P1 and P2 are primarily used to extend the time. By shorting P1, you extend the time by 8 times, by shorting P2, you extend the time by 64 times. Shorting both yields a time extension of 512 times. That seems to be the 8*N (N=0,1,2,3) formula. Think binary for P1 and P2. Just found on internet.
At time 11:53 you pressed the trigger button. The LED went off at time 11:58. So it was about 5 seconds. That looks like a useful little circuit! Thanks for demonstrating how they work. I think I'll pick up a few.
The interesting thing that you mentioned was that the chip doesn't draw current unless triggered. That being the case, this would be useful to power things that you forget and leave on that causes the battery to go flat. A few years ago I built a gadget to fit inside my multi-meter (which I always forgot to turn off) and wasn't the modern kind that had auto shut off. Consequently I went through a lot of 9v batteries. The circuit was designed by Bob Kellogg AE4IC and it appeared in issue 156 of SPRAT magazine and it used a LMC7221 chip (and a few extra components). So I could imagine this being useful (for instance) in battery powered closet lighting where you only need (say) 10 seconds and it turns off. Thanks for the videos. Much appreciated.
Thanks for the info paul i got half dozen star delta timers to tear down now I know where the timer module is and how to use it the units have those chips as a daughter board on the switching relay board
Could use that as a outdoor light timer along with a movement detector module. Cross the scanning path, set off the timer to keep light on for a set amount of time. It's probably a production overstock. Thanks Paul.
I wrote an article about the same last year, when people were using an arduino and Ultrasonic sonic sensor to dispense sanitizer, about stupidity in the middle of all crazy stupidness of covid, all you need is this IC and an IR LED and a relay, to make a cost effective, usable and small form factor sanitizer dispenser. the best part was even if the trigger is still there, it won't affect, as you have to remove your hand from IR sensor and place it again to make the sanitizer dispense again. and a variable pot can ensure how much you want to dispense the sanitizer.
Seems like that's a 555 in monostable config. Oh yeah 555 is also a timer chip too. All the manufacturer did was hid the capacitor inside the COB. Maybe that's why the pin next to output is called C. If you get a 1/3 and 2/3 VCC around the resistors, that will definitely confirm that it's a 555.
Greetings, I found this very helpful thank you for posting it. I’m currently looking for two applications (little fun projects) for this and I went ahead and ordered a few of these. I was wondering if this could be adapted to a repeating pattern. I need a 6 hour on 18 off version. I 1st attempted cannibalizing a led tea candle but all the ones I have the flickering candle feature integrated into the candle timing board. Any suggestions? FYI I’m a retired mechanical engineer and I’m attempting to relearn my electronics from 44 years ago 😂
@@pleasecho2 if you mean one on/off cycle for 1k hours. It could be possible but the capacitance and resistance needed for that timing in the astable operation would not be easy for 1k hours. Plus the timing error percentage of the chip. As an example of the largest values I have. Without multiple components to increase the capacitance and resistance: 0.693 * 1000uF * (10M + (10M * 2)) = 20.79K sec / 60 = 346.5 min / 60 = 5.775 hrs. I would need a lot of space for the physical capacitors size to get 1k hours.
timing measured with a scope would still let you count the grid i know you like too count the problem is the table is hard to find and i hope it gets better info updated. i i let it sit in a box for 3 years and come back too it i need the info available. looks like a 555 i can find the data sheet in 4500 places. thank you for your videos and your time i enjoyed it even if my comments dont seem that way was worth it to watch.
I think I could use one of these. I have a networked 3T USB hard drive that is hooked to an old repurposed HP Thin Client with the OS overwritten with a light Linux (I think Puppy). When starting the drive must be offline until linux has had a chance to fully load or it will never load unless power cycled (the drive), so the normal way to get it to work on boot is to unplug power from the USB drive, cycle on the HP and wait about 90 seconds (there is no monitor attached) and then plug in power for the USB drive so that it can be recognized and loaded (which takes another minute). There are probably thousands of ways of automating that (I was thinking a NO relay that gets toggled on by a serial pin - parallel pins are a choice on this device, or even a cheap ESP32 that controls a relay for the USB power that can be reached via wifi, and about 30 other ideas). Add using this to the list - inserted in the USB power line, the 5V could be blocked until the timer tripped (which of course assumes power cycle on both devices as the same time as in a power outage situation, which is about the only cause for a reboot).
The output must be sinking current going by the LED position on the diagram. i wonder what chip is under the blob.. & if it can anything else apart from timing?? you should try some test's on it to see! Have you ever seen those chip identifiers like the transistor testers?? they can identify loads of chips and their pins. kinda looks like the tester you had there. thats what i thought it was when i 1st seen it..
@@frankowalker4662 I think this is a poor review. This are exact variables you are interested in designing circuit with delay. You need to be nosey, unless you don't want to learn electronics.
I have 10 of these bought on AE for something close to zero. They seems to behave as shown in the table, at 3V I have 3s with 0ohm, 5s with a little less than 9k, 6.5s with 13k ...and removing the resistor the led stays on forever. BTW, I wired the button according to the "documentation", with a pull-up resistor ...I am mentioning these while thinking it does not change anythyng :-)
I've been playing around with these for a couple weeks now and it seems that the pull up is needful, otherwise this module can get quirky under continual use conditions (power remains on Vcc+ & Gnd)
@@learnelectronics LOL on the ebay site. There is a small box on the image and when you put your mouse cursor in the middle it starts the zoom. I'm referring to when you were looking at the schematic. Sorry for the confusion
Voltage is potential. 5 volts could be the potential between 5 and 0. Or it could be the potential between 300 and 295. So when we hook up the grounds first we give our circuits a reference. So now our two 5-volt circuits are both between 5 and 0.
Hmm, I wonder if that result was only caused by chinese mathematics and component tolerances or if american precision in measuring the time might have falsified it a bit too ;-) If I stop it in the video I get a bit closer to the expected 5.8 seconds than to the "measured" 4 ;-)
Hi Paul, I miss some short riffs on your Fender Strato at the end of your videos. The Intros to your videos are very professional. A very nice logo oszilloscope like signal of a 555 squarewave, the nice sound. An introduction.... everything is perfect. I like it very much to hear "I am out, peace" is also great. Peace is what we all need, perhaps much more than all other things. The end of your videos is perfect as well. But I mean, that it could be a good idea to let your audience hear some (few) chords you played on your strato. it must not be everytime the same.... please remove this comment... have a nice day...
Nice little mystery timmer with the looong description... Lol You have to love those auctions to get the other half of the information you have to do more searches on eBay... Lol China does some neet little things like that. Very useful as a secondary timmer after a 555 timer triggering it to run a series of leds like a race track christmas tree... :-) The 555 could set then off and you could put a pot on the last one to vary the Yellow led and or even on the Green one too. Just thinking out loud... :-) Thanks for the video! LLAP P.S. Watch Alice, she's a bit of a wild card..... HaHaHAHa
I connect these to a momentary switch and a relay to tie in addition to a traditional On/Off switch for use in simple projects where I often only need power for a few moments (under bench/cabinet lights at 30~ secs, or same setup on my soldering station except set to 90+/- secs). Momentary switch gives me some "walk away insurance" white regular switch for manual On/Off.
Using a digital timer, I measured 5.5 seconds, the error being 0.3 seconds due to not starting exactly when you started. But even so, getting 5.5 seconds delay is quite close to the 5,8 seconds delay stated in the Chinese literature.
@@learnelectronics Perhaps Huntsville ordered up a bunch of these on line and put them into their mission sequencer. Try setting the resistor for 8 minutes and see when it stops. If it cuts off at 1:46 we are on to something.
Could be a multiplier to extend the range. Short one or the other (or both) to reach longer timing periods. Remember the description had N = 0, 1, 2, 3 - this might be the multipliers for P1, P2 and both shorted. (Yes, I'm ignoring the zero. Another explanation might be that they mean 0.1, 0.2 and 0.3. More experimentation needed.) One great application for this is to keep an entry light on for a while after entry is detected. (Motion detector, switch, etc.) Note the description said this is not retriggerable; the light (or whatever) will have to go off before it can be turned on again. The best use is probably to use a potentiometer to trim or adjust for an accurate time, though there will be variation between modules and even with the same one - different temperatures alone could make a difference.
They only cost 76c for 10 on Aliexpress. They are direct wafer to board chips which is why they are so cheap and globed. It seems people are buying whole wafers of these from some factory. There are also tons of these for use in doorbells that output music and dog barking sounds. A few weeks ago I actually found a few listings on alibaba for companies selling wafers of all kinds of transistors etc. I think it was ~$100 for 5" wafers with 100v trans an something like 3000-8000 pieces depending on the types. at 1.4mm X 1.4mm they are just barely big enough that you could use a 0201 pnp machine to mount them. Imagine building your own display controller with a big transistor array of some of the lower power transistors :D Found it: $86 for a wafer of 37,200 BC807 triodes www.alibaba.com/product-detail/BC807-5-inch-triode-silicon-controlled_62145554598.html $96 for over 5000 100V 3A transistors www.alibaba.com/product-detail/P1-4-100Vsilicon-wafer-chip-semiconductor_62145537776.html
Fantastic circuit for this module to be found at Talkingelectronics.com www.talkingelectronics.com/projects/Long%20Duration%20Timer/LongDurationTmer.html
Hi there Paul. Is it possible I send you a private msg? I have a question for ya, but I wish to explain myself a bit. Found no link/info for contact on your page.
P1 and P2 are primarily used to extend the time. By shorting P1, you extend the time by 8 times, by shorting P2, you extend the time by 64 times. Shorting both yields a time extension of 512 times.
That seems to be the 8*N (N=0,1,2,3) formula. Think binary for P1 and P2.
Just found on internet.
Excellent information, thank you
cool, thank you, I searched a lot after having received ten of these, and documentation is really poor
How do you short P1 and P2? Do you connect them to ground? Sorry, I'm not very good with electronics but this looks to be exactly what I need.
@@garykuper2480 P1 and P2 are a pair of 2 pads each (one pad seems to be Vcc). Just short one pair or another or both and you are done. See 2:30.
@@sebastian19745 Ah, okay. Got it. Thank you.
At time 11:53 you pressed the trigger button. The LED went off at time 11:58. So it was about 5 seconds. That looks like a useful little circuit! Thanks for demonstrating how they work. I think I'll pick up a few.
The interesting thing that you mentioned was that the chip doesn't draw current unless triggered. That being the case, this would be useful to power things that you forget and leave on that causes the battery to go flat.
A few years ago I built a gadget to fit inside my multi-meter (which I always forgot to turn off) and wasn't the modern kind that had auto shut off. Consequently I went through a lot of 9v batteries.
The circuit was designed by Bob Kellogg AE4IC and it appeared in issue 156 of SPRAT magazine and it used a LMC7221 chip (and a few extra components). So I could imagine this being useful (for instance) in battery powered closet lighting where you only need (say) 10 seconds and it turns off.
Thanks for the videos. Much appreciated.
The 5th chip is on the breadboard, hahaa. Great video, extremely helpful. Thank you as always.
Great video as always. Putting a potentiometer in place of the resistor would make it adjustable making it easier to get the time you want.
Thanks for the info paul i got half dozen star delta timers to tear down now I know where the timer module is and how to use it the units have those chips as a daughter board on the switching relay board
My guess is this IC will be more useful at the longer delay times (>30s) where the 555 isn't as accurate...but more testing would need to be done.
These modules don't seem to be precise either. That's the point I took from this video.
Could use that as a outdoor light timer along with a movement detector module.
Cross the scanning path, set off the timer to keep light on for a set amount of time.
It's probably a production overstock.
Thanks Paul.
Thank you
I wrote an article about the same last year, when people were using an arduino and Ultrasonic sonic sensor to dispense sanitizer, about stupidity in the middle of all crazy stupidness of covid, all you need is this IC and an IR LED and a relay, to make a cost effective, usable and small form factor sanitizer dispenser. the best part was even if the trigger is still there, it won't affect, as you have to remove your hand from IR sensor and place it again to make the sanitizer dispense again. and a variable pot can ensure how much you want to dispense the sanitizer.
If you solder wires to the pads on one of these things be careful. Use flexible small diameter wire or you'll pull the pad off in the blink of an eye
^^^^^^ FACT!!!
Nice piece of hardware and the cost is good too. Thanks, Paul.
Seems like that's a 555 in monostable config. Oh yeah 555 is also a timer chip too. All the manufacturer did was hid the capacitor inside the COB. Maybe that's why the pin next to output is called C. If you get a 1/3 and 2/3 VCC around the resistors, that will definitely confirm that it's a 555.
Greetings, I found this very helpful thank you for posting it. I’m currently looking for two applications (little fun projects) for this and I went ahead and ordered a few of these. I was wondering if this could be adapted to a repeating pattern. I need a 6 hour on 18 off version. I 1st attempted cannibalizing a led tea candle but all the ones I have the flickering candle feature integrated into the candle timing board. Any suggestions? FYI I’m a retired mechanical engineer and I’m attempting to relearn my electronics from 44 years ago 😂
Interesting, but I think I'll stick to my trusty 555 Thank you for sharing this though
I agree.
Can you make a 555 time for 1,000 hours?
@@pleasecho2 :)
@@pleasecho2 if you mean one on/off cycle for 1k hours. It could be possible but the capacitance and resistance needed for that timing in the astable operation would not be easy for 1k hours. Plus the timing error percentage of the chip.
As an example of the largest values I have. Without multiple components to increase the capacitance and resistance:
0.693 * 1000uF * (10M + (10M * 2)) = 20.79K sec / 60 = 346.5 min / 60 = 5.775 hrs.
I would need a lot of space for the physical capacitors size to get 1k hours.
This reminds me to led candles, where they are ON for 6 hours and then turned OFF for 18 hours.
True. I think these ICs are built to go into those kind of devices and toys. 1000h is supercool though!
Bro, any idea how it can be made by this chip?
Nice one Paul. It isn't much different than the 555. How about a side by side comparison?
How could I reverse the way it works.
As in not having the light to turn on for 3 seconds, but to take 3 seconds to be able to turn on?
timing measured with a scope would still let you count the grid i know you like too count
the problem is the table is hard to find and i hope it gets better info updated.
i i let it sit in a box for 3 years and come back too it i need the info available.
looks like a 555 i can find the data sheet in 4500 places.
thank you for your videos and your time i enjoyed it even if my comments dont seem that way
was worth it to watch.
What happens if you continue to hold the button down past the time period ?
it triggers only the first time, after the 3 seconds the led turns off
Klasse Erklärt, danke für das Video... / Great explanation, thanks for the video...
can you give a bunch of examples of using timers in circuits to do what?
Can this be made with no trigger? Just constant cycling.
I think I could use one of these. I have a networked 3T USB hard drive that is hooked to an old repurposed HP Thin Client with the OS overwritten with a light Linux (I think Puppy). When starting the drive must be offline until linux has had a chance to fully load or it will never load unless power cycled (the drive), so the normal way to get it to work on boot is to unplug power from the USB drive, cycle on the HP and wait about 90 seconds (there is no monitor attached) and then plug in power for the USB drive so that it can be recognized and loaded (which takes another minute). There are probably thousands of ways of automating that (I was thinking a NO relay that gets toggled on by a serial pin - parallel pins are a choice on this device, or even a cheap ESP32 that controls a relay for the USB power that can be reached via wifi, and about 30 other ideas). Add using this to the list - inserted in the USB power line, the 5V could be blocked until the timer tripped (which of course assumes power cycle on both devices as the same time as in a power outage situation, which is about the only cause for a reboot).
I guess since it can power an LED, an optocoupler style power gate would be cheap...
Nice video !
Can i use this to light the led after a certain time instaed that it goes off after a certain time ?
I have seen similar mini boards in those solar dancers
The output must be sinking current going by the LED position on the diagram.
i wonder what chip is under the blob.. & if it can anything else apart from timing?? you should try some test's on it to see!
Have you ever seen those chip identifiers like the transistor testers?? they can identify loads of chips and their pins. kinda looks like the tester you had there. thats what i thought it was when i 1st seen it..
No I haven't. Do you have a link?
Nice video thanks. BTW, what is the power supply you use in the video? Neither of the two you have listed in the notes.
what if you push and hold the trigger? will it trigger again? will it trigger on let go? will it trigger on push down and not do anything else?
Wow, your nosey! LOL.
@@frankowalker4662 I think this is a poor review. This are exact variables you are interested in designing circuit with delay. You need to be nosey, unless you don't want to learn electronics.
@@contemporiser Thats why all my toys growing up in the 70's were broken Reel to reels and record players. And still are.
I did, it does not trigger anymore, neither keeping it pressed longer than the led stays lit, nor releasing it meanwhile or after
@@lucapesce3335 thnx. This is important when you set a shorter delay
I have 10 of these bought on AE for something close to zero.
They seems to behave as shown in the table, at 3V I have 3s with 0ohm, 5s with a little less than 9k, 6.5s with 13k ...and removing the resistor the led stays on forever.
BTW, I wired the button according to the "documentation", with a pull-up resistor ...I am mentioning these while thinking it does not change anythyng :-)
I've been playing around with these for a couple weeks now and it seems that the pull up is needful, otherwise this module can get quirky under continual use conditions (power remains on Vcc+ & Gnd)
When trying to zoom you need to put your pointer in the center square to start the zoom to follow your mouse.
what?
@@learnelectronics LOL on the ebay site. There is a small box on the image and when you put your mouse cursor in the middle it starts the zoom. I'm referring to when you were looking at the schematic. Sorry for the confusion
Can we update same amount of time if we press the trigger button before it comes in the default position ....
No
What is the current consumption for mark & space?
"Allways hooking up ground first" - Question: but isn't that where current actually comes from? electrons from the negative side?
You hook up the grounds first as the ground is the reference
@@learnelectronics okay... but why sir?
Voltage is potential. 5 volts could be the potential between 5 and 0. Or it could be the potential between 300 and 295. So when we hook up the grounds first we give our circuits a reference. So now our two 5-volt circuits are both between 5 and 0.
Awesome circuit 😃👍 that looks cool.
Got one pack of 10. Thx for this useful video. :-)
Hmm, I wonder if that result was only caused by chinese mathematics and component tolerances or if american precision in measuring the time might have falsified it a bit too ;-)
If I stop it in the video I get a bit closer to the expected 5.8 seconds than to the "measured" 4 ;-)
Hello Paul,
what about fender outros to your channel contributions?
What do you mean?
Hi Paul, I miss some short riffs on your Fender Strato at the end of your videos. The Intros to your videos are very professional. A very nice logo oszilloscope like signal of a 555 squarewave, the nice sound. An introduction.... everything is perfect. I like it very much to hear "I am out, peace" is also great. Peace is what we all need, perhaps much more than all other things. The end of your videos is perfect as well. But I mean, that it could be a good idea to let your audience hear some (few) chords you played on your strato. it must not be everytime the same.... please remove this comment... have a nice day...
Nice little mystery timmer with the looong description... Lol You have to love those auctions to get the other half of the information you have to do more searches on eBay... Lol
China does some neet little things like that. Very useful as a secondary timmer after a 555 timer triggering it to run a series of leds like a race track christmas tree... :-)
The 555 could set then off and you could put a pot on the last one to vary the Yellow led and or even on the Green one too.
Just thinking out loud... :-)
Thanks for the video!
LLAP
P.S. Watch Alice, she's a bit of a wild card..... HaHaHAHa
From someone, I purchased ten of the timers and wired up five of them. None worked.
Nice and small, But I can't think of a use for one.
Team it with an infrared sensor or laser trigger and you have motion activated variable on time... whatever
I connect these to a momentary switch and a relay to tie in addition to a traditional On/Off switch for use in simple projects where I often only need power for a few moments (under bench/cabinet lights at 30~ secs, or same setup on my soldering station except set to 90+/- secs). Momentary switch gives me some "walk away insurance" white regular switch for manual On/Off.
@@BuckWezr Cool.
Nice chip
Using a digital timer, I measured 5.5 seconds, the error being 0.3 seconds due to not starting exactly when you started. But even so, getting 5.5 seconds delay is quite close to the 5,8 seconds delay stated in the Chinese literature.
At least you didn't spend billions of dollars only to have your test shut down early like NASA with the SLS core.
lol true
An not over budget either... Lol
LLA{
@@learnelectronics Perhaps Huntsville ordered up a bunch of these on line and put them into their mission sequencer. Try setting the resistor for 8 minutes and see when it stops. If it cuts off at 1:46 we are on to something.
It might be a 555 ic.
It is not, pins don't match
555 requires cap. This module is way different from 555.
@@learnelectronicsThis is what I found.
sxemy-podnial.net/c005-prostoj-tajmer/
Wow that Cool..."I'll buy That For A Dollar..."
Running Man!
@@learnelectronics RoboCop...lol
Yep RoboCop! Now I have to go and watch it... Lol
LLAP
what do np1 and p2 do?
No idea
Could be a multiplier to extend the range. Short one or the other (or both) to reach longer timing periods. Remember the description had N = 0, 1, 2, 3 - this might be the multipliers for P1, P2 and both shorted. (Yes, I'm ignoring the zero. Another explanation might be that they mean 0.1, 0.2 and 0.3. More experimentation needed.)
One great application for this is to keep an entry light on for a while after entry is detected. (Motion detector, switch, etc.) Note the description said this is not retriggerable; the light (or whatever) will have to go off before it can be turned on again.
The best use is probably to use a potentiometer to trim or adjust for an accurate time, though there will be variation between modules and even with the same one - different temperatures alone could make a difference.
Nice Paul... Isn't worth.... But it's great job ✌️
Kind of like an LM3909
That is definitely Chinese maths
Interesting - were these made for a special purpose? Weird.
tahnks man!
Bien 👍
They only cost 76c for 10 on Aliexpress. They are direct wafer to board chips which is why they are so cheap and globed. It seems people are buying whole wafers of these from some factory. There are also tons of these for use in doorbells that output music and dog barking sounds. A few weeks ago I actually found a few listings on alibaba for companies selling wafers of all kinds of transistors etc. I think it was ~$100 for 5" wafers with 100v trans an something like 3000-8000 pieces depending on the types. at 1.4mm X 1.4mm they are just barely big enough that you could use a 0201 pnp machine to mount them.
Imagine building your own display controller with a big transistor array of some of the lower power transistors :D
Found it:
$86 for a wafer of 37,200 BC807 triodes
www.alibaba.com/product-detail/BC807-5-inch-triode-silicon-controlled_62145554598.html
$96 for over 5000 100V 3A transistors
www.alibaba.com/product-detail/P1-4-100Vsilicon-wafer-chip-semiconductor_62145537776.html
They have a large collection of the LM family apparently in packages as well as precut dies.
Fantastic circuit for this module to be found at Talkingelectronics.com www.talkingelectronics.com/projects/Long%20Duration%20Timer/LongDurationTmer.html
Hi there Paul. Is it possible I send you a private msg? I have a question for ya, but I wish to explain myself a bit. Found no link/info for contact on your page.
arduino0169@gmail.com
I co love alice myself
Next try the 1000. It will be your longest video ever
"One-one thousand, two-one thousand, three-one thousand...." 😆
Called a C005, investigated on this blog: westsideelectronics.com/delay-timer-ic/
Your slow starting your count.
👍👍👌❤
Hey, do you folks know what you call a nun who has had gender reassignment surgery? ANSWER: a TransSister.
Chinese Math or Tolerability 🤔
I Trust My Resistors. Especially When hand made.