The Devil In Definition: The Complete Grendel Cycle
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ก.ค. 2024
- From beginning to end, a thorough look at the comic book series, Grendel, and all the iterations of the persona. Written by Matt Wagner and illustrated by various. Published by Comico and Dark Horse Comics between 1982 and 2021.
0:00 - Introduction
3:02 - Hunter Rose
13:44 - Christine Spar
19:42 - Brian Li Sung
25:35 - The Incubation Years
29:25 - Eppy Thatcher
37:29 - Orion Assante
42:09 - Grendel Prime
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#Grendel #MattWagner #Comico #DarkHorseComics #ModernAge - บันเทิง
I introduced a friend of mine to Grendel and he said the mask beared a striking similarity to Venom, to which I responded that Grendel predates Venom by a good many years, but then something occurred to me. Venom is an alien entity that seeks a host and is generally a pretty violent character, Grendel is an ethereal entity that seeks a host and is a generally pretty violent character as well. It makes you wonder if Mcfarlane and Larsen took some inspiration or if it's all just a big coincidence.
Food for thought
Venom (the character as it exists and has become popularized in comics and related media) is essentially a Grendel.
Whoa. This gives me a new perspective
Well, Mcfarlane is proud to present himself as a guy who doesn’t care about reading books, nothing that smells “cultural”. On the other side, Spawn is sooooo similar to Tim Vigil’s Faust so who knows.
Keep in mind, the initial design was by Mike Zeck for Spidey’s black costume, then when fans didn’t like it, David Micheline decided to turn it into a symbiote which was the basis for Venom. McFarlane retooled the black costume to have a giant mouth and everything. There were so many cooks involved in creating Venom, it’s hard to say anyone purposefully ripped off Grendel or anything else.
grendel, the crow, and the mask all walk into a bar. you just can't describe what happens next
Grendel: a meme that truly goes viral.
Grendel always was a meme in the sense that it is after the DNA of consciousness specifically a meme the codes for Violence, Domination and Sociopathic aggression.
@@docbaker3333 truly
One of the most Underrated comic series/universes ever. I have all of the Grendel issues in single issues, but it's crazy that this whole run isn't available in oversized hardcovers when you've got endless junk available in a premium format.
There are soft cover versions that exist at least! Envious of having them all, the series is a masterpiece.
The entire run of Grendel 1-40 is riveting. Most of the Grendel Tales minis are top notch comics.
I always considered the Grendel "voice" a manifestation looking for a host, hence the internal conflict in Brian and it's nebulous nature later searching for a focus.
I like that take! That is a very good interpretation.
I think this story really shows potential of what could be done with comics that use villains/criminals as protagonists. It's weird that so few people do that.
Spec ops the line tries that but you're correct.
@@minespatch I mean in comics. Video games do that all the time, just think of every GTA clone.
@@ShinoSarna So what like 7 gta games compared to the entire video game catalog? Yeah that doesn't mean "video games do it all the time:
@@NinjapowerMS small mind this applies to
God of War series
Saints row series
Hitman series
Metal gear solid five
Star wars the force unleashed series
Infamous series
Etc
Thank you very, very much. That’s an extraordinarily well put together synopsis of one of the most compelling and original concepts ever explored in comics. As revered as Wagner may be, he is still underrated.
Your channel is the best comic review show ever!!! Classy, clean, I don’t always agree, but I do agree with most of your reviews. I share your videos all the time. I want to you to continue and grow as a youtuber. Great stuff my friend. I’m a big fan. Keep it up. 👍🏼❤️😎
Thank you, sir!
I,m a BIG Grendel fan , so much I have the 1st firing of the Randy Bowen statue of Grendel , and have most of these books and can't wait for the Netflix series , been a Grendel fan for many many years and I'm glad that more people are finding my favorite "devil "
I find myself returning to this overview again and again.
That was super impressive, you did a hell of a job here.
Thank you very much!
This is one of my very favourite comics. I had collected nearly all the first 40 issues when sadly they and most of my comic collection, were accidentally dumped by the council, when they ignored instructions on what to take to the tip.
This is my favorite series. Thank you so much!! Matt Wagner is my hero.
@AntiZenithActivist it must be exhausting being so clever. Congratulations!
Obviously I’m late to the party on this video - sorry! The Grendel Cycle is hands down my favorite story in comics. I love that you gave it the serious literary review it deserves - thank you!
I need to find this in it's entirety, I've always seen it back in the day frequenting my favorite comic shops back in the day, I never really gave it much attention, but ever since I've watched every Grendel video on this channel, makes me want to read this series all the more.
Unfortunately the Omnibuses are very expensive nowadays
If it’s not black hammer or hellboy Dark Horse isnt giving it perennial reprints.
The omnibuses are being reprinted this year! Perfect time to hop on the Grendel story.
@@ryanb3665 That's amazing. Any idea if they will be through Dark Horse?? Thanks!!
Edit: Never mind! I found them on Ebay. I cannot believe they are priced so low. So stoked to get these when they're released in October.
Superb. I only have Grendel Cycle (bought second hand from a UK thrift shop). The Grendel concept has always struck me as a great concept (perhaps pleasingly untapped by Hollywood's calling).
The John Gardiner tale of Grendel is basically the story from Grendel's point of view. "Poor Grendel has had an accident... so may you all." Best ending ever!👹
Good video. I always was fascinated by the Grendel series, particularly Devil by the Deed.
First read those chapters in the back of a Mage trade at my library that for some reason had Devil by the Deed in the back. The whole saga however seemed overwhelming but this video has me curious about it again.
Well done, my friend. Worth the second viewing. VIVAT!
Vivat!
VIVAT!
I've long been curious about Grendel, but knew nothing about it. Now I HAVE to read it.
Nice to see ya back!
Grendel was a big part of my comic collecting days way back when. So much so that it influenced other hobbies. The black BDUs that I wore playing paintball had large white "Eyes of Grendel" on the back. Fitting in the discussion of inheriting Grendel, my oldest daughter now possesses this jacket, and her son, my grandson, plays paintball... Vivat Grendel.
Hunter Rose: Devil By the Deed
Christine Spar: Devil By Loss
Brian Li Sung: Devil By Heartbreak
Eppy Thatcher: Devil By Blasphemy
Orion Assante: Devil By Conquest
Grendel Prime: Devil By Duty
This channel is amazing, as always a banger video!
Nice to see this again. One of my favorite series
Thank you , sir! This took far more time than I thought it would when I began it. Sorry for the wait!
That was really magnificently done. Thank you very much.
Yes!! You are back and with a vengeance. Worth the wait. Now to track these books.
Awesome work so detailed love the extra info that you ad the stuff outside of the actual story
What a great video. I collected superhero comics when i was a kid. I drifted away from them in my late teens. In college, during the 80’s i saw my some Grendel comics in my friend’s dorm room. I got hooked on comics again. Mage and Grendel led to Love and Rockets, The Trouble With Girls, Hate, Eightball, Fish Police, Dinosaurs For Hire, Roachmill, etc. Grendel and Mage were always my favorites. Wagner is the Man! This art form can be so sublime. Thanks for your efforts.
Incredible video, great work.
It’s so nice to have you back.
Thank you! It's good to be back. Although, I hadn't gone anywhere...this one just took a LONG time to get done.
Your videos are so well done. Thank you for this one its great.
I can only imagine the amount of work that was put into this Gendel store telling. The script alone must be hundreds of pages. Thank you for your unwavering dedication to tell the stories behind the stories we follow.
I'm so glad you're back. I've missed your reviews. I hope everything is okay in your world. I loved the Grendel series. It definitely stood out from the very beginning.
I have Devil by the Deed - bought it new off the shelf. And I recently acquired a page from Grendel Prime - couldn't resist having a page by Wagner.
We'd just read Beowulf in school when Gardner's book came out, so of course I had to read it - still have that copy.
Excellent overview and analysis, as always.
I never expected such a thorough and excellent remastering of an older video.
Thank you! It's a good topic and one I'm passionate about. Plus, I added an extra 20 minutes to the original runtime. It was worth a redo.
Thanks for the updated video. I was looking for the old one the other day and couldn't find it.
A Perfect video in every sense of the word
I am in love with this series
I know how you feel. I didnt know it until after the fact, but finding grendel eventually was the entire reason i ever read comics in the first place.
Nice essay video
Having had iterations done of V for Vendetta, Watchman, Swamp Thing, & The Dark Knightt, Grendel is the one I have longed for to come to any screen in some fashion. It will take a genius director/ producer team with the vision that the story will be required, regardless of the medium. A limited series run is now a very real thing. A piece like the Queens Gambit the Marvel series developed for Disney+ shows the viability of such mediums or streaming services can be for a seemingly "niche crowd", but with all the frankly 💩 movies made every year in Hollywood that DO pop up on said services... how can no one have taken a shot at at least a screenplay by now? 🤔
The concept of the Incubation Years sounds really cool.
As always, well worth the wait. Please could we hear your views etc on CONCRETE. I feel it was just as important as Grendel but is severely overlooked/forgotten these days. Anyway, welcome back again + thank-you. Simply the best “comics” channel going.
This was a great review video. Nicely done. Really touched on points that I did not know.
Are you planning to do a Mage one?
It’s kinda funny how the original black and white comic looks like Astroboy
Now that you say it, I totally see it. Damn.
I been interested in the character/franchise but never jumped in so this is excellent. Thanks.
#threecountcommentaries
I would love for you to cover Jamie Delano's run on Animal Man!
Damn i didnt know there was overlap on that besides me! Delanos run on animal is my second favorite comics arc after grendel. Ive spent decades never being confident enough to recommend either to anybody i know. Im simply incapable of describing what it is im recommending.
Wow this is a really good video and comic book character
Very cool you mentioning Silverback.
this comic always interested me, well the character did when i was young in the 90s but never saw the books anywhere besides articles written about it in Wizard mag from time to time. must be why 22 years more or less after i quit collecting comics i still remembered the character when i saw his pic in your thumbnail, i dont even seek comic stuff out these days but i enjoyed this content , it kinda filled in a huge blank i had for 20+ years lo.l ya know what might as well sub i think ill find more here that ill connect w/ or find something else i was always curios about from all those years i collected/read comics that i still remember
Man... I've only read Christine Spar. I have a lot of homework ahead. Great video 👍
Very nice retrospective on grendel.
The story of Grendel is a complex one and yet, if looked at it in detail, you can see it is very compelling and you just want to know more.
Grendel being known as the devil due to the aggression and violence it has unleashed upon the world, has also become something more as we see in the series.
Starts as a persona in the criminal underworld, then as an identity in order to find revenge, it evolves worlwide until it becomes the dominant force of the world and, as the narrator said, somewhat a "force for good".
I once worked a crossover about everything I knew with a friend. She and I mixed a story with franchises such as Halo, Titanfall, Final Fantasy, Warhammer 40k and so much more. At its core, we made this as some sort of parody, but rather than being a comical parody, it embraced many events from their respective franchises and twisted a bit, this led to the creation of an intetesting story, there were canon characters as well as ones of our own creation based in their respective universes.
Why do I share this? You see, it's been years since I talked to this friend of mine and we have, in essence, finished that story the last time we talked. But recently I thought...what if we I were to add the concept of Grendel in this? So far is looking good, I am yet to see if I will publish it or not. However I am grateful for this video, I needed a refresh on Grendel's true purpose and what it essentially is. This proves that I have been doing right so far
Great video
I own a fair amount of Grendel books but not all, so this was a good analysis and overview of what's available.
It's an enormous series and simply the best ongoing comics property of the late eighties and nineties. I'm surprised you didn't mention the latest hunter rose tale where the demon reveals his legacy to him. That's Wagner tying the whole saga together and there's lots to digest there. I also would have gone into more depth on the formalist experiments Wagner employs which are at least as important as the storyline and themes. Grendel was groundbreaking on so many levels and you could have easily tripled the length of your video on it. Maybe I'll do my own.
Love this video. Will you do a follow up on Grendel Odyssey?
Yes, I will. I have to finish the series off. :)
When I was 12 or 13 in the late eighties, my older brother had several of these. I tried reading them but didn't understand a bit of it. But the tone and image of the character stuck with me all these years.
It's amazing how much dense atory telling Wagner was able to fit in a forty issue run
Damn I completely miss this one I should definitely read this when I get a chance this might work for some of the ideas I have for my own comic
I always rewatch this one.
Wow! Thank you very much!
I had all the original prints going back to the original Hunter Rose b+w 3 issue run all the way up to through Grendel Tales. It got harder to keep up when Dark Horse started doing reprints of the 40 issue run and after a while I completely lost track of the series entirely. Only recently after my kids are now grown ups have I started looking into what I have missed in the last few years.
Excellent video! i think it should be noted that, while not 100% obligatory read, the Batman crossovers do count play an important part in the Grendel lore,specially the second.
I am a Grendel addict Matt Wagner is a Genius!
The interstitial Grendel issues during the so -called Incubation period are absolute powerhouses. I'm surprised you considered them negligible. That might be the case if you solely consider the text through its narrative trajectory. You don't mention the art or craft as much as you mention the writing and I think that's a blindspot. Those interstitial episodes are wild formal experiments and offer lots of ideas one can get drunk on. I'm more interested in how art technique and text interact than the lore of the Grendel being. You also give short shrift to War Child bc you simply address it within the arc rather than looking at how it works via craft or on its own merits. I think War Child is a fascinating work that also sees some infiltration of epic manga / anime tropes into a western idiom. Granted, I don't think those elements are a focus on your series. I think the way you talk about it does do it a disservice, despite how articulately you discuss it in a larger sense. Still, this is a wonderful video! Thank you!
The issue where the little blonde girl falls in love with the grendel during the oil control games is maybe my favorite single issue
Rly interesting video, will check grendel out someday
man I haven't read the Dark Horse collections in ages watching this video think I'll take them back out and give them a reread
I loved the opening of Primer #2. Argent and Grendel, nemesis, two sides of the same coin, talking on a rooftop.
Holy fuck man I was just wondering what was coming next. I've always been curious about Grendel. Definitely checking it out now.
I've bought random issues of grendel since the dang 90's. Thanks you for explaining what the hell was going on. I never had a clue
Good lord, Matt Wagner was an art deco comics genius back in the 80s.
This sounds really cool, sucks that all the collected editions are out of print though.
One of my super regrets. An independent title back in the late 80s that I always wanted to purchase but due to limited funds was always too broke at the time. Than I forgot about it!!! Hope I can find collected HCB somewhere.
A show that uses this art as asperation would be AMAZING - art deco!! But i guess if it went threw different ages it would be cool to have the look of the show to change, but i know i would love the 1920's art deco story!! It would be cool if many of the stories took place in different countries and eras. i would say since they have vampires they might as well also have other creatures of the underworld and they should have them from the beggining.
I gotta read this book
ive never heard of him i should look into overlord comics stories
Grendel is my favorite shit. Devils & Deaths made me cry. Edvin Biukovic was an incredible artist. RIP
I finally got to ordering the omnibus today
I was wondering will do you Sandman Mystery Theatre?
I wouldn't mind a glider like Eppy had.
Objectively, this is a powerful series of works from a creator whose other masterpiece (Mage) is among my favorite reads of all time. His other work has mostly been a real pleasure to read. Even liked his artwork on the old Villains & Vigilantes adventure Battle Above the Earth (although I didn't connect it with him for years, just a big V&V fan - which was better known for Jeff Dee's art).
Subjectively, I just cannot bring myself to care about, much less like any of the Grendel stories. They not only bore me, there's something about them that makes me feel vaguely ill. Just ugliness to me, both artistically and philosophically.
I am stunned by your lack of love for War Child..
War Child was amazing.
Very good! Although I think the character of the Paladin/Grendel Prime needs a bit more examination, particularly as seen in the "past prime" novel, "devil's quest" and in the completed (as of 2022) "Devil's odyssey". He seems to become a very conflicted and somewhat sad figure by the end of that arc, having lived so long that he's seen the ultimate degeneration/entropy of a philosophy which he did unspeakably awful things in single-minded support of.
I was just thinking about reaching out this weekend to say, "Hey, I missed you. Is everything okay, current context considered. "
This video is so good it made me want to start reading the series.Quick question do I have to read the first 3 black and white issues? Or ,can I go strait to the devil by the deed?
You can start with Devil By The Deed. You will miss no story at all by skipping the three black and white issues.
@@StrangeBrainParts thank you for the answer , keep up the excellent work
Thank you! I will do my best, sir.
I watched this because I’d never really been interested in reading the series, and now that I know the whole story I’ll start picking them up lol.
Are the rarer issues tremendously valuable? I’m unsure of the size of the fandom
The three original black and white comics can be pricey. However, the rest of the series is very inexpensive. You should be able to get it at a dollar a book, for the most part.
Grendel is perhaps the most underappreciated work of art that i am aware of. It is no doubt way cheaper than it has a right to be
What version of Grendel would you say is your favorite?
Huh. I didn't know the late great Dave Stevens worked on the series.
You shoud do a vídeo about hellboy
I love the Grendel character. It's perfect noir.
It’s comics for grown ups
I believe, and I could be wrong, that Hunter Rose was more of a Psychopath as he reveled in the power he had under the Grendel persona.
Spawn/Crow influence
So this guy is getting a Netflix anime?
The Hunter Rose series was great and so impactful. The rest of Grendel, while fun, is a severe drop off in quality and purpose. Like I said it’s a fun continuation of the story but it really loses what I feel were the core elements and ideas of the first series. Just by including full color the series immediately lost a large portion of its narrative effect (obviously this isn’t the only misstep in the series it’s just one key example)
I'm still upset about war child....and the lack of content.
It's narcissistic not sociopathic, big difference
First, thanks for giving broader context to the story arks as a whole. Apparently the Grendel concept stil infects, as here we all are! For me, Waggoner’s work is nostalgically representative of the 80’s comic explosion. A time when creators (owned properties or not) were willing to risk and push the medium. Unlike now, when Comics, like Pop Music, have gone Hollywood. That’s not to say there isn’t anything worthwhile, it’s just not as driven by creativity, as it once was. The prevailing mentality seems to be placate, make shiny things, smile pretty, and take the money. Apply to medium(s) of your choice.
If I lament this bygone era, it’s because these creators don’t have much in the way of successors. As Frank Miller once put it “I think we’ve turned a few corners that we shouldn’t have”. Even Pete Townsend (reportedly) wrote Who Are You?, after a drunken bar rage, demanding to know who’s next? Who’s taking over? Who are you? He didn’t get an answer. That seems to be incorporated into Grendel mythology as well. Evolve or die.
So l miss this time when the Stephen Bissettes, Bernie Meralts, Matt Waggoners, etc. took thing as far as they could. But their answers seem more like a faint whisper-echoe. It’s 2021, and here we are, regarding Grendel. Infection indeed.
God, I need a Cherry Coke.
“co-MEE-co…”
You’re killing me. The company name was a portmanteau of “comic(s)” and “company”.
It was pronounced “COMIC-o”. Folks who read this in the ‘80s still remember.
We are going to disagree. Grendel was better as a thing, a monster spiritus virus with its own purpose. I liked it as a thing with a voice. I think everyone from Hunter Rose to Epps thought they were using Grendel when Grendel
Was actually using them. But for me Grendel was a living thing just life beyond human understanding. Grendel was what we think the devil should be.
Ngl, I thought that was venom or Spawn.