AMD Radeon Super Resolution vs. FidelityFX Usability & Image Quality Comparison
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 มิ.ย. 2024
- AMD's Radeon Super Resolution is now out, following-up FidelityFX Super Resolution (FSR). This comparison looks at AMD RSR vs. FSR and talks about how the technology works.
Sponsor: Montech Century 850 on Amazon: geni.us/s2aV
As AMD pushes its Radeon Super Resolution out the door, the real news is that FidelityFX Super Resolution 2.0 is right around the corner. FSR 2.0 will drastically change (and theoretically improve) how FSR works, and RSR will inherit those changes -- making it immediately more interesting. NVIDIA is also forging ahead with its own DLSS, which we need to revisit soon, and NIS technologies. The current fight of NVIDIA vs. AMD seems to be fought both on a software front and a hardware front, with super resolution and scaling technologies being used to better support aging GPUs and ray tracing alike.
For more information on AMD FSR, we ran a full test including benchmarks here: • AMD FidelityFX Super R...
We also made a complete DLSS guide for Cyberpunk 2077 here (useful for seeing how DLSS works): • Cyberpunk 2077 DLSS Qu...
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TIMESTAMPS
00:00 - Graphics Comparisons with AMD RSR
01:59 - Overview - FSR vs. RSR
03:56 - Defining Important Terms
07:20 - Image Comparison
08:04 - Far Cry 6 (In-game)
11:46 - Far Cry 6 (Menu)
13:00 - The Riftbreaker (in-game)
14:14 - Cyberpunk 2077 (in-game)
18:01 - Usability & Future of RSR
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Host, Editorial: Steve Burke
Research, Testing, Writing: Patrick Lathan
Video Production: Keegan Gallick - เกม
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For more information on AMD FSR, we ran a full test including benchmarks here: th-cam.com/video/KCzjQ4qP124/w-d-xo.html
We also made a complete DLSS guide for Cyberpunk 2077 here (useful for seeing how DLSS works): th-cam.com/video/zUVhfD3jpFE/w-d-xo.html
:| the onyl thing i gave a fk about was hjow this improves performance with Raytracing, and you didn't even touch that at all.
@@ErgonomicChair Just decrease your resolution and look how fps improves, then count 1 or 2 fps under that and you got the exact performance benefit, it's a super basic upscaler, it's very predictable.
Question though. I seen the old version you could choose the resolution to upscale to. Like 1080 to 4k or 1080 to 2k. Is this only now whatever resolution you choose tonplay it just goes to 4k? I have a 2k monitor and rendering up to 4k does me no good and will be a lower fps then just rendering to 2k plus can't run 4k on a 2k so having a 2k and access to rsr does me no benefit? Or will it notice on a 2k monitor and just to uts magic from 1080 to 2k?
silly thing but why cant they use both tech at the same time?
first rsr render the image then fsr render the same image will that make any difference? 🤣😂🤣
@@rinkumultani6515 Latency.
This makes input lag and could make more frame tearing....
But combining both tech to be automated could be interesting if they use something to help guide both tech.
I can say, beyond a shadow of a doubt that fidelity FX in cyberpunk has turned gaming with a 1050ti max-q from impossible to moderately ok.
That is a beautiful endorsement if I've ever heard one.
People still play that game?
Wow… Ill give it another go then… thanks 👍🏼
do you not mind that the game turns into a van gogh painting through the process?
You mean from 5fps to 20fps?
When youre showing off examples of RSR and FSR, changing which side of the screen they are on between examples is really annoying
Noted and good criticism. We'll work on that. It's hard because there are 3 options getting compared, not just two, so one will always be moving around.
@@GamersNexus Maybe also add some symbols (not just texts) to make it easier to identify what screen uses what at a glance.
@Gamers Nexus maybe use vertical bars for native vs rsr/fsr and horizontal bars for fsr vs rsr?
Another possibility is to have the whole image occupy the whole screen and go back and forth which helps spot differences. Leaving the opportunity to go forward and back in the video to directly compare if the viewers if we want to spend time doing a comparison. It's easier than literally side by side since you don't have to move your eyes if you're focused on a specific detail.
Love when TH-camrs and companies can handle constructive criticism. That's why GN is my favorite tech channel
I wish I could use FSR and RSR to make things look better in my life right now 😔
Sadfuck
Keep your head up ! Fix one problem at a time. Gotta be positive enough to see a good future.
I'm never sure if this kind of comment is just a pure joke or not. Just in case it's not a joke: Chin up and push through, but don't be afraid to take time to reflect when you need it. It's hard sometimes to find the momentum to get through something, but once you generate it, it gets easier. You got this!
Same here.
@@GamersNexus wholesome
Hi, just a bit of feedback on the video, it would make it easier to follow if the two feeds being compared were on consistent sides of the screen, i.e. keeping RSR on the right and FSR on the left etc
🤘🏻
I think the point for that is if you have to look for the annotations to determine which is which, either technology is very good and much usable in real life because we tend to not pixel peeping while playing.
@@namtrieunguyen7630 no it's because I CAN see the differences that make it more disorienting, and it's not whether or not it matters irl, it's just the matter of keeping the locations of the captures consistent when trying to highlight their differences, since the whole point is to compare and see how they differ
@@renchesandsords 98% of people agree with you
Yeah I don't understand why they did that
I tried out the RSR setting yesterday on Total War: Warhammer III. It doesn't support DLSS or FSR and doesn't seem to like AMD cards so my performance on my RX 6700 XT isn't spectacular at 1440p. With settings Med and High, I was averaging 79.7 fps with a high of 98 and low of 62 on the internal battle bench mark. I changed to 1080p and enabled RSR with it scaling to 1440p with all the settings the same and got an average of 115.5 fps with a high of 146 and low of 92. For me it looked good and ran super smooth. I was able to re-enable some settings and up some others and I'm still getting frames averaging above 100 fps. I like it.
did you make any Benchmark videos showcasing what you described here like I did? It may take some time, but it would add a lot of credence to your comment especially since you went through displaying the Frame rate while you were playing in the first place
This is what I did too. Have a 5700 XT and gaming on a 3440x1440 resolution. I get like 25fps in the campaign map but 55+ fps during battles. I changed my resolution to 2560x1080 enabled RSR to scale to 3440 x 1440 and I got 45+ fps in campaign and a guaranteed 70+ fps in battle. This is with mostly on Medium settings. Looks good and I can run warhammer 3 alright now.
Thank you for providing a real-world example. What is the size of your display, and how far away from it would you say you sit?
@@piers3074 I game on a Samsung C32HG7. It's a 32 inch, 1440p, 144hz, curved monitor with a VA panel. I sit about 3 feet from it.
e a qualidade?
Rich people can hack FSR, RSR, and DLSS by buying a better GPU.
@@yupimrandy INFLATION
@@yupimrandy Comunism/Socialims taxes (which are robberies and you cannot do anything against them), inflation and other things
@@techyescity bryan go to bed!
@@extreme123dz communism is when no I phone
poor people can get FSR with any game on most gpus with magpie.
Great job as always, Steve. Can't wait for you to dive into FSR 2.0 when it's available. As a GTX 1660 Super owner, FSR has dramatically improved performance on Cyberpunk 2077. 👏🏼
Is fsr2.0 coming to gtx card also?
@@samertiman1222 it’s open source it’ll work on anything
Worth saying with FSR 2.0, if it has a temporal component, it most likely needs motion vectors so will have to be employed at the engine level (and will be harder to implement than fsr 1.0). I hope I'm wrong, but i don't see any way of effectively using fsr 2.0 as a completely postprocessed effect like rsr.
@@supersnail5000 We don't know the details of fsr 2.0 yet. It could require motion vectors or similar data from game engine objects, but it could also be based on just several frames of data. Amd might take a different slightly approach here, doing one step at the time instead of trying to duplicate DLSS. Considering that fsr is not based on ai the overall implementation might be much harder, so I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to simplify things for now. We have also intel upscaling tech about to arrive, so I hope next months will be quite prominent.
@@kamiladamski5715 We don’t know exactly how it works, but I think AMD have already stated it needs motion vectors. It can’t just be “based on several frames of data” as the content in each frame is dynamic, so unless you have motion vectors to compensate for changes between frames, you will just create a blurred image. It is essentially just an open source TAAU implementation and likely cannot meaningfully leverage ML as, unlike DLSS and XeSS, it isn’t hardware accelerated (possibly just adaptive sharpening after the upscale).
I’m also very confused by what “doing one step at a time” means here?
Thanks! I wish AMD made this less confusing. The naming doesn’t help. Basically FSR if the game has it. Else try RSR and see if it looks ok because it can blur text a bit.
This comment was the TLDR I needed the most ^^ Thx mate
Yo it's PewDiePie twin
how bout afmf? how does it differ with rsr? can i use both together?
There's literally no reason for them to omit Polaris and Vega from using RSR... Those are the gpus that would benefit from it the most... What a bummer.
Yes: marketing and profits.
@@saxombie8614 Why RSR, if that’s the case? They could’ve done that with FSR, which is superior, but they didn’t.
@@ALph4cro i think they will add older cards support on next drivers, but for now they're just making the novelty profitable.
@@saxombie8614 I really hope that they do. Because, is it profitable? Would anyone buy a new Radeon just so they could use RSR?
@@ALph4cro for sure much people will love their new card with RSR! Look how many people buys Nvidia just for the RTX and DLSS! Totally profitable.
I would have been more interested in seeing closer resolutions than only the big jump from 1080 to 4k. 1080 to 1440 would have been a good addition to see how this technology scales with different resolutions. It seems to me like only showing 1080 to 4k is showing this technology in the worse case scenario only.
1080p to 1440p will look better, just as Steve said
@@Ikxi Obviously. But how much better, and what are the framerates? That’s what they were asking for.
Tried it myself in Horizon Zero Dawn. At 1080p you'll see almost similar quality with some blur in the grasses when moving around. At 1170p (around 80% native) is where I could barely find noticeable differences comparing side by side, without comparison I wouldn't know which resolution I'm using.
@@floop1108 pretty sure they covered all that with their original FSR video. Apart from very subtle differences and the HUD / UI elements they're the same thing, so unless you really want to see how it handles that at different resolutions GN really didn't miss anything, just have to watch the right video for the right info.
1440 is alright with fsr gain up to like 30fps on quality and its not to bad i tryed it out on black desert on my 1080ti and was alright dont think i could have told the diffrence really other than the horse hair and bits i must say i dont us fsr but i like having the options of it cos if i got a new game that was under 75fps after playing with the shadows ... id change to fsr and have a play cos its there to try and get the performance i want and aim for
Pro tip: You can create a custom resolution for your monitor and use that resolution for a more adjustable RSR upscale.
are there any issues with windows / general use / conflict with other apps / conflict with other games, that may arise when I do that?
omg how??
Or have a Sapphire card and the Trixx software.
@@bipolaryx I think the utility I use is called CRU.
I use that and Nvidia DSR, should quite similarly with AMD cards.
I use DSR to run higher than native resolution and use DLSS or FSR for image quality depending on the game.
Some games look better than native, others it's strictly for performance.
@@jokur7 setting a lower custom resolution will just make a lot of things bigger on screen that demand a certain amount of pixels, for example a 100x100 icon just takes up more space after, but I use this truck with work computers and don’t notice anything severely conflicting but I obviously am not gaming at work so YMMV
A small advise, at 15:34 RSR and FSR footage suddenly switch sides, and I was confused for a sec. It would be better if they all stay at the same side of the screen to avoid confusion.
happens at 13:40 too
For the most part, many of these details could be ignored depending on the game. For example, if playing a FPS game, you will not stop to smell the roses (or see them up close). Still good to have the option thou, pretty sure many will find it quite beneficial.
Don't worry FPS games DO have Nvidia DLSS so problem solved. And those who doesn't run very fast and better on Nvidia GPU's than AMD anyway.
Plus Nvidia added Nvidia Image Scaling and Game Filters support to GeForce Experience Globally to ALL games if you wish to do so
Something to keep in mind is because it is temporal, FSR 2.0 is making use of motion vectors that the game engine has to generate for it to use as input. Regular FSR by comparison can just take an image as input.
That is an important distinction to make, because while FRS 2.0 is much closer to the original pitch of FSR being a DLSS equivalent, it has to access data that is internal to each game's executable, which makes it impossible to implement at a driver level.
One neat thing about RSR is that one can buy a higher resolution monitor today and upgrade the graphics card a lot later.
I am amazed at how much information you crammed into this video. You guys did a superb job.
Thank you for making this more or less confusing mess much easier to understand.
Just to give you some engagement, I replayed a good chunk of Control with RSR 1080->1440p on my 5700XT. I feel it was worth it using there. 1080->1440p RSR High Settings looks better than 1080p High Settings or 1440p Medium settings to achieve similar frames rates of 70-100FPS - I think if it enables you to up your graphical settings to something a little more eye pleasing and you're not too far away from native resolution, that's where it's going to shine as a feature, as in my case. That's not to say it'll work for every game in that regard, but I think it's going to vary game by game and I'm going to leave it enabled for a while and see how it impacts my games.
While this is a solid look at the function, I think it overlooks the fact there are lot of different cases where an upscaling tech might be viable. In the case of RSR, my initial impressions without further interaction with it is that it's a way to edge out slightly better quality graphics, as opposed to making your 1080p medium settings games feel like 4K medium setting games. Comparing those three setting spaces in Control, it was pretty clear how it shakes out, for me. I can't notice how much blurrier it is in action and it didn't detract from the experience at all, wherein and the benefit of a higher setting to achieve the same framerate gave me a lot more than RSR took away.
I plan on testing it on A Plague's Tale, which I'm mid-playthrough as well as Shadow of the Tomb Raider, which I haven't played through yet, so my opinion is prone to change pending the results of those experiences.
you actualy can run 1440 native with a 5700xt isn't a problem for that card
@@comguaf8093 yes, but my sweet spot frame rate is about 80 fps before the returns feel diminishing to my perception. The 5700xt can only achieve that at medium/mixed for 1440p, which is why I'm digging having RSR active for this game as there's a fair quality up tick going to high. This isn't going to apply to every game because graphical levels are different in every game. In most cases ultra isn't that great of an uptick in quality. But oftentimes going from medium to high is, when there's a lot of setting tiers. I suspect that in a lot of cases that's where RSR is going to have an advantage, it's going to allow you to bring the resolution down a notch. Bring the quality up a lot and get a better looking game as a result. Again, I haven't really tested it across a lot of games to form an opinion. That's just my initial impression.
Ohhh I see, I actualy play all 1440p 60fps ultra settings all my games so thats why Im telling you that but it can’t be your situation I know, I hope see more xfx and rsr progres in more games and pc aplication in general, it be a great benefit un cyberpunk, now i Can Tun cyberpunk 1440p 60fps ultra settings love it
Tried RSR in Metro Exodus Enhanced vs the shading rate toggle. 4k at 0.7 shader resolution did look marginally closer to native 4k than RSR upscaling from 1440p, but the difference in performance is phenomenal. The same scene rendering in native 4k was 47fps, at 0.7 shader resolution 63fps, at 0.6 shader resolution 70 fps. RSR upscaling from 1440p - 4k came in at 80+fps, despite sitting in between 0.7 and 0.6 in terms of scaling.
In some areas there was almost a 2X difference between 0.7 and RSR upscaled from 1440p. I'm not entirely sure why, I guess the shader upscaler can be more costly in some scenes than others, whereas RSR doesn't seem to incur any performance hit?
I read over the FSR source code, and while I'm by far not fluent in HLSL it looked extremely light weight. The biggest code block is the sharpening pass with edge detection. It's all coded in a fashion that looks almost like assembly level code, so just pushing bytes around in arrays and applying bit masks and such. So there is a performance hit compared to straight up native, but it's pretty darn small. I think KitGuruTech found that 100FPS native translates to 94FPS upscaled on RDNA2 and 92FPS upscaled on Ampere. So a 6 and 8% overhead respectively.
@@andersjjensen 🤘🏻
@@andersjjensen it's probably deceptively simple. Once you get to that level of optimisation, the only way to code things is to do them with vector/matrix math, because they get translated directly to vector/matrix bytecode commands by the compiler & get ran fast af by the cpu/gpu. It's faster than parallelisation, but only works with problems that use vectors/matrices and it requires extremely good knowledge of linear algebra.
@@teknonmy7210 The edge detection of the sharpening pass didn't look simple though :P
But yes, a frame is a matrix of colour values and transmorphing that into a bigger matrix of colour values seemed like the least amount of operations.
Have you tried comparing the image quality with RSR enabled vs RSR disabled with lower render resolution? I tried today and found that... RSR did nothing. I'm not sure if it's my monitor being just 24 inch 1440p or that the GPU scaling option in AMD is already doing its job.
edit: just checked techpowerup article on RSR, and it seems that RSR does introduce some sharpening and better image. in conclusion, it's just my monitor.
Kinda weird that it's not available to older amd gpus on launch, those would need RSR a lot more.
My biggest frustration. Maybe they don't want us running 4k on our old ass cards.
@@Wabajak13 yep, its a bad idea so just don't.
Answer is: Upselling. "There also could be some sort of technical reason, but since FSR works on any card its unlikely"
It’s more likely just testing and validation. Their software teams will be busy with FSR2.0 and RDNA3, would expect it to trickle down much like SAM
@@spacechannelfiver This! RDNA3 comes out later this year and AMD has to make 100% sure that RSR works as good as it can on those cards. It can't be like the RDNA2 situation where they said "oh yeah we have an answer to DLSS and it's coming soon™"
Instead they have the chance to say "we have an upscaling technology and it works out of the box on any game no questions asked". That's huge.
I see this is more of a win for older games than newer ones, with more and more games adding Resolution Scaling or FSR/DLSS in games. RSR makes more sense as a tool to bring life back to older games without these features.
Older games shouldn’t have as many performance issues which is probably why it wasn’t mentioned, but I think this a great point.
@@rws531 It would no doubt lower performance on older games. Most of the old games I play max out at 1080p so adding the upscale to 1440p would lower fps... not that I'd notice because it would still be above 144fps in most of them id bet lol
not work older games ;)
@@Weirdanimator max out at 1080p lol what game? And what's that smell? I used to use a 1200p monitor like over 20 years ago no bs.
@@thechurchofsupersampling what are you on man ? theres loads of older games that dont support 1080p or less, who cares about your 1200px res from an unknown time and unknown game ? You think your personnal experience makes reality invalid ? dudebro needs a sanity check.
My resolution only works from January 1st to maybe January 15th or so, I hope the Super Resolution will fix this
Super Resolution works by upscaling a smaller resolution. It should allow you to hit your "hit the gym" target by just doing some pushups and situps at home. Though that might need to be set to "performance" mode instead of "quality".
Yes but we're not bowling
Just take something to give you the runs and you'll lose a few pounds.
Thanks for the comparison, Steve & gang!
I always appreciate the breakdowns and comparisons. I am starting to research components for a build for my daughter, so this is very helpful.
Seems awesome for older games stuck at lower resolutions
That's a great point - would like to see what it does to the original Deus Ex.
yeah its like those addons you can get for gamecube ps2 and n64 that makes it way higher res and crisp and hdmi
The weird part about the difference in the UI quality from RSR and FSR, is FSR had way better text and icon quality, but RSR had way better quality in the image of the weapon displayed above the ammo count, I'm not sure what to make of that. At 7:07 you can see overall the hud looks worse with RSR but the weapon icon looks much sharper.
RSR is applied after the UI is rendered, it's like a post-post processing, but FSR is applied at any stage in rendering that the developer can choose
nVidia's driver-level NIS works at the same stage as RSR
It's likely because RSR probably ties itself to a sharpening filter alongside the scaling like how NVIDIAs NIS works. Weird Steve didn't bring that up unless he did and I just missed it.
I believe this is because the game itself uses a low-res thumbnail image of the gun for this part of UI, and FSR just leaves it alone, while RSR applies upscaling to it.
@@brantyin4745 This is the correct answer.
But I don't understand why they had to be so cheap with the HUD, you're looking at it everytime!
@@cash_banooca17 he did comment on how RSR improved the icons, but you'll have to take my word on it since I'm too lazy to look for the timestamp :D
I've been using RSR in a few titles and honestly it actually helps a few older games I have with problematic internal resolution scaling.
I really appreciate this because it actually fixes some games that use DirectX 9/10/11 but don't have proper scaling in rendering on higher resolution displays.
To me, this just works, and it works well, and actually fixes some things for me.
Not sure if that was intended, but if it is a side effect, its a welcomed side effect in my opinion.
This would be a good way to test scaling against older titles that don't have proper resolutions that work on modern monitors.
Thanks for the in depth explanation Steve!
When you have to zoom in stuff that much in a static image to even try to get a comparison, it means the tech is pretty good. Would like to see a double blind test.
I agree. And you don't even have to do the "performance" option to the extent that this review did if you don't need to or want to. It would be pretty easy to add quality on top of what this whole video showed while still getting performance over 4k native.
The zoom is more useful for people who watch TH-cam on their phones
Its because of youtube compression, you won't see much of a difference in a gameplay comparison recording. However you would notice a difference in person and through zoom ins.
enhance! ENhance! ENHANCE!!!!!!
Pixel peeping like this is needed, don't get me wrong. But the real test of these is in motion where you see possible shimmering, ghosting and the like which are a bigger problem to IQ than blurrier text in a texture in the back of the scene that makes up 1/32 of the whole image or whatever small fraction you'd like
While it sucks older AMD cards aren't gonna get access to rsr in its driver its still great to see those stuck on older hardware are gonna get more life and preformance out of their hardware especially in this market where its nearly impossible to upgrade and not get ripped off
It would be interesting to compare the image quality between lower quality settings and upscaling methods at similar fps
Curious to see this live on my AMD card. Thanks Steve.
And will need to update this in just a couple months with Alchemists launch and xess.
I use a manually installed FSR implementation for almost all my VR games that use openVR. Using a wireless Quest2 means that I need to allow a bit of overhead for encoding of the stream, and FSR can be a lifesaver for keeping things playable on a 2060. The per game implementation is kind of useful though, as I use very different settings in Beat Saber, where latency is everything, vs Skyrim VR, where I just want to make it playable and not look like shit.
Is it really Skyrim VR if it doesn't look like shit? I say this as someone who enjoys Skyrim VR.
thanks for the video, just a small improvement suggestion. It was a little confusing when you changing from one scene to another or one comparison back to the previous, the side is switching. So take A, FSR on the left side and RSR is on the right, next take, it switched, FSR is on the right and RSR is on the left side. This switches back and forth through out the comparison. Mostly when doing a full screen and than switching back or when changing the scene.
As an indie game developer, these kinds of deep dives really help in deciding which tech and settings would work best for my project. Thanks a bunch!
RSR has been good for me in early access games that are usually lightly optimized and can make lower end graphics card chug with quality setting turned up. I have been able to hold a more stable 60 frames without sacking much in the way of visual quality.
The best thing would be AMD making the RSR available with both full screen and windowed screen-like options
I been using Magic Borderless for that combined with Lossless Scaling. Lossless Scaling can't do full screen so I use Magic Borderless to make full screen games to a window version. Now fsr is usable on full screen games with Magic Borderless and Lossless Scaling combo.
@@100Bucks why do people do this? Why not play in fullscreen mode????????
@@liquidsunshine697 For me it has to do with utilizing multiple monitors without the need to press alt+tab. Its much easier to keep what you're looking at on your game and just slide your mouse over to your other monitor for whatever it is you're going to do
@@ilikehalolots Oh I see multiple monitors that makes sense. Thank you!
@@liquidsunshine697 some people need to alt tab a lot to keep changing values in their trainers. I see my son doing it and I mock him for not being able to win modern on-rails easy mode games without cheats. He just comes back with, yeah well if I take twice as long to get through a game then I spend less time doing my homework (Little sod doesn't bloody do it anyway!).
Off-topic. I've been looking up your TH-cam video's & reading on your website. I have to say, i really enjoy your content. The way that you (and your team) shares the information and all the numbers (testing). But, having allot of data about coolers and an idea of a good airflowcase, wouldn't it be a great idea trying making one yourself?
Nice stuff. Also is there any problem watching 1080p stuff on 1440p display anymore?
There is a software called "Looking Glass" which is basically a "remote" desktop app for linux but it can only be used int he local machine. Its purpose is to control a Windows VM with GPU passthough configured and play in a window (instead of changing the monitor source from the settings). I'm bringing this up because it recently implemented FSR and this makes it possible to try it with any game, even those whose developers didn't integrate FSR on them.
Of course the problem is that you have to use Linux, create and configure a VM with GPU passthrough enabled so it's not an option for most people but it's cool for linux users :)
Seen Looking Glass demoed by Wendell a few times, really impressive software
There's also "Lossless Scaling" on Steam and "Magpie", which both allow you to use FSR on any game directly on Windows.
On Linux you can use FSR directly through Proton GE.
@@nalsai Tried Magpie and the performance was terrible, much worse than upping the resolution. Lossless Scaling is indefinitely on hold because Ukraine.
Its not really remote, but copying directly from memory, so far as I understand. It simply shares the memory buffer
I feel like Magpie, a FOSS implementation of FSR and other upscaling algorithms should be brought into the conversation, I've been using it on a fanless HTPC 5700G to play older games like Dark Souls 2 on a 4k HDR tv, with w11's HDR colour stretching
Fsr 2.0 should be a better upscaler imho
I use it to play RPG Maker games, it's great.
Wait, RSR doesn't support zen3 APUs?
@@damara2268 No, those are not Navi GPU's they are still Vega based
@@dralord1307 whaaat?
That's such a shame, why would they not support their product which literally released a year ago??
Great to see the Linux support mentioned! One minor point to add is that you can use FSR/RSR on any program in Linux. The way it works in general on Linux, is that the program is given a virtual screen where you can define how big that looks to the program/game and how big you want that to be displayed. So, you can, for example, give a video player, with a 720p video, a virtual screen of 720p (so it fullscreens), but give a display resolution of 1080p and that way have an FSR/RSR upscaled window of that video.
The Steam Deck interface has all that built in, so no need to set any options, but the functionality is completely open to use how you want in any other program (including desktop Steam).
It may significantly increase your comparison workload and complexity but I think a follow-up where you add Blinue's Magpie and its upscaling filter options to your testing. It allows you to add FSR 1.0 in a similar way (to my understanding) of the end-of-pipeline way RSR works and in addition has several filters to choose from. Would like to see how it measures up.
Could be a big help if you are using a CPU with an integrated GPU.
IGPU's dont play games dude... they are basic gpu's for day to day internet surfing only....
@@MenCanNotBeWomen That never stopped people from gaming on them. In fact, it's an pretty popular option for those who can't afford GPUs
@@dranzule191 what you are looking for are APUs. CPUs with beefier GPU found in discrete cards integrated.
@@Aereto I'm also referring to chips such as the Athlon 3000G.
@@MenCanNotBeWomen You can game just fine on a laptop with iGPU. Sure not all games, some modern games might not run when they don't scale well. But not every new game is graphically intensive, and just because a game is 5+ year old doesn't make it any worse. Quite the opposite, some older games have not found equivalents in their genres yet, and we are at a point where even older games still look good.
00:29 This actually is a problem I would place squarely at nVidia's door.
DLSS = "Deep Learning Super Sampling"
Only it's not super-sampling at all. It's sub-sampling. A "sample" is an actual piece of data - something generated or measured that is considered valid in and of itself. Like all upscaling algorithms, DLSS operates by taking _fewer_ samples, then extrapolating information from there to create more data for output. In other words, you render something like ~2M pixels (1920x1080 resolution), but then generate an extra ~6M pixels and display a result containing ~8M pixels (3840x2160 resolution). The smaller the difference between those numbers, the fewer pixels with fictional data there are. The fewer fictional pixels, the more accurate the result should be.
Actual super-sampling is collecting _more_ information than you end up displaying. This is exemplified by AMD's VSR, or "Virtual Super Resolution", which allows you to set a game's resolution to something larger than what your monitor supports, then scales it down to your monitor's native resolution (or maybe something lower). The down-scaling algorithm doesn't need to be particularly sophisticated to provide a very good result. It automatically anti-aliases the image, and in general makes everything look better, because it has more real data to work with than you end up displaying directly in the output.
But when nVidia called DLSS a form of "super-sampling", AMD was left with little choice but to name their competing offering using the word "super" as well, which is how we ended up with both VSR and FSR - two forms of "super resolution" - that operate in exactly opposite ways.
It'd be a lot easier to criticize AMD for this naming choice if _anyone_ in the tech press had had the knowledge and wherewithal to point out that DLSS is named utterly stupidly, doing exactly the opposite of what the name claimed. But nobody did that. They just repeated the name, said what it stood for, and acted as if that was perfectly normal.
Lots of stuff in IT has terrible naming, that's just how it is. Don't get me started on USB or "fibre" internet. Or 6 different versions of Windows 10! and where did Windows 9 go?
A really nice topic and a really nice video as usual!
I was just wondering if Patrick had an opportunity to test and evaluate DLSS on an Nvidia machine? I would love to hear his comparisons of DLSS and (once available) FSR 2.0 to see how far AMD has come along. Great stuff.
I was excited to check out RSR on my “amd advantage edition” laptop, just to find out it isn’t compatible yet…..need a mux switch to be able to enable it. Lame.
My take away:
FSR is being used at a different point in the rendering pipeline, and thus potentially more positive results are recieved.
Yeah, that's pretty much it, including FSR tries to match your current resolution but renders at a lower resolution, while RSR tries to increase the resolution based on your current resolution.
FSR = Small to current
RSR = Current to big
I just got a new monitor.... 4k on 1080p and 4k on 4k.... so different. Never noticed how good your videos looked!
Excellent clarification however, Suggest that you also show FPS / frame-times differences between RSR and FSR. 😊
What I will say with FSR is that, at least on Linux, you can force it on in any game using proton and it actually works quite well. Played Yakuza Kiwami 2 like this and went from 40ish frames at 1440p native with maxed settings to 60 frames upscaled from 1080p and the quality difference wasn't really noticeable even with side by side uncompressed screenshots besides obviously seeing a little sharpening with FSR applied all on a Vega 56. Can't wait for FSR 2.0 as some of the post processing looks even cleaner agian.
The only downside to this is it's applied at the end of the pipeline so it can be hit or miss with upscailing artifacts or UI upscailing issues but so far I've had none personally. I guess this kind of means that the way we forced FSR on in Linux is what AMD is going for here in RSR as the quality was determined by the game's render resolution setting.
I have a vega64 card and switched to linux several months ago. So far I'm happy with how everything is working, but a little more would always be appreciated.
How do I force FSR in proton? Is it just a simple setting in steam?
@@tomface55 I think you have to be still using a Glorious Eggroll version on steam so I'd get the latest of that. Set your game to use the glorious eggroll version and then all you do is type the following as steam launch options:
WINE_FULLSCREEN_FSR=10 WINE_FULLSCREEN_FSR_STRENGTH=1 %command%
You can change the strength value to anything from 1 - 10. I can't for the life of me remember weather 1 or 10 means more sharpening though. Once that's all done you have to have your game running in fullscreen, not boarderless, and lower the resolution to what ever you feel like. Proton should have it automatically upscaled and with post processing effects applied.
@@The88shrimp Thank you!
So, you mean FSR via Proton is applied at the end of the pipeline?
Since usually, RSR is applied at the end and FSR is still in the middle. It changed from spacial to temporal upscaling from FSR 1 > 2, though.
To hell with 4k and 1440p , i want to upscale 480p and 720p to 1080p
I would love to see if RSR can be used for older games, like early 2000s games, halo ce, nfsu2, prince of persia, etc. If they can use RSR i believe its the only kind of modern upscaling that would work at little to no cost in performance and i feel like it's a good use case in that scenario given how old games have lower resolution textures and ui elements that would all benefit from the upscale. Ofc, there are mods that lovingly recreate and upscale things for such titles but this would be less demanding than mods and also preserve the old aesthetic in cases where mods change them up.
Surprised you answering so many questions so quickly
You must be new here! :P
Steve spits facts like a machine gun spits bullets!
whoever edited this was very confused. It kept inverting the comparison from left to right all the time (FSR vs RSR, then it suddenly changed to RSR vs FSR, etc), like right after 15:30
I've been waiting to upgrade my 1070ti, until the game I've been playing most implemented FSR. Now I'm running it at high settings, 1440p ultra wide, at 100hz. AMD saved the day with that one.
Yeah, nVidia really handed AMD an easy one here. If nVidia had given DLSS a fallback mode "that still improve performance but doesn't look entirely as good as the magical AI trained super mega awesome Tensor Core driven DLSS" they would have kept the sales pitch AND avoided the "AMD has given me more performance uplift on my Pascal card than all the nVidia driver optimizations combined" memes... And they could've gotten away with locking Radeon users out of it with a bit of technobabble and a straight lying face.
@@andersjjensen Nvidia has NIS which you can enable. It's basically the same thing as this "brand new" RSR, already available since last November.
@@damara2268 - yup very similar - was actually expecting comparison between FSR, RSR i NIS frankly, as RSR and NIS are the direct competitors to each other
@@damara2268 he's talking about FSR :D, also RSR is only available for RX 5000 and 6000 series cards which I see pointless since these cards don't need it
@@damara2268 That's a big "basically". NIS is a linear upscaler and a global sharpening filter you have to manually tune. The Radeon software has had this since 2016. RSR, being based on FSR, is a bilinear upscaler and a sharpening pass that does edge detection (that is, it sharpens more in high contrast areas and less in more gradient areas) that you don't need to manually tune.
Great breakdown. One thing I have NOT seen discussed ANYWHERE is the forgotten step child "Virtual Super Resolution". I would LOVE to see an implementation of RSR or FSR upscaling a game into virtual super resolution to give 1080 native monitors a new lease on life. Any takers on making this happen?
You could try using CRU (Custom Resolution Utility).
Hey Steve and Co... is it beneficial to have your tower computer laying on its side? Is that better for things like large cpu air coolers and huge graphics cards on the motherboard? Thanks!
I'm gonna use FSR and then also enable RSR, sounds like a great plan.
Xzibit would be proud.
Doesnt work
Set native resolution to 720p, upscale with FSR to 1440p, and then re upscale the whole image with RSR to a 4k mess.
RSR looks really good with Elden Ring if you're scaling from 1440P to 4K. It made the image noticeably sharper on my 55 inch TV.
No input latency or anything?
Finally! A comprehensive breakdown into the small bits, with visuals, that help me make sense of all the AMD FSR/RSR nonsense. Well done, Patrick and Steve. 👍
GOLD Standard for reporting as always. Great work!
I know this might be a dumb question, but is RSR able to be used on gtx cards?
It's not a dumb question, but it is answered very early in the video.
@@GamersNexus oh, I might have missed it... It's really late where I am.
@@raawesome3851 No. It's built into the Radeon Adrenaline driver user interface. But you can get Lossless Scaling or Magpie from Steam which does the same thing.
@@andersjjensen I see...
@@andersjjensen Anybody using Lossless Scaling like me. I highly suggest buying Magic Borderless as well. Lossless Scaling doesn't work on full screen games. If you use Magic Borderless, you can convert full screen games into a windowed version and use Lossless Scaling on top. Or if you're in a situation trying to play games on a crappy laptop. Example, most games on laptops run the best at 800x600 for max fps. Maybe you want a bit more fps. Use magic Borderless and create a custom resolution below 800x600. Then use Lossless Scaling on top of Magic Borderless to make the game run at 1366x768.
For platforms that almost exclusively only feature user generated content, like VRChat, Neos VR, Second Life, and Roblocks... FSR would be a great option for upscaling, because of it's wide hardware support, and because it doesn't need to train on visual samples of the game.
The nature of user generated content will guarantee that something won't look good with an AI upscaler, given the wide range of styles, textures, and post processing being used. You just couldn't keep up with all the new content if you tried. And if you could keep up with it, the AI method would be very middle-of-the-road looking, and only look good on "average" content. Or the AI upscaler could try to learn all the different styles, and need to be enormous and slow to run due to the extra size of the neural network.
Thank you for the great analysis!
I like the subtle change to the intro
Would RSR be a good option if one were playing an older game where resolution maxed out at 720 or 1080 but you are playing on a high resolution monitor?
It might be better to use virtual super resolution for that
Yes it looks great even for lower resolutions.
Yes. RSR is better at upscaling than your monitor. And you get rid of the frustrating flicker when you alt-tab out of the game...
I tested it on Sacred Gold. Had problem upscaling it to 720p, even though mod exists, RSR works and now is 1080p
4k Oregon Trail in DosBox...here I come! 😆
So RSR is a no brainer in older games without high res support?
I wonder if virtual super resolution would be better for this
Yes. RSR does a better job at upscaling than your monitor.
just saw it in this video for the first time, but the desk top you use for b roll is the same one I'm typing this on, love mine to death
I'd be interested in hearing about the OEM of PSUs that you do sponsor spots for / if there's info on their performance like voltage regulation and ripple also.
I'm using the 1060 6gb, tried all the scaling available and I'll just stick to my 1080/60 oled till 3080+ performance is affordable or buy a console and let them waste the time tweaking each game... I personally hate when UI gets messed up, had too many RPG games turn unplayable and if 1080p mid settings don't get me to 60fps I'll just wait a bit as I would prefer enjoy a game I'm paying $20-80 for rather than compromise to that extent.... That and a good quality low latency fast response screen is probably going to make everything way better for many vs time wasted on tuning scaling might get a cople games to just playable.
I think you should probably disable post processing effects if they're an option in the game you're testing using RSR. Most people disable them without it anyway, since most people do not like film grain, chromatic aberration, etc
@@aweigh1010 tbh they do have a performance effect so only people with higher end pc components would use them.
and thats certainly not the majority.
@@aweigh1010 I'm not in the minority actually because from watching videos online their is an unanimous consensus from gamers and tech TH-camrs that things like motion blur and chromatic aberration don't look good in their opinion. Just because you like it does not mean you have to pretend like you're in the majority, what a weak argument.
Secondly, I'm a former Ubisoft developer, who's worked on Assassin's Creed games that have postfx effects and I never said every effect looks horrible but I definitely do find some to not be good. We add a lot of effects to the game in case people like them, not because we think it's the best way to play the game with them on
Thirdly you are insane if you think it is reasonable or to force your preferences onto everyone else "you have to play it this way, with EVERY PostFX on!" NO YOU DON'T! You can play it however you please and enjoy the game.
@@aweigh1010 way to go, man - speaking on behalf of every game dev studio that all their games should be played with all the graphics settings included in their games - especially post-processing, which objectively have been one of the most controversial graphical settings for years! That's so absurd to the point it's hilarious! Lmao... You remind me of myself 10 years ago when I would put every slide on ultra, check all the graphics settings boxes and get excited about it, lol!
@@aweigh1010... No. No they don't.
@@aweigh1010 That is actually an impressive combination of multiple logical fallacies: Argument from authority, argumentum ad populum, argumentum ad hominem, unsubstantiated claims... For all I know, you might have multiplexed a few more in there somewhere...
A lot of the softer look of RSR is going to be down to most FSR implementations having mip-map biasing during rendering so that it has more detail to work with.
I used rsr in RDR2 1080 up to native 1440 and personally I think it looked pretty amazing with a pretty huge uplift, able to max out the quality preset bar and still get stable 60 fps on 6700xt. Think it can be pretty amazing for games that don't have any other scaling methods
The fact that we are now commenting on wether the upscaled or native looks better blows me away. FSR is quickly going to be a go to for games with possible performance issues.
FSR it's going to be more implemented than DLSS, specially because it's available for more hardware and console hardware is made by AMD
I still dont get why all these videos about DLSS, FSR, RSR are about 4K gaming, when literally the MOST people are still gaming in 1080p???
is it that hard to benchmark things to the mainstream and not only for the upper enthusiasts?
My pc is my living room game console so things like this help me upscale to my 4k resolution. I have an gtx 1060 3GB
@@bipolaryx Because FSR, DLSS and RSR start to make (good) sense on 1440p and higher. On 1080p you have many artifacts, so for checking it on 1080p they would need to use cards like 1050 ti which they could not have now (and it also prolonge tests, because why stop on 1050 ti, when there is also popular 1060 etc)
I am sure there are games where the HUD has a particular pixel size, for example an icon on the screen is 100 pixels wide, regardless of resolution, in a case like this, the difference between FSR and RSR would be very noticeable in terms of visible screen
The only questions left after watching this that i have.. and maybe i missed you mention this but... is there any difference in the performance gains? Anyone using any super resolution tech is most likely going for those sweet sweet frames and if having FSR built into a game is typically better quality, then, does that come at a frame cost? And if the difference is basically negligible with decent hardware does it scale up as you go backwards in generations that support it?
I've found RSR pretty useful so far. The crysis remastered trilogy, metro Exodus and call of duty black ops cold war all have raytracing that exceeds the performance of my 6900xt and they don't have FSR so now I can finally max out the raytracing settings and have a playable frame rate. The image is softer, sure, but not that bad.
So great to see competition and improvements in this tech. It's easily the most impactful tech in gaming for a long time. I'd rank it as more important than hardware ray-tracing.
Am 36 years old and won 5 warzone out of 50 games, but spotting image quality is not my specialiality, i care more about stability. I play in competitive settings anyway, as long is gives good low 1 % 0,1 % am golden. Great video btw.
How does RSR compare to Integer Scaling?
Was it intentional to have the RSR and FSR comparison frames switch sides between examples?
While it’s not FSR, Nvidia Image Scaling has made Elden Ring look quite a bit nicer on my 4K screen because I have to run it at 1440p for performance reasons. The standard upscaling looks bleh, NIS looks better. Not quite native 4K, but better. I imagine RSR will be even better.
"I have to run it at 1440p for performance reasons" Elden ring is capped at 60 FPS. Unless you are averaging 30fps while playing it at native 4k, running it at 1440p for this sake wouldnt make much sense lol
FSR in Vermintide 2 allowed a 3050 to hit decent frame rates at 3440 x 1440 on the quality preset. FSR impressed me more than DLSS in a lot of titles.
Was playing with rsr the other day, it works in borderless windowed mode as well. I kept toggling it on and off at 1440p (1080p rsr) using the shortcut. Its an interesting tech for sure
I love You guys and Have deep respect for you and love that as a consumer You have our backs. I love your attention to detail in ALL subjects With the Exception of VR Image and I get that IMO it is a totally separate category from Flat screen but Do you think you could start to work it into some of the Categories you cover for some kind of enjoyment for us VR lovers?
With both consoles using AMD, I think we will see further support in future games for FSR. Which will benefit PC users.
I don't believe so, the gold standard for upscaling on consoles has been unreal's TAAU, with Unreal and AMD collaborating on TSR for UE5 I think that will be the new standard for the consoles. We'll still see TSR on pc and it will probably as good or better than FSR 2.0
@@khaledm.1476 Most console games do not use UE5 because they don't want to pay Epic anything. The best looking games on the market always use in house engines.
Going on image quality to judge RSR performance is the wrong way to go! What RSR has done for me is make my average FPS @1080 low-medium settings become my average FPS @4k ultra settings (stable 120 FPS in COD Warzone as an example), my GPU is a Gigabyte RX5700XT OC'd and the performance difference is night and day.
How, it's like the main thing to judge, or else you'd just lower the rezolution?
@@mryellow6918 Obviously you don't have a 5000 or 6000 series card, otherwise you'd already have seen the results in performance playing games @4k Ultra settings with a 120 FPS after getting the same level of performance @1080 mediumish settings.
@@RoCkShaDoWWaLkEr explain how image quality has nothing to do with it?
@@mryellow6918 Are you guys huffing glue or not English speaking? Having your average FPS @1080 medium settings become the average at 4k ultra settings is a much bigger deal for games which are moving pictures not still images.
How fast and stable a system runs while playing a game is much more important.
Not sure how much more simple to spell it out for you guys ;but then again obviously you don't even have a capable card or you would already know.
@@RoCkShaDoWWaLkEr except its just running at the same internal render rez and isn't remotely close to 4k.
I have to admit I've been very confused about upscaling and other ways to get 4K experiences. This video makes it all make sense and when I go to replace my 1080p TV monitor I'll seriously consider going with 4K as there are evidently ways to make it work without dropping two grand on a monster card.
Am I the only one who puts a GN video on in the background for no other reason than the soothing nature of Steve's voice??
Got here in 16 secs!
Not the first time I've said that. 🤣
Okay 👌
As a maybe improvement of your pixel peeping for the next dlss or fsr rsr comparison. Please do not use single Screenshots. Please lock fps to 60, then take 1/4 of a second aka 15 frames and compose a stillimage via Photoshop. This Single Pixel lines comparisons do nothing for or of anything to actually show what we humans would see if starring at that image. This will show what we humans would actually see on while playing a game and moving, our brain takes informations from our eyes about.0.05 to 0.15 seconds to compose an image of reality that becomes conscious
Exactly, all these techniques look great in theory but they all advertise with stills for something that will be in motion. I've been disappointed with every DLSS title I've tried, ends up looking muddy like TAA when actually playing, guessing AMD and intel's implementation will be the same.
@@luke5957 its good to be skeptical, but your one size fits all perspective should always be criticized
I've been waiting for a video like this, usually the consensus online is that FSR is better for performance but DLSS is better for image quality
Is it not the same performance at the sane resolution?
RSR is also compatible with TAA toggles and allows for 3200x1800. Whereas FSR often forces TAA on when using it and is limited in resolution.
I don't get the point of using higher resolutions to then shit on it with an AI upscale.
If your PC is shit at 4K, play at 1080p
Oh dang they accepted a Montech sponsor? I never knew they were a good brand! Right? They're a good brand? Genuine question.
They would have had to test out the psu before allowing a sponsorship
We tested the PSU and have a side channel video for it that we'll run soon. It passed our validation.
I had this weird thing going on while playing Elden Ring in 2k with my Red Devil 5700xt. The image looked amazing while I was standing still. Very vibrant and clear with yellow and purple flowers really popping. Armor lighting looked fantastic. When you move though the vibrancy immediately cuts out, texture drops instantly and the whole screen dims. It was almost seizure inducing and was driving me crazy trying to find a setting that didn't do this. Turns out it was in the radeon image sharpening. Hopefully they get the kinks out cause it looks great when it works but I kinda need to move around in my games.
Can make a review of the montech psu.. Is it a good brand