Scion xD: A Misfire Killed The Alternator!?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ส.ค. 2022
- In this video I have a look at a lady's 2009 Scion xA that she dropped off because the engine light was flashing and then all of a sudden the battery light came on too. Are the problems related? Well....kind of.
-Enjoy!
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I see several of you folks are asking about the purpose of the decoupling pulley on the alternator. Do a quick google search and you will find some good results from reputable sources.
-Cheers 🍻
Alternator pulleys are not so simple anymore. Many late-model vehicles are equipped with special pulleys that are engineered to reduce NVH (noise, vibration and harshness) and extend the life of the alternator. An Overrunning Alternator Pulley (OAP) has a one-way clutch mechanism inside the hub that allows the belt to turn the alternator in one direction, but allows the alternator to “free wheel” and spin at its own speed when the engine suddenly decelerates.
-Stolen from the internet
It is still on the internet so no theft. Only moved.
2009 with 246K MILES WOW! ITS A TOYOTA
Did you know that some solid alternator pulleys have been replaced by a patented pulley technology that is an important part of the drive system design? These new high tech alternator decoupler pulleys (ADP) allow the belt to power the alternator during acceleration and cruising speed, but DECOUPLE or disengage from the alternator during engine deceleration.
When I first saw it, I thought you had a lose belt. The cars they keep a changin'
"Extend the life of the alternator" my ass. All they do is break. The idea that the armature is going to spin faster than the pulley that is driving it and generate extra electricity is totally idiotic. I just weld the pulley solid and it works every time.
The customer that just says "fix it" is the best kind to have!
Eric, Less than 247,000 miles and it is already causing grief. No wonder Scion went out of business. 😉
If only she bought a chrysler smh
I 100% agree with what you said about a quiet shop. The hour or 2 I stay late at the shop with no waiters or other interruptions is magic time.
During my engineering career I was typically presented with problems near COB. They wanted an analysis (preferably a solution) by OOB. The only way to crank out the solutions was to work in the solitude of night...
Yo, I need one sandwich plain & one with Mayo, Nick! 🤣🤣
I'm a carpenter but do mechanic's on all engines,the times i work at night with some tunes, no karen or ken over my shoulder are the best.
@@dudleydeplorable5307 You could work overtime but it still won't clear all the crap that's in the lot waiting to be repaired.
Eric, I have more confidence in your parts cannon guesses than other technicians factual diagnoses.
Had a failed alternator on a Mazda tribute, client wanted a second hand one to replace it, so I asked my son to get it from his local pick a part, same sort of place as Wilberts.
He thought he wouldn't have to much trouble, not realising that it was between the firewall and the block just above the suspension and the car was on the ground, by the time he got it out the place had closed and everyone had gone, gates locked and guard dogs loose....oops.
When it comes to ignition coil failures (over 100k miles) my approach is: First time you get new coil and all plugs. Second time you get the rest of the coils. Communication with the customer is key. Nothing worse than hearing "Its doing the same thing".
My check engine light is on its doing the same thing 😂.
It's either an aftermarket alt now, or an aftermarket alt later, so probably better that you swapped it out. Nice of you to work late so the lady doesn't have to stress about getting around. You're a good guy, Eric! 👍
I agree with her decision. The absolute most milage that I have had an alternator last was about 275,000. Usually I don't even get close to that. I'm a little nervous because I'm driving an 04 Corolla that has 235,000 plus miles on it. Original alternator and a new set of brushes in the starter about 2 years ago. I just have to keep an eye on it and take care of it when it happens.
@@danielbutler578 sounds like Russian Roulette to me, but then I'm a preemptive belt and suspenders guy. I don't like breaking down on the highway, cuz today's drivers are freaking maniacs. You simply cannot go fast enough for some of them. They think the Route 95 sign is the speed limit.
I just replaced the alternator on my wife’s RAV4. It is truly amazing how an alternator that looks like it would be so easy to replace can turn out to be such a PIA when you actually do it.
Toyota V6 alternators are a royal P.I.T.A.
@@SibRevs I up that PIA with a 2008 Cadillac DTS
@@ignacio8597 I just did a Northstar alternator a few weeks ago. Not fun, but it's a piece of cake compared to the 1st gen Ford Fusion with the 3.5 V6. That was by far the most difficult alternator I ever changed. Never would have believed that there is a regular family car in existence that requires the AC compressor to be removed and entire sub frame dropped to just to barely have enough clearance to change the alternator. Way to go Ford turning what should be a reasonably simple job into an infuriating 7 hour nightmare!
@@averyalexander2303 Wow, that's rough. The bad part is I own a DTS and also heard the starter is located beneath the intake? Or something like that. I don't get why they have to overly complicate parts that should be easily serviceable. And of course I didn't learn all of this until I bought the car. I do HVAC and it's the same way, engineers hate service technicians and make parts that are supposed to be maintained yearly the hardest to get to/service/replace.
@@ignacio8597 On the starter replacement, the first time is miserable. Once you've gone through four parts store replacements in a month, it's about a 20 minute job to put in a factory starter in the Caddy dealer lot. Just pull the manifold bolts and prop it up, no need to unhook the fuel lines, cake!
I like the way you discuss the practicalities of a busy shop. You've got enough street cred for everybody to realize when a cut corner is justifiable, certainly the diagnosis was proven. And your remark about quiet time after the shop closes is golden.
Bit of a universal truth, that. As an engineering manager, most of my day is spent on 'management' type issues, or 'people' issues. I only really get settled into 'engineering' issues once everyone else goes home.
This is a really cool video. I've would have chosen to replace the alternator also. Why take a chance on getting stuck again for the same part? The customers that live near you don't know how lucky they are. Most mechanics & garages would never take the time to test the cars to make sure everything is up and running ok. They figure I got this problem fixed if something else breaks it's on the customer. The car manufactories should never build cars with everything pushed into a very small place. Awesome video thumbs up. Stay well & safe everyone.
I bought a 2019 Hyundai Elantra. One of the things I noticed when I was looking at the car at the dealership, I bought it new, was how much room there was in the front of the engine. This year prototypical transverse mounted engine and transmission. It does have the dual clutch transmission so it's kind of an automatic manual. There's a lot of room under the hood for this car. I've worked on bigger cars that had no room under the hood. The worst memory I have was a Ford tempo. I replaced the head gasket and the water pump. A friend had overheated the hell out of the car and warped the head. I didn't have any way to true the head and I wasn't really feeling like taking it off again. So you know I told him yeah he needed to get another head for it or get another car. That car was a serious knuckle buster. Just the backyard mechanic here so I didn't have lifts and other goodies if I worked on something.
@@JohnRodriguesPhotographer The good news is soon all cars sold will be electric and subscription based purchase. Imagine the freedom of never getting to save money working on your own car again.
YES! agreed!
A note for all of us ... Sometimes, Eric, it does NOT pay to be "Too Nice". If all 4 coils had been changed at your previous repair ... you might have been able to go home early instead of even making this video!
That said, please know that I admire your expertise and honesty ... AND ... your videos and commentary are both ... EXCELLENT!
Replacing an alternator isn't always the way to go. Replaced one on the RV in Alaska and by the time I got to Whitehorse it had gone bad. The NAPA in Whitehorse replaced the bearings in the old one and I was good to go again.
When I was a young shade tree mechanic in the mid 80s I remember swapping out the alternator on my then 1976 Gran Torino on the side of the road (were it died) in under 30mins. I’m older now and the charging systems on cars today are much scarier. Somewhere down the line I think I’ve lost my youthful, I can fix anything, mindset. Great job Eric O!
I watched your video at Playback Speed x2 so that you could get home sooner. :)
You're a good man Mr. O. A good deed you did making sure her cars back on the road given her situation.
Way back in the 80s when the tiny cars first started hitting the shop I was wishing then the engineers would just give me an extra inch if free space on all sides to make repairs like this so much easier.
Come on people, give the man some likes! Nice job Eric.
With the TH-cam shadow banning, it's difficult to comment, like, and share...
@@dudleydeplorable5307 What do you mean shadow banning? Haven't heard of that before.
@@SouthMainAuto If something is shadow banned, the users activity is only visible to them, it’s ghosted to everyone else.
@@SouthMainAuto I think it’s like shadow boxing. :)
@@dudleydeplorable5307 YT is shadow banning Automotive channels?
I so remember back in the 70s and 80s working on cars where you actually had a bit of space to put parts in and take them out. Now guys like Eric O. damn near have to be Olympic gymnasts to install replacement parts. Great job Sir. I would have thrown a wrench at it and went on home. 😆.
I really identify with your "get more done after the end of the day" comment. Mine was getting more done before the start of the work day. I would typically get to work by 6 for an 8 o'clock start and would get more done in those 2 hours than the rest of the day. Completely different field of endeavor, but still diagnosis and repair. Keep it up! You and Rainman Ray make my days all the better.
Good Job Eric...I would have replaced the whole alternator as well...especially with that many miles. You might have been back in there sooner rather than later changing it anyway. Besides i would give me peace of mind knowing it should be good to go for another 250,000 miles
Thanks for the video very interesting
The mileage is a consideration in that decision, but it works sort of backward. My view is that it is good to spend the least amount of money keeping the vehicle working as long as it should. Toward that end it is good to replace something that will have to be replaced once in a particular vehicle's life near the middle of the intended vehicle life rather than wait until it fails on the road. Few customers see it that way, though, except for timing belts.
You gave the customer honest options so they could make the best decision for them. That's great customer service. She'll definitely come back for those other two coils with those miles. Great stuff
I wonder if she would have sprung for the other two coils.
Unus Annus lanyard. Not something I expected to see outside of Markiplier's channel.
What are you talking about????
I’ve figured it out. Most Mechanics already talk to theirselves while working on vehicles. They mostly talk about the engineers that design sometime garbage that’s sprung on the public but, the engineers don’t have to get their hands dirty (if they fit) into replacing failed parts. Videos came along then TH-cam, a perfect union. The good mechanics can share their knowledge, experience and frustrations with others. Thanks for sharing your mechanical talents and knowledge, with the rest of us.
Exactly.
Retired submariner here. Yeah, you guys ain’t seen nothing yet!
When in doubt with high mileage I always replace the alternator (on my own vehicles) ... think of it this way, at least you know you'll get X-more trouble free miles with some warranty and they're usually cheaper than a tow at midnight in the rain and more down time ... load the parts cannon and fire when ready
With the exception of those for Toyota/Denso. Easily do this mileage and more on the factory original. And the Denso brand costs more for that reliability. And the manufacturers know as well so they also charge more than a midnight tow for a reman unit. So not "always." Maybe for the German, American and other makes other than Japanese and especially not for the case of Toyota.
Wow! A mechanical failure. Don’t see many of those anymore. Lol!
The D coupling pulley is amazing technology. When you come across aftermarket alternators they do not use them always. I would stress to use OE quality.
You need to not be so hard on yourself, you are one of the most detailed mechanic channels on TH-cam and we appreciate you. I am a shotgun guy when it comes to my truck, but you have taught me that there could be other underlying issues that are affecting what I think is wrong. I’m a 100% disabled veteran that would love the opportunity to work under you for free for a year to soak up all your experience and knowledge, you are an amazing mechanic. And screw working on a Saturn. 😂😂😂 If I owned a shop, I would definitely turn down certain vehicles regardless of profit
One note on replacing coil packs for misfires - I have a 2007 Fit that I did the plugs on, NGK Iridium (or so I thought). 8000 miles later a misfire developed on one cylinder. Swapped coil packs around to verify and the misfire moved with the coil pack, so I replaced it. Decided to check the plugs, and the gaps were massive! Turns out the plugs were counterfeit, and the "iridium" tips were completely gone. One coil pack was weakest, but the rest were sure to go soon. The counterfeit plugs are pretty hard to spot, so beware, and be sure to check the plugs when replacing coil packs.
I've heard of this happening too. Great advice
Bwahahahaha ! Isn't China great ?
@@commietube_censorship_sucks Haven't had any issues with misfiring or plugs backing out on the two we've been through, but the valves needing relatively regular adjustment is a thing. At least it's easy, no shims to fuss with. The infernal ticking lets you know when it's time.
@@commietube_censorship_sucks but it's not Honda Fit...
Alternator removal / installation is like navigating a sofa up a staircase - I fear you could find yourself in a weird spatial anomaly whereby it will neither go in, nor come out...
I think that you did it the right way,...as the customer wanted.
Being down to 1 vehicle,it would ease things ,for them in the long run.
WELL DONE!
(I've done gas/diesel repairs for 48 yrs, and there are times such things must be done!)
When the Lady says Do it, what's a fella to do ?
You Do it 😂😂😂
Something new learnt ,didn't know about the decoupling pulley , again more knowledge learnt from the school of Eric O 🤗
Cheers
0:09 Had to do a double take on what that lanyard said on it. 🤣
I really appreciate Eric’s honesty and methods regarding parts and perhaps swapping a coupler/pulley around. Coming from a Parts Pro at AA, I would totally support this
Your patience is most commendable !
You gave me flashbacks,drove 75 miles to replace the alternator on my granddaughter’s car in an outdoor parking ramp in Minneapolis, -10 with snow flurries.
Thanks Eric, I know you get a butt load of comments but if you happen to see this one, thanks for the educational and entertaining content~
A misfire when driven on it long enough definitely could take out an overrun clutch. The constant acceleration and deceleration of the drive belt by the the cylinder not contributing is going to make the overrun engage over and over each time that cylinder fails to fire. Combine age, a previous misfire, and this misfire it's not crazy for it to have happened.
Yeah I just didn't put two and two together right at the beginning until I thought a bit and had a eureka moment.
Yep that is completely plausible for that to happen depending on how worn the clutch in it was already and could have possibly just broken the brittle plastic inside
Engine sttttuuuutttteeeerrrr!
When you're making a TH-cam video?
No way. You're a great teacher but one of the things we love about your videos is that you aren't blowing smoke at anyone. You are honest and showing us what you do in a working shop. Key word, working shop.
We are lucky that you take us along.
Don't stop.
You're in the rare breed of honest mechanics, props to you!
I feel your pain trying to remove the alternator. I had to replace one on an older Santa Fe. I had to remove most of the bits on the front of the engine for clearance. Not a fun job.
At that mileage it would soon need new brushes, so probably best to change the whole unit.
Over here in the UK we have a lot of 4-cyl diesels and for the past 20 years most have dual mass flywheels, therefore the crank acceleration and deceleration during one cycle is way higher, so the clutch pulley is an essential part.
The most common failure is for them to lock up solid, the belt makes horrendous noise below 1200rpm when they do.
Not had many fail where they just slip either way, only two or three.
My most common repair is to replace the regulator/brush pack for no-charge conditions, can usually do these in situ or without fully removing the alternator.
Very informative video thanks Eric!
Well done as always
Fantastic job as always
That was a good decision on her part to change out that alternator 246000 good job. Eric, another smile, another smiling customer and thank you for the video.🎉
Just binge watching your videos, trying to catch up 🤣
I know what you mean. I'm a couple videos behind as well
I know a guy who calls them aldernadors. He was car warsh owner from warshingtun. Always ordered pizza on a tuesdee.
Lol dude
Used to work with a mechanic who hated working on Mar-sadies or Outies, Porches or Pooh Joes.
@@jamespfitz you crack me up🤣🤣🤣
Thanks Mr O. Nice work.
Great work! Thanks for taking a passion in your work.
Always entertaining. Stay safe out there.
I changed an alternator in a 2006 kia sedona. what a nightmare!!took me all afternoon. way underneath engine shoe horned in there. no room to work!! Keep Rockin Mr. O!!!
Nice that you have her the option to change the coupler but like you said the mileage is high brushes might not be there very long less chance of a come back except for the aftermarket part.
No I’m not having much luck with the aftermarket parts lately change them and having failures left and right lately and yes I’m buying from NAPA not a sponsor
Mr.O, always informational! And also entertaining. Learning a lot from videos like this.
Eric, at 250,000 ALL the parts are worn out so might as well replace that Alternator! With the price of new or used cars throwing a little money at the one you own makes sense. Besides, its kind of cute. P.S. Might as well order those other ignition coils as well from NAPA (not a sponsor) cause their worn out too! Thanks for Sharing!
As always Eric, great video. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
Nice job as always
Sure was nice for that alternator to come out without disassembling the motor, brackets, arms, belts, and coolant lines !!!! Slipped out and in easily - nice !!!! Plug #3 was misfiring, so it was either the plug or the coil or both, I would have changed both to be safe. And a new belt was good for all them miles on it and some piece of it wiggling around. Customer knows the value of having your car working, and not broke down - put on a new part, don't gamble with the old stuff. Job well done Eric !!! Another satisfied customer spreading your trustworthiness at SMA !!!!!! When do we get a video of Mrs. O. at work dealing with the drop off and pick up customers and how she answers repair questions ??? A look into customer relations and the paperwork side of SMA !!!!!! Ready for the next video if the cars are three deep !!!!!! 🚙🚘🛻
Another great video!!
Thank you for the upload. I love watching others do repairs. It helps me to be better at them :)
ANOTHER GREAT JOB ERIC
Great video Eric ! Great work !
Dr. O goin crazy with the vids lately. Love it.
Nice repair Eric!
Thanks for sharing. Great video again.
Learned something new this morning. De-coupling pulley on an alternator. Who'd a thunk it? Thank You Sir Eric.
You bet
The purpose of TH-cam videos is to Educate "my thoughts" I learned something here. A decoupling pulley!!! Never would of guessed. 56 years "Shade tree: wrenching, nice to learn something new. THANKS MR. O!!!
Eric your a good man. Most repair facilities would say sorry, not till tomorrow and it needs an alternator. You give her the option to save money AND stay late so she can have it first thing. Someone who really gives a crap about his customers. Rare these days
Great work as always.
Love how you problem solve. Great series and great sense of humor.
Thanks for the informative and entertaining video!
good work, well done
Damn dude you are a gem! keep on keeping on!
Your a hell of a man Eric keep up the great work 👏
Always enjoy watching your videos Eric! 🥰🥰🥰👍👍👍
Another ringer! Have a great weekend and thanks.
Another great video .
Keep it coming Eric O
Eric, your videos are so chill.
Great content honest will see you in good stead
You've got to keep the customer happy, great after hours work
Another job well done
Love the dedication 30+ years for me
I do all my own work on my 04 Pontiac Grand Am, but I wish that I lived nearby...I probably wouldn't question a single thing even though I like to discuss auto repairs. You take on some pretty tough looking vehicles that some shops would balk at due to rust etc, but always make it work and work through every step before condemning the really expensive parts. It's really tough to find a shop that treats their patrons so well and keeps their situations in mind.
Hi Eric, I really enjoy your vids and always learn alot!
First time I've heard of the decoupling pulley. Learn something new every day... Especially on this channel...
Great video video Eric. Your great.
Great video, I could watch these all day!
Ur ending transition was classic, we won’t leave u hangin anytime, specially working overtime, as always a great fix , thanks for posting
246k on a yoda at 23 years and a problem again a year later. Sounds like a lemon law case for Duewe ,Cheatem and Howe. . Seriously, we should all be so fortunate. On the lady's side if you really need to rent a car, the going rate is over $100 a day. If cars are available, and they lie about that. . Will an aftermarket overrunning clutch match up and work? Eric has the part, the correct part to solve it in hand. Back to school time and sales to be at. good vid thanks.
Great work Eric, I had no idea of an alternator pulley being that way, I always learn something new from you, Thanks for posting!!!
With that kind of age and mileage, it was probably time for an alternator anyway. Thanks, Eric O. for being the kind of guy who stays late to help a neighbor out. You are a good man.
Nicely done! An alternator swap is one of few jobs I've done, and it definitely felt like worming the alternator in/out of the engine bay was one of the toughest parts. Either that or getting my ratchet trapped between a bolt I was loosening and the wall of the e bay. I'll learn someday... hopefully! Thanks for the video.
I added an OAP to one of my cars, makes it shift a lot smoother when the engine smacks down from 8000 RPM to the next gear.
I love the fact that you stayed after a long day to help what is probably a struggling family 👪. That shows you are a great human being. Love your videos!
Wouldn’t have surprised me to see the alt fail soon after replacing the pulley. Good video
Awesome fix Eric O. You been working on these cars and trucks for a long time Eric your a awesome mechanic really appreciate the videos 👍
Thanks for another great video
Thanks for yet another video this week Mr. O. I know I've been missing Mustie as well, but I don't think you need to make up for him. Hopefully the YT Bots aren't making you work overtime. We appreciate everything you do!
I never heard of those pulleys for alternators. You were spot on on your diag. Happy customer is a returning customer. Have a nice day.
I still can’t do it, but enjoy watching you do it. Best Regards
short and sweet............very cool! no distractions either. miss those old videos you took things apart to find out why they failed but time is money.
Awesome Alternator debug!
Very informative to the layman where ever they are!