I laughed so hard that I almost fell down and hit my head when he said "heck, if you think you can get any valve spring that's actually any good for $35, you have fell down and hit your head". No truer words have ever been spoken! I like these videos very much!
@@DanielJohnson-ec8rk Not at all. I like the flow of the way he talks and accentuates instead of making an entire sentence sound like one long word. I don't want to distract from the true value in this video, but I just felt the need to clarify that point.
I've been working on engines since I started as a kid in the back yard with my Grandpa and my Uncles. Your channel popped up in my feed about a week ago and it's quickly become one of my favorites - I've found a lot of solid information here from a knowledgeable industry guy who's also got a good sense of humor. Keep the great content coming sir! New subscriber from Augusta, Georgia.
$35 . . . . $20 of it is for shipping , $10 of it is for packaging , $4 is profit , and $1 is what it actually cost to make those horrible valve springs. Would you mind it if I shared this video on my Gab-Gearheads channel? I'll be sure to leave proper credits and links.
You really don't know what you are buying these days. When Crane Cams were still in business I ran the same spring on my BBC solid lifter cam. I ran that spring which was a dual spring which was the spring that ran on all BBC cams up to 580 lift or so. I forgot the part number but still have a brand new set in a there crane box. Part number on the box of new springs are 99893-16. I still have 3 BBC engines with these on them. Ran them springs for over 30 to 40 years ago years and never had a problem. They seem to last forever. I bought there cam kits which were great kits. I still have the springs on my street BBC which has been on there for close to 40 years and it still goes to 7,000 rpm on the factory valves which are heavy. Made in the USA doesn't mean much if they buy the steel from some were else. What a mess we have today. Comp Cams bought out by Edelbrock. Wonder what will happen there? You really need to buy from a good machine shop that is in the know now days like Powell.
One thing people need to realize about racing, the reason so many hi rpm racing engines DO NOT BLOW UP in high level racing is because the care taken in the valve train. When they started Xraying the valve springs to check for tiny defects the number of broken valve springs fell drastically. Valve Springs were the least expensive part in an engine, for many years costing less than $100. I think a high end set of xrayed springs runs maybe $500. IT IS $500 WELL SPENT!
I actually very recently saw a broken Pac spring,, same as you it had been coil bound. Wrong spring for the application. Worse it was a name engine builder. The other 15 still measured ok but showed where the coils had been binding. I also saw some retainers that came with a set of springs and some where machined to big to nestle in the springs. Amatuer though at least he picked it after a valve train check before it was driven
The Chinese springs do not appeared to be shot peened. PAC springs are shot peened aren't they? I remember I broke a Manley spring in my LS1,luckily valve did not drop, but engine ran like crap. I now know what a broken valve spring sounds like, before it finally drops.
Brand new Canuck sub Love your honesty and ability to explain what I have always considered extremely complicated mechanical systems in a way that I can understand Shalom
Back in the year 2002, i remember when the Compcams 918 springs were supposedly breaking. There were a few complaints on the LS forums. I have used Comps lower tension 915 beehive spring with good success on a 224/226 570 lift cam.
Called summit ordered Edelbrock cam kit.... Wat came n the Edelbrock box ⁉️⁉️⁉️⁉️ A comp cam n Edelbrock springs....😶🤷 Through w m.... N they rite up da road🤦
Basically the Valve spring in my opinion is one of if not the hardest working part in the motor...$35 for valve springs what the 😂? If you know anything about engines wouldn't you honestly think to stay away from that junk..Sorry mate I'm a fan of and use PSI springs, I'm watching from Australia and love your channel and videos keep up the great work 👍
Me again, i'm a sub'r to Weingartner Racing, he' s a cyl head dude, if u dont already know...PAC springs are supossed to be the bad ass mf rite now, he tests alot of stuff, he likes PAC ... he's Seen issues, but dont make a concise vid like you.. ... .you put it to rest...TY SIR!!😊
We have changed from NexTek we used for years never had an issue now they break like crazy we call them post covid springs giving PSI a try to see how they hold up lot better visually than the New Nextek took 3 boxes just to find 18 and they where junk.
I’m not sure about NexTek, but PAC supposedly got bought out in 2022… I don’t know anything about the buyer, but what happens alot of the time in just about every manufacturing industry is that when a company is sold, they start cutting costs in one way or another. After seeing all these obviously fake PAC springs all over the internet, I recently got a set of PSI springs. Open the box and Fake garbage! I’m afraid there is more foreign LS parts that have flooded the market nowadays and some of the fake stuff is looking more and more real. But At the end of the day, I see more and more engines seemingly failing from parts failures than ever before.
Mmmmmmm,interesting,, put the Chinese Springs in the spring tester,set a pressure,,eg;130 at 1.800"...then go up and down 20 times.. check first pressure again.. they will probably be down..
ght a set of BBC aluminum winters casting heads used straight from the machine shop. Seller said they have Ferrea valves and PAC springs. Those springs look just like the chinese ones you showed in the video. I wondered how to tell for sure, good thing I never bolted the heads on. THANKS!!!!
The best thing the machine shops can do is just send away any customer who brings in this product. The only result is going to be the shop name being slung through the mud.
I don't want to sound old and cranky (I am) but who would think they can get the same quality for a fraction of the price? It CAN NOT be done. Who would be foolish enough to roll those dice? I hate learning the "hard" way. Also, the people working at Pac Racing Springs will keep their jobs if you buy their products. That in itself is why you should buy from them. They might return the favor some day.
Its worth noting the pink elephant in the room: giant, no limits, online resellers. They handle the listing, they handle the money, and sometimes a truck to truck transfer of goods. What they don't do generally speaking, is handle the merchandise: they've never seen it/don't want to - physical inventory takes up space, which induces bigger leases & insurance costs.
no idea why i got here but thats a damn good video man. i do have a four stroke dirt bike i might try to diy rebuilt, doesn't seem too hard. i like your shop and like your video. if i ever get to learn to rebuild an engine and i hope i do, this is good shit to know
Well, I'll have to look out for this. I wanna build a 1.8L Mazda BP next year. Not sure what valve springs I'll need but I sure will watch out for the signs
Great information to add to the cam and lifter problem. I only solved the cam and lifter problem with using DLC coated lifters. And it took 4 cams to get that far. I pulled a lot of metal out of the pan many times. I then had a head gasket go so I got a look at the lifters and cam after use. Each lifter on the cam face with the DLC looked like they came just out of the box new. The cam looked like someone had polished it. Steel does not touch the hardness of a diamond and since DLC is carbon based it is also slippery. When used in piston pins the coating never wears it is the underlying material which breaks. Use a DLC lifter with a new cam and forget having to go roller for your street motor. Obviously, materials and quality control went to hell concerning cams and lifters. Why should they care when they make so much more on every set when roller. Look at the difference in price along with needing new pushrods so they are the proper length.
Every engine I've rebuilt, over 500 of them, every single one of them I've placed magnets in them. I also place them in the transmission. They catch any and all metal debris.
Finally got hit recently with fake MOSFETs (comp audio amplifier) myself after years of making sure I don’t, last time I use a “distributor” vs going factory direct which I usually do, can’t trust shit lately …
I'm checking out your video from down the road in Spartanburg. I'm trying to figure out what valve springs to get for my 6.0 ls engine. Bought a cam that came with springs. Fb groups have been telling me not to use the springs. Some say to get springs with a .600 lift. What's the difference?
If you will warm people about procomp/speedmaster junk, they might listen to you. Richard Holdner praises their garbage in some of his videos. I've called him out on it before too. Standard response "I've never had any trouble out of them". Bull crap. I bet if he is using speedmaster junk, it's been worked over in an American machine shop.
guys buy the PAC springs, save the box, buy some cheap springs and put them in the box and sell them as new PAC springs. I have seen everybodys springs break but Isky and PAC
Few years ago I bought Pac 1218s off ebay. Came in the correct box, but came with used ls6 springs. So I ordered a second set off amazon and those were good but double the price
Same problem with roller lifters on Ebay they are advertising BTR and Delphi roller lifters for 1/3 the price of the real thing and people buy them. It's alot of $$$ to R&R an engine to save a few $$$ in parts.
If a person had to develop for themselves the information you give away it would take years and cost a canoe fulla money. A person only needs to be smart enough to look, listen, and think. I enjoy your videos and always learn something, many thanks. If you were local I'd swing by and sweep your shop.
Lmao he said “ this is your wong fu puu” 1218 lmao 🤣 ohh shit i died lol and then he said “you have fell down and hit Your head” if you think You can get American made pac springs for 35$ oohhh man after this video and your valve seat video and another I forget oh the ebay crooks video im subbing outta you being real knowing your shit and dudes funny as hell lol
This is why I buy bare heads and put quality hardware on them. See so much stuff broke due to cheap stuff that some of the head manufacturers not all put on them. I was told by a guy that I spend to much money buying bare heads but like you said pay now or pay later either way you are going to pay.
So basically just have a little bit of common sense and if its too good to be true its not lol. I always order directly from the manufacturer or authorized dealer no matter what I am buying. People spend tons of money building an engine then what to buy $35 valve springs to save a few dollars, it completely blows my mind. 🇺🇸
If raw materials are shipped to a fabricator in China who then manufactures a part, (in this case a spring), then that part is packaged a shipped around the world to the US, then processed and shipped to your door for $35 bucks, IT’S JUNK! Don’t buy. It!😊😊😊
Anyone who thinks they can get a good quality set of valve springs (one of the most important parts of their engine) for 30 or 40 bucks is out there in fantasy world.
Unfortunately many DIY keyboard warriors tend to badmouth products or manufacturers for some failures they themselves created mainly because they think they know more than they do and won't admit it. I have seen this with all sorts of things from engines and engine parts, computer parts, boat parts, and on and on. I don't put a lot of stock in those customer reviews with stars or thumbs or any of the chat room talk. I actually have products that the reviews overwhelmingly denounce but I have personally been using nearly daily for many years with good results.
A guy Ben, He said a very funny phase, the other day. Regarding exhaust lobe design and the valve not deaccelerating to the seat it time. he said," I hope they don't go to the moon because they are not coming back !". Very funny just slipped into a half hour chat.
I'm more cautious than ever. It's scary. Daniel, thanks for educating us. Here in South Africa we pay 20 times the USD value plus shipping and we still get ripped off. You tell it like it is and that's why we all respect you and your opinions.
Thanks for posting video's i have a 347 stroker with dss pistons for boost im $14000 into machine shop cost first shop charged me $7,632 to build a 347 when i got the motor from them i had a typewriter for a valve tran and glitter in the oil with smoke coming out of the oil catch can filters. Had to take it to a different shop they looked it over and said it needed to be line honed and better lifters installed so they charged me $3,800. Got the motor back from them and i had to take it back to them do too noise in the valve tran and still getting glitter in the oil and smoke at the filters.i my need to send my motor to you if your willing to do the job
I sold hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of paper into china for many years, we were looking to have a large paper rewinder manufactured over there, our contact owned 30 companies in China, she FLAT OUT STATED that we would spec the machine they would manufacture the ones coming directly to my plant in the US to spec and they would be correct, but the first chance the chinese company had the opportunity they would cheapen the input materials and be out of spec. I would be lucky if the drop shipped goods were operable at all. She said when I go into a store I pick up a product, it says Made in China -I throw it down, TRASH,
My issue is, what's stopping that name-brand company from using their box, but putting physically identical springs (made in other countries, not just China) in their box? If they do this and lets say there's 1 box that failed out of 50, it's easy for them to say "oh must have been a bad batch". If they only paid 50% to make an identical product through "China", their profit margin goes through the roof...switching out their parts with Chinese parts (and its not just china). I've seen american made parts fail as well....packaged in a "Made in America" box. When it comes down to it, everything's a roll of the dice. As much as we Americans want to trust in American made products, and are raised to believe that....we can't. Every purchase is a chance we take, regardless of the packaging and how the product looks.
They are riding. Chinese production will dial in on a well known, well respected international/U.S. companies. Manufacture and sell cheap, barely passable goods. As the quality issues begin to surface, the blame falls on the company they impersonate. Their sales actually increase because of the negative press showered on the respected manufacturer. Add to that, an email, Facebook, X campaign sponsored by the Chinese producer and you've got yourself a marketing bomb. Email accounts are cheap. Until business people/builders like yourself, bring the truth to light...The interwebs run wild with inuendo and baseless accusations. Finally, one never knows if child labor is involve in this type of manufacture. Temu is being scrutinized over child labor accusations. Guessing you won't find a ten year old working at the Pac factory....
A few times customers declined 380$ PSI Beehive springs Claiming Ebay Pac springs are just as good. I just say no thank you and send them on the way. Not worth the effort and not worth the headache. They will figure it out the hard way
CRAP! I got a cam spring pushrods from BTR and the springs look just like those junk ones, even the crappy packing. Had them on shelf to long to return now. Son of A 😖
Counterfeit factory labeled parts Seriously Toyota Lexus copy parts in factory looking boxes, Gm, Ford ex its not just springs and the boxes look like OEM. Only way you can trust its OEM is buy from a reputable auto parts store or the dealership. If you use let's say a knock off oil filter it can cause serious motor damage. Its not even as good as an aftermarket brand.
In China their MFG laws are different and they don't care if they make sub standard parts. We here in the USA need to understand that our laws about products don't apply in China. Some US branded parts like lifters are made in China because the brand wants to save money by getting them made in China. I wish US companies still made their own parts.
When you open a box of Chinese valve springs it looks like a salvage yard reincarnate , 16 cars recycled , honda buick dodge etc etc , if your lucky you might springs made from old Honda crank
Steve Morris has had a few springs break in his SMX engines....and these are premium good stuff...but they've found that the methanol fuel puts a lot of moisture in the motors and if you don't run them up to temperature with gasoline to drive out this moisture they springs will rust. Every one that broke did so at a rust spot that had penetrated enough to weaken them. I agree that the Chinese CAN make good stuff and have had a few positive dealings with them, but always remember that there are deceitful businessmen over there that will change materials to make more profit especially if they don't think you'll notice. They have lots of buildings falling down because they were built with substandard materials so the owner could make more money and I think this trend is going in the wrong direction rather than getting better as their economy is failing badly.
@@powellmachineinc I didn't buy a dirt cheap set, I paid 200.00 for the set but I'm checking them before I run it any more. I'll get ahold of you in the future, I trust you.
Dang i have a pair of speedmaster heads that came with spings that have been said to fail on reviews. Now im thinking maybe i should have taken the advice of changing them but was just content with the 202 values.
People read a comment online, take it’s as fact then Everytime they hear someone ask for help with a problem they are having they use that information from the comment they read to diagnose the issue. Never even knowing anything about the topic at hand. Then you have the others that read the comments and see most of the comments are making a specific diagnosis then he will comment that same diagnosis to make people think he knows something. I see some of the absolute worst diagnosis in reading comments every single day. And these people asking for help don’t even realize they are getting terrible information. It blows my mind.
Can't you just stretch that short one out a little bit? 😮 They probably dip them in used oil after heating them, that's where the nice dark patina comes from. Joe
I bet the dark ones are super soft man in comparison purple black usually means soft the harder the heat treat usually the lighter the color will be so they went super deep into the temper to try and make them last a min lmao just a theory about the ramen noodles
I laughed so hard that I almost fell down and hit my head when he said "heck, if you think you can get any valve spring that's actually any good for $35, you have fell down and hit your head". No truer words have ever been spoken! I like these videos very much!
Glad you enjoyed!
@powellmachineinc3179 happy Thanksgiving to you and your family
ROFL!!! My wife and I too!! ha ha ha!!
Did you laugh for same reason I did? Because of the unbelievable southern draw?
@@DanielJohnson-ec8rk
Not at all. I like the flow of the way he talks and accentuates instead of making an entire sentence sound like one long word.
I don't want to distract from the true value in this video, but I just felt the need to clarify that point.
If the springs are black...send 'em back !
Informative as always.
Kudos to Andrew for the steady video work !👍👍
Ty! I will tell him
"They don't have a dog in the hunt"! Utter gold. Never a truer world spoken. Love it.
I've been working on engines since I started as a kid in the back yard with my Grandpa and my Uncles. Your channel popped up in my feed about a week ago and it's quickly become one of my favorites - I've found a lot of solid information here from a knowledgeable industry guy who's also got a good sense of humor.
Keep the great content coming sir!
New subscriber from Augusta, Georgia.
Thank, we really appreciate you!
$35 . . . . $20 of it is for shipping , $10 of it is for packaging , $4 is profit , and $1 is what it actually cost to make those horrible valve springs.
Would you mind it if I shared this video on my Gab-Gearheads channel? I'll be sure to leave proper credits and links.
Absolutely, share away!
Are we talking 35$ per spring or for all of them?
@@Birb_of_Judge a set
@@powellmachineinc holy crap. That's absolutely nothing
I had a friend that raced in a class. They changed the PAC springs ever 3 races so i would buy all the pulls. 99% were still like new.
that height difference between the fakes and the real pac is unreal! spring pressures must be way outta wack too eh?
Absolutely
You really don't know what you are buying these days. When Crane Cams were still in business I ran the same spring on my BBC solid lifter cam. I ran that spring which was a dual spring which was the spring that ran on all BBC cams up to 580 lift or so. I forgot the part number but still have a brand new set in a there crane box. Part number on the box of new springs are 99893-16. I still have 3 BBC engines with these on them. Ran them springs for over 30 to 40 years ago years and never had a problem. They seem to last forever. I bought there cam kits which were great kits. I still have the springs on my street BBC which has been on there for close to 40 years and it still goes to 7,000 rpm on the factory valves which are heavy. Made in the USA doesn't mean much if they buy the steel from some were else. What a mess we have today. Comp Cams bought out by Edelbrock. Wonder what will happen there? You really need to buy from a good machine shop that is in the know now days like Powell.
Thank you!!
This, sir, is common sense. To bad it is uncommon.
I am a diesel mechanic, however, I enjoy this channel.
They package them loose because the box peening is part of the finish process.
Lol, good one
Needs to go around the world a few times
One thing people need to realize about racing, the reason so many hi rpm racing engines DO NOT BLOW UP in high level racing is because the care taken in the valve train. When they started Xraying the valve springs to check for tiny defects the number of broken valve springs fell drastically. Valve Springs were the least expensive part in an engine, for many years costing less than $100.
I think a high end set of xrayed springs runs maybe $500. IT IS $500 WELL SPENT!
Hey Daniel,
Tim here, THIS is why i'm a proud sub'r, THIS is why MORE folks need to sub, GREAT content!!!.....yep....HAPPY THANKGIVING sir!!!.....
Thanks, you too!
So, your genuine personality and your purposeful love for machining has won me over. Where do I send my parts for for machining?
Upstate SC
"heck, if you think you can get any valve spring that's actually any good for $35, you have fell down and hit your head"
i fucking love this guy lol
Lol, ty
Love that comment 😂😂
Been stung a few times as l was in a hurry and learnt the hard way too
Expensive lessons
Sir, I'm Australian, I can listen to you talk for ages. Thank you for the breakdown comparison.
Awesome, glad to have you
I actually very recently saw a broken Pac spring,, same as you it had been coil bound. Wrong spring for the application. Worse it was a name engine builder. The other 15 still measured ok but showed where the coils had been binding.
I also saw some retainers that came with a set of springs and some where machined to big to nestle in the springs. Amatuer though at least he picked it after a valve train check before it was driven
Good that it was caught before a disaster
The Chinese springs do not appeared to be shot peened. PAC springs are shot peened aren't they? I remember I broke a Manley spring in my LS1,luckily valve did not drop, but engine ran like crap. I now know what a broken valve spring sounds like, before it finally drops.
Yep, definitely
Brand new Canuck sub
Love your honesty and ability to explain what I have always considered extremely complicated mechanical systems in a way that I can understand
Shalom
Welcome aboard!!
I remember the last video you posted about those delicately made China springs. Happy Thanksgiving 🦃 Everyone 😊
Absolutely
Back in the year 2002, i remember when the Compcams 918 springs were supposedly breaking. There were a few complaints on the LS forums. I have used Comps lower tension 915 beehive spring with good success on a 224/226 570 lift cam.
Dude been loving your videos.... I been out of the engine world for a spell. It feels good to be back...
Called summit ordered Edelbrock cam kit....
Wat came n the Edelbrock box ⁉️⁉️⁉️⁉️
A comp cam n Edelbrock springs....😶🤷
Through w m.... N they rite up da road🤦
Edelbrock has never manufactured a cam,lifters or spring's in there career, just reboxed
Basically the Valve spring in my opinion is one of if not the hardest working part in the motor...$35 for valve springs what the 😂? If you know anything about engines wouldn't you honestly think to stay away from that junk..Sorry mate I'm a fan of and use PSI springs, I'm watching from Australia and love your channel and videos keep up the great work 👍
Definitely
Me again, i'm a sub'r to Weingartner Racing, he' s a cyl head dude, if u dont already know...PAC springs are supossed to be the bad ass mf rite now, he tests alot of stuff, he likes PAC ... he's Seen issues, but dont make a concise vid like you.. ... .you put it to rest...TY SIR!!😊
💯
Building an engine isn’t cheap. Do it once by doing correctly.
💯
That doesn't always happen. Especially in any engine that's modified.
Unless you straight across copy a crate engine.
We have changed from NexTek we used for years never had an issue now they break like crazy we call them post covid springs giving PSI a try to see how they hold up lot better visually than the New Nextek took 3 boxes just to find 18 and they where junk.
Wow
I’m not sure about NexTek, but PAC supposedly got bought out in 2022… I don’t know anything about the buyer, but what happens alot of the time in just about every manufacturing industry is that when a company is sold, they start cutting costs in one way or another.
After seeing all these obviously fake PAC springs all over the internet, I recently got a set of PSI springs. Open the box and Fake garbage!
I’m afraid there is more foreign LS parts that have flooded the market nowadays and some of the fake stuff is looking more and more real. But At the end of the day, I see more and more engines seemingly failing from parts failures than ever before.
Just found your channel and glad i did. Great information. Seem like a hard workin dude with alot of Knowledge
TYVM
Another awesome informative video
Glad you enjoyed it
Mmmmmmm,interesting,, put the Chinese Springs in the spring tester,set a pressure,,eg;130 at 1.800"...then go up and down 20 times.. check first pressure again.. they will probably be down..
Heat them in the oven. Then check them.
ght a set of BBC aluminum winters casting heads used straight from the machine shop. Seller said they have Ferrea valves and PAC springs. Those springs look just like the chinese ones you showed in the video. I wondered how to tell for sure, good thing I never bolted the heads on. THANKS!!!!
No problem
Best lifter to run is the ctsv 88958689 with the ceramic check. I’ve ran them to 8200 with .015 preload and 525 pounds over the nose.
The best thing the machine shops can do is just send away any customer who brings in this product. The only result is going to be the shop name being slung through the mud.
Lots of shops just don't know any better
It's a shame because PAC makes an excellent spring. I run the 1219X in my Ls6.
I don't want to sound old and cranky (I am) but who would think they can get the same quality for a fraction of the price? It CAN NOT be done. Who would be foolish enough to roll those dice? I hate learning the "hard" way. Also, the people working at Pac Racing Springs will keep their jobs if you buy their products. That in itself is why you should buy from them. They might return the favor some day.
Who you ask?....the welfare Ls crowd...
Its worth noting the pink elephant in the room: giant, no limits, online resellers. They handle the listing, they handle the money, and sometimes a truck to truck transfer of goods. What they don't do generally speaking, is handle the merchandise: they've never seen it/don't want to - physical inventory takes up space, which induces bigger leases & insurance costs.
We're too old and wise anymore to learn the hard way.
Put a magnet in every engine.
I have seen them like with a also china sloppy stage 2 cam for under $150 but wasn't sure about them
th-cam.com/video/PhyVb0dFK5c/w-d-xo.html
30 year mechanic here, It has killed the restoration trade for me. I can't do it anymore. All problems and no money.
There has to be copyright crap rite, the Chinese gotta not claim this garbage!!
I'm sure
no idea why i got here but thats a damn good video man. i do have a four stroke dirt bike i might try to diy rebuilt, doesn't seem too hard. i like your shop and like your video. if i ever get to learn to rebuild an engine and i hope i do, this is good shit to know
Absolutely!
I’d been floating on the fence about hitting subscribe but this video is what kicked my butt on over and all the way to the dinner table!!
Lol
Well, I'll have to look out for this.
I wanna build a 1.8L Mazda BP next year.
Not sure what valve springs I'll need but I sure will watch out for the signs
Great information to add to the cam and lifter problem. I only solved the cam and lifter problem with using DLC coated lifters. And it took 4 cams to get that far. I pulled a lot of metal out of the pan many times. I then had a head gasket go so I got a look at the lifters and cam after use. Each lifter on the cam face with the DLC looked like they came just out of the box new. The cam looked like someone had polished it. Steel does not touch the hardness of a diamond and since DLC is carbon based it is also slippery. When used in piston pins the coating never wears it is the underlying material which breaks. Use a DLC lifter with a new cam and forget having to go roller for your street motor. Obviously, materials and quality control went to hell concerning cams and lifters. Why should they care when they make so much more on every set when roller. Look at the difference in price along with needing new pushrods so they are the proper length.
Yup
Definitely
Looking into dlc myself for next build. What ra did they use/recommend for cam & lifters before coating?
Every engine I've rebuilt, over 500 of them, every single one of them I've placed magnets in them.
I also place them in the transmission.
They catch any and all metal debris.
That is pretty fascinating stuff mate, thank you for the insight and also to this channel 😊
Happy Thanksgiving Daniel to you and your family!
Same to you!
Blows my mind that people put any amount of trust in these valve springs of all things. 😂😂
No doubt
Wong Fu poo is a legendary comment
Finally got hit recently with fake MOSFETs (comp audio amplifier) myself after years of making sure I don’t, last time I use a “distributor” vs going factory direct which I usually do, can’t trust shit lately …
Facts
I'm checking out your video from down the road in Spartanburg. I'm trying to figure out what valve springs to get for my 6.0 ls engine. Bought a cam that came with springs. Fb groups have been telling me not to use the springs. Some say to get springs with a .600 lift. What's the difference?
If you want quality spring's and cams, go to our website
Powellmachineinc.com
If you will warm people about procomp/speedmaster junk, they might listen to you. Richard Holdner praises their garbage in some of his videos. I've called him out on it before too. Standard response "I've never had any trouble out of them". Bull crap. I bet if he is using speedmaster junk, it's been worked over in an American machine shop.
Kickbacks.....
Don't buy from jegs.
Instead...buy at Powellmachineinc.com
guys buy the PAC springs, save the box, buy some cheap springs and put them in the box and sell them as new PAC springs. I have seen everybodys springs break but Isky and PAC
That's exactly why I clearly showed the "visual " difference
Few years ago I bought Pac 1218s off ebay. Came in the correct box, but came with used ls6 springs. So I ordered a second set off amazon and those were good but double the price
Yep, always buy from a authorized dealer
Same problem with roller lifters on Ebay they are advertising BTR and Delphi roller lifters for 1/3 the price of the real thing and people buy them. It's alot of $$$ to R&R an engine to save a few $$$ in parts.
Yep and neither of those companies actually make a lifter....
If a person had to develop for themselves the information you give away it would take years and cost a canoe fulla money. A person only needs to be smart enough to look, listen, and think. I enjoy your videos and always learn something, many thanks. If you were local I'd swing by and sweep your shop.
@@roberthumphreys1316 lol, we really appreciate that 🙏
If you want to learn something new watch a couple of Mr. P's videos. I wish I had this material 10 years ago.
Tyvm, we try hard!
Lmao he said “ this is your wong fu puu” 1218 lmao 🤣 ohh shit i died lol and then he said “you have fell down and hit
Your head” if you think
You can get American made pac springs for 35$ oohhh man after this video and your valve seat video and another I forget oh the ebay crooks video im subbing outta you being real knowing your shit and dudes funny as hell lol
Glad to have u!!
This is why I buy bare heads and put quality hardware on them. See so much stuff broke due to cheap stuff that some of the head manufacturers not all put on them. I was told by a guy that I spend to much money buying bare heads but like you said pay now or pay later either way you are going to pay.
💯
So basically just have a little bit of common sense and if its too good to be true its not lol. I always order directly from the manufacturer or authorized dealer no matter what I am buying. People spend tons of money building an engine then what to buy $35 valve springs to save a few dollars, it completely blows my mind. 🇺🇸
If raw materials are shipped to a fabricator in China who then manufactures a part, (in this case a spring), then that part is packaged a shipped around the world to the US, then processed and shipped to your door for $35 bucks, IT’S JUNK! Don’t buy. It!😊😊😊
Years ago there were many pac springs breaking they had a run of issues for a while but its seemed to have been fixed
I have been a Pac distributor for 10 years, never seen any issues, 1 broke spring in to years and it wasn't a pac issue.
That’s why I spend the extra money and get my springs from Joe Hornick… psi springs only and always
Anyone who thinks they can get a good quality set of valve springs (one of the most important parts of their engine) for 30 or 40 bucks is out there in fantasy world.
Unfortunately many DIY keyboard warriors tend to badmouth products or manufacturers for some failures they themselves created mainly because they think they know more than they do and won't admit it. I have seen this with all sorts of things from engines and engine parts, computer parts, boat parts, and on and on. I don't put a lot of stock in those customer reviews with stars or thumbs or any of the chat room talk. I actually have products that the reviews overwhelmingly denounce but I have personally been using nearly daily for many years with good results.
Hang tight Dan pushrod deflection connections
I'm trying to hang loose right now, lol
Thanks Daniel!!
My pleasure!
A guy Ben, He said a very funny phase, the other day. Regarding exhaust lobe design and the valve not deaccelerating to the seat it time. he said," I hope they don't go to the moon because they are not coming back !". Very funny just slipped into a half hour chat.
I'm more cautious than ever. It's scary. Daniel, thanks for educating us. Here in South Africa we pay 20 times the USD value plus shipping and we still get ripped off. You tell it like it is and that's why we all respect you and your opinions.
Thank you!! We really appreciate that 🙏, we ship to south Africa fyi
@@powellmachineinc I sent you email but I know you're busy and I'm not in a rush. God Bless you Daniel.
thanks,,,new to your channel
Thanks for the sub!
Throw a hoodie on your Web Site and I’ll order a couple 👍
There on there
good info thanks
Absolutely
Appreciate this!
Absolutely
If its too great of a deal....apply common sense
But common sense isn't so common anymore
I can’t even believe someone would risk their motor with a set of Chinese valve springs.
Thanks for posting video's i have a 347 stroker with dss pistons for boost im $14000 into machine shop cost first shop charged me $7,632 to build a 347 when i got the motor from them i had a typewriter for a valve tran and glitter in the oil with smoke coming out of the oil catch can filters. Had to take it to a different shop they looked it over and said it needed to be line honed and better lifters installed so they charged me $3,800. Got the motor back from them and i had to take it back to them do too noise in the valve tran and still getting glitter in the oil and smoke at the filters.i my need to send my motor to you if your willing to do the job
Sure we do them often
@powellmachineinc3179 Thank you. I'm waiting for them to get back to me so I can see what I'm going to do
I died when he mocked the Chinese spelling!
Lol
No dog in the hunt............. Love it
I sold hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of paper into china for many years, we were looking to have a large paper rewinder manufactured over there, our contact owned 30 companies in China, she FLAT OUT STATED that we would spec the machine they would manufacture the ones coming directly to my plant in the US to spec and they would be correct, but the first chance the chinese company had the opportunity they would cheapen the input materials and be out of spec. I would be lucky if the drop shipped goods were operable at all.
She said when I go into a store I pick up a product, it says Made in China -I throw it down, TRASH,
Anyone crazy enough to think you can get a decent set of springs for $35 from anywhere much less Ebay almost deserves the outcome
IMO ALLEGEDLY
My issue is, what's stopping that name-brand company from using their box, but putting physically identical springs (made in other countries, not just China) in their box? If they do this and lets say there's 1 box that failed out of 50, it's easy for them to say "oh must have been a bad batch". If they only paid 50% to make an identical product through "China", their profit margin goes through the roof...switching out their parts with Chinese parts (and its not just china). I've seen american made parts fail as well....packaged in a "Made in America" box. When it comes down to it, everything's a roll of the dice. As much as we Americans want to trust in American made products, and are raised to believe that....we can't. Every purchase is a chance we take, regardless of the packaging and how the product looks.
They are riding. Chinese production will dial in on a well known, well respected international/U.S. companies. Manufacture and sell cheap, barely passable goods. As the quality issues begin to surface, the blame falls on the company they impersonate. Their sales actually increase because of the negative press showered on the respected manufacturer. Add to that, an email, Facebook, X campaign sponsored by the Chinese producer and you've got yourself a marketing bomb. Email accounts are cheap.
Until business people/builders like yourself, bring the truth to light...The interwebs run wild with inuendo and baseless accusations.
Finally, one never knows if child labor is involve in this type of manufacture. Temu is being scrutinized over child labor accusations. Guessing you won't find a ten year old working at the Pac factory....
A few times customers declined 380$ PSI Beehive springs Claiming Ebay Pac springs are just as good. I just say no thank you and send them on the way. Not worth the effort and not worth the headache. They will figure it out the hard way
Anyone who would take a chance on $35 valve springs deserves $35 valve springs.
CRAP! I got a cam spring pushrods from BTR and the springs look just like those junk ones, even the crappy packing. Had them on shelf to long to return now. Son of A 😖
Counterfeit factory labeled parts
Seriously Toyota Lexus copy parts in factory looking boxes, Gm, Ford ex its not just springs and the boxes look like OEM.
Only way you can trust its OEM is buy from a reputable auto parts store or the dealership.
If you use let's say a knock off oil filter it can cause serious motor damage. Its not even as good as an aftermarket brand.
In China their MFG laws are different and they don't care if they make sub standard parts.
We here in the USA need to understand that our laws about products don't apply in China.
Some US branded parts like lifters are made in China because the brand wants to save money by getting them made in China. I wish US companies still made their own parts.
When you open a box of Chinese valve springs it looks like a salvage yard reincarnate , 16 cars recycled , honda buick dodge etc etc , if your lucky you might springs made from old Honda crank
Steve Morris has had a few springs break in his SMX engines....and these are premium good stuff...but they've found that the methanol fuel puts a lot of moisture in the motors and if you don't run them up to temperature with gasoline to drive out this moisture they springs will rust. Every one that broke did so at a rust spot that had penetrated enough to weaken them.
I agree that the Chinese CAN make good stuff and have had a few positive dealings with them, but always remember that there are deceitful businessmen over there that will change materials to make more profit especially if they don't think you'll notice. They have lots of buildings falling down because they were built with substandard materials so the owner could make more money and I think this trend is going in the wrong direction rather than getting better as their economy is failing badly.
So, if LS motors are so so from the factory, how much for a long block from GM and how much for a long block from you with all the bugs addressed?
Good morning from Spartanburg South Carolina!
!! #locals, welcome
I bought an LS drop in double spring kit from extreme cfm . they were dark the company is no longer in business.now I wonder.
Yeah, it's scary
@@powellmachineinc I didn't buy a dirt cheap set, I paid 200.00 for the set but I'm checking them before I run it any more. I'll get ahold of you in the future, I trust you.
Dang i have a pair of speedmaster heads that came with spings that have been said to fail on reviews. Now im thinking maybe i should have taken the advice of changing them but was just content with the 202 values.
People read a comment online, take it’s as fact then Everytime they hear someone ask for help with a problem they are having they use that information from the comment they read to diagnose the issue. Never even knowing anything about the topic at hand. Then you have the others that read the comments and see most of the comments are making a specific diagnosis then he will comment that same diagnosis to make people think he knows something. I see some of the absolute worst diagnosis in reading comments every single day. And these people asking for help don’t even realize they are getting terrible information. It blows my mind.
Can't you just stretch that short one out a little bit? 😮
They probably dip them in used oil after heating them, that's where the nice dark patina comes from.
Joe
Lol
Stretching them is only a temporary solution.
To do it right, you have to stuff tiny little footballs inside the springs.
A high percentage of made in China products are substandard.
It’s like comparing harbor freight to snap on you get what you pay for
With the cost of everything you're gonna break by using cheap springs there is no reason to buy them
Thanks for that
I bet the dark ones are super soft man in comparison purple black usually means soft the harder the heat treat usually the lighter the color will be so they went super deep into the temper to try and make them last a min lmao just a theory about the ramen noodles
The old saying, "if it's got tits or wheels it's gunna give you grief"!
All Chinese valve spring sent with fortune 🥠 cookie.
Every one of them says, " Use at your own risk. "
😆 🤣 😂 😹 😆
Getting a deal is one thing but when the deal is to good to be true........