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So it is a paid review. I had the feeling it was. There was so much left out that should have been said. There is $100 difference in price and yet the more affordable has better specs. Not saying that iFi hasn't got it place being very different and different selling points. But it is less and shouldn't be more than Mani 2. Hifi seems to be very unregulated. But thanks for the review and discussion/debate that it will give.
@@paulboyce8537 - Not at all. I bought this preamp with my own money I'll have you know. The links in the description are an ongoing part of how I fund this channel, and there is certainly nothing wrong with that. If any brand "pays for a review" I'll be sure to let you know.
I ended up with the Zen Phono after having auditoned many others to couple with my Rega P3 + Benz Micro Gold MC cartridge. For the money it is truly excellent-around £500 in other makers' terms, no hiss oR noise as well. To get a serious step up in quality, for fun, i A/B this with a Rega Aria mk2. That area(approx £750-£950) is where one needs to aim to get a much better all round phono stage IMHO. A great review please keep thEm coming.
Great review, Mark. I used the Zen Phono while using moving magnet cartridges with great results and a linear power supply made a big improvement too, irrespective of what ifi say about their fancy wall warts. It also just about worked when I upgraded to moving coil, but it was clearly, and quite reasonably given the rest of the system, the weakest link. The lack of fine tuning on the interface means matching to MC cartridges is a bit hit and miss. But, hey, it’s a very inexpensive box in comparison to the cost of decent MC cart’s.
Thanks Mark! Interesting to hear about the linear power supply upgrades (something that was touched on in the Spartan 15 review of course). I’m the same in that I agree I think it performs well with MC for the price. I think it would be unreasonable to expect miracles in all areas given the very low price. Thanks for watching as always. 🎶🎧
I went on a bit of a phonostage safari last year. I started with the Zen Phono and wanted to see if I could improve its sound appreciably. I tried a Dynavector (forget the model), the Schiit (just for an apples to apples comparison), Musical Fidelity M1 ViNL, and a Lehmann Black Cube SE. In my experience, the only one that was appreciably better than the iFi was the Lehmann. And it was better in every conceivable way. I have since moved to a “digital” phono preamp, the Pro-ject Phono Box DS2 USB. It accommodates two turntables (MM and/or MC) coverts the signal to digital, upsamples it to 192 kHz, and sends it out to my Naim DAC V1. It’s pretty great. Not as good as the Lehmann, but it works well for my use case. I still have my Zen Phono though. It’s the only one I kept because it’s a great affordable reference and it may come in handy someday. Love your channel!
Thanks for sharing your experiences testing some different models. The Music Fidelity one is another on my list to try out. I’ll seek out the Lehmann too now you’ve said that. Thanks for your kind words about the channel. Enjoy the music 🎶
Great review, I bought one of these a couple of years ago. At the time I used a trichord dino, which was a far more expensive product. I no longer own the dino! Ifi zen has almost no hiss, as you said, and better dynamics. It would be a great product if it cost £450, at the money it retails at it’s a bargain
Thanks for the review! I’m looking into upgrading from the fosi audio tube phono stage and these are the two main contenders (ifi and mani2)! Any thoughts on which would be best with a goldring e3?
Thanks for watching. From what I know of the Goldring E3, it’s a slightly warmer sound than anything Ortofon produces. It’s hard to say 100% which preamp is best as so much of this comes down to personal taste. I found the Mani 2 a little harsh up top for my taste, which is why I prefer it with a warmer sounding cartridge. That said, some people like a more forward sound in that respect. The ZEN is undoubtedly quieter in terms of the noise floor. Plus it has a more balanced sound in my opinion. Hope that helps to some degree 🎶🎧👌
I would look at the E4 100£ more but it's worth it, you might get it for only £20 more if you buy it from a studio shop retailer. Have a look at the spartan 5 as well phonostage at 150£. If you're going between the mani and the Zen I would go for the Zen, they do make a more expensive phonostage what it's like I don't know! should be better at least it's got capacitance but you can buy RCA female to male capacitance adaptors of different sorts separately and they're not expensive or make your own.
I own both pre-amps as well as the Ortofon 2M Blue (and 3 other cartridges) I almost bought a Goldring E3 instead of the 2M Blue but since I already had the RED, I opted for the Blue when I saw it on sale about 6 months ago. The Blue is bright but not harsh and offers a little better bottom end extension than the RED but I can't compare it directly to the Goldring, unfortunately. But I can compare the Zen compared to the little Fosi tube phono stage, and it is light years more refined, more detailed and spacious. You're going to love it. From what I understand about the Mani2, it may well be a terrific match with the warmth of the Goldring E3, as it won't overly smooth your highs or bury the detail of the upper midrange. That's not to say that the Zen does that. It's just that because the Blue is a bit more lively up top and can sound harsh depending on your other components in your system (particularly your speakers and furnishings and placement in the room) it is probably a better match for a pre-amp that is slightly warmer compared to other options available. That would be the Zen. It's really a coin toss, and there are no wrong answers...only some that might be more preferable to your ears and sensibilities. Good luck. I hope you find a happy marriage of your cartridge and pre-amp. 😁
Hello! Great choice on the Goldring E3! I had one for the last year or so until I got a new table and got a nice discount on the vm95ml which was a very easy switch since the table came with the 95e, the green one that comes with so many tables these days. Had I not gotten such a great price on the ml which gave me a chance to try something new and saved me from all the tedious work switching a cartridge often does, I would have gotten another E3 or possibly tried the E4 considering how impressed I am with the E3. I figure by now you’ve already made your choice, but I was going to say that the either choice would have sounded great. The Zen imo was a bit better. I had a mani 2 and upgraded to the zen phono and found it to be worth it. I’m now considering the phono 3. On a side note, if you use headphones at all, I can tell you that I recently got the Topping A70pro amp/preamp and it has taken my vinyl to a whole new level! It’s made the biggest difference of anything to date. It’s incredible and so satisfying to see a VU meter or the screens that shows the spectrum of sound frequencies changing in realtime, I can’t recall what the official name of the meter is but it’s wicked to see it in action with your vinyl. Just adds a sweet touch. Of course it wouldn’t matter if the sound was just mid, but I swear it has taken my vinyl experience to new heights. It’s not the first thing I think people would think of when looking for a headphone amp/preamp for their vinyl but it should be. What a discovery! I’m so happy with it. I hope you settled on a preamp you’re happy with and if you chose the Mani2 you might as well stay there unless you’re upgrading to something far more expensive. Now if you could sell it for a decent price and get a zen phono 3 it would probably be worth it, but I can’t tell you how much or if it’s significantly better just yet. Hopefully soon. I can without a doubt tell you that amp is a no brainer. Paired with the Hifiman Arya Stealth planar magnetic open back headphones, man, what a delight.
Hi Mark! Great review of the Ifi zen! I enjoy watching your video's, they are very entertaining to watch! I do have a question, do you know how much milivolts the Zen can handle without sounding distorted? I have a Ortofon Concorde mkii club on my Technics SL-1200 which is 8mv and I know that's pretty. I do have the Technics connected to a Allen & Heath Xone 23c analog mixer on it's phono input but the phono sound pretty good but does not have the highest gain but that mixer is known for that, still a very very solid mixer, but I do want to upgrade with a regular higher quality phono preamp between the Technics and the Xone 23c, I have my eye's on the Ifi Zen phono preamp for a while now and I can't find any information online of a Concorde mkii club and the Zen combination anywhere as far as I have searched. I mostly listen to classic trance and those tracks are pretty loud anyway but they can benefit from a audio upgrade as well, and I have the original release of Jeff Wayne's War of the Worlds on vinyl too and it doesn't sound very loud with the Concorde and the Xone so if I want to experiment more with other genres on vinyl I want them to be pretty loud and clear too. I'm sorry for this very long response for something that can be a easy and simple question, but I want to know if you maybe know if 8mv is good for something like the Zen phono preamp?
Thanks! Glad it helped. That is quite a hot output on the Concorde, so I see your concern. They don't actually state the max input, but I would hope it could handle that. One person who does state this figure is the guy behind the Spartan series (max input of 84mV rms at 1K): michaelfidler.com/products/spartan/spartan-5-moving-magnet-phono-stage/
very good review. thanks. have you tried setting both to 48db gain with MM cartridges ? Just curious to know how both will behave in my setup at that gain. thanks
I have a Mani 2 currently with an Orotdon 2m Blue. I was thinking of upgrading to the Zen Phono or possibly the Pro-Ject Phono Box DS2 (which I saw you also reviewed). Would you say the the DS2 is worth the extra $150? Thank you.
The Phono Box sounds flatter to my ears than the Mani, which is a little more lively in the bass frequencies. Switching to MC is obviously easier with the Pro-Ject too, but the unit is also much bigger. So I think it depends on what you're looking for/space/personal preference. Hope this helps
Thanks so much. I think at this point I'm looking for a cleaner, more transparent sound with wider sound stage. Hoping the Pro-Ject could provide that.
I would read reviews specific to your cartridge. Specifically I found Mani 2 does not sound great with your blue. You may not need an upgrade but a horizontal change over to this and may have success. The Mani 2 resells for damn near full price on the secondary market
On your Mani 2 video you were talking a bit of the specs. But here I do not see anything about the iFi to compare? If there is a comparison it should start from the specs and what it can and can't as both are very different and directed to different use between MC/MM. Then see if the paper values transfer to the real world with a good sound quality. Why I make a big fuss about specs is for example 110pF vs 200pF and DC 5V / 500mA vs 16VAC /1A. There is a huge difference just in these two specs that will decide what cartridge you can amplify well. One is more towards MC and other works better on MM cartridges. Mani 2 (US$149) Gain 1 = L, Gain 2 = L (Decca Mode) Gain: 33dB THD: 108dB, A-weighted, ref 2V RMS Crosstalk: -90dB, 20-20kHz Sensitivity: 5.3mV for 300mV output Overload Margin: >20dB Gain 1 = L, Gain 2 = H (Standard MM Mode) Gain: 42dB THD: 98dB, A-weighted, ref 2V RMS Crosstalk: -90dB, 20-20kHz Sensitivity: 1.9mV for 300mV output Overload Margin: >20dB
Gain 1 = H, Gain 2 = L (Low Output MM/High Output MC Mode) Gain: 48dB THD: 96dB, A-weighted, ref 2V RMS Crosstalk: -80dB, 20-20kHz Sensitivity: 1.06mV for 300mV output Overload Margin: >20dB
Gain 1 = H, Gain 2 = H (MC Mode) Gain: 60dB THD: 87dB, A-weighted, ref 2V RMS Crosstalk: -75dB, 20-20kHz Sensitivity: 0.33mV for 300mV output Overload Margin: >20dB
Input Loading:
Selectable R: 47KΩ, 200Ω, 47Ω, or 38Ω Selectable C: 47pF, 100pF, 150pF, or 200pF
RIAA Accuracy: +/- 0.2dB, 20-20kHz
Low Frequency Filter: 6dB/octave or 12dB/octave at 15 Hz, fully passive
Output Impedance: 75 ohms Topology: Fully passive RIAA network with OPA1612 gain stages, OP07 DC servo, switchable passive CR LF filter, 1- or 2- pole, 0.1% thin-film resistors, and 2% film capacitors Power Supply: “wall wart” style 16VAC transformer, dual-filtered, regulated +/- 16V rails Power Consumption: 4W Size: 5 x 3.5 x 1.25” Weight: 1 lb ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Here is iFi ZEN Phono specs. iFi ZEN Phono (GBP199.00/US$250) Gain settings MC (v lo)@ MC (lo) MC (hi) MM 72dB (+/- 1dB) 60dB (+/- 1dB) 48dB (+/- 1dB) 36dB (+/- 1dB) AI Sub-sonic filter Remedies only the 'warp' in LPs No negative impact to bass response Max Output Voltage (RMS) 20v RMS bal output into 100k (< 1% THD & N) 13.5V RMS bal output into 600R (< 1% THD & N) Output Impedance: BAL SE 200 Ohm resistive 100 Ohm resistive Input impedance MM: 47K Ohms (Load: 110pF) MC High: 47K Ohms MC Low: 1K Ohms MC V Low: 110 Ohms Signal/Noise Ratio: 94dB(A) MM re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL 80dB(unweighted 80kHz BW) MM re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL 84dB(A) MC Hi re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL 71dB(unweighted 80kHz BW) MM re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL 90dB(A) MC lo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL 79dB(unweighted 80kHz BW) MC lo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL 79dB(A) MC vlo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL 69dB(unweighted 80kHz BW) MC vlo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL EIN (equivalent input noise): 0.6nV|/Hz (unweighted) MC lo/vlo 6.5nV|/Hz (unweighted) MM/MC hi -151dBV (A weighted) -141dBV (unweighted) -130dBV (A weighted) -119dBV (unweighted) Harmonic Distortion: < -110dB / 0.0003% MM re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL < -80dB / 0.01% MC lo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL < -86dB / 0.005% MC vlo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL Dimensions 160(l) x 113(w) x 35(h) mm 6.3" x 4.4" x 1.4" Power Supply: DC 5V / 500mA Net weight: 515g (1.14 Ibs) Warranty: 12 months
@@Pkilla80 Recommended load capacitance/pF for OM10 is 200-500pf. You can also upgrade the power supply to 16VAC 2.5A. Wiltronics Research Pty. Ltd. Description This 16VAC Desktop Power Supply with an alternating voltage of 2.5A has good insulation and high electrical resistance. Features short-circuit, over-current, overload, and over-voltage protection. Low temperature and long service life. Features Linear transformer C-Core type Low noise with No SMPS RF Specifications Volts16VAC Size2.5mm Current2500mA TypeAC
Yes the IFI Zen Phono is the pre i need, but now other component i ask Sound Matters, is the phono, wich one would you chose : The Rega RP3 aniversary, or the AVID Ingenium with rega arm? the first one 1.000€ and the second 1.500€?
The AVID deck I haven't tried I'm afraid: seems good though. Less surface area for the plinth should be good for resonance avoidance. The RP3 is a classic though. Both good options, perhaps it just depends on your budget and taste. If you can get the chance to play with one in the flesh and hear a demo, even better. Hope this helps
Hi Marc sorry to bother you but i had made my mind up on the ifi zen audio but here in the uk they have just lowered the cambridge alva duo to £199 from £299 i suppose there must be a new model coming im wondering if thats worth a punt or stick with the ifi ?
No worries at all. The Alva Duo is on my list to review. But I can’t comment from direct experience on this I’m afraid. It’s supposed to be good though; works with both MM & MC of course. The auto-off power saving function is a nice touch also
@@soundmatters thank you Marc it was normally £299.99 but they have just cut the price to £199 the websites say for a short time only but I’m thinking they may have an updated model coming out soon so £199 seems like a really good deal for a pre amp with a subsonic filter a headphone socket and as you said auto power off. Thanks Marc appreciate your view and I will look forward to your review. Cheers
Do you listen to all three phono pres stacked like that? What better phono preamps have you listened to. Normally I don't ask about specific models but what have you listened to as a reference point?
It should be noted that different preamps sound better with different cartridges even with all the switches. For example the Mani 2 doesn't shine with the Blue but sounds great with my Ortofon 20
Agree. The Mani makes the 2M range sound rather TOO bright as they’re a bit brighter to begin with. It sounds great with a Nagaoka or my Shure M97xe though 🎶🎧 Happy listening
I'm curious if you have heard anything new happening with the Zen Phono. I cannot find the Zen Phono anywhere for sale, everyone is out of stock. Do you know if they discontinued the Zen Phono or maybe coming out with a new model? It just seems odd to me that its almost like they pulled it from the market.
I have heard this from a few subscribers. There was some stock in the U.K. until recently and the US Amazon has been out of stock for at least a month or two it would seem. I suspect there must be a new model coming or maybe there are some supply chain issues. The Mani seems to be out of stock too, I’m thinking supply chain issues
@@soundmatters That’s unfortunate for me. The only local authorised retailer told me it’s discontinued and wont be selling it anymore. Is the NAD PP 2e comparable to the ifi phono? Its the only one available
Sorry for the slow reply here. The r51pm has a built in phono preamp. If you want to run the Zen, you need to switch the speakers to line. So yes, you're correct. Hope this helps!
I don't agree with just about anything you said I compared the Zen to the original Mani and the Mani beat it in every single way musically. I couldn't wait to ship the Zen back 😮 so disappointed 👎
Sound is very, very subjective. I’m not saying the Mani is a bad phono pre-amp, it’s just different and may suit different setups/personal taste better. At the end of the day, if you’re enjoying the way your system sounds, then that’s all that matters. Enjoy the the music 🎶
Should you compare it to the spartan 5 it's the same price, didn't you have a spartan 5 or the spartan 15? You've not got ít anymore Why? You can buy RCA female to male adaptors to change capacitance I thought ifi did sell them?? I know one company does or you can buy them from somebody else.
I’ve never heard the Spartan 5. I reviewed the Spartan 15 as mentioned briefly in this review. Judging from what I’ve seen of the 15 though, I’m sure the 5 is excellent 👌
I realise you said that after I left my comment I was listening lol so where do you put the 15 in the mix between these two do you think it's better than the Zen? you didn't want to commit to say but hinted I feel 15 was better.@@soundmatters
No worries. Yea, I love Michael’s products, for sure. I think it’s a bit of an unfair comparison with the 15 in particular as it’s simply meant as a MM only phono stage. Plus it’s more expensive and only does MM at the same time. Sound and build quality alone though if we’re only considering MM, then yea, if I’m pushed I’d say the Spartan 15. Everyone’s taste and priorities are different though, some people just want a single box that’s affordable, sounds good, and has a clear upgrade cartridge path. So for that alone I think both the ZEN and the Mani have a place in the market
But I don't think we should be looking at MC here in this sort of price range it's a bit nonsensical, and I suppose down the line if you wanted to get an MC you could get a step up transformer for about 200 £@@soundmatters
@@soundmatters Still unavailable in the US for the most part. Mani 2 still on backorder on their website and I see one pop-up on Amazon but on an inflated price with shipping. Not Prime eligible.. But I got lucky and got a "like new" Zen Phono on Amazon for a little bit discount. As you said, the Ortofon Blue is a bit bright so the Ifi was more ideal in my opinion rather than the Schiit. I was suprised to distinctly hear more separation and detail on the instruments compared to my previous Pro-Ject Phono MM. Aslo, the biggest change was when I listen to Andeas Vollenweider and crank it up, before the crystals "crashes"! Now, wow they shimmer, beautifully, no harshness and more detail but not too much.
@@DanClapp Not sure if I just got lucky but if you frequent Amazon and don't mind "like new" or "open box", you might get one at a discount and sounds the same as new. I got mine $20 off and with still the original warranty and no hint of being used at all.
Thanks for watching! 🎶🎧 Do drop your comments and questions below. If you'd like to support the channel, check the video description for many DISCOUNT CODES codes to enjoy money off various products and feed your vinyl habit! (I earn a small commission - no additional cost to you). Thank you for your support!
So it is a paid review. I had the feeling it was. There was so much left out that should have been said. There is $100 difference in price and yet the more affordable has better specs. Not saying that iFi hasn't got it place being very different and different selling points. But it is less and shouldn't be more than Mani 2. Hifi seems to be very unregulated. But thanks for the review and discussion/debate that it will give.
@@paulboyce8537 - Not at all. I bought this preamp with my own money I'll have you know. The links in the description are an ongoing part of how I fund this channel, and there is certainly nothing wrong with that. If any brand "pays for a review" I'll be sure to let you know.
@@soundmattersWhat about the Project Phono Box S2 that is also under $300? And the iFi is now Phono 3
Been using my Zen Phono since 2021, still going strong!
Nice! Glad to hear it!
Just getting into hifi, pardon my lack of knowledge but that makes it sound like preamps don’t last that long? 😰
Happy iFi Zen phono user and I have tried so many stages, arguably the best MM phono stage under £500.
Glad to hear it! Thanks for watching
I ended up with the Zen Phono after having auditoned many others to couple with my Rega P3 + Benz Micro Gold MC cartridge. For the money it is truly excellent-around £500 in other makers' terms, no hiss oR noise as well. To get a serious step up in quality, for fun, i A/B this with a Rega Aria mk2. That area(approx £750-£950) is where one needs to aim to get a much better all round phono stage IMHO. A great review please keep thEm coming.
Thanks for sharing and your kind words. Enjoy the music 🎶🎧
Rocking an ifi zen phono here and sooo happy! Beautiful piece for the price
Enjoy! happy listening
Great review, Mark. I used the Zen Phono while using moving magnet cartridges with great results and a linear power supply made a big improvement too, irrespective of what ifi say about their fancy wall warts.
It also just about worked when I upgraded to moving coil, but it was clearly, and quite reasonably given the rest of the system, the weakest link. The lack of fine tuning on the interface means matching to MC cartridges is a bit hit and miss. But, hey, it’s a very inexpensive box in comparison to the cost of decent MC cart’s.
Thanks Mark! Interesting to hear about the linear power supply upgrades (something that was touched on in the Spartan 15 review of course).
I’m the same in that I agree I think it performs well with MC for the price. I think it would be unreasonable to expect miracles in all areas given the very low price.
Thanks for watching as always. 🎶🎧
Mucho gracias for a clear & highly informative comparison between 3 highly desirable units.
My pleasure! Thanks for watching 🎶🎧
I went on a bit of a phonostage safari last year. I started with the Zen Phono and wanted to see if I could improve its sound appreciably. I tried a Dynavector (forget the model), the Schiit (just for an apples to apples comparison), Musical Fidelity M1 ViNL, and a Lehmann Black Cube SE. In my experience, the only one that was appreciably better than the iFi was the Lehmann. And it was better in every conceivable way.
I have since moved to a “digital” phono preamp, the Pro-ject Phono Box DS2 USB. It accommodates two turntables (MM and/or MC) coverts the signal to digital, upsamples it to 192 kHz, and sends it out to my Naim DAC V1. It’s pretty great. Not as good as the Lehmann, but it works well for my use case. I still have my Zen Phono though. It’s the only one I kept because it’s a great affordable reference and it may come in handy someday.
Love your channel!
Thanks for sharing your experiences testing some different models. The Music Fidelity one is another on my list to try out. I’ll seek out the Lehmann too now you’ve said that.
Thanks for your kind words about the channel. Enjoy the music 🎶
Great review, I bought one of these a couple of years ago. At the time I used a trichord dino, which was a far more expensive product. I no longer own the dino! Ifi zen has almost no hiss, as you said, and better dynamics. It would be a great product if it cost £450, at the money it retails at it’s a bargain
Thanks for watching. Definitely very impressed for the money 🎶🎧
I had a Rega Fono and a Dino. Tried this + upgraded wall wart. Can't believe how good it was...sold the others. Just bigger, clearer, more fun.
Great review, Mark.
Thank you kindly. Enjoy the music
Thanks for the review! I’m looking into upgrading from the fosi audio tube phono stage and these are the two main contenders (ifi and mani2)! Any thoughts on which would be best with a goldring e3?
Thanks for watching. From what I know of the Goldring E3, it’s a slightly warmer sound than anything Ortofon produces.
It’s hard to say 100% which preamp is best as so much of this comes down to personal taste.
I found the Mani 2 a little harsh up top for my taste, which is why I prefer it with a warmer sounding cartridge. That said, some people like a more forward sound in that respect.
The ZEN is undoubtedly quieter in terms of the noise floor. Plus it has a more balanced sound in my opinion.
Hope that helps to some degree 🎶🎧👌
I would look at the E4 100£ more but it's worth it, you might get it for only £20 more if you buy it from a studio shop retailer. Have a look at the spartan 5 as well phonostage at 150£. If you're going between the mani and the Zen I would go for the Zen, they do make a more expensive phonostage what it's like I don't know! should be better at least it's got capacitance but you can buy RCA female to male capacitance adaptors of different sorts separately and they're not expensive or make your own.
I own both pre-amps as well as the Ortofon 2M Blue (and 3 other cartridges) I almost bought a Goldring E3 instead of the 2M Blue but since I already had the RED, I opted for the Blue when I saw it on sale about 6 months ago.
The Blue is bright but not harsh and offers a little better bottom end extension than the RED but I can't compare it directly to the Goldring, unfortunately.
But I can compare the Zen compared to the little Fosi tube phono stage, and it is light years more refined, more detailed and spacious. You're going to love it. From what I understand about the Mani2, it may well be a terrific match with the warmth of the Goldring E3, as it won't overly smooth your highs or bury the detail of the upper midrange. That's not to say that the Zen does that. It's just that because the Blue is a bit more lively up top and can sound harsh depending on your other components in your system (particularly your speakers and furnishings and placement in the room) it is probably a better match for a pre-amp that is slightly warmer compared to other options available. That would be the Zen.
It's really a coin toss, and there are no wrong answers...only some that might be more preferable to your ears and sensibilities. Good luck. I hope you find a happy marriage of your cartridge and pre-amp. 😁
Hello! Great choice on the Goldring E3! I had one for the last year or so until I got a new table and got a nice discount on the vm95ml which was a very easy switch since the table came with the 95e, the green one that comes with so many tables these days. Had I not gotten such a great price on the ml which gave me a chance to try something new and saved me from all the tedious work switching a cartridge often does, I would have gotten another E3 or possibly tried the E4 considering how impressed I am with the E3. I figure by now you’ve already made your choice, but I was going to say that the either choice would have sounded great. The Zen imo was a bit better. I had a mani 2 and upgraded to the zen phono and found it to be worth it. I’m now considering the phono 3. On a side note, if you use headphones at all, I can tell you that I recently got the Topping A70pro amp/preamp and it has taken my vinyl to a whole new level! It’s made the biggest difference of anything to date. It’s incredible and so satisfying to see a VU meter or the screens that shows the spectrum of sound frequencies changing in realtime, I can’t recall what the official name of the meter is but it’s wicked to see it in action with your vinyl. Just adds a sweet touch. Of course it wouldn’t matter if the sound was just mid, but I swear it has taken my vinyl experience to new heights. It’s not the first thing I think people would think of when looking for a headphone amp/preamp for their vinyl but it should be. What a discovery! I’m so happy with it. I hope you settled on a preamp you’re happy with and if you chose the Mani2 you might as well stay there unless you’re upgrading to something far more expensive. Now if you could sell it for a decent price and get a zen phono 3 it would probably be worth it, but I can’t tell you how much or if it’s significantly better just yet. Hopefully soon. I can without a doubt tell you that amp is a no brainer. Paired with the Hifiman Arya Stealth planar magnetic open back headphones, man, what a delight.
I just noticed a lot of hiss noise in my SCHITT Mani pre. Gain on the slider on the mixer all the way up. The mixer DOES NOT MAKE any electronic noise
Hi Mark! Great review of the Ifi zen! I enjoy watching your video's, they are very entertaining to watch! I do have a question, do you know how much milivolts the Zen can handle without sounding distorted? I have a Ortofon Concorde mkii club on my Technics SL-1200 which is 8mv and I know that's pretty. I do have the Technics connected to a Allen & Heath Xone 23c analog mixer on it's phono input but the phono sound pretty good but does not have the highest gain but that mixer is known for that, still a very very solid mixer, but I do want to upgrade with a regular higher quality phono preamp between the Technics and the Xone 23c, I have my eye's on the Ifi Zen phono preamp for a while now and I can't find any information online of a Concorde mkii club and the Zen combination anywhere as far as I have searched. I mostly listen to classic trance and those tracks are pretty loud anyway but they can benefit from a audio upgrade as well, and I have the original release of Jeff Wayne's War of the Worlds on vinyl too and it doesn't sound very loud with the Concorde and the Xone so if I want to experiment more with other genres on vinyl I want them to be pretty loud and clear too.
I'm sorry for this very long response for something that can be a easy and simple question, but I want to know if you maybe know if 8mv is good for something like the Zen phono preamp?
Thanks! Glad it helped. That is quite a hot output on the Concorde, so I see your concern. They don't actually state the max input, but I would hope it could handle that. One person who does state this figure is the guy behind the Spartan series (max input of 84mV rms at 1K):
michaelfidler.com/products/spartan/spartan-5-moving-magnet-phono-stage/
very good review. thanks. have you tried setting both to 48db gain with MM cartridges ? Just curious to know how both will behave in my setup at that gain. thanks
I have a Mani 2 currently with an Orotdon 2m Blue. I was thinking of upgrading to the Zen Phono or possibly the Pro-Ject Phono Box DS2 (which I saw you also reviewed). Would you say the the DS2 is worth the extra $150? Thank you.
The Phono Box sounds flatter to my ears than the Mani, which is a little more lively in the bass frequencies. Switching to MC is obviously easier with the Pro-Ject too, but the unit is also much bigger. So I think it depends on what you're looking for/space/personal preference. Hope this helps
Thanks so much. I think at this point I'm looking for a cleaner, more transparent sound with wider sound stage. Hoping the Pro-Ject could provide that.
I would read reviews specific to your cartridge. Specifically I found Mani 2 does not sound great with your blue. You may not need an upgrade but a horizontal change over to this and may have success. The Mani 2 resells for damn near full price on the secondary market
On your Mani 2 video you were talking a bit of the specs. But here I do not see anything about the iFi to compare? If there is a comparison it should start from the specs and what it can and can't as both are very different and directed to different use between MC/MM. Then see if the paper values transfer to the real world with a good sound quality. Why I make a big fuss about specs is for example 110pF vs 200pF and DC 5V / 500mA vs 16VAC /1A. There is a huge difference just in these two specs that will decide what cartridge you can amplify well. One is more towards MC and other works better on MM cartridges.
Mani 2 (US$149)
Gain 1 = L, Gain 2 = L (Decca Mode)
Gain: 33dB
THD: 108dB, A-weighted, ref 2V RMS
Crosstalk: -90dB, 20-20kHz
Sensitivity: 5.3mV for 300mV output
Overload Margin: >20dB
Gain 1 = L, Gain 2 = H (Standard MM Mode)
Gain: 42dB
THD: 98dB, A-weighted, ref 2V RMS
Crosstalk: -90dB, 20-20kHz
Sensitivity: 1.9mV for 300mV output
Overload Margin: >20dB
Gain 1 = H, Gain 2 = L (Low Output MM/High Output MC Mode)
Gain: 48dB
THD: 96dB, A-weighted, ref 2V RMS
Crosstalk: -80dB, 20-20kHz
Sensitivity: 1.06mV for 300mV output
Overload Margin: >20dB
Gain 1 = H, Gain 2 = H (MC Mode)
Gain: 60dB
THD: 87dB, A-weighted, ref 2V RMS
Crosstalk: -75dB, 20-20kHz
Sensitivity: 0.33mV for 300mV output
Overload Margin: >20dB
Input Loading:
Selectable R: 47KΩ, 200Ω, 47Ω, or 38Ω
Selectable C: 47pF, 100pF, 150pF, or 200pF
RIAA Accuracy: +/- 0.2dB, 20-20kHz
Low Frequency Filter: 6dB/octave or 12dB/octave at 15 Hz, fully passive
Output Impedance: 75 ohms
Topology: Fully passive RIAA network with OPA1612 gain stages, OP07 DC servo, switchable passive CR LF filter, 1- or 2- pole, 0.1% thin-film resistors, and 2% film capacitors
Power Supply: “wall wart” style 16VAC transformer, dual-filtered, regulated +/- 16V rails
Power Consumption: 4W
Size: 5 x 3.5 x 1.25”
Weight: 1 lb
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is iFi ZEN Phono specs.
iFi ZEN Phono (GBP199.00/US$250)
Gain settings MC (v lo)@
MC (lo)
MC (hi)
MM 72dB (+/- 1dB)
60dB (+/- 1dB)
48dB (+/- 1dB)
36dB (+/- 1dB)
AI Sub-sonic filter Remedies only the 'warp' in LPs No negative impact to bass response
Max Output Voltage (RMS) 20v RMS bal output into 100k (< 1% THD & N)
13.5V RMS bal output into 600R (< 1% THD & N)
Output Impedance: BAL
SE 200 Ohm resistive
100 Ohm resistive
Input impedance MM: 47K Ohms (Load: 110pF)
MC High: 47K Ohms
MC Low: 1K Ohms
MC V Low: 110 Ohms
Signal/Noise Ratio: 94dB(A) MM re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
80dB(unweighted 80kHz BW) MM re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
84dB(A) MC Hi re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
71dB(unweighted 80kHz BW) MM re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
90dB(A) MC lo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
79dB(unweighted 80kHz BW) MC lo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
79dB(A) MC vlo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
69dB(unweighted 80kHz BW) MC vlo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
EIN (equivalent input noise): 0.6nV|/Hz (unweighted) MC lo/vlo
6.5nV|/Hz (unweighted) MM/MC hi -151dBV (A weighted)
-141dBV (unweighted)
-130dBV (A weighted)
-119dBV (unweighted)
Harmonic Distortion: < -110dB / 0.0003% MM re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
< -80dB / 0.01% MC lo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
< -86dB / 0.005% MC vlo re 2V BAL/1V UNBAL
Dimensions 160(l) x 113(w) x 35(h) mm
6.3" x 4.4" x 1.4"
Power Supply: DC 5V / 500mA
Net weight: 515g (1.14 Ibs)
Warranty: 12 months
Wow! So I've been shopping and have no idea what any of that means but am leaning Mani 2 for my om10 stylus (mm) on a Fluance Rt82
@@Pkilla80 Recommended load capacitance/pF for OM10 is 200-500pf. You can also upgrade the power supply to 16VAC 2.5A. Wiltronics Research Pty. Ltd.
Description
This 16VAC Desktop Power Supply with an alternating voltage of 2.5A has good insulation and high electrical resistance. Features short-circuit, over-current, overload, and over-voltage protection.
Low temperature and long service life.
Features
Linear transformer C-Core type
Low noise with No SMPS RF
Specifications
Volts16VAC
Size2.5mm
Current2500mA
TypeAC
I have the zen phono and zen air phono and l love them both.
Great! Glad to hear you’re enjoying them. 🎶🎧 enjoy the music and thanks for watching
I would love to see a review of the iFi Zen Phono 3
I think that’s the replacement model that just came out, right?
which ZEN are you talking about here??? Amazon has the iFi audio Zen 3 low noise PS is $328
iFi Zen phono: I think they've discontinued it sadly. New model out.
Yes the IFI Zen Phono is the pre i need, but now other component i ask Sound Matters, is the phono, wich one would you chose : The Rega RP3 aniversary, or the AVID Ingenium with rega arm? the first one 1.000€ and the second 1.500€?
The AVID deck I haven't tried I'm afraid: seems good though. Less surface area for the plinth should be good for resonance avoidance. The RP3 is a classic though. Both good options, perhaps it just depends on your budget and taste. If you can get the chance to play with one in the flesh and hear a demo, even better. Hope this helps
Hi Marc sorry to bother you but i had made my mind up on the ifi zen audio but here in the uk they have just lowered the cambridge alva duo to £199 from £299 i suppose there must be a new model coming im wondering if thats worth a punt or stick with the ifi ?
No worries at all. The Alva Duo is on my list to review. But I can’t comment from direct experience on this I’m afraid. It’s supposed to be good though; works with both MM & MC of course. The auto-off power saving function is a nice touch also
@@soundmatters thank you Marc it was normally £299.99 but they have just cut the price to £199 the websites say for a short time only but I’m thinking they may have an updated model coming out soon so £199 seems like a really good deal for a pre amp with a subsonic filter a headphone socket and as you said auto power off. Thanks Marc appreciate your view and I will look forward to your review. Cheers
@@Danny.1.007 - yea, sounds like something new is coming :)
Do you listen to all three phono pres stacked like that? What better phono preamps have you listened to. Normally I don't ask about specific models but what have you listened to as a reference point?
What curve we're you using on the Moon, RIAA or IEC?
RIAA 🎶
It should be noted that different preamps sound better with different cartridges even with all the switches. For example the Mani 2 doesn't shine with the Blue but sounds great with my Ortofon 20
Agree. The Mani makes the 2M range sound rather TOO bright as they’re a bit brighter to begin with. It sounds great with a Nagaoka or my Shure M97xe though 🎶🎧 Happy listening
I noticed the same thing. My 2m Blue seems to have lost something with the Mani 2. However my Nagaoka 200-M comes to life.
Pls try the Pro-Ject Audio Design DS3-B phono stage with the RS2 phono power box
Thanks. I’ll speak to my contacts at Pro-Ject and see if I can get a loan for review 🎶🎧
I'm curious if you have heard anything new happening with the Zen Phono. I cannot find the Zen Phono anywhere for sale, everyone is out of stock. Do you know if they discontinued the Zen Phono or maybe coming out with a new model? It just seems odd to me that its almost like they pulled it from the market.
I have heard this from a few subscribers. There was some stock in the U.K. until recently and the US Amazon has been out of stock for at least a month or two it would seem. I suspect there must be a new model coming or maybe there are some supply chain issues. The Mani seems to be out of stock too, I’m thinking supply chain issues
@@soundmatters Thank you for your insight. the Mani was my other option so I'll just have to keep an eye out and be patient.
The ifi zen phono seems to be discontinued? I can’t find it anywhere in Singapore :/
Still seems on sale here in the UK and in the US. Perhaps it's a supply chain thing?
@@soundmatters That’s unfortunate for me. The only local authorised retailer told me it’s discontinued and wont be selling it anymore. Is the NAD PP 2e comparable to the ifi phono? Its the only one available
I run a set of klipsch r51pm (powered) could i run the zen with those by switching from phono to line on the klipsch?
Sorry for the slow reply here. The r51pm has a built in phono preamp. If you want to run the Zen, you need to switch the speakers to line. So yes, you're correct. Hope this helps!
I don't agree with just about anything you said I compared the Zen to the original Mani and the Mani beat it in every single way musically. I couldn't wait to ship the Zen back 😮 so disappointed 👎
Sound is very, very subjective. I’m not saying the Mani is a bad phono pre-amp, it’s just different and may suit different setups/personal taste better. At the end of the day, if you’re enjoying the way your system sounds, then that’s all that matters. Enjoy the the music 🎶
Should you compare it to the spartan 5 it's the same price, didn't you have a spartan 5 or the spartan 15? You've not got ít anymore Why? You can buy RCA female to male adaptors to change capacitance I thought ifi did sell them?? I know one company does or you can buy them from somebody else.
I’ve never heard the Spartan 5. I reviewed the Spartan 15 as mentioned briefly in this review. Judging from what I’ve seen of the 15 though, I’m sure the 5 is excellent 👌
I realise you said that after I left my comment I was listening lol
so where do you put the 15 in the mix between these two do you think it's better than the Zen? you didn't want to commit to say but hinted I feel 15 was better.@@soundmatters
No worries. Yea, I love Michael’s products, for sure. I think it’s a bit of an unfair comparison with the 15 in particular as it’s simply meant as a MM only phono stage.
Plus it’s more expensive and only does MM at the same time. Sound and build quality alone though if we’re only considering MM, then yea, if I’m pushed I’d say the Spartan 15.
Everyone’s taste and priorities are different though, some people just want a single box that’s affordable, sounds good, and has a clear upgrade cartridge path. So for that alone I think both the ZEN and the Mani have a place in the market
But I don't think we should be looking at MC here in this sort of price range it's a bit nonsensical, and I suppose down the line if you wanted to get an MC you could get a step up transformer for about 200 £@@soundmatters
I had the moon 110 not good send it back the same day got the pro ject ultra 500 the s2 ultra pro ject is the same
Interesting but I’ll stick with my trichord dino.
I bought one. Made an underwhelming difference connected to my Emotiva T1 w/ Klipsch Rp8000 and/or my 600m. Pretty much just takes up space.
Both seems to have disappeared from the face of the earth. :(
There must be some sort of supply issue. I can see the Zen on Amazon in the U.K. at least.
@@soundmatters Still unavailable in the US for the most part. Mani 2 still on backorder on their website and I see one pop-up on Amazon but on an inflated price with shipping. Not Prime eligible.. But I got lucky and got a "like new" Zen Phono on Amazon for a little bit discount. As you said, the Ortofon Blue is a bit bright so the Ifi was more ideal in my opinion rather than the Schiit. I was suprised to distinctly hear more separation and detail on the instruments compared to my previous Pro-Ject Phono MM. Aslo, the biggest change was when I listen to Andeas Vollenweider and crank it up, before the crystals "crashes"! Now, wow they shimmer, beautifully, no harshness and more detail but not too much.
For real, i want the ifi zen but it’s out of stock everywhere
@@DanClapp Not sure if I just got lucky but if you frequent Amazon and don't mind "like new" or "open box", you might get one at a discount and sounds the same as new. I got mine $20 off and with still the original warranty and no hint of being used at all.