I bought my 817 right after the 818 came out as it was $100 cheaper at the time. I am not a "fan boy" but I do like my 817. If I want to blast out I use my 100 Watt radio. If I am just looking for a quick setup and fun I go with the 817. Question: Does the 891 feature VHF/UHF? No. For a learning radio the 817 is ok. Do I recommend it as a first radio? Yes, because it is an all mode 70cm - 160M radio. I know I will probably get hate replies but to each their own. Question: How many of the marketing department actually are licensed and operate these radios? I went to a Motorcycle shop once and offered to help push all of the motorcycles that were waiting to be repaired in at the end of the day. "Those are the employees motorcycles. If you work here you have to own and ride a motorcycle." Same thing for Ham Radio???
This just goes to show how each of us have our own opinions on different things and that is a great thing to have. I came very recently into the hobby (3 yrs) and like many, on a limited budget. As an M6 I soon discovered that field operations was the way forward for me and that is what I have slowly built my kit around. An 817ND, 4500mah lipo RC batteries, solar charger and my own little collection of homebrew resonant antennas so no tuner required. I would agree with two of the issues with the newer 818 that I can relate to and that is..... a much better internal battery and an increased TX to 10w. The rest I have no worries about and happily make contacts far and wide on my stock 817 without the need for filters or other mods. I absolutely understand that as an M6 with very little experience my opinion is restricted to what I know, but I just love getting out with my backpack on, up a hill with my little 817 and get on with it.
See my own posting. The FT817 is a GREAT rig. I love it. The FT818 is essentially just a FT817 with very minor tweaks. I bought my FT817 back in 2001 (apparently when it was released), so this tells me that this rig design is nearly 20 years old. It is a complement to the original design and specification that it has sold so well and no doubt continues to do so (in the guise of the FT818). I think the point of the video is that given the age of the FT817, the FT818 (as a successor) is a massive disappointment. With changes in technology and batteries over this 20 year lifetime, the FT818 could have been so much more. Given the right improvements, as a FT817 owner, I would have jumped at the chance to buy the successor to this iconic rig, but I am now going to buy an IC-705 when it becomes available. That's one less sale to Yaesu. Yaesu management need to wake up and "smell the coffee". I could be completely wrong, but I am guessing sales-wise right now that they are being completely spanked by Icom. M1GRY
Yes you've understood the video correctly. The point is not to knock the ft-817 or the original design. The goal was simply to point out how the 818 failed to provide 21st century modernization, for the 817nd. It's a shame really. 73 Julian oh8stn
If you don’t already have an FT-817ND I think the 818 is still a good buy.With the current sale prices ($599) I can’t find anything with the same capabilities and band coverage including VHF/UHF at that price. I don’t own a QRP rig yet but I’m tempted to pick up an 818 to add portable QRP capabilities.
Because you need to add an external audio interface and often cat control. The cables in the back of the radio going to the audio and cat control interfaces create a wire mess. The radio becomes larger and heavier than it needs to be with all the accessories required to do anything "extra". It's not like Yaesu doesn't have the technology in-house. They've implemented these features in the 991a. I've been a Yaesu guy for the last 20 years. They have slowly moved away from Innovative portable Communications, to desktop contesting. They have even sold off their Vertex Standard Branch to Motorola. That's where all of the portable know how came from.
@@OH8STN Yeah I'm not sure I'd be as excited about the 818 if I was into digital modes. I like things simple and as clean as possible and the wire mess would not be cool. That being said I do own and use a completely stock 818 as my primary rig for a base and portable station (mostly SSB and some AM) and I totally enjoy it for my purposes. The only add-on I may consider is an SSB filter but so far it hasn't been necessary. Luckily there's more choices for our niche of a hobby than there ever has been.
I was really disappointing with the FT-818 as well, but even with the short comings of the FT-817 and FT-818 I still consider them a top pick for an "All Band", highly portable and rugged radio. Right now you can get a new FT-818 for $600 US. That is a lot of radio for that price. Yaesu could be dominating the market if they just paid a little more attention to what people want.
Just purchased a FT-818. Glad I did and this video is a hoot. Yes if you had a 817 the 818 probably was not worth the cost to "upgrade". But I sure am glad the Yaesu kept this great little rig in production and made incremental improvements. Not a fanboy, pretty much an Icom owner for everything else (including a 703 for most of my QRP work). But this is still a great rig for what it was designed to do: portable QRP with all band/mode coverage.
I haven't sold mine, but when you put it next to a 705 and of course I know the cost of the 705 is much higher. But when you compare it to what's available today, you begin to see the problems. For example being only able to add one filter which are extremely difficult to find. Anyway I guess the bottom line is it's not a bad radio, it just isn't what many of us expected from Yaesu.
I owned the 857, the 897, and now I have the 891 for portable operation. I need more than 10/20 watts. I almost exlusively operate on PSK31. But I see your point. Even the 891 is too heavy and draws lots of current. Almost 2A on RX. But I don't think the IC-705 will be the silver bullet for off grid radio. I even started designing my own radio to address the issues. I wold need at least 50 Watts with a tuner., isolated audio interface, IF dsp (this is where my engineering ability is weak), and CAT control. For now, I follow your magnificent tutorials, and I integrate my computer, display, and other stuff in one unit. Thanks for sharing all your ideas! 73s de HA5OGL
Well I don't think it's a fail. I'm happy with mine. I have 4 FT817s and the 818 and I've been more than satisfied with all of them. After watching this video I ordered another 818. I'm glad they didn't change it. And after it comes in I might just buy a third one. K4JTP
I’m a complete newbie. No anchoring biases yet. After a lot of research and reflection I realised that small size, low weight, and LACK OF fancy features are actually most important to me. I need to grow INTO a radio before I can grow OUT of a radio. Yaesu would do well to make an updated robust field radio. No doubt about that. I just bought a brand new FT-818ND. For now it’s a unit that I’m more likely to haul outside than many of its larger, or more delicate, or more expensive, competitors. Assuming I get into this new hobby and stick with it I can probably sell it gently used to a fanboy for what may be a zero or a couple hundred dollar usage and education fee. I paid $645 for it. It’s going to be a tax deduction though. Let’s see how I feel about it a year or two down the track.
It's a good approach and I like it.. The thing that gets you with the 818, is all the add on's one must buy. Enjoy it though. I enjoyed mine for over 20 years.
@@OH8STN Yes the add ons gave me pause. I’m going to try to push it as far as I can without going nuts on upgrades. The power post might be the first add though. If I stick to resonant antennas the tuner won’t be an issue. Might spring for a spare or upgraded battery. I’m planning a FT5D acquisition to handle all the digital stuff to begin with. In a year or two iCom will likely have an upgraded IC-7300 more on par with an FTDX10 so I’m holding off on a base rig for now. I’m also into photography… the best camera is always the one you take with you/have at hand. I’m thinking the same might apply here a bit with radios. Antenna choice is key here… any suggestions for outdoor portable/POTA/SOTA/IOTA type use case? Multi band capable preferred…
Love your channel content! I’m a brand new ham and will be attending the Huntsville Alabama ham fest starting tomorrow looking for my first field radio. Thank you again for all the content that you provide us with.73
I think you nailed it on all points. I was also expecting a much more improved radio than the FT-817 MK3. I still love my FT-817ND, but I'm also very interested in the announced new Icom IC-705 and how well it performs!
Totally thought the same thing when the FT-818 came out - thought it a complete insult. Wow... Years ago I had already sold the FT-817 for an ICOM IC-703+ wow, what a great radio complete with LC-156 backpack and AH-703 5-band whip. Works great for FT-8 portable with Signalink USB. I was waiting for Yaesu to come out with a REAL replacement for the FT-817 but didn't wait long after the IC-705 came out. Kept the IC-703+ setup and ADDED the IC-705 with LC-192 backpack. Wow...the IC-705...nice nice job Icom!
Still lots of people don't understand the FT-818 slap in the face. Only one filter and it is made of unobtainium. No internal audio interface, no DSP, no real battery life. Yaesu broke my heart! 73 Julian oh8stn
Julian, all good points. New ham here, and still haven’t settled on a radio, as I’m doing my homework with videos like this before I commit to a serious buy. That being said, I am waiting for the QRP-Labs QSX to come out. I know its a kit, but it offers a ton of features out the door at what is supposed to be a very reasonable price. I also have given up, for a lack of better words, on small QRP rigs like this, and have looked at other rigs like the FT-857D, and the FT-991A. The one thing that bothers me about Yaesu’s product line is that they seem to be out of focus, or like you say, not listening to the customer. Sure, they have interesting gear, but IMHO too many radios to choose from, and not enough features in any one radio to make it a complete buy. I might find a standard mil-spec hand held on their site, but it lacks a few features that one of their newer line of hand helds have. I get it, its all about marketing, but their sales will die a slow death if they don’t start listening to the customer’s needs. Thank you for enlightening me on this gear, and all of your expertise and input. I find it very helpful. 73 -KD9MED
Of course when we look at them subjectively. When given the chance to try something with a better receiver, better battery life, additional output power the 81x (objectively) begins to show its age.
@@OH8STN it was sold as a qrp radio. Why would you want more power? thats the whole point of it. the battery pack is intende as a stop gap if you need power quickly. When you are trying to use this radio outside of its intended use then it will obviously fall below expectations. if you want more power buy as radio not intended for qrp. So your arguments are pointless. As a qrp radio it stands up well.
@maenhir8938 Nonsense! Indeed, I wanted a QRP radio. The problem was this radio could only be run at ~2.5 - 3 watts (not 5w) while operating PSK, RTTY, Winlink, ... This is a well-known 817/818 problem. Moreover, that was just one of many antiquated issues with this formally ironic radio. Yaesu gave it a face lift, trying to sell it to us as an 817MK3. The Icom IC-705 showed us what the FT-818 could have been.
@@OH8STN no not nonsense, so no need to be rude. Why buy a low power radio and then complain about the low power. That makes no sense whatsoever. also you are comparing a modern sdr icom radio against a 10 year old design, again this makes no sense. What did icom have out at the time of the release of the 818 that compared to it? absolutely nothing. also the reviews of the 705 are not that good, poor documentation that doesn't even tell you how to set half of the options, nothing to adjust viewing angle, fragile plastic jacks, dodgy touchscreen, hard access to sd card slot, obsolete usb socket, obsolete mic connector, not even a small antenna for quick use, even the bluetooth has problems connecting to most things. so please if yo uare going to compare 2 radios at least give the failings of the other radio, which are many more than the yaesu, which the only problem most people have really is the battery.
For the ham looking at an FT818, I would suggest rather getting the FT-891. For the same or less money, they will get the ability to go to 100 watts if condx are bad, they get a nice BIG display, and tons of more features. The 817 was ground breaking when it came out...but 20 years have passed since then. It is obviously still selling very well, so Yaesu are just letting it continue as is. I think a built in ATU is more needed than built-in batteries. I prefer to use an external battery pack - the internal batteries will never last long when transmitting a lot. Rather use the battery space for an ATU.
Good point John: batteries are more and more effective and have more and more power for the same weight (density). So indeed, whilst portable, an ATU is way more useful if built in than the 817 / 818 battery which is too small by the way.
You are the second person I have come across to mention the FT-891 as an alternative. As much as I would like a "do everything" radio for field use, I want something based on newer technology and not a 20 y/o design. Low power consumption would be helpful for a field/QRP radio, but I can easily get a larger battery or switching power supply (a lot of park/forest preserve picnic shelters have electrical outlets in my area). Definitely, something to think about.
First of all, I'm asking these questions because you have great videos and I respect your opinion on the subject. I'm in the same position as some others as a first time QRP buyer. I did not previously own a 817 and was looking for my first QRP rig at a reasonable price. I got my FT-818 new for $575. Since you call it a complete fail, ridiculous, and a waste of time, I thought I made a poor choice in radio. But it seems like you just don't think its a big upgrade from the 817nd (i agree). But if the 817 is a great radio (for what it is intended to be) and the 818 is basically the same thing, wouldn't it fall into the same category as a great QRP rig? I'm asking for clarity, not to argue. Is your dissatisfaction because its not a great upgrade from the 817nd or is it a terrible failure of a radio in general like you seem to suggest? Also, why is it a poor choice for doing ft8, js8, psk31? I was looking forward to exploring these modes QRP. Is it just the power output limitations? Thank you for the videos and all the great content you put out.
despite of all the glorious reviews about Chinese radios I myself got me ft818 this October. I simply don't trust anything as I trust Japan. you made a right choice. you just can't go wrong with such legendary unit. enjoy.
Icom IC-705 is from Japan. Lab599 Discovery tx500 from Russia. Elecraft KXx from USA, mcHF from UK. all light years ahead of the FT-818. All of them include IF filters which Yaesu makes you buy. All include DSP, notch filters, ... which the FT-818 doesn't have. Even the Xiegu G90 and X5105 have these features built in. Your (fanboy based) argument is suggesting buying an inferior radio, simply because it comes from Japan. Don't buy a Chinese radio then, there are also alternatives from other countries. Sounds like you're not trying to convince us but, convincing yourself up your bad decision to buy an 818.
@@OH8STN I agree with you that there are many other, and potentially better radios available, but just keep in mind the price difference with a radio of the same quality and features (144/430 bands, sold as a premade unit with reliable warranty) like the ICOM IC-705. While the Icom radio is arguably better, in my country it costs over double the price of a FT-818!!! You could get a decent portable radio like the FT-818 and a base station radio like the FT-450D, all for the price of an ICOM IC-705!! I think that you probably should not upgrade to it from a 817ND, but if you are interested to buy it as your first (or as a supplementary) QRP Radio, it should absolutely suit your needs.
I don't disagree. Think about this though. If you add the signalink USB, add the sotabeams speech compressor, add the mechanical filter, AG the cat control adapter, at the DSP (optional), then we can see the actual cost of the ft-818. All of those features are already built in to almost every other qrp radio sold today. The IC 705 is an excellent example because everything is already built inside. The ft-818 if you want to do portable data modes, you have an awful lot of stuff taxed to the outside of the radio. You also have an awful lot of cable mess. I would agree with your statement if your only operating CW or SSB, without filters.
@@OH8STNWell I guess it depends on the operator's needs ands mostly if someone can afford to pay that amount of money at once. If you can afford the ICOM, buy it and you won't be disappointed. But if you want a more affordable option, you can buy the yaesu and buy the upgrades as you need them. (for example maybe you don't find the speech compressor necessary, or a signalink interface)
Would agree with all parts on the FT-818 down falls. I used a FT817ND for 7 years and added the windcamp internal battery, then added a DY-8x7 2.0 compressor and then added another windcamp battery for backup. This setup was used for both SOTA & WWFF activations, it did very well. My upgrade path was when looking at everything that I do I choose the KX3. I was lucky enough to pick one up a 2nd hand for a very good price ($1500 AUST) with all extras except 2m module and came all packed in a pelican case all ready to go, this was a no brainer for me to buy and sell the FT-817ND. Cheers Adam VK2YK
This is a good topic. I recently bought a xiegu x5105.The radio had everything I was looking for. Easy to read display. Long lasting internal battery. Built in antenna tunner and the list goes on. BUT the Xiegu failed in less than a month with indoor use. I will get a replacement radio and see if I just got a lemon. For some reason the external power jack on the radio opened up and it would not charge or accept external power. If quality controll etc was better with the newer Chinese rigs they would dominate the market. They seem to know what people want.They just need to deliver a product that is dependable. The Yaesu per price point is the next inline. And yes it is missing the mark on what it could have been. But it is a time tested radio that is much more dependable than the Chinese compititon. The first thing you need in a field radio is something you can trust to work when you climb that mountain top. I see great promise in the new russian radio. The others like the new icom are just to pricey to bring out in the field. KB9MVW
Thanks for commenting. That's the conclusion I came up with as well. I've had the oven in my radio, since before the 818 when he came out. I don't know man, it might be time to start looking for commercial r8gs like Codan for example.
it wasn't really meant to be an upgrade. Yaesu has stated that components used in the PA section of the 817ND were becoming scarce, so they had to redo the PA a bit, which required FCC approval again, hence the barely new model number of 818.
That being said, it's still a very dated radio design and is screaming for an update! A Yaesu 871, a smaller 10W version of the 891 with 2M and 70cm would be amazing.
As a new ham and my only rig is the Yaesu FT-818 is there a video you recommend on how to use it? I would go to a local club but being stationed overseas there is a huge language barrier. Any help would be great. Thank you KD9VUL
Julian, Thanks for the write up and agree with everything you said. I have several QRP radios here, Icom 703, 817, KX2,KX3 etc. However I just got the FT-891 and am very happy, even though no inbuilt ATU. Bought it mainly for digital modes with the SCU-17 interface and also my SCS Pactor modems operating portable/mobile. Jack VK4JRC
Long-time 897 field user, always thought about picking up an 817/818 mainly due to size. But this video is dead on. Probably enough room inside an 897 for all the mods you discussed, but it's still a big unit. Imagine a mini QRP 991a: Oh wait, that would be the IC-705... Yaesu is easily capable of making a killer field radio, it's time for them to get off the couch and actually do it.
Which is exactly why I sold off my ‘817ND and grabbed an IC-705. Even adding the AH-705 ATU I still have a better rig. With one hose for digi modes DStar too. Deff a win.
The 897 is big and heavy, inefficient to be carried in a backpack, but it's true that you can fit so many things in its battery compartment. I installed the guts of an ldg yt-100 antenna tuner inside and even had room to add a small LiPo battery. It is a fun radio to mod, and it looks incrasingly rugged as they introduce flashier models. But it may also be that I'm growing old... 73 de Diego EC1CW
I agree. My QRP rigs include FT-817ND, Elecraft KX3, Icom-703 Plus, and mcHF SDR. My choice when I want to take a QRP rig to the field ? Without hesitation I take my IC-703 Plus - 1) it has an excellent ATU built in, and when you're in the field using odd antennas, an ATU is a must. 2) It offers up to 10 watts output for marginal conditions 3) It has a lovely big display which is a joy to use. My KX3 UI is simply too complicated - 3 functions on each button, steep learning curve. mcHF is a fantastic SDR radio but lacks an ATU, but a big plus is it includes a built-in USB sound card, making digital so simple, just a single cable to the laptop. I am just disappointed that Icom did not refresh their QRP line. All the IC-703 Plus lacks is a USB port with built-in sound card. Otherwise it's pretty much perfect
I don't know about Josh, but at least I'm happy with mine. I've had it for a year and it's been Rock Solid. There's a couple of silly things with the menus, but definitely the menus are better than the eighth one seven and 857
891 is not even in the same category as 857 or 818 imho,I have all three and would wholeheartedly recommend the 891 without delay! You will not be displeased. The dnr is just outstanding!
I've owned an 817nd for years and I'm happy with it, I have the sota beams speech compressor for me who's had this radio for a long time it was a cheap upgrade and has made a good improvement to the 817's performance I think there is a lithium iron phosphate battery that can fit in the battery compartment of the radio, I think if like me you already own an 817 if yaesu did an upgrade kit 10watt final and a speech compressor microphone I'd buy them, cheers for the video Adam G7CRQ
Thank you for your evidenced based comments. I am struggling to determine which radio to purchase for satellite. This radio has full split duplex. I will continue to investigate.
Hold on there a minute John. The ft-817 and ft-818 are good radios for transponders. Many operators are using two of them in parallel to get full duplex from the satellites. This review was based on the ft-818 as an HF rig. There certainly are other specialized operating modes satellites for example, are these radios are totally acceptable.
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I only have one HF rig and that is my FT817ND - used with fldigi, is does everything for me. I have yet to take out in the field, but will do so at some point.
You nailed it Julian... I have the 817ND and the 857D. While the 891 has a better receive capability, for me a field radio needs VHF/UHF (if for no other reason that to be a backup to the HT). I had hoped the 818 would be a significant improvement but it was an immediate disappointment for all the reasons you hit on. Off of your list, I would have even forgiven omitting the tuner function since I've recently paired my 817ND with a MFJ-971 manual tuner (no additional power consumption unless you want /need to light the swr for the price of 6uA). Hopefully the next unit in the series will be a quantum leap.
I use the 891 in the field and its been great, but now I've been looking at a qro radio, mainly the 705. Between the size of the 892 and the amount of battery I need, takes up a lot more space. I'm using what I have, but now see the advantages of smaller when lugginf up a hill. I can use the space for water.
I agree with you about the battery. I totally disagree with you about the internal antenna tuner. That would make the unit so much bigger, and not every body wants one anyway. Internal tuners will only tune within a small SWR range. My LDG's all tune with the SWR of 9:1. An internal will only do about 3:1. Basically worthless imho. Also, the FT-818 was not built because they wanted to improve the radio. They replaced the 817 with the 818 because their parts supply they needed in order to build it, ran out. They had to build the 818 as a direct replacement out of necessity, not cuz they thought the extra watt was going to make a difference, or any other reason. That's my understanding of it, and I'm willing to be corrected if anyone else has anything to add. I really wish they would update it to SDR
Well I look at the antenna tuner from the kx2 and Kx3. That's doing a pretty good job in a very small package. I think where we completely agree is wishing it was an SDR rig. I guess I wonder how Yaesu could build the ft-891 but still thinking the ft-818 is comparable to other more modern HF radios.
They think we’re all fan boys and will pay anything. Here we are on Black Friday and the Yaesu inventory has price reductions EXCEPT the FT-818. Your complaints/points are valid.
If you're okay with doubling the size (and weight?) then wouldn't you just want a successor to the FT-857? For QRP, I'm looking for durable all-mode portability, so I'd prefer the next version of the 818 to be smaller and lighter and ideally have more weatherproofing for backpacking, but maintain the current price point.
Agreed! Unfortunately there is no indication we will ever get that radio from Yaesu. Yaesu is firmly behind the curve with QRP & portable rigs. They discontinued the ft-897, killed off the ft-857 and didn't really offer any significant update to the ft-817/818. While their focus has been on contest radios, Icom IC-705 moved the bar light years ahead of the Yaesu FT-818. I was hopeful for so many years but finally stopped holding my breath.
I greatly appreciate your videos and honesty as well. I just recently picked up an FT-897 to add to arsenal for impending move to AK as felt was a more realistic field use radio and better way to approach Survival/multi role man portable comms. I am curious if don't mind me ask what would you go with as far as what's currently out there for something in this size range? I would like have something not necessarily QRP output only but small and light ( slightly larger and hevier be fine with more functionality )and backup to the 897 perhaps SDR based as seems better way to go as well. thx for all your content I am learning much by binging on it .
I couldn't agree more, Julian. I was highly disappointed when I began reading the specs on the ft818. Filters upgrades would be nice, but I was certainly expecting a 10 watt rig and upgraded battery. The upgrade to 6 watts is a joke and I can do better with an aftermarket battery than what they gave us. I do not know why they even bothered with the 818. I know several that were excited when it was initially announced. But since we all found out the specs, don't know anyone who has purchased one.
I just bought one, with the 500hz Filter installed the LDG Z Autotuner, the data interface with cat cables, A Power Supply and all in a nice Suitcase plus a stand for it for 550 Dollars.
My vote for the 'build-my-own-radio'... down size the ft-991 into footprint like the ft-891. The C4FM on 10M & 6M would be nice in addition to the all-band, all-mode VHF/UHF capability already in the ft-817/nd/857d. It (991) already has the USB/sound card connectivity you would like to see. The obvious sacrifice would be the large display due to the smaller case size/footprint. Power consumption would need to be addressed as well. Thank you for the video Julian!
My field radio is still the SGC2020 with their first gen noise filter. It does a great job at getting out. Only drawback is that it does not do AM. Was a little late at buying the unit and the overpriced battery pack housing had been discontinued. Too bad they have pretty much folded in ham radio equipment and have focused on the more lucrative and highly profitable military supplier of antenna couplers. I am sure if P.G. Was alive today he would have produced a radio with all of the features you mentioned in the video. Lets hope someone listens soon or I might have to and invest in a surplus "green radio" which could be a major problem to use as a field radio here in Greece. They tend to frown upon hams using these restricted ( cough gag ) items. A long time member of HF Pack in the USA we love to use these rigs in the field. One can find plenty of the Clansmen HF packs on line, however the main issue is that there are no replacement IC's available for these units since the Plessy warehouse went up in flames years ago. Thanks for the great and informative videos. 73!
I borrowed a friend's Clansman for field day once...that was interesting (PRC-320, as I recall). Got a couple of contacts, but it just got stepped on by a lot of the big contesters. Worked it out of the back of my truck.
Thank you for uploading this video. I agree with what you are saying. I am considering the purchase of an FT-818 within the next few weeks. I'd like to have a "do everything" radio that I could take out to the parks and forest preserves to operate away from the house, and not have to take my K1 or K2 or any of the other QRP kit radios out of the house. After watching your video, I am beginning to rethink my possible purchase. I own an FT-857d, and it does everything the FT-818 does, and I already have the Collins filters and TCXO. For field use, at six Watts, I'd pretty much use the FT-818 for CW and digital work only. As you pointed out, having 10-20 Watts is more ideal for SSB and all. The big draw for me on the FT-818 is its ruggedness. I'd feel more comfortable taking it out with me than the QRP kit radios I have. Definitely food for thought.
Great question. Field radios generally have an internal battery bay, a rugged frame, and a low rx current. The 891 is nearly there, but rx current is high at 0.9a. I should mention the eight nine one is my primary radio right now. I've had an external lithium iron phosphate battery, and I'm in the process of integrating it into a Pelican case.
Roger Roger...I had a FT-450D in the truck for a while, but have since installed the FT-891 in the vehicle. It can be quickly removed for field or portable ops. I agree that the FT-891 has a phenomenal receiver...a small amount of DSP is all it takes! 73 - KM4RT.
@OH8STN have you looked into the CTX-10? I was one of the first group of people to play with it in a RTO course taught by NCScout (survival radio course, his blog is Brushbeater). It has an CW keyer, OLED display, internal Li-ion battery, internal tuner, and internal sound card. It was great, but I wish it covered VHF/UHF, otherwise it may be a good fit.
Yeah I have but its price point makes it a no-go. Also the company's TH-cam channel and documentation are really bad. I wouldn't be willing to bet my money on that radio, but if I got one here for testing, I would certainly have a go. On paper it seems pretty cool. The company marketing is pretty terrible though. Do you have one?
@@OH8STN I agree. No, I don't have one, but NCScout does they sent it to him to showcase, they could do the same for you possibly, you have a much larger audience I imagine.
I have been a ham for a long time. I've hardly ever operated on the HF bands. I operated digital modes at vhf and above. Well I've finally become interested in HF. I know you don't like the radio as an upgrade from the 817 but is it worth the trouble as a first QRP rig? I know there are much more capable QRP rigs out there but I'm trying not to spend to much money at this point. My main reason for looking at the 818 is it seems to cover more bands than many other QRP backpack radios.
Absolutely and you seem to have understood the video quite well. As a first radio certainly the eight one seven or eight one eight is a fine rig to start with. HF VHF UHF all mode. It's not perfect but it's a great starter radio. Yeah I have no problems with the radio as it is, my problem was with the update. I'm glad you asked, the question was very much appreciated. 73 Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN I now have an an ft-818 .. this just my starting point more rigs in my future I hope. Unrelated question, as a Prepper do you harden any of your gear against EMP? I just saw a documentary about it, it's truely terrifying, since we are moving back towards solar Max should we as hams start hardening some of our gear? Last solar Max the electronics we have now was not around - n8aho 😎
Congratulations on your new radio. There's a video on TH-cam showing how to modify an ammo can to be a faraday cage. I have a large Faraday case where I store critical Electronics. My ham Shack is also hardened. Otherwise nothing else.
I got my HF license in 2016, and an 817 FD as my first HF radio. It was awful. Reception was terrible. Within 6 weeks I spent the coin and bought a new Kx2. I let someone else start with my 817 Fd for SOTA. He too upgraded to a KX2, as soon as he could save up the money. Maybe save yourself one step, and just buy a KX2 from the get go?
I think you bring up valid complaints. The biggest question I have is, if Yaesu did these upgrades, what would it cost? A separate LDG tuner is a pain in the butt but still doable. The filters done right shouldn't cost a fortune. Upgraded battery pack should be easy.....USB port for CAT control....super easy.....But again....at what cost? Cheers KX4IG
Icom 7200 as an example. Mchf, rs-928, kx2, x5105. All reasonably priced. Honestly if they would actually build this radio, I would easily pay more for it.
I think you hit the nail on the head in the very last part. ‘If Yaesu had called this the 817mk3 we wouldn’t be having this conversation’ in other words the problem lies with your expectation of what the 818 was going to be, what you wanted it to be, rather than the radio itself. Your endless reference to ‘fanboys’ just comes across as angry and I guess if the radio continues to be such a disappointment the really obvious answer, especially as your not a Yaesu fan as such, is to wait a few months and plump for an Icom IC-705 which appears to have most of what you want (I’d hate to have an internal ATU, why tie yourself to the weight and bulk). Prepare yourself though, while you can easily get an 818 in the U.K. for under 500UKP the 705 will set you back nearly 1200UKP but for those looking for the extra functionality, the option is now there.
I have a 818, am setting it up as a manpack, with a soundcard for digital, I use a separate power sourse ,and don't have a real problem, it is a very versatile radio, with the right antennas, you really can't expect perfection in the field, you do what you can.
We can come very close to perfection in the field with other radios. It just comes at a higher price. Although my TX-500 and IC-705 are my go-to rigs, still haven't sold the little Yaesu. Add a filter to help the receiver and get the Elecraft T1 antenna tuner if you're not using resonant antennas. 73 Julian oh8stn
I owned a VX-1210 for a number of years. It was an interesting radio. Not super ham friendly, but usable enough. Tried it for a field day and was walked over a lot by the amplified super contesters. Overnight, though, when people went to sleep, I was able to make a few nice contacts from Arizona.
Well thought out and researched video Julian. The radio has been a disappointment to the satellite community as well. I think we were all hoping for more power. 10 watts would have been great. For our purposes two of these type of radios together is a great full duplex setup for linear/SSB sats, and of course it also works for the FM sats. It's really the only/best option for very portable full duplex sat ops on all the birds. So I can't say I'd want the size to double. But for HF operators in the field, doubling the size to something more like the 897 to get all the features you mentioned makes sense. If they could double the size, give you all the features you need on HF, and give us full duplex across VHF/UHF then I'd be psyched, that would actually make powering the setup easier. 73, John Brier KG4AKV
Yeah I was considering including a word about satellite Communications with the eight one eight. I didn't think about the dual vfo, but it's an excellent point. The I think there was a huge opportunity for Yaesu to put out an excellent rig, but they chose not to.
I'm using 2x FT817 for SAT operations too. It is a good solution for portable operation or just to operate from my garden. The thing I don't like is when using the radio with CAT to adjust the frequency for doppler the frequency isn't corrected during TX. When the SAT is around it zenit position the doppler change is the most and you have to release the PTT shortly to get the frequency adjusted by the computer. This could be most probably a simple change in the RIG firmware and know the SAT community has addressed this problem to Yaesu many times. For other I completly agree with Julian. Specially the DC connector.
Julian, thank you for your channel. I am just getting started into HAM and your channel has been incredibly helpful. Working on a budget and making intelligent choices is a must. Thank you for showing how you can start small and build up from there. I spent may years doing field operations in my profession. Hard choices have to be made when carrying heavy comms gear plus survival equipment and still needing to fill operational requirements. Your channel does just that! Hopefully, I will be working distant stations by the end of the year and you will be one of the first trans-Atlantic contacts, smart choices permitting. Again, thank you for your field operational reviews. John/KE0CSC
I like the video. I just got a Ft-891 last weekend. I like it a lot so far but I've only used it at home. I can't wait to get out in the middle of nowhere with it when the weather breaks. Hey, do you know ever happened to another TH-camr I think his name was Tony and his callsign had ARV in it I believe. He was from Florida and did a lot of QRP.
The items you list is the main reason I went with the mcHF V6 (Real version). I had a Kx2 and was disappointed with the amount of menus and things I had to do to go from digi to cw or phone. I did have a FT-891 and while I loved the RX, other issues like the chirp from usb connection as well as total lack of support from Yaesu was a big let down. Love the videos keep up the good work! 73 David N8DAH
I'm right there with you David. My eyesight isn't good enough to build the mchf myself oh, so I've been trying to find someone to build it for me. I love that rig! It is the direction modern portable radios should be headed.
@@OH8STN Check with the Yahoo group: uk.groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/M0NKA-mcHF/info A few good people that build them. I would offer to but have my hands full with my new site.
Look @ Xiegu they are doing right. For the 819: A-LiIon Battery 4-7 Ah (3S2P Config) with Built-In Charge Controller B: ATU C: USB and Bluetooth D: DSP Filtering E: Monochrome OLED Display F:Backlit Keys for Night Operation G: ManPack Case
So, I was considering this unit until I watched this video. What would you guys recommend for me? I'm looking for a HF/UHF/VHF radio that is battery powered that I can use at an off-grid (no power at all) seasonal cabin in a heavily forested area. Thanks!
Thank you for asking the question. I know Yaesu is not listening to most of the current users of the FT-817/818. There is a group that is the radio as a IF receiver for much higher frequencies. In that regard using it to work with a transverter is easy with the low power output. This is not really a field radio in these applications. The failing of the 818 has allowed a new radios to appear on the market. Some like my favorite the KX2 have most of what you are asking about. They have the higher power, antenna tuner, Li type batteries and very low receive current. This coupled with a quiet SDR arcituture you get very good performance. What is missing that I like on the FT-817 is VHF/UHF all the rest miss. I can only hope Yaesu wakes up to the growing field opps and decides to participate.
Watching this in present times, I enjoy how well fantastically this video has aged. Everything was spot on and grinded out now 2 years earlier. Before the 705, tx-500, etc, and still the ft-817/818 no longer made sense, after it's glorious and deserved reputation
I was considering a TX-500, but the war in Ukraine has made that all but an impossibility now. That radio is made in Russia. Last year, they were about $800. Now what is left in stock in the US is $1200+.
I completely agree, FT-818 is too expensive for what it is capable of. The receiver is just ridiculous, it's because of him that I didn't even consider buying it. We should immediately buy a non-cheap mechanical filter - and even it is not able to significantly improve the signal quality any way. For the same money, I took the FT-891, which has a wonderful modern receiver, does not have any optional filters, with a perfectly working DSP (NAR mode for CW with a bandwidth of 50 Hz is just crazy). Not to mention that it's a 100W radio. Elecraft understands perfectly well what operators need for QRP, I would rather take it than the hopelessly outdated FT-817/818.
I still love my IC-703+. 10w, internal ATU, very low RX current draw and very good DSP receive. I don’t understand why Icom do not offer a field radio given the popularity of SOTA, POTA etc.
Hello Julian. As you said, housing size like 2x 817 stacked or single 897 with the 891 inside, bigger display, IF DSP, Lipo Battery, CAT or BT and ATU. As option a clip on additional Battery pack and a Rugged housing were you can put in the TRX + additional battery ( like a flip down front from a flightcase) that it can survive a drop from 2m high. Because I don't think bubble wrap is an option in a emergency situation. 73 DO3FX
I agree with Julian. That's when the Marketing Dept "smart" guys (who think they are so clever) will tell you that 6W will move the crowd and they'll buy it. Same happens everywhere. This idea is not from the tech folks, nor from the users, it's from Mkt Dept.. See what the military uses for voice ? Between 20 and 50, 20W will make it if you focus on having an effective antenna. I have checked this and had lots of rigs, sure i've had fun with my 10W Elecratf, when propagation is there, 5W is enought. However often, it's more difficult to be heard in the crowed at 5W and 20W can make the difference and less frustration from both sides (the other side struggles don't forget). Choice? Xiegu G90 at 20W (has also built-in ATU), Yaesu 891 (Wolf cycle down) or some military rig as the HF90 which i own but it's not user friendly for the HAM community. Don't forget: batteries are getting better and better, with higher and higher power density and can power easily higher output rigs. Want to QRP? You can bring it down to 5W from these rigs if you fancy the fun of QRP, which is fun indeed, provided propagation is here.
I pretty much agree. They're going to have to up their game, especially with the new Chinese Elecraft-like models on the market. I would like the same form factor as the FT-81X, lithium battery, OLED display (higher res, more flexibility), lower RX current, the 891's DNR, a much more resilient power connector. I would prefer a front-panel mic connector over the extra BNC, drop VHF and UHF (HT's are so cheap now). Ship with removable protection side / carry rails ex-factory. I wouldn't bulk the radio out with an internal tuner, but would like an internal antenna analyser to help tweak a portable antenna - a standard in-field task. External tuners almost always have loads more tuning range than any internal unit, anyway.
And I forget to add, 10W would be an ideal, competitive output power. My preferred antennae for portable (where I'm going to carry the gear) are: LMR400 magnetic loop, resonant dipole or the speaker wire resonant doublet. None of which need an antenna tuner, but an antenna _analyser_ is handy for tweaking the wire antennas.
I have owned a Yaesu FT 817 since they first came out. Primarily, it is used for H.F. portable. When I went to purchase the rig, I took the opportunity to check its specifications, and above all.......the suitability for my needs. The Yaesu 817 is what it is. It has 5w r.f. output, no auto tuner, that’s no big deal. At the end of the day we are amateur radio operators, and some loose sight of that very fact. If anyone is looking to just turn on a radio and and operate with minimal input, then buy some 446 p.m.r. radios or buy an internet radio. You have to accept, that the equipment you take out in the field will have some limitations, 5w of low power and the lack of an auto a.t.u. Is not a limitation, it is a traditional challenge to true qrp radio operations. To add to this, realistically, we will at some point discover the need to extend the battery life of your portable operating. There are several ways to do this, but increasing the o/p power to 10watts isn’t going to help this. Often you will hear base stations running 100w, the “other” station will be running considerably more power, and yet, the report exchange is similar. Go out and use what you have, don’t get hung up over auto atu’s there are some very nice portable atu’s out that fit the bill. As time goes by, try and adapt to the equipment you have , and enjoy operating it. Lastly, never, ever, ever, ever take out your patch leads to use on gear at the home qth. Why? Because the next time you go out on a field trip, they won’t be in your kit pack, you will then know what disappointment is like. Take it from someone who knows hi. Safe operating everyone 73’s G4SQJ.
You are spot on. I used to be an 817 fanboy but for the last 4 years have not even considered Yaesu at all. I thought they could not screw up more after the 170 HT was sooo bad! They did. The 270 was next then System Confusion. Now this??! Are you listening Yaesu?
Great review. So, is there a product out there that gets it done as a field radio? A self contained all/most-mode radio kit really appeals to me (like what the FT818 maybe intends to be) but thanks to your video I think I'll stay away from it.
Hello from Atlanta Georgia I just bought the eight one eight it's a nice radio it's not that much of an upgrade from the 817 I had but it's a nice radio and I could buy all my lithium ion batteries at batteries America you can even get the pack for it you can get it lithium ion like 2600 milliamps or 2800 milliamps but it's a cute little radio it's got a nice receiver but I really appreciate you sharing this post thanks again my friend you work very hard in doing what you do on TH-cam bringing the darkness into the light you do a great job I subscribe to your channel thank you so much your best friend from Atlanta Georgia
is 817 ND still viable option today? im eying one for 400€€ (cheapest in my part of world), but dont want to throw away money . im brand new in ham hobby, still learning my ropes ...
For portable HF operation the FT-891 is the way to go. The main thing the FT-818 has going for it is ssb on vhf/uhf for portable linear satellite operation. A common setup is a pair of 818s combined with an arrow portable yagi for satellite operation.
Im not sure this rig is for the guy thats had one for 20 years.However the guy thats been on the fence now can have a 818 for 600 bucks you tell me fail or win.
The price is a deception. You still need to add the filter, if you want to operate for any length of time you'll need to add additional batteries or an external battery. I would definitely say it's a good first qrp radio, but it's far from the best. The flip side is it's the only radio of this size that has old bands old modes HF VHF UHF.
I bought the 818, it runs hot even on internal batteries, I think it needs a heatsink! I wish I went for the 897D but the very last ones were sold as I started looking, the 891 would have been a better choice but I wanted 6/2M and 70cm
We all feel your pain. I also wish I would have got the 897D. It would be amazing if Yaesu came out with an updated 897 with filters and display technology from the 891
Let me know my friend who makes that mounting system you have your 817 sitting on with the little handles on each side could you let me know where I can get one I really appreciate it thank you for sharing this valuable video
I've never owned the 818 I still have Andrew's one of the early 817s and I am still amazed at what they've done with it I am also disappointed in the same places that most are The power option being the biggest the display being second The filtering being third if I had bought an 818 expecting some sort of step up and received essentially the same radio I too would be disappointed and the 897 was a great radio I always figured that's what I would step up to when I outgrew the 817 sadly that never came about
Julien, yr spot on,...I have been looking to buy an FT897D just for reasons u have stated,..i feel the 81x is great radio but was just not quite what Im looking for, as for the 991a its a great radio, but i would not consider it as rugged as the 897, so again, not a replacement. In the end Im about to purchase an 891 as an alternative. Did not consider the 857, still looking to get an 897D for reasonable price. Im still a Yaesu Fan, A92GW, cheers n 73s Julien, thanks again, for your candid reviews
Thanks Thomas. I'm also still a Yaesu fan, but felt we needed to use this platform to push them in the right direction. If I could get an 897 in good condition, I would snatch it up in a heart beat. My skills in regards to lithium iron phosphate cells have progressed enough, I could easily replace the nickel metal hydride batteries in the 897, with lithium iron phosphate cells, bms and charge controller. The 891 is very good rig, with an excellent receiver. Current draw is higher than I would like, but size, receiver, output are perfect for a field station. Thanks for the comments and the kindness. It's very much appreciated. 73 Julian oh8stn
Not an HF operator yet but if I could "redesign the 817-818 I'd make it an all mode VHF/UHF radio without an internal battery pack. I'd also keep the price in under the $500 mark. I know I'm probably the only person that this would appeal to but I love the idea of a small packable all mode radio for Techs to mess around with 2M SSB for SOTA activations and other field ops.
Spot on with the analysis Julian. One reason I'm going with a 2nd hand Icom IC-706MkiiG as my portable shack in a box and /P contest station. It may be power hungry but it's small enough for my backpack and has the correct ports on the back for accessories and power.
Most of the time I work in the field due to high levels of QRM in my QTH, and had some hands-on experience with the KX3 and KX2 (they are great ). And I know that there are some cool new low-priced Chinese rigs out there which you can buy for around $500 (excl vat, custom taxes etc). But they all lag one thing : VHF/UHF. The "upgrade" to the FT818 is marginal, because it wasn''t attended as a major upgrade for features but replacement due to end-of-life parts. The TCXO-9 is a nice extra when you use slow digital modes. And yes they should have named it FT817NE of FT817ND-MK2. But owning my second FT817(ND) I will replace it with the FT818 when my FT817ND dies on me. All because I use VHF/UHF SSB, CW and digital modes in the field on sat, portable experiments, etc. and for that there is no substitute at the price of a new FT818. 73 de Lex PH2LB P.s. And yes I want to buy and build the QRP-Labs QSX. Not because I need it but because I want to build it and support Hans Summers .
The FT-818 is totally ok, i own one and i really like it. The only mistake Yaesu made ist the name of the radio. It should be FT-817NE or some thing like that, because FT-818 suggests a new radio, which it isn't. I'm shure thats a decision from the today's marketing guys, which don't have the right feeling about marketing for technical guys's like Ham operators.
Agreed. I believe that's almost the last thing I said in the video. We wouldn't have this conversation if they called it Yaesu ft-817 Mark 3, November Echo, ... Thanks for the polite comment. 73 Julian oh8stn
I'm happy with my original FT817 ... great field radio, fun to use. As a CW op, I find the menu system a bit of hassle. Why oh why did Yaesu stick the F button between the main tuning dial and the display? Those of us with normal fingers (not pointy lady-fingers) inevitably touch the dial when making a simple menu change. The filter "issue" really isn't for most hams. We usually have one mode we prefer, and for me the Collins CW filter works great, and I don't use USB. I also have the TXCO-9 in mine As to connectors, internal tuners and such, well, there's only so much real estate available in that small form factor ... and to change these feature wouldn't be an update, it would be a redesign.. That crummy DC connector can be rectified with a PowerPole adapter. The battery life is awful, and the charging time is, too. But I keep the internal battery charged, and usually use an external 12V 7AH AGM battery. I'm not a fanboy, and I'm not a nit-picker. This little radio does everything Yaesu told me it would do. If this rig dies, I'll be looking to get an 818. As in many things, to each his own.
I have both the 817 and the 891. Despite the fact that the 891 lacks 2 meters and 70cm, it is a better rig. The if dsp filters the speech processor, and even the price. It is actually less money that the 817/818 and there are no filters to buy. The 817 without some speech processing is very hard to work with. The 891 can be dialed down to qrp levels and has much punchier audio. I like my 817 but if it ever takes a dump on me I will likely not fix or replace it.
I believe if you own a 817nd they is no point upgrading...if you don't own one,.it's still a good QRP radio for it's money. I believe Yaesu didn't want to twinkle too much with it's iconic design but I do think they could of gave us a little extra and may be raised the price a little.
I agree with much of what you say. I left my comments about this rig under a different video, until I saw the link to this interesting video. The FT817 was the first rig I ever purchased. At the time I was a new ham and had no idea what to buy. Turns out it was a great choice. It's still one of my favourite rigs. Over the years I have taken it on business trips to France (where I took it up a mountain near Grenoble, but only had one QSO) and Italy/Sicily (from where I had my first 6m DX QSO). I was really looking forward to see how Yaesu would follow up this iconic rig. The FT817ND was of no interest, then finally the FT818 was to me a massive disappointment. As you say 6W - REALLY! Are you serious! As I have already posted it appeared that Yaesu was just being lazy. They didn't even have to re-tool the casing (hence the reason for no power input change). In the meantime Icon have left Yaesu in the dust with their innovations (e.g. SDR, 70MHz) and now the IC-705. I really wanted a rig with the same form factor and size (more or less). I don't care about ATU. I would have liked 10W from a new LiPo internal battery. I would also have liked a new TFT colour display with bandscope. I wanted 70MHz too. It didn't even have to be SDR. BTW I like your idea for the features of a replacement rig, and 20W would be very nice, but would like to keep the size as small as possible. You can do a lot with low power. The 5W of the FT817 has got me all across Europe on 6m and once on 17m I even worked Japan (all /P). 20W would be gentle on SLA batteries (for example) but still give that extra power when needed. Let's all hope that Yaesu have seen what Icom have done and have woken up and are developing a proper successor to the FT817! BTW I tried to use a IC-7000 /P running off a medium sized SLA (as a successor to my FT817), but this rig is just not happy with anything less than 13V (even at lower power) and will shut down very quickly. This rig was not perfect, but had great features, including bandscope and excellent noise suppression. Perhaps I will try it again having made one of your LiFePo battery packs? Also this rig is quite fragile. I blew the pre-driver twice, doing nothing unusual at the time. M1GRY
I agree with your analysis. I am still happy with my FT-817 (original) that has been working 100% for 20 years. I have upgraded the CW filter, and put a LiON pack in it. It blows me away that Yaesu is still using NiMH batteries in these radios. I would agree if you were out shopping for a new radio to steer clear, but if you already have one -- you still have a very capable and reliable radio. Much more reliable than the Chinese radios.
I'm sharing this Channel with everyone in the amateur community in Douglasville Georgia in Atlanta Georgia thanks once again my friend we love you here in Atlanta Georgia
I bought the 817nd used, two years later I bought a brand new 891 for about the same price. I like the 817 so I won't get rid of it, however the cost of the 818 and that it doesn't do anything different, vs something like the 891, I can't figure that one out. Maybe Yaesu wants to make it bad enough that they have a reason to discontinue it.
Those are really valid points Mark. I'm kind of wondering why if they can build a radio like the 891, would they not make a portable version based on the same technology. Looks like Yaesus right hand doesn't know what Yaesus left hand is doing.
@@OH8STN What I thought the 818 would have been before it was released is an elecraft competitor. I don't have one of those, I have a couple of friends that do, and other than the cost, I like those. I like yaesu radios as well. Unfortunately I don't know think they will.
This is a great point about the kx2 and kx3. The receivers in those radios are incredible. But the lack of ruggedness, is completely by Design. These are gentlemans radios. They were never designed to be dragged through the mud. Great comments John thank you. 👍
@@johnzarubajr actually that's not a bad thing 😊 I like the idea of ham radio not having to be so excessive, or complicated. Elecraft does an excellent job with this point on the kx2 and kx3.
just got an 818 because i sold a NIB 817 that was never used... there is still no radio on the market that equals the 818... i also have a KX2, which is a terrible radio (bad design, too fragile, battery has to be removed to be charged, lousy AM reception, confusing as heck to use or learn), along with an SGC SG-2020, Icom IC-703, Xiegu X5105, G1M, and G90... of all my QRP radios, the 818 is the only one that does it all, and if i want to make contacts in these lousy band conditions, i'll go with my G90 or 2020...
Overpriced and not an upgrade. The FT-817 or FT-818 should be a $350.00 radio. I got mine on craigslist listed as a cb radio for $50.00, a very good deal. It didn't come with a microphone and was untested. I also have the FT-897 and one day I may get it back from the repair shop. (It was another great deal)
I completely agree with your analysis btw and find the prices on even used 817;to defy logic considering capabilities of radio vs some things on horizon. I haven't had opportunity to test the Xiegu's but looks like that could be way to go if have reliablity as they seem to be more willing listen and adapt to needs of customer base. hopefully the big 3 will follow suit due to competition.
I bought my 818 for $599. I did not own an 817ND, and had no choice but to buy an 818. I think there is value in an HF QRP rig at that price. Yaesu never claimed that the 818 was their next QRP/Field offering, they billed it as an upgrade to the 817ND. If the 817 crowd was expecting a full redesign, I think that would come with a much higher price tag, and it's certainly not what Yaesu advertised prior to the release. I agree with your evaluation, but to have expected more than a few simple updates from a radio at the same price point seems like an unreasonable expectation.
I agree with most of this. But not all. I would not replace my FT817 (I still use the Mk1) with an FT818. I do not feel that the improvements would be worth the money for such an upgrade. It is important that I am only a casual field operator (SOTA, WFF, IOTA) , but I do quite a lot of holiday style DXpeditions etc. 1) First off, the FT819 should definitely not be double size and weight... The popularity of the FT817 series is partly because of its size. I have kept my FT817 only because it is a very small radio, which I often use while in motion, hanging it from my neck or shoulder. I do not have a HT, the FT817 does the job for me. When I started ham radio in the early 1980s, the FT290R was a game changing radio. The FT817, in my eyes, is the direct successor, with HF and UHF added. I would not have bought the 817 if it was not like this. 2) Display. Being a contester and DXpeditioner, I believe that Yaesu usually fails on ergonomy, ie not employing a UX designer with some contesting/DXing experience. Having to rotate through different menus to be able to set the CW keyer speed, power , or the filters, etc is just ridiculous. It is not much bettter on the FT891 either, and I cannot fathom why in the age of colour touchscreens Yaesu can not equip the radio with a touch panel and user-configurable and programmable soft buttons as well as physical buttons and knobs.... 3) USB connection for CAT and audio. Or even bluetooth. Especially in portable use, a single USB/bluetooth/WLAN port could save you from carrying interfaces, cables, etc. As for the FT897 that you mention. Well, honestly, that was the worst transceiver in my arsenal, even though I kept it long (about 15 years) because I liked the size and all. But unfortunately it was a total design disaster, and not for the size. I just realised that I was rather taking my big desktop transceiver to DXlocations paying for excess luggage and hand carrying it onto one-man island trips, just because of the handling ergonomy of the 897... I finally replaced it with a FT991 and that radio I consider to be a direct inheritor of the FT897 (similar size and weight) , but with a much-much-much better design in every respect. The only thing I miss from the 991 is the optional power supply like the FP30 or internal battery pack, that could be fitted in the belly of the FT897. The user interface is still a mess, but not even comparable to the FT897.
Yep, this is a discussion, so there are no right or wrong opinions. Btw, the ft-817 and ft-897 had exactly the same menu structure. In fact, they are nearly identical radios, built on the same technology. The 857 and 897 are identical.
Great video Julain!!! I personally think you have done more testing of alternative power options than Yaesu ever has. Okay, perhaps that's a silly statement. But, you make some very good points and have the research to back up your comments. They are not listening, and with the SDR wave of radios hitting, they are going to loose their market if they keep this crap up. Especially with the QSX on the horizon. Granted we have to build it, and it would take some work to get all the bits needed for pure mobile (if you want speakers n such) but the feature set built in (price, filtering, size, digi modes...) should make any low power radio manufacturer at least a little worried.
Yeah when the 5 105 came out I realized the Chinese were putting some effort into the radios. The only things I don't like about the 5105 is no internal sound card, and the add on port to connect computer for data modes. On the flip side, as an SSB or CW rig, it's hard not to consider it.
@@OH8STN I do like it. I have the ce-19 which allows for cat control but it seems a little wonky. The wolphilink doesn't allow for cat control but it's simple and compact. I have an 817nd and still love it. Was very disappointed with the 818 and thus purchased the x5105. 73 de KF7VUT
As a newer operator to HF, this is really insightful. Thank you for making this review. It give me a lot to think about.
I bought my 817 right after the 818 came out as it was $100 cheaper at the time. I am not a "fan boy" but I do like my 817. If I want to blast out I use my 100 Watt radio. If I am just looking for a quick setup and fun I go with the 817. Question: Does the 891 feature VHF/UHF? No. For a learning radio the 817 is ok. Do I recommend it as a first radio? Yes, because it is an all mode 70cm - 160M radio. I know I will probably get hate replies but to each their own. Question: How many of the marketing department actually are licensed and operate these radios? I went to a Motorcycle shop once and offered to help push all of the motorcycles that were waiting to be repaired in at the end of the day. "Those are the employees motorcycles. If you work here you have to own and ride a motorcycle." Same thing for Ham Radio???
This just goes to show how each of us have our own opinions on different things and that is a great thing to have. I came very recently into the hobby (3 yrs) and like many, on a limited budget. As an M6 I soon discovered that field operations was the way forward for me and that is what I have slowly built my kit around. An 817ND, 4500mah lipo RC batteries, solar charger and my own little collection of homebrew resonant antennas so no tuner required. I would agree with two of the issues with the newer 818 that I can relate to and that is..... a much better internal battery and an increased TX to 10w. The rest I have no worries about and happily make contacts far and wide on my stock 817 without the need for filters or other mods. I absolutely understand that as an M6 with very little experience my opinion is restricted to what I know, but I just love getting out with my backpack on, up a hill with my little 817 and get on with it.
See my own posting. The FT817 is a GREAT rig. I love it. The FT818 is essentially just a FT817 with very minor tweaks. I bought my FT817 back in 2001 (apparently when it was released), so this tells me that this rig design is nearly 20 years old. It is a complement to the original design and specification that it has sold so well and no doubt continues to do so (in the guise of the FT818).
I think the point of the video is that given the age of the FT817, the FT818 (as a successor) is a massive disappointment. With changes in technology and batteries over this 20 year lifetime, the FT818 could have been so much more. Given the right improvements, as a FT817 owner, I would have jumped at the chance to buy the successor to this iconic rig, but I am now going to buy an IC-705 when it becomes available. That's one less sale to Yaesu. Yaesu management need to wake up and "smell the coffee". I could be completely wrong, but I am guessing sales-wise right now that they are being completely spanked by Icom.
M1GRY
Yes you've understood the video correctly. The point is not to knock the ft-817 or the original design. The goal was simply to point out how the 818 failed to provide 21st century modernization, for the 817nd.
It's a shame really.
73
Julian oh8stn
If you don’t already have an FT-817ND I think the 818 is still a good buy.With the current sale prices ($599) I can’t find anything with the same capabilities and band coverage including VHF/UHF at that price. I don’t own a QRP rig yet but I’m tempted to pick up an 818 to add portable QRP capabilities.
This certainly is true if you just want to operate Voice or CW. If you want to operate for, ft8, js8, psk31, ... the 818 becomes less attractive.
@@OH8STN Why?
Because you need to add an external audio interface and often cat control. The cables in the back of the radio going to the audio and cat control interfaces create a wire mess. The radio becomes larger and heavier than it needs to be with all the accessories required to do anything "extra". It's not like Yaesu doesn't have the technology in-house. They've implemented these features in the 991a. I've been a Yaesu guy for the last 20 years. They have slowly moved away from Innovative portable Communications, to desktop contesting. They have even sold off their Vertex Standard Branch to Motorola. That's where all of the portable know how came from.
@@OH8STN Yeah I'm not sure I'd be as excited about the 818 if I was into digital modes. I like things simple and as clean as possible and the wire mess would not be cool. That being said I do own and use a completely stock 818 as my primary rig for a base and portable station (mostly SSB and some AM) and I totally enjoy it for my purposes. The only add-on I may consider is an SSB filter but so far it hasn't been necessary. Luckily there's more choices for our niche of a hobby than there ever has been.
I was really disappointing with the FT-818 as well, but even with the short comings of the FT-817 and FT-818 I still consider them a top pick for an "All Band", highly portable and rugged radio. Right now you can get a new FT-818 for $600 US. That is a lot of radio for that price. Yaesu could be dominating the market if they just paid a little more attention to what people want.
Excellent review as someone who gave up on Armature radio years ago now is getting interested in FT8 looking for a mobile digital rig for my jeep.
Just purchased a FT-818. Glad I did and this video is a hoot. Yes if you had a 817 the 818 probably was not worth the cost to "upgrade". But I sure am glad the Yaesu kept this great little rig in production and made incremental improvements. Not a fanboy, pretty much an Icom owner for everything else (including a 703 for most of my QRP work). But this is still a great rig for what it was designed to do: portable QRP with all band/mode coverage.
I haven't sold mine, but when you put it next to a 705 and of course I know the cost of the 705 is much higher. But when you compare it to what's available today, you begin to see the problems. For example being only able to add one filter which are extremely difficult to find. Anyway I guess the bottom line is it's not a bad radio, it just isn't what many of us expected from Yaesu.
I owned the 857, the 897, and now I have the 891 for portable operation. I need more than 10/20 watts. I almost exlusively operate on PSK31. But I see your point. Even the 891 is too heavy and draws lots of current. Almost 2A on RX. But I don't think the IC-705 will be the silver bullet for off grid radio. I even started designing my own radio to address the issues. I wold need at least 50 Watts with a tuner., isolated audio interface, IF dsp (this is where my engineering ability is weak), and CAT control. For now, I follow your magnificent tutorials, and I integrate my computer, display, and other stuff in one unit. Thanks for sharing all your ideas! 73s de HA5OGL
Well I don't think it's a fail. I'm happy with mine. I have 4 FT817s and the 818 and I've been more than satisfied with all of them. After watching this video I ordered another 818. I'm glad they didn't change it. And after it comes in I might just buy a third one. K4JTP
Perhaps one should not forget, that the price of the Yaesu FT-818 is only half of the ICOM 705?
I’m a complete newbie. No anchoring biases yet. After a lot of research and reflection I realised that small size, low weight, and LACK OF fancy features are actually most important to me. I need to grow INTO a radio before I can grow OUT of a radio. Yaesu would do well to make an updated robust field radio. No doubt about that. I just bought a brand new FT-818ND. For now it’s a unit that I’m more likely to haul outside than many of its larger, or more delicate, or more expensive, competitors. Assuming I get into this new hobby and stick with it I can probably sell it gently used to a fanboy for what may be a zero or a couple hundred dollar usage and education fee. I paid $645 for it. It’s going to be a tax deduction though. Let’s see how I feel about it a year or two down the track.
It's a good approach and I like it.. The thing that gets you with the 818, is all the add on's one must buy. Enjoy it though. I enjoyed mine for over 20 years.
@@OH8STN Yes the add ons gave me pause. I’m going to try to push it as far as I can without going nuts on upgrades. The power post might be the first add though. If I stick to resonant antennas the tuner won’t be an issue. Might spring for a spare or upgraded battery. I’m planning a FT5D acquisition to handle all the digital stuff to begin with. In a year or two iCom will likely have an upgraded IC-7300 more on par with an FTDX10 so I’m holding off on a base rig for now. I’m also into photography… the best camera is always the one you take with you/have at hand. I’m thinking the same might apply here a bit with radios. Antenna choice is key here… any suggestions for outdoor portable/POTA/SOTA/IOTA type use case? Multi band capable preferred…
@@bradl2636 take a look at this video for your antenna strategy th-cam.com/video/OEpFwZhSdMo/w-d-xo.html
@@OH8STN Thank you sir..!
Love your channel content! I’m a brand new ham and will be attending the Huntsville Alabama ham fest starting tomorrow looking for my first field radio. Thank you again for all the content that you provide us with.73
Welcome to the community.
73
Julian oh8stn
I think you nailed it on all points. I was also expecting a much more improved radio than the FT-817 MK3. I still love my FT-817ND, but I'm also very interested in the announced new Icom IC-705 and how well it performs!
What you think of the 705
Totally thought the same thing when the FT-818 came out - thought it a complete insult. Wow... Years ago I had already sold the FT-817 for an ICOM IC-703+ wow, what a great radio complete with LC-156 backpack and AH-703 5-band whip. Works great for FT-8 portable with Signalink USB. I was waiting for Yaesu to come out with a REAL replacement for the FT-817 but didn't wait long after the IC-705 came out. Kept the IC-703+ setup and ADDED the IC-705 with LC-192 backpack. Wow...the IC-705...nice nice job Icom!
Still lots of people don't understand the FT-818 slap in the face. Only one filter and it is made of unobtainium. No internal audio interface, no DSP, no real battery life. Yaesu broke my heart!
73
Julian oh8stn
Julian, all good points. New ham here, and still haven’t settled on a radio, as I’m doing my homework with videos like this before I commit to a serious buy. That being said, I am waiting for the QRP-Labs QSX to come out. I know its a kit, but it offers a ton of features out the door at what is supposed to be a very reasonable price. I also have given up, for a lack of better words, on small QRP rigs like this, and have looked at other rigs like the FT-857D, and the FT-991A. The one thing that bothers me about Yaesu’s product line is that they seem to be out of focus, or like you say, not listening to the customer. Sure, they have interesting gear, but IMHO too many radios to choose from, and not enough features in any one radio to make it a complete buy. I might find a standard mil-spec hand held on their site, but it lacks a few features that one of their newer line of hand helds have. I get it, its all about marketing, but their sales will die a slow death if they don’t start listening to the customer’s needs. Thank you for enlightening me on this gear, and all of your expertise and input. I find it very helpful. 73 -KD9MED
Hi Michael. We are all waiting for the qsx. It seems to be made of unobtainium, but we are crossing our fingers.
I own the FT-817 and FT-818. Both rigs are great for my needs.
Of course when we look at them subjectively. When given the chance to try something with a better receiver, better battery life, additional output power the 81x (objectively) begins to show its age.
@@OH8STN it was sold as a qrp radio. Why would you want more power? thats the whole point of it. the battery pack is intende as a stop gap if you need power quickly. When you are trying to use this radio outside of its intended use then it will obviously fall below expectations. if you want more power buy as radio not intended for qrp. So your arguments are pointless. As a qrp radio it stands up well.
@maenhir8938 Nonsense! Indeed, I wanted a QRP radio. The problem was this radio could only be run at ~2.5 - 3 watts (not 5w) while operating PSK, RTTY, Winlink, ... This is a well-known 817/818 problem. Moreover, that was just one of many antiquated issues with this formally ironic radio. Yaesu gave it a face lift, trying to sell it to us as an 817MK3. The Icom IC-705 showed us what the FT-818 could have been.
@@OH8STN no not nonsense, so no need to be rude. Why buy a low power radio and then complain about the low power. That makes no sense whatsoever. also you are comparing a modern sdr icom radio against a 10 year old design, again this makes no sense. What did icom have out at the time of the release of the 818 that compared to it? absolutely nothing. also the reviews of the 705 are not that good, poor documentation that doesn't even tell you how to set half of the options, nothing to adjust viewing angle, fragile plastic jacks, dodgy touchscreen, hard access to sd card slot, obsolete usb socket, obsolete mic connector, not even a small antenna for quick use, even the bluetooth has problems connecting to most things. so please if yo uare going to compare 2 radios at least give the failings of the other radio, which are many more than the yaesu, which the only problem most people have really is the battery.
For the ham looking at an FT818, I would suggest rather getting the FT-891. For the same or less money, they will get the ability to go to 100 watts if condx are bad, they get a nice BIG display, and tons of more features. The 817 was ground breaking when it came out...but 20 years have passed since then. It is obviously still selling very well, so Yaesu are just letting it continue as is. I think a built in ATU is more needed than built-in batteries. I prefer to use an external battery pack - the internal batteries will never last long when transmitting a lot. Rather use the battery space for an ATU.
Good point John: batteries are more and more effective and have more and more power for the same weight (density).
So indeed, whilst portable, an ATU is way more useful if built in than the 817 / 818 battery which is too small by the way.
You are the second person I have come across to mention the FT-891 as an alternative. As much as I would like a "do everything" radio for field use, I want something based on newer technology and not a 20 y/o design. Low power consumption would be helpful for a field/QRP radio, but I can easily get a larger battery or switching power supply (a lot of park/forest preserve picnic shelters have electrical outlets in my area). Definitely, something to think about.
@@daviddietrich9449 what did you go for
@@lastseenoutdoors I got the 891. I'm very happy that I did all my research. 🙂
@@daviddietrich9449 only thing I like to do SOTA and 818 seems suited for this activity
Thanks for making this video! I was debating on getting the FT-818, but after watching this I will just stick with my FT-891! Keep up the great work!!
First of all, I'm asking these questions because you have great videos and I respect your opinion on the subject. I'm in the same position as some others as a first time QRP buyer. I did not previously own a 817 and was looking for my first QRP rig at a reasonable price. I got my FT-818 new for $575. Since you call it a complete fail, ridiculous, and a waste of time, I thought I made a poor choice in radio. But it seems like you just don't think its a big upgrade from the 817nd (i agree). But if the 817 is a great radio (for what it is intended to be) and the 818 is basically the same thing, wouldn't it fall into the same category as a great QRP rig? I'm asking for clarity, not to argue. Is your dissatisfaction because its not a great upgrade from the 817nd or is it a terrible failure of a radio in general like you seem to suggest?
Also, why is it a poor choice for doing ft8, js8, psk31? I was looking forward to exploring these modes QRP. Is it just the power output limitations?
Thank you for the videos and all the great content you put out.
despite of all the glorious reviews about Chinese radios I myself got me ft818 this October. I simply don't trust anything as I trust Japan. you made a right choice. you just can't go wrong with such legendary unit.
enjoy.
Icom IC-705 is from Japan. Lab599 Discovery tx500 from Russia. Elecraft KXx from USA, mcHF from UK. all light years ahead of the FT-818. All of them include IF filters which Yaesu makes you buy. All include DSP, notch filters, ... which the FT-818 doesn't have. Even the Xiegu G90 and X5105 have these features built in. Your (fanboy based) argument is suggesting buying an inferior radio, simply because it comes from Japan. Don't buy a Chinese radio then, there are also alternatives from other countries. Sounds like you're not trying to convince us but, convincing yourself up your bad decision to buy an 818.
@@OH8STN I agree with you that there are many other, and potentially better radios available, but just keep in mind the price difference with a radio of the same quality and features (144/430 bands, sold as a premade unit with reliable warranty) like the ICOM IC-705. While the Icom radio is arguably better, in my country it costs over double the price of a FT-818!!! You could get a decent portable radio like the FT-818 and a base station radio like the FT-450D, all for the price of an ICOM IC-705!! I think that you probably should not upgrade to it from a 817ND, but if you are interested to buy it as your first (or as a supplementary) QRP Radio, it should absolutely suit your needs.
I don't disagree. Think about this though. If you add the signalink USB, add the sotabeams speech compressor, add the mechanical filter, AG the cat control adapter, at the DSP (optional), then we can see the actual cost of the ft-818. All of those features are already built in to almost every other qrp radio sold today. The IC 705 is an excellent example because everything is already built inside. The ft-818 if you want to do portable data modes, you have an awful lot of stuff taxed to the outside of the radio. You also have an awful lot of cable mess. I would agree with your statement if your only operating CW or SSB, without filters.
@@OH8STNWell I guess it depends on the operator's needs ands mostly if someone can afford to pay that amount of money at once. If you can afford the ICOM, buy it and you won't be disappointed. But if you want a more affordable option, you can buy the yaesu and buy the upgrades as you need them. (for example maybe you don't find the speech compressor necessary, or a signalink interface)
Would agree with all parts on the FT-818 down falls. I used a FT817ND for 7 years and added the windcamp internal battery, then added a DY-8x7 2.0 compressor and then added another windcamp battery for backup. This setup was used for both SOTA & WWFF activations, it did very well.
My upgrade path was when looking at everything that I do I choose the KX3. I was lucky enough to pick one up a 2nd hand for a very good price ($1500 AUST) with all extras except 2m module and came all packed in a pelican case all ready to go, this was a no brainer for me to buy and sell the FT-817ND.
Cheers Adam VK2YK
This is a good topic. I recently bought a xiegu x5105.The radio had everything I was looking for. Easy to read display. Long lasting internal battery. Built in antenna tunner and the list goes on. BUT the Xiegu failed in less than a month with indoor use. I will get a replacement radio and see if I just got a lemon. For some reason the external power jack on the radio opened up and it would not charge or accept external power. If quality controll etc was better with the newer Chinese rigs they would dominate the market. They seem to know what people want.They just need to deliver a product that is dependable. The Yaesu per price point is the next inline. And yes it is missing the mark on what it could have been. But it is a time tested radio that is much more dependable than the Chinese compititon. The first thing you need in a field radio is something you can trust to work when you climb that mountain top. I see great promise in the new russian radio. The others like the new icom are just to pricey to bring out in the field. KB9MVW
New ham here - quite glad I have just bought a second hand 897D! Thanks for the video!
FT-897 was epic. You're definitely lucky to get one. I have no idea why Yaesu discontinued it. It was a solid radio 👍
I agree . I looked at it at Hamcation and couldn't really see any real upgrade over the 817ND besides marketing. Thanks for sharing !
Thanks for commenting. That's the conclusion I came up with as well. I've had the oven in my radio, since before the 818 when he came out. I don't know man, it might be time to start looking for commercial r8gs like Codan for example.
it wasn't really meant to be an upgrade. Yaesu has stated that components used in the PA section of the 817ND were becoming scarce, so they had to redo the PA a bit, which required FCC approval again, hence the barely new model number of 818.
@@TheDillio187 Exactly...!
That being said, it's still a very dated radio design and is screaming for an update! A Yaesu 871, a smaller 10W version of the 891 with 2M and 70cm would be amazing.
As a new ham and my only rig is the Yaesu FT-818 is there a video you recommend on how to use it? I would go to a local club but being stationed overseas there is a huge language barrier. Any help would be great. Thank you KD9VUL
Julian, Thanks for the write up and agree with everything you said. I have several QRP radios here, Icom 703, 817, KX2,KX3 etc. However I just got the FT-891 and am very happy, even though no inbuilt ATU. Bought it mainly for digital modes with the SCU-17 interface and also my SCS Pactor modems operating portable/mobile.
Jack VK4JRC
Long-time 897 field user, always thought about picking up an 817/818 mainly due to size. But this video is dead on. Probably enough room inside an 897 for all the mods you discussed, but it's still a big unit. Imagine a mini QRP 991a: Oh wait, that would be the IC-705... Yaesu is easily capable of making a killer field radio, it's time for them to get off the couch and actually do it.
Which is exactly why I sold off my ‘817ND and grabbed an IC-705. Even adding the AH-705 ATU I still have a better rig. With one hose for digi modes DStar too. Deff a win.
The 897 is big and heavy, inefficient to be carried in a backpack, but it's true that you can fit so many things in its battery compartment. I installed the guts of an ldg yt-100 antenna tuner inside and even had room to add a small LiPo battery. It is a fun radio to mod, and it looks incrasingly rugged as they introduce flashier models. But it may also be that I'm growing old... 73 de Diego EC1CW
I agree. My QRP rigs include FT-817ND, Elecraft KX3, Icom-703 Plus, and mcHF SDR. My choice when I want to take a QRP rig to the field ? Without hesitation I take my IC-703 Plus - 1) it has an excellent ATU built in, and when you're in the field using odd antennas, an ATU is a must. 2) It offers up to 10 watts output for marginal conditions 3) It has a lovely big display which is a joy to use. My KX3 UI is simply too complicated - 3 functions on each button, steep learning curve. mcHF is a fantastic SDR radio but lacks an ATU, but a big plus is it includes a built-in USB sound card, making digital so simple, just a single cable to the laptop. I am just disappointed that Icom did not refresh their QRP line. All the IC-703 Plus lacks is a USB port with built-in sound card. Otherwise it's pretty much perfect
Outstanding comments John wow. 👍👍👍
I basically like the features of the kx series they just need more sealing and waterproofing . Too many openings for s field radio.
Agreed
I agree completely. I just picked up an 891. Looking to kit that out now. Thanks for all the great videos!
Are you happy with it thus far? I’m so tempted to pick one up. HRO has a great deal on them right now...it seems like the perfect time to buy one.
I don't know about Josh, but at least I'm happy with mine. I've had it for a year and it's been Rock Solid. There's a couple of silly things with the menus, but definitely the menus are better than the eighth one seven and 857
891 is not even in the same category as 857 or 818 imho,I have all three and would wholeheartedly recommend the 891 without delay! You will not be displeased. The dnr is just outstanding!
@@OH8STN Use Win4 Yaesu and you don't need to use the menus.
Windows certainly solves some problems, but creates a heck of lot more
I've owned an 817nd for years and I'm happy with it, I have the sota beams speech compressor for me who's had this radio for a long time it was a cheap upgrade and has made a good improvement to the 817's performance I think there is a lithium iron phosphate battery that can fit in the battery compartment of the radio, I think if like me you already own an 817 if yaesu did an upgrade kit 10watt final and a speech compressor microphone I'd buy them, cheers for the video Adam G7CRQ
Thank you for your evidenced based comments. I am struggling to determine which radio to purchase for satellite. This radio has full split duplex. I will continue to investigate.
Hold on there a minute John. The ft-817 and ft-818 are good radios for transponders. Many operators are using two of them in parallel to get full duplex from the satellites. This review was based on the ft-818 as an HF rig. There certainly are other specialized operating modes satellites for example, are these radios are totally acceptable.
I only have one HF rig and that is my FT817ND - used with fldigi, is does everything for me. I have yet to take out in the field, but will do so at some point.
What about the FT-991a? Yes - bigger, heavier, more power hungry, but it does check all of the other boxes?
Unfortunately it's not a field radio Troy. It's okay if I'm sitting it on my desk at home, but it was never designed to be deployed in the field.
So we need a 991a in the 891 form factor that uses 1/10 the power
I’ve been taking my FT991A to camping. Am I not suppose to do that?
No way a touch screen radio would work out well in the field.
@Radio Operator Portable My definition of portable and yours are completely different. I bet the touch screen works real well in the cold.
You nailed it Julian... I have the 817ND and the 857D. While the 891 has a better receive capability, for me a field radio needs VHF/UHF (if for no other reason that to be a backup to the HT). I had hoped the 818 would be a significant improvement but it was an immediate disappointment for all the reasons you hit on. Off of your list, I would have even forgiven omitting the tuner function since I've recently paired my 817ND with a MFJ-971 manual tuner (no additional power consumption unless you want /need to light the swr for the price of 6uA).
Hopefully the next unit in the series will be a quantum leap.
I'm not fussed about the missing 2m/70cm on the 891; it's an excellent radio and I'm not convinced those bands are critical in a field radio.
I would love to hear your thoughts on the FT-891. No internal battery option but it can be turned down to QRP levels or up for QRO.
Only "problem" with the 891 is RX current draw. Otherwise Excellent radio.
73
Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN true. I also have a GX90 but I'm looking for a smaller, better. and more rugged QRP SSB transceiver for SOTA/POTA
I use the 891 in the field and its been great, but now I've been looking at a qro radio, mainly the 705. Between the size of the 892 and the amount of battery I need, takes up a lot more space. I'm using what I have, but now see the advantages of smaller when lugginf up a hill. I can use the space for water.
I agree with you about the battery. I totally disagree with you about the internal antenna tuner. That would make the unit so much bigger, and not every body wants one anyway. Internal tuners will only tune within a small SWR range. My LDG's all tune with the SWR of 9:1. An internal will only do about 3:1. Basically worthless imho.
Also, the FT-818 was not built because they wanted to improve the radio. They replaced the 817 with the 818 because their parts supply they needed in order to build it, ran out. They had to build the 818 as a direct replacement out of necessity, not cuz they thought the extra watt was going to make a difference, or any other reason. That's my understanding of it, and I'm willing to be corrected if anyone else has anything to add.
I really wish they would update it to SDR
Well I look at the antenna tuner from the kx2 and Kx3. That's doing a pretty good job in a very small package. I think where we completely agree is wishing it was an SDR rig. I guess I wonder how Yaesu could build the ft-891 but still thinking the ft-818 is comparable to other more modern HF radios.
They think we’re all fan boys and will pay anything. Here we are on Black Friday and the Yaesu inventory has price reductions EXCEPT the FT-818. Your complaints/points are valid.
If you're okay with doubling the size (and weight?) then wouldn't you just want a successor to the FT-857? For QRP, I'm looking for durable all-mode portability, so I'd prefer the next version of the 818 to be smaller and lighter and ideally have more weatherproofing for backpacking, but maintain the current price point.
Agreed! Unfortunately there is no indication we will ever get that radio from Yaesu. Yaesu is firmly behind the curve with QRP & portable rigs. They discontinued the ft-897, killed off the ft-857 and didn't really offer any significant update to the ft-817/818. While their focus has been on contest radios, Icom IC-705 moved the bar light years ahead of the Yaesu FT-818. I was hopeful for so many years but finally stopped holding my breath.
I greatly appreciate your videos and honesty as well. I just recently picked up an FT-897 to add to arsenal for impending move to AK as felt was a more realistic field use radio and better way to approach Survival/multi role man portable comms. I am curious if don't mind me ask what would you go with as far as what's currently out there for something in this size range? I would like have something not necessarily QRP output only but small and light ( slightly larger and hevier be fine with more functionality )and backup to the 897 perhaps SDR based as seems better way to go as well. thx for all your content I am learning much by binging on it .
I couldn't agree more, Julian. I was highly disappointed when I began reading the specs on the ft818. Filters upgrades would be nice, but I was certainly expecting a 10 watt rig and upgraded battery. The upgrade to 6 watts is a joke and I can do better with an aftermarket battery than what they gave us. I do not know why they even bothered with the 818. I know several that were excited when it was initially announced. But since we all found out the specs, don't know anyone who has purchased one.
Personally I think they're Burning Bridges Bob. The whole 818 Escapade was marketing. I won't sell my 817ND, but I certainly won't upgrade.
I just bought one, with the 500hz Filter installed the LDG Z Autotuner, the data interface with cat cables, A Power Supply and all in a nice Suitcase plus a stand for it for 550 Dollars.
My vote for the 'build-my-own-radio'... down size the ft-991 into footprint like the ft-891. The C4FM on 10M & 6M would be nice in addition to the all-band, all-mode VHF/UHF capability already in the ft-817/nd/857d. It (991) already has the USB/sound card connectivity you would like to see. The obvious sacrifice would be the large display due to the smaller case size/footprint. Power consumption would need to be addressed as well.
Thank you for the video Julian!
My field radio is still the SGC2020 with their first gen noise filter. It does a great job at getting out. Only drawback is that it does not do AM. Was a little late at buying the unit and the overpriced battery pack housing had been discontinued. Too bad they have pretty much folded in ham radio equipment and have focused on the more lucrative and highly profitable military supplier of antenna couplers.
I am sure if P.G. Was alive today he would have produced a radio with all of the features you mentioned in the video. Lets hope someone listens soon or I might have to and invest in a surplus "green radio" which could be a major problem to use as a field radio here in Greece. They tend to frown upon hams using these restricted ( cough gag ) items. A long time member of HF Pack in the USA we love to use these rigs in the field. One can find plenty of the Clansmen HF packs on line, however the main issue is that there are no replacement IC's available for these units since the Plessy warehouse went up in flames years ago. Thanks for the great and informative videos. 73!
I borrowed a friend's Clansman for field day once...that was interesting (PRC-320, as I recall). Got a couple of contacts, but it just got stepped on by a lot of the big contesters. Worked it out of the back of my truck.
Thank you for uploading this video. I agree with what you are saying. I am considering the purchase of an FT-818 within the next few weeks. I'd like to have a "do everything" radio that I could take out to the parks and forest preserves to operate away from the house, and not have to take my K1 or K2 or any of the other QRP kit radios out of the house. After watching your video, I am beginning to rethink my possible purchase. I own an FT-857d, and it does everything the FT-818 does, and I already have the Collins filters and TCXO. For field use, at six Watts, I'd pretty much use the FT-818 for CW and digital work only. As you pointed out, having 10-20 Watts is more ideal for SSB and all. The big draw for me on the FT-818 is its ruggedness. I'd feel more comfortable taking it out with me than the QRP kit radios I have. Definitely food for thought.
Howdy! Great vid. Why would the FT-891 not be considered a field-rig?
Great question. Field radios generally have an internal battery bay, a rugged frame, and a low rx current. The 891 is nearly there, but rx current is high at 0.9a. I should mention the eight nine one is my primary radio right now. I've had an external lithium iron phosphate battery, and I'm in the process of integrating it into a Pelican case.
Roger Roger...I had a FT-450D in the truck for a while, but have since installed the FT-891 in the vehicle. It can be quickly removed for field or portable ops. I agree that the FT-891 has a phenomenal receiver...a small amount of DSP is all it takes! 73 - KM4RT.
*I meant DNR...
@OH8STN have you looked into the CTX-10? I was one of the first group of people to play with it in a RTO course taught by NCScout (survival radio course, his blog is Brushbeater). It has an CW keyer, OLED display, internal Li-ion battery, internal tuner, and internal sound card. It was great, but I wish it covered VHF/UHF, otherwise it may be a good fit.
Yeah I have but its price point makes it a no-go. Also the company's TH-cam channel and documentation are really bad. I wouldn't be willing to bet my money on that radio, but if I got one here for testing, I would certainly have a go. On paper it seems pretty cool. The company marketing is pretty terrible though.
Do you have one?
@@OH8STN I agree. No, I don't have one, but NCScout does they sent it to him to showcase, they could do the same for you possibly, you have a much larger audience I imagine.
I have been a ham for a long time. I've hardly ever operated on the HF bands. I operated digital modes at vhf and above. Well I've finally become interested in HF. I know you don't like the radio as an upgrade from the 817 but is it worth the trouble as a first QRP rig? I know there are much more capable QRP rigs out there but I'm trying not to spend to much money at this point. My main reason for looking at the 818 is it seems to cover more bands than many other QRP backpack radios.
Absolutely and you seem to have understood the video quite well. As a first radio certainly the eight one seven or eight one eight is a fine rig to start with. HF VHF UHF all mode. It's not perfect but it's a great starter radio. Yeah I have no problems with the radio as it is, my problem was with the update. I'm glad you asked, the question was very much appreciated.
73
Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN I now have an an ft-818 .. this just my starting point more rigs in my future I hope. Unrelated question, as a Prepper do you harden any of your gear against EMP? I just saw a documentary about it, it's truely terrifying, since we are moving back towards solar Max should we as hams start hardening some of our gear? Last solar Max the electronics we have now was not around - n8aho 😎
Congratulations on your new radio. There's a video on TH-cam showing how to modify an ammo can to be a faraday cage. I have a large Faraday case where I store critical Electronics. My ham Shack is also hardened. Otherwise nothing else.
I got my HF license in 2016, and an 817 FD as my first HF radio. It was awful. Reception was terrible. Within 6 weeks I spent the coin and bought a new Kx2. I let someone else start with my 817 Fd for SOTA. He too upgraded to a KX2, as soon as he could save up the money. Maybe save yourself one step, and just buy a KX2 from the get go?
I think you bring up valid complaints. The biggest question I have is, if Yaesu did these upgrades, what would it cost? A separate LDG tuner is a pain in the butt but still doable. The filters done right shouldn't cost a fortune. Upgraded battery pack should be easy.....USB port for CAT control....super easy.....But again....at what cost? Cheers KX4IG
Icom 7200 as an example. Mchf, rs-928, kx2, x5105. All reasonably priced. Honestly if they would actually build this radio, I would easily pay more for it.
@@OH8STN how about a 50 watts ultra portable all band tranciever?
I think you hit the nail on the head in the very last part. ‘If Yaesu had called this the 817mk3 we wouldn’t be having this conversation’ in other words the problem lies with your expectation of what the 818 was going to be, what you wanted it to be, rather than the radio itself. Your endless reference to ‘fanboys’ just comes across as angry and I guess if the radio continues to be such a disappointment the really obvious answer, especially as your not a Yaesu fan as such, is to wait a few months and plump for an Icom IC-705 which appears to have most of what you want (I’d hate to have an internal ATU, why tie yourself to the weight and bulk). Prepare yourself though, while you can easily get an 818 in the U.K. for under 500UKP the 705 will set you back nearly 1200UKP but for those looking for the extra functionality, the option is now there.
I have a 818, am setting it up as a manpack, with a soundcard for digital, I use a separate power sourse ,and don't have a real problem, it is a very versatile radio, with the right antennas, you really can't expect perfection in the field, you do what you can.
We can come very close to perfection in the field with other radios. It just comes at a higher price. Although my TX-500 and IC-705 are my go-to rigs, still haven't sold the little Yaesu.
Add a filter to help the receiver and get the Elecraft T1 antenna tuner if you're not using resonant antennas.
73
Julian oh8stn
I owned a VX-1210 for a number of years. It was an interesting radio. Not super ham friendly, but usable enough. Tried it for a field day and was walked over a lot by the amplified super contesters. Overnight, though, when people went to sleep, I was able to make a few nice contacts from Arizona.
Well thought out and researched video Julian. The radio has been a disappointment to the satellite community as well. I think we were all hoping for more power. 10 watts would have been great. For our purposes two of these type of radios together is a great full duplex setup for linear/SSB sats, and of course it also works for the FM sats. It's really the only/best option for very portable full duplex sat ops on all the birds. So I can't say I'd want the size to double. But for HF operators in the field, doubling the size to something more like the 897 to get all the features you mentioned makes sense. If they could double the size, give you all the features you need on HF, and give us full duplex across VHF/UHF then I'd be psyched, that would actually make powering the setup easier.
73, John Brier KG4AKV
Yeah I was considering including a word about satellite Communications with the eight one eight. I didn't think about the dual vfo, but it's an excellent point. The I think there was a huge opportunity for Yaesu to put out an excellent rig, but they chose not to.
"I think there was a huge opportunity for Yaesu to put out an excellent rig, but they chose not to."
pretty much :-/
I'm using 2x FT817 for SAT operations too. It is a good solution for portable operation or just to operate from my garden. The thing I don't like is when using the radio with CAT to adjust the frequency for doppler the frequency isn't corrected during TX. When the SAT is around it zenit position the doppler change is the most and you have to release the PTT shortly to get the frequency adjusted by the computer. This could be most probably a simple change in the RIG firmware and know the SAT community has addressed this problem to Yaesu many times.
For other I completly agree with Julian. Specially the DC connector.
My DC port has already FAILED! Any set-by-step instructions on how to replace?
Sorry wrong link, try this one
oh8stn.org/blog/2018/10/03/stupid-dc-socket-design-on-yaesu-ft-817-ft-818/
Its a great radio.
Julian, thank you for your channel. I am just getting started into HAM and your channel has been incredibly helpful. Working on a budget and making intelligent choices is a must. Thank you for showing how you can start small and build up from there. I spent may years doing field operations in my profession. Hard choices have to be made when carrying heavy comms gear plus survival equipment and still needing to fill operational requirements. Your channel does just that! Hopefully, I will be working distant stations by the end of the year and you will be one of the first trans-Atlantic contacts, smart choices permitting. Again, thank you for your field operational reviews.
John/KE0CSC
I like the video. I just got a Ft-891 last weekend. I like it a lot so far but I've only used it at home. I can't wait to get out in the middle of nowhere with it when the weather breaks. Hey, do you know ever happened to another TH-camr I think his name was Tony and his callsign had ARV in it I believe. He was from Florida and did a lot of QRP.
I like my 891 very much. Yeah I don't know what happened to Tony. TH-cam is a tough place, and it's not for everybody.
The items you list is the main reason I went with the mcHF V6 (Real version). I had a Kx2 and was disappointed with the amount of menus and things I had to do to go from digi to cw or phone.
I did have a FT-891 and while I loved the RX, other issues like the chirp from usb connection as well as total lack of support from Yaesu was a big let down.
Love the videos keep up the good work!
73
David
N8DAH
I'm right there with you David. My eyesight isn't good enough to build the mchf myself oh, so I've been trying to find someone to build it for me. I love that rig! It is the direction modern portable radios should be headed.
@@OH8STN Check with the Yahoo group: uk.groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/M0NKA-mcHF/info
A few good people that build them. I would offer to but have my hands full with my new site.
Look @ Xiegu they are doing right. For the 819: A-LiIon Battery 4-7 Ah (3S2P Config) with Built-In Charge Controller B: ATU C: USB and Bluetooth D: DSP Filtering E: Monochrome OLED Display F:Backlit Keys for Night Operation G: ManPack Case
Now we got the rig, it has to be reliable Japanese style; should be having some weatherproofing and some sort of ruggedness for the field.
So, I was considering this unit until I watched this video. What would you guys recommend for me? I'm looking for a HF/UHF/VHF radio that is battery powered that I can use at an off-grid (no power at all) seasonal cabin in a heavily forested area. Thanks!
If low current consumption is important, take a look at the Icom IC-705.
th-cam.com/video/FEtYClfVz9I/w-d-xo.html
@@OH8STN will do! Thanks…
Thank you for asking the question. I know Yaesu is not listening to most of the current users of the FT-817/818. There is a group that is the radio as a IF receiver for much higher frequencies. In that regard using it to work with a transverter is easy with the low power output. This is not really a field radio in these applications. The failing of the 818 has allowed a new radios to appear on the market. Some like my favorite the KX2 have most of what you are asking about. They have the higher power, antenna tuner, Li type batteries and very low receive current. This coupled with a quiet SDR arcituture you get very good performance. What is missing that I like on the FT-817 is VHF/UHF all the rest miss. I can only hope Yaesu wakes up to the growing field opps and decides to participate.
Watching this in present times, I enjoy how well fantastically this video has aged. Everything was spot on and grinded out now 2 years earlier. Before the 705, tx-500, etc, and still the ft-817/818 no longer made sense, after it's glorious and deserved reputation
I was considering a TX-500, but the war in Ukraine has made that all but an impossibility now. That radio is made in Russia. Last year, they were about $800. Now what is left in stock in the US is $1200+.
Try www.theqrpstore.com/
I completely agree, FT-818 is too expensive for what it is capable of. The receiver is just ridiculous, it's because of him that I didn't even consider buying it. We should immediately buy a non-cheap mechanical filter - and even it is not able to significantly improve the signal quality any way. For the same money, I took the FT-891, which has a wonderful modern receiver, does not have any optional filters, with a perfectly working DSP (NAR mode for CW with a bandwidth of 50 Hz is just crazy). Not to mention that it's a 100W radio. Elecraft understands perfectly well what operators need for QRP, I would rather take it than the hopelessly outdated FT-817/818.
I still love my IC-703+. 10w, internal ATU, very low RX current draw and very good DSP receive.
I don’t understand why Icom do not offer a field radio given the popularity of SOTA, POTA etc.
They do. The ICOM 705. I realise it's taken them a year since your comment, but surprise! 😊
Hello Julian.
As you said, housing size like 2x 817 stacked or single 897
with the 891 inside, bigger display, IF DSP, Lipo Battery, CAT or BT and ATU.
As option a clip on additional Battery pack and a Rugged housing were you can put in the TRX + additional battery ( like a flip down front from a flightcase) that it can survive a drop from 2m high.
Because I don't think bubble wrap is an option in a emergency situation.
73
DO3FX
I agree with Julian.
That's when the Marketing Dept "smart" guys (who think they are so clever) will tell you that 6W will move the crowd and they'll buy it.
Same happens everywhere.
This idea is not from the tech folks, nor from the users, it's from Mkt Dept..
See what the military uses for voice ? Between 20 and 50, 20W will make it if you focus on having an effective antenna.
I have checked this and had lots of rigs, sure i've had fun with my 10W Elecratf, when propagation is there, 5W is enought.
However often, it's more difficult to be heard in the crowed at 5W and 20W can make the difference and less frustration from both sides (the other side struggles don't forget).
Choice? Xiegu G90 at 20W (has also built-in ATU), Yaesu 891 (Wolf cycle down) or some military rig as the HF90 which i own but it's not user friendly for the HAM community.
Don't forget: batteries are getting better and better, with higher and higher power density and can power easily higher output rigs.
Want to QRP? You can bring it down to 5W from these rigs if you fancy the fun of QRP, which is fun indeed, provided propagation is here.
I pretty much agree. They're going to have to up their game, especially with the new Chinese Elecraft-like models on the market. I would like the same form factor as the FT-81X, lithium battery, OLED display (higher res, more flexibility), lower RX current, the 891's DNR, a much more resilient power connector. I would prefer a front-panel mic connector over the extra BNC, drop VHF and UHF (HT's are so cheap now). Ship with removable protection side / carry rails ex-factory. I wouldn't bulk the radio out with an internal tuner, but would like an internal antenna analyser to help tweak a portable antenna - a standard in-field task. External tuners almost always have loads more tuning range than any internal unit, anyway.
Well said.👍👍👍
And I forget to add, 10W would be an ideal, competitive output power. My preferred antennae for portable (where I'm going to carry the gear) are: LMR400 magnetic loop, resonant dipole or the speaker wire resonant doublet. None of which need an antenna tuner, but an antenna _analyser_ is handy for tweaking the wire antennas.
I have owned a Yaesu FT 817 since they first came out. Primarily, it is used for H.F. portable. When I went to purchase the rig, I took the opportunity to check its specifications, and above all.......the suitability for my needs. The Yaesu 817 is what it is. It has 5w r.f. output, no auto tuner, that’s no big deal. At the end of the day we are amateur radio operators, and some loose sight of that very fact. If anyone is looking to just turn on a radio and and operate with minimal input, then buy some 446 p.m.r. radios or buy an internet radio. You have to accept, that the equipment you take out in the field will have some limitations, 5w of low power and the lack of an auto a.t.u. Is not a limitation, it is a traditional challenge to true qrp radio operations. To add to this, realistically, we will at some point discover the need to extend the battery life of your portable operating. There are several ways to do this, but increasing the o/p power to 10watts isn’t going to help this. Often you will hear base stations running 100w, the “other” station will be running considerably more power, and yet, the report exchange is similar. Go out and use what you have, don’t get hung up over auto atu’s there are some very nice portable atu’s out that fit the bill. As time goes by, try and adapt to the equipment you have , and enjoy operating it. Lastly, never, ever, ever, ever take out your patch leads to use on gear at the home qth. Why? Because the next time you go out on a field trip, they won’t be in your kit pack, you will then know what disappointment is like. Take it from someone who knows hi. Safe operating everyone 73’s G4SQJ.
You are spot on. I used to be an 817 fanboy but for the last 4 years have not even considered Yaesu at all. I thought they could not screw up more after the 170 HT was sooo bad! They did. The 270 was next then System Confusion. Now this??! Are you listening Yaesu?
Great review. So, is there a product out there that gets it done as a field radio?
A self contained all/most-mode radio kit really appeals to me (like what the FT818 maybe intends to be) but thanks to your video I think I'll stay away from it.
Hello from Atlanta Georgia I just bought the eight one eight it's a nice radio it's not that much of an upgrade from the 817 I had but it's a nice radio and I could buy all my lithium ion batteries at batteries America you can even get the pack for it you can get it lithium ion like 2600 milliamps or 2800 milliamps but it's a cute little radio it's got a nice receiver but I really appreciate you sharing this post thanks again my friend you work very hard in doing what you do on TH-cam bringing the darkness into the light you do a great job I subscribe to your channel thank you so much your best friend from Atlanta Georgia
is 817 ND still viable option today? im eying one for 400€€ (cheapest in my part of world), but dont want to throw away money . im brand new in ham hobby, still learning my ropes ...
For portable HF operation the FT-891 is the way to go. The main thing the FT-818 has going for it is ssb on vhf/uhf for portable linear satellite operation. A common setup is a pair of 818s combined with an arrow portable yagi for satellite operation.
Im not sure this rig is for the guy thats had one for 20 years.However the guy thats been on the fence now can have a 818 for 600 bucks you tell me fail or win.
The price is a deception. You still need to add the filter, if you want to operate for any length of time you'll need to add additional batteries or an external battery. I would definitely say it's a good first qrp radio, but it's far from the best. The flip side is it's the only radio of this size that has old bands old modes HF VHF UHF.
I bought the 818, it runs hot even on internal batteries, I think it needs a heatsink! I wish I went for the 897D but the very last ones were sold as I started looking, the 891 would have been a better choice but I wanted 6/2M and 70cm
We all feel your pain. I also wish I would have got the 897D. It would be amazing if Yaesu came out with an updated 897 with filters and display technology from the 891
Let me know my friend who makes that mounting system you have your 817 sitting on with the little handles on each side could you let me know where I can get one I really appreciate it thank you for sharing this valuable video
I've never owned the 818 I still have Andrew's one of the early 817s and I am still amazed at what they've done with it I am also disappointed in the same places that most are The power option being the biggest the display being second The filtering being third if I had bought an 818 expecting some sort of step up and received essentially the same radio I too would be disappointed and the 897 was a great radio I always figured that's what I would step up to when I outgrew the 817 sadly that never came about
Julien, yr spot on,...I have been looking to buy an FT897D just for reasons u have stated,..i feel the 81x is great radio but was just not quite what Im looking for, as for the 991a its a great radio, but i would not consider it as rugged as the 897, so again, not a replacement. In the end Im about to purchase an 891 as an alternative. Did not consider the 857, still looking to get an 897D for reasonable price. Im still a Yaesu Fan, A92GW, cheers n 73s Julien, thanks again, for your candid reviews
Thanks Thomas. I'm also still a Yaesu fan, but felt we needed to use this platform to push them in the right direction. If I could get an 897 in good condition, I would snatch it up in a heart beat. My skills in regards to lithium iron phosphate cells have progressed enough, I could easily replace the nickel metal hydride batteries in the 897, with lithium iron phosphate cells, bms and charge controller. The 891 is very good rig, with an excellent receiver. Current draw is higher than I would like, but size, receiver, output are perfect for a field station.
Thanks for the comments and the kindness. It's very much appreciated.
73
Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN thx for the reply Julien,.. 73s my friend,... lets hope yr input is taken to heart at Yeasu
Not an HF operator yet but if I could "redesign the 817-818 I'd make it an all mode VHF/UHF radio without an internal battery pack. I'd also keep the price in under the $500 mark. I know I'm probably the only person that this would appeal to but I love the idea of a small packable all mode radio for Techs to mess around with 2M SSB for SOTA activations and other field ops.
Spot on with the analysis Julian. One reason I'm going with a 2nd hand Icom IC-706MkiiG as my portable shack in a box and /P contest station. It may be power hungry but it's small enough for my backpack and has the correct ports on the back for accessories and power.
Most of the time I work in the field due to high levels of QRM in my QTH, and had some hands-on experience with the KX3 and KX2 (they are great ). And I know that there are some cool new low-priced Chinese rigs out there which you can buy for around $500 (excl vat, custom taxes etc). But they all lag one thing : VHF/UHF.
The "upgrade" to the FT818 is marginal, because it wasn''t attended as a major upgrade for features but replacement due to end-of-life parts. The TCXO-9 is a nice extra when you use slow digital modes. And yes they should have named it FT817NE of FT817ND-MK2. But owning my second FT817(ND) I will replace it with the FT818 when my FT817ND dies on me. All because I use VHF/UHF SSB, CW and digital modes in the field on sat, portable experiments, etc. and for that there is no substitute at the price of a new FT818.
73 de Lex PH2LB
P.s. And yes I want to buy and build the QRP-Labs QSX. Not because I need it but because I want to build it and support Hans Summers .
It’s a lazy update, sadly. The Icom IC 703 had some of these getting on for what, 20 years ago?
The FT-818 is totally ok, i own one and i really like it. The only mistake Yaesu made ist the name of the radio. It should be FT-817NE or some thing like that, because FT-818 suggests a new radio, which it isn't. I'm shure thats a decision from the today's marketing guys, which don't have the right feeling about marketing for technical guys's like Ham operators.
Agreed. I believe that's almost the last thing I said in the video. We wouldn't have this conversation if they called it Yaesu ft-817 Mark 3, November Echo, ...
Thanks for the polite comment.
73
Julian oh8stn
The only thing that lets it down for me is the crappy power socket. I fitted an aftermarket powerpole connector. 73’s
You just convinced me not to grab that from the shelf. Thanks a lot, 73 de IW9HOJ
I'm happy with my original FT817 ... great field radio, fun to use. As a CW op, I find the menu system a bit of hassle. Why oh why did Yaesu stick the F button between the main tuning dial and the display? Those of us with normal fingers (not pointy lady-fingers) inevitably touch the dial when making a simple menu change. The filter "issue" really isn't for most hams. We usually have one mode we prefer, and for me the Collins CW filter works great, and I don't use USB. I also have the TXCO-9 in mine As to connectors, internal tuners and such, well, there's only so much real estate available in that small form factor ... and to change these feature wouldn't be an update, it would be a redesign.. That crummy DC connector can be rectified with a PowerPole adapter. The battery life is awful, and the charging time is, too. But I keep the internal battery charged, and usually use an external 12V 7AH AGM battery. I'm not a fanboy, and I'm not a nit-picker. This little radio does everything Yaesu told me it would do. If this rig dies, I'll be looking to get an 818. As in many things, to each his own.
I have both the 817 and the 891. Despite the fact that the 891 lacks 2 meters and 70cm, it is a better rig. The if dsp filters the speech processor, and even the price. It is actually less money that the 817/818 and there are no filters to buy. The 817 without some speech processing is very hard to work with. The 891 can be dialed down to qrp levels and has much punchier audio. I like my 817 but if it ever takes a dump on me I will likely not fix or replace it.
Well said.
I believe if you own a 817nd they is no point upgrading...if you don't own one,.it's still a good QRP radio for it's money. I believe Yaesu didn't want to twinkle too much with it's iconic design but I do think they could of gave us a little extra and may be raised the price a little.
I agree with much of what you say. I left my comments about this rig under a different video, until I saw the link to this interesting video.
The FT817 was the first rig I ever purchased. At the time I was a new ham and had no idea what to buy. Turns out it was a great choice. It's still one of my favourite rigs. Over the years I have taken it on business trips to France (where I took it up a mountain near Grenoble, but only had one QSO) and Italy/Sicily (from where I had my first 6m DX QSO).
I was really looking forward to see how Yaesu would follow up this iconic rig. The FT817ND was of no interest, then finally the FT818 was to me a massive disappointment. As you say 6W - REALLY! Are you serious! As I have already posted it appeared that Yaesu was just being lazy. They didn't even have to re-tool the casing (hence the reason for no power input change). In the meantime Icon have left Yaesu in the dust with their innovations (e.g. SDR, 70MHz) and now the IC-705.
I really wanted a rig with the same form factor and size (more or less). I don't care about ATU. I would have liked 10W from a new LiPo internal battery. I would also have liked a new TFT colour display with bandscope. I wanted 70MHz too. It didn't even have to be SDR.
BTW I like your idea for the features of a replacement rig, and 20W would be very nice, but would like to keep the size as small as possible. You can do a lot with low power. The 5W of the FT817 has got me all across Europe on 6m and once on 17m I even worked Japan (all /P). 20W would be gentle on SLA batteries (for example) but still give that extra power when needed. Let's all hope that Yaesu have seen what Icom have done and have woken up and are developing a proper successor to the FT817!
BTW I tried to use a IC-7000 /P running off a medium sized SLA (as a successor to my FT817), but this rig is just not happy with anything less than 13V (even at lower power) and will shut down very quickly. This rig was not perfect, but had great features, including bandscope and excellent noise suppression. Perhaps I will try it again having made one of your LiFePo battery packs? Also this rig is quite fragile. I blew the pre-driver twice, doing nothing unusual at the time.
M1GRY
I agree with your analysis. I am still happy with my FT-817 (original) that has been working 100% for 20 years. I have upgraded the CW filter, and put a LiON pack in it. It blows me away that Yaesu is still using NiMH batteries in these radios. I would agree if you were out shopping for a new radio to steer clear, but if you already have one -- you still have a very capable and reliable radio. Much more reliable than the Chinese radios.
I'm sharing this Channel with everyone in the amateur community in Douglasville Georgia in Atlanta Georgia thanks once again my friend we love you here in Atlanta Georgia
I really would like an 818, but I'll stick with my ICOM 703 for now. Hopefully Yaesu will do an '819' soon.. ;-)
I really wish they would. The 818 is not that bad. A few updates and it would be perfect.
What is wrong with FT-857d as field radio?
Nothing wrong with the 857. It's got DSP, two filter spots, and it's a good rig.
I bought the 817nd used, two years later I bought a brand new 891 for about the same price. I like the 817 so I won't get rid of it, however the cost of the 818 and that it doesn't do anything different, vs something like the 891, I can't figure that one out. Maybe Yaesu wants to make it bad enough that they have a reason to discontinue it.
Those are really valid points Mark. I'm kind of wondering why if they can build a radio like the 891, would they not make a portable version based on the same technology. Looks like Yaesus right hand doesn't know what Yaesus left hand is doing.
@@OH8STN What I thought the 818 would have been before it was released is an elecraft competitor. I don't have one of those, I have a couple of friends that do, and other than the cost, I like those. I like yaesu radios as well. Unfortunately I don't know think they will.
You've made a great argument to purchase either a KX2 or KX3.
Or the mchf
This is a great point about the kx2 and kx3. The receivers in those radios are incredible. But the lack of ruggedness, is completely by Design. These are gentlemans radios. They were never designed to be dragged through the mud.
Great comments John thank you. 👍
@@johnzarubajr actually that's not a bad thing 😊 I like the idea of ham radio not having to be so excessive, or complicated. Elecraft does an excellent job with this point on the kx2 and kx3.
just got an 818 because i sold a NIB 817 that was never used... there is still no radio on the market that equals the 818... i also have a KX2, which is a terrible radio (bad design, too fragile, battery has to be removed to be charged, lousy AM reception, confusing as heck to use or learn), along with an SGC SG-2020, Icom IC-703, Xiegu X5105, G1M, and G90... of all my QRP radios, the 818 is the only one that does it all, and if i want to make contacts in these lousy band conditions, i'll go with my G90 or 2020...
Overpriced and not an upgrade. The FT-817 or FT-818 should be a $350.00 radio. I got mine on craigslist listed as a cb radio for $50.00, a very good deal. It didn't come with a microphone and was untested. I also have the FT-897 and one day I may get it back from the repair shop. (It was another great deal)
Whether correctly or incorrectly people do compare them to the price point of the Chinese radios.
I completely agree with your analysis btw and find the prices on even used 817;to defy logic considering capabilities of radio vs some things on horizon. I haven't had opportunity to test the Xiegu's but looks like that could be way to go if have reliablity as they seem to be more willing listen and adapt to needs of customer base. hopefully the big 3 will follow suit due to competition.
I bought my 818 for $599. I did not own an 817ND, and had no choice but to buy an 818. I think there is value in an HF QRP rig at that price. Yaesu never claimed that the 818 was their next QRP/Field offering, they billed it as an upgrade to the 817ND. If the 817 crowd was expecting a full redesign, I think that would come with a much higher price tag, and it's certainly not what Yaesu advertised prior to the release. I agree with your evaluation, but to have expected more than a few simple updates from a radio at the same price point seems like an unreasonable expectation.
I agree with most of this. But not all. I would not replace my FT817 (I still use the Mk1) with an FT818. I do not feel that the improvements would be worth the money for such an upgrade. It is important that I am only a casual field operator (SOTA, WFF, IOTA) , but I do quite a lot of holiday style DXpeditions etc.
1) First off, the FT819 should definitely not be double size and weight... The popularity of the FT817 series is partly because of its size. I have kept my FT817 only because it is a very small radio, which I often use while in motion, hanging it from my neck or shoulder. I do not have a HT, the FT817 does the job for me. When I started ham radio in the early 1980s, the FT290R was a game changing radio. The FT817, in my eyes, is the direct successor, with HF and UHF added. I would not have bought the 817 if it was not like this.
2) Display. Being a contester and DXpeditioner, I believe that Yaesu usually fails on ergonomy, ie not employing a UX designer with some contesting/DXing experience. Having to rotate through different menus to be able to set the CW keyer speed, power , or the filters, etc is just ridiculous. It is not much bettter on the FT891 either, and I cannot fathom why in the age of colour touchscreens Yaesu can not equip the radio with a touch panel and user-configurable and programmable soft buttons as well as physical buttons and knobs....
3) USB connection for CAT and audio. Or even bluetooth. Especially in portable use, a single USB/bluetooth/WLAN port could save you from carrying interfaces, cables, etc.
As for the FT897 that you mention. Well, honestly, that was the worst transceiver in my arsenal, even though I kept it long (about 15 years) because I liked the size and all. But unfortunately it was a total design disaster, and not for the size. I just realised that I was rather taking my big desktop transceiver to DXlocations paying for excess luggage and hand carrying it onto one-man island trips, just because of the handling ergonomy of the 897... I finally replaced it with a FT991 and that radio I consider to be a direct inheritor of the FT897 (similar size and weight) , but with a much-much-much better design in every respect. The only thing I miss from the 991 is the optional power supply like the FP30 or internal battery pack, that could be fitted in the belly of the FT897. The user interface is still a mess, but not even comparable to the FT897.
Yep, this is a discussion, so there are no right or wrong opinions. Btw, the ft-817 and ft-897 had exactly the same menu structure. In fact, they are nearly identical radios, built on the same technology. The 857 and 897 are identical.
Great video Julain!!! I personally think you have done more testing of alternative power options than Yaesu ever has. Okay, perhaps that's a silly statement. But, you make some very good points and have the research to back up your comments. They are not listening, and with the SDR wave of radios hitting, they are going to loose their market if they keep this crap up. Especially with the QSX on the horizon. Granted we have to build it, and it would take some work to get all the bits needed for pure mobile (if you want speakers n such) but the feature set built in (price, filtering, size, digi modes...) should make any low power radio manufacturer at least a little worried.
I’m rather pleased with the. Xiegu X5105. Right sort of price point, rugged, internal lipo and atu.
Not quite up there with a KX3, but not bad at all.
Yeah when the 5 105 came out I realized the Chinese were putting some effort into the radios. The only things I don't like about the 5105 is no internal sound card, and the add on port to connect computer for data modes.
On the flip side, as an SSB or CW rig, it's hard not to consider it.
@@OH8STN got the x5105 not long ago and use the wolphilink with it. Makes a great JS8 setup with the RPi and Android tablet.
Hi Tim, I didnt know that. You like it?
@@OH8STN I do like it. I have the ce-19 which allows for cat control but it seems a little wonky. The wolphilink doesn't allow for cat control but it's simple and compact. I have an 817nd and still love it. Was very disappointed with the 818 and thus purchased the x5105. 73 de KF7VUT
The antenna analyzer in a killer feature on the X5105. Its great for field work.