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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ม.ค. 2025
- This presentation was given on 06\30\2014. It was part of the Lipscomb University "Summer Celebration 2014". We are grateful to their generosity in enabling this video to be shared on TH-cam as a form of education for the world at large. For those interested in a quality education there is no finer institution to attend. for more information: www.lipscomb.edu/
For those unfamiliar with Edward Fudge and who want more information: www.edwardfudge...
Fudge is a humble, wise, scholarly, prophetic voice for the Church in our generation.
I have believed in conditional immortality for 30 years before I ever heard of Fudge. I'm thankful to find that there are many saints who agree with me. :)
I am very much a traditionalist when it comes to the doctrine of Hell, but I find Fudge's humility and knowledge to be very persuasive. I ordered his book "A Consuming Fire" yesterday. Perhaps he might change my mind after I read it.
I, as a traditionalist, believe in the intermediate state, so I believe he is in Heaven right now! Listening to him talk gives me the definite sense that he was and is a genuine Christian!
Learning from Fudge makes me have respect for Seventh Day Adventist Christians, who reject the traditionalist view of Hell and are Conditionalist in theology.
Ed was a great brother in the Lord! It’s a shame how he was treated by many within the Churches of Christ.
There is nothing more straight forward than "fear him who is able to destroy both body and soul in hell" don't be decieved by false teachers
Look up the meaning of hell in that verse. Then you might begin to understand
I've shown Edward Fudge's video to a fellow Chrsitian and he has come to believe that the bible doesn't say eternal conscious torment. It can be frustrating when eternal consious torture loving Christian's refuse to even contemplate the possibility, waste time commenting when they probably didn't even listen to more than 5 mins of the video. However I am sure it helps many Christian's that don't comment but might be deeply impacted by the research done by Mr. Fudge.
I sent it to my Christian friend and he has adopted this view of hell that Mr. Fudge has so we cannot get discouraged.
Edward's book first published in 1982 has been the most influential book written in behalf of the conditional Immortality view. He held the traditional view prior to doing research for Verdict Publication they published the first several runs and then gave him all the rights to publish it. there is a movie titled Hell and Mr Fudge based on true events in his life. i also have His testimony unaffected by artistic licence titled: Edward Fudge - My Life Story - Psalms 71.
@@fleetwd1 wow. Awesome. Are there any other Christian's that you can point me too that have this view of hell? Or any other youtube videos that are as well expressed as Edward?
@@JasonJohnSwartz yes there is a group of Evangelicals who have formed a group Rethinking Hell. Edward titled his classes at Lipscomb to their logo. they have .com FaceBook and TH-cam sites. they started 2014 after Chris Date had interviewed Edward several times and he moved to Edward's position and helped start the group. Chris Date, Peter Grice and Glenn Peoples are all founders of the group. there may be others also.
Definitely don’t get discouraged. I could not give my life to Christ until I discovered conditional immortality. Praise the lord for Edward!
I had the pleasure of meeting Edward fudge in the early 2000s / at Pepperdine University in Southern California. I must admit that teaching of annihilation didn’t sit well with me. At the time I was a young, immature believer.” With all the hyperbolic symbolic apocalyptic language in the Bible. We need to be careful and rightly divide the word being approved workmen of God that need not be ashamed.! There will be several’ different views on this subject - I think the deciding factor the opponents are unable to give a scriptural view of God, giving immortality to the wicked, in order to punish them throughout eternity” a lot of inconsistencies with the view of eternal conscious tournament!
thanks for sharing your journey. it was Edward's discovery that the immortality of the soul was not a biblical teaching that helped him turn from the traditional teaching.
I thought the Old Testament was speaking of shoel and perishing in death. Concept of hell came about Enoch’s time?
no actually Sheol is the grave or the underworld of the dead and both the righteous and the wicked go there, in Gen Jacob says he will go down to Sheol to mourn for Joseph. David says that his body will not be abandon in Sheol. And another Psalm says God will not abandon us in Sheol. there are many more these are only a few. I see you plan to get Edward's book he covers all of this thoroughly. "The Fire That Consumes" is the most complete study of Scripture, Intertestamental literature, and church history on the subject of final punishment of the wicked. He also has a book that outlines his beliefs that was written for average people and is less technical but still theologically accurate called "Hell a Final Word" This was written to accompany a Hollywood movie about his life titled "Hell and Mr Fudge" which is free to view on Amazon Prime and some other streaming services. it can also be purchased as a DVD and is worth having.
Didn’t Jesus go down to the people in prison that died in Noah’s day to preach the gospel, then rescue them and raised them up? That doesn’t sound like they perished.
Hell is not Sheol. it does not happen at death. it happens after the great white throne of judgment just after Jesus returns, not before. it happens as the world is made new and all things contrary to God and His Kingdom perish. the people from Noah's time were in the grave, or Sheol, not in hell.
Hell fire is after the throne judgement in revelation. It doesn't happen at death.
@@JasonJohnSwartz wdym hellfire isn’t real
@@realestatemarkets0 what is your beliefs or thoughtsvabout judgment and the the end of the wicked ? If you don't believe the bible then I understand why you don't believe in hellfire. If you do see the bible as authoritative then please share you views. 👍I don't believe since listening to Edward Fudge in eternal conscious torment. It never sat right with me. Annihilation seems more plausible to me than billion × billions × billions of years of conscious torment. Hard to attribute kinda punishment to God. Maybe I'm wrong.
@@JasonJohnSwartz I definitely believe everything the Bible says but it says nowhere about hellfire in the Word, I believe that the wicked will be destroyed and perish when the time comes, but I don’t believe that the wicked will be tortured for eternity I believe that they will be destroyed, perished, ceasing to exist
There is no question that Mr. Fudge is a humble and scholarly man but very possibly he neglected to read the very back of the book. Here is what the Bible actually states about everlasting punishment: Rev 14:9 If anyone receives the mark of the beast on his forehead or on his hand, he also will drink the wine of the wrath of God.....and will be tormented with the fire and brimstone; VS 11 and the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever they will have no rest day and night. Rev 20:10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone.... and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. Rev 20:15 And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life he was thrown into the lake of fire. The key to avoiding this awful terrible tragedy is to do exactly what Jesus told the religious leader of the Jews to do: "Truly, truly, unless one is born again, he cannot see the Kingdom of God." John 3:3 How? Repent of your sins and ask God for His mercy and to forgive you. Believe that Jesus is truly the Son of God and that he died in the cross to redeemed you with his precious blood. Trust in Him, confess Jesus as your Lord and Savior and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead. Receive His free gift of grace through your complete faith in him and you will become a child of God. John 1:12
Actually Edward covers all Scripture related to the subject of the punishment of the wicked. So should you want to understand how he deals with these and any other texts you can think of watch more of his videos including Q&A sessions or better yet read his exhaustive book "The Fire That Consumes" 1St edition first published 1982 or 3rd edition published in 2011 where he includes replies to the 17 people who wrote objections to his 1982 edition. there is no oee who covers the topic more completely than he. In the 1st edition at the end he appeals to those holding the traditional view to bring any evidence that he had not covered. The 17 authors who opposed his view did not bring one argument that he had not already covered but he still replies to them in the 3rd edition.
Oh he must of missed that
I will get your book. But this still seems mean. Like hitler lining up the people for the furnace. This is justice? There’s got to be something missing for the people - like my son -who was raised in the church, but hates it now because of its monster god.
yes the traditional view that says God will keep people alive forever to torture them endlessly has caused many to embrace atheism. It is unfortunate when we find there is no biblical support for such a view.
Too many verses that talk about consciousness in eternal suffering. To state otherwise is to appeal to emotion.
why don't you list them for us?
Matthew 25:46 - And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
fleetwd1 2 Thessalonians 1:9 - Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
fleetwd1 you can address these and I’ll get the popcorn 🍿
@@blackpatriot3 thank you for your reply. this claim you made is often made.
the text you offer first here does not address "consciousness in eternal suffering." You may be surprised at how few texts can be read that may suggest consciousness in eternal suffering but there are hundreds and hundreds of text that say the wicked die, or are destroyed. I was wondering if you knew those few texts. you can number them on one hand and still have fingers left. they are in Revelation and interpreting Revelation always requires you find the ideas taught elsewhere since much of it uses Symbols that have no place in reality as we know it. often the symbol used will be given a more real interpretation. like the Lake of Fire is said to be the 2nd death. death ends life. it does not preserve it endlessly.
now your text is saying the punishment will last everlasting. but the punishment is death it says nothing about the punishment ongoing and the dead being conscious for eternity. which is what we are looking for in the text. I hope this helps you narrow your search.