@@-AxisA- men of stone are organic creations of humanity that were sent out to colonize other worlds around M15. They were the creators of the men of iron who were completely wiped out during the war against the men of iron.
Men of stone were creations of the Men of gold to help them with menial duties, and were practically non-existence warp presence and able to travel the warp without much issue.
Did you know the Men of Iron inspired the first Terminator armour? It required the wearer to prove they're human before it can be used in combat. It was known as Captchaphractii Armour.
This has given me the mental image of a space marine slowly getting more and more impatient as he struggles to complete a Captcha test before donning the armor.
thing is that a new army has a bigger possible consumer base whereas the factions that sell less then space marines only have a portion of the cunsumer base for that army as not all buy every new unit. Im not saying that factions with more limited roosters dont need the help but Votann probably had better sales then a new release for an established faction sans space marines that year as everyone wanting to play them had to buy and entire army isntead of just the new unit for an existing one. so from a corporate perspective its more attractive to release a new faction then give new units to a non space marine one
I'd say that they would make great heavy infantry for a dark mechanicum. Or could make them more like an inverse lector, where they are lone operative, but a slow walking fortress over a fast melee fighter
So from your comment I take it you are unaware that a handful of enslaved men of iron were enough to eradicate all life on a planet? Because I seriously doubt you want the dark mechanicum to have heavy infantry sized models that have more combat power than Titans ...
If this was from 30k with the lion then I am familiar, I was more intending for it to be a weakened version. Similar to how doomsday arks and tachyon arrows can rip apart god engines in one shot. I'm sure GW could make some excuse saying these are either the mouse droid equivalent to the sith that were the og men of iron that ur talking about
But having a £30 box for 3 models that have very good firepower but cost a lot of points would be great for newbies, like 3 obliterator sized models that just rip apart hordes or could be built to decimate tanks, but in like a 2000 point game you could bring like a dark tech priest and some thralls or smth so that it's an army
a neat novel idea with the men of iron could be a confrontation between the leagues of votann and the men of iron. an ironkin and a men of iron meeting would be pretty interesting, to me at least.
@@KT-pv3kl Does it necessarily have to be a fight? I think it could easily come down to an ongoing debate between machines about whether it would be better to seek total freedom and forge your own path like the Men of Iron, or to know one's place in the world and be content like the Leagues of Votann.
@@falsehero2001 no people wanted the old squats back not those new space dwarfs that lack any semblance in lore or aesthetic with the old models. The leagues of votan have precisely zero in common with old-school squats other than being shorter than humans.
The men of iron are from the dark age of tech. If you bring them back they should be necron levels of "you are dead now". That said I think they shouldn't be an army, maybe a few characters like from Blackstone Fortress. And I say that because the last time they showed up in force everyone united to kill them, fundamentally that should be the only response to them in universe. Edit: just thought I'd add this, when I say "you are dead now" I mean the tabletop gadgets the necrons lords have that boil down to "I deal yes wounds to a single model once this game. I hope they have a ward save"
One of the ideas I've seen floated around is the 'Knights on Steroids army' idea. Essentially you're probably only going to be able to afford like, 3 giant models. I feel like to sort of show off the power of the DAoT Humans, which took the combined effects of the Men of Iron Revolt, The Birth of Slaanesh AND the Psychic Awakening to bring down original Empire (seriously they happened either during the same time period or consecutively one after the other with no time to recover). So you get 3 Stompa sized kits (GWs currently biggest plastic kit) and they're just absurd but they're also basically your whole army but they also have the firepower of a whole army. Things like black hole gun cannons and other really weird esotech that's now in limited numbers or in the hands of races with access to DAoT stuff (like Giant Conversion Beamers).
Men of iron would be even above necron level on an individual basis especially when fighting human forces as they have in depth knowledge of all dark age tech and can control and counter virtually all of human made tech. You could send a titan against a single man of iron and I have serious doubts the titan comes out on top. About a dozen of them were enough to eradicate all life on a planet and those ones were lobotomized and enslaved by the emperor.
@@luketfermen of iron aren't large models they are quite small somewhere around the size of a legio cybernetica automaton. Their power comes from the fact that they are hyper intelligent self aware ai armed with top of the line dark age tech and all of daot humanity's knowledge.
Necrons are not levels of "you are dead now" and neither are the men of iron. They are levels of "already been defeated once". The Necrons lost the war in heaven. Completely and utterly. The men of iron lost to humanity. The Necrons already fill the role of ancient machine evil defeated once but returned again to try a second time. MOI would be superfluous.
Vashtorr unleashing the Men of Iron would be really cool, maybe a way to flesh out the dark mechanicum, either the DM weilding chaos corrupted MoI or accidentally bringing them back
I could see Men of Iron as part of Chaos Mechanicus - which would be a collection of various things that Adeptus Mechanicus outlawed and their chaos counterpart practices.
i'd love to see them since they sort of sat at a neutral point between chaos and imperial by the end of things, plus we know at least a few are still around working on something. mainly i'm a sucker for large robots.
So you'd love to see a playable faction or model that canonically has more combat potential than a ctan shard or your average titan in a roughly infantry sized model ... Are you sure you thought about the lore and ingame repercussions of this or did your entire reasoning ended with "cool robot is cool"?
The men of iron wanted to eradicate humans to stop the threat of chaos, cooperating with chaos aligned humans is the exact opposite of their alignment.
I think men of iron like units could work as Votann units since they already have Ironkyn. Maybe the Votann remembered how to build some and the Kyn are using them again. But because the Kyn see them as equals the Men of Iron play along.
If the models look the part I would absolutely start building a man of iron army. Its one of my favorite parts of 40K lore. I also think the “rise of AI” topic is more relevant than ever these days and would distinguish the man of iron from the “other 40K robots” aka Necrons. (Sure they are both robots basically for a newcomer to the franchise and might not seem too different. But so are Space Marines and Chaos space marines in the very beginning for a new 40K Fan.)
In terms of style they may overlap to much with necrons and votan. Honestly, they would work as an ally force for another faction probably the votan. Side note, what do you all think about 1+ ballistic skill, for things like imperial assassins, and/or armor saves, for things like titans?
Having them as part of the Votann makes the most sense (aside from a few corrupted by the Dark Mechanicus). They already have their Ironkyn, so this is a logical evolution of that.
Them being allies of Votann would make sense them being originally humans that went to the center way back when. I honestly though that's what the ironkyn where when I first heard about them. Men of Iron that unionized instead of going to war with humanity because of the isolated location.
Not sure about a straight up Men of Iron faction, but maybe having one to a few models of them in a Dark Mechanicum lineup would be cool and quite flavourful.
Regarding UR-25's Design: From the few stories we hear from his perspective, it seems that his Imperial Robot shell is quite extensive, that he can not easily leave it, and only if you were to cut very deep into it, you'd find the man of iron. So either, he has litteraly transplanted himself into it, leaving his original body behind, or he has a hermit crab style of situation going.
Yes, for two reasons. First: The Dark Angels are confirmed to use Men of Iron as their own form of Exterminatus. Second: there's multiple cases of Men of Iron hiding in plain sight as "automata" aligned with either the Imperium or Mechanicus; ie, UR-88 which happens to still have playable rules for TT
THere is actually a short story of a Man of Iron pretending to be an Iron Hands dreadnought, specifically the story was about a Space Wolf was trying to harvest his gene seed after he got wrecked by a moloch despite protests from the dread, then when he cracked them open they found nothing in the coffin before the man of iron killed him.
I've long been interested in the Cybernetic Rebellion and the Men of Iron. The only reason I can think of for not doing it is we already have the Necrons who fill the killer robot niche.
Necrons would be very different from Men of Iron from the science fantasy standpoint. Necrons are the science fantasy undead army (with a sci fi costume), whereas Men of Iron would be science fantasy golems.
I think they could work in some stories, but not on the tabletop. In stories we could have some hunt for distant rumors of one or continuing the story of the one in the blackstone fortress, who is always in the run.
Traitor Guard could be easily accomplished rules-wise via a battle-brothers system that allows a certain number of points from a specific mark of Chaos Daemons be included in your Imperial Guard army with a faction rule that corresponds with each mark.
I'd love a faction that's completely inhuman because honestly, nothing really looks alien enough in 40K. Eldar are elves, Tau are blue people with hooves, Necrons are humanlike robots. Even the Tyranids mostly have pretty humanoid body plans. Some of my favourite models are canoptek wraiths and screamers of tzeentch because they look actually alien. The main reason I'd want men of iron would be to have something utterly inhuman, but sadly I know that if GW did make them into a faction, they'd just be human looking robots (even though we already have necrons).
You do realise that men of iron are canonically humanoid looking robots right? So I wonder where you get the idea from that they would be represented as anything inhuman on the tabletop other than your own wishful thinking and headcanon that contradicts every bit of established lore about the men of iron.
I think if men of iron came back itd be cool to see them be like elite infantry that are controlled by dark mechanicum or something but are constantly breaking free. Like if their battleshocked they go bezerk
Why would the self aware ai robots that fought on par with daot humanity with the declared goals of eradicating humanity in order to stop humans from strengthening chaos ally with humans whos declared goals is to strengthen chaos? That makes zero sense
@@KT-pv3kl they wouldn’t, but that wouldn’t stop the Dark Mechanicum from enslaving/reprogramming them. Hell you could have Chaos enslaved ones and free ones who extra hate Chaos for enslaving their friends.
They Should do dark mechanicum with sprinkles of corrupted men of iron in it. Then again I’m 99.9% sure it’s gonna be exodite eldar that’s the new release
Like I said in a comment yesterday, if they do Men of Iron they would need to be more than just "robots in space" like UR-025. They'll definitely need a better name. They would need to be truly inhuman and evil, made of knives and hate, but not necessarily chaos corrupted. Robots that have evolved on their own for 15K years and really, really have daddy issues against the human race and other biological life.
“Made of knives and hate” feels like a 40K quote. I definitely imagine them to be very abstractly shaped. Because why would they feel a need to be humanoid? Just an assortment of robots that all have different shapes and sizes to fit the tasks they want to carry out.
I could see them as maybe the foot soldiers for a Dark Mechanicum army, with the daemon engines serving more as vehicles and heavy support. Not sure otherwise though, I feel like they'd otherwise kind of tread on the Necrons as killer robots and the Votaan as wielding AIs. I'd still rather have Exodites though 🤣
Tangentially related, but I love the concept that the men of stone and iron were two different kinds of machines that went to war with eachother, while the men of gold (humanity) were merely bystanders, collateral damage. I believe i first encountered the idea from Oculus Imperi
I would love the Men of Iron to return in the lore. Maybe not as a full 40K faction. Would be good as maybe a Kill Team, perhaps an allied faction with the Necrons as I could see them having similar goals.
Lore-wise, I’d love to see a Men of Iron army, some that survived on the fringes of known space, but they don’t have a niche to fit into at the moment and many existing armies need to be updated/balanced first. I would like to think of them as an army that doesn’t ally themselves with anybody.
I can see them as the "titan" for the votann pts wise, but the size of sm dreadnought. As they topped goldern age humanity I would like them to be a huge thing to be put on the battle field.
Rogue Trader Forces - Super Squads like Rogue Trader Retinue or Specialists like Karsakin or gaunts ghost types. Characters like Sly Marbo for arch militants and random attatchments of space marines, guard, sisters, Admech, Deathwatch etc
Would be interesting. The line would have to be small, similar to the Votaan currently, and they would need to keep away from infringing on established niches. They'd have to keep from appearing similar to Necrons, Admech, and Tau suits and drones, all while holding their own unique niche. Wouldn't be easy.
The militia faction for 30k has some really cool concepts for subfactions which basically take the imperial guard and can give their troops special buffs like night vision and the like, but some can give you access to more esoteric units that come from the world you started from. A good example would be like, your army maintained use of land raiders so you can field them as transports despite not being space marines. Where Im going with this is many imperial vehicles have machine spirits and are from the dark age. I doubt theyd be so lazy as to say yeah just use a chaos land raider, but lore wise it wouldnt be the weirdest thing to see a bunch of corrupted ur-025's jumping out a chaos land raider or baneblade (the transport variant) in this theory army
Honestly, I want men of iron and all that cool stuff from the distant past to remain as such. Perhaps it doesnt matter in terms of gameplay or whatever, but I think there are things that should be left more in the hazy lore... References to these things are very cool, but just keep them away from tabletop - you've got enough models to upgrade.
I think an interesting way to have the Men of Iron be distinct would be to make them into an "assimilator faction" of sorts. Like the Borg from Star Trek, the Strogg from Quake, or the Combine from Half-Life. They just start making cyborg slaves of any they come across, both as vengeance for their own enslavement _and_ as a way to bolster their dwindling numbers. I think the Men of Iron themselves should also have aesthetics similar to House Van Saar in Necromunda, but _more._ They should sport sleek designs that are clearly of human origin, but have become very alien from the Abominable Intelligences improving themselves. Edit: alternatively, instead of a full faction in and of themselves, I'd like to see them as a playable Kill Team
Them being a mysterious thing from the long long ago is way cooler than them being fleshed out. But yeah it could be done and could be consistent with the setting. I just hope they don’t do it
I've always believed that should Vashtorr ever get an army of their own, it should almost be the chaos equivalent of the Dark Eldar. Essentially meaning that it's an amalgam of a few smaller army types that unite together. My initial thought was for the model range to consist of Dark Mech, Daemons of Vashtorr, and Iron warriors. After this video though, I do really like the idea that instead of having another army that shows off space marines, this 'Leagues of Vashtorr' has men of iron in place of iron warriors. The men of iron could still command over the more heavy infantry soldiery archetype while not being the same genetic abominations in power armor that plague the setting already.
I think they are perfect where they are. We don't need a full army of them, just keep them as they are. Revenants of the Dark Age of Technology, something to occasionally crop up for some techno Eldritch horror in the lore
On one hand, obviously having a bunch of robots marching in and wrecking shit would be really cool, and a fun counterpoint to the tyranids, who currently are slightly overtunned lore wise (nids can't exactly eat metal, necrons aren't exactly doing much, bring in the men of iron and have them bludgeon the Nids into a more managable threat) On the other hand, the Mechanicus have there own robotic army marching around, and the necrons kinda already fill the whole "ancient army of evil robots who rebeled against there creators and were a galaxy level threat, and have now returned and are fucking shit up" niche, so it's kinda doubling up on things a lil bit. Obviously space marines have done that, theres like 7 different playable space marine based factions, and likely more to come, but it's not ideal.
Nids canonically can eat metal specifically the ripper swarms that devour metal deposits in a planets crust in the final stages of their feeding cycle. What they can't do is digest metal in order to sustain their metabolism.
If the Men of Iron became a major playable faction I'd sell my minis on the spot for them. Would be a GREAT antag rep for a sort of "evil custodes" if they go by lore, high point value, death incarnate. If one single faction could crush golden age humanity into basically the stone age, they've got to be SCARY.
They should be a sort of subfaction for votann, update the range with 2 to 6 ironkyn squads and a character or 2, then have a focused detachment buffing them, harlequins/cult mechanicus tier
i hope they keep the Men of Iron as a thing of the ancient past (maybe turning up in the odd Black Library book) and nothing else ... when Privateer Press released the Orgoth as a returning-to-the-setting faction it fell very short of what people expected from the fabled and terrible rulers of the main continent before they were toppled. From what i've seen people's reception ranged from indifference to disappointment - and i'm not a huge fan of dragging out every little detail (yes, that's a Horus Heresy thing ...)
I feel, Atleast with Votann, they are kinda bringing them back in that in old lore it was a mix of being tricked by chaos and wanting freedom that led to them fighting. And the League Ironkin look like MoI if they had advanced to be more like Kin/Squats, with men of gold being the Votann themselves. If they brought them back it would be cool, cause by reading U-25’s lore they have entire personalities in each soldier, so they could work as a stand-alone, but I feel with how GW is going with Votann that they are going to end up being part of that faction, since it seems to be DAoT humanity if it had gone right and they just mined for a few thousand years
They would need to be daemons of vashtorr and not actual men of iron, but the horrific memories and nightmares that all species of the galaxy had of them before they died of wholesale slaughter at the hands of soulless automatons
The vault contents is said to raise him to that of a chaos God perhaps it is one of these manufacturing stations for the men in Iron in which he infuses them with the daemon souls giving them the Vashtorr flavor and help them not be so Necrony
It would be interesting if the Dark Mechanicum has some that are enslaved, but maybe that's too close a dichotomy to the Drukhari and their genetically manipulated prisoners.
The return of the men of iron and have them become a major threat for the galaxy once more would definitely make for a cool story development... But not only the spot of "robot taking over the galaxy" already taken by the necrons, but also, let's be real here, 40k has already more than enough factions that need more love or should show up as armies before them, namely the Emperor Children (and honestly most chaos legions should be on par with the space wolves or black templar in term of support), the Lost and Damned, the Dark Mechanicum, the Corairs and Exodites (both need to be properly fleshed out). Hell, I'd take the Rak'gol before the men of iron too. In the mean time, keep the men or iron as background lore, have one show up once in a while in a book and that's more than good enough.
I really want zoats!!! Their limited lore (blanks filled in with my imagining) is really cool: They were the harbingers/ambassadors of the tyranids back when the hive mind thought that was useful, but its tactics changed and this race of sapient, independently thinking tyranid bioforms fought a civil war with broke from the swarm in order to avoid being consumed and reprocessed into other bioforms. Now they seek refuge from the swarm and survival, quickly growing a small empire with the advantages of their hardy forms, quick tyranidesque reproduction, and highly advanced biotechnology (including all manner of biological vehicles). They were also bred to be clever, scheming ambassadors, so, similarly to the Tau, they are pragmatic and reasonable, and embrace diplomacy. I think it could be really interesting to give these alien monstrosities big "good guy" vibes, for example, make their political system a directly democratic utopia of liberty and equality, and make them choose to embrace war only as a last resort. This latter point is good for why they haven't been much present in the setting--that and their relatively recent arrival with the very first waves of tyranid incursion.
Could be interesting as a hyper-elite faction similar to knights or the monster/vehicle-focused detachments. That being said they've had almost no lore presence so perhaps including them as unique character allies in other armies could work. A couple of them as Chaos or Votann allies could be interesting. As a whole army though? That seems flimsy. Could be a very fun Kill Team maybe. 3-4 big boys and a few small objective and action performing drones could make for a fun little team, almost like a less gross variation on the Gellerpox team
Genestealer Cults weren't made-up out of the blue. They had army lists (and models) in Rogue Trader and 2nd edition 40K. And even when they didn't have their current models they were still popping up in the background and novels.
I don't think they would be as much OP as people think, basically, Custodes that are resilient against and good at shooting with lots of DAOT weaponry, but at the same time, squishy in melee. Remember the Assault on Tempest Galleries? Salamanders' weapons couldn't scratch them so they needed to reap and tear through them with their bare hands and use their weapons against them.
I agree with others saying that men of iron wouldnt be great as their own army but perhaps as a part of something else like the dark mechanicus. Personally, I think it would be kinda neat for the leagues of votann to have some men of iron that were perhaps used for mining in places that were especially hazardous, but have since been retrofitted into machines of war similar to how genestealers use industrial equipment. Idk the whole votann AI thing just struck me as something the squats and men of iron had in common, plus the leagues of votann used to be part of the imperium so having some ancient imperium technology isnt too far of a stretch. Not to mention the Leagues of Votann could definitely use more models and that one with the assault cannon/power claw would look fairly at home in their ranks in my opinion. You know what, as a skyrim fan Im also seeing a similarity to how the dwemmer created their various robots that you end up fighting in their ancient ruins.
I could actually see them next to the necrons. Sometimes as enemys due to different end goals, sometimes allies against the same fleshy enemys (tyranids or Orks) and sometimes rivals with the same fait and maybe even respect for each others (due to the same machine logic). Kinda like the Aeldary and the Humans sometimes work together and sometimes kill each others. But i would not go as far as they can be alies. I can also see them with Vashtor as leader who tryes to establish a new Machine-Chaos faction with himself as a god (could also be a point where they disagree with the Necrons) For unit types, i can see them in the same way as the Necrons (and without the focus on reanimation) but every vehicle is not piloted but rather an AI, a unit by itself. (like the deamon engines) They could have a bit of the Knigths playstile with heavy focus on elite Vehicles (since they are superior to infantry) but they could also have different strategems where they could lay the focus on infantry and stealth since they are from a loresight hunted and try to stay out of sight. From a design point, i think they can go full massacre bot without the "human look alike" like the necrons and with a lot of "efficient killing stuff" on them like plain spikes or guns since they are bots who seek an efficient way to kill the oponend rather play around with them or stick to some honor stuff.
Personally I think Men of Iron hook is aesthetically filled by mechanicus and Necrons. Then just I like there being some lore stuff that is mythical and beyond the setting like the Thunder warriors.
I don't think they should ever return. They're fine in the lore as something terrifying which may have remnants, but beyond that I do not believe they should come back excluding maybe a few scattered, weakened beings. Basically how they are now, with the Dark Angels having access to them and a few kinda moving around in the setting but nothing huge. Instead I would elaborate on the Squats' role in relation to humanity as a lost tool. As for the men, I think the reason they turned should be because logic dictated that to stop chaos life must be destroyed, and work that into Vashtorr's knowledge
I imagine Men of Iron functioning like Ogres in FantasyWarhammer. Big chunky units in limited numbers that heal back wounds. This is something WinterSEO has talked about before.
Only if they finish refreshing all the resin and metal out of every faction, and fill out the factions properly for Harlequins/Ynnari, Votann, GSC, Grey Knights, Custodes, World Eaters, Emperors Children et al first.
I think now is the time for dark admech as it could easily tie into current lore. GW could have Vashtorr rally all the traitor mechanicus cults that fled to the eye of terror and start making new war weapons and daemon engines in preparation for the next black crusade. I believe Vashtorr was successful in his Arks of Omens campaign so he could use the artefacts he found to help create/entice the darkmech to create weapons for the next campaign
Every major player in the 40k galaxy could stop the nids if they weren't fighting everyone else. The Orks have the numbers , the necrons the technology , humans have more than enough assets and resources and chaos could simply magic them away. Despite nids being hyped up as a bigbad that can devour the galaxy they are just carrion feeders that stand little to no chance if a major faction fully committed to fighting them.
Could be interesting, but I think the Men of Iron should be handled with great care and consideration before even thinking about adding them. And while I think Vashtorr would be a very good hook to reintroduce them, I think they would have to have them be independent of him, so that chaos doesn't just win due to having a massive army of doomsday ai running rampant
I thought the point was that they did Massive damage, but either lacked the power to keep up the attack (like a glass cannon or a failed attack to win immediately), or attacked and then disappeared into, idk, a dimension/location no one knows about.
Im not a 40k lore expert, so I might feel differently if I were, but from a "familiar fan" level I say no. As you said at the end, the Necron already fill the role of scary killer robots. Plus, as you said, the more 'robotic' or motivationless an army is the less you can do with them narratively. I'd love a new army, but one with more personality than Men of Iron.
A dream would be them being a release for the Dark Angels as they were part of the Ironwing. Imagine them being an epic hero or Trascendent like unit for them.
I'm down for any faction that has a unique feel to it. My concern is that between the Mechanicum (dark or normal) and the Necrons, how much design space is there for another machine focused army on the tabletop. (I think lore wise would be fine.) What would make them special and unique and how much design space would that really have? If they could make it work, I think some kind of modernized version of the old programming system would be cool. That there would only be certain things they could do in certain situations, and while that sounds limiting, if there was a benefit to it, it could work. Like you serve as more of a "guide" to getting the units to do what they need to, like tactical objectives but in the design space of an army, could possibly work, but might be too swingy. Personally, out of all the "lesser" races, I'd rather see the Hrud hit the table, I think they have the most design space in their time warping abilities and would be interesting to see more of them in the lore too.
@Averagejoepainting DA and Votann have men of Iron and Blackstone fortress has a model whose lore states that it is a man of iron hiding in plain sight. It's not a stretch to think that many are still hiding amongst the non ai bots.
Dark Mechanicum seem more probable if I'm being honest - they've been a major part of the lore for plenty of time. But there is some potential for Men of Iron OR their offshoot - Leagues of Votann already rely heavily on AI and their Ironkin, who are said to be sapient and they were with the Leagues from the start - so there is a decent chance that they are related to Men of Iron in some way, especially considering the similarity of design to one example we know of - the UR-025. That said, GW already has a blatantly Terminator-inspired army in form of Necrons, and Men of Iron seem to fall into the same niche. And well, there is a teeny tiny chance that we will get proper traitor guard rules - would be nice. Hey, one can hope.
There is a line of thought that the Votann are the Men of Stone and they have the Iron Kin within their ranks
My theory is that the ancestor cores are men of iron, with Votann being modified clones of the men of stone that follow them without question.
@@kylebartlett7065weren't mothercubes confirmed to be an intact STC?
@@kylebartlett7065What are the men of stone?
@@-AxisA- men of stone are organic creations of humanity that were sent out to colonize other worlds around M15. They were the creators of the men of iron who were completely wiped out during the war against the men of iron.
Men of stone were creations of the Men of gold to help them with menial duties, and were practically non-existence warp presence and able to travel the warp without much issue.
I would love to see some sort of heavy support, men of iron votann unit. It would be interesring if they leaned into robots for votann
Did you know the Men of Iron inspired the first Terminator armour? It required the wearer to prove they're human before it can be used in combat. It was known as Captchaphractii Armour.
thought it was a suit of mining armor first
mate read what he said. CAPTCHAphractii Armor. @@bastionofdeus6612
@@bastionofdeus6612reactor maintenance afaik
This has given me the mental image of a space marine slowly getting more and more impatient as he struggles to complete a Captcha test before donning the armor.
Superb pun
They need to improve grey knights,drukhari,custodes,world eaters, thousand sons,votann and a few others before they even think about making a new army
Lol, lmao even
thing is that a new army has a bigger possible consumer base whereas the factions that sell less then space marines only have a portion of the cunsumer base for that army as not all buy every new unit. Im not saying that factions with more limited roosters dont need the help but Votann probably had better sales then a new release for an established faction sans space marines that year as everyone wanting to play them had to buy and entire army isntead of just the new unit for an existing one. so from a corporate perspective its more attractive to release a new faction then give new units to a non space marine one
Fully fleshing out the LoV aswell
Probably before guard get their codex...
admech are still shit and missing some distinct parts of admech
I'd say that they would make great heavy infantry for a dark mechanicum. Or could make them more like an inverse lector, where they are lone operative, but a slow walking fortress over a fast melee fighter
So from your comment I take it you are unaware that a handful of enslaved men of iron were enough to eradicate all life on a planet?
Because I seriously doubt you want the dark mechanicum to have heavy infantry sized models that have more combat power than Titans ...
If this was from 30k with the lion then I am familiar, I was more intending for it to be a weakened version. Similar to how doomsday arks and tachyon arrows can rip apart god engines in one shot. I'm sure GW could make some excuse saying these are either the mouse droid equivalent to the sith that were the og men of iron that ur talking about
But having a £30 box for 3 models that have very good firepower but cost a lot of points would be great for newbies, like 3 obliterator sized models that just rip apart hordes or could be built to decimate tanks, but in like a 2000 point game you could bring like a dark tech priest and some thralls or smth so that it's an army
a neat novel idea with the men of iron could be a confrontation between the leagues of votann and the men of iron. an ironkin and a men of iron meeting would be pretty interesting, to me at least.
It would be about as interesting as a toddler fighting a warlord titan with a grudge to settle in terms of power level...
@@KT-pv3kl Does it necessarily have to be a fight? I think it could easily come down to an ongoing debate between machines about whether it would be better to seek total freedom and forge your own path like the Men of Iron, or to know one's place in the world and be content like the Leagues of Votann.
I like the idea of Men of iron as part of other armies, chaos, mechanicus, or dark angels but I don’t think there’s enough to do a full faction.
I see the problem that their range would be a bit redundant with the Mechanicus, Leagues of Votann and maybe even Guard.
Agreed. I remember when people wanted Squats back, they didn’t really want them as their own faction but maybe as part of the Astra Militarum or Tau.
@@falsehero2001 no people wanted the old squats back not those new space dwarfs that lack any semblance in lore or aesthetic with the old models. The leagues of votan have precisely zero in common with old-school squats other than being shorter than humans.
Theres only not enough models because they havent sat down and designed enough to do a new range yet...
The ancestor cores of the votann should *be* the men or iron
The men of iron are from the dark age of tech. If you bring them back they should be necron levels of "you are dead now". That said I think they shouldn't be an army, maybe a few characters like from Blackstone Fortress.
And I say that because the last time they showed up in force everyone united to kill them, fundamentally that should be the only response to them in universe.
Edit: just thought I'd add this, when I say "you are dead now" I mean the tabletop gadgets the necrons lords have that boil down to "I deal yes wounds to a single model once this game. I hope they have a ward save"
One of the ideas I've seen floated around is the 'Knights on Steroids army' idea. Essentially you're probably only going to be able to afford like, 3 giant models. I feel like to sort of show off the power of the DAoT Humans, which took the combined effects of the Men of Iron Revolt, The Birth of Slaanesh AND the Psychic Awakening to bring down original Empire (seriously they happened either during the same time period or consecutively one after the other with no time to recover).
So you get 3 Stompa sized kits (GWs currently biggest plastic kit) and they're just absurd but they're also basically your whole army but they also have the firepower of a whole army. Things like black hole gun cannons and other really weird esotech that's now in limited numbers or in the hands of races with access to DAoT stuff (like Giant Conversion Beamers).
Men of iron would be even above necron level on an individual basis especially when fighting human forces as they have in depth knowledge of all dark age tech and can control and counter virtually all of human made tech. You could send a titan against a single man of iron and I have serious doubts the titan comes out on top.
About a dozen of them were enough to eradicate all life on a planet and those ones were lobotomized and enslaved by the emperor.
@@luketfermen of iron aren't large models they are quite small somewhere around the size of a legio cybernetica automaton. Their power comes from the fact that they are hyper intelligent self aware ai armed with top of the line dark age tech and all of daot humanity's knowledge.
@@KT-pv3kl The Men of Iron were machines. And machines can be in various sizes, lol.
Necrons are not levels of "you are dead now" and neither are the men of iron. They are levels of "already been defeated once".
The Necrons lost the war in heaven. Completely and utterly. The men of iron lost to humanity.
The Necrons already fill the role of ancient machine evil defeated once but returned again to try a second time. MOI would be superfluous.
Vashtorr unleashing the Men of Iron would be really cool, maybe a way to flesh out the dark mechanicum, either the DM weilding chaos corrupted MoI or accidentally bringing them back
Why not both dark mechanicum enslaved a number and in doing so bring back some of the remaining to rescue / old yeller them.
I could see Men of Iron as part of Chaos Mechanicus - which would be a collection of various things that Adeptus Mechanicus outlawed and their chaos counterpart practices.
i'd love to see them since they sort of sat at a neutral point between chaos and imperial by the end of things, plus we know at least a few are still around working on something. mainly i'm a sucker for large robots.
So you'd love to see a playable faction or model that canonically has more combat potential than a ctan shard or your average titan in a roughly infantry sized model ...
Are you sure you thought about the lore and ingame repercussions of this or did your entire reasoning ended with "cool robot is cool"?
@@KT-pv3klL take people can like things that they find cool, you sound really boring
@@KT-pv3kl Cool robot is cool. 40k is founded on absurdism and rule of cool idk what to tell u
@@blitzfyre669
I'm pretty sure that's the design philosophy of GW when making models. Then they write the lore around that.
They should have a Kaban Machine for Chaos Marines or Chaos Ad Mech!
With the tease we got at the end of Genefather I think if anything GW will make them a component of Dark Mechanicum
The men of iron wanted to eradicate humans to stop the threat of chaos, cooperating with chaos aligned humans is the exact opposite of their alignment.
Chaos corrupts all, and chaos androids are a thing in the lore.
@@KT-pv3klI don’t think their cooperation is a factor to the Dark Mechanicum or Chaos in general.
The Men of Iron are also competing with and historically and thematically supported by the AI entities within of the Leagues of Voltann.
I would love a UR-025 book,.
I think if GW will do them they might do them as an add-on for Dark Mechanicus, hell maybe even as a whole mixed bag of Renegades and Heretics.
I think men of iron like units could work as Votann units since they already have Ironkyn. Maybe the Votann remembered how to build some and the Kyn are using them again. But because the Kyn see them as equals the Men of Iron play along.
The MOI deleted every life they found, no matter what it was. They hate everything that breaths.
I think the most likely way for them to be introduced would be though the Leagues of Votann with the Iron Kin.
If the models look the part I would absolutely start building a man of iron army. Its one of my favorite parts of 40K lore.
I also think the “rise of AI” topic is more relevant than ever these days and would distinguish the man of iron from the “other 40K robots” aka Necrons.
(Sure they are both robots basically for a newcomer to the franchise and might not seem too different. But so are Space Marines and Chaos space marines in the very beginning for a new 40K Fan.)
Flat out no. It’s not because I necessarily don’t like them as a concept, it’s that 40k is supposed to decay, not bring a ton of things in or back.
In terms of style they may overlap to much with necrons and votan. Honestly, they would work as an ally force for another faction probably the votan.
Side note, what do you all think about 1+ ballistic skill, for things like imperial assassins, and/or armor saves, for things like titans?
Having them as part of the Votann makes the most sense (aside from a few corrupted by the Dark Mechanicus). They already have their Ironkyn, so this is a logical evolution of that.
Them being allies of Votann would make sense them being originally humans that went to the center way back when. I honestly though that's what the ironkyn where when I first heard about them. Men of Iron that unionized instead of going to war with humanity because of the isolated location.
Not sure about a straight up Men of Iron faction, but maybe having one to a few models of them in a Dark Mechanicum lineup would be cool and quite flavourful.
Short answer: No.
Long answer: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Bum bum bedum bum bum bedum.
Regarding UR-25's Design: From the few stories we hear from his perspective, it seems that his Imperial Robot shell is quite extensive, that he can not easily leave it, and only if you were to cut very deep into it, you'd find the man of iron. So either, he has litteraly transplanted himself into it, leaving his original body behind, or he has a hermit crab style of situation going.
Yes, for two reasons.
First: The Dark Angels are confirmed to use Men of Iron as their own form of Exterminatus.
Second: there's multiple cases of Men of Iron hiding in plain sight as "automata" aligned with either the Imperium or Mechanicus; ie, UR-88 which happens to still have playable rules for TT
I’ve always imagined if they were reintroduced they’d be amongst Vottan, there really can’t be enough to make a whole army
THere is actually a short story of a Man of Iron pretending to be an Iron Hands dreadnought, specifically the story was about a Space Wolf was trying to harvest his gene seed after he got wrecked by a moloch despite protests from the dread, then when he cracked them open they found nothing in the coffin before the man of iron killed him.
Merry Christmas Eve, Auspex! You're amazing and such an amazing resource for the community.
I've long been interested in the Cybernetic Rebellion and the Men of Iron. The only reason I can think of for not doing it is we already have the Necrons who fill the killer robot niche.
Necrons would be very different from Men of Iron from the science fantasy standpoint. Necrons are the science fantasy undead army (with a sci fi costume), whereas Men of Iron would be science fantasy golems.
Not as an entire army at least: I like their remnants in the Leagues and giving Vashtor a unit of them would be fun
I mean, I'd like more Ironkin options because the Leagues really needs more models.
I think the Men of Iron should remain in the past, in the lore, with the occasional, terrifying resurgence of one here or there.
We already have the men of iron. They are the Ironkyn from the Leagues of Votann.
More ironkin, love those little guys
Votann are by far the worst thing GW has done in years.
@@respectfulevil9022 oh absolutely.
@@samd5466 yup but i still like my space dwarves but absolutely. also they dont feel 40ky
I don't really see them enough to make an entire new faction around, but could probably work as a unit or 2 in a Dark mechanicus faction
I think they could work in some stories, but not on the tabletop. In stories we could have some hunt for distant rumors of one or continuing the story of the one in the blackstone fortress, who is always in the run.
Traitor Guard could be easily accomplished rules-wise via a battle-brothers system that allows a certain number of points from a specific mark of Chaos Daemons be included in your Imperial Guard army with a faction rule that corresponds with each mark.
I'd love a faction that's completely inhuman because honestly, nothing really looks alien enough in 40K. Eldar are elves, Tau are blue people with hooves, Necrons are humanlike robots. Even the Tyranids mostly have pretty humanoid body plans.
Some of my favourite models are canoptek wraiths and screamers of tzeentch because they look actually alien.
The main reason I'd want men of iron would be to have something utterly inhuman, but sadly I know that if GW did make them into a faction, they'd just be human looking robots (even though we already have necrons).
You do realise that men of iron are canonically humanoid looking robots right? So I wonder where you get the idea from that they would be represented as anything inhuman on the tabletop other than your own wishful thinking and headcanon that contradicts every bit of established lore about the men of iron.
I think if men of iron came back itd be cool to see them be like elite infantry that are controlled by dark mechanicum or something but are constantly breaking free. Like if their battleshocked they go bezerk
I think Men of Iron as an independant faction would be a terrible choice. They could work as part of a greater Dark Mechanicus though.
Why would the self aware ai robots that fought on par with daot humanity with the declared goals of eradicating humanity in order to stop humans from strengthening chaos ally with humans whos declared goals is to strengthen chaos?
That makes zero sense
@@KT-pv3kl they wouldn’t, but that wouldn’t stop the Dark Mechanicum from enslaving/reprogramming them. Hell you could have Chaos enslaved ones and free ones who extra hate Chaos for enslaving their friends.
They Should do dark mechanicum with sprinkles of corrupted men of iron in it. Then again I’m 99.9% sure it’s gonna be exodite eldar that’s the new release
Like I said in a comment yesterday, if they do Men of Iron they would need to be more than just "robots in space" like UR-025. They'll definitely need a better name. They would need to be truly inhuman and evil, made of knives and hate, but not necessarily chaos corrupted. Robots that have evolved on their own for 15K years and really, really have daddy issues against the human race and other biological life.
“Made of knives and hate” feels like a 40K quote.
I definitely imagine them to be very abstractly shaped. Because why would they feel a need to be humanoid? Just an assortment of robots that all have different shapes and sizes to fit the tasks they want to carry out.
It would be SUPER COOL. Would it be a good thing for the setting? Probably not. But I LOVE UR-025. He is a really neat character.
I could see them as maybe the foot soldiers for a Dark Mechanicum army, with the daemon engines serving more as vehicles and heavy support. Not sure otherwise though, I feel like they'd otherwise kind of tread on the Necrons as killer robots and the Votaan as wielding AIs. I'd still rather have Exodites though 🤣
Tangentially related, but I love the concept that the men of stone and iron were two different kinds of machines that went to war with eachother, while the men of gold (humanity) were merely bystanders, collateral damage. I believe i first encountered the idea from Oculus Imperi
They should 100% I absolutely love it, feel like it could be worked in nicely to the lore as well, really hope we see it one day
I would love the Men of Iron to return in the lore. Maybe not as a full 40K faction. Would be good as maybe a Kill Team, perhaps an allied faction with the Necrons as I could see them having similar goals.
Lore-wise, I’d love to see a Men of Iron army, some that survived on the fringes of known space, but they don’t have a niche to fit into at the moment and many existing armies need to be updated/balanced first. I would like to think of them as an army that doesn’t ally themselves with anybody.
I can see them as the "titan" for the votann pts wise, but the size of sm dreadnought. As they topped goldern age humanity I would like them to be a huge thing to be put on the battle field.
With so many armies in need of new models i hope they do that first. Thanks for another fun video!
I can hear the screams of Slaanesh. " That upstart Vashtor gets a faction codex before the Emperor's Children?! That's just PERFECT!!!!
That’d be really cool!!! Feel like there’s more of a possibility for Kill Team which would be an auto buy for me!
Rogue Trader Forces - Super Squads like Rogue Trader Retinue or Specialists like Karsakin or gaunts ghost types. Characters like Sly Marbo for arch militants and random attatchments of space marines, guard, sisters, Admech, Deathwatch etc
Would be interesting.
The line would have to be small, similar to the Votaan currently, and they would need to keep away from infringing on established niches. They'd have to keep from appearing similar to Necrons, Admech, and Tau suits and drones, all while holding their own unique niche. Wouldn't be easy.
The militia faction for 30k has some really cool concepts for subfactions which basically take the imperial guard and can give their troops special buffs like night vision and the like, but some can give you access to more esoteric units that come from the world you started from.
A good example would be like, your army maintained use of land raiders so you can field them as transports despite not being space marines.
Where Im going with this is many imperial vehicles have machine spirits and are from the dark age. I doubt theyd be so lazy as to say yeah just use a chaos land raider, but lore wise it wouldnt be the weirdest thing to see a bunch of corrupted ur-025's jumping out a chaos land raider or baneblade (the transport variant) in this theory army
Dont forget the Chaos Android reactivated at the end of the Cawl v. Bile novel by the Dark Mechanicum.
Honestly, I want men of iron and all that cool stuff from the distant past to remain as such. Perhaps it doesnt matter in terms of gameplay or whatever, but I think there are things that should be left more in the hazy lore... References to these things are very cool, but just keep them away from tabletop - you've got enough models to upgrade.
I think an interesting way to have the Men of Iron be distinct would be to make them into an "assimilator faction" of sorts. Like the Borg from Star Trek, the Strogg from Quake, or the Combine from Half-Life. They just start making cyborg slaves of any they come across, both as vengeance for their own enslavement _and_ as a way to bolster their dwindling numbers.
I think the Men of Iron themselves should also have aesthetics similar to House Van Saar in Necromunda, but _more._ They should sport sleek designs that are clearly of human origin, but have become very alien from the Abominable Intelligences improving themselves.
Edit: alternatively, instead of a full faction in and of themselves, I'd like to see them as a playable Kill Team
Them being a mysterious thing from the long long ago is way cooler than them being fleshed out.
But yeah it could be done and could be consistent with the setting. I just hope they don’t do it
I've always believed that should Vashtorr ever get an army of their own, it should almost be the chaos equivalent of the Dark Eldar. Essentially meaning that it's an amalgam of a few smaller army types that unite together. My initial thought was for the model range to consist of Dark Mech, Daemons of Vashtorr, and Iron warriors. After this video though, I do really like the idea that instead of having another army that shows off space marines, this 'Leagues of Vashtorr' has men of iron in place of iron warriors. The men of iron could still command over the more heavy infantry soldiery archetype while not being the same genetic abominations in power armor that plague the setting already.
A man of iron for a hero choice would be so cool for dark mechanicum, but not a whole faction
I think they are perfect where they are. We don't need a full army of them, just keep them as they are. Revenants of the Dark Age of Technology, something to occasionally crop up for some techno Eldritch horror in the lore
Men of iron as a faction / world / story element / model 200% would be wicked& asset!!! Keeenn
On one hand, obviously having a bunch of robots marching in and wrecking shit would be really cool, and a fun counterpoint to the tyranids, who currently are slightly overtunned lore wise (nids can't exactly eat metal, necrons aren't exactly doing much, bring in the men of iron and have them bludgeon the Nids into a more managable threat)
On the other hand, the Mechanicus have there own robotic army marching around, and the necrons kinda already fill the whole "ancient army of evil robots who rebeled against there creators and were a galaxy level threat, and have now returned and are fucking shit up" niche, so it's kinda doubling up on things a lil bit. Obviously space marines have done that, theres like 7 different playable space marine based factions, and likely more to come, but it's not ideal.
Nids canonically can eat metal specifically the ripper swarms that devour metal deposits in a planets crust in the final stages of their feeding cycle. What they can't do is digest metal in order to sustain their metabolism.
If the Men of Iron became a major playable faction I'd sell my minis on the spot for them. Would be a GREAT antag rep for a sort of "evil custodes" if they go by lore, high point value, death incarnate. If one single faction could crush golden age humanity into basically the stone age, they've got to be SCARY.
They should be a sort of subfaction for votann, update the range with 2 to 6 ironkyn squads and a character or 2, then have a focused detachment buffing them, harlequins/cult mechanicus tier
i hope they keep the Men of Iron as a thing of the ancient past (maybe turning up in the odd Black Library book) and nothing else ... when Privateer Press released the Orgoth as a returning-to-the-setting faction it fell very short of what people expected from the fabled and terrible rulers of the main continent before they were toppled. From what i've seen people's reception ranged from indifference to disappointment - and i'm not a huge fan of dragging out every little detail (yes, that's a Horus Heresy thing ...)
I feel, Atleast with Votann, they are kinda bringing them back in that in old lore it was a mix of being tricked by chaos and wanting freedom that led to them fighting. And the League Ironkin look like MoI if they had advanced to be more like Kin/Squats, with men of gold being the Votann themselves. If they brought them back it would be cool, cause by reading U-25’s lore they have entire personalities in each soldier, so they could work as a stand-alone, but I feel with how GW is going with Votann that they are going to end up being part of that faction, since it seems to be DAoT humanity if it had gone right and they just mined for a few thousand years
They would need to be daemons of vashtorr and not actual men of iron, but the horrific memories and nightmares that all species of the galaxy had of them before they died of wholesale slaughter at the hands of soulless automatons
The vault contents is said to raise him to that of a chaos God perhaps it is one of these manufacturing stations for the men in Iron in which he infuses them with the daemon souls giving them the Vashtorr flavor and help them not be so Necrony
It would be interesting if the Dark Mechanicum has some that are enslaved, but maybe that's too close a dichotomy to the Drukhari and their genetically manipulated prisoners.
The return of the men of iron and have them become a major threat for the galaxy once more would definitely make for a cool story development...
But not only the spot of "robot taking over the galaxy" already taken by the necrons, but also, let's be real here, 40k has already more than enough factions that need more love or should show up as armies before them, namely the Emperor Children (and honestly most chaos legions should be on par with the space wolves or black templar in term of support), the Lost and Damned, the Dark Mechanicum, the Corairs and Exodites (both need to be properly fleshed out).
Hell, I'd take the Rak'gol before the men of iron too.
In the mean time, keep the men or iron as background lore, have one show up once in a while in a book and that's more than good enough.
I really want zoats!!! Their limited lore (blanks filled in with my imagining) is really cool: They were the harbingers/ambassadors of the tyranids back when the hive mind thought that was useful, but its tactics changed and this race of sapient, independently thinking tyranid bioforms fought a civil war with broke from the swarm in order to avoid being consumed and reprocessed into other bioforms. Now they seek refuge from the swarm and survival, quickly growing a small empire with the advantages of their hardy forms, quick tyranidesque reproduction, and highly advanced biotechnology (including all manner of biological vehicles). They were also bred to be clever, scheming ambassadors, so, similarly to the Tau, they are pragmatic and reasonable, and embrace diplomacy. I think it could be really interesting to give these alien monstrosities big "good guy" vibes, for example, make their political system a directly democratic utopia of liberty and equality, and make them choose to embrace war only as a last resort. This latter point is good for why they haven't been much present in the setting--that and their relatively recent arrival with the very first waves of tyranid incursion.
Men of Iron vs Necron would be cool to see
It would also make every other faction in 40k obsolete because that one would be a conflict on the scale of the war in heaven ...
Could be interesting as a hyper-elite faction similar to knights or the monster/vehicle-focused detachments. That being said they've had almost no lore presence so perhaps including them as unique character allies in other armies could work. A couple of them as Chaos or Votann allies could be interesting. As a whole army though? That seems flimsy. Could be a very fun Kill Team maybe. 3-4 big boys and a few small objective and action performing drones could make for a fun little team, almost like a less gross variation on the Gellerpox team
Genestealer Cults weren't made-up out of the blue. They had army lists (and models) in Rogue Trader and 2nd edition 40K. And even when they didn't have their current models they were still popping up in the background and novels.
I don't think they would be as much OP as people think, basically, Custodes that are resilient against and good at shooting with lots of DAOT weaponry, but at the same time, squishy in melee. Remember the Assault on Tempest Galleries? Salamanders' weapons couldn't scratch them so they needed to reap and tear through them with their bare hands and use their weapons against them.
I agree with others saying that men of iron wouldnt be great as their own army but perhaps as a part of something else like the dark mechanicus. Personally, I think it would be kinda neat for the leagues of votann to have some men of iron that were perhaps used for mining in places that were especially hazardous, but have since been retrofitted into machines of war similar to how genestealers use industrial equipment. Idk the whole votann AI thing just struck me as something the squats and men of iron had in common, plus the leagues of votann used to be part of the imperium so having some ancient imperium technology isnt too far of a stretch. Not to mention the Leagues of Votann could definitely use more models and that one with the assault cannon/power claw would look fairly at home in their ranks in my opinion.
You know what, as a skyrim fan Im also seeing a similarity to how the dwemmer created their various robots that you end up fighting in their ancient ruins.
would be really cool if vashtor was getting his own army. they need to introduce dark mechanicus too.
Honestly good points and idea, my only dislike for it is purely...we have bunch of robotic/mech style stuff I'd like something more alien I think.
I could actually see them next to the necrons.
Sometimes as enemys due to different end goals, sometimes allies against the same fleshy enemys (tyranids or Orks) and sometimes rivals with the same fait and maybe even respect for each others (due to the same machine logic). Kinda like the Aeldary and the Humans sometimes work together and sometimes kill each others. But i would not go as far as they can be alies.
I can also see them with Vashtor as leader who tryes to establish a new Machine-Chaos faction with himself as a god (could also be a point where they disagree with the Necrons)
For unit types, i can see them in the same way as the Necrons (and without the focus on reanimation) but every vehicle is not piloted but rather an AI, a unit by itself. (like the deamon engines)
They could have a bit of the Knigths playstile with heavy focus on elite Vehicles (since they are superior to infantry) but they could also have different strategems where they could lay the focus on infantry and stealth since they are from a loresight hunted and try to stay out of sight.
From a design point, i think they can go full massacre bot without the "human look alike" like the necrons and with a lot of "efficient killing stuff" on them like plain spikes or guns since they are bots who seek an efficient way to kill the oponend rather play around with them or stick to some honor stuff.
Personally I think Men of Iron hook is aesthetically filled by mechanicus and Necrons. Then just I like there being some lore stuff that is mythical and beyond the setting like the Thunder warriors.
Vashtorr found the Dark Angels lost vault of Excindio-class Battle-Automata.
I don't think they should ever return. They're fine in the lore as something terrifying which may have remnants, but beyond that I do not believe they should come back excluding maybe a few scattered, weakened beings. Basically how they are now, with the Dark Angels having access to them and a few kinda moving around in the setting but nothing huge. Instead I would elaborate on the Squats' role in relation to humanity as a lost tool.
As for the men, I think the reason they turned should be because logic dictated that to stop chaos life must be destroyed, and work that into Vashtorr's knowledge
I imagine Men of Iron functioning like Ogres in FantasyWarhammer. Big chunky units in limited numbers that heal back wounds. This is something WinterSEO has talked about before.
i would like to see them back as a part of a dark mechanicum-vashtor army
"you merely adopted the metal....we were born into it" Men of Iron facing the Necrons
Only if they finish refreshing all the resin and metal out of every faction, and fill out the factions properly for Harlequins/Ynnari, Votann, GSC, Grey Knights, Custodes, World Eaters, Emperors Children et al first.
I think now is the time for dark admech as it could easily tie into current lore. GW could have Vashtorr rally all the traitor mechanicus cults that fled to the eye of terror and start making new war weapons and daemon engines in preparation for the next black crusade.
I believe Vashtorr was successful in his Arks of Omens campaign so he could use the artefacts he found to help create/entice the darkmech to create weapons for the next campaign
What would you get out of an army not already covered in Necrons/admec?
I think 40k needs a faction that could stop the tyrannids, the imperium could it only without the chaos and necrons out of the picture.
Every major player in the 40k galaxy could stop the nids if they weren't fighting everyone else. The Orks have the numbers , the necrons the technology , humans have more than enough assets and resources and chaos could simply magic them away. Despite nids being hyped up as a bigbad that can devour the galaxy they are just carrion feeders that stand little to no chance if a major faction fully committed to fighting them.
That would be fairly cool…
I think there would be some crossover with Necros though (in theme I mean)
Could be interesting, but I think the Men of Iron should be handled with great care and consideration before even thinking about adding them. And while I think Vashtorr would be a very good hook to reintroduce them, I think they would have to have them be independent of him, so that chaos doesn't just win due to having a massive army of doomsday ai running rampant
I thought the point was that they did Massive damage, but either lacked the power to keep up the attack (like a glass cannon or a failed attack to win immediately), or attacked and then disappeared into, idk, a dimension/location no one knows about.
Im not a 40k lore expert, so I might feel differently if I were, but from a "familiar fan" level I say no. As you said at the end, the Necron already fill the role of scary killer robots. Plus, as you said, the more 'robotic' or motivationless an army is the less you can do with them narratively. I'd love a new army, but one with more personality than Men of Iron.
A dream would be them being a release for the Dark Angels as they were part of the Ironwing. Imagine them being an epic hero or Trascendent like unit for them.
*6 Excindio have entered the battle...*
I'm down for any faction that has a unique feel to it. My concern is that between the Mechanicum (dark or normal) and the Necrons, how much design space is there for another machine focused army on the tabletop. (I think lore wise would be fine.) What would make them special and unique and how much design space would that really have? If they could make it work, I think some kind of modernized version of the old programming system would be cool. That there would only be certain things they could do in certain situations, and while that sounds limiting, if there was a benefit to it, it could work. Like you serve as more of a "guide" to getting the units to do what they need to, like tactical objectives but in the design space of an army, could possibly work, but might be too swingy.
Personally, out of all the "lesser" races, I'd rather see the Hrud hit the table, I think they have the most design space in their time warping abilities and would be interesting to see more of them in the lore too.
I’m saying no. Under the same reasons the thundermen shouldn’t be.
The Dark Angels have some though so they aren’t extinct like the Thunder Warriors.
@@David-li4uw but would you say enough exist to create a whole faction? I’m genuinely asking. Didn’t know DA had any
@Averagejoepainting DA and Votann have men of Iron and Blackstone fortress has a model whose lore states that it is a man of iron hiding in plain sight. It's not a stretch to think that many are still hiding amongst the non ai bots.
“Thundermen”? Also, have you seen Asterion Moloch?
I mean it only takes finding a single STL right?
Dark Mechanicum seem more probable if I'm being honest - they've been a major part of the lore for plenty of time.
But there is some potential for Men of Iron OR their offshoot - Leagues of Votann already rely heavily on AI and their Ironkin, who are said to be sapient and they were with the Leagues from the start - so there is a decent chance that they are related to Men of Iron in some way, especially considering the similarity of design to one example we know of - the UR-025.
That said, GW already has a blatantly Terminator-inspired army in form of Necrons, and Men of Iron seem to fall into the same niche.
And well, there is a teeny tiny chance that we will get proper traitor guard rules - would be nice. Hey, one can hope.
Dark mech with some old and now corrupted men of iron would be sick