scopes (but they could be a lot better and the internal DMM is a joke) but have heard a few complaints about others in their range. Rigol are the only Chinese maker I've seen decent stuff from.
Portable scopes are not for bench use - there is a need for a well-implemented small and light scope for field use, but nobody has yet done a really decent job of it.
UI doesn't necessarily mean "rendering graphics", there's also input handling, setting up the graphics processor, etc. You can run a user interface on just about any microcontroller as long as the heavy graphics processing is handled by a secondary IC.
Hi Mike! - Nice video - You are always very educating in your way of explaining things. Thank you for that! :-) I hope We will see a mini scope in the near future with a better build quality and some real thought put in to the design!
I can't understand why fluke and Tektronix were able to design hand held scopes two decades ago. Yet the technology is available today design a scope the size of the HPS 140 with all the features of say a fluke 125 and with a higher bandwidth and a higher resolution at least 12bit resolution. Yet no one seems to have tried.
The DSO 203 quad wins. 175$ from EBAY and open source firmware. I downloaded the CHIP firmware/UI and it's freakin awesome. FFT, X,Y plotting. Vpp + duty cycle control over the signal generator with built in PWM in addition to the sine/square/saw/etc. Making the D203 into a ESR/Curve tracer is unbelievably easy.
Chinese receptacles are like upside down Australian receptacles, but they also commonly have a combination receptacle that takes both NEMA 1-15 plugs (what's on the POS USB supply) and Europlugs in the same unit.
I've seen worse, like that little OLED scope. reusing an existing case is entirely reasonable as tooling costs for a custom case would probably not be justifiable. They _Could_ have made a perfectly useable pocket scope in this case.
would it be possible to add a cap and dc couple the probe? on a piece of equipment like this I couldn't see it getting much worse, and an increase in usable screen space/zoom has to be useful
There are still a lot of things even the cheapest digital scope can do that analogue can't. You can certainly but an analogue scope AND a cheap digital scope for a lot less money than a digital which is as good as analogue.
I have one of the DSO Nano's and I can at least say they have live trigger levels! They also put a bit of an emphasis on hacking them, there are a few custom firmwares out for them already.
A "Blackberry" style scroll wheel or the more modern scroll pad would be a great option for a viable "knob" replacement. I'm a strong believer in spending your development money on an an extremely well designed UI even if you have to cut back on scope functionality. Limited capabilities that are a joy to use would sell me FAR better than a wonderful feature set with a crap UI.
Are there any specific manufacturers you would recommend for safe, well built, power bricks? I was just about to connect up a USB hub but hesitated at the thought of what was inside the suspiciously light weight 5v 2.6A adapter they gave me
If you do get a chance to review the Quad, please do it after you've upgraded to the custom firmware. The factory firmware has some problems with the offset etc. The new firmware fixes this and many other bugs. You can calibrate it against a decent reference as well.
Gee, the RPS2050 has "arrow" buttons, which have nothing to do with direction, and this one uses an mp3 player box....do you get the idea these things are thrown together in some back-alley Shanghai workshop, from suplus leftovers?
Mike, which stereo microphone you are using for recording this video? I am asking, because at some point - strange knoking noise, and I thought it is in my room. So good quality mics. Plese tell me more about those. Thank you in advantage.
I used to have a seeedstudio DSO quad. Similar thing to this but the casing was actually designed as a scope. My opinion, spend £100 and get a 50MHz rigol scope. The little scopes may look great on paper but they have weird button layouts and it takes so long to just fit the wave to the screen the way you want it. Unintuitive to use, looks and feels like a toy, more of a pain to use than its worth tbh.
More for looking at the edges of the waveform etc, although its handling of square waves looked pretty woeful as well, so I'm not sure I'd even trust that.
I watched Dave's review as well, and I agree - it's a shame that all the hardware is there, but the front end + small MPU let's it down. I held out for the DSO Quad, as it was the only one I've seen which seemed to have had any thought put into it. Also, I knew it wouldn't be long until the firmware was "upgraded", and it now works as a basic logic / spec analyser too. I would NEVER recommend using it for high-voltage stuff though! (even though it's rated at 400V p-p with a 10x probe).
A decent portable scope would be really good for me.. I've moved around a lot and my real scope is too big to come on along. A scope the size of a phone I could just chuck into my hand luggage.
There's a wonderful touchscreen interface called an iPad. I've seen iPods used as the human interface in broadcast equipment with great success. Why reinvent the touch interface control - these devices do the job already, virtual knobs and all. Wouldn't it be great if somebody made a scope that was a sort of 'frame' that the iPad plugged into? Two channels ideally, and yes it would be lovely if it went to 100 MHz or so...
Scrolling knobs for vertical/horizontal.. why don't they use one of those legacy volume knobs. If they can get them with pulses out (rotary knob), I guess that's 50% of the user interface work done.
The technology is hers to do it Tektronix and fluke were designing hand held scopes decades ago. I can't see why know one has tried to design a hand help scope a form factor similar to a hps140 with all the software features of a fluke 125 and isolated channels 14 bit resolution etc.
Those cheap power supplies always scare me... I always open mine up to check before I power anything up from overseas. I am surprised at what they get away with!!
15:32 I really doubt the UI is running on that 8K microcontroller, and I'd guess it's doing something boring like acting as a serial IO expander. More likely the entire system is running on top of a soft core in the FPGA.
Do you trash cheapo wall warts because you truly think they constitute a significant fire hazard and danger to the equipment, or is it just a pet peeve? :)
Generally, you even see this on higher-end stuff, where they bridge the copper of adjacent ground pins together on TQFPs, but in this case, it almost looks like it was done manually ;)
i have an old 10 Mhz analogue scope that will trigger off and show video signals better than that even when its not on TV/video triggering mode. i honestly wouldnt go above a few Mhz with that thing
The DSO203 quad is a better device, it's a pain to get used to the controls but live trigger levels works. It's all open source too with a growing community, lots of fixes and added features available, such as a logic analyzer.
Maybe that earphone icon is really OK. Have you tried putting the probe in your ear to see what you can hear? Perhaps you will be pleasantly surprised! "OMG, IT'S PLAYING GOD SAVE THE QUEEN!"
I'm only 5 minutes in and can see that this device was created as a proof-of-concept device using a readily available surplus enclosure. For whatever reason, it was pushed to market as-is without further development, which is a shame. As least it shows how an affordable, ultra-compact, pocket-sized oscilloscope can possibly be implemented.
Well it looks really, really good compared to the scope I have (a 1970's era Heathkit with a bandwidth of 5MHz, no storage and a small round green screen, and a 20-lb box the size of two full size computer towers side-by-side). I think that thing cost me about $300 in 1972 dollars, which would be like $1500 today.
I am so sick of these toy attempts at usable instruments. The software is universally crap, and frequently the hardware isn't much better. Makes one want to design their own. An encoder or two or a capsense touch screen a reasonable front-end and UI programmers that don't suck and you'd have a product I'd buy.
... This is crap, really crap. This is what happens when you give the concept of a scope from english to chinese to roadside copycats We're just lucky Rigol, Hantek And Owon figured it out a couple of years ago.
yes, especially on a portable unit where quick and easy operation is probably more important than a fullsized one.
All the current ones, yes. But it would be possible to make a really useful scope in this format - it will never replace a desktop scope but there are lots of times a small, light one would be very useful.
Possibly, although soft cores are quite expensive in silicon area on an FPGA.
The only thing that may take significant space is character sets, esp. Chinese, however it may be that the graphics chip has internal fonts - I didn't read the datasheet - easy to find by googling the part number. They could also store fonts in unused space in the FPGA config memory.
You need a pretty advanced digital scope to do everything an analogue one will, specifially high update rates and intensity mapping.
that is a blacktopped and remarked ad converter
if you ever can't tell just look in the dimple for pin one and if it's not flat on the bottom then you have a blacktopped part
other test you can do is swab a bit of acetone on it and see if it dissolves the coating/lettering
Not seen it - I quite like their newer portable scopes (but they could be a lot better and the internal DMM is a joke) but have heard a few complaints about others in their range. Rigol are the only Chinese maker I've seen decent stuff from.
Portable scopes are not for bench use - there is a need for a well-implemented small and light scope for field use, but nobody has yet done a really decent job of it.
UI doesn't necessarily mean "rendering graphics", there's also input handling, setting up the graphics processor, etc. You can run a user interface on just about any microcontroller as long as the heavy graphics processing is handled by a secondary IC.
Yes - edge type pots/encoders would be good - if positioned right could even work one-handed while holding the unit. Scopes NEED knobs.
Hi Mike! - Nice video - You are always very educating in your way of explaining things. Thank you for that! :-) I hope We will see a mini scope in the near future with a better build quality and some real thought put in to the design!
I like this "Mike vs Dave". People should consider sending more stuff to both of them!
I didn't notice that - if they can;t even spell it would you trust them to design it right?
I can't understand why fluke and Tektronix were able to design hand held scopes two decades ago. Yet the technology is available today design a scope the size of the HPS 140 with all the features of say a fluke 125 and with a higher bandwidth and a higher resolution at least 12bit resolution. Yet no one seems to have tried.
May be cheaper to use a dedicated chip than use FPGA space. Also probably a lot less design work if the graphics chip handles all the draw functions.
The DSO 203 quad wins. 175$ from EBAY and open source firmware. I downloaded the CHIP firmware/UI and it's freakin awesome. FFT, X,Y plotting. Vpp + duty cycle control over the signal generator with built in PWM in addition to the sine/square/saw/etc. Making the D203 into a ESR/Curve tracer is unbelievably easy.
Chinese receptacles are like upside down Australian receptacles, but they also commonly have a combination receptacle that takes both NEMA 1-15 plugs (what's on the POS USB supply) and Europlugs in the same unit.
I've seen worse, like that little OLED scope. reusing an existing case is entirely reasonable as tooling costs for a custom case would probably not be justifiable. They _Could_ have made a perfectly useable pocket scope in this case.
would it be possible to add a cap and dc couple the probe? on a piece of equipment like this I couldn't see it getting much worse, and an increase in usable screen space/zoom has to be useful
There are still a lot of things even the cheapest digital scope can do that analogue can't. You can certainly but an analogue scope AND a cheap digital scope for a lot less money than a digital which is as good as analogue.
I wonder how difficult it'd be to make a little interface that converts a smart phone into a user friendly portable 'scope.
...19:40 fwd... 20:00 perfect toss.
Best review I've seen in a while, worthy of Pease.
full marks
Whoa it's a scope, I've also seen it disguised as a portable TV, video magnifier (for vision difficulties) and an MP3 player! China loves that casing!
I have one of the DSO Nano's and I can at least say they have live trigger levels! They also put a bit of an emphasis on hacking them, there are a few custom firmwares out for them already.
That scope is obviously an MP3 accessory so you can watch your music while it plays.
It makes more sense to make a scope adapter for a laptop. Older laptops abound and are easier to get surplus.
A "Blackberry" style scroll wheel or the more modern scroll pad would be a great option for a viable "knob" replacement. I'm a strong believer in spending your development money on an an extremely well designed UI even if you have to cut back on scope functionality. Limited capabilities that are a joy to use would sell me FAR better than a wonderful feature set with a crap UI.
I was going to buy one, but when I found they are dc coupled only and the trigger isnt live I changed my mind.Thanks for the review Mikey.
Well I can see what I will NOT be purchasing for my bench. I keep wondering what application this was built for.
Are there any specific manufacturers you would recommend for safe, well built, power bricks? I was just about to connect up a USB hub but hesitated at the thought of what was inside the suspiciously light weight 5v 2.6A adapter they gave me
If you do get a chance to review the Quad, please do it after you've upgraded to the custom firmware. The factory firmware has some problems with the offset etc. The new firmware fixes this and many other bugs.
You can calibrate it against a decent reference as well.
Could be quite handy for testing DMX in the field with a TNC to XLR lead.
Gee, the RPS2050 has "arrow" buttons, which have nothing to do with direction, and this one uses an mp3 player box....do you get the idea these things are thrown together in some back-alley Shanghai workshop, from suplus leftovers?
Mike, which stereo microphone you are using for recording this video? I am asking, because at some point - strange knoking noise, and I thought it is in my room. So good quality mics. Plese tell me more about those. Thank you in advantage.
I used to have a seeedstudio DSO quad. Similar thing to this but the casing was actually designed as a scope. My opinion, spend £100 and get a 50MHz rigol scope. The little scopes may look great on paper but they have weird button layouts and it takes so long to just fit the wave to the screen the way you want it. Unintuitive to use, looks and feels like a toy, more of a pain to use than its worth tbh.
More for looking at the edges of the waveform etc, although its handling of square waves looked pretty woeful as well, so I'm not sure I'd even trust that.
I watched Dave's review as well, and I agree - it's a shame that all the hardware is there, but the front end + small MPU let's it down.
I held out for the DSO Quad, as it was the only one I've seen which seemed to have had any thought put into it. Also, I knew it wouldn't be long until the firmware was "upgraded", and it now works as a basic logic / spec analyser too.
I would NEVER recommend using it for high-voltage stuff though! (even though it's rated at 400V p-p with a 10x probe).
Maybe your turn to have a crack at it Mike...you have the knowledge and skills for sure.
Google chrome throws a fit when I visit their website. Maybe they are having issues?
A decent portable scope would be really good for me.. I've moved around a lot and my real scope is too big to come on along. A scope the size of a phone I could just chuck into my hand luggage.
Could you tell me where I can get one.
There's a wonderful touchscreen interface called an iPad. I've seen iPods used as the human interface in broadcast equipment with great success. Why reinvent the touch interface control - these devices do the job already, virtual knobs and all. Wouldn't it be great if somebody made a scope that was a sort of 'frame' that the iPad plugged into? Two channels ideally, and yes it would be lovely if it went to 100 MHz or so...
it really bandwidth 40MHz or less?
did you do a drop test ?
Maplin sell an (apparently quite deaf) "portable TV" in that exact same case, too.
Maybe, but not the time.
@Dana Lee That's already been done, and it's as expensive as buying another iPad.
Scrolling knobs for vertical/horizontal.. why don't they use one of those legacy volume knobs. If they can get them with pulses out (rotary knob), I guess that's 50% of the user interface work done.
The technology is hers to do it Tektronix and fluke were designing hand held scopes decades ago. I can't see why know one has tried to design a hand help scope a form factor similar to a hps140 with all the software features of a fluke 125 and isolated channels 14 bit resolution etc.
G rated version of Dave's review :-)
Those cheap power supplies always scare me... I always open mine up to check before I power anything up from overseas. I am surprised at what they get away with!!
Dual Trace??
Quick look at the DSO Quad at scopejunction - search for "DSO quad".
Fantastic video!
15:32 I really doubt the UI is running on that 8K microcontroller, and I'd guess it's doing something boring like acting as a serial IO expander. More likely the entire system is running on top of a soft core in the FPGA.
Do you trash cheapo wall warts because you truly think they constitute a significant fire hazard and danger to the equipment, or is it just a pet peeve? :)
15:10 looks like some pins are bridged, or bodged :)
Generally, you even see this on higher-end stuff, where they bridge the copper of adjacent ground pins together on TQFPs, but in this case, it almost looks like it was done manually ;)
why use a dedicated LCD controller chip and not implement that on the FPGA ? surely he didn't use all the logic blocks on the FPGA.
Probe comp may be inside scope...
No - it would be useless, as to test DMX you need 2 channels and a pulse width trigger.
I think they were rather embarrassed by the even worse little OLED pen scope I bought from them...
would it be good for testing automotive systems?
I came for the OK jigglies, and stayed for the clipped no offset.
i have an old 10 Mhz analogue scope that will trigger off and show video signals better than that even when its not on TV/video triggering mode. i honestly wouldnt go above a few Mhz with that thing
The DSO203 quad is a better device, it's a pain to get used to the controls but live trigger levels works. It's all open source too with a growing community, lots of fixes and added features available, such as a logic analyzer.
Someone's going to nail this form factor for under $200 and make a boat load of money.
Skip to 14:07 if you don't want a headache. I hate crappy user interfaces!
I consider them unsafe, and therefore not to be used.
i have this but it is a free-view tv in instead of an oscilloscope,
and that come from maplins. lol
the "M" Button is upside down on yours
Maybe that earphone icon is really OK. Have you tried putting the probe in your ear to see what you can hear? Perhaps you will be pleasantly surprised! "OMG, IT'S PLAYING GOD SAVE THE QUEEN!"
it's a shame to mess up on the interface if most of the rest is ok
I'm only 5 minutes in and can see that this device was created as a proof-of-concept device using a readily available surplus enclosure. For whatever reason, it was pushed to market as-is without further development, which is a shame. As least it shows how an affordable, ultra-compact, pocket-sized oscilloscope can possibly be implemented.
i could use a scope like this at work. its hard to stand on a ladder and use a full size scope.
20 minute quick review huh?
Ah, I see. I suppose that explains the crazy erratic behavior of my android's touchscreen when it's charging.
Well it looks really, really good compared to the scope I have (a 1970's era Heathkit with a bandwidth of 5MHz, no storage and a small round green screen, and a 20-lb box the size of two full size computer towers side-by-side). I think that thing cost me about $300 in 1972 dollars, which would be like $1500 today.
This is what they use to test all Wal-Mart Electronics. :P
Seems to me you need some sort of big electronics shredder to get at least SOME satisfaction out of stuff like this :-)
"occasional sort of lumpy bits" only in britain!
Never mind
Thks-So is $130 of trash?
It wouldn't have been half bad if they didn't try to over sell it.
I have the DSO quad. Interface is terrible!
i can tell this used to be one of those cheap mp4 players then converted to this LOL
You'd think they'd make it marketable before sending it to be demoed in front of tens of thousands of people. If you buy cheap you buy dear.
+Frank E Davidson Better than the banggood kit julian illet put together. Don't waste your time watching all 3 of those vids!
That thing is PANTS, an Epic Fail !!
People like me who don't really know any better lol.
JUNK! CHEAP JUNK! don't waste your money
I am so sick of these toy attempts at usable instruments. The software is universally crap, and frequently the hardware isn't much better. Makes one want to design their own. An encoder or two or a capsense touch screen a reasonable front-end and UI programmers that don't suck and you'd have a product I'd buy.
Oh, tell me how you realy feel. Lol
... This is crap, really crap. This is what happens when you give the concept of a scope from english to chinese to roadside copycats
We're just lucky Rigol, Hantek And Owon figured it out a couple of years ago.