I was six years old and had just arrived home from school to find my mother sitting on the kitchen floor being held by a next door neighbor. My oldest sibling was at the time a flight attendant for United stationed at Idlewild and had flown that United flight the previous day, but my mom had confused the date and thought my sister had perished on that flight as repeated attempts to reach her by phone went unanswered. Turned out my sister was asleep at the time of the crash and wasn’t even aware of it until my mom finally reached her at 3:30 PM. My sister flew with several of the crew that lost their lives. RIP all on both flights.
Thank you. I can only imagine the grief your mother was going through thinking that her daughter was lost. Back in the day we had neighbours to lean on, we all knew each other. I hope we see that again. Oh, and I'm glad her fears were unfounded.
@@emmcee476 9/11/2001 my father allowed me to miss school and go to NYC with my uncle, who had a business meeting with Howard Lutnick. I was a huge history geek. Our plan was to have breakfast at Windows on the World before the meeting. On the way there, we got a flat on the BQE, which delayed our arrival. The first plane hit while we where in the courtyard. My father was 100 percent sure that we were in the building and didnt find out we were safe until 530pm that evening when i walked through the door.
The boy who survived from the DC-8 had about 75 cents in his pocket. A nurse who treated him made a memorial plaque with the coins. It is still in the hospital lobby today. Also, news papers reported several survivors in the wreckage of the Connie but they died before they could be extracted from the aircraft. Lots of images and witness statements in news papers online. The transition to high speed jets was not as easy as it sounds today.
@@cheeseman7453 I don't know if it was this accident. I've seen images of the Constellation wreckage and it did not look survivable but anything is possible. In 1949, a Pan Am Connie over New York was involved in a midair collision that left the cabin of a Cessna 140, along with the bodies of it's passengers, imbedded in the forward fuselage of the Connie. They were able to safely land without any injury to passengers or crew. With aviation anything is possible...
Actually the plaque the nurse made with the change the little boy had is not in the lobby of the hospital, it is in the chapel of the hospital, and you cannot just walk in. You have to ask the hospital security if you can go see it. Probably because of covid or stricter rules these days
There was a civilian on the streets who saw his apartment get crushed by the DC-8. The wing had clipped his house, then there was a major explosion because of the crashing plane. RIP Victims of this incident.
@@quangminhnguyen2504 i think it was all a plan hush hush . my guess what's your take ?. right / or wrong . please be REAL . thank you . look fwd when you have time to my reply . stay tuned . 👩❤
The pilots of the DC-8 just flat messed up. Too fast, off course, not paying attention to their surroundings. This was an accident waiting to happen, and it did... so sad. Nice video, Allec...
my father (USMC Capt) was involved in the investigation. there were several marines aboard one plane. he said some very senior officers lost their jobs over it, because commands would let marines go home early before their discharge dates, carrying post-dated discharges and no orders. essentially they were Unauthorized Absence and not eligible for honors/military funeral, a huge embarrassment because the USMC wasn't "taking care of their own". the sh*t storm that caused went all the way to the pentagon and white house. it was pretty serious, his team eventually had to debrief Ike--he was gone for around 6 months. it must've been pretty gruesome--he didn't talk much about it. RIP
One plane hit the side of the canyon and the other straight down. They had a hell of a time getting to the crash sites. Not that anyone survived. But just to start their investigation.
My mom was in school in Staten Island, the school was next to Miller Field when this happened. When the crash occurred they heard a loud bang and a flash of light. They thought that a nuclear bomb had went off and they all hid under their desks. My uncle was involved in helping to recover body parts in Miller Field after this happened. The field was littered with debris from the collision.
I was just a child when this happened and knew nothing of it for years but have seen it featured on television and I realize just how terrible this crash was. It's so sad that so many lost their lives but yet it's also a miracle that even more lives were not lost considering the fact that these two planes collided and then crashed in the heart of a city at Christmas time. Thank you Mr. Allec for all your hard work and for featuring this crash of so long ago. Appreciated.
The TWA plane missed an elementary school by just half a block and the United flight could have easily gone down in a much more densely populated area than she did.
I was seven and remember the photo of the boy. This was my first exposure to something so dramatic and it haunted me for years. I so much wanted the child to survive. I'm in tears now at age 69 I cannot put my finger on it but this horror never left me.
I know what you mean, being haunted myself by the murder of a local girl who was 12 by a local boy who was 15. Happened when I was 9. She was missing for a few months, eventually he confessed. We didn't know either her or him, but they both lived very close & we could see their houses on the way to school.
There were a lot of communication failures all along the line in regards to flight 826. The TWA plane was an innocent victim of the other planes failures.
For non-professional pilots here, the last few minutes of A/c/ATC conversation must be somewhat confusing. One essential element might be the fact that the failed instrument on the UA Jet was a VOR. This can give the pilot a bearing to a ground-based transmitter, and, in some cases a distance. If the pilot is flying directly to the beacon we know we are on a particular track, rather like following a motorway or Interstate. Having a second similar instrument, off to one side, we would know when crossing a particular point on a chart, rather like passing an intersection. Without the second instrument, the only way of establishing how far we are along the airway would be to constantly re-tune the only instrument available to the frequency of the second transmitter, a laborious way of fixing our position. Of course, today, in the era of GPS, it's all displayed on a screen. I still feel quite comfortable with the old system, but the young guys can freak out !
Yeah. I guess sometimes makers of these vids lose out of sight that by far not all of us are supertechnical or indeed understand all the vectors and clearances and how, what and where. Probably because they do understand it or use the crash investigation and then lose track of making it clear to everyone watching. It’s why I like Airspace or Green Dot Aviation. While it is sort of easied up, it’s much clearer to understand what went wrong and what the thing was that had to go into the thingamiggy which should connect the whatyoucallit to this amazinglycoolpieceofsteel… (I watch The Flight Channel but literally have no clue what the hell he is talking about when he goes into the technical things of an aircraft in a way that assumes that every one inluis subs thinks:”oh so THAT’S what happened, now I fully understand.” Moreover, I exit the video since I know I won’t understand a thing that will follow. All these Victors and intersections, Preston, holding pattern… it got me dizzy at the end of all the numbers mentioned and had no idea how that would have looked like, when a simple graph or drawing would make it visible and much easier to understand. I do feel Allec seems to get more technical and using more advanced aviation explanations now he’s into flightschool. Good for him but I miss the easier explanations, or it’s just me. I don’t need another TFC tbh…
m guessing no one in them days could do any math to calculate the speed and intersection ,..obviously they may assumed he was under the 250 ..and rem there was no hand off to traffic control either
I was five years old but remember this vividly as I lived in Staten Island when this happened. The day after the crash, my father took me to Miller Field where most of the Connie came down. I recall seeing aircraft pieces scattered about but really couldn’t get too close. That was a terrible day. This accident didn’t stop me from flying, as I went on the become a corporate pilot as well as a A and P mech, with 22k hrs in my book I’m now retired. Very informative video, but you got the name wrong, it’s Staten Island. Opps
Some pilots never made the transition from propliner to jets and maybe this was partly to blame. The propliner's days were far from over as the Constellation was used in passenger service until 1967 and then used for charter and freighter service for many more years after. It's so sad the boy did not live. He'd be 73 this year.
I have a strangely personal connection to this. I was 10 months old. My mother and I were at home in the Flatbush area of Brooklyn when the DC-8 fell. In 2010 I asked my mother if she was aware of an explosion or anything unusual and she said no. I should think it would've shaken neighbourhoods near the site. Her brother, my uncle Jackie, was one of the fire fighters who responded to this.
What a cluster****. And what a good explanation of what happened. I’ve heard that the boy who survived the crash initially was able to give some description of events before he passed away. The TWA Constellation involved was the sister ship of the TWA plane destroyed in the 1956 Grand Canyon mid-air collision.
Sister ship? Was that an intentional? Anyway, the boy really had to go through an unsurvivable air disaster and he, by luck, survived and still used his remaining time to tell people how it all happened. May he rest easy.
I remember this happening so vividly. I was 13, and passenger jets were a new thing. I remember everyone following the story and hoping that the 11 year old boy would survive. RIP, all the victims.
I was 14 and in prep school in New Jersey and due to fly home to California for Christmas vacation the next day. When the young boy survived the crash but then died the next day of his burns I knew at the moment there was no god and became a life long atheist.
@@MichaelHallGray I think I pretty much reached that point 2 years earlier with the Lady Of The Angels Chicago school fire. Although I consider myself more of an agnostic. There could be a God but I haven't seen much evidence of it.
I remember this incident very well, I was 13 years old and living in a house in Queens NY. I was home from school that day with a flu like cold and I was watching TV at the time of the crash, when the news broke in and reported the horrible story. Will never forget those pictures.
SO SAD, So avoidable! I believe this crash was included in the plot of Netflix's "MAD MEN", one of the main characters lost his father in the crash. Thanks for this reviewing this Allec.
@@dcanimations9198 I just looked it up and the episode mentions Not UA flight vs.theTWA Super Connie but American Flt# 1 NYC to LAX in 1962, ( Season 2, Episode 2). I'm sorry for the confusion in accidents and plot lines.
The TH-cam channel “Faces of The Forgotten” has a story about the little boy who initially survived the crash, his pocket money was given to the hospital where he was treated. What makes this boy’s story so sad was that he was traveling alone. Thank you Allec, for a sincere telling of a terrible tragedy.
@@trob0914 Thank you for clarifying that, it was American Airlines 1, but Mohawk was mentioned in the episode, had to look it up as well. American Flt 1 crashed into Jamaica Bay, NY.
Our dear family friend, Herman, died in that crash. Our families vacationed together in Bolton Landing on Lake George for many years. Herman had been in the CCC in the 1930s and was as strong as an ox. He cut wood along with my dad for the annual bean hole bean breakfast after a day of logging and cutting. Herman may have participated in the building of the CCC stone tower on mount Constitution on Orcas island.
it's the ordinary pleasures with friends that you miss the most once they're gone. Impromptu picnics, rides in the country on a Sunday, going to your old high school for a football game.
i believe another channel did an exacting analysis (a lack of controller radar systems) of failures for the time period. Mentour pilot? my father, an investigator: "it was horrifying." aircraft parts and human remains were splattered down the heights of hundreds of feet of canyon walls. recovery was an extremely soul-wrenching process. daddy didn't talk about it.
Allec, nice video again. You know, what I like most about lot of videos from you is the information provided, which explains WHY some rules are how they are now. In this case, why are jets not allowed to go faster than 250 knots within 30 miles of destination? THATS WHY! And why aren´t jets allowed to exceed 250knots below 10k feet? THATS WHY! By 'THATS WHY' I meant the documented desaster happened. Thank you very much!
At age 14 in 1960, I really identified with that boy, Stephen Baltz, who died in this aircraft collision! However, about 1970, I met a middle-aged man who owned a small candy factory, that the aircraft crashed into! He was on a ladder, changing a light bulb, when the plane hit the building. He fell off the ladder & fell two stories to a landing below & was seriously injured but recovered, unlike the six who died on the ground! R.I.P. Stephen et al!
Whoa, I'd never heard about that before. Ship sinkings and plane crashes are more spectacular, but you don't hear that much about other disasters as much.
@@jakerson181 You want me to die based on a You Tube comment. You said "we're", you have been elected to speak for others? You are such a tough girl hiding behind your keyboard.
@@Capecodham Yes, I have been elected to speak for everyone cause like the students you taught who hated you, people here hate you too and yes, I asked each one of them. Buy me a ticket to Cape Cod and I will be more than happy to come out from behind my keyboard so we can discuss this further in person. What do you say tough guy?
The black and white photos of the Flight 826 crash scene seem particularly atmospheric...crashing into the middle of a neighborhood in the depths of winter, looking like a bomb went off in a block of buildings; something from WW2 in Europe.
And I guess nobody knew what happened exactly until smoke from the burning fuel cleared about a half hour after the DC8 hit the ground and people could see her tail.
I had an Aunt on 836. Last week during Mom's 80th birthday, this subject came up. She described how her sisters charred hands were found grasping something, and her sister was identified by a ring that was found on those grasping hands. Mom said that was the moment she believed in predetermination. There were many random occurrences that caused Dorthey to be on that flight. She had told me about Dorthey many years ago, but not the grisly details she has acquired over the years, nor how that event shaped her philosophical view of life for the next 60 years. RIP Aunt Dorthey.
I was 10 years old when that happened and remember it like it was yesterday. We lived 20 blocks away about 10 15 minutes by car. I will never forget Stephan Baltz face on the cover of the New York Daily News. He died at the hospital that I was born in on 7th. Ave & 5th. St. Total nightmare.
@@muffs55mercury61 Also 2 midair collisions in my home state. In 1955, a TW Martin 202 collided with a private DC-3 over CVG, killing everyone on both planes. In 1967; a TW DC-9 on approach to DAY, collided with a Beechcraft, again killing all on both planes.
A trip via TWA would have been on my "bucket list" for sure, had they still been around when I was old enough to "adult" travel. I was born 8 years after this crash and sadly, I wasn't that old when they shut down. But they had a storied beginning and left a luxurious legacy, unrivaled by any U.S. airline today.
The TWA was trying to land on Miller Field but broke up too badly and just fell on Miller Field. The United was desperately trying to make Prospect Park and come down there, away from the homes. He almost made it.
Aside from the tradegy it is interesting to see that point in aviation where piston and jet engined airliners were operating together.The super connie must have been very noisy inside with 4 wright 3350 engines running.(famously unreliable due to running too hot)The joke amongst pilots was that the connie was the best 3 engined airliner because loosing an engine was so regular.
When I was around 4 years old, my dad (USAF) was stationed in Spain (we lived overseas with him), we flew on a Connie when it was time for my dad's next assignment (Maine, USA). From Lisbon, Portugal to New York City (with refueling stop in the Azores). The ride seem to take forever before we finally landed in NYC. Seem like I couldn't get the sound of those engines out of my head for weeks.
I was seven days old at a Brooklyn hospital born December 9, 1960. My dad used to tell me he could smell the jet fuel and other nasty smells on his way to the hospital.
Some flight crews, despite having great experience on piston aircraft, simply could not adapt to the higher performance of the jets and the quicker reaction times needed. The SLC 727 crash was another example of this. It is ironic that the DC-8 was named for comedian Will Rogers, who died in a plane crash....
Will Rogers was an accomplished pilot and radio commentator. He was very well known in his time. Did anyone else notice the DC-8 had the registration number was N8013? Fitting for the first collision that involved a passenger jet with another airliner.
I recall (vaguely, so therefore subject to further check) discussions within United Airlines in the late 1960’s to the point that the UAL crew began their duty day the previous evening in SFO flying the overnight red eye to ORD landing before sunrise then taking off for New York after sunrise. The concern was that flying through the sunrise can be disorienting to the point where it effected the crew’s response to the circumstances they faced on descent and approach into the New York area.
@@liamb8644 "crash"? Pretty sure a plane getting shot down in an active war zone is not considered a civilian aviation disaster. Just sayin'. I guess that explains her flippant attitude when I called her out.
My mother was pregnant with me. She was frantically trying to reach her parents who lived one block away from the United crash site. Thankful they were fine.
I well recall this frightful accident when I was a 16 yr old boy and listening to the CAB Accident hearing investigation seemingly only a few days later when some of this came out indicating failures on the part of the United crew only four and a half years after the Grand Canyon accident where again a United aircraft overtook a TWA constellation from almost the same perspective of the right rear where no action could be taken by the TWA plane. Yet again some years later a TWA Convair 880 struck an Eastern Airlines Air Shuttle Constellation over Putnam County N.Y. where the 880 made it to Kennedy and the Constellation pancaked into a clear hillside and all escaped except for the Captain. Since then there have been very few mid air collisions in this country as positive control exists nearly everywhere at all times.
The TWA plane involved was a 707-331 N748TW, made it to JFK with part of its wing gone. There were four who perished on the Eastern Connie. Captain Charles White and three passengers. Date of crash: December 4, 1965.
@@Capecodham You know exactly what they stand for but just need to be a jerk about it. Just because your life is sad and pathetic doesn't mean you have to try to make everyone else's that way.
Thank you Allec for the video. I notice you always have several spelling errors in the narration at the end. You should have someone check it before publication.
An unsung hero was Captain Ambrose Wilson, CO of the 78th Precinct. That precinct is used for the Brooklyn 99. Captain Wilson personally lead the rescue efforts of the men he sent to the crash. Those men found the boy and brought him to Methodist Hospital. No show inspector tried to crush Captain Wilson when he submitted the overtime for the rescue. It looked bad for the inspector not to have worked overtime or spent much time, if any at all.
I have been an airline pilot for nearly 35 years and am familiar with the 250 knots below 10000 feet rule. However, I have never heard of the 250 knots when within 30 miles from a destination airport rule.
O M F H G NEVER SAW IT COMMING TILL IT WAS TO LATE . MY HOLY HEAVEN LEE PEICE MAY GOD WILL ALWAY'S WILL ALL OF YOU . THR GREATIST GITVOM ALL MAN KIND . GOD IS WITH YOU ALL SAFE , LOVED TOGHTHER . NEVER ANYMORE PAIN . ONLY HEAL . WILL ALWAY's take time & that's alo we have there after . LOVE IS ALWAY'S FOREVER ETURINTY 👩❤💙💜🙏💋💋🙏
we can assume understaffed ,..and no real communications available and so they needed much more time ..this why they stack um up ...the more ships you have the tighter it gets and the tighter it gets the slower you have to go ,..just a guess
Problem is when you have aircraft converging into a general area. Air traffic control was not as tight, especially in terminal areas. Nowadays the traffic flow is much more complex with STARS (Standard Terminal Arrival Routes). Tightly routed and timed.
my daughter was born in the methodist hospital saw the plaque with the change in the chapel was 5 years old when this happen and lived only a few blocks away but have no recall of this accident maybe i was in school and my parents were working ?
My now former boyfriend's father was a photographer for the Post Office (now USPS) in NYC. Because planes carry mail and I think postal property had been damaged,, he was sent to photograph the Brooklyn crash site. To my knowledge, the photos are in their files and not published although they were possibly given to the CAB. I saw prints his father had made from the Brooklyn crash site and couldn't get through them. Awful, like London during the Blitz and the V2 bombings.
I remember when that happened. I was 13 and remember it shocked the nation. As mentioned in here also I also remember the mid air over the Grand Canyon.
So much was learned from this incident. I can only hope that the saying " a wise man learns from his mistakes " has the next line " a wiser man learns from other people's mistakes added to it. This incident took place just (and I do mean just) before I was born.Commercial Aviation was in its infancy. So sad that people lost their lives but the lessons learned have saved countless others.
I remember this midair crash. NBC-TV did a Special Report when the flight manifest was released, and used the old sandwich boards with the push on letters, to show the names of all of the passengers who had died, as the camera went slowly from the top to the bottom. Nowadays it would had been on an electronic character generator, called a Chyron. The Today Show did an extensive report the next morning.
United and TWA had had a Mid-air collision 4 years earlier over the Grand Canyon in both cases the United plane hit the TWA aircraft in both accidents the total killed on both accidents 128 the only difference was in the Grand Canyon accident it was the TWA airplane that was out of position causing the accident.
I lost count of the number of decisions made which, if just one had not occurred, the planes would not have hit each other. But all of them did occur. :-(
I feel so sorry for the 11 year old kid..he was the one Who suffered the worst outcome yet, Alive and conscious for one day, badly burned and dead from pneumonia the Next day..must be painful as hell
Not Stanten Island but Staten Island. What a horrible day as I was there on Staten Island and saw the death, debris and devastation. I can still see clothing and other things hanging from broken trees.
This is so heartbreaking to see. The technology was still evolving, the only way to solve a problem is to identify there is a problem, and unfortunately with flying it cost lives. I'm amazed by the fact Mid Air Collisions weren't more common back then. That tells you how good the pilots were. God Bless them
I remember this.I was 9 and lived in Queens.The boy who survived was named Burns I think.Very frightening.When I was teaching I work ed in brooklyn 2 blocks from the crash site .Small memorial stands there.
1960 I was seven years old. That was a long time ago, but still to this day when I see this terrible tragedy, I think of all of our lives that were lost. Every time I see something sad that happens to people or animals it brings tears to my eyes, I feel so sorry for them because they didn’t know what was going to happen and even in modern technology today. Things like this can still happen. I love to fly but it’s getting too scary. I think I’ll just stay on the ground. Thanks for the video, but again my heart goes out to the people that have passed away.😢😢😪 I guess I’m just a heartfelt person. That’s the way I’ve always been a good part of my life.🥲 I only hope nothing good Lord takes care of those who have died in such tragic accidents 😟🥲
It's so sad how UA826 almost made it after the collision, only to lose control at the last moment - a little longer in the direction they were going, and they'd've been able to (crash-)land at la Guardia, with potentially lots of survivors.
I was six years old and had just arrived home from school to find my mother sitting on the kitchen floor being held by a next door neighbor. My oldest sibling was at the time a flight attendant for United stationed at Idlewild and had flown that United flight the previous day, but my mom had confused the date and thought my sister had perished on that flight as repeated attempts to reach her by phone went unanswered. Turned out my sister was asleep at the time of the crash and wasn’t even aware of it until my mom finally reached her at 3:30 PM. My sister flew with several of the crew that lost their lives. RIP all on both flights.
Thank you. I can only imagine the grief your mother was going through thinking that her daughter was lost. Back in the day we had neighbours to lean on, we all knew each other. I hope we see that again. Oh, and I'm glad her fears were unfounded.
Thanks for sharing
@@emmcee476 9/11/2001 my father allowed me to miss school and go to NYC with my uncle, who had a business meeting with Howard Lutnick. I was a huge history geek. Our plan was to have breakfast at Windows on the World before the meeting. On the way there, we got a flat on the BQE, which delayed our arrival. The first plane hit while we where in the courtyard. My father was 100 percent sure that we were in the building and didnt find out we were safe until 530pm that evening when i walked through the door.
Thank you for writing this.
Righttttttttttt
The boy who survived from the DC-8 had about 75 cents in his pocket. A nurse who treated him made a memorial plaque with the coins. It is still in the hospital lobby today. Also, news papers reported several survivors in the wreckage of the Connie but they died before they could be extracted from the aircraft. Lots of images and witness statements in news papers online. The transition to high speed jets was not as easy as it sounds today.
Is it true the captain went back to help a passenger unlock his seatbelt but they both died or was it another crash ?
@@cheeseman7453 I don't know if it was this accident. I've seen images of the Constellation wreckage and it did not look survivable but anything is possible. In 1949, a Pan Am Connie over New York was involved in a midair collision that left the cabin of a Cessna 140, along with the bodies of it's passengers, imbedded in the forward fuselage of the Connie. They were able to safely land without any injury to passengers or crew. With aviation anything is possible...
Plaque
The price I pay for getting too comfortable with predictive spelling. Or is that two comfortable? To?
Actually the plaque the nurse made with the change the little boy had is not in the lobby of the hospital, it is in the chapel of the hospital, and you cannot just walk in. You have to ask the hospital security if you can go see it. Probably because of covid or stricter rules these days
There was a civilian on the streets who saw his apartment get crushed by the DC-8. The wing had clipped his house, then there was a major explosion because of the crashing plane. RIP Victims of this incident.
@@quangminhnguyen2504 i think it was all a plan hush hush . my guess what's your take ?. right / or wrong . please be REAL . thank you . look fwd when you have time to my reply . stay tuned . 👩❤
You know it’s gonna be good one when Allec Joshua Ibay puts out a video. One of the best in the business!
gonna?
@@Capecodham C'mon man....
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Interminable repetition
The pilots of the DC-8 just flat messed up. Too fast, off course, not paying attention to their surroundings. This was an accident waiting to happen, and it did... so sad. Nice video, Allec...
4 yrs earlier, in 1956, a TWA Constellation and a United DC 7 collided into each other over the Grand Canyon.
Uhh is DC 7 not DC 6
my father (USMC Capt) was involved in the investigation. there were several marines aboard one plane. he said some very senior officers lost their jobs over it, because commands would let marines go home early before their discharge dates, carrying post-dated discharges and no orders. essentially they were Unauthorized Absence and not eligible for honors/military funeral, a huge embarrassment because the USMC wasn't "taking care of their own". the sh*t storm that caused went all the way to the pentagon and white house. it was pretty serious, his team eventually had to debrief Ike--he was gone for around 6 months. it must've been pretty gruesome--he didn't talk much about it. RIP
@@em1osmurf Interesting, thanks
@@gatronflightsim dc-7 is a dc-6 variant
One plane hit the side of the canyon and the other straight down. They had a hell of a time getting to the crash sites. Not that anyone survived. But just to start their investigation.
My mom was in school in Staten Island, the school was next to Miller Field when this happened. When the crash occurred they heard a loud bang and a flash of light. They thought that a nuclear bomb had went off and they all hid under their desks. My uncle was involved in helping to recover body parts in Miller Field after this happened. The field was littered with debris from the collision.
I was just a child when this happened and knew nothing of it for years but have seen it featured on television and I realize just how terrible this crash was. It's so sad that so many lost their lives but yet it's also a miracle that even more lives were not lost considering the fact that these two planes collided and then crashed in the heart of a city at Christmas time. Thank you Mr. Allec for all your hard work and for featuring this crash of so long ago. Appreciated.
rem only one landed in the city ..8 miles from the actually collusion
The TWA plane missed an elementary school by just half a block and the United flight could have easily gone down in a much more densely populated area than she did.
I was seven and remember the photo of the boy. This was my first exposure to something so dramatic and it haunted me for years. I so much wanted the child to survive. I'm in tears now at age 69 I cannot put my finger on it but this horror never left me.
I know what you mean, being haunted myself by the murder of a local girl who was 12 by a local boy who was 15. Happened when I was 9. She was missing for a few months, eventually he confessed. We didn't know either her or him, but they both lived very close & we could see their houses on the way to school.
Weakling.
What a beautiful plane the Constellation was.
Still is beautiful!
Indeed.
@@gregb6469 Right up there with the 747, Beechcraft Staggerwing and the Concorde.
There were a lot of communication failures all along the line in regards to flight 826. The TWA plane was an innocent victim of the other planes failures.
This was so heart breaking.
For non-professional pilots here, the last few minutes of A/c/ATC conversation must be somewhat confusing. One essential element might be the fact that the failed instrument on the UA Jet was a VOR. This can give the pilot a bearing to a ground-based transmitter, and, in some cases a distance. If the pilot is flying directly to the beacon we know we are on a particular track, rather like following a motorway or Interstate. Having a second similar instrument, off to one side, we would know when crossing a particular point on a chart, rather like passing an intersection. Without the second instrument, the only way of establishing how far we are along the airway would be to constantly re-tune the only instrument available to the frequency of the second transmitter, a laborious way of fixing our position. Of course, today, in the era of GPS, it's all displayed on a screen. I still feel quite comfortable with the old system, but the young guys can freak out !
A graphic would be a nice addition that shows what was expected verses what actually happened, for thise of us spatially challenged. Cheers!
Yeah. I guess sometimes makers of these vids lose out of sight that by far not all of us are supertechnical or indeed understand all the vectors and clearances and how, what and where. Probably because they do understand it or use the crash investigation and then lose track of making it clear to everyone watching. It’s why I like Airspace or Green Dot Aviation. While it is sort of easied up, it’s much clearer to understand what went wrong and what the thing was that had to go into the thingamiggy which should connect the whatyoucallit to this amazinglycoolpieceofsteel… (I watch The Flight Channel but literally have no clue what the hell he is talking about when he goes into the technical things of an aircraft in a way that assumes that every one inluis subs thinks:”oh so THAT’S what happened, now I fully understand.” Moreover, I exit the video since I know I won’t understand a thing that will follow.
All these Victors and intersections, Preston, holding pattern… it got me dizzy at the end of all the numbers mentioned and had no idea how that would have looked like, when a simple graph or drawing would make it visible and much easier to understand.
I do feel Allec seems to get more technical and using more advanced aviation explanations now he’s into flightschool. Good for him but I miss the easier explanations, or it’s just me.
I don’t need another TFC tbh…
There is a documentary on youtube that provides a graphic th-cam.com/video/SMAci5JNwqg/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=AirDocumentaries
It would have been helpful if you'd have overlaid the flight paths on a map. The description left me as lost as the pilots were.
Agreed. The description was far too long-winded. Clarity was ignored here.
m guessing no one in them days could do any math to calculate the speed and intersection ,..obviously they may assumed he was under the 250 ..and rem there was no hand off to traffic control either
Those images of huge airliner parts among the buildings, signs, and people of the everyday city are particularly striking.
I was five years old but remember this vividly as I lived in Staten Island when this happened. The day after the crash, my father took me to Miller Field where most of the Connie came down. I recall seeing aircraft pieces scattered about but really couldn’t get too close. That was a terrible day.
This accident didn’t stop me from flying, as I went on the become a corporate pilot as well as a A and P mech, with 22k hrs in my book I’m now retired.
Very informative video, but you got the name wrong, it’s Staten Island. Opps
Some pilots never made the transition from propliner to jets and maybe this was partly to blame. The propliner's days were far from over as the Constellation was used in passenger service until 1967 and then used for charter and freighter service for many more years after.
It's so sad the boy did not live. He'd be 73 this year.
This is a very true point steam gauges to a glass cockpit
I have a strangely personal connection to this. I was 10 months old. My mother and I were at home in the Flatbush area of Brooklyn when the DC-8 fell. In 2010 I asked my mother if she was aware of an explosion or anything unusual and she said no. I should think it would've shaken neighbourhoods near the site. Her brother, my uncle Jackie, was one of the fire fighters who responded to this.
You have many interesting connections: Tina Turner did a song about Flatbush, and your ancestors make great Party-drinks!
This is crasy because the same happened to me as a friend of mine whose cousin's grandchildrens' father got scooped up by a giant crane and....
@@bettyboop-xg6jo That was Nutbush!
I'll bet your uncle had a few nightmares about that incident afterwards, but men didn't talk about it back then.
@@billolsen4360 Omg, of course! Dumbo me. Thank you! 😄😄😄⚘️
😭all the souls lost that day. The best videos in the business! 👍
Hope your flight school is going well ! Thanks for another 👍🏼 video , keep up the great job !!
What a cluster****. And what a good explanation of what happened. I’ve heard that the boy who survived the crash initially was able to give some description of events before he passed away.
The TWA Constellation involved was the sister ship of the TWA plane destroyed in the 1956 Grand Canyon mid-air collision.
Sister ship? Was that an intentional? Anyway, the boy really had to go through an unsurvivable air disaster and he, by luck, survived and still used his remaining time to tell people how it all happened. May he rest easy.
I remember this happening so vividly. I was 13, and passenger jets were a new thing. I remember everyone following the story and hoping that the 11 year old boy would survive. RIP, all the victims.
I was 14 and in prep school in New Jersey and due to fly home to California for Christmas vacation the next day. When the young boy survived the crash but then died the next day of his burns I knew at the moment there was no god and became a life long atheist.
@@MichaelHallGray I think I pretty much reached that point 2 years earlier with the Lady Of The Angels Chicago school fire. Although I consider myself more of an agnostic. There could be a God but I haven't seen much evidence of it.
he survived just long enough for everyone to forget this terrible crash,now you believe ,..god is good
I remember this incident very well, I was 13 years old and living in a house in Queens NY. I was home from school that day with a flu like cold and I was watching TV at the time of the crash, when the news broke in and reported the horrible story. Will never forget those pictures.
SO SAD, So avoidable! I believe this crash was included in the plot of Netflix's "MAD MEN", one of the main characters lost his father in the crash. Thanks for this reviewing this Allec.
Where can I find that episode what number is it?
That was the crash of Mohawk Airlines, Mad Men episode “For those who think young.”
@@dcanimations9198 I just looked it up and the episode mentions Not UA flight vs.theTWA Super Connie but American Flt# 1 NYC to LAX in 1962, ( Season 2, Episode 2). I'm sorry for the confusion in accidents and plot lines.
The TH-cam channel “Faces of The Forgotten” has a story about the little boy who initially survived the crash, his pocket money was given to the hospital where he was treated. What makes this boy’s story so sad was that he was traveling alone. Thank you Allec, for a sincere telling of a terrible tragedy.
@@trob0914
Thank you for clarifying that, it was American Airlines 1, but Mohawk was mentioned in the episode, had to look it up as well. American Flt 1 crashed into Jamaica Bay, NY.
Our dear family friend, Herman, died in that crash. Our families vacationed together in Bolton Landing on Lake George for many years. Herman had been in the CCC in the 1930s and was as strong as an ox. He cut wood along with my dad for the annual bean hole bean breakfast after a day of logging and cutting.
Herman may have participated in the building of the CCC stone tower on mount Constitution on Orcas island.
it's the ordinary pleasures with friends that you miss the most once they're gone. Impromptu picnics, rides in the country on a Sunday, going to your old high school for a football game.
Great video. Say Allec think you could do a video on the 1956 Grand Canyon mid-air collision?
i believe another channel did an exacting analysis (a lack of controller radar systems) of failures for the time period. Mentour pilot? my father, an investigator: "it was horrifying." aircraft parts and human remains were splattered down the heights of hundreds of feet of canyon walls. recovery was an extremely soul-wrenching process. daddy didn't talk about it.
Allec, nice video again. You know, what I like most about lot of videos from you is the information provided, which explains WHY some rules are how they are now. In this case, why are jets not allowed to go faster than 250 knots within 30 miles of destination? THATS WHY! And why aren´t jets allowed to exceed 250knots below 10k feet? THATS WHY!
By 'THATS WHY' I meant the documented desaster happened.
Thank you very much!
The collision crashes is the one that hits me in the guts... smh... Remembering the victims of this tragic crash
At age 14 in 1960, I really identified with that boy, Stephen Baltz, who died in this aircraft collision!
However, about 1970, I met a middle-aged man who owned a small candy factory, that the aircraft crashed into!
He was on a ladder, changing a light bulb, when the plane hit the building. He fell off the ladder & fell two stories
to a landing below & was seriously injured but recovered, unlike the six who died on the ground! R.I.P. Stephen et al!
As usual, this man has excellent videos! Top notch on here. I totally love this channel
Thanks for doing this video, Allec!
Bad week in New York City, just 3 days after this crash a fire in the Brooklyn Navy Yard killed over 50 people
Whoa, I'd never heard about that before. Ship sinkings and plane crashes are more spectacular, but you don't hear that much about other disasters as much.
Apart from the 128 on the two planes, 6 persons on the ground also died.
Then the les moved into Park Slop.
Allen you are amazing! Awesome job again.
It's Allec not Allen.
RIP to all. And thank you Mr. Allec for the great work.
RIP what and idiot, this was 62 years ago.
@@Capecodham We're all looking forward to when we can say RIP about you Burt, but in your case, it would stand for Rot In Purgatory.
@@jakerson181 You want me to die based on a You Tube comment. You said "we're", you have been elected to speak for others? You are such a tough girl hiding behind your keyboard.
@@Capecodham Yes, I have been elected to speak for everyone cause like the students you taught who hated you, people here hate you too and yes, I asked each one of them. Buy me a ticket to Cape Cod and I will be more than happy to come out from behind my keyboard so we can discuss this further in person. What do you say tough guy?
Once again, you hit it out of the park! Thank you!
The black and white photos of the Flight 826 crash scene seem particularly atmospheric...crashing into the middle of a neighborhood in the depths of winter, looking like a bomb went off in a block of buildings; something from WW2 in Europe.
Or 2022 Ukraine 🇺🇦😢
And I guess nobody knew what happened exactly until smoke from the burning fuel cleared about a half hour after the DC8 hit the ground and people could see her tail.
How terrifying. And that poor boy!
Been waiting on this one for a long time
Well done, Mr Ibay.
Live and learn, hopefully 🙏🏽
I’m also thinking of the United and TWA colliding over New
York, years before.
Great video!👍🙂
Until this video I've never heard about this crash.
Fantastic job!
I had an Aunt on 836. Last week during Mom's 80th birthday, this subject came up. She described how her sisters charred hands were found grasping something, and her sister was identified by a ring that was found on those grasping hands. Mom said that was the moment she believed in predetermination. There were many random occurrences that caused Dorthey to be on that flight.
She had told me about Dorthey many years ago, but not the grisly details she has acquired over the years, nor how that event shaped her philosophical view of life for the next 60 years. RIP Aunt Dorthey.
Dorothy M. Miner.
That hits hard to hear.
Jesus has her in heaven now. ✝️
What do you think she was grasping?
Great! Thank you so much for this video. I couldn't wait for this.
one of the rare FROM COCKPIT looks at the oncoming ground by Allec.... man that can't be a good sight to see ..>EVER!! a great video as always.
I was surprised that United plane is still flying despite damage to the wing
It had 3/4 of the total wing span left, so it's feasible it was still able to fly.
Is it flying for a minute when there is no control and the plane won't do what the pilot wants or is it remaining airborne until impact?
I was 10 years old when that happened and remember it like it was yesterday. We lived 20 blocks away about 10 15 minutes by car. I will never forget Stephan Baltz face on the cover of the New York Daily News. He died at the hospital that I was born in on 7th. Ave & 5th. St. Total nightmare.
Well done! I was wondering when you would do a simulation of this disaster.
TWA suffered a lot of mid air collisions... RIP to that great airline and all the souls lost that day
Yes. Four years earlier was the Grand Canyon crash.
@@muffs55mercury61 Also 2 midair collisions in my home state. In 1955, a TW Martin 202 collided with a private DC-3 over CVG, killing everyone on both planes. In 1967; a TW DC-9 on approach to DAY, collided with a Beechcraft, again killing all on both planes.
RIP what and idiot, this was 62 years ago.
@@tpajay So sad. No such thing as TCAS in those days, It was the rule "see and be seen". Sometime air traffic control could help but not always.
A trip via TWA would have been on my "bucket list" for sure, had they still been around when I was old enough to "adult" travel. I was born 8 years after this crash and sadly, I wasn't that old when they shut down. But they had a storied beginning and left a luxurious legacy, unrivaled by any U.S. airline today.
Love your channel. God I miss flight sim so bad.
Good video Allec. Lots of communication problems, inoperative equpt and misunderstandings involved.
These Planes are almost as fast as my clicking on your new videos...turbo engaged
Conny was a beautiful aircraft. so sad.
The TWA was trying to land on Miller Field but broke up too badly and just fell on Miller Field.
The United was desperately trying to make Prospect Park and come down there, away from the homes.
He almost made it.
Aside from the tradegy it is interesting to see that point in aviation where piston and jet engined airliners were operating together.The super connie must have been very noisy inside with 4 wright 3350 engines running.(famously unreliable due to running too hot)The joke amongst pilots was that the connie was the best 3 engined airliner because loosing an engine was so regular.
When I was around 4 years old, my dad (USAF) was stationed in Spain (we lived overseas with him), we flew on a Connie when it was time for my dad's next assignment (Maine, USA). From Lisbon, Portugal to New York City (with refueling stop in the Azores). The ride seem to take forever before we finally landed in NYC. Seem like I couldn't get the sound of those engines out of my head for weeks.
@@dwmzmm You lucky man.I have had a pleasure flight in a DC3 and that made some noise so I can only imagine what the Connies were like.
I was seven days old at a Brooklyn hospital born December 9, 1960. My dad used to tell me he could smell the jet fuel and other nasty smells on his way to the hospital.
Some flight crews, despite having great experience on piston aircraft, simply could not adapt to the higher performance of the jets and the quicker reaction times needed.
The SLC 727 crash was another example of this.
It is ironic that the DC-8 was named for comedian Will Rogers, who died in a plane crash....
Will Rogers was an accomplished pilot and radio commentator. He was very well known in his time. Did anyone else notice the DC-8 had the registration number was
N8013? Fitting for the first collision that involved a passenger jet with another airliner.
6 min agooo and I've been waiting for this for like a century
get a life.
I recall (vaguely, so therefore subject to further check) discussions within United Airlines in the late 1960’s to the point that the UAL crew began their duty day the previous evening in SFO flying the overnight red eye to ORD landing before sunrise then taking off for New York after sunrise. The concern was that flying through the sunrise can be disorienting to the point where it effected the crew’s response to the circumstances they faced on descent and approach into the New York area.
This was the deadliest aviation disaster of all time, the Tenerife of its day. It would hold the title until May 1968.
134 fatalities here. 88 in the 1968 Braniff crash.
@@BlackMan614 Then I am obviously not referring to that.
@@BlackMan614 I think Tania is referring to the May 1968 crash in Vietnam
@@liamb8644 "crash"? Pretty sure a plane getting shot down in an active war zone is not considered a civilian aviation disaster. Just sayin'. I guess that explains her flippant attitude when I called her out.
@@BlackMan614 I think your attitude is just as flippant but I will just leave that there lol.
Another excellent video 🙂
It is difficult to fully understand what happened without a map and a track of the planes.
that would require some effort.
Excellent video..First I'VE heard about this horrific crash...I was just a little kid when it happened.....
These amazing graphics make me feel 25 years younger, like playing my first Playstation.
My mother was pregnant with me. She was frantically trying to reach her parents who lived one block away from the United crash site. Thankful they were fine.
You need charts to make this presentation understandable.
That one kid who survived for an extra day ! Still Awesome today !!
I well recall this frightful accident when I was a 16 yr old boy and listening to the CAB Accident hearing investigation seemingly only a few days later when some of this came out indicating failures on the part of the United crew only four and a half years after the Grand Canyon accident where again a United aircraft overtook a TWA constellation from almost the same perspective of the right rear where no action could be taken by the TWA plane. Yet again some years later a TWA Convair 880 struck an Eastern Airlines Air Shuttle Constellation over Putnam County N.Y. where the 880 made it to Kennedy and the Constellation pancaked into a clear hillside and all escaped except for the Captain. Since then there have been very few mid air collisions in this country as positive control exists nearly everywhere at all times.
The TWA plane involved was a 707-331 N748TW, made it to JFK with part of its wing gone. There were four who perished on the Eastern Connie. Captain Charles White and three passengers. Date of crash: December 4, 1965.
The audio is fantastic.
man u r really pumpin out great vids.
u? r? vids?
@@Capecodham You know exactly what they stand for but just need to be a jerk about it. Just because your life is sad and pathetic doesn't mean you have to try to make everyone else's that way.
Thank you Allec for the video. I notice you always have several spelling errors in the narration at the end. You should have someone check it before publication.
Love the videos but maybe change up the ending music a bit? :)
An unsung hero was Captain Ambrose Wilson, CO of the 78th Precinct. That precinct is used for the Brooklyn 99. Captain Wilson personally lead the rescue efforts of the men he sent to the crash. Those men found the boy and brought him to Methodist Hospital. No show inspector tried to crush Captain Wilson when he submitted the overtime for the rescue. It looked bad for the inspector not to have worked overtime or spent much time, if any at all.
I remember this crash. Used to live around the corner from the impact zone.
I have been an airline pilot for nearly 35 years and am familiar with the 250 knots below 10000 feet rule. However, I have never heard of the 250 knots when within 30 miles from a destination airport rule.
O M F H G NEVER SAW IT COMMING TILL IT WAS TO LATE . MY HOLY HEAVEN LEE PEICE MAY GOD WILL ALWAY'S WILL ALL OF YOU . THR GREATIST GITVOM ALL MAN KIND . GOD IS WITH YOU ALL SAFE , LOVED TOGHTHER . NEVER ANYMORE PAIN . ONLY HEAL . WILL ALWAY's take time & that's alo we have there after . LOVE IS ALWAY'S FOREVER ETURINTY 👩❤💙💜🙏💋💋🙏
we can assume understaffed ,..and no real communications available and so they needed much more time ..this why they stack um up ...the more ships you have the tighter it gets and the tighter it gets the slower you have to go ,..just a guess
@@thecoondog56 : My point was, if there ever was such a rule, it was no longer there during my airline career which started in 1987.
I remember reading about this crash at the time in the UK newspapers - I was the same age as the boy who had initially survived
Problem is when you have aircraft converging into a general area. Air traffic control was not as tight, especially in terminal areas.
Nowadays the traffic flow is much more complex with STARS (Standard Terminal Arrival Routes). Tightly routed and timed.
my daughter was born in the methodist hospital saw the plaque with the change in the chapel was 5 years old when this happen and lived only a few blocks away but have no recall of this accident maybe i was in school and my parents were working ?
My now former boyfriend's father was a photographer for the Post Office (now USPS) in NYC. Because planes carry mail and I think postal property had been damaged,, he was sent to photograph the Brooklyn crash site. To my knowledge, the photos are in their files and not published although they were possibly given to the CAB. I saw prints his father had made from the Brooklyn crash site and couldn't get through them. Awful, like London during the Blitz and the V2 bombings.
Good job Allec.
I love how allec refuses to use any animations but air crash investigation
I remember when that happened. I was 13 and remember it shocked the nation. As mentioned in here also I also remember the mid air over the Grand Canyon.
So much was learned from this incident. I can only hope that the saying " a wise man learns from his mistakes " has the next line " a wiser man learns from other people's mistakes added to it.
This incident took place just (and I do mean just) before I was born.Commercial Aviation was in its infancy. So sad that people lost their lives but the lessons learned have saved countless others.
62 yrs, I was shocked as a 11 yr old boy to think something like this could happen
I was waiting for this one
Interesting to find out this was the reason for implementation of the
speed doesnt give air traffic time to correct things if and when they`re starting to happen ,..im guessing the slower the speed the bigger the window
RIP to the ones who passed away
So enjoy your work
The second time a United and twa planes hit each other
I remember this midair crash. NBC-TV did a Special Report when the flight manifest was released, and used the old sandwich boards with the push on letters, to show the names of all of the passengers who had died, as the camera went slowly from the top to the bottom. Nowadays it would had been on an electronic character generator, called a Chyron. The Today Show did an extensive report the next morning.
United and TWA had had a Mid-air collision 4 years earlier over the Grand Canyon
in both cases the United plane hit the TWA aircraft in both accidents the total
killed on both accidents 128 the only difference was in the Grand Canyon accident
it was the TWA airplane that was out of position causing the accident.
I lost count of the number of decisions made which, if just one had not occurred, the planes would not have hit each other. But all of them did occur. :-(
I feel so sorry for the 11 year old kid..he was the one Who suffered the worst outcome yet, Alive and conscious for one day, badly burned and dead from pneumonia the Next day..must be painful as hell
This is another video where you need to add a graphical chart somewhere. Describing the Victor airways and intersections does not work in just text.
Not Stanten Island but Staten Island. What a horrible day as I was there on Staten Island and saw the death, debris and devastation. I can still see clothing and other things hanging from broken trees.
This is so heartbreaking to see. The technology was still evolving, the only way to solve a problem is to identify there is a problem, and unfortunately with flying it cost lives. I'm amazed by the fact Mid Air Collisions weren't more common back then. That tells you how good the pilots were. God Bless them
I remember this.I was 9 and lived in Queens.The boy who survived was named Burns I think.Very frightening.When I was teaching I work ed in brooklyn 2 blocks from the crash site .Small memorial stands there.
The surviving boy was named Stephen Baltz.
I Believe Life magazine had a picture of a woman holding an umbrella over the boy. She had a leopard skin coat on.
1960 I was seven years old. That was a long time ago, but still to this day when I see this terrible tragedy, I think of all of our lives that were lost. Every time I see something sad that happens to people or animals it brings tears to my eyes, I feel so sorry for them because they didn’t know what was going to happen and even in modern technology today. Things like this can still happen. I love to fly but it’s getting too scary. I think I’ll just stay on the ground. Thanks for the video, but again my heart goes out to the people that have passed away.😢😢😪 I guess I’m just a heartfelt person. That’s the way I’ve always been a good part of my life.🥲 I only hope nothing good Lord takes care of those who have died in such tragic accidents 😟🥲
It's so sad how UA826 almost made it after the collision, only to lose control at the last moment - a little longer in the direction they were going, and they'd've been able to (crash-)land at la Guardia, with potentially lots of survivors.
No! They were desperately trying to crash land in Prospect Park.
An interesting video about a tragic event, but of limited value to those unfamiliar with airline navigation terms. Victor? Preston?