This has been so helpful, thanks! Currently working on a newly purchased (old) rally car with DMS50’s. We’ll get them running well enough for an event or two, but I know new dampers are in the future.
My brother just recently put a set of Flatout Suspension GR Lite offroad coilovers on his '05 Forester XT. They aren't full on rally coilovers, but for medium duty offroad suspension, they seem to be great coilovers.
Those are definitely an option. One of the teams we are working with to develop the Cusco's is coming from the Flatout suspension. They are all right to be sure, but we are getting some good improvements with the Cusco's. Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
Another awesome chat. This and pricing is why I try to shop at flatirons tuning. My daily “rally stance” GR on feal FPS +1. This is a great option but rallycross better be on the smooth side or you’ll have issues like any other oe type strut. The Cusco look nice and $3.5k is a reasonable poor mans setup, please update on these.
Great video! Incredibly helpful. So, aside from coilovers, can you discuss other aspects of the suspension? Bracing, bushings, supports, sway bars, etc? What about setup as far as recommended camber, toe, and caster for different surfaces? (Specifically for GC and GD chassis). Thanks!
Yoo, thanks for answering my question! Tein wasn't even on my radar but now is at the top of my list. Coming from the MTB world, I know how amazing hydrologic bottom outs are as they are speed-dependent, so there will be more damping with a higher impact and less harshness with slower speed impacts. It's super awesome to know they have that! And they are priced very reasonably compared to the Koni! Im curious if you can rebuild/ revalve the teins?
Thanks for watching and thanks for the question! As far as I know, the Tein Endura Pro Plus suspension is not rebuildable. Hope that helps and Stay Tuned!
Coilovers don't have to be unforgiving. A Rally suspension is definitely designed to be more forgiving because it has to soak up lots of bumps, but there are a lot of good tarmac coilovers out there that still ride very well. If you need some help considering options, please feel free to reach out to us on Live Chat. Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
@@TranceFur unfortunately, good spring and damper calibration can do a lot even for slammed coilovers. Travel is a key element in compliance, but it’s tricky for some aftermarket providers to offer extended travel when they only stock shock bodies that are design for scraping frame. An impossible balancing act with the majority of coilover customers just wanting to go ridiculously low
coilover is basically same-same as gravel long travel suspension.. still coilover... the only reason coilover of the "coilover" were harsh because most of the time out of package box, the came with super stiff spring rate meant for track/roadcourse/extreme lowering usage... any coilover actually can be made riding great and comfy if u matched them with reasonable spring rate stiffness... my forester SF5 ran cusco Zero3s inverted coilover meant for circuit/roadcourse semi slick tyre compound... they came with 11k front spring, and 9k rear spring... i just swap to 6k front and rear spring...now it rodes like dream when full familiy on board, stil handles pretty great on circuit....
Hey, love your expert channel. Question, do the GR STI group N wheel bearing hubs fit VA STI? Reason I ask if something in my suspension feels a tiny bit loose, like torque steer. Wheel bearings are pretty much the last thing I haven't checked/replaced so I want to replace them with Group N's but I only see 2011-2014 listed. I would think the VA bits carried over. I see the Moogs on your site, which of all the bearing hub assemblies would you recommend for spirited canyon runs on crap roads?
Thanks for watching and thanks for your question. You could certainly daily drive on these Cusco's. One of our testers has been for about a month now, and we have another project in the works that will be doing the same. Hope that helps and Stay Tuned!
Thanks for watching and thanks for the question. To a certain extent, that likely has something to do with it. The multi-link rear suspension is also why the 2008+ cars feel like they have more rear grip. It definitely changes the feel of the car. Hope that helps and Stay Tuned!
I ALWAYS THOUGHT DOUBLE WISHBONE WAS SUPERIOR TO MCPHERSON STRUTS BECAUSE OF CONTACT PATCH WAS MORE CONSISTENT THROUGHOUT THE RANGE OF MOTION...IS THIS A FAIR ASSESMENT OR AM I MISINTERPRETING THAT ? ALSO WAS HAPPY TO SEE THE SWITCH TO A MULTI LINK REAR SETUP
Thanks for watching and thanks for the question. Yes, the double wishbone suspension or multi-link for that matter does give you much more control of how the camber and toe changes through the suspensions range of motion. Typically though this comes with the penalty of less overall travel in the suspension, and typically that change in camber say is less than what you can potentially get with a McPherson suspension. There are definitely benefits to both, but for Rally Cars, McPherson really seems to be the best option. Hope that helps and Stay Tuned!
Any experience with the flatout or raceworks inverted strut suspension? They are within reason on pricing but I have no experience with them. Any other options? Someone force FEAL to make rally struts again?
How much static spring sag is optimal for trying to go for the softest spring rates for the car’s weight for gravel? Also if there is too little rebound in the rear, would this cause fishtailing, side to side, loose feeling as both rear tires oscillate over bumps?
We are now running the Reigers on our Rally car. They are very durable and work well, but we are still working to find the right setup to get them to work with way that we want. Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
Jon Cooley-Montana: "In this rally, you gotta get the routine of the rally first. Then you get the diffs. Then you get the suspension. Then you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the women."
![079: Suspension Setup Secrets From KW’s Head of Motorsport. [#PODCAST]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Mm8sqpQKFg8/mqdefault.jpg)
This is insanely good info. The "everything is a wear item" on a rally car is no joke. $$$$ keep it up guys!
Thanks very much! Really appreciate that.
Stay Tuned!
This has been so helpful, thanks! Currently working on a newly purchased (old) rally car with DMS50’s. We’ll get them running well enough for an event or two, but I know new dampers are in the future.
Excellent! Glad that you enjoyed the video.
Stay Tuned!
My brother just recently put a set of Flatout Suspension GR Lite offroad coilovers on his '05 Forester XT. They aren't full on rally coilovers, but for medium duty offroad suspension, they seem to be great coilovers.
Those are definitely an option. One of the teams we are working with to develop the Cusco's is coming from the Flatout suspension. They are all right to be sure, but we are getting some good improvements with the Cusco's.
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
Thank you so much for answering these questions!
Absolutely! Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
Another awesome chat. This and pricing is why I try to shop at flatirons tuning. My daily “rally stance” GR on feal FPS +1. This is a great option but rallycross better be on the smooth side or you’ll have issues like any other oe type strut. The Cusco look nice and $3.5k is a reasonable poor mans setup, please update on these.
Thanks for watching and thanks for your support!
Stay Tuned!
Thanks for answering my questions! Ill be looking into the cusco coilovers!
Excellent! Glad that the video helped.
Stay Tuned!
Great video! Incredibly helpful. So, aside from coilovers, can you discuss other aspects of the suspension? Bracing, bushings, supports, sway bars, etc? What about setup as far as recommended camber, toe, and caster for different surfaces? (Specifically for GC and GD chassis). Thanks!
Thanks and glad to hear that the information was helpful.
I'll add those topics to the list!
Stay Tuned!
Yoo, thanks for answering my question! Tein wasn't even on my radar but now is at the top of my list. Coming from the MTB world, I know how amazing hydrologic bottom outs are as they are speed-dependent, so there will be more damping with a higher impact and less harshness with slower speed impacts. It's super awesome to know they have that! And they are priced very reasonably compared to the Koni! Im curious if you can rebuild/ revalve the teins?
Thanks for watching and thanks for the question! As far as I know, the Tein Endura Pro Plus suspension is not rebuildable.
Hope that helps and Stay Tuned!
Would much rather have gravel rally long travel suspension on our STI but have coilovers. Pretty unforgiving for street driving. Yuck.
“Coilovers” don’t have to be harsh, contact a company that offers custom rates and valving and explain your desired setup.
@Zackparagon They don’t need to be harsh *if* you allow a reasonable amount of suspension travel.
Coilovers don't have to be unforgiving. A Rally suspension is definitely designed to be more forgiving because it has to soak up lots of bumps, but there are a lot of good tarmac coilovers out there that still ride very well.
If you need some help considering options, please feel free to reach out to us on Live Chat.
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
@@TranceFur unfortunately, good spring and damper calibration can do a lot even for slammed coilovers. Travel is a key element in compliance, but it’s tricky for some aftermarket providers to offer extended travel when they only stock shock bodies that are design for scraping frame. An impossible balancing act with the majority of coilover customers just wanting to go ridiculously low
coilover is basically same-same as gravel long travel suspension.. still coilover...
the only reason coilover of the "coilover" were harsh because most of the time out of package box, the came with super stiff spring rate meant for track/roadcourse/extreme lowering usage...
any coilover actually can be made riding great and comfy if u matched them with reasonable spring rate stiffness...
my forester SF5 ran cusco Zero3s inverted coilover meant for circuit/roadcourse semi slick tyre compound...
they came with 11k front spring, and 9k rear spring...
i just swap to 6k front and rear spring...now it rodes like dream when full familiy on board, stil handles pretty great on circuit....
love what you guys do
Thanks very much!
Stay Tuned!
Hey, love your expert channel.
Question, do the GR STI group N wheel bearing hubs fit VA STI?
Reason I ask if something in my suspension feels a tiny bit loose, like torque steer. Wheel bearings are pretty much the last thing I haven't checked/replaced so I want to replace them with Group N's but I only see 2011-2014 listed. I would think the VA bits carried over.
I see the Moogs on your site, which of all the bearing hub assemblies would you recommend for spirited canyon runs on crap roads?
awesome talk, thank you!
Absolutely! Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
Is there a rally type suspension for daily use? I only know of maybe Bilstein
Thanks for watching and thanks for your question. You could certainly daily drive on these Cusco's. One of our testers has been for about a month now, and we have another project in the works that will be doing the same.
Hope that helps and Stay Tuned!
Is the difference in suspension explain why my VA chassis rides so much softer than my gd chassis hatchback?
Thanks for watching and thanks for the question. To a certain extent, that likely has something to do with it. The multi-link rear suspension is also why the 2008+ cars feel like they have more rear grip. It definitely changes the feel of the car.
Hope that helps and Stay Tuned!
I ALWAYS THOUGHT DOUBLE WISHBONE WAS SUPERIOR TO MCPHERSON STRUTS BECAUSE OF CONTACT PATCH WAS MORE CONSISTENT THROUGHOUT THE RANGE OF MOTION...IS THIS A FAIR ASSESMENT OR AM I MISINTERPRETING THAT ? ALSO WAS HAPPY TO SEE THE SWITCH TO A MULTI LINK REAR SETUP
Thanks for watching and thanks for the question. Yes, the double wishbone suspension or multi-link for that matter does give you much more control of how the camber and toe changes through the suspensions range of motion. Typically though this comes with the penalty of less overall travel in the suspension, and typically that change in camber say is less than what you can potentially get with a McPherson suspension.
There are definitely benefits to both, but for Rally Cars, McPherson really seems to be the best option.
Hope that helps and Stay Tuned!
What ride height do you set for a gravel rally? Do you still set it an inch or so lower than stock ride height?
Any experience with the flatout or raceworks inverted strut suspension? They are within reason on pricing but I have no experience with them. Any other options? Someone force FEAL to make rally struts again?
How much static spring sag is optimal for trying to go for the softest spring rates for the car’s weight for gravel? Also if there is too little rebound in the rear, would this cause fishtailing, side to side, loose feeling as both rear tires oscillate over bumps?
I have DMS 50mm Tarmac on my 2.5rs. Can those still be serviced?
Thanks for watching and thanks for the question. I believe so, but I am not sure by who here in the states.
What about Reiger suspension?
It’s very good, and extremely expensive. Overkill for most people.
We are now running the Reigers on our Rally car. They are very durable and work well, but we are still working to find the right setup to get them to work with way that we want.
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
Maxspeeding rods 👍🏽👍🏽
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
Jon Cooley-Montana: "In this rally, you gotta get the routine of the rally first. Then you get the diffs. Then you get the suspension. Then you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the women."
Ha! Nice :-)
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
Didnt yet watch ths video but i want rally suspension these pothole roads are crazy
Ha! Well, I do hope that the video is helpful.
Stay Tuned!
CONTENT!!!!!!!!!!
how to raise car while lowering spring rate , while maximising travel is the question
NEED
VB WRX
FA24F/DIT