Welding A Shaft Keyway and Carbide Precipitation
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ธ.ค. 2015
- visit the store for special deals goo.gl/mJkDww welding a keyway in a shaft is a common repair. sometimes the keyway gets worn out...or sometimes its oversized or mismachined.
here are a few tips for filling a keyway with weld. click here for a detailed article on this topic goo.gl/4dCACB - แนวปฏิบัติและการใช้ชีวิต
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jodi///u got me through school and you got me a job welding stainless...and now you are increasing my skill within my profession...THANK YOU MAN!!!!! you are THE SHIZZZZNIT!!!!! thank you yur videos sistain me...one day i will shake yur hand and buy you some beer brother thank you!!!!!
If you want to see some *real* carbide precipitation, take a look at some of my pulsejet engines which were made from 304 and 316 stainless. Running at over 900 deg C and exposed to combustion gases (high in carbon) they eventually suffer such a huge amount of precipitation that all you have left is a crumbly material which is mainly nickel and iron oxide. With 0.8mm (32 thou) stainless it only takes about 10 hours of constant use for this to happen. Incredibly interesting!
+xjet very! Is this a situation where titanium would be a preferred material?
I know it is resilient to heat input and impurity pickup in a variety of ways and wonder if this would be one of them.
I find the metallurgy and chemistry stuff quite interesting. I'd like to see more of that aspect covered in future videos, if possible.
Jody, great video! Most of what you talk about i already have a strong understanding of. This however was some thing i needed a more detailed description of. Please more of this, more advanced metallurgical information. I know a lot of people might not be interested, but the ones that are would benefit greatly from it.
A truly great welder knows and wants to learn all that stuff. Good comment man. I love learning about metals and what I do to them and how it effects them or defects thwm
+nicholas newcomb it really does get in your blood, welding, doesn't it?
Jody, I am not a welder... yet, but at nearly 60, I am going to learn. The real message I want to share is how much I learn every time I watch one of your videos. Thank you. Always interesting and informative. So easy to understand with the excellent explanations.
Jody - always a pleasure to listen to and watch your videos. Can't recall ever hearing a better or simpler explanation of Carbide Precipitation. Your videos have been deadly for teaching concepts to my welding students over the past few years. Helps me too, to remember things I'd learned some years ago and since forgotten.
haha breathe my friend as you have accomplished one more mission. thanks jody as always you are the man. this particular video is a gem and the comment section feels more and more like a community of shared knowledge. so happy to be here thanks to you and everyone commenting this topic. regards. pete
Very good video Jody! Carbide precipitation is a very miss understood thing and people think that all the colors that a stainless weld get are cool but in reality they can be detrimental to a weld ment. Glad you educate people about this stuff. You help me be the welder I'm learning to be today. I don't think I'd be doing so well in school without your videos helping me like they do. Keep it up and I hope one day I can make it down to Georgia and meet up and see some of those welds up close. Keep it up!
Carbide Precipitation !!!! wOw, WoW , Thanks tor the explanation, you have passed out many gems in your videos, but this , for me is one of the most useful, I got to go right now and deposit this in my Bank of Welding Knowledge. WOW!
This is why I keep watching your vids Jody! Little gems like this.Thank you! A+ vid
Hey Jody, Very good explanation about carbide precipitation, knowing that it is the amount of time at a high temperature that makes the difference is very helpfull. I do some stainless exhaust purifiers. they are only about 6" long so they heat up quite quickly. So this is the kind of info that is really important.
that second half was phenomenal jody. I'd love to see more content like that- the technical metallurgical stuff.
Great stuff Jody! In the early 80's, I did a lot of "crack repair" in the recirculating water lines in the GE nuclear power houses, these cracks were stress corrosion cracks. We welded pads over the top of the HAZ and old weld using Dimetrics machines. These were temporary repairs and the theory was the pad not only sealed the cracks, but shrunk the pipe to further reduce the intergranular crack size. Cheers!
Thank you Jodie love you're videos, always looking for new ones. Keep them coming.
I appreciate the more in depth stuff like this.
You clearly want to say more about a topic here and there and you're good at it.
"grain boundries" and metallic bonding in crystal structures are usually topics left for hard to find metallurgy books written for graduate students, and i've found it to be an incredibly steep learning curve, but every bit I can piece together always helps me.
Just saying, feel free to risk sounding like a know it all and drop these pearls for us. You'll get the occasional chemist throwing a tantrum in the comment section about your terms, but he/she'll get over it.
Thanks, Jodi!
Hey Jody . I used to work in a machine shop where building up shafts was a daily thing . I was taught to (whenever possible ) rotate the shaft and weld around it as it turned in order minimize uneven heat which could cause the shaft to pull one way or another. We didn't have the luxury of a tig welder so everything including stainless was done with stick.
Thanks for the video. your metalurgy lessons are always very helpful. Thanks.
jody your a very intelligent welder with knowledge in multi welding processes thanks for the educational videos
that was a very good explanation of what goes on with carbon and chromium in steel. i never realized this occurs, to such a degree, in the very low carbon stainless steels like the 300 series. the metaphors were very good, it's hard to come up with metaphors that are both understandable and not misleading in one way or another.
Thanks for that great metaphor on carbide precipitation. I feel it was really useful for explaining to others.
Thank you I'm learning a lot from your outstanding videos.
great video with a good description of the carbide precipitation problem.
Great video, especially the explanation of a controversial technique - which is the simplest solution for those who know. Thanks!
Thanks Jody - another great video of tips and technique.
I enjoyed that lesson at the end. Very interesting. Thanks for that .
-Pidge
Thank you Jody for the great explanation.
Spot on about carbide precipitation and intergranular corrosion. The 321 and 347 grades are specifically alloyed with an amount of titanium or niobium, which at elevated temperatures preferentially combines with the carbon, leaving the metallic chromium intact. This makes them resistant to carbide precipitation for high temperature service.
+jonathanrabbitt This should be bumped for more people to read. It is however at a cost to get these materials.
+jonathanrabbitt You see those materials often for turbocharged exhaust headers and exhaust piping. The only better option seems to be inconel.
+EchoSixMike Yes. Typical for continuous high temperature service. Carbide precipitation requires a combination of high temperature and time. Higher the temperature, the quicker the carbide precipitation happens. There is a threshold temperature of sorts (~500C, 950F), although the phenomena really follows a temperature-time curve. This is why Jody emphasizes the interpass cooling to prevent precipitation in the HAZ (for non-stabilized grades). Rectification of bad heating requires further heating; way, way hotter; to redissolve the carbide.
My experience has been in gas plant waste heat recovery heat-exchangers; but common for aviation exhaust systems (continuous high temperature) or auto racing/turbocharged systems (likewise).
+jonathanrabbitt I've used 309S for turbo exhaust manifolds on high temp applications. Been considering some of the other high temp materials too. 317 or 314, can't remember from the top of my head.. but 309S has worked like a charm.
309 and 309S have waaay more Chromium than 304 and 316 which compensates for Cr depletion from carbide precipitation; but at the cost of significantly reduced yield strength.
If it works, that's good. Best to know why it works, tho', so you can avoid situations when it doesn't.
310H is another alloy, which has better high-temp strength. I've used it in the past for fired heater coil hangers, as an alternative to more expensive Inconels.
Brick and mortar. Excellent explanation!
Excellent video. Thank you so much for sharing!
Awesome explanation on carbide precipitation
Great video, very in depth. thanks.
Great Video, thanks for the explanation of carbide precipitation.
Another great video! Look forward to Wednesdays.
Haha like the breath at the end and the mortar eating termites!! Great channel thank you
That was a great explanation, thanks! More of this please.
great info Jodi! Thanks again!
Thumbs weldingtipssandtricks Amazing channel
In school people said stuff that made me think it is scary to weld stainless. Then I asked the guys at work who make food grade conveyors about over heating stainless, but they didn't think it was a problem. It was confusing, and it made me apprehensive about welding stainless. But now I think I understand. Now it seems simple, and easy to avoid.
I've learned a lot watching your videos..... thank you.... Must be some super awesome welders out there to give you a thumbs down.
Jody your vids are the best!! Thanks 100x. vRequest - Tube to thicker bar with TIG. It was sensible at the time, and pretty difficult! I did it to reinforce a tube buried in ground for railing. I had 16ga 3/4" tube and .325 x 3/4" bar. Mine's ugly but functional just curious your thoughts and solution. Email if you want pics of how not to do it
Thanks for another good one Jody.
thanks for another great lesson ...
you're the coolest dude jodi!
Excellent video, Jody. I'd like to point out a problem area that you might be able to make a video and point out some issues and techniques. Namely, worn engine camshafts. Often they are made from not-that-good cast iron and there's several problems. 1: they have lived in oil for decades and behave like oil sponges. 2. you can't just weld it like steel, heat cracking and warping is a real issue. 3. On many of the build-ups I have done on worn cam lobes, the material cracks after short term use, even using a hard-facing rod for the final welds, so it would have a really hard wear face. Any pointers on how you would handle things like this would be very appreciated. :)
and yet another great video from Jody. thank you brother. I was waiting all the way till the end of the video for the "shameless plug" hahahahaha. by the way i ordered a tig finger XL and loved it. thanks again.
next time Im welding stainless I'll give it a go, thanks for the tip.
hey. i was wondering if you knew about any tig rods that i can use to add a really hard surface too a Steel plate so it can be used for crushing and other similar applications
I watched the Keith Fenner video you linked us viewers to and he did a pre-heat on that shaft and then commenced to stick weld away, so I'm assuming that the part got fairly hot. Is there any danger of the carbide precipitation in the beads on that particular job?
Hey Jodi how would like to be welding inside a SS flume that had brine for cheese production in it just an hour prior. I worked for a cheese manufacturer. And we usually had a short hour window to weld cracks and damage to many machines and the flume which was several hundred feet long made of 316 SS would go from 20 degrees to over 102 after shut down and cleaning cycle. It would expand and contract over and over and develop cracks that we had to address. Never could seem to get the SS free of the salt from brine used in the process. And welding while my head is in flume and feet upwards.
Thanks great info
We have a cam shaft in the shop from a large diesel , it has a bad journal I was wondering if I could tig it up and regrind the journal , if the heat is controlled ? I think the material is 8620 , but not sure . would a general purpose filler rod work?
Excellent.
Thanks Jody
That furick cup is the absolute best I've ever used. Don't use it much because I believe it's a gas hog compared to what else is available. Wish I could use it all the time
hey man big fan of yours I had question for you is it worth while to pad beads with out a filler rod oned handed of course. I ran out and can't afford to buy more for a while but I still need to practice I guess the question is am I just wasting my gas
Jesse Perkins make some tig filler out of mig wire,i seen jodi do in a video with great results.
thanks for sharing :)
Do you ever use 303 grade of Stainless Steel for shaft build up?
I noticed all the beads were run from the end of the shaft in. Was there a reason for this? I would think there would be less distortion if it was a mix of some in to out and some out to in. Or is that not the case?
thanks j!
In welding up a worn shaft in general what bead layout is preferable and which should be avoided?
Concentric rings?
A spiral bead?
Along the length like shown here?
I have a 3/4" axle shaft that the wear area, maybe 2 inches long, stops a few inches from the wheel hub. What method (Mig or Tig) and direction will minimize warpage at the end of the shaft?
+Eddie the Grouch
I'm not a machinist or a welder, but for some reason I watch these videos. I've recently seen a video from abom79 where he did a repair like that. He made concentric rings and spirals with a stick welder. If I had to guess rings/spirals should be much better for warpage than lengthwise beads.
But I'm interested in a "pro" answer as well.
+Eddie the Grouch His last video is a shaft build up, check it out.
+Eddie the Grouch shaft build up can be done using either longitudinal beads or transverse. I have seen it done both ways but if longitudinal beads are used on a large diameter shaft, rotating 180 degrees every few beads can help.
in my experience, mig will distort less than tig on a shaft. and peening each bead with a ball peen hammer can minimize the uneven shrinking. keith fenner is an expert and you can see one of his shaft repair vids here th-cam.com/video/EtbP-h_-1hI/w-d-xo.htmlm22s
Thank Youuu!!!!!!!
I just started welding tig welding recently, probably like a week ago. I find it very difficult. I thought it was going to be similar to oxy fuel acetylene but it's completely different. Anyone have any beginner tips for me ? What I really mess up on is feeding the wire into the puddle at the right time, & feeding it evenly. My instructor tells me to wait for a puddle, insert the rod, and then move over a little bit and repeat.
can you do a series for hard facing parts with stellite filler. thanks jody.
chris Stellite is great stuff. Unless you have to repair it
I was told you can't wire brush stainless steel right after welding cause it wont remove all the heat tint and other stuff off. AT what time is it the best time to wire brrush stainless steel after welding.
that makes sense
Wicked
n7ce
Exactly what I say to the rookies. If you only THINK you have enough add more
People always look at me like i'm insane when I tell them one way to keep their interpass temps low when welding 300 series stainless is to cool it with water rather than waiting 45 minutes for the weld to cool down to 250F.
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