Looking For Signals From Alien Civilizations with Seth Shostak | John Michael Godier
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 23 ก.ย. 2024
- Have much have we looked for Aliens? The equivalent of a few bathtubs of water from the worlds oceans? Will we ever find signals from Alien Civilizations? Seth Shostak of SETI joins John Michael Godier to discuss how we are looking for signs of intelligent life.
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It is a hard day's night. Greece is going through some kind of social trauma because of the tragic train accident. Your videos, John, provide a safe and calm space to overcome the harsh reality of life.
You have your governments to thank for that. It's part of the 2030 WEF agenda.
My condolences aqunpoc. Tragic. Thank dependable jmg for blowing our minds every Thursday. Dara from Ireland
Keeping Greece in my thoughts, Lampros.
Peace from Albania
Best wishes from the US.
Although I love listening to John's episodes in here and on his other channel, there is one thing I always very much appreciated but rarely mentioned, which is Eryn's voice. She embodies the perfect introduction to subjects which might be rather "heavy" to understand for most of us. So I would say thank you twice: Thank you Eryn for being John's counterpart and Thank you John for doing such deep research into subjects that might prove fundamental in the future. This raises the question of course, what Eryn and John will do once alien life is finally discovered? :)
Eryn is my favorite thing and I love science. She has her own yt channel as well.
@@mikeyoung9810 what's the channel, pre thanks
Aw thanks! John does LOADS of research before interviews. He won't ever go into an interview blind. Each time we have a new guest, they always seem surprised that John has read through all their papers and asks questions the questions that he does. Ross knows John's interview style and makes sure John has enough material to work with. Both John and Ross are really great to work with. The opossum is tolerable. XD
Eryn you sound like you're from the South West of England like me? Do I detect a Somerset/,Bristol lilt tomorrow accent? It sounds cool anyway.
@@robertsmith9024 I'm in West Yorkshire. I throw a tint of west country in there and muddle in some Estuarian. The joke of the character is that it's supposed to be an American impression of what a British accent sounds like and has programmed the AI to speak that way; a really bad fake british accent. I'm natively British-RP though. I take it you're in the UK too?
I suspect The Great Silence is just our ordinary deafness. Whether they're out there or not, we don't have big enough ears yet to know either way.
The great silence caused by ignorance and close mindness of people like seth shostak and neil degrass tyson
@@bunnyban5365or people like you!
One of the best talks you`ve done. Seth is a great guest.
Looking for alien signals is like me looking for my soulmate 😂
You’ll get there. Until then… enjoy the ride 😁💚♾️
Harder than they told us isn't it?
The Ow! signal
@@Tails_Tradesthe UWU signal
There it is, my good night story tonight 🙂
Always interesting to listen to Seth.
Yes! After 3-4 years we get another chat with Dr Shostak, was waiting for him to return on the show!
Dr Shitstick. He's a tool
These conversations on the search for ETs are always interesting. But with the exception of Ari Loeb I always get the nagging feeling that the researchers are terrified of actually finding something. Seth spent a good deal of this interview punching holes in sighting and signals. Does he really believe a trained Navy pilot couldn't tell the difference between a Southwest Airline and a UAP?
Yah. Him and NDT are the only ones doubting and calling it all nothing. Kind of a joke of a scientist not to even be curious.
He will be remembered as a debunker nothing more and real scientists like john mack,garry nolan,eric davis will be remembered as earth's heros
On the other hand, it seems like Avi Loeb and colleagues are trying their best to find aliens evidence be damned. I don't like Avi Loeb's constant moralising either. The existence of aliens is not contingent on whether humans are open-minded or not. It's not ignorant to not blindly assume ETI is everywhere and has visited Earth when there's zero evidence for it.
He didn't punch through anything. His analogy on pilots was extremely lazy.
Perhaps he should go on to renounce all of the scientific discovery made by amateurs over the years because they weren't formerly trained scientists.
Or eat a dish at a restaurant that he perceives as "not done" or made poorly just because he isn't a formerly trained chef, so there's no way he would know that.
He should probably follow that line of thinking to quit looking for signals because there is no current alien signal that we possess for him to study to become an expert in signals from other planets.
As always, it’s great to hear an interview with Seth. Thank you much, wonderful job of interviewing, going one step beyond the usual questions.
Another great interview!! I always look forward to Event Horizon every week. Thanks for the episode!
“Physics doesn’t violate the idea that I’m gonna walk to Argentina for lunch.” So unexpected and I laughed so hard. He doesn’t suffer foolish ideas easily. I Love Dr. Shostak.
Exactly Jack he’s a great guy, certainly doesn’t listen to those pilots, military and civilian, plus air traffic controllers who keep making up all those stories about silent flying discs, thankfully.
Fantastic!!!! I have been waiting for this, huge fan of Dr.Shostak, cheers!!!
One of my favorite guests!
The mental gymnastics for ufos made me laugh ,he tried do dismiss the navy pilots 😂
Pilots make mistakes.
It's especially hard to tell the difference between speed and parallax when you don't know how far away the object is.
@@massimookissed1023 pilots make mistakes but their instruments don't make the same mistake at the same time
It's pretty obvious that you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about
But what evidence is there that they're aliens? Seems a much less reasonable assumption. Honestly, ghosts are more plausible than aliens.
It's difficult. On one hand there are off-screen reports from pilots who had clear UFO just above their helicopter or fighter or evem tried to shoot it down (also corresponding radar data from the ground control which sent the fighter or helicopter). On another there are witnesses on the ground who claim the UFO started to boil the water in the lake they were fishing in. Also some sightings are baloons carried by strong winds, Chinese flying lanterns, bolt lightnings or geese.
@@bunnyban5365 there could also be atmospheric phenomena that we completely don't understand. Look at ball lightning until recently as an example
i love when your guests have their own microphones
So do we
Yes... favorite show...let's go
And such a nice person.
Just started my shift. Thank you John please keep up the good work x
Enjoy!
Oh ya,this is gonna be rewatched like a hundred times while falling asleep for the next 3 months
Thanks John, your videos really help me de stress and relax brother, cheers from England.
Glad I can help.
I have nothing technical to add, but wanted to say I can’t imagine a better tonic for my Thursday evening commute than listening to this up-tempo, fascinating discussion between two gentlemen who really know their stuff. Excellent!
As always John, grand standard.
Respect for the Waterworld movie reference near the end.
We are just getting started how can we say what ETs would or would not do.
I'm listening to this while putting together trivia about the Armstrong nebula in mass effect. This requires me to find images of Gus Grissom Alan Shepard Yuri Gagarin Valentina Tereshkova Neil Armstrong and the Dong Fang Hong 1 satellite. It didn't feel so emotional until I put your video on I just want you to know that what you're doing with this channel is it's own form of space pioneering and is really so much more than simple discussions about what why and how. You're an explorer in your own right going somewhere few others will and both you and your teams efforts are greatly appreciated.
The Klingons would never send a signal, the Ferengi would though, and it would be advertisements.
At least the Klingons would be entertaining. The Vulcans would bore us to tears!
I'm very skeptical about ET colonizing the whole galaxy, fast or slow, whether by colony ships, Von Neumann probes, whatever.
I'm less skeptical about ET sending out trillions of tiny little probes, maybe like Starshot. They'd be hard to spot, even if there were lots of them.
That's a video John has yet to do. Civilizations are stuck on their home world or system then go extinct when their sun destroys their home. Interstellar travel might be impractical, cost and technologically prohibitive.
@@scottjarvis123 My guess is, interstellar travel isn't worth the bother. There's no economic model for it.
But it's not so hard to colonize a whole solar system. Spacefaring civs should be able to outlast their home worlds.
And while interstellar commerce and expansion might not make cents, migrating entirely to another star could.
One of this month's videos on the JMG channel is going to be about a variant of this idea. In a nutshell, it examines why aliens would choose not to colonize or travel interstellar space not because of feasibility, but other reasons that compel them to decide not to leave their home world. I've thought of several interesting ones.
@@JohnMichaelGodier I think economics is a big one that would apply to virtually any alien civ. I think it would explain the Fermi Paradox by itself.
But I can think of others. Here's one:
Internet lag. Imagine having a 4.1 year ping. The first ten trillion humans might refuse to live farther away than low orbit, let alone Mars, let alone another star. This applies to ~all ~imaginable aliens, maybe especially to AI/machine civs.
@@JohnMichaelGodier Can't wait! I hope that you also cover those new galaxies the jwst saw. Thst stuff is fascinating!
I think it's important not to assume UAP would automatically represent the true nature of alien intelligence and to consider the possibility they'd be some kind of psychosocial display for human consumption. That's tricky epistemological territory because it could theoretically explain anything, but I think it's a reason that unexpected and bizarre behavior doesn't necessarily mitigate against it being aliens and why that shouldn't necessarily be surprising if what we're seeing isn't so much nonhuman intelligences themselves as prop "aliens" to probe and elicit human reactions, analogous to zoologists & entomologists creating animal puppets to interact with their behaviors.
Was just thinking I had nothing to watch, thanks for coming to the rescue John!!
I really enjoyed that, thanks everyone. What's REALLY going to stick with me for a while is Seth's response to your question about whether any astronomical discoveries have accidentally been made [by SETI] while SETI was doing its thing.
And the answer was *no,* at least not that he's aware of... _bro,_ lol. First of all, that was an excellent question, John, so good on you for coming up with it. But as for the answer, the question of which it didn't seem to me like Seth had ever been asked before (it sounded like he was surprised and fascinated by the answer that he _pretty immediately_ landed on-this is probably more beside the point but I don't know, maybe someone else will have picked up on that too, we'll see), the fact that it was a no, or a _never_ even (that he's aware of), has to be telling us something, doesn't it?
I have my own ideas on what that might be, but I feel like it could be suggesting _so many different things_ to us either simultaneously, or separately! That's incredibly intriguing to me, and it might be...no, it'd *DEFINITELY be* worth having a discussion about to get a _sitrep_ on what we're doing, how we're making our measurements, who's deciding what should be prioritized with the SETI budget, and why we have not only just _not detected a single unambiguous SETI signal_ in the radio band, but why we're BOTH not detecting our primary target (signs of past or current extraterrestrial habitation in the Milky Way), and _somehow_ not picking up a single worthwhile.. well, ANYTHING, in _any of our observational data_ at the same time lmao!!!
It could be pointing us to something perhaps mildly spooky, or it could be telling us that this method of looking for technosignatures was always wrong and misguided, and would always be fruitless for one reason or another (but of course you miss *100%* of the shots you never take, so that would be great to know if true), maybe we really have not been looking hard enough, or for long enough like some people believe, and it could _always_ be that we're just _silly, silly monkeys ('nuff said, right?_ lol).
...... but due to the nature of what we're discussing, it very well may represent not a _mildly spooky_ reality, but a deeply chilling, *downright horrifying* one.
Whatever the case, we should be honest with ourselves (always), keep our minds and eyes open, and brainstorm as a science-minded community and as a greater society, what exactly our best path forward could be.
The answer is God. We are alone.
I've heard so many interviews with Seth Shostak & have heard him & others bring up the _"we've only looked at a tiny, tiny...tiny... percentage of the universe...."
However, the lack of heat signatures, lack of Dison spheres, etc. does strongly lead credence to the rare Earth hypothesis...
I don't know why but I just don't think we're going to find aliens anytime soon
Agree. Unless we've been around for a couple billion years maybe.
Your videos are so awesome and very informative..
Seth was great but would have been nice to see what he thought of the 8 new signals you reported on no too long ago. Perhaps this show was recorded earlier? Either way, anxiously awaiting more info. Thanks
We've done almost no searching in comparison to just the size of our own galaxy. When you consider signal attenuation and the inverse square law, searching most radio frequencies is a waste of time. Our best bet is to start with optical surveys of stars as soon as it's feasible to use space based spectroscopy. It's going to be far more difficult for life to hide telltale biosignitures with this set of tools.
Agree. JWST is our best bet pointed at Trappist-1e and even that is a long shot. We need 300+ transits of one planet and the time for that exceeds JWST lifespan. So.... we're kinda screwed.
33:00 hopefully you don't dismiss all triangle ufo as being geeses
Well, some clearly are not if they have bright lights at the corners. It's just that a flight of geese at night with streetlights faintly reflecting off them can look like a very rapidly moving triangle UFO. But that doesn't mean all sightings of triangle UFOs are geese of course.
Phoenix lights were geese duh! Seth is smart!
@@JohnMichaelGodier Yeah agreed that perception can be a great deceiver, geese do fly in a V formation. Surely accounts for some of those sightings. By the way i discovered your channel just recently, love it !
@@quezmar411 seth is the smartest scientist alive oh! And neil tyson too
So smart and so open minded
UFO's are real but they are unidentified.
Hi Seth, hope you are good, good to see you on Event Horizon!
SETI is like the drunk who looks for his keys under the street light because that's where the light is. The light is analogous to the radio frequency spectrum. Any advanced race wouldn't use radio frequencies for interstellar communication. My guess is that they use quantum entanglement for instantaneous data transmission. Shostak probably knows this, but his job is to keep searching and searching "under the streetlight".
Spot on. Seth and SETI are a waste of space.
@@rossmcleod7983 always has been
You *_can't_* use quantum entanglement for instant communication.
The sender has no control over the data sent, and the receiver has no way of knowing a signal was sent.
Nah their even beyond that. Quantum physics is not fundamental. Their more than likely using conciouness.
One funeral at a time bro…
34:50 Surprised to see the aircraft engine exhaust so would like to do a quick and dirty debunking of the debunking. Your pilot ( more recently) explained fighter sensors are highly optimized to detect other aircraft. That as well as the military being highly knowledgeable on aircraft characteristics makes me doubt they could be so clueless in a particular case.
It is still far more likely, because we know aircraft exists and produce such infrared footprint. Also, the fact it was recorded with on board instruments, means it was detected, wasn't it? I am taking about the three videos.
About the comment about mapsnfrom the 1600s: there actually are maps from that era, and older, depicting Antartica and also other land fearures which have been submerged for at least 10.000 years. But that is a whole different subject.
Love the video John
The greatest discovery that the ocean world found was the ability to grow coral and create Floating Land. Then came fire, then came rockets.
How did they breathe?, gills or lungs
@@joekey8464 who TF r U!??? Fr don't cook on it children! Gtfo my boy , comment on yomur owns stuff Masahiro!!!!
This channel deserves way more attention.
How about 10 Keplers for a total cost of $5B? Unless there is a better energy source than stars all civilizations capable of broadcasting a signal probably have already started building their Dyson swarms. Side benefit is finding a whole bunch of exoplanets and building up a better statistical base on exoplanets. Another search strategy is for K2+ civilizations through a whole sky galaxy search.
I have to challenge JMG’s assertion that coral atolls represent a possible source of “land” on ocean worlds. Water on most real ocean worlds is hypothesized to be hundreds of miles deep, and coral atolls can’t form without being connected to the sea floor. Could some kind of floating coral “island” occur? I suppose, but there’s no analog for such an organism on earth.
Yeah, it would have to a world with very shallow oceans that seems unlikely. That would essentially just be like earth with a lot of flat land trapped just a short distance underwater. But that would take some very contrived circumstances to occur.
Remember the old back yard satellite dishes were popular in the late '80's and '90's? Could they possibly be repurposed and retrofitted to be used as receivers for SETI? There seem to be a lot of them still around.
Sure you could put on new electronics to observe, say, at 1420 MHz. There are amateur radio astronomy channels on YT that are into hydrogen line observing. You will want to learn about things like half-wave dipoles, LNB, LNA, SDR. But would it be sensitive enough for SETI? If the dish is 3 meters diameter then the collecting area is roughly 7 square meters. By comparison, each SETI Institute dish is double the diameter, so 4 times the area, and they have 40 of them, in round numbers. Plus, they have great electronics and computers, so you will have to do a lot to match them.
But the inverse square law helps you a little. If someone has 4 times the sensitivity that you do, they can only detect the same power broadcast at twice the distance. Using powers of two, if SETI Institute can detect a signal 1024 light-years away, and your dish is 1/256 as sensitive as their array, then you should detect that signal if it was 64 LY away. Numbers off the top of my head.
Now the inverse square law works against you. If you want to double that distance then you need four times the dish area. Presumably four dishes. I've been looking into this type of thing to see if it was do-able for a reasonable budget. If you get into multiple dishes then you may be into phased arrays. You might also want to look into motorizing the dish(es) so they can point themselves, and track a star. You could certainly start with one dish. How many stars are within 64 LY? Over a thousand. Low odds that one that close would be broadcasting, but it seems a reasonable starting point.
Good response, pretty knowledgeable.
I have heard of dozens of plausible ideas for how ET could possibly communicate with us (radio, lasers, sprinkling anomalous stuff onto stars, etc.), but I haven't heard much about what motives ETs might have for doing it.
I think we're in a weird stage in which we have started to search, but with primitive tools / small telescopes. We are virtually blind, but we might notice a very bright light, if we got lucky. In just 100 years or so, maybe we'll have multi-AU baseline interferometers in space, and maybe we'll see aliens everywhere, and maybe it will seem redundant to say "we are here."
I would assume they aren't trying to contact anyone and look for technological evidence such as obscuring stars with Dyson swarms.
Greetings earthlings 🙃
There could be a million worlds in the galaxy with civilizations like ours, and we probably wouldn't know it, they'd probably all be too far away for us to detect them. We need much, much bigger, better telescopes.
The issue is time.
And the crop circle which i thought was next to that seti dish, that answered the piece sent into space about humanity? Intentional amnesia again? Piri reis map?
Going on about the wow signal may be that one thing that prevents us from enjoying a peaceful death,( when ever that is). Thankful for the experiences, the love, damn wow signal...what was up with gaaaak! Dead. That may just be how I go. Oh, by the way. As a layman, Dr.Shostak is a hero of mine and I am always thrilled to listen to his opinions and banter. What fascinating work, however frustrating it must be. ttfn
The problem with Seth's dismissal of David Fravor (and in case anyone is wondering, yeah, he's been dismissive of the current whistleblower incident as well, with one of his interviews about it on NewsNation having the *_hilarious bad take_* of "How does he know something is extraterrestrial?!"... Yeah...) is it was seen by eye, by infrared sensors and by radar. And according to Fravor... was actively jamming his radar (which as he points out is an act of war). The fact that *_not even one single instance gives him pause_* just makes me write him off as too dogmatic.
1) Witness testimony is worth nothing in science.
2) Pilots aren't trained to deal with biases as scientists.
3) The current whistle blower claimed program is secretive, but he had requested public disclosure permission from pentagon and was granted it! His stories don't make much sense.
4) The question how they know things are extraterrestrial is FUNDAMENTAL question, not hilariously bad take. Learn how to deal with your bias.
5) There is no evidence to backup any Fravor's claims. Of course, you can always blame more conspiracy, but it is counterproductive in real world and you won't achieve much.
6) Modern military aircraft and missiles are equipped with radar jamming equipment, if the claim is even true. See Ockham's razor.
7) Plenty of people gave Fravor pause, but witness testimony is garbage, and pilots make mistakes all the time.
8) The problem is your standard for evidence is garbage. You like the story, because of your bias.
9) Every time someone claims science is too dogmatic, I find they don't understand how science works and have to much bias - "I want to believe".
Really surprised that Seth says the idea of one civilisation sending a probe to study life in another solar system makes as much sense as "me walking to argentina just to get lunch". That's a bizarre comparison.
If humans found out there was alien life in another solar system then OF COURSE we'd send a probe there if we could. Why would aliens be so incurious that they wouldn't even bother trying to study a whole new planet full of life forms....
Even if it would take a million years for the probe to reach the destination? It is orders of magnitude cheaper to study a target from own solar system, not too mention there are estimated 200-400 billions of stars in Milky Way.
@@pavel9652 Well yes. The universe is 14 billion years old. An intelligent civilisation might last billions of years also. So there's no harm in sending out probes to as many planets as possible, even if it takes a long time. Automated, self-replicating probes could gradually "leapfrog" their way across the galaxy from planet to planet, and have the entire milky way explored within a few million years.
@@dave4deputyZX 1) So where are they? 2) Good luck securing funding for a mission that lasts thousands of years not to mention longer missions. Usually sponsor wants to see results in reasonable time. 3) Do you think it is good idea to send self-replicating, intelligent machines to colonize galaxy on their own? Do you want to get replicators? Because this is how you get replicators! ;) 4) This all sounds great on paper, but in reality it is far easier, cheaper and more efficient to build a very large scale instruments in the solar system to search galaxy from home.
@@pavel9652 "in reality it's easier to....." Well in reality it's easier to study the arctic from a computer screen in a University than it is to send expeditions or set up outposts up there. But the fact is we do BOTH.
I think you are limiting yourself to the constraints of living in 2024. What will human civilisation look like in 500 years? Or 10,000 years? Or a million years? Or 2 billion years? Presuming we survive beyond this century, we will likely have technological abilities that today we can only dream about. It seems inevitable that SOMEBODY will want to send probes to distant stars at some stage.
"Usually sponsor wants to see results in reasonable time" - well the Voyager probe was send in 1977, and most of the scientists who worked on it are dead. And we are still benefiting from it today. I think you are underestimating the spirit of scientific discovery.
And also bear in mind that even today we are close to "curing" ageing. So who knows what kind of lifespans people will have in a million years from now (again, if humanity survives that long).
As for the replicators argument, well look just cos it's dangerous doesn't stop scientists from doing it! Look at the development of AI right now. We have no idea what it will lead to, but we still do it. And there's probably plenty of ways of programming machines to build more probes while also ensuring that they have an Off Switch, or just make sure that they don't terraform anywhere that looks like it has life.
Oh and if we did send probes, it wouldnt be a long wait with nothing happening and then Boom, the galaxy is explored. They could continually send back information on each new star they reach, so it would potentially be an ongoing process of discovery and exploration lasting millions of years.
Overall, i think you are limiting your imagination to what we would do in 2024 or in the near future. The last stars are expected to die out in 100-200 TRILLION years so there could be an insanely long amount of time ahead of us to try ambitious things, even if they take very long to complete.
✌
@@dave4deputyZX 1) I don't think you understand the complexity and challenges of the Interstellar travel as well as the size of the entire galaxy. If they were inspecting with telescope each star for only 10s, it would take 127,000 years to check all the stars in galaxy at the upper estimate of 400 bln stars. Modern H. Sapiens has estimated 160,000 years, so it would be hard to maintain continuity of such project.
2) We are running into hard limits enforced by laws of physics. In future we will have more of everything, but not necessarily vastly better technology or unlimited energy. Everyone assumes the technology will keep getting better and better.
3) Voyager probes completed the main mission goals in few years. They almost got cancelled, by the way.
4) Of course someone will send probe here, just like someone will eventually take a walk to Argentina to grab lunch. By the way, Seth said it makes as much sense unless they know we are here, which you missed.
5) Off switches won't work when the AI dwarfs its creators. Ask chimpanzee how they would implement security to keep H. Sapiens in check.
6) I am limiting my imagination, because we aren't talking about trillions of years. Seth was talking about current times and perhaps reasonable future. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if vast majority of future society decided to live in virtual reality, just like now people spend time with smartphones, and wouldn't be doing anything.
"Aliens would spend the money"... that's too much anthropomorphism (IMO) we can also argue that our scientist would do this given enough socio economical advancement is made to the point where automated construction of things is free. In the same way that we would pursue our curiosity or hobbies given that our other needs are covered.
Problem with UFO sightings is the fact no pilot would risk being grounded for reporting a UFO straight above them. Unoficially there were sightings which started with radar seeing an intruder, assault helicopter or jet fighter would start towards it and sometimes even try to shoot it down. Radar data and reports do exist and at every event multiple ppl would describe the same thing from different POVs, yet in the end 95 % or so had conpletely mundane explanation, with most of the rest being some atmoshperic phenomenon (swamp gas, ball lightning...), instrument glitch... so when metal Tik Tak probe starts recording progress of our species, it's really hard to prove. And of course there are those sats and cameras everywhere nowadays, like mentioned in the video.
Also in one such case one of the multiple (civilian) witnesses claimed the UFO boiled water in the lake where he was fishing. However he didn't state how many beers or shots he had, when that happened. (Try to take UFO sightings seriously with reports like that).
5 bong hits and a pizza on the way.
Fire Snoory, hire this guy.
I'M GLAD THAT THERE'S NO PUBLIC FUNDING FOR SETI! ! ! ! !
You need Eric Weistein on. I'm really starting to think these people are wasting our time.
Absolutely seth shostak is a waste of time he adds absolutely nothing to this alien topic because he's too close minded to even talk about the possibilities
You mean he doesn't say what you want him to say?
NO! He doesn't! I've been hearing this from SETI my whole life. Like I said before get Eric on here and pick his brain.
The search is on.
It’s taking it’s first baby steps.
We’ll get there. 🤓💚♾️
Our lack of overall factors in this equation is what fascinates me most about this topic. While I agree the idea of other primates or primate-like creatures evolving on an entirely different world is an interesting problem for abductees to explain, I do wonder how anthropomorphized our own ideas of evolution are. Who's to say life doesn't have a preferred path? A sort of organic chemistry bias. One that leads to opposable thumbs and eye balls beating monkeys as opposed to tentacle and suction cup bearing squid. It could be life only exists on planets similar to Earth, in which case you might even expect similar routes of evolution. I do hope I get to hear the answers on your channel one day John.
Can't wait for bedtime now!
Woa😊 great episode
Ok
We are looking for radio signals...
I've heard people who claim encounters of the third degree say "They talk with their minds".....
So, would they use radio signals or telepathy?
Advanced life forms using Radio??
Why not using the telegraph?
Their communication technology would be too advanced for us to see.
There are only a few viable methods of communication, simple because there are only a few forces in nature.
We’re not blasting intentional signals with lots of power towards space. Why do we expect another civilisation to?
Always great to hear the authoritative and amusing Seth Shostak. It is really too bad that Paul Allen passed away before the Allen Array got more fully built out. Let's see there are 42 parabolic antennas in the array, does that tell us anything? Probably something about Douglas Adams...
Wait can u explain this just a bit more. I almost get your joke
Is 42 a lot or a joke?
Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy
38:48 you can use electricity underwater to melt metals, I guess
Excellent as always.
Great ...Seth is always worthy of a listen knows what end of the telescope to look through....a recent doco. on a UFO convention 2 journalists quietly questioned patrons and published results . 75 percent did not know earth orbited our sun and distance time/ could not fully name our planet system / did not own a telescope / did not know how far the moon is from earth / did not know the distance of our atmosphere from land to space negative gravity / and none were pilots ......hmmmm ......
Starship could put a telescope on the moon hopefully
Yes, so called sightings are just that, sightings.Yet, what about contact experiences? Why does it seem that JMG disregards contact experiences?
I kept waiting for In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida to break out
I'm so glad Seth Shostack stopped by to explain to navy pilots how to use infrared cameras! 😂
There is video on this platform where ex-navy pilot and instructor explains how normal cameras work and he makes a school level error. He claimed that cameras can't focus on two objects at the same time. Looks like he didn't understand cameras can focus to infinity. Fravor at some point, while explaining equipment, made statements that were contradicted by the manual from the manufacturer. So tell me more about pilots not knowing details of the equipment they use.
Was the audio sped up?
I am wondering if the floor of a crater on the moon can be used as the dish part of a satellite dish... Just need a receiver at the right point held over the center of it if feasible, it could reduce the cost of making a dish on the moon considerably.
Interesting.
John, you missed a good opportunity to ask how many frequencies are there?
We have searched for signals sent directly at us on purpose. I don't think those are very likely to exist, even if there are lots of ET civs.
Agreed. Given cosmological distances, it's naive to think electromagnetic radiation is the medium of extraterrestrial communication between other intra- or intergalactic regions.
@@srb20012001 Maybe I'm naive, but I bet EM is the best means for most communication, even for advanced ETs.
I just don't think ET spends much time pointing radio beacons at distant stars like ours, even if they can see us.
@@bozo5632 This begs the question of whether ET have harnessed FTL communication or transport technology to overcome the distance barrier.
@@srb20012001 I would bet against FTL anything.
@srb20012001 FTL makes the Fermi paradox far more difficult to explain. If FTL were possible, then you can no longer make any assumptions about anything, and it makes it far more likely we are simply alone.
Great stuff thx so much!!!
19:37 what's to say they use water for biochemistry what about ammonia
31:38 what's to say they have discovered faster than light travel and they want to study us? And the reason why we don't see them is that we are to primitive to contact and once we find a theory of everything will stuff open up.
There is only as much as you can do with physics and biology. What if they are invisible and cannot be investigated? It isn't very helpful approach.
Seth is literally the last type of scientist or person, I would want involved in the search for alien life. A completely dogmatic and unimaginative person, which are attributes I would not want in someone working on cutting edge science and exploration. The fact John mentioned several interesting ideas and Seth laughed at him is all you need to know.
All you need to know is how science works to appreciate Seth. Although he made a few small mistakes. You are either interested in doing a proper research or a pseudo-scientific fiction that is appealing to your bias, "I want to believe" style.
Maybe they know the value of radio silence? Allies of Humanity.
This all assumes a series of technical paths and choices that are far from automatic. In effect it's describing one small sliver of how a civilization could have developed. For example humans aren't even using that spectrum for intergalactic communication...
Fun discussion but it feels like fan fiction
12:23 Perry Reiss map? IDK spelling.
What about the numerous first hand accounts of people being taken on ships to other worlds? I have found half a dozen 1st hand accounts of interactions. Billy Meier, fella george something from the states, he had a private airstrip in Nevada i believe. Also a french Australian guy who has written an amazing account of interaction. Visiting other worlds. Its like theres willing blindness coz everyone wants to crack the code thru their own means. Mans ego always gets in the way.
the points of contention were great...nice when ideas can be propped or challenged w out either person having to have a "mic drop" moment...the typical modern sci corp/gov type wouldn't be able to move on until they had one...his push back seemed of his principle and demeanor which leaves a very nice open ended vibe to it....and of course that 100 grit yet buttery smooth voice is always awesome...
Sounds like JMG popped some adderal for this episode lol
Wouldn't it be annoying if the "wow" was a handshake protocol we never replied in kind to accept the protocol
More more more!
"We're the Klingons". Lol really hope it's not the Klingons :)
Physics as we Earthlings know it...
Wooooooooooooooooooo!
Pilots especially fighter pilots accounts of UAPs are the most legit encounters because they are expert observers, and they all say they defy physics
1) It doesn't mean they don't make mistakes. Almost every aircraft accident was a result of someone making mistake.
2) There we several cases around WW2 when entire groups of units engaged targets that didn't exist. See Battle of Los Angeles.
3) How they know objects defy physics? Are they trained physicists?
Seth should get a M.B.E. 👌🏽
Great video !
Maybe aliens are everywhere but most of them are just not as advanced as we are. Food for thought 6:43
If the grey's look like us, then perhaps they are us...time travelers. Michael P. Masters
One thought about convergent evolution: if we ever meet aliens, they will probably look like crabs.
After all, every single life form becomes a crab eventually. 🦀😃
Such a nerdy, niche joke ;)
If an alien was listening for a radio signal as powerful as the ones were emitting how far away would they be able to pick them up assuming they had a similar level of technology we do and assuming they we had been emitting radio signals for 100000 years? How far away would an alien actually be able to tell that we are here? Maybe they already know we’re here
Half way to Alpha Centauri.
The Coral People! 🤣
Why does it feel like the interview was uploaded at speed x1.1-x1.2?
If it was, it was an oversight
Check your playback speed.
If we found a signal imagine how old it would have to be