The reason Garrosh can be used as a battery is because his soul has a fault that doesn't end (so they can keep extracting it). It's pride. His orcish pride is unending.
"Duuuurr, but garrosh done nothin' wrong, Huk Yuk!" Cue the garrosh fanboys who can't accept it even when the game itself is showing them Garrosh's actions had him placed there. The Arbiter put garrosh in that place because of his faults
i dont think its unending, if he was evil beyond redemption he wouldve been send to the maw instead, also from one of the bronze dragons we get the information that garosh in most other timelines was one of if not the best warchief ever so there is definitly a potential for good in him, i think its just the case that he will sit in revendreth unyielding for a long long whole
Mr Orc Shaman Yo dude chill. I liked Garrosh because he made the Horde feel like the Horde instead of the super-best-friends club. I get some people don't want the Horde to be bad, but I grew up on WC2 and miss the old baddie orcs.
Venthyr #1: So, what is this one in for? (gestures towards Garrosh) Venthyr #2: Oh, him? Assault and *battery* _Venthyr #1 gives a knowing look towards the camera._
"I am Denathrius and I am here to ask a question? Is man not entitled to the anima of his soul?" 'No! says the Kyrians of Bastion, it belongs to the righteous' 'No! says the Necrolords of Maldraxxus, it belongs to the military might' 'No says the Night Fae of Ardenweald, it belongs to the cycle of rebirth' I rejected those purposes; instead, I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose…Revendreth. A region where the sinful would not fear the Maw, where the prideful would not be bound by petty morality, where the few would not be constrained by the many! And with the anima of your soul, the Venthyr could be your covenant as well."
@@Manasquid.67 Ah yes, Theramore, a hub of activity and joy. Where I would drop a portal to, on top of the Wintergrasp portal, when the event started, back in WotLK.
@@muddybloody Lying to one's self is fine if it is executed well, but the fact that the narration in Before the Storm horrendously abused a literary tool that was not intended to deceive the reader OR suggest lying to one's self (you do that through other more subtle means when writing a good book) is just one of many reasons why Christie Golden shouldn't be allowed to write another book. You don't use literary tools against their purpose. Internal monologues are strictly for insight into the character's true intentions, and lying through it is a dishonest writing technique and signs of a true amateur's work.
I guess people's aim to create something different or unexpected "twist" is driving them to doing hopeless or annoying attempts. We can only hope that the story gets better, and is told in a better way.
@@LuckySmurf well when youre freeing guldan in the wod intro he says "grommash will pay for his arrogance" but other than that garrosh wasnt there so it couldnt have been him. Suppose it wasnt necessarily his idea, one of his lieutenants coulda given it to him i guess :p
@@gerihuginn2143 Well, I did hear a rumor that Nestle uses underpaid child labor to farm cocoa from their plantations of cocoa trees. But I have absolutely nothing to back up this rumor, so I could be wrong!
@@bonefetcherbrimley7740 From what i see is that they indirectly profit from it, they buy cocoa beans from the farmers of the Ivory Coast , these farmers use child slave labor.
Plus, I just have to point out the irony... Garrosh literally screaming in "Hell" and being used by supposedly noble leaders. Not allowed to atone in death. That's truly dark.
And the irony that in life the 'force' Garrosh hated the MOST was death. As seen by how he felt about the Forsaken. Now he's a battery for one of death's covenants.
@@jare3959 I thought Garrosh hated the Legion most, after what happened to his father and most of the orc race. Now he pretty much hates everyone and everything.
Well, he didn't absorb the Sha of Pride. We defeated the Sha of Pride in the raid after Garrosh had already left for Orgrimmar. But he certainly did SPAWN the Sha of Pride after taking the Heart. Which may or may not be worse than just absorbing it, lol.
Always stumped me why it didn't use a much more common local term "упырь" (Eastern European spin on bloodsucking undead) or just a general "кровосос" ("bloodsucker", invoking a leech more than anything).
@@principetnomusic only if we are talking about the specifics of their mythos. But if we are talking about the idea of some rich and powerful metaphorically sucking the life out of their people, it is indistinguishable, at least to my knowledge. Not to mention that most workers and peasants would have understood the term more easily.
@@principetnomusic saw your edit, and to address your second point: "упырь" used referring to ruthless police and secret service is a relatively recent development. Before that the idea of a loyal dog is and has for centuries been the go-to monicker associated with the people guarding the Tsar and enforcing his will. In more educated circles another popular move was liking people to the servants and officials under Middle Eastern despots.
4:40 Finally, someone is mentioning Max Schreck and Nosferatu! Thank you for that! It was partially filmed in my hometown "Wismar" which was part of the "Hanse" and has incredible red brick Gothic, if anyone wants to experience this style of art come to Wismar. We have a lot of tour guides and a museum for that. 👍😉
if you know the prepatch event you also know of the 20 rares we will have to kick in the nuts soon (and again and again for weeks). all sent by the maw, therefore everybody and their bad grandma from WotLK is there and also every meanie from earlier times. illustrious bunch and not a bit tormented as promised otherwise
I can think of another Hellscream that was kept in chains and bled dry for the gleeful amusement of a sadistic and charismatic leader, and who also refused to ever be broken. (it didn't end well for his captor) Really loving the father / son parallel that's being drawn here; I just hope they follow through appropriately and actually do something with it.
Personally I'm hoping that Hellscream is NOT relegated to some mythic-only raid boss mechanic. I would love to see a questline where he breaks free and starts wreaking havok. Sure he may be a racist wrecking ball, but we could make him a useful racist wrecking ball.
17:00 - One thing of note is the constant theme of pride. The Runecarver refers to Revendreth members as "feeding on pride". Denathrius emphasizes the most "prideful" of souls. And finally the quest involving Kael'thas paints his greatest sin as his crimes against his people being a product of pride. Garosh's function as a battery of sorts is likely a product of his pride. While anima is very much an ephemeral soulstuff, the red anima being pulled from victims in Revendreth is unique compared to the other covenants. Garosh is basically pride incarnate. So much so that his sha corruption in the siege of Orgimar seemed to be a resurrection of the sha of pride, who we killed earlier in the raid.
Thank you Taliesin! Love this video! You are the only reactor to these videos who not only understands all of the lore and characters, but also the themes and meaning behind them. It is a joy to watch your channel.
Omg!!! Another highly anticipated and amazing cinematic analysis, Tali! Always love how much more appreciation you bring to us with these incredible cinematics from the cinematics team! Can't wait for the Ardenweald analysis one! ":D
"Blizz get political" I mean about as political as the many, many, many other games that have told a similar story about oppression and class exploitation have gotten.
I always love these cinematic analysis videos. They are always so awesome! I am here to beg you to please make a proper one on the Ardenweald as well. I know you were super busy with the move and all. But I would love it if you could do it now that you are getting all settled in. Pretty please with roly-poly Maurice on top.
I loved this cinematic so much... Hands down, the best for me... I can almost see Denathrius saying "Some of you may die... But, that is a risk I am willing to take..." And I'm an Arthas fanboi... The cinematic team is doing such a great job! Wish they could teach the systems team how to care about their job....
@@kaizoc5314 There is a cinematic with the Jailer. Wowhead had an article about it earlier this week. Here it is. th-cam.com/video/YIhAQzsQCDU/w-d-xo.html
A really interesting analysis video, it was fun to watch and listen to. I also like the comic book style paneling you've been using for these videos, rather than have a single visual backdrop. Cheers!
Its one of the few that I think don't really need it, not alot of information in that one isn't easily figured out other than who the non Winter Queen characters are
The reason why I expect the Garrosh finally transcending his flaws after what he is subject to in Revendreth storyline is not just him being 'purged of sin by pain' as it's SOP (standard operating procedure) for Venthyr, but him realising he's become a victim in afterlife - a victim of injustice and whims of those stronger than him i.e. literally what he had done to so many others in life. If he has at least a freaking ounce of self-reflection he will do some homework after what happens to him in afterlife. If not.. that'd be the disappointment of the decade of WoW storytelling.
Or, if Garrosh is Garrosh, the only conclusion that he will draw from this is that he is too weak and has to shift the balance of power to get back at his torturers. To uncaring despots like him, morals don't matter. Only power dynamics do.
Tali: this speech is a clever way for the team to alienate us towards the Revendreth, opposite to what previous cinematics did. Me: yep, Revendreth is my covenant. Here I come!
Best analysis I've seen so far, very deep and meaningful thoughts - thx for the famous work and effort you've put in it. I'm from germany and sadly we only have just one good lore-channel (an excellent one btw), so I came here in hope for more information (and maybe speculation) and I'm really flashed, it's wonderful content! Thumps up and subbed. 👌👍
It's incredible how much you see in these cinematics, Taliesin. They have so much more depth and meaning than people give them credit for, and it's nearly impossible to fully understand everything going on in them the first viewing.
@@dantebzs It actually is a representation of feudalism. The conexion to capitalism is how often the middle and low classes are taxed in order to mantain those in power and theri needs. Corporate capitalism is basically that.
@@Hoztyle619 well, It is indeed. But where in the World is feudalism still active? Nowhere, then, there is no criticism to anything. This connection you mention is the same we can make to socialism, not the ideal, but the practical one, where a minority under the ruler's wings are well fed and the rest dies of hunger (Venezuela, mao tse's China, North Korea, usrr...), While only in socialism the ruler owns the means of production, which is the case for the venthyr. Either you criticize socialism with this, or doesn't criticize any ruling system, because it's a critique to dictatorship, not a system. To which I would add: dictatorship is the only result of socialism. But, this cinematic doesn't mention It at any form, to be Fair.
I must say, I haven't been playing WoW for the last year, and I don't think I'm coming back any time soon. For lack of a computer to run it on, now that Blizzard games can no longer be played through GeForce Now. I don't miss it much, but I do love to keep in touch through content creators such as yourself, and I find your content extremely refreshing. Thank you for your awesome work!
Imagine when Garrosh finds out his pride is almost powering an entire realm and he’s being milked dry to sustain the realm. Ohh Boy, how pissed he’ll be will be literally off the charts on another level.
i can just see garrosh being too proud to admit he sinned so he won let himself move on, the venthyr might just be capitalizing on the happy coincidence.
Denathrius talking about milking "their old reliables" is a very clever metaphor for how Blizzard milks old characters and their older playerbase to build up hype for the new expansion. I'm actually impressed.
Since Garrosh died 3 expansions ago that is about 6 years in our time, and in Shadowlands time flows faster, that means Garrosh has been down there fueling them with anima for decades
@@DarkWolf958 Garrosh went back 35 years, not us. He had time to establish the Iron Horde infrastructure (like the Grimrail, Blackrock Foundry, etc) because time in AU Draenor flows faster than on Azeroth (as shown in the Mag'har unlock scenario with old Grommash and Durotan/Draka's AU offspring Geyarah).
@@VladiMatt i always thought in the mag'har unlock questline we just went across to AU Draenor because we didn't have to power to go back to the point where left. and yes setting up infrastructure takes time it doesn't take 35 years so lets say 10 years tops that still leaves 25 years
Love the cinematographic analysis, the reference to cinematic angles, colour pallet and music on top of the lore. It makes your analysis quite different and enjoyable at so many levels. Thank you. Loved the 4 covenant shorts, great job from Blizzard’s team, anchored my choices for a thematically correct covenant with ok abilities for their spec for 4 different classes to play casually, enjoy the lore. Pls do Ardenweald too: the cinematographic analysis, the references to movies, theatre, literature or historical events is a breath of fresh air beyond the average TH-camr more into just mechanics and number crunching. Art has a message and gaming a potential role to play as commentary to our times. ❤️ GL with the new place!
23:06 While not contradictory to capitalism, monarchy is not synonymous with it either! In many places, like France, it was the capitalists, the bourgeoisie, that played a key role in overthrowing the old feudal elites, including the monarch, because the things that gave the old elites power under feudalism were no longer relevant in the modern world. It is possible for the monarchy to adapt and become part of the capitalist world order (like the British or Saudi royals), but it's ultimately a remnant of the older era, of feudalism. The Marxist definitions of feudalism, capitalism, socialism, etc. were less about who holds political power, but more about who holds economic power - because it's the economic power that matters, regardless of who is formally in charge. In a liberal democracy (like your country, the UK), the bourgeoisie maintain control via lobbying, funding election candidates, and the mass media. In a dictatorship (like my country, the Russian Federation), they use more blunt methods, like bribery and brute force. In an absolute monarchy like Saudi Arabia, instead of merely influencing the government, they outright merge with them, and the royal family becomes the biggest capitalist of them all. But in all these scenarios, it is the bourgeoisie that holds most of the power, and government institutions can only do so much to rein them in.
to be honest it's not capitalism that this makes me remember but communist and USSR. everybody was poor and had to give what they had to the State. The gargoyles could be a representation of KGB trying to put down the rebels. In general it was super bias that he assumed this was about capitalism when we have so many example in the world where communism and socialism dries the "blood" of its population to give power to the people in the power "state"
@@Thefilipe58 If there's any period in Russian history that I can relate this cinematic with, it is modern capitalist Russia, where the average person's wealth falls down while Putin and his cronies continuously embezzle public money for their own benefit. Though I despise the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, its elites never had the same level of wealth disparity under socialism (though it was their desire to possess this wealth that led them to betray their country and dissolve the USSR), and public money was instead funneled into infrastructure and social welfare. Sure, the poor vampires may be snatched by the gargoyle KGB/FSB, but would they be guaranteed a free house after enough years of service, or an efficient public transport system to travel around, or free helathcare? These are the things that Putin and his capitalist system have been continuously destroying.
@@principetnomusic there is a road in Russia called the (and I'm quoting I don't know the exact name) million souls road. Where over 1 miion people died building it and stalin told his men to burry the bodies in the road while they built it. .....so which era of Russia was worse again? Communist russia or current. I don't remember any million death road built by putin. (Not saying its perfect now, but to think its worse than Communist means you have not looked very deep into the history books.)
@@charlesscott1468 I only know of the ghost railtracks that carried those marked for forced deportation, so called because the victims were not allowed to stop and bury their dead and had to throw them by the tracks. That's the tragedy my family has gone through, so I know full well the horrors of Stalinism. Of course Stalinism was worse, but the USSR was not just Stalin. By the 1960s the gulags were dismantled, and though the government remained authoritarian, it would never again commit the same atrocities. Now, was *Stagnation*-era USSR worse or better than Putinist Russia? *That* is a tough question to ask. Neither era has many political freedoms, but now there is more freedom of movement and freedom of speech (though now it is only because of new technology such as the Internet). We have more luxury goods on average. However, in terms of overall life quality, of social stability, crime, corruption, economic inequality, infrastructure - *all* of that is worse, especially when accounting for the time that has passed.
Been looking forward to these every week, Taliesin's analyses are fantastic and help develop an even greater appreciation for Blizzard's creative and literary skill. Please don't forget to come back to Ardenweald or my druid will be very sad! (**gives puppy-dog eyes but in cat)
Well since vampires are originated from Romania I'm surprised ( in a good way) they didn't give him a stereotypical Russian accent. And as a romanian I'm happy Blizzard added typical romanian names to some of the NPC in Ravendreth.
This reminds me of the time we visited a local prison in High School as part of the law and economics classes. A girl asked a prison guard if he enjoys his job and he said that the prison warden is never allowed to enjoy his job or it'll go south. Revendreth went south.
Eh, big difference between putting some fictional politics in to flesh out the setting and turning the whole thing into an impromptu soapbox. That being said, Revendreth doesn't seem like an example of the latter, since that zone is just boils down to "cartoonish vampire aristocracy", fun but pretty thoughtless. Guess I will still only be getting my fix of more interesting and nuanced vampire shizz from World of Darkness.
Idk about you but i always thought that the concept of Horde (red) and Alliance (blue) has always derived from communist red Soviets and capitalist blue NATO. My opinion does not have a political reason, nor does it approve of anything political, its just an opinion, dont offend me.
I love these videos, the depth and intense research. Mentioning Nosferatu was one but the 1984 style tyrannical big screen link was also amazing. Well done, just well done.
I always thought that I would go venthir for my rougue but after this cinematic I think I changed my mind. Yes the ability is cool and up my alley as a rogue I'm always more of a lore player and I don't think I feel good with this. Perhaps it will be Ardenweald after all...
What Sire Denathrius is doing isn't supposed to be what goes down. You side with other against this as part of the covenant. It's addressed in the leveling through Revendreth.
I get what you mean. If it helps at all, it seems like our joining the Ven'thyr will be more in league with those who disapprove or rebel against the way Denathrius is running things, rather than in support of it. There will probably be some overlap, but joining the Ven'thyr covenant probably doesn't mean supporting Sire Denathrius.
I've been playing world of Warcraft since 06 and hands down this is the best breakdown of any cinemac I have ever seen. I salute to you, your the Michael Jordan in this
So we can be Vampire Russian Communists ? Where do I sign up? Who doesn't want to be a machine for the Aristocratic Vampire Dredlord of lords Denathrius! And the red accents on everything and just the really Headless Horsemanish art of the zone is delightful ! My Blood Elf will be right at home he's pale as the moon anyway
I'm not a smart man, so watching these videos makes my body and brain happy because I finally have words to put to the things I feel when I watch these cinematics. Thanks for doing these, Tali! I really enjoy being able to go through and looking at all the details I missed on my first (and fifth) viewings.
I saw the shot at 7:12 of the dude giving the speech and was immediately reminded of the imagery being displayed here as quite similar to the shot of Saruman shouting to the Orks of his army right before they besiege Helm's Deep in The Two Towers. Not sure if that's intentional or not but I think it's cool nonetheless
23:35 Have you SEEN Denathrius? They basically named him Daddy Denathrius. Then again, I also have a thing for Illidan, so maybe I just like Nathrezim but slightly to the left.
Thank you so much for doing these videos, I'm a lil autistic and it makes it really difficult for me to read between the lines with this type of thing. Your videos help build the excitement and intrigue for me. I can't wait until you can do Ardenweald as well
In the UK the government introduced Austerity policies with the slogan "We are all in this together", which disproportionately made the poor poorer and the rich richer. The comparison with Revendreth's "Rich and poor alike must sacrifce" is pretty easy to make. And it's something my country is living through right now, so it seems pretty relevant to me. Other people can have different reference points and that's fine :)
My goodness. I’m so glad he pointed out the electric sound in the torture of Hellscream. That’s insane! I loved the introductions that bliz showed us! It really has got me excited for all of the zones. Personally, I still feel most drawn to Kyrian and Maldrax. However, I love Garrosh and I hope we discover more upon our adventures in Revend.
Blizzard are such amateurs omg spiral staircase in medieval castles always turns left from above so righthanded defenders can defend easily omg I'm unsubbing!
As a designer, I couldn't stop staring at the white border on your camera not lining with the video.. It made my eye twitch. But cool layout, a real step up from previous videos.
Yeah i love how everyone is trying to draw parallels to capitalism but its more leaning toward communism since all the plebians have to work and give all the anima they gather to the government and then get it redistributed meanwhile the government are living large and fat while the citizens starve. But capitalism bad
@@CodeeXD And that's not happening right now under capitalism? Millionaires getting millions in bailouts to only sack their employees whilst the 'plebians' as you put it get a tiny sum of money do to them for 6 months? Like fuck communism & socialism but Jesus Christ man educate yourself.
The reason Garrosh can be used as a battery is because his soul has a fault that doesn't end (so they can keep extracting it). It's pride. His orcish pride is unending.
"Duuuurr, but garrosh done nothin' wrong, Huk Yuk!"
Cue the garrosh fanboys who can't accept it even when the game itself is showing them Garrosh's actions had him placed there. The Arbiter put garrosh in that place because of his faults
i dont think its unending, if he was evil beyond redemption he wouldve been send to the maw instead, also from one of the bronze dragons we get the information that garosh in most other timelines was one of if not the best warchief ever so there is definitly a potential for good in him, i think its just the case that he will sit in revendreth unyielding for a long long whole
@@MrOrcshaman bUt GaROsh diD nOthINg wROnG :D
@@MrOrcshaman imagine thinking that meme is serious
Mr Orc Shaman Yo dude chill. I liked Garrosh because he made the Horde feel like the Horde instead of the super-best-friends club. I get some people don't want the Horde to be bad, but I grew up on WC2 and miss the old baddie orcs.
Venthyr #1: So, what is this one in for? (gestures towards Garrosh)
Venthyr #2: Oh, him? Assault and *battery*
_Venthyr #1 gives a knowing look towards the camera._
Badum tsssshhhh....
Gotta love "Hellscream" living up to his name
"living" xD
He has finally become his name, lol.
Yeah, he definitely is showing the iron will of his father.
Garrosh just made it there as a pun from the devs xD
Then where is Grom?
I really like Tali's breakdown of Afterlives. There is so much details. And each detail makes it poetic. Cinematic are brilliant. 10/10
Add them all together, and you get a full movie or documentary worth of content that is originally few min
"I am Denathrius and I am here to ask a question? Is man not entitled to the anima of his soul?"
'No! says the Kyrians of Bastion, it belongs to the righteous'
'No! says the Necrolords of Maldraxxus, it belongs to the military might'
'No says the Night Fae of Ardenweald, it belongs to the cycle of rebirth'
I rejected those purposes; instead, I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose…Revendreth. A region where the sinful would not fear the Maw, where the prideful would not be bound by petty morality, where the few would not be constrained by the many! And with the anima of your soul, the Venthyr could be your covenant as well."
S tier comment
would ya kindly craft a legendry or something and go into the maw!?
Bice bioshock reference dood
Bioshock!
@@freddymeisner I LOVE THIS!!!
Say what you will about Garrosh. At least he didn't burn my tree,
He did bomb a city...
At least he didn't kill the majortiy of a race.
@@Manasquid.67 Ah yes, Theramore, a hub of activity and joy. Where I would drop a portal to, on top of the Wintergrasp portal, when the event started, back in WotLK.
@@KlaelDemon You evil magic caster.
@@Manasquid.67 And nuke the vale. And caused an inter-timeline war. Among other charges.
Bold of you to assume that the venthirs aren't sexy sex man vampires too
With how many venthirs look, it's more of "Bald" really.
Taliesin is the A-level media student every teacher wanted but, never got.
Maybe if they paid the students :)
Tali: "And you don't generally lie in an internal monologue."
Sylvanas' writers: "WAIT YOU DON'T?"
Ever heard of lying to oneself
@@muddybloody Lying to one's self is fine if it is executed well, but the fact that the narration in Before the Storm horrendously abused a literary tool that was not intended to deceive the reader OR suggest lying to one's self (you do that through other more subtle means when writing a good book) is just one of many reasons why Christie Golden shouldn't be allowed to write another book.
You don't use literary tools against their purpose. Internal monologues are strictly for insight into the character's true intentions, and lying through it is a dishonest writing technique and signs of a true amateur's work.
@@TheDaiTenguofFuji Also Christie Golden shouldn't write anything involving the Horde, but that is another matter entirely.
I guess people's aim to create something different or unexpected "twist" is driving them to doing hopeless or annoying attempts. We can only hope that the story gets better, and is told in a better way.
"Everyone gets that one last chance"
Imagine the venthyr having to deal with Galakrond
Since Ursoc got turned into a marble, I imagine those souls sent to Revendreth could be forced into a manageably torturable package if need be.
well just another "eternal battery" to feed from.
I really love how Denathrius sounds like Scar from the original Lion king. He has that smug charm about him.
I love it. Reinforced my choice in covenant! 😆
Also let's not forget that Garrosh used Guldan as a battery to power the new Dark portal, so yeah karma hits hard
That was grom not garrosh...
@@williamjeanrie8524 Do we know whose idea it was to use Gul'dan as a battery? Or did I miss that bit of detail?
@@LuckySmurf well when youre freeing guldan in the wod intro he says "grommash will pay for his arrogance" but other than that garrosh wasnt there so it couldnt have been him. Suppose it wasnt necessarily his idea, one of his lieutenants coulda given it to him i guess :p
I don’t think karma applies to people like Gul’dan.
So: Is Revendreth basically Nestle?
As a former executive manager at Nestle, I concur. That's why I dropped it.
What is the connection?
Has Nestle done something fucked up?
EDIT : I just searched Nestle controversy and the list keeps going on.
@@gerihuginn2143 Well, I did hear a rumor that Nestle uses underpaid child labor to farm cocoa from their plantations of cocoa trees. But I have absolutely nothing to back up this rumor, so I could be wrong!
@@bonefetcherbrimley7740 From what i see is that they indirectly profit from it, they buy cocoa beans from the farmers of the Ivory Coast , these farmers use child slave labor.
It's not any specific corporation. It's all of them.
More on the nose, it's America in general.
Plus, I just have to point out the irony... Garrosh literally screaming in "Hell" and being used by supposedly noble leaders. Not allowed to atone in death. That's truly dark.
still able to end in the Maw, but who decides when ?
It's more of purgatory really. The maw is hell.
And the irony that in life the 'force' Garrosh hated the MOST was death. As seen by how he felt about the Forsaken. Now he's a battery for one of death's covenants.
@@jare3959 I thought Garrosh hated the Legion most, after what happened to his father and most of the orc race. Now he pretty much hates everyone and everything.
Garrosh absorbed the Sha of pride.
If anyone would be a battery it's him
That might be part of why his Redemption would be taking so long even if Revendreth lived up to its PR.
Well, he didn't absorb the Sha of Pride. We defeated the Sha of Pride in the raid after Garrosh had already left for Orgrimmar.
But he certainly did SPAWN the Sha of Pride after taking the Heart. Which may or may not be worse than just absorbing it, lol.
@@EloquentTroll Also it's only been like ten to fifteen years, some souls have been working on their redemptions for centuries.
@@drudle That's my bad misspeaking there.
He absorbed the most powerful of the old gods responsible for the creation of the sha's.
Random fact: the Russian version of the Marseillaise used during the Russian Revolution explicitly refers to Nicholas II as "the Vampire Tsar"
Always stumped me why it didn't use a much more common local term "упырь" (Eastern European spin on bloodsucking undead) or just a general "кровосос" ("bloodsucker", invoking a leech more than anything).
@@fillosof66689 Упырь has different connotations. It's usually used to refer to the police instead
@@principetnomusic only if we are talking about the specifics of their mythos. But if we are talking about the idea of some rich and powerful metaphorically sucking the life out of their people, it is indistinguishable, at least to my knowledge. Not to mention that most workers and peasants would have understood the term more easily.
@@principetnomusic saw your edit, and to address your second point: "упырь" used referring to ruthless police and secret service is a relatively recent development. Before that the idea of a loyal dog is and has for centuries been the go-to monicker associated with the people guarding the Tsar and enforcing his will. In more educated circles another popular move was liking people to the servants and officials under Middle Eastern despots.
So~ creative. ;)
>cough
4:40 Finally, someone is mentioning Max Schreck and Nosferatu! Thank you for that! It was partially filmed in my hometown "Wismar" which was part of the "Hanse" and has incredible red brick Gothic, if anyone wants to experience this style of art come to Wismar. We have a lot of tour guides and a museum for that. 👍😉
You're not gonna drain my blood, right?
@@justin-md4xm Don't worry, thanks to the noble and humble Sire Denathrius i have plenty of Anima!
I want an Afterlives about the Maw
if you know the prepatch event you also know of the 20 rares we will have to kick in the nuts soon (and again and again for weeks). all sent by the maw, therefore everybody and their bad grandma from WotLK is there and also every meanie from earlier times. illustrious bunch and not a bit tormented as promised otherwise
I want it to be thirty seconds and to be one, slow zoom in on the Jailor before a single word is uttered and then it ends.
I can think of another Hellscream that was kept in chains and bled dry for the gleeful amusement of a sadistic and charismatic leader, and who also refused to ever be broken. (it didn't end well for his captor) Really loving the father / son parallel that's being drawn here; I just hope they follow through appropriately and actually do something with it.
Personally I'm hoping that Hellscream is NOT relegated to some mythic-only raid boss mechanic. I would love to see a questline where he breaks free and starts wreaking havok. Sure he may be a racist wrecking ball, but we could make him a useful racist wrecking ball.
@@SeJoHu The Suramar dinosaur world quest but you ride Garrosh.
@@SeJoHu OR kinda like Illidan in legion.
Hell scream Batteries: they keep going and going and going....
17:00 - One thing of note is the constant theme of pride. The Runecarver refers to Revendreth members as "feeding on pride". Denathrius emphasizes the most "prideful" of souls. And finally the quest involving Kael'thas paints his greatest sin as his crimes against his people being a product of pride.
Garosh's function as a battery of sorts is likely a product of his pride. While anima is very much an ephemeral soulstuff, the red anima being pulled from victims in Revendreth is unique compared to the other covenants. Garosh is basically pride incarnate. So much so that his sha corruption in the siege of Orgimar seemed to be a resurrection of the sha of pride, who we killed earlier in the raid.
Thank you Taliesin! Love this video! You are the only reactor to these videos who not only understands all of the lore and characters, but also the themes and meaning behind them. It is a joy to watch your channel.
Omg!!! Another highly anticipated and amazing cinematic analysis, Tali! Always love how much more appreciation you bring to us with these incredible cinematics from the cinematics team! Can't wait for the Ardenweald analysis one! ":D
"Blizz get political"
I mean about as political as the many, many, many other games that have told a similar story about oppression and class exploitation have gotten.
shut up
@@geoffreywalters5491 Nice talk
What's your point, sweety?
To be honest, I was just waiting for Denathrius to say "After, all...we're all in this together
I always love these cinematic analysis videos. They are always so awesome! I am here to beg you to please make a proper one on the Ardenweald as well. I know you were super busy with the move and all. But I would love it if you could do it now that you are getting all settled in. Pretty please with roly-poly Maurice on top.
I loved this cinematic so much... Hands down, the best for me... I can almost see Denathrius saying "Some of you may die... But, that is a risk I am willing to take..."
And I'm an Arthas fanboi... The cinematic team is doing such a great job!
Wish they could teach the systems team how to care about their job....
Ayyy, my favourite saturday activity, watching Taliesin do a deep dive :D
0:42 This "almost certainly" makes me think you are expecting a surprise fifth about the Maw, aren't you?!
31:29
Now I'm hoping for a CGI cinematic about the Jailer and the Maw like those Saurfang ones and know I'll be sad when we don't get it lol.
this wolf still has TEETH
@@kaizoc5314 There is a cinematic with the Jailer. Wowhead had an article about it earlier this week. Here it is. th-cam.com/video/YIhAQzsQCDU/w-d-xo.html
@@HavocHounds1988 A TH-cam link to a WoWhead article, I'm gonna pass on that bait, my dude.
Sounds like revendreth is due for a good ol revolt.
Time for the good people of revendreth to build a guillotine
Viva la resistance!
A really interesting analysis video, it was fun to watch and listen to. I also like the comic book style paneling you've been using for these videos, rather than have a single visual backdrop. Cheers!
I know you weren’t able to... But I really wish y’all could’ve done a video for Afterlives Ardenweald 😔
Its one of the few that I think don't really need it, not alot of information in that one isn't easily figured out other than who the non Winter Queen characters are
Hello Taliesin, internet here! /wave
/wave
type/wave
Thanks for the analysis.. ill just keep hitting refresh, hoping for the Ardenweald one..
i stand by what I said in discord that Denathrius' speech is a political Rorschach test. In that regard it's an outstanding example of word salad.
You know when Garrosh is screaming he’s like
“I did nothing WROOOOOOOOOOOOONG!”
The reason why I expect the Garrosh finally transcending his flaws after what he is subject to in Revendreth storyline is not just him being 'purged of sin by pain' as it's SOP (standard operating procedure) for Venthyr, but him realising he's become a victim in afterlife - a victim of injustice and whims of those stronger than him i.e. literally what he had done to so many others in life.
If he has at least a freaking ounce of self-reflection he will do some homework after what happens to him in afterlife. If not.. that'd be the disappointment of the decade of WoW storytelling.
Or, if Garrosh is Garrosh, the only conclusion that he will draw from this is that he is too weak and has to shift the balance of power to get back at his torturers. To uncaring despots like him, morals don't matter. Only power dynamics do.
@@Yutani_Crayven that's why I mentioned an ounce of self-reflection. You know, not only times change, but personalities, and perspectives, too.
Are you talking about character development?
Blizzard: "we don't do that here"
Tali: this speech is a clever way for the team to alienate us towards the Revendreth, opposite to what previous cinematics did.
Me: yep, Revendreth is my covenant. Here I come!
I'm all for the edgelord vampire bitey bois, too XD
Me too
Best analysis I've seen so far, very deep and meaningful thoughts - thx for the famous work and effort you've put in it. I'm from germany and sadly we only have just one good lore-channel (an excellent one btw), so I came here in hope for more information (and maybe speculation) and I'm really flashed, it's wonderful content! Thumps up and subbed. 👌👍
It's incredible how much you see in these cinematics, Taliesin. They have so much more depth and meaning than people give them credit for, and it's nearly impossible to fully understand everything going on in them the first viewing.
"I guess that makes him.. a.. dictATORRRRRR"
I love How every single aspect of the venthyr screams another failed socialistic society and still is called capitalism...
@@dantebzs It actually is a representation of feudalism. The conexion to capitalism is how often the middle and low classes are taxed in order to mantain those in power and theri needs. Corporate capitalism is basically that.
@@Hoztyle619 well, It is indeed. But where in the World is feudalism still active? Nowhere, then, there is no criticism to anything. This connection you mention is the same we can make to socialism, not the ideal, but the practical one, where a minority under the ruler's wings are well fed and the rest dies of hunger (Venezuela, mao tse's China, North Korea, usrr...), While only in socialism the ruler owns the means of production, which is the case for the venthyr. Either you criticize socialism with this, or doesn't criticize any ruling system, because it's a critique to dictatorship, not a system.
To which I would add: dictatorship is the only result of socialism. But, this cinematic doesn't mention It at any form, to be Fair.
@@dantebzs
"I love how every single aspect of the venthyr screams another failed socialistic society" What about the Victorian goth aesthetic?
@@MrElionor It does too. But one thing doesn't exclude the other, It could have the aesthetic of old greece but the political aspects of what I Said.
I must say, I haven't been playing WoW for the last year, and I don't think I'm coming back any time soon. For lack of a computer to run it on, now that Blizzard games can no longer be played through GeForce Now.
I don't miss it much, but I do love to keep in touch through content creators such as yourself, and I find your content extremely refreshing.
Thank you for your awesome work!
Imagine when Garrosh finds out his pride is almost powering an entire realm and he’s being milked dry to sustain the realm. Ohh Boy, how pissed he’ll be will be literally off the charts on another level.
i can just see garrosh being too proud to admit he sinned so he won let himself move on, the venthyr might just be capitalizing on the happy coincidence.
Denathrius talking about milking "their old reliables" is a very clever metaphor for how Blizzard milks old characters and their older playerbase to build up hype for the new expansion.
I'm actually impressed.
Gaming company uses popular characters to build hype, call the news
Bit too big brain to be intentional i think, but brilliant comparison
Well, he was the best warchief until the genocide/time traveling bits they wrote in.
Congratulations, your videos are so nice and well thought, thank you :-)
Since Garrosh died 3 expansions ago that is about 6 years in our time, and in Shadowlands time flows faster, that means Garrosh has been down there fueling them with anima for decades
you fail to realise that Garrosh died on Draenor. Draenor from 35 years ago. hes migh have been there centuries
Time doesn't flow differently in the Shadowlands. It FEELS different only, but it doesn't FLOW differently. I believe it was Ion who clarified it.
@@DarkWolf958 Garrosh went back 35 years, not us. He had time to establish the Iron Horde infrastructure (like the Grimrail, Blackrock Foundry, etc) because time in AU Draenor flows faster than on Azeroth (as shown in the Mag'har unlock scenario with old Grommash and Durotan/Draka's AU offspring Geyarah).
@@VladiMatt i always thought in the mag'har unlock questline we just went across to AU Draenor because we didn't have to power to go back to the point where left. and yes setting up infrastructure takes time it doesn't take 35 years so lets say 10 years tops that still leaves 25 years
What's is the exchange rate for Anima to Pepsi in the shadow lands?
Bet he supplied them with a river's worth of drinks.
Love the cinematographic analysis, the reference to cinematic angles, colour pallet and music on top of the lore. It makes your analysis quite different and enjoyable at so many levels. Thank you.
Loved the 4 covenant shorts, great job from Blizzard’s team, anchored my choices for a thematically correct covenant with ok abilities for their spec for 4 different classes to play casually, enjoy the lore.
Pls do Ardenweald too: the cinematographic analysis, the references to movies, theatre, literature or historical events is a breath of fresh air beyond the average TH-camr more into just mechanics and number crunching. Art has a message and gaming a potential role to play as commentary to our times. ❤️
GL with the new place!
23:06 While not contradictory to capitalism, monarchy is not synonymous with it either! In many places, like France, it was the capitalists, the bourgeoisie, that played a key role in overthrowing the old feudal elites, including the monarch, because the things that gave the old elites power under feudalism were no longer relevant in the modern world. It is possible for the monarchy to adapt and become part of the capitalist world order (like the British or Saudi royals), but it's ultimately a remnant of the older era, of feudalism.
The Marxist definitions of feudalism, capitalism, socialism, etc. were less about who holds political power, but more about who holds economic power - because it's the economic power that matters, regardless of who is formally in charge. In a liberal democracy (like your country, the UK), the bourgeoisie maintain control via lobbying, funding election candidates, and the mass media. In a dictatorship (like my country, the Russian Federation), they use more blunt methods, like bribery and brute force. In an absolute monarchy like Saudi Arabia, instead of merely influencing the government, they outright merge with them, and the royal family becomes the biggest capitalist of them all. But in all these scenarios, it is the bourgeoisie that holds most of the power, and government institutions can only do so much to rein them in.
to be honest it's not capitalism that this makes me remember but communist and USSR. everybody was poor and had to give what they had to the State. The gargoyles could be a representation of KGB trying to put down the rebels.
In general it was super bias that he assumed this was about capitalism when we have so many example in the world where communism and socialism dries the "blood" of its population to give power to the people in the power "state"
@@Thefilipe58 If there's any period in Russian history that I can relate this cinematic with, it is modern capitalist Russia, where the average person's wealth falls down while Putin and his cronies continuously embezzle public money for their own benefit. Though I despise the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, its elites never had the same level of wealth disparity under socialism (though it was their desire to possess this wealth that led them to betray their country and dissolve the USSR), and public money was instead funneled into infrastructure and social welfare.
Sure, the poor vampires may be snatched by the gargoyle KGB/FSB, but would they be guaranteed a free house after enough years of service, or an efficient public transport system to travel around, or free helathcare? These are the things that Putin and his capitalist system have been continuously destroying.
*facepalms* oh dear....... sigh.....
@@principetnomusic there is a road in Russia called the (and I'm quoting I don't know the exact name) million souls road. Where over 1 miion people died building it and stalin told his men to burry the bodies in the road while they built it. .....so which era of Russia was worse again? Communist russia or current. I don't remember any million death road built by putin. (Not saying its perfect now, but to think its worse than Communist means you have not looked very deep into the history books.)
@@charlesscott1468 I only know of the ghost railtracks that carried those marked for forced deportation, so called because the victims were not allowed to stop and bury their dead and had to throw them by the tracks. That's the tragedy my family has gone through, so I know full well the horrors of Stalinism.
Of course Stalinism was worse, but the USSR was not just Stalin. By the 1960s the gulags were dismantled, and though the government remained authoritarian, it would never again commit the same atrocities. Now, was *Stagnation*-era USSR worse or better than Putinist Russia? *That* is a tough question to ask. Neither era has many political freedoms, but now there is more freedom of movement and freedom of speech (though now it is only because of new technology such as the Internet). We have more luxury goods on average. However, in terms of overall life quality, of social stability, crime, corruption, economic inequality, infrastructure - *all* of that is worse, especially when accounting for the time that has passed.
Love the content Tali hope your family is staying safe.
revendreth with daddy denathrius is the best one no questions asked
Awesome video analysis, thank you!
This is definitely one of the best cinematics blizzards has done.
That trickle down joke was just perfect
Been looking forward to these every week, Taliesin's analyses are fantastic and help develop an even greater appreciation for Blizzard's creative and literary skill. Please don't forget to come back to Ardenweald or my druid will be very sad! (**gives puppy-dog eyes but in cat)
That sheriff of Nottingham bit made me choke on my coffee
Thanks for an awesome take on these Afterlife videos
There's my true Warchief.
every time you take a not-so subtle dig at the society we live in i smile a little
Honestly, I expected Denathrius would have a british accent when the music started.
Bah, French would be more suitable.
Zis Anima ez excuisit, zos commonog need to supply mog.
Well since vampires are originated from Romania I'm surprised ( in a good way) they didn't give him a stereotypical Russian accent.
And as a romanian I'm happy Blizzard added typical romanian names to some of the NPC in Ravendreth.
@@Phoenixillusion18 Well they gave the Russian accent to the Draenei already, so it would be kinda weird for Denathrius to have that same accent.
When you can get to it, Ardenweald please!! Much love, well done, keep it up.
emmm, you've just gave me an idea... there will be a 5th one for the Maw?
It’s going to drop with the pre-patch likely being the parallel to Old Solider.
This reminds me of the time we visited a local prison in High School as part of the law and economics classes. A girl asked a prison guard if he enjoys his job and he said that the prison warden is never allowed to enjoy his job or it'll go south.
Revendreth went south.
I can't believe there are politics in my game about war, literally crying and shaking right now
quaking in my boots man
War without politics just makes it pointless
Eh, big difference between putting some fictional politics in to flesh out the setting and turning the whole thing into an impromptu soapbox. That being said, Revendreth doesn't seem like an example of the latter, since that zone is just boils down to "cartoonish vampire aristocracy", fun but pretty thoughtless. Guess I will still only be getting my fix of more interesting and nuanced vampire shizz from World of Darkness.
RIGHT!? what would be next? OIL!? how dare they... xD
Idk about you but i always thought that the concept of Horde (red) and Alliance (blue) has always derived from communist red Soviets and capitalist blue NATO.
My opinion does not have a political reason, nor does it approve of anything political, its just an opinion, dont offend me.
Have been waiting for this!! Great interpretation, really enjoyed it.
But there's still one more covenant for Blizz to make a video on... the Maw covenant!
I love these videos, the depth and intense research. Mentioning Nosferatu was one but the 1984 style tyrannical big screen link was also amazing. Well done, just well done.
the cinematic should've been called:
"How to absolutely NOT come across as a total douche"
A Goosey guide by Sire Denathrius©
Love your analysis', looking forward to the Ardenweald one as it is my favorite of all of them!
I’m pro Garrosh and I can’t wait when my Warchief breaks free and cause total chaos and mayhem. This not for the Horde but for Garrosh
Liking Garrosh is basically liking Hitler.
@@F0jizzle Silvanas killed more innocent then garrosh, so who would she be? Mao? Stalin?
@@MrDeflador I never said Sylvanas was any better. She burned a tree full of civilians. Anyone who still roots for her, has issues.
@@F0jizzle
To compare Garrosh with Hitler is to have no idea of either of them, they are very different.
@@maximus5263 Yet they were racist power hungry leaders who invaded other nations for the sake of their "pure race"
Love these Tali, keep it coming.
I always thought that I would go venthir for my rougue but after this cinematic I think I changed my mind. Yes the ability is cool and up my alley as a rogue I'm always more of a lore player and I don't think I feel good with this. Perhaps it will be Ardenweald after all...
What Sire Denathrius is doing isn't supposed to be what goes down. You side with other against this as part of the covenant. It's addressed in the leveling through Revendreth.
I get what you mean. If it helps at all, it seems like our joining the Ven'thyr will be more in league with those who disapprove or rebel against the way Denathrius is running things, rather than in support of it. There will probably be some overlap, but joining the Ven'thyr covenant probably doesn't mean supporting Sire Denathrius.
Having the same doubts for my warlock based on this cinematic too.
@@nuriraha you know we're gonna kill Denathrius and stop this operation right
I'm feeling the same about my mage now...
I've been playing world of Warcraft since 06 and hands down this is the best breakdown of any cinemac I have ever seen. I salute to you, your the Michael Jordan in this
So we can be Vampire Russian Communists ? Where do I sign up? Who doesn't want to be a machine for the Aristocratic Vampire Dredlord of lords Denathrius! And the red accents on everything and just the really Headless Horsemanish art of the zone is delightful ! My Blood Elf will be right at home he's pale as the moon anyway
u have won my heart with that fox robin hood picture from my childhood. im forever yours.
Man, as soon as I heard Denathrius' voice I said, "I can't wait to kill that guy!"
I'm not a smart man, so watching these videos makes my body and brain happy because I finally have words to put to the things I feel when I watch these cinematics.
Thanks for doing these, Tali! I really enjoy being able to go through and looking at all the details I missed on my first (and fifth) viewings.
a thousand points for the jab at the trickle down economy theory
I saw the shot at 7:12 of the dude giving the speech and was immediately reminded of the imagery being displayed here as quite similar to the shot of Saruman shouting to the Orks of his army right before they besiege Helm's Deep in The Two Towers. Not sure if that's intentional or not but I think it's cool nonetheless
23:35 Have you SEEN Denathrius? They basically named him Daddy Denathrius. Then again, I also have a thing for Illidan, so maybe I just like Nathrezim but slightly to the left.
Thank you so much for doing these videos, I'm a lil autistic and it makes it really difficult for me to read between the lines with this type of thing. Your videos help build the excitement and intrigue for me. I can't wait until you can do Ardenweald as well
I come for the intelligent discussion and breakdowns, I stay for the thinly veiled anti-capitalist commentary, keep it up 💜
I absolutely love that Tali uses those opportunities and esepcially that he mentioned Bobby Kotick by name.
I enjoyed the trickle-down reference lol Thank you for including that :P
The ruling class betraying their people and in league with the big baddies of the expasnion? Anyone else get Elisande vibes?
The best line contains the brilliant "eventual redemption" expression.
Whatever dude, just give my dk that sword.
I love these videos! Keep up the great work!
Revendreth is legit modeled after Latin American governments.
Or just Americas.
"The Dutch Tilt can be used for dramatic effect and helps portray unease, disorientation, frantic or desperate action, intoxication, madness, etc,”
It's curios that you say that this represents capitalism.This is an exact representation of life under communism in my country.
looks like you are close to a revelation there, keep going
hes is rich white boi from GB, he doesnt know shit about world, thats why he is commie.
Capitalism and Communism are not mutually exclusive. One is an economic system and other, a political.
China is a good example of having both.
Its a example of "corrupt" communist system. Communism in theory and how it is done in practice are different things.
In the UK the government introduced Austerity policies with the slogan "We are all in this together", which disproportionately made the poor poorer and the rich richer. The comparison with Revendreth's "Rich and poor alike must sacrifce" is pretty easy to make. And it's something my country is living through right now, so it seems pretty relevant to me. Other people can have different reference points and that's fine :)
Your cinematic analysis is the best by far in the WoW content creator community. Thanks for your work.
I'm almost sad "Denathrius really is a dick, isn't he?" wasn't the title of this video.
Admittedly I'm not sure the 'tubes would take well to that
My goodness. I’m so glad he pointed out the electric sound in the torture of Hellscream. That’s insane!
I loved the introductions that bliz showed us! It really has got me excited for all of the zones.
Personally, I still feel most drawn to Kyrian and Maldrax. However, I love Garrosh and I hope we discover more upon our adventures in Revend.
Imagine paying taxes thinking the money goes to the ones in need :'(
The Maldraxxus cinematic made me want to go there. I didn't care about them at all until the cinematic, so huge props to the Story team at Blizz!!
Blizzard are such amateurs omg spiral staircase in medieval castles always turns left from above so righthanded defenders can defend easily omg I'm unsubbing!
Lol. Well, maybe Revendreth defends from below, to protect the anima batteries from would-be liberators.
@@fairycardmakerlisa3359 Or maybe all Venthyr are left handed, because as is well-known, all left-handed people are pure evil!!! /s
gentleman oni lol - maybe so!
@@gentleman_oni
my sister's left handed. This explains so much. XD
As a designer, I couldn't stop staring at the white border on your camera not lining with the video.. It made my eye twitch. But cool layout, a real step up from previous videos.
Typical communist leader. Lovely. In Croatia, we call Yugoslavia dictator Josip Broz Tito - The Vampire. So yes. Revendreth - red commies. :)
Yeah i love how everyone is trying to draw parallels to capitalism but its more leaning toward communism since all the plebians have to work and give all the anima they gather to the government and then get it redistributed meanwhile the government are living large and fat while the citizens starve. But capitalism bad
@@CodeeXD And that's not happening right now under capitalism? Millionaires getting millions in bailouts to only sack their employees whilst the 'plebians' as you put it get a tiny sum of money do to them for 6 months?
Like fuck communism & socialism but Jesus Christ man educate yourself.
Cheers to you, mate! Gues it takes a nation who has suffered under commies to know them.
@@CodeeXD you just gave the perfect definition for capitalism though...
I see no capitalist torturing people, but google Goli Otok or gulags. :)
8:56
*Hype, Hype, Hype*
I do so adore Ray Chase, he's such a marvelous VA.
It sounds a lot more like communism and marxism.
Nice walkthrough! (Thought you could call it that.. xD) and nice to see the community around WOW KILLER grow! love it :D