The problem for Third Party companies is that once Takara makes a character, the KO companies come in and make knock-offs for $30-50 for most of these toys. Third party companies live and die on razor thin margins already and many of them can't afford to compete at the $40 price point. Unless they think they can really knock a toy out of the park the risk is too high because most people will take a $40 KO over a $100-150 third party figure.
@@tydiriumhanger1320 It is also why we get so many 3rd Party Optimus Prime figures. MP-10 KOs were always in the $80-100 price range and so are MP-44 KOs. There is room for new 3rd Party companies to compete at those prices and Optimus Prime is the most popular character in the franchise with his own fanbase apart from other Transformers.
That cloud 9 Shockwave is a thing of beauty it positively destroys all the other options! It's well painted its Hefty it's extremely well-made and it's gorgeous on the Shelf. It's really a bummer that they didn't do anything else ever again. Rumor was they were tied into gigapower somehow but other than their Dinobots those guys have kind of disappeared too. And it's a shame because those Dinobots are also absolutely things of beauty to behold...
I still believe it comes down to something simple, when Takara/Hasbro sees something that they think is infringement, they go to the authorities. The authorities say something to the effect of show us the one you make. In the case of Pipes, as an example, Takara/Hasbro can't show one. The authorities don't do anything because Takara/Hasbro don't make a version that product. When Takara/Hasbro make an MP it gives more cause to go after 3rd party manufacturers. Mind you how big the 3rd party company is probably makes a difference.
Great point that there is a percentage of similarity needed to prove infringement and they get so close to the source material that it could be a problem
The simple answer to why legends aren't afraid is direct competition. 3p Mp directly competes with official Takara and is more likely to raise an issue while legends closest competition with official is core class. The level of detail and price point are so dramatically different that even tho they're in the sameish scale the target audiences don't overlap at all.
Nobody is "afraid" there's just less risk with a legends bot than an MP one, being sensible is in no way equal to being afraid. The very idea is laughable.
I think there is a genuine fear to touch some of these characters. With the profile Bumblebee has these days I think 3P MP companies know they'll get the Zeta treatment if they put something out, so why risk it. The Shockwave issue is a big one for me, there's money on the table there and I don't think the Takara version has wiped out the competition like MP36 did, I think a DS could come in and swoop that prize, if they were prepared for any heat that were to follow.
I have a theory as to why they're (3rd party companies) aren't doing some of the characters (yet) because those characters have a figure, and most people are happy to have a place holder or a gap until a major 3rd party company does. There is also risk over rewards and demand, I can't remember the last viral discussion with the majority of people saying they want to have an updated Bumblebee or Megatron, (not saying it won't happen), I don't think a major demand is there for a supply
I just find it funny that there's an entire list of characters that companies are too scared to touch, yet there are at least five 3p Optimus Primes. That being said, I also find it funny that no one has done an original mould of 2007 Prime.
Yes it sure is odd that we get Prime after Prime after Prime and nothing happens to them for making another prime. I thought it was odd that the movies all had different Prime iterations
Third-party companies, when choosing to design and manufacture their own rendition of a masterpiece bot, generally consider two significant factors. The preliminary consideration revolves around whether Takara has already created what might be considered a 'definitive' version of the bot. The secondary consideration pertains to the bot character's popularity. If Takara has yet to produce a specific bot, third-party companies often seize the opportunity to fill the void. By capitalizing on unrepresented characters, these companies significantly reduce their business risk. Characters like Huffer, Trailbreaker, and Sun Streaker have multiple third-party versions, purely because of the existing gap in Takara's product lineup. An intriguing scenario arises when a character already has a 'definitive' version from Takara. This is where the character's popularity comes into play. Highly popular characters tend to be reinvented by third-party companies after a considerable time has passed. The logic behind this stems from the perceptible aesthetic difference that arises between the older Takara versions and modern design sensibilities over time. In essence, these companies are betting on the consumer's desire for a version of the bot that aligns with current aesthetic trends. Consequently, they produce a third-party alternative. This is what we see with the seekers, Ultra Magnus, Optimus Prime, etc. One can even infer a correlation between the likelihood of a third-party company creating a bot and the potential of Takara releasing an updated version of the same. The anticipation of a '2.0' version from Takara can sometimes act as a catalyst for third-party companies to bring their own version to the market. However, one must also take into account the decline in the number of third-party companies in recent years. Several have chosen to exit the masterpiece market, consequently limiting the diversity and number of available products. The surviving companies have grown more discerning and strategic in their releases, catering primarily to their own business priorities rather than broad market trends. Despite these challenges, third-party companies are still hesitant to compete against Takara in certain areas where the latter has excelled. Takara's versions of car bots have generally been of high enough quality to discourage third-party competition. Characters like Smoke Screen or Prowl are considered 'safe' from third-party intervention due to the superior quality and acceptance of Takara's versions. However, there are exceptions. Take Tracks, for instance. This character's Takara version has been criticized heavily, and many collectors are awaiting a better version. The demand is ripe for third-party companies like Fans Toys or XTB to create a more aesthetically pleasing and functionally superior version of Tracks. If I had to guess, I think Fans Toys and TXB may eventually produce characters like Iron Hide and Bumble Bee, but by then, we will most likely be collecting social security along with MP figures.
Like most MP collectors I grew up with the G1 toys, so if I'm gonna drop $100-$150 on an MP bot it damn sure better have rubber tires & some die cast construction. Looking at you "Datsun" bros! I'm waiting impatiently for a 3rd party to hit some of those gaps in my collection, and as always I want MP jumpstarters too, just my 2cents.
It’s smart of ft to tackle mini bots. No other 3rd party was doing it surprisingly and they’re small projects to distract from delaying their combiner.
I agree with many posters, a fearfulness for certain characters. Look at Zeta StudioCell Unicron and what happened there. Challenged the BIG DOG and it didn't go so well. Why are FTs sitting on the shelf? Pricing. Legends not only are cheaper, they are in many cases, seem to be of superior design, not always of course, but, they also take up FAR LESS SPACE. As an example, for those that like to build Dioramas, imagine building a scene from the Movie, Devastator and the Dinobots, Legends takes up a small space, now imagine replicating that same Diorama with ToyWorlds Devy and the Gigasaur/FT Dinobots. Yeah SUPER COOL, but the space you would chew up doing it is several square feet.
This video was great timing for me. I just started doing research on MP, trying to figure out which MP/3rd/4th party release I should get for my favorites. Starscream was a pretty easy decision, Soundwave I eventually figured out, but I happen to like Grimlock and Shockwave as well, so you could imagine how quickly that got confusing for me. This video helped me realize that everyone is just as confused as me.
Legends company are not really messing directly with neither Hasbro nor Takara so I guess they are off the hook to do what they want. Sure, Hasbro has core class figures but they are not really affecting each others sales as they are targeting completely different customers. I think 3P MP companies are avoiding Bumblebee for two reasons, as apart from obvious threat from HasTak you can also get on Volkswagen radar as Beetle is pretty much a synonym for the company and they might go overboard to protect it... or they couldn't care less, but it seems nobody is willing to risk. :)
Sorry for the double comment, but I still can't believe that we don't have toon accurate dinos. Not that I want them (the two sets on the market are good enough for me), but I know there is a large group of people that was screaming out for Dinos with yellow instead of chrome.
Bumblebee is a high-risk, low reward character to do for 3P MP... especially when you associate a high $$ amount with which it would be sold for. BB is a brand that has *_movie_* scope, reach & money with it. Remember WeiJiang got shut down when they tried to do a hot toys esque version of MCU ironman. Is Oprimus Prime cooler than BB? Yes. Will OP figs sell more than BBs? Yes. But remember, there is no "Optimus Prime" movie, let alone OP product that generates near $1B. So, that character will be 3P'd/KO'd/OS'd. I think 3P/KO'd legends was getting away with the various BB iterations because they didn't cross the magical $ amount to raise flags, and I think, many of them were before the BB movie.
That does sound like sound logic. It is funny because in my mind Bumblebee is a small character in my need/want list but he causes so much concern in the community
The lack of a good Shockwave is baffling to me. Rereleasing the dark purple MP or just any version slightly more toon accurate than the FT Quakewave would just sell out. I don't understand why no official, no 3rd party or even no KOs. But I don't honestly think it's because any companies are afraid of repercussions, because that just doesn't line up with SO many other characters. It's weird. I can see why they went after Zeta for Unicron, because it was a direct competitor to a Haslab project, that's a weird special situation. But really they just don't go after anybody, so whatever the reason it, I don't see any evidence it's fear of consequences.
Well I don't think it has to do with Hasbro/Takara preventing anything from the third parties making anything, I wouldn't be surprised if some of the brand names like Volkswagen/ Mitsubishi and the like where they don't produce it because of legal reasons with companies like them. I actually thought that the masterpiece Ironhide/Ratchets are pretty good once you swapped out the kibble with the conversion kit. Still think it's better than Voodoo myself.
You are spot on. There are companies that actively look to protect their brand while others aren’t very active. Given how easy it is to spot a Volkswagen bug these small 3rd parties wouldn’t be able to survive a lawsuit. It’s not worth it.
3rd party company should make an attempt with the following characters like Tracks, Ironhide, Hot Rod or maybe Skyfire. If you can design them better with non completed transformation. Go for it.
I just want upscaled newage and magic square, especially the seeker molds , and I don't want legends scale up scaled to MP, I d rather have them standard sizes 6 to 8 inches like the Tigerwing Menasor.
Remember when MP trailbreaker was announced and fans toys released theirs in a hurry with a weird box? 3P seems to put the brakes on anything that's had an official release. Or the put it out through a dummy company.
i think a lot of 3rd party legends change the game a little. to be fair i got into it. i have so many already but it's nice to have smaller bots to occupy shelf space while still looking toon accurate. magic square and newage seems to be ruling that market and i get from both of them. also more affordable and they look great. i have space so for me it's just extra but still nice to have. the market is looking for more toon while saving space and cost effective and i think that's one of the many reasons why the bots you mentioned are not being thought of. that's just my two cents
For some of them (e.g. Bumblebee) don't forget fear of the car companies (VW especially) I don't think anybody has put out a great Shockwave yet - always a huge gap somewhere or weirdly sized (too big/small to hold in gun form). And I'd love to have the sound effects. I'd really like to see an Ironhide/Ratchet that has the original Robot/Base gimmick of the G1 toy - I just loved to toy factor of that as a kid (had the Diaclone version).
I've got a better question, why should another company invest time into making a new Smokescreen, Streak and Prowl when 4th party competition is selling those figures for under $40US? Xtransbots who are making carbots cannot sell a minibot for under $80US (Ollie is an exception), I just don't think many companies can justify charging double for what "could" be a premium product when the cheap 4th party with all the licensed features of the car companies like Jeep and Volkswagon sell better, Xtransbots have tried with their Dante and Davinci to only have mixed results and the QC issues didn't help. Don't get me wrong, there are many things I would like to see be done better with Takara masterpiece like rubber wheels on carbots, I just don't think we give 3rd Party a reason to invest in making a better Ironhide. Plus I think the movies are messing with MP production.
We need a better Ironhide and Ratch and a better version of badcube sideswipe it's a decent figure, but can use a fanstoys version and a masterpiece Daniel and Spike and all the humans characters and some good size diorama for your collection
Well with each of these they all have different issues. To start things off Takara/Hasbro only come down on 3rd parties release something on top of their drop of a big item of the same kind. Takara usualy with masterpieces, or the real toe stomper with Zeta toys unicron with hasbro. Zeta decided to announce their version litteraly right after haslab announced theirs. Endangering the entire project of failing for Haslab. Especially since they had no real info other than they would fully unvail it at the time upcoming convention. Which led to a slew of rumors that it was going to be bigger and better than the haslab one, and backers started stearing away from the haslab project. That's when Hasbro brought the hammer down Bumblebee is a tough one due to popularity burnout, VW trademarks, and pricing restrictions. He's just a tough one to do. With our characters that turn into guns its unffortunately do to current toy laws reguarding any toy that looks remotely like a gun. Most of the big countries like USA, UK, China, etc. have very strict rules on these for a really long time. Takara is really one of the few companies that can still droduce them as they once were due to Japan's laws. That's why Megatron & Shockwave nolonger get their gun altmodes anymore. The last 3rd party Shockwave I heard about made was Lemon Tree's Potatoe. And he turned into the Nemesis. So sadly no more G1 altmodes for those iconic characters anymore. 😢😢
Didn't know where to put this. I wish there was megs g1 to scale with mainline. Have you heard of LQIPPOE KO version 7inch Meg EX-02D? Is it legit? Is there any other 7inch gun Megs made by 3rd or 4th out there Mike?
I am sure Fanstoys knows they could not beat what XTB did so they are not going to try... just kidding. Give FT time to catch up and they will be banging out the rest of the minibots
Another thing to consider is that ever since the MP36 KOs came out and hit the triple digits (Toy House Factory routinely went for 90-105, I got the Infinite Transformation IT01 for 115), prices on KOs have been creeping upward. The MP43 BW Megatron KO was 125, the MP44 KO has been between 85-125, etc. And size doesn't help, either. Notice that: 1. MP22 Ultra Magnus hasn't been reissued (not counting the Diaclone based repaint that is MP31 Delta Magnus) 2. Toy House Factory had the ONLY KO of it, their "Hyper Magnum" 3. Instead of reissuing their "Citizen Stack", KFC aka XTB made a whole new one in "Commander Stack"...and there's no talks of reissues (nott including the repaints) Certain characters definitely ain't as popular as far as G1 Masterpieces. Ironhide, Ratchet, Sandstorm, etc., they're just not as marketable.
10:48 It is called the square cubed law. If you double one dimension of a three dimensional object then the volume increases by a factor of 8. So going from legends to MP means a change of 8x in terms of volume roughly speaking
@@tydiriumhanger1320 Just to be clear you get to 8 because the three dimensions get doubled. so you get the original has a heigh of 1 that is doubled, a width of one doubled and a length of 1 doubled so 1x2x1x2x1x2 = 2x2x2 = 2^3 =8
I wonder if it has anything to do with the movies and their characters? Now they’re IP for massive film studios too, not ‘just’ toy companies… Dunno though, not a watertight idea by any means. But it’s certainly a thing that’s for sure. Some of those characters you showed are really crying out for better representations (mainly Season One vehicles oddly)
The movies may not excite the interest in G1 character like they did in the past and with all the Rise of the Beast product out there also competing with the product that could be an issue
Maybe in legends cause of price point it boosts Hasbro sales while on mp it only do damage to Takara? Especially cause if MP is much less audience. It clearly has to do with their earnings takara and Hasbro I mean. But all very good points mate.
Similarly, MP36+ Megatron (toy color version) was never reissued, and technically never KO'd; I say technically, because while the chest detail and other paint apps weren't redone, the toy style face was KO'd by Toy House Factory well before Takara announced that there would be a MP36+. I think that the Modfans light-up kit also had the toy style face...again, before Takara announced it. Speaking of toy heads... right when the Trailbreaker KO comes out, Takara announces MP56+ Riggoras...a Hoist repaint given the derpy legs...and Riggoras has the toy head.
Afraid? No, it jjst defeats the purpose of filling in holes in the masterpiece line if youre just making the same characters that have already been made, thats why they generally only get KO's, nobody wants to waste money on R&D and production of something that won't sell well.
MP Ironhide/Ratchet are bad, somebody needs to redo them properly. Honestly, I'd take a new version of Tracks as well, along with a proper Red Alert with doors how they should be. I'd gladly sell my MP+ Red Alert to fund it.
![The Best (NOT) Bumblebee? [Cyber Era KING BEE KNIGHT CE-01 review]... in the vein of JobbytheHong](/img/n.gif)
Someone just needs to upscale Newage's or Magic Square's Ironhide and Ratchet. That would do it for me.
That would work and while they increase the size the refine minor details of the mold
New ages needs to upscale all their legends projects
@@thugg4lifdo they? They seem to be selling fine as is and have a rather large fan base, no I think Newage knows what's best for Newage.
The problem for Third Party companies is that once Takara makes a character, the KO companies come in and make knock-offs for $30-50 for most of these toys.
Third party companies live and die on razor thin margins already and many of them can't afford to compete at the $40 price point.
Unless they think they can really knock a toy out of the park the risk is too high because most people will take a $40 KO over a $100-150 third party figure.
That has to be a factor in their decision of which characters to make
@@tydiriumhanger1320 It is also why we get so many 3rd Party Optimus Prime figures. MP-10 KOs were always in the $80-100 price range and so are MP-44 KOs. There is room for new 3rd Party companies to compete at those prices and Optimus Prime is the most popular character in the franchise with his own fanbase apart from other Transformers.
That cloud 9 Shockwave is a thing of beauty it positively destroys all the other options! It's well painted its Hefty it's extremely well-made and it's gorgeous on the Shelf. It's really a bummer that they didn't do anything else ever again. Rumor was they were tied into gigapower somehow but other than their Dinobots those guys have kind of disappeared too. And it's a shame because those Dinobots are also absolutely things of beauty to behold...
i wish Gigapower continued making stuff, everything is overly toon focused to the point of blandness, i would love to see Gigapower Insecticons
I still believe it comes down to something simple, when Takara/Hasbro sees something that they think is infringement, they go to the authorities. The authorities say something to the effect of show us the one you make. In the case of Pipes, as an example, Takara/Hasbro can't show one. The authorities don't do anything because Takara/Hasbro don't make a version that product. When Takara/Hasbro make an MP it gives more cause to go after 3rd party manufacturers. Mind you how big the 3rd party company is probably makes a difference.
Great point that there is a percentage of similarity needed to prove infringement and they get so close to the source material that it could be a problem
The simple answer to why legends aren't afraid is direct competition. 3p Mp directly competes with official Takara and is more likely to raise an issue while legends closest competition with official is core class. The level of detail and price point are so dramatically different that even tho they're in the sameish scale the target audiences don't overlap at all.
Nobody is "afraid" there's just less risk with a legends bot than an MP one, being sensible is in no way equal to being afraid. The very idea is laughable.
I think there is a genuine fear to touch some of these characters.
With the profile Bumblebee has these days I think 3P MP companies know they'll get the Zeta treatment if they put something out, so why risk it.
The Shockwave issue is a big one for me, there's money on the table there and I don't think the Takara version has wiped out the competition like MP36 did, I think a DS could come in and swoop that prize, if they were prepared for any heat that were to follow.
I would be down for a DS version of Shockwave
I have a theory as to why they're (3rd party companies) aren't doing some of the characters (yet) because those characters have a figure, and most people are happy to have a place holder or a gap until a major 3rd party company does. There is also risk over rewards and demand, I can't remember the last viral discussion with the majority of people saying they want to have an updated Bumblebee or Megatron, (not saying it won't happen), I don't think a major demand is there for a supply
True there is a decrease in demand and many are happy with what is already on their shelf
I just find it funny that there's an entire list of characters that companies are too scared to touch, yet there are at least five 3p Optimus Primes. That being said, I also find it funny that no one has done an original mould of 2007 Prime.
Yes it sure is odd that we get Prime after Prime after Prime and nothing happens to them for making another prime. I thought it was odd that the movies all had different Prime iterations
Third-party companies, when choosing to design and manufacture their own rendition of a masterpiece bot, generally consider two significant factors. The preliminary consideration revolves around whether Takara has already created what might be considered a 'definitive' version of the bot. The secondary consideration pertains to the bot character's popularity.
If Takara has yet to produce a specific bot, third-party companies often seize the opportunity to fill the void. By capitalizing on unrepresented characters, these companies significantly reduce their business risk. Characters like Huffer, Trailbreaker, and Sun Streaker have multiple third-party versions, purely because of the existing gap in Takara's product lineup.
An intriguing scenario arises when a character already has a 'definitive' version from Takara. This is where the character's popularity comes into play. Highly popular characters tend to be reinvented by third-party companies after a considerable time has passed. The logic behind this stems from the perceptible aesthetic difference that arises between the older Takara versions and modern design sensibilities over time. In essence, these companies are betting on the consumer's desire for a version of the bot that aligns with current aesthetic trends. Consequently, they produce a third-party alternative. This is what we see with the seekers, Ultra Magnus, Optimus Prime, etc.
One can even infer a correlation between the likelihood of a third-party company creating a bot and the potential of Takara releasing an updated version of the same. The anticipation of a '2.0' version from Takara can sometimes act as a catalyst for third-party companies to bring their own version to the market.
However, one must also take into account the decline in the number of third-party companies in recent years. Several have chosen to exit the masterpiece market, consequently limiting the diversity and number of available products. The surviving companies have grown more discerning and strategic in their releases, catering primarily to their own business priorities rather than broad market trends.
Despite these challenges, third-party companies are still hesitant to compete against Takara in certain areas where the latter has excelled. Takara's versions of car bots have generally been of high enough quality to discourage third-party competition. Characters like Smoke Screen or Prowl are considered 'safe' from third-party intervention due to the superior quality and acceptance of Takara's versions.
However, there are exceptions. Take Tracks, for instance. This character's Takara version has been criticized heavily, and many collectors are awaiting a better version. The demand is ripe for third-party companies like Fans Toys or XTB to create a more aesthetically pleasing and functionally superior version of Tracks.
If I had to guess, I think Fans Toys and TXB may eventually produce characters like Iron Hide and Bumble Bee, but by then, we will most likely be collecting social security along with MP figures.
Like most MP collectors I grew up with the G1 toys, so if I'm gonna drop $100-$150 on an MP bot it damn sure better have rubber tires & some die cast construction. Looking at you "Datsun" bros! I'm waiting impatiently for a 3rd party to hit some of those gaps in my collection, and as always I want MP jumpstarters too, just my 2cents.
It’s smart of ft to tackle mini bots. No other 3rd party was doing it surprisingly and they’re small projects to distract from delaying their combiner.
Hoping we get cosmos revealed soon since they’re on a roll with them as well as wind charger tail gate hubcap and eventually bee.
I agree with many posters, a fearfulness for certain characters.
Look at Zeta StudioCell Unicron and what happened there. Challenged the BIG DOG and it didn't go so well.
Why are FTs sitting on the shelf? Pricing. Legends not only are cheaper, they are in many cases, seem to be of superior design, not always of course, but, they also take up FAR LESS SPACE.
As an example, for those that like to build Dioramas, imagine building a scene from the Movie, Devastator and the Dinobots, Legends takes up a small space, now imagine replicating that same Diorama with ToyWorlds Devy and the Gigasaur/FT Dinobots. Yeah SUPER COOL, but the space you would chew up doing it is several square feet.
This video was great timing for me. I just started doing research on MP, trying to figure out which MP/3rd/4th party release I should get for my favorites.
Starscream was a pretty easy decision, Soundwave I eventually figured out, but I happen to like Grimlock and Shockwave as well, so you could imagine how quickly that got confusing for me.
This video helped me realize that everyone is just as confused as me.
Glad this was helpful! I like the Giga Grimlock and there is a KO OS of the original Takara coming again called Reximus prime.
There's no such thing as 4th party, just knock offs.
Legends company are not really messing directly with neither Hasbro nor Takara so I guess they are off the hook to do what they want. Sure, Hasbro has core class figures but they are not really affecting each others sales as they are targeting completely different customers.
I think 3P MP companies are avoiding Bumblebee for two reasons, as apart from obvious threat from HasTak you can also get on Volkswagen radar as Beetle is pretty much a synonym for the company and they might go overboard to protect it... or they couldn't care less, but it seems nobody is willing to risk. :)
Good point I forgot to mention is that Hasbro changed their scale name from legends to core. I wonder why
Sorry for the double comment, but I still can't believe that we don't have toon accurate dinos. Not that I want them (the two sets on the market are good enough for me), but I know there is a large group of people that was screaming out for Dinos with yellow instead of chrome.
Seems like an easy cash grab but oddly enough the legends dinos perform better if sold in toy deco vs toon
Bumblebee is a high-risk, low reward character to do for 3P MP... especially when you associate a high $$ amount with which it would be sold for. BB is a brand that has *_movie_* scope, reach & money with it. Remember WeiJiang got shut down when they tried to do a hot toys esque version of MCU ironman.
Is Oprimus Prime cooler than BB? Yes. Will OP figs sell more than BBs? Yes. But remember, there is no "Optimus Prime" movie, let alone OP product that generates near $1B. So, that character will be 3P'd/KO'd/OS'd. I think 3P/KO'd legends was getting away with the various BB iterations because they didn't cross the magical $ amount to raise flags, and I think, many of them were before the BB movie.
That does sound like sound logic. It is funny because in my mind Bumblebee is a small character in my need/want list but he causes so much concern in the community
There are still legends Bees releasing now, Lucky Cat have an upcoming BBM one so nah, no correlation to draw there pal.
NA and MS weibo pages had just been wiped clean
What Why? Do you have a link?
The 3rd/4th parties are not afraid for me. But with so many factors to consider, any of these may give them sufficient reasons to not make the mold
True it could be less of a fear of Hasbro but fear of the figure not selling
It's simple. MP scale is Takara's baby. Once they make a character they want to be the only version available.
They who? Do you think 3p gives a crap what Takara think? They just don't want to waste money making something that won't sell, simple as that.
Man, if Magic Square upscaled their Legends-scale Megatron (particularly the new painted version), I'd probably break my arm preordering it so fast.
The lack of a good Shockwave is baffling to me. Rereleasing the dark purple MP or just any version slightly more toon accurate than the FT Quakewave would just sell out. I don't understand why no official, no 3rd party or even no KOs. But I don't honestly think it's because any companies are afraid of repercussions, because that just doesn't line up with SO many other characters.
It's weird.
I can see why they went after Zeta for Unicron, because it was a direct competitor to a Haslab project, that's a weird special situation. But really they just don't go after anybody, so whatever the reason it, I don't see any evidence it's fear of consequences.
Well I don't think it has to do with Hasbro/Takara preventing anything from the third parties making anything, I wouldn't be surprised if some of the brand names like Volkswagen/ Mitsubishi and the like where they don't produce it because of legal reasons with companies like them. I actually thought that the masterpiece Ironhide/Ratchets are pretty good once you swapped out the kibble with the conversion kit. Still think it's better than Voodoo myself.
There are some good points to both but if XTB did an Ironhide it would sell just like Dante Inferno was a hit
I'm good with my Ironhide and Ratchet. Upgrade kits and all.
You are spot on. There are companies that actively look to protect their brand while others aren’t very active. Given how easy it is to spot a Volkswagen bug these small 3rd parties wouldn’t be able to survive a lawsuit. It’s not worth it.
I want a FT Bumblebee as a retooled Parkour Cliffjumper!
So do , and don't even have ft Clift cause I'm waiting Takara :p
That would be awesome if they release one but it would be under a different name like robot paradise
3rd party company should make an attempt with the following characters like Tracks, Ironhide, Hot Rod or maybe Skyfire. If you can design them better with non completed transformation. Go for it.
The question about FT Cliffjumper isn't why they are not doing Bumblebee, it's where is Hubcap ?
HA an easy repaint that gets missed like bumblejumper they could do them all
I just want upscaled newage and magic square, especially the seeker molds , and I don't want legends scale up scaled to MP, I d rather have them standard sizes 6 to 8 inches like the Tigerwing Menasor.
Remember when MP trailbreaker was announced and fans toys released theirs in a hurry with a weird box? 3P seems to put the brakes on anything that's had an official release. Or the put it out through a dummy company.
I think that 3rd party companies just focus on figures that are not yet produced by Takara as an addition to the official mp figures
Quakeblast is freaking awesome. Glad i got a copy.
Fanstoys quakewave still an amazing figure to this day.
IT-01 Megs looks great too.
i think a lot of 3rd party legends change the game a little. to be fair i got into it. i have so many already but it's nice to have smaller bots to occupy shelf space while still looking toon accurate. magic square and newage seems to be ruling that market and i get from both of them. also more affordable and they look great. i have space so for me it's just extra but still nice to have. the market is looking for more toon while saving space and cost effective and i think that's one of the many reasons why the bots you mentioned are not being thought of. that's just my two cents
Great vid, Mike ! Someone please give us the wheeljack+ addition KO. What about Prowl? Facts toys needs a prowl so bad.
For some of them (e.g. Bumblebee) don't forget fear of the car companies (VW especially)
I don't think anybody has put out a great Shockwave yet - always a huge gap somewhere or weirdly sized (too big/small to hold in gun form). And I'd love to have the sound effects.
I'd really like to see an Ironhide/Ratchet that has the original Robot/Base gimmick of the G1 toy - I just loved to toy factor of that as a kid (had the Diaclone version).
I've got a better question, why should another company invest time into making a new Smokescreen, Streak and Prowl when 4th party competition is selling those figures for under $40US? Xtransbots who are making carbots cannot sell a minibot for under $80US (Ollie is an exception), I just don't think many companies can justify charging double for what "could" be a premium product when the cheap 4th party with all the licensed features of the car companies like Jeep and Volkswagon sell better, Xtransbots have tried with their Dante and Davinci to only have mixed results and the QC issues didn't help.
Don't get me wrong, there are many things I would like to see be done better with Takara masterpiece like rubber wheels on carbots, I just don't think we give 3rd Party a reason to invest in making a better Ironhide. Plus I think the movies are messing with MP production.
Great angle the KO figures are so cheap it is hard to pay $80 to $100 for a new iteration
Megatrons issue must be the getting around the gun mode.
We need a better Ironhide and Ratch and a better version of badcube sideswipe it's a decent figure, but can use a fanstoys version and a masterpiece Daniel and Spike and all the humans characters and some good size diorama for your collection
Well with each of these they all have different issues. To start things off Takara/Hasbro only come down on 3rd parties release something on top of their drop of a big item of the same kind. Takara usualy with masterpieces, or the real toe stomper with Zeta toys unicron with hasbro. Zeta decided to announce their version litteraly right after haslab announced theirs. Endangering the entire project of failing for Haslab. Especially since they had no real info other than they would fully unvail it at the time upcoming convention. Which led to a slew of rumors that it was going to be bigger and better than the haslab one, and backers started stearing away from the haslab project. That's when Hasbro brought the hammer down
Bumblebee is a tough one due to popularity burnout, VW trademarks, and pricing restrictions. He's just a tough one to do.
With our characters that turn into guns its unffortunately do to current toy laws reguarding any toy that looks remotely like a gun. Most of the big countries like USA, UK, China, etc. have very strict rules on these for a really long time. Takara is really one of the few companies that can still droduce them as they once were due to Japan's laws. That's why Megatron & Shockwave nolonger get their gun altmodes anymore. The last 3rd party Shockwave I heard about made was Lemon Tree's Potatoe. And he turned into the Nemesis. So sadly no more G1 altmodes for those iconic characters anymore. 😢😢
I missed out on the Plus for Wheeljack and the Datsuns .
Didn't know where to put this. I wish there was megs g1 to scale with mainline. Have you heard of LQIPPOE KO version 7inch Meg EX-02D? Is it legit? Is there any other 7inch gun Megs made by 3rd or 4th out there Mike?
Where’s a Fanstoys Windcharger?? Or any company that tackles a new version? The mini-bots have now been updated except for him 😩
I am sure Fanstoys knows they could not beat what XTB did so they are not going to try... just kidding. Give FT time to catch up and they will be banging out the rest of the minibots
I hope FT tackles BB. Even the 2.0 Takara version is dated and lacking in so many ways you could hardly call it an MP.
Another thing to consider is that ever since the MP36 KOs came out and hit the triple digits (Toy House Factory routinely went for 90-105, I got the Infinite Transformation IT01 for 115), prices on KOs have been creeping upward. The MP43 BW Megatron KO was 125, the MP44 KO has been between 85-125, etc. And size doesn't help, either. Notice that:
1. MP22 Ultra Magnus hasn't been reissued (not counting the Diaclone based repaint that is MP31 Delta Magnus)
2. Toy House Factory had the ONLY KO of it, their "Hyper Magnum"
3. Instead of reissuing their "Citizen Stack", KFC aka XTB made a whole new one in "Commander Stack"...and there's no talks of reissues (nott including the repaints)
Certain characters definitely ain't as popular as far as G1 Masterpieces. Ironhide, Ratchet, Sandstorm, etc., they're just not as marketable.
I want to see an update on Trax.
10:48 It is called the square cubed law. If you double one dimension of a three dimensional object then the volume increases by a factor of 8. So going from legends to MP means a change of 8x in terms of volume roughly speaking
That makes sense and now knowing is half the battle. Thanks
@@tydiriumhanger1320 Just to be clear you get to 8 because the three dimensions get doubled. so you get the original has a heigh of 1 that is doubled, a width of one doubled and a length of 1 doubled so 1x2x1x2x1x2 = 2x2x2 = 2^3 =8
I wonder if it has anything to do with the movies and their characters? Now they’re IP for massive film studios too, not ‘just’ toy companies…
Dunno though, not a watertight idea by any means. But it’s certainly a thing that’s for sure. Some of those characters you showed are really crying out for better representations (mainly Season One vehicles oddly)
The movies may not excite the interest in G1 character like they did in the past and with all the Rise of the Beast product out there also competing with the product that could be an issue
Maybe in legends cause of price point it boosts Hasbro sales while on mp it only do damage to Takara? Especially cause if MP is much less audience. It clearly has to do with their earnings takara and Hasbro I mean. But all very good points mate.
It is sad that the MP market is shrinking
Pipes looks so giod
Maybe a new road rage and tracks. Takaras are very hollow...
Nobody has made Broadside or Sandstorm
takara did make a mp darker plus version of shockwave. did i miss the memo because i own one
Yes they did. Like he said it was Hasbro's Plus version, but he believes people weren't as keen on it as the lighter purple.
Takara has not put that one back out and there never was a KO of the Plus version of shockwave. I think most collectors would like the plus reissued
Similarly, MP36+ Megatron (toy color version) was never reissued, and technically never KO'd; I say technically, because while the chest detail and other paint apps weren't redone, the toy style face was KO'd by Toy House Factory well before Takara announced that there would be a MP36+. I think that the Modfans light-up kit also had the toy style face...again, before Takara announced it.
Speaking of toy heads... right when the Trailbreaker KO comes out, Takara announces MP56+ Riggoras...a Hoist repaint given the derpy legs...and Riggoras has the toy head.
Afraid? No, it jjst defeats the purpose of filling in holes in the masterpiece line if youre just making the same characters that have already been made, thats why they generally only get KO's, nobody wants to waste money on R&D and production of something that won't sell well.
Why can't i get a decent Jazz?
Toyworld Bii is coo
MP Ironhide/Ratchet are bad, somebody needs to redo them properly. Honestly, I'd take a new version of Tracks as well, along with a proper Red Alert with doors how they should be. I'd gladly sell my MP+ Red Alert to fund it.