@@arielfetters5662 If you made a venn diagram of the things the cause fanaticism, this idiocy of religion would be the majority. too deny that is truly being fact adverse, another major feature in a venn diagram of ignorance is religion.
@@starpawsy The term is correct in the legal sense. Temporal referred to earthly issues while spiritual was the realm of the church. The House of Lords in England did, and I think might still do, make a distinction between the Lords Spiritual and the Lords Temporal.
You gotta admit that the actor hired to portray an anti-abortionist was perfect for the part. Not only that but the scene at the end when Stone reminds her of the baby that she'd forgotten all about in her quest to get that bomb set and working was perfect. She was sitting there with victory and smugness in her eyes and all over face like she was just tolerating Stone. She couldn't wait to answer a question from because she just knew she could twist it the way she wanted. Complete confidence. Then, as soon as he delivered his line that look in her eyes become a look of "Wha????". As her brain very quickly processed hos question and what it meant the rest of face dropped as well. I especially liked the little lip quiver she had as well. It too, was perfect. From Victory to Defeat with one question.
Agreed, the actress did a great job of conveying the near(?) fanaticism of that sort of person, and the shock when someone actually manages to get through to them. Many of the so-called "Right to lifers" don't give a crap about the baby once it's born.
I know what you mean. Ben Stone was indeed a compassionate Human being who valued life unlike her who was willing to sacrifice people for her cause and then say that they had it coming for doing something she felt was wrong. Seeing this witch taken down by Stone was pleasing as she did indeed kill an unborn child with her actions thus becoming what she hates.
'This case is being judged on the temporal plain' always makes me laugh, but that last line from Stone...absolute mike drop. Game, set, and match. He knew he had her the moment she stepped up to the witness stand. Anyone who can describe trading lives as balancing the scales is downright terrifying.
The entire political right is all about measuring lives with scales, but they’re more about making sure the killing side is heavier. More death and suffering means you get happy conservatives. They can only actually feel happiness when killing or hurting others.
@Tony Mario most people would agree that they would save an adult person rather than a fetus in an artificial womb though. So no a fetus and a human is not balanced equally on a scale.
@@ericaewenin242 People argue that over and over again. Most neutral people say it's a matter of opinion. It might not match the dictionary definition but that could be considered subjective too. (I do happen to agree with you though they aren't a child yet) but they DO have some semblance of sentience. They move inside the womb to an extent and such things so they have a form of awareness. In my book it depends how far along one is.
Her defence was flimsy as you can't go breaking the law by blowing up abortion clinics and killing a fellow Human being to try and get your way and then say "he or she deserved it because she was going to get an abortion" as well as "abortion is evil" and expect the jury to ignore the rule of law and undermine law and order by letting you off. She was quite naive and failed to realize that her argument was hypocritical until it was too late.
Stone: If abortion is murder,no matter how you feel about Mary Donavan, aren't you guilty for the murder of her unborn child? Defendant: 0_0 Someone in the back: *Congratulations fool, you played yourself*
I love the moment at 7:58, because she gets put in her place and gets slammed with the realization that she’s just as evil as the people she claims she was trying to stop. I love when these self righteous villains get slammed with the fact that not only are they wrong, but they’re guilty of hypocrisy
Actually shes even worse, her action resulted in the gruesome death of the mother and the unborn child. Until Stone pointed out she killed the very thing she wanted to protect she was willing to do this over and over again if given the chance at other similar locations. She was basically a terrorist
@@jmmproductions6741 "Your honor, since Miss Schwimmer is adamant that the termination of a pregnancy is murder, I request we respect her wishes... and add murder to the charges against her"
ugh swimmer was so smug and self righteous "I'm against abortion because it's murder" stone "but you blew up a pregnant woman you know that killed her baby too right " I just loved watching her face when the irony finally sunk in my favorite stone moment
Can we just- “And regardless of your personal feelings you are not being asked to decide a moral issue but a legal issue” Anybody else love the fact that the first words said out of this mans mouth **IN THE 1990’s** was that religion and legal cases (that can/will cause damage to a person -in this case death-) are two damn DIFFERENT THING
@@mayjones1 except we can only in good faith decide a moral issue. It was illegal for whites to marry blacks in my parents' generation but there's no way I'd find guilty anyone who did.
@@kimricautumn6918 i mean if she wanted to use a moral arguement she could argue all the way to the supreme court to change the law... but obviously she failed at the moral issue so
There’s a reason why there’s a separation of government and the church in America’s constitution yet we all seem to be forgetting that sadly. And that’s coming from a catholic lol
@@oceanelf2512 They DID have an episode about an animal rights activist committing a crime. A man was killed while they were trying to rescue animals. Unlike this case, it wasn't intentional. But the young man was still found guilty of manslaughter, and based on the details of the case, rightly so. However, JUST like this case, he was spurred on by fanatic handlers. In the end the handlers told him to take a deal because he had already made a point for their cause. But the kid was so brainwashed he refused, it cost him many years in prison.
The pro choice are the looneys. The left/democrats have a history of dehumanizing those who are not "convenient". When they dominated the Confederate government, democrats considered blacks as 3/5 human. Now, they want people to believe that unborn children are somehow not children.
That last line was fucking brilliant. It was simple and almost casual in its delivery but that single sentence had about as much power as the bomb that dropped on Hiroshima. Gods, I love Ben Stone. Why don't they ever rerun these episodes?!
The kicker? She knew that Donovan was pregnant when she went through with her plan. She just didn’t think about the fact that killing the mom also kills anything they’re carrying, especially when she was so convinced of her righteous cause.
This scene where he asks her that last question is amazing and I don't think people get why it's so good. Stone didn't have to ask this question, he knew there was no chance she'd be found not guilty and knew that she knew that. All she cared about was being a martyr for the cause and knew this belief wouldn't die with her going to prison. Stone most likely knew that, and probably knew some of her followers were in there as well. Stone asking that, destroyed her whole argument though because she did the same thing she claims is an atrocity. While it won't stop every one of them from thinking that way, it does at least point out the hypocrisy in their way of thinking which even she realizes after Stone asks that question out loud.
Stone made her realize that she's as bad as the people she's been railing against. She justified killing those people. Now she knows she's one of them. She can do nothing but silently condemn herself. I think this was Stone's best moment on the show.
TBF, at that point it was no longer about defending herself. It was about making a statement and getting more people on her side. Unfortunately for her, Stone’s final question demolished that.
Caring more about a fetus than a fully-realized human being is absolutely disgusting. I know this is fiction, but there are people like this in the world, and it's awful.
And now it's just our reality...the Supreme Court no longer seems to recognize a woman has the right to privacy with regards to her own bodily autonomy. Its an awful time for civil rights in America, worst in my lifetime.
@@bernlin2000 The Supreme Court hasn't ruled on it yet, it was simply a draft by one of the Justices and they have yet to vote on it. I'm not even sure if they're arguing it at the moment. Still, the Conservative judges hoped to sneak in an overturning of Roe vs Wade while everyone was distracted with the war in Ukraine and the economic fallout from it. The fact that they're actually trying to do this sort of thing is disturbing but luckily, someone blew the whistle so now America's up in arms about it once again.
The scary thing is that this isn't fiction. These specific characters and court proceedings are but the actions, ideologies, and misinformation they are built around are not.
Not to mention but isn’t it kinda contradictory to do something like this by there own standards? I mean if the bomb killed one of the pregnant women, wouldn’t it also kill the fetus?
Prosecutor: "We're willing to give you a lighter sentence if you admit to the crime." Defendant: "No" Also Defendant, like 2 hours later: Admits to the crime anyway and guarantees she's getting the maximum sentence.
Right after the prosecutor asked his final question, I just imagined Red from That 70's Show sitting in the juror's box saying, "Didn't think it through did ya?........Dumbass!"
I'd like to think Stone had that question at the ready almost from the start but wanted her to essentially bury herself in her own self righteousness. Let her try preaching her deluded nonsense, she convinced the jury that she's a nut because she feels no remorse for her actions, in fact she defends them with pride, the guilty verdict was assured but she would go on still convinced of her infallibility. That's when Stone goes for it and absolutely destroys her. She's not only going to prison, but she's now going to have to live with the fact that she betrayed the very thing she stood for.
What I hate the most is that she thinks she’s completely in the right, and superior in her motives. Despite being advised against testifying she still does it! The final question is satisfying!
She was absolutely nuts when she went on that stand... So confident that she could get away with killing a woman who wanted abortion. Why dont people put up a place who would take in children of mothers who don't want their pregnancies? Like give them the necessities of carrying to full term because not all women have the means to carry to full term.
@@samwilson188 Yeah. All that talk about caring for the fetus and the baby having a right to live. But then what about the person in whose body that baby lives? Not a single pro-lifer has ever mentioned ANYTHING about the mother's well-being, health or mental state. All we hear is "Baby this, baby that". Who cares what happens to the mother right?
@@dreamhobbiz and to top it off, once the kid’s born, they suddenly go from wanting to do everything to help it to “Nothin’ to do with me”. Almost every “pro-lifer” I’ve met, when asked if we should provide free school meals for children has said no because “meh tax dollars!” To quote the late great George Carlin, if you’re preborn, they want you, if you’re newborn, you’re screwed
@@dreamhobbiz Not even then most don’t even care about the babies. Someone said it best one day when I was researching this, they are not pro life they are forced birth.
The look on that woman’s face when she realises she killed someone’s unborn baby was heartbreaking. No matter where our beliefs come from, we should be fully aware of the consequences of our words and actions. Blindly following one line of morality isn’t acceptable.
that look was her heartbreak maybe and irrelevant. Its meant to be satisfying/gratifying that a murderer doesn't come out on top as intended by L&W showrunners. After watching that clip, if it only made your heart break for ms schwimmer, i have to wonder how many planned parenthoods you've blown up
Both of you are correct, and both of your feelings towards the ending shot are valid, if only so we can all acknowledge that the actress playing the pro-life fanatic (and that is what she is, this is not to represent the majority of pro-lifers, it’s to represent the ones who go too far, which leads to fanatics that end up committing crimes for their cause like this one-anyways) did a phenomenal job with her portrayal and emotional delivery at the end. It is both very satisfying from a viewer’s perspective, and heartbreaking from her perspective as well, and the actress delivered that all with a slow change of expression
@@WhoTookPlockrock Is that what the nuns told you? They LIED to you, then. Machiavelli was on the outs, with the Medicis; they had exiled him from Florence. He wanted to get back in their good graces. In "The Prince", Machiavelli wrote the dedication: "To Lorenzo The Magnificent, Son Of Piero Di Medici". Does that sound like "mocking" to you?
This makes me so mad. Killing a woman just because you don't agree with abortion is sick. You're not pro-life if you don't value the mother's like too.
That last question always gives me chills. It’s at that moment the delusional waste ( great performance by the actress btw) finally understands the full irony of her situation.
I Absolutely Love How Stone Completely Owns This Uptight Religious Zealot He Says That Line She Is Stone Faced She Knows She Is Done Like A Mike Tyson Uppercut She Won't Get Up From That One Folks...
I swear this episode is what made me ultimately decide I was pro-choice. The evangelical hypocrisy of the Holy Rollers absolutely sickens me to this day. Btw, you can be against abortion but still be pro-choice. I could never go thru with it myself but I will fight for others to make that decision for themselves until my last breath
@@frenchmontana961 Why? The Jungle by Sinclair revealed to Americans how badly their meat was being handled, and led to change. Philadelphia (2003) greatly assisted educating the public about the misconceptions of HIV/AIDS and the LGBT community. See It Now by Edward Murrow led to the end of McCarthyism. Fred Rogers and the children's educational programs we see on television, and to an extent, the domination of VCR. Why should a television show be less influential, educational, or inspiring than a book, a film, a speech, or anything? It's the impact, what you take from what you see, the changes that you experience that matters. I'll always remember Jurassic Park 3 after Billy stole raptor eggs with the "best intentions" and Grant replied, "With the best intentions!? Some of the worst things imaginable have been done with the 'best intentions.' You know, as far as I'm concerned, you're no better than the people who built this place." I was a child, and that stuck with me, taught me that it doesn't matter what I intend to do, but what will occur if I do it. So what's your intention here? To attack a person? Demean them for using a television show to witness the hypocrisy of extremism? Or to solicit a response for a human conversation?
Trinidad Tooke That's exactly what it means to be pro-choice. You, personally, choose to never have an abortion, but you'll still support those who do choose abortion. There's quite a few pro-choices who think abortion is sad, but understand that taking away someone's choice is even sadder.
The total, unrestrained cruelty of the anti-choice gang is on full display here. They writers were careful to add in that sneaky line “ the others wouldn’t have understood” to walk the statement back, but in real life that’s not true. Her friends would have not only understood, but they also would have helped make and plant the bomb, and prevented any warning to the clinic. A real anti-choice monster would never have felt the regret she was implied to at the end either. Having been forced to work closely with these things, they’d have felt a sexual pleasure at the thought of stamping out human life.
True. They never stop to think that in the process, they are stamping out the life of the very being they purport to want to save - namely, the baby's. How the hell do they expect to save the baby's life if they kill the mother? Just goes to show how stupid their thinking is.
She was playing Texas Hold'em No Limit with Stone. Was dealt a pocket pair of Jesus and thought she was winning through the flop and the turn until her pair was washed by the river.
When you die you're going to have to justify your choices and if you have to explain the choice of one life over another as "Balancing the scales" you're not gonna pass those pearly gates
It just goes to show it's incredibly easy to overlook your own hypocrisy when it comes to something you believe too strongly in without even realising it.
Just like those flat earth fanatics. Once they get the idea into their head, its like the blind leading the blind. Nothing and no one is gonna sway them.
7:40 that is one of the greatest Hypocrite reveals I’ve ever seen in anything. I mean right there on her face she realized she became the very problem she was fighting so hard against but in the worst way possible.
2:03 Whoa, whoa, hold up. That attorney needed to tell his client to STFU because every defendant is their own worst enemy (it's why we have the 5th amendment). Notice later that he's not exactly 100% thrilled with her idea of putting the victim on trial. She got exactly what was coming to her, but that doesn't mean she needed to make it easier for Stone. ... And her insistence on "telling her side of the story", and her performance, is exactly why we have defense attorneys and why we should listen to their counsel.
The attorney and judge both tried to warn her not to testify but she was willing to give up her 5th amendment right and neither could stop her because she felt she was on a crusade. That is why Stone asked his only question. To make her realize that she was not a martyr.
Disgusting, the way these people think and how feel so entitled to make decisions over someone else's life is absolutely disgusting, the worst thing is that there are still a lot of those arounf the world
This question has stuck in my mind for years. Masterful backing the murderer into a corner. also points out what is wrong with the thinking of most pro-lifers. As long as the baby is in the womb, killing it is murder, but once it's born, it can starve to death or die of disease for all they care.
@@Jemalacane0 Yup. No uterus = no opinion. Everyone with the capacity to be pregnant is entitled to privacy regarding their medical needs, and that includes not having a child if one becomes pregnant. No matter what, people have autonomy and so if someone doesn't want to / can't physically or mentally sustain / for any reason have a child, it is their right to not have a child. No one has the right to force a person to be pregnant and suffer through all the physical and physiological changes and conditions that make up pregnancy. Also, people are granted the freedom of religion, which encompasses freedom from religion, and considering most pro-life advocates have religious motives it would be unconstitutional to make abortion illegal because of morality or religious causes. Come back with an actual case for personhood for a fetus and maybe people will consider your logic.
Ah, the nineties, when a jury of New Yorkers nullifying an anti-abortion murder was a real threat. "In this state capital punishment is against the law." - I was sure that wasn't true of New York in 1991, but apparently it was actually true until 1995, then it was brought back for nine years. Basically, post-Furman capital punishment in New York had almost the exact tenure of Christopher Reeve's wheelchair. Also, best objection ever.
Stone: "Your Honour, I have only one question to ask of the defendant." Ms. Schwimmer: "Which is?" Stone: "If abortion is murder, no matter how you feel about Mary Donovan, aren't you guilty of the murder of her unborn child?" JR on commentary: "STONE COLD! STONE COLD! STONE COLD! STONE COLD!"
Imagine, for a moment, that you are a big-time lawyer who scored a big case with a lucrative client. And she decides to go on the stand and basically say "I did it I fuckin whacked em and I'd do it again, too!"
Caroline Kava (Rose Schwimmer) is an underrated and unappreciated actress. She played Tom Cruise's mother in "Born on the Fourth of July", Mickey Rourke's wife in "Year of the Dragon" and many other supporting roles.
7:48 That is both so satisfying and infuriating at the the same time. Satisfying when she realized she became the one thing she hates the most. But infuriating that she just realized that. Like she really not think about that?
For those who didn't quite understand the question Stone was asking: He was asking her if, since the victim didn't have the abortion before her death, wouldn't that mean she was also guilty for the death of the victim's unborn child. He asked in a weird way, but this is what he meant.
I'm almost certain they would've tried her for the baby's death as well. I'm pro-choice and that activist actually killed someone and her unborn child in a terroristic way rather than the legal, medical way like how abortions are done 😂🤔
![[UNCUT] “บอสณวัฒน์” ลากไส้!! ใครหนุนหลัง "แม่ตั๊ก ป๋าเบียร์" I คนดังนั่งเคลียร์ I 30 ก.ย. 67](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/QlD7mU2KKRk/mqdefault.jpg)
That last shot by Stone was one of the biggest he ever delivered.
TURN DOWN FOR WHAT
I sincerely agree with you. He shot down that self righteous attitude and it felt great!!
Yes I agree, she got herself cornered and she wasn't getting out of it this time.
I can hear J.R yelling Rock Bottom! Rock Bottom!
he was like submarine captain firing a torpedo to sink a battleship.
He pulled a reverse Uno on her 😅
And a draw four🤣🤣🤣
That was such an obvious "Gotcha, Biotch!!!"
Ikr lol
@@garnet9788 naw he pulled the 8 card draw 2 lmao
*suprise pikachu face*
"She was gonna kill that baby, and that's bad. So I killed her AND the baby."
Impeccable logic.
Unfortunately, that's how Fanatics think.
Double Kill
@@arielfetters5662 You mean the religious. Fanaticism is just par for the course for religion, even the moderates.
@@shakesfirst2443 But there's fanaticism in more than just religion. So when I say fanaticism, I mean in any form. Religious, political, whatever.
@@arielfetters5662 If you made a venn diagram of the things the cause fanaticism, this idiocy of religion would be the majority. too deny that is truly being fact adverse, another major feature in a venn diagram of ignorance is religion.
This episode delivered my most favourite Ben Stone line: "Objection, this case is being judged on the temporal plane, your honour."
Best objection ever
Not "temporal". "Physical". Big difference.
@@starpawsy The term is correct in the legal sense. Temporal referred to earthly issues while spiritual was the realm of the church. The House of Lords in England did, and I think might still do, make a distinction between the Lords Spiritual and the Lords Temporal.
@@LordZontar I think that makes us 1 strike 1 ball :D
You gotta admit that the actor hired to portray an anti-abortionist was perfect for the part. Not only that but the scene at the end when Stone reminds her of the baby that she'd forgotten all about in her quest to get that bomb set and working was perfect. She was sitting there with victory and smugness in her eyes and all over face like she was just tolerating Stone. She couldn't wait to answer a question from because she just knew she could twist it the way she wanted. Complete confidence. Then, as soon as he delivered his line that look in her eyes become a look of "Wha????". As her brain very quickly processed hos question and what it meant the rest of face dropped as well. I especially liked the little lip quiver she had as well. It too, was perfect. From Victory to Defeat with one question.
"Fanaticism consists of redoubling your effort when you have forgotten your aim." - George Santayana
Wysiwyg101 you could see her confidence and smugness just shatter in less than a second.
@@brokenpieces5852 Yupp...and it was awesome!!
Agreed, the actress did a great job of conveying the near(?) fanaticism of that sort of person, and the shock when someone actually manages to get through to them. Many of the so-called "Right to lifers" don't give a crap about the baby once it's born.
She thought she's about to go down like a martyr lol
I think it’s hysterical she called him the Devil. Stone was a very compassionate person despite his job.
Especially since she was the one advocating that killing people for her cause was totally above board.
I know what you mean. Ben Stone was indeed a compassionate Human being who valued life unlike her who was willing to sacrifice people for her cause and then say that they had it coming for doing something she felt was wrong.
Seeing this witch taken down by Stone was pleasing as she did indeed kill an unborn child with her actions thus becoming what she hates.
LOL
Exactly. The only people he wanted to suffer were the ones he believed did bad things.
He cared for justice, not winning.
'This case is being judged on the temporal plain' always makes me laugh, but that last line from Stone...absolute mike drop. Game, set, and match. He knew he had her the moment she stepped up to the witness stand.
Anyone who can describe trading lives as balancing the scales is downright terrifying.
A fetus isn't a child
The entire political right is all about measuring lives with scales, but they’re more about making sure the killing side is heavier. More death and suffering means you get happy conservatives. They can only actually feel happiness when killing or hurting others.
@Tony Mario most people would agree that they would save an adult person rather than a fetus in an artificial womb though. So no a fetus and a human is not balanced equally on a scale.
@@ericaewenin242 People argue that over and over again. Most neutral people say it's a matter of opinion. It might not match the dictionary definition but that could be considered subjective too. (I do happen to agree with you though they aren't a child yet) but they DO have some semblance of sentience. They move inside the womb to an extent and such things so they have a form of awareness. In my book it depends how far along one is.
@@ericaewenin242 aww how cute a 🤡
Isn’t it funny how her entire defense can be unraveled all at once by Stone pulling one hanging thread?
Especially how flimsy they are built. House of cards, I tell ya.
Anything based on a Holy Book can be undone as quickly.
Her defence was flimsy as you can't go breaking the law by blowing up abortion clinics and killing a fellow Human being to try and get your way and then say "he or she deserved it because she was going to get an abortion" as well as "abortion is evil" and expect the jury to ignore the rule of law and undermine law and order by letting you off.
She was quite naive and failed to realize that her argument was hypocritical until it was too late.
I remember watching this and thinking Stone dropped the mic with that question.
@@sarahakm
Dropped the mic ...?
... more like dropped a 200lb anvil ...
I just loved how Stone pointed out to Ms. Schwimmer that when the women died her unborn baby died too, the look on her face was priceless.
but she didnt intend to kill the woman (and her baby) in the first place ?
@@gobblelevclass3nuclearsubm393 True however it is beside the point Stone was making to this to was a fanatic.
She should have taken the plea bargain
@@wessltov Her pride and sense of self-righteousness wouldn't let her.
@@saharruwaydah I know.
If she had taken the plea bargain, he whole world wouldn't have fallen apart before her eyes (serves her right)
“ I don’t make deals with the Devil” well you already signed away your soul when you killed a pregnant girl so, seems hypocritical
Just serving someone isn't really making a deal with them.
Stone: If abortion is murder,no matter how you feel about Mary Donavan, aren't you guilty for the murder of her unborn child?
Defendant: 0_0
Someone in the back: *Congratulations fool, you played yourself*
“...on paper, this was a good idea.”
A fabulous scene. Well written and superbly acted.
It hurt itself in its confusion!
it was almost like she hadn't thought of that
Wooow...further proves she made an abortion out of blowing the place up with the unborn child.
"I don't make deals with the devil."
Yes, she does. She just didn't recognize him.
No, The Devil just loves to transform into an angel of light.
@@maxcardunthe false prophet
Love this comment
She does make a deal with him to end the lives of those unborn infants.
Lucifer Morningstar: I have never met that woman!
I love the moment at 7:58, because she gets put in her place and gets slammed with the realization that she’s just as evil as the people she claims she was trying to stop. I love when these self righteous villains get slammed with the fact that not only are they wrong, but they’re guilty of hypocrisy
Actually shes even worse, her action resulted in the gruesome death of the mother and the unborn child. Until Stone pointed out she killed the very thing she wanted to protect she was willing to do this over and over again if given the chance at other similar locations. She was basically a terrorist
Yesss they should be ashamed of their hypocrisy
Yeah, but what's even better is it was set up from 2:34 . That's why he asked her to reconsider not taking a plea.
@@jmmproductions6741 "Your honor, since Miss Schwimmer is adamant that the termination of a pregnancy is murder, I request we respect her wishes... and add murder to the charges against her"
god help her now...
I loved the way Stone owned that self-righteous blowhard at the end!
ugh swimmer was so smug and self righteous "I'm against abortion because it's murder" stone "but you blew up a pregnant woman you know that killed her baby too right " I just loved watching her face when the irony finally sunk in my favorite stone moment
$10. gets you $20. she hung herself in her cell.
Can we just-
“And regardless of your personal feelings you are not being asked to decide a moral issue but a legal issue”
Anybody else love the fact that the first words said out of this mans mouth **IN THE 1990’s** was that religion and legal cases (that can/will cause damage to a person -in this case death-) are two damn DIFFERENT THING
Some how people don't understand that in 2019, it's mind boggling
@@mayjones1 except we can only in good faith decide a moral issue. It was illegal for whites to marry blacks in my parents' generation but there's no way I'd find guilty anyone who did.
@@kimricautumn6918 i mean if she wanted to use a moral arguement she could argue all the way to the supreme court to change the law... but obviously she failed at the moral issue so
@@kimricautumn6918 moral issues have no business in a court of law. especially if youre using said moral issue as a cheap excuse justify murder.
There’s a reason why there’s a separation of government and the church in America’s constitution yet we all seem to be forgetting that sadly. And that’s coming from a catholic lol
She played the pro life loony so well. Stone nailed her at the end. Kudos to the writers of the episode
N if they'd done an episode where an animal rights activist was actually guilty of the crime, that would've been great.ow
@@oceanelf2512 They DID have an episode about an animal rights activist committing a crime. A man was killed while they were trying to rescue animals. Unlike this case, it wasn't intentional. But the young man was still found guilty of manslaughter, and based on the details of the case, rightly so.
However, JUST like this case, he was spurred on by fanatic handlers. In the end the handlers told him to take a deal because he had already made a point for their cause. But the kid was so brainwashed he refused, it cost him many years in prison.
Pro life is looney?
@@oceanelf2512 There was such an episode.
The pro choice are the looneys. The left/democrats have a history of dehumanizing those who are not "convenient". When they dominated the Confederate government, democrats considered blacks as 3/5 human. Now, they want people to believe that unborn children are somehow not children.
That last line was fucking brilliant. It was simple and almost casual in its delivery but that single sentence had about as much power as the bomb that dropped on Hiroshima. Gods, I love Ben Stone. Why don't they ever rerun these episodes?!
They do, you just gotta catch them at the right time.
@@ThMnWthNNm or get Peacock
If I was him I'd say the line then just stare at her with an emotionless face until she cried
you see the look of realization on her face.
"Wait she had a child....? And after what I just said... oh crap."
The kicker? She knew that Donovan was pregnant when she went through with her plan. She just didn’t think about the fact that killing the mom also kills anything they’re carrying, especially when she was so convinced of her righteous cause.
This scene where he asks her that last question is amazing and I don't think people get why it's so good. Stone didn't have to ask this question, he knew there was no chance she'd be found not guilty and knew that she knew that. All she cared about was being a martyr for the cause and knew this belief wouldn't die with her going to prison. Stone most likely knew that, and probably knew some of her followers were in there as well. Stone asking that, destroyed her whole argument though because she did the same thing she claims is an atrocity. While it won't stop every one of them from thinking that way, it does at least point out the hypocrisy in their way of thinking which even she realizes after Stone asks that question out loud.
That shot was one of the best ever. No words, no response, nothing from her. He smashed her.
It was a one hit KO!
Her lips trembling when she realizes her logic is flawed. Priceless !
Stone made her realize that she's as bad as the people she's been railing against. She justified killing those people. Now she knows she's one of them. She can do nothing but silently condemn herself. I think this was Stone's best moment on the show.
“Objection: this case is being judged on the temporal plane, your honor” 😂😂😂
Michael Moriarty is the master of tempo and voice pitch modulation. Balls to the walls best. The coolest cat in that ensemble.
Ben Stone coming in clutch with that Buzzard Beater.
He beats buzzards with the best of them.
He hit em with the Michael Jordan
When a judge says it isn’t a good idea to testify on your own behalf you should probably listen to the judge.
TBF, at that point it was no longer about defending herself. It was about making a statement and getting more people on her side. Unfortunately for her, Stone’s final question demolished that.
A judge and a lawyer
that look on her face at the end was wow
"I don't make deals with the devil"
Yes...making deals with one's self does not make much sense.
"I don't make deals with the devil."
If I was there, I would have said "she just called me the devil!"
Caring more about a fetus than a fully-realized human being is absolutely disgusting. I know this is fiction, but there are people like this in the world, and it's awful.
And now it's just our reality...the Supreme Court no longer seems to recognize a woman has the right to privacy with regards to her own bodily autonomy. Its an awful time for civil rights in America, worst in my lifetime.
@@bernlin2000 The Supreme Court hasn't ruled on it yet, it was simply a draft by one of the Justices and they have yet to vote on it. I'm not even sure if they're arguing it at the moment.
Still, the Conservative judges hoped to sneak in an overturning of Roe vs Wade while everyone was distracted with the war in Ukraine and the economic fallout from it. The fact that they're actually trying to do this sort of thing is disturbing but luckily, someone blew the whistle so now America's up in arms about it once again.
Lol it's 2022 and your country is still stupid when it comes to this subject.
The scary thing is that this isn't fiction. These specific characters and court proceedings are but the actions, ideologies, and misinformation they are built around are not.
Not to mention but isn’t it kinda contradictory to do something like this by there own standards? I mean if the bomb killed one of the pregnant women, wouldn’t it also kill the fetus?
Prosecutor: "We're willing to give you a lighter sentence if you admit to the crime."
Defendant: "No"
Also Defendant, like 2 hours later: Admits to the crime anyway and guarantees she's getting the maximum sentence.
*Top ten Uno reverse card moments*
Is it just me or Mojo should make a video about the top ten “uno reverse” moments on television.
Wth is Uno?!!
@@jaxcoss5790 It's a card game
@@sensiblecryptid4406 Oh, okay. I've never heard of it.
@@squeakymcbeal6193 that’s exactly what I was thinking
Right after the prosecutor asked his final question, I just imagined Red from That 70's Show sitting in the juror's box saying, "Didn't think it through did ya?........Dumbass!"
I'd like to think Stone had that question at the ready almost from the start but wanted her to essentially bury herself in her own self righteousness. Let her try preaching her deluded nonsense, she convinced the jury that she's a nut because she feels no remorse for her actions, in fact she defends them with pride, the guilty verdict was assured but she would go on still convinced of her infallibility. That's when Stone goes for it and absolutely destroys her. She's not only going to prison, but she's now going to have to live with the fact that she betrayed the very thing she stood for.
That last line Stone delivered was brutal. There was no coming back from that on her part.
What I hate the most is that she thinks she’s completely in the right, and superior in her motives. Despite being advised against testifying she still does it!
The final question is satisfying!
That's why we have the right against self-incrimination.
Ben:"Your honor, I have one last question..." FORM BLAZING SWORD!!!! BEN STONE DISCOVERS THE POWER OF LOGIC!!!
That moment where she Eliza's the baby didn't magically survive the explosion
She was absolutely nuts when she went on that stand... So confident that she could get away with killing a woman who wanted abortion.
Why dont people put up a place who would take in children of mothers who don't want their pregnancies? Like give them the necessities of carrying to full term because not all women have the means to carry to full term.
That would require them to actually care about the women, of which they don’t.
@@samwilson188 Yeah. All that talk about caring for the fetus and the baby having a right to live. But then what about the person in whose body that baby lives? Not a single pro-lifer has ever mentioned ANYTHING about the mother's well-being, health or mental state. All we hear is "Baby this, baby that". Who cares what happens to the mother right?
@@dreamhobbiz and to top it off, once the kid’s born, they suddenly go from wanting to do everything to help it to “Nothin’ to do with me”. Almost every “pro-lifer” I’ve met, when asked if we should provide free school meals for children has said no because “meh tax dollars!” To quote the late great George Carlin, if you’re preborn, they want you, if you’re newborn, you’re screwed
@@dreamhobbiz
Not even then most don’t even care about the babies. Someone said it best one day when I was researching this, they are not pro life they are forced birth.
@@samwilson188 Just like you don't care about the babies. I'm glad we agree on something.
Don’t you just love when Stone makes a guilty person to eat crow?
The look on that woman’s face when she realises she killed someone’s unborn baby was heartbreaking. No matter where our beliefs come from, we should be fully aware of the consequences of our words and actions. Blindly following one line of morality isn’t acceptable.
that look was her heartbreak maybe and irrelevant. Its meant to be satisfying/gratifying that a murderer doesn't come out on top as intended by L&W showrunners. After watching that clip, if it only made your heart break for ms schwimmer, i have to wonder how many planned parenthoods you've blown up
Both of you are correct, and both of your feelings towards the ending shot are valid, if only so we can all acknowledge that the actress playing the pro-life fanatic (and that is what she is, this is not to represent the majority of pro-lifers, it’s to represent the ones who go too far, which leads to fanatics that end up committing crimes for their cause like this one-anyways) did a phenomenal job with her portrayal and emotional delivery at the end. It is both very satisfying from a viewer’s perspective, and heartbreaking from her perspective as well, and the actress delivered that all with a slow change of expression
I have to say it. He earned it. In this clip...
Ben Stone was Stone Cold.
I love how Ben Stone nailed her with that last question
The look on her face when she finally realizes what she’s done
0:26 In Catholic School, i was taught that the ends NEVER justify the means.
Machiavelli wrote "The Prince" for the Medici family, several of whom became Pope.
Your nuns were lying to you.
@@starguy2718 The nuns in my school taught me math and biology. My religious teachers were all regular people.
@@starguy2718 So you're little theory about my being brainwashed by nuns and priests, doesn't wash. Sorry.
@@starguy2718 Machiavelli wrote "The Prince" to mock the very practices he was paid to endorse.
@@WhoTookPlockrock Is that what the nuns told you? They LIED to you, then.
Machiavelli was on the outs, with the Medicis; they had exiled him from Florence. He wanted to get back in their good graces. In "The Prince", Machiavelli wrote the dedication: "To Lorenzo The Magnificent, Son Of Piero Di Medici".
Does that sound like "mocking" to you?
This makes me so mad. Killing a woman just because you don't agree with abortion is sick. You're not pro-life if you don't value the mother's like too.
7:24 when she said the scales are balanced, I inadvertently thought of Thanos.
sammmmeee
That last question always gives me chills. It’s at that moment the delusional waste ( great performance by the actress btw) finally understands the full irony of her situation.
That was the greatest reverse Uno of all time
This. Definitely this.
YEP!
The Acting in this scene is amazing. Just show how fantastic the acting in Law and order is
I Absolutely Love How Stone Completely Owns This Uptight Religious Zealot He Says That Line She Is Stone Faced She Knows She Is Done Like A Mike Tyson Uppercut She Won't Get Up From That One Folks...
I swear this episode is what made me ultimately decide I was pro-choice. The evangelical hypocrisy of the Holy Rollers absolutely sickens me to this day. Btw, you can be against abortion but still be pro-choice. I could never go thru with it myself but I will fight for others to make that decision for themselves until my last breath
You're an idiot if you make your political decisions based on television shows
Another Trini, what up brethren?
@@frenchmontana961 Why? The Jungle by Sinclair revealed to Americans how badly their meat was being handled, and led to change. Philadelphia (2003) greatly assisted educating the public about the misconceptions of HIV/AIDS and the LGBT community. See It Now by Edward Murrow led to the end of McCarthyism. Fred Rogers and the children's educational programs we see on television, and to an extent, the domination of VCR.
Why should a television show be less influential, educational, or inspiring than a book, a film, a speech, or anything? It's the impact, what you take from what you see, the changes that you experience that matters. I'll always remember Jurassic Park 3 after Billy stole raptor eggs with the "best intentions" and Grant replied, "With the best intentions!? Some of the worst things imaginable have been done with the 'best intentions.' You know, as far as I'm concerned, you're no better than the people who built this place."
I was a child, and that stuck with me, taught me that it doesn't matter what I intend to do, but what will occur if I do it. So what's your intention here? To attack a person? Demean them for using a television show to witness the hypocrisy of extremism? Or to solicit a response for a human conversation?
@@edmondchan3426
Great comment.
👍
Trinidad Tooke That's exactly what it means to be pro-choice. You, personally, choose to never have an abortion, but you'll still support those who do choose abortion. There's quite a few pro-choices who think abortion is sad, but understand that taking away someone's choice is even sadder.
"I don't make deals with the Devil."
A shame, you already have, and he's laughing at seeing what a fool you're making of yourself.
The total, unrestrained cruelty of the anti-choice gang is on full display here. They writers were careful to add in that sneaky line “ the others wouldn’t have understood” to walk the statement back, but in real life that’s not true. Her friends would have not only understood, but they also would have helped make and plant the bomb, and prevented any warning to the clinic. A real anti-choice monster would never have felt the regret she was implied to at the end either. Having been forced to work closely with these things, they’d have felt a sexual pleasure at the thought of stamping out human life.
True. They never stop to think that in the process, they are stamping out the life of the very being they purport to want to save - namely, the baby's. How the hell do they expect to save the baby's life if they kill the mother? Just goes to show how stupid their thinking is.
Schwimmer: ABORTION IS MURDER!!
Stone: But you killed a woman and an unborn baby.
Schwimmer:....
7:49
*O O F F*
The sad part is that there are crazy people like this woman.
5:50 the attorneys face and tone just crack me up, he knows this is going to sink the whole case but he can't stop it.
7:43 that moment when Stone exposed the defendant's logic instantly snap her into reality
That last question is EXACTLY why so many conservative arguments fail: they aren't critically thought out and they're rife with cognitive dissonance.
She was playing Texas Hold'em No Limit with Stone. Was dealt a pocket pair of Jesus and thought she was winning through the flop and the turn until her pair was washed by the river.
That's the most Texas sounding sentence ever
When you die you're going to have to justify your choices and if you have to explain the choice of one life over another as "Balancing the scales" you're not gonna pass those pearly gates
What pearly gates? That's up there with Tinkerbell and the Tooth Fairy.
My man pulled out the ultimate reverse UNO card at the end there.
It just goes to show it's incredibly easy to overlook your own hypocrisy when it comes to something you believe too strongly in without even realising it.
Just like those flat earth fanatics. Once they get the idea into their head, its like the blind leading the blind. Nothing and no one is gonna sway them.
the moment that she realized that she made terrible mistake
She made that mistake the moment she got on the stand
“Objection - this case is being judged on the temporal plane, your honor.”
7:40 that is one of the greatest Hypocrite reveals I’ve ever seen in anything. I mean right there on her face she realized she became the very problem she was fighting so hard against but in the worst way possible.
Her defense immediately came tumbling down when it became apparent she basically threw another body onto the pile just to prove her point.
"Objection, this case is being judged on the temporal plane, your Honor" That's hilarious
In the end he played the uno reverse card, well played sir well played
I'm love the look on her face at the end where he asked her that question they all deserve to be told that and put in their place.
The realization in her face at the end was oh so satisfying
Both her lawyer AND the judge told her not to get on the stand... LOL
Well, people who insist on proving their point and making others see their point of view never listen to anyone.
2:03 Whoa, whoa, hold up. That attorney needed to tell his client to STFU because every defendant is their own worst enemy (it's why we have the 5th amendment). Notice later that he's not exactly 100% thrilled with her idea of putting the victim on trial.
She got exactly what was coming to her, but that doesn't mean she needed to make it easier for Stone.
... And her insistence on "telling her side of the story", and her performance, is exactly why we have defense attorneys and why we should listen to their counsel.
Well they had tried to warn her... but some people are just determined to scuttle their chances of survival.
The attorney and judge both tried to warn her not to testify but she was willing to give up her 5th amendment right and neither could stop her because she felt she was on a crusade. That is why Stone asked his only question. To make her realize that she was not a martyr.
This actress is amazing. That last line and the reactions afterward.
Her facial expressions, my gawd what fabulous acting!
The prosecutor didn't have to ask her questions. She was finished. He just wanted her to realize she was wrong.
Disgusting, the way these people think and how feel so entitled to make decisions over someone else's life is absolutely disgusting, the worst thing is that there are still a lot of those arounf the world
I love how in courtrooms, lawyers/prosecutors keep their winning argument/question until the end to deal the final blow. :)
This question has stuck in my mind for years. Masterful backing the murderer into a corner.
also points out what is wrong with the thinking of most pro-lifers. As long as the baby is in the womb, killing it is murder, but once it's born, it can starve to death or die of disease for all they care.
He isn't wrong to ask her that question. You can't commit actual murder and call yourself pro life.
"If abortion is murder no matter how you feel about Mary Donovan, aren't you guilty of her unborn child?"
Me: Oh shit. He got her
That gotcha moment at the end was savage and I loved it. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
I love these older episodes better acting, better stories, just a whole better class of TV.
Woman - BLAAH BLAAAHHH BLAAAH BLAAAH AHHH BLAHHH.
Ben Stone - logic...
Woman - Gasp...
once again it turns out that anti-abortion opinions arent about saving children but about controlling women and punishing them for their perceived sin
So, I guess pro-life women are nothing but no good misogynists.
@@Jemalacane0 Yup. No uterus = no opinion. Everyone with the capacity to be pregnant is entitled to privacy regarding their medical needs, and that includes not having a child if one becomes pregnant. No matter what, people have autonomy and so if someone doesn't want to / can't physically or mentally sustain / for any reason have a child, it is their right to not have a child. No one has the right to force a person to be pregnant and suffer through all the physical and physiological changes and conditions that make up pregnancy. Also, people are granted the freedom of religion, which encompasses freedom from religion, and considering most pro-life advocates have religious motives it would be unconstitutional to make abortion illegal because of morality or religious causes. Come back with an actual case for personhood for a fetus and maybe people will consider your logic.
Grace Jewett I really don’t understand these pro- lifers .
Or, it's a preference for contraception and adoption.
Gammareign That’s an individual decision, one people can make for themselves but have no right to force onto others.
She forgot about shall not kill and shall not judge.
“I don’t make deals with the devil.” The only devil around here is you! You show no remorse for what you did.
"I told her that will kill her pants." That's the point yes..
When he hit her with the trap card I was like GOTTEEEEEEEEEEEEE
7:39 The suspect is toasted in 10 seconds
Ah, the nineties, when a jury of New Yorkers nullifying an anti-abortion murder was a real threat.
"In this state capital punishment is against the law." - I was sure that wasn't true of New York in 1991, but apparently it was actually true until 1995, then it was brought back for nine years. Basically, post-Furman capital punishment in New York had almost the exact tenure of Christopher Reeve's wheelchair.
Also, best objection ever.
Stone: "Your Honour, I have only one question to ask of the defendant."
Ms. Schwimmer: "Which is?"
Stone: "If abortion is murder, no matter how you feel about Mary Donovan, aren't you guilty of the murder of her unborn child?"
JR on commentary: "STONE COLD! STONE COLD! STONE COLD! STONE COLD!"
That's how I felt too, that Stone scored a KO on her and took out her entire argument with one hit. Talk about having a glass jaw.
Imagine, for a moment, that you are a big-time lawyer who scored a big case with a lucrative client.
And she decides to go on the stand and basically say "I did it I fuckin whacked em and I'd do it again, too!"
The worse thing is, with how Texas is in 2021, this is how some anti-abortionists might do some abortion clinics.
I doubt that will happen because we aren’t interested in sinking to their level. The pro-life movement is highly peaceful.
@@Powerranger-le4up There are always black sheep among movements. Some idiots go so far as to kill abortion doctors.
Caroline Kava (Rose Schwimmer) is an underrated and unappreciated actress. She played Tom Cruise's mother in "Born on the Fourth of July", Mickey Rourke's wife in "Year of the Dragon" and many other supporting roles.
Always a hoot when the judge gets angry.
I don’t know why but I crack up every time when stone says “objection your honor this is being judged on the temporal plane”
Rose Schwimmer is Nikita's (Played by the late River Phoenix) mother from the film "Little Nikita".
7:48 That is both so satisfying and infuriating at the the same time. Satisfying when she realized she became the one thing she hates the most. But infuriating that she just realized that. Like she really not think about that?
This hits differently today...
Definitely, after the repulsive decision done by the SCOTUS.
@Africanwarrior101
Its A State Division Decision To Decide Abortion The USA United States Of America 🇺🇸 Supreme Court Made The Right Decision?.
For those who didn't quite understand the question Stone was asking:
He was asking her if, since the victim didn't have the abortion before her death, wouldn't that mean she was also guilty for the death of the victim's unborn child. He asked in a weird way, but this is what he meant.
I'm almost certain they would've tried her for the baby's death as well. I'm pro-choice and that activist actually killed someone and her unborn child in a terroristic way rather than the legal, medical way like how abortions are done 😂🤔