I was once a PSA only guy. I am now a SGC guy. The reasons are simple. Waiting 3 or 4 months to get my cards back is a deal breaker. I'm old and I don't wait to think that I may live long enough to see my cards again. Customer service at PSA is terrible. My last submission with them they sent two of my cards with labels mixed up so the card of one had the label of other and visa versa. I showed them video of their mistake and asked for two vouchers to refund my expenses and they refused. PSA has gone completely off the rails in their grading. I had been a 35 year customer of PSA and the standards have changed so much that grades are getting in some cases 2 grades lower than before. I have sent in a dozen or so PSA cards that were clearly under graded and sent to SGC for a real grade. Only one card got the same grade and all the others were higher. They say the definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different result. Once an only PSA guy to now a never a PSA guy.
It would be nice if PSA did something, to show, their appreciation for long-time PSA submitters, without doing up charges, and any other additional membership tiers (more money) for it.
Great video and question, straight to the point. This is where my observations stand: PSA: Focus: Some P.C. Collector Realm. Main Realm: Consumer/ Seller Realm(Fast Money). **This is why the value of the cards are high.** SGC/Others: Main Realm: P.C. Collectors who want Quality/ Generational Appreciation(Investment Money) Secondary: Seller/Consumer market. **Quality/ Prestige/ Long-term Value** So that's why I try to stay w/ SGC mainly, besides their Turn Around time. On
I buy cards graded by both SGC and PSA. I’d consider cards graded by other companies as well, but I rarely see any around here. I make a submission to SGC once or twice a year. I have no interest submitting to any other company at this time
Another fine episode. As for this week’s question, it depends. I know, I know. It depends on if I’m buying a graded card or if I’m sending it in to be graded. If I’m buying, I’m slabnostic. I don’t care about the slab as much as the card, or even perceived value of the “deal”. If I’m sending them in, I’m SGC all day every day. This past year I sent orders for both to the same group submitter in the same shipment. The SGC was back before the PSA order had even moved out of their research phase. The icing on the cake was when the modern cards in my PSA order were back a month before my vintage cards, and one of the vintage slabs came back damaged and was another two months wait while they reslabbed it. My vintage cards were gone 4 months. That is why I’m SGC all day every day. My question is: What happens if/when Peter leaves SGC? What if he goes to CSG, or Beckett? Do those companies instantly get a bump because of the vintage collectors assuming that he will get whichever one following the SGC playbook that was successful? Thanks again for the video and opportunity to participate.
... will it hurt psa enough to take market shares away from PSA? PSA is all about PSA and only bought SGC to buy out the true competition. They're keeping them down, while still adding their customers' money into PSA's pocket.
I think if I were Mr. Turner, I would be asking Ryan why we are buying out PSA’s competition at all. If SGC is truly competitive with PSA without having an eBay deal, without having a set registry, and now without doing on site grading at the National , there is something wrong with the business model/culture at PSA. I would have been finding out why SGC was gaining market share, why SGC has a much faster turnaround time, and after the purchase I think I would have elevated Peter since he’s the one leading the rise of our biggest competitor. Just my opinion.
I am currently frustrated with grading. I have not submitted to PSA since the massive slowdown during COVID. I am not young and I cannot stand waiting months for my cards to return plus none of my cards are worth spending the high prices for a quick turnaround. They also are too inconsistent in their grades. In the last few years I have only submitted to SGC for my vintage card collection from the 1880s- 1960s. I like how the older cards look in the SGC holder. I also plan to send some of my cards from my 1958 autograph set to be authenticated but will use Beckett. I really want Beckett to survive. The tendency toward monopoly in the hobby is very troubling.
GRAIG - First time commenting. I am submitting predominantly to SGC these days. I love the way the black slabs frame vintage cards. Additionally, I collect with my 9 year old daughter who tracks the progress of our submissions on almost a daily basis. The long wait at PSA simply doesn’t hold her attention. We collect largely for the joy of the chase so the current difference in ultimate value of a PSA slab versus an SGC slab is not that important to us. Yours in the hobby - Jason
I appreciate you touching on my prediction. I believe you are correct with the rare items increasing in value. The more common stuff regular collectors buys.. I'm holding to my position. The wind will go out of the hobby sale for much of it.
Graig - Great video! I always appreciate your direct approach and honesty in what is going on with the hobby. In regards to PSA vs. SGC, I prefer SGC by a long shot. I prefer the look of an SGC slab, prefer how they grade (although they seem to be even tougher lately), and of course their pricing and turnaround is superior to PSA. In looking at VCP lately, it appears as SGC is bringing even more $ in some vintage cards. As a collector of mostly vintage, I have no reason to prefer PSA over SGC. I almost wonder if Collectors would be better off with a combined registry as you've mentioned previously and then marketing SGC as the "vintage" grading arm and PSA for everything post-1980. Allow each group to play to their strengths. My fear is that PSA will just poach the good vintage graders from SGC (as you mentioned) and then allow SGC to just go away.
Man! A bunch of interesting takes. The grading thing is very frustrating to me. They were way better at it when they were way cheaper. I’ve been dealing with grading since the beginning and they are completely insane now. It’s kind of ruined it for me.
I will answer your question, but first some context. I have been experimenting with grading for a few years. I currently have cards in 10 different companies slabs. I have personally sent several orders to both PSA and SGC. After some experimenting, I decided to use PSA for some items I planned to sell. Generally, I don’t like PSA slabs, so I don’t want PC Cards in them. I don’t care about re-sale value for my PC because I plan to keep PC pretty much forever. Also, I prefer raw, but do like some slabs for displaying purposes. About 6 months ago I started to see a very bad trend with PSA. They seemed to be under grading most cards, and some by several grades. I am not a grader by trade, so that was just my opinion. Since these were cards I planned to sell, I took a sample and cracked them out and sent them to SGC. All of them came back with higher grades in line more with my expectations. After that I decided that I am done with PSA. I don’t have any more gradable cards I am looking to sell now, but if I did I would send them to SGC. More context - based on yours, and a few other content creators videos I did a search for some low grade PSA vintage football cards recently graded appearing too severely rated. I found two and bought them. Don’t have them in hand yet, but plan to free them from their PSA shells immediately. Probably keep them raw. If I get them graded, my preferred slab for vintage is CGC. In my opinion CGC just presents the card the best. I have been considering a search for a 1953 Topps Mickey Mantle. I would probably only buy one in an SGC slab. Normally I would consider buying PSA miss graded to crack and sub to SGC, but the card cost too much so I would only buy one in an SGC slab. Thanks for another interesting and educational video!!!
To me PSA vs SGC is no contest. PSA jacked up the price of their membership, and their turnaround times have gotten ridiculous. They've had a ticket stub of mine since early November, it's been in "Assembly" for several weeks and I have zero indication from them when it will be ready other than an estimated finish date of APRIL 14! That means they could have my stub for over five months. That's not an acceptable timeline for me. They only cater to the Skenes RPA-pullers of the world who can afford same-day service. The speed with which SGC grades, the consistency of their grading, the look of especially vintage cards in the tuxes, and their lightning-fast and courteous customer service puts them head and shoulders above PSA. The only question is how long that continues as SGC gets more and more integrated into the Collectors Cinematic Universe.
Getting cards graded is a real dilemma, in my opinion. I've never sent a card in to be graded. I realize that it would be beneficial for a few reasons but I am not impressed with the abilities of the grading companies. A lot of horror stories on you tube. Great videos Graig, thank you BTW, Jackie Was Safe...
I am so glad you asked this question for next week; I have in the past been an exclusively BVG/BGS submitter due to their subgrades and good customer service which has since declined. When SGC went to the Tuxedo look, I just loved how the cards looked in those slabs and I immediately went to SGC for all my current and future grading. I have never ever used PSA and never will due to their high prices, lame tight slabs, extremely slow return times, horrible customer service, and often times poor grading abilities, especially when it comes to centering. SGC is a far superior product with great customer service and much better return times and prices. I just wish Collectors Universe would not have purchased SGC. I fear Collectors will faze out SGC and monopolize the industry with PSA. In my opinion PSA sucks and I wish another company could gain traction to compete and eventually overtake them.
Did some recent SGC submissions (my first!)…they will be approaching their 1 millionth order. Pretty big accomplishment. I was under the impression, you can send your SGC cards to the PSA vault (just change the shipping address to your vault number/address OR mail them there yourself) and you can sell your SGC cards from the PSA vault on EBay, no? So you can do it from what I can tell, just one different step that’s not automated. 🤔 Correct me if I’m wrong, folks.
I was just thinking about my perspective on both PSA and SGC. Here goes: I buy cards in slabs from both companies (generally a vintage and 80s-90s collector). I have graded with both companies, and have had successes and failures with both companies. PSA: I just tried their grading to eBay service and I do have to say it was fantastic. My cards sold for at or above cops using 7 day auctions, the fee wasn't too bad compared to what I already pay selling myself on eBay, and it was very seamless. PSA's "premium" on sale prices- I am not sure I will ever totally understand it, given their general delays in processing cards versus SGC and perception that they are less consistent than SGC. I can wrap my head around why some people don't like the SGC slab, but I wonder if SGC made their slab look more similar to PSA if that would appease collectors/sellers who don't like current SGC slabs. SGC's turn around time and cost are hard to beat, especially for low to mid end cards I want slabbed. I'd choose SGC for those cards all day and save myself the $10 between grading companies (I am not a PSA Collector Club member). I also understand that people like PSA for the registry, but I don't think modern collectors/flippers care much about that at all. If SGC offered a registry, or if there was a shared registry with both grading companies' data, I could see a scenario where the gap in sale price on certain cards would close (likely vintage). In closing, I try my best to buy the card, not the slab, and don't mind having cards in different slabs in my collection. I have found great looking cards in SGC slabs at significant discounts, so I also wouldn't mind if that price gap continues!
There are so many bells and whistles with psa...and the customer has to pay for those overhead costs. Sgc is simpler and keeps grading costs low. I just want a nice slab with consistent and rational grading...which is what i get with sgc
Hey Graig! Hope you feel better soon! Your right older dudes like MLN battle thru and not like some wussy 20 something year old calling out sick 3 times a month!! Ok… my response now… PRO SGC - Consistent grading on vintage, and in most cases a bump for higher eye Appel cards. - Turn around time for cards, if I just bought cards at a shows & send them off just after having them I want them back quick. This is generally when I submit depending on how many raw cards I pickup. - Black boarders make vintage stand out/POP!! - Overall feel of the SGC slab compared to PSA, only 1 better in my opinion, I have 1 GMA slab and I think the clarity is amazing! - Cheaper to grade - Picked SGC after coming back from the BVG years, never like PSA’s slab look then and I don’t now! Ha so consistency 🤣 - A few downsides to Sgc below …massive grade # on the front. I hope one day all slab companies put the grade AND sub grades on the Back! Let the card speak!😊 - SGC not having a set registry, this feature I’m not sure I would use but you never know. This would push some collectors to complete/compete and bring the value closer to PSA. I’m not fully convinced on PSA vs. SGC in pricing, I think we all know the card will determine a lot, I’d hope. For those that collect like I do 50’s -70’s for the most part… you can be patient to find the SGC card that fits your eye instead of a PSA if you have have issues like I do on continuity and vice versa for the PSA only collectors. Pre-war buy the card! Thanks Graig! This might be my most long winded response🤪
On many levels I’m slabnostic, but I still tend to favor PSA and that’s where I do most of my grading. The Registry is a part of the reason, even though I’m not trying to really compete at a high level. It’s just nice to see my cars in the Registry app. That being said, I literally just left my LCS with my latest SGC order. I was able to grade my Exhibits and Topps Giants without paying a huge premium. I also graded cards that PSA said were min size, but SGC had no issues assigning a number. SGC has a lot going for it and I love the company, but there is no denying that PSA is King of the Hill.
Great Q&A. Thank you for using my comment. Good points all around. Looking forward to your upcoming “experiment” video. I use both…but I do not submit myself. I buy already graded. I love the look of SGC in the 50s and earlier, but would exclude anything from 60s and up just because it was SGC. I wish there were more options. I mean, there are a few other companies, but I just don’t believe that they can compete. I don’t sell cards, so I should not care about who grades the card as long as it’s in my collection. The problem is, I do care. I may consider a Beckett, but honestly, it’s all a risk, right? Ten years ago, Beckett was the top notch grader. Then, poof! Now it’s on many people’s pay no mind list. Thanks for the video!
I get newer cards in PSA but vintage always in SCG . I just have graded cards for the information after I am gone since not everyone in my house knows cards . Heck my wife watched the 1950 World Series episode on TH-cam with me and started laughing because of Yogi Berras name . So she needs all the help !
As a collector who dabbles in both vintage baseball photographs and vintage cards, I have a unique distaste for PSA. Being the only game in town for photos means they get to set the rules for photography authentication. I believe their system is broken and even their authenticator(s) can't get it right far too often. It is probably harder to see on the card side of things at such a grand scale, but it seems like AH houses that submit photos get a bit more leeway and definitely quicker turn around times. I have big problems with any authentication service that has financial incentive to grade higher (or authenticate vs not authenticate) in the form of up charging. Don't let PSA\Collectors become the monopoly that Fanatics is becoming. SGC is great for now and I could see myself submitting on-card vintage autos to CGC/JSA. Their new slabs look great.
Here's a dark horse long term prediction.....sgc slabs will gain in popularity. They are solid consistent graders, slabs look good and the psa premium is a bit overblown. If psa retires the sgc brand, maybe the sgc slabs become unique and sought after
GRAIG great question I use only SGC AND CGC I use them both because of price and turn around time but mostly because both have great customer care…I use CGC for my lesser value cards that I want slabbed as it cost me 8.80 per card and I take advantage of the monthly specials that SGC offer and live both of those companies slab…I’ve never liked PSA and will never use them they take too long and charge too much and their customer service is the worst and really Nate needs to wake up and realize just cause your the standard doesn’t mean you can treat your customers like crap and have horrible turn around times it’s unacceptable period .,.
Being a vintage/prewar collector i do not like that they have the same parent company. There are far too many possible negative outcomes that can occur in the corporate world for me to trust it. It seems to already be happening that sgc will get tripped at every opportunity. No set registry? No onsite grading? No autos? I cant see any reason for the parent company to increase innovation at sgc and have it have any chance to effect any bit of PSAs bottom line. For instance SGC really could use another oversize holder, and maybe 2 or 3. Its a terrible situation for us as collectors. Do we find ourselves 5 or 10 or 20 years from now having to re-grade everything to sell our collections when the time comes because SGC has long since been put out to pasture in the name of the bottom line? By then has psa hiked their costs up to a completely unfair % of value for the privilege?
SGC all day every day never graded with PSA But most of my collection is raw The price and times are important and should be for everyone. People always say PSA gets more value,well yes if your paying more to grade a card,you should ask for more and the time it takes to get them back is just crazy crap. Hopefully status quo for SGC Just like GMC and Chevy,same company but different brands.
Oh man! There was a lot going on this week! My thoughts tie into this week's question! I may do a video on this at some point because I have a lot of thoughts! To this week's question. Part of me thinks that SGC has to feel like the redheaded stepchild at Collectors! And PSA is the favorite. Another part of me thinks that SGC is the annoying little brother who wants to follow big brother around and gets on big brother's nerves. But in a lot of ways is already better than big brother in some aspects. Big brother may feel threatened with little brother's potential because he doesn't want little brother to be better than him. I hope I didn't lose you. The SGC vs PSA argument reminds me of the old Millerlite commercials! Tastes great! Less filling! Most of us fall into one of those camps. In my opinion, most people who adamantly prefer PSA are sellers who are looking for the most value, or are set registry guys, or are sliding more toward the investor side of the scale. I think a lot of collectors prefer SGC. I think I tend to slide more toward the collector side of the scale. It seems like a lot of people who collect in this way tend to prefer SGC. I think SGC is the collectors grading company to a certain extent, and I think it will continue that way moving forward. I think PSA is known for value, the set registry, and the investment grading company to a certain extent and will stay that way moving forward. I think I just wrote my first novel! I have more thoughts.....
I agree that people who buy tens collect the grade not the card. Any time you see what the highest cards sell for its always tens. How many people have tens, especially when PSA uses high power technology that detects flaws that the human eye can't see. If i can't see the flaw, with my eyes, its not there.
I look at PSA and SGC as two completely different companies. Traditionally when a company buys a company that is already in their current space, the newly acquired company is stripped of its assets and used to line the pockets of the new owners while strengthening the new ownership company. I think longer term Collectors is going to use SGC as a niche or lesser grading company while PSA still holds the flagship. I also think Collectors understands the actual value of the SGC company and understood the financials on the company and bought SGC for a good value with upside for the Collectors brand. Let's not forget these are businessmen who work in the collectables space, they may have PCs but they also have degrees in business and finance and will do what makes sense financially. As someone who grades cards i value resale value more than anything else, even cards I keep in my PC. Eventually they will leave me, and i want maximum value for whomever gets my collection. When i grade i send a large majority to PSA as the market has spoken and the values PSA bring across the board are higher than SGC. I know many people discuss midgrade vintage as SGC being equal but most of the stuff I see PSA is still slightly outselling SGC. With PSA bulk being $18.99 (before the $1 price increase) and SGC being $15 a card the extra $4 per card to grade is worth spending as the resale value is worth it. For what i am grading i can wait the extra couple months as I am not trying to time the market or flip prospects. What i do send to SGC are autographed cards from 1997 and previous as PSA will only grade those through PSA/DNA which is $25 bulk and takes 3-4 months whereas SGC will grade them for $15 in a couple weeks. I actually think SGC could lose some share of the market to CGC this year as CGC bulk is around $9 per card with a membership, and memberships come with a grading credit equal to the value of the membership i believe. I think the market has shown there is a demand for a grading company around the $10 range and CGC being at $10 and SGC being at $15, that difference can add up to casual collectors not with the priority of reselling the cards.
Thanks for discussing my comment Graig! As you point out, the choice is slowly being made for us by Collector’s Universe. PSA all the way for high value cards. SGC is becoming a niche brand for vintage cards under $500 in value. I still own SGC slabs but I’ve stopped submitting there. The $4-$5 difference in grading cost is more than made up for by the extra value and liquidity for PSA slabs. Moreover, I’m certain PSA will still exist in 10 years as that is clearly Collector’s preferred brand. I’m a lot less certain SGC will exist in 10 years.
PSA announced they have a backlog, and then they announce a price increase. Smells fishy to me! Add to that, the Paul Skenes debut patch card that people were hunting for was announced as having been pulled last week. Turns out the card was pulled by a kid on Christmas day. The day after the announcement came about the card being pulled, it was announced that the card had already been graded! It was graded as (I kid you not!) A PSA 10! How the hell did PSA, known for slow turnaround times, grade it that quickly! Regarding SGC vs PSA, it seems to me that Collectors Universe doesn't give a damn about SGC. I'm more of a SGC guy than a PSA guy. SGC has better customer service and faster turnaround times. PSA's customers service sucks and so does their turnaround time. Further, the way Collectors favors PSA over SGC despite owning both is shady!
How interesting is this video,, as an experiment I have sent 20 vintage Baseball Cards to Australia’s best Grading site,, I know that’s “counter to “ common wisdom, but I see how it goes
I really wish people would stop talking in circles about grading, it’s getting very tiresome. With that said, people need to repeat the following to themselves ad nauseum: “SGC is owned by Collectors, PSA does not own SGC” It has been stated numerous times by the heads of each company, including everybody’s beloved Peter, that the companies are run almost exclusively independent of each other. What is done by PSA does not have to be done by SGC, and vice versa. Regarding the ebay example, maybe the financial agreement between them and PSA isn’t feasible for SGC, or that they might lack the back end systems to implement it. Nat and PSA have devoted a ton of resources to things that aren’t directly related to the act of grading cards, and it is not a difficult argument to make that it has made them slower. It isn’t a stretch at all that Peter might not want to divert resources away from their card grading efficiency, which is the greatest attraction of that company, in order to catch up to some of the outside things that PSA does. They are different companies, I wish more people could appreciate them as such without tearing down the other
I begrudgingly use SGC. But would NEVER use PSA. They are preposterously slow, they cost too much, their grades are horribly inconsistent, and the cards look like crap in their ugly holders. Prefer raw cards, but if I grade, it’s SGC or nothing.
The industry advantages that PSA has are equal to and as blatant as those given to the Chiefs over the Bills & I’m a Packers fan as you know Graig 🤨😉 I avoid all the grading debate now & just but PSA-slabbed cards
Hi Graig, Where do I stand on PSA vs SGC ? I prefer raw in commons and semi stars. But on larger value cards, it makes no difference what holder it’s in. I pay little attention to what their opinion is on assigned grade. I regrade the card to what I see to determine if it’s good enough for my collection and what I’m willing to pay. That being said, if I ever was going to pay to grade any cards. I would definitely go SGC for any or all of the reasons you’ve discussed in the past. To me it looks like PSA has grown so large they have become “ The Evil Empire “ of the hobby. Or to tamp it down a bit, they add a touch of “ Hollywood “ to the hobby. I like what Mangini has done with his collection using slabs and his personal label. But, due to so many other collectors thoughts on having all the same holders or the registry sets, PSA will stay on top. They will continue to hold SGC down. It’s all ego on their part. They know they are number one in the hobby, so egotistically they also have captured number 2 and want to keep them there. They will only make adjustments to SGC if someone else threatens number 2 spot. Classic business buyout. No mystery here, however it was a sad day in the hobby when PSA bought SGC. The whole topic is like, if you owned an awesome classic car and the discussion becomes, it’s no longer about the car, but the garage you park it in.
I love sgc’s customer service. I once had an issue with a 57 Ernie banks that was damaged during encapsulation and they went as far as calling me to resolve the issue. PSA would never call me… I’ll still send some mid level cards to sgc. However, I’ve been making less and less submissions to sgc. I’ve been feeding the beast (psa) with my recent submissions. There hasn’t been a lot of innovation with SGC recently. I feel like they are being ‘tamed’ by collectors so that the first born (psa) can take the glory. It was inevitable that sgc would be engulfed by collectors/psa. Where do I stand? I prefer psa. Sgc won’t exist in the next couple years. Psa’s hierarchy will get layered.. nat will be at the top.. peter will lead a sports division and maybe another counterpart to lead tcg/comics. This was all part of collectors plans when they bought sgc. Psa just needs headcount to alleviate the backlog issues, thus buying sgc. They also conveniently opened an office next to a dying Beckett brand out in Texas.. collectors didn’t need to buy BGS. Bgs employees will come to them. Psa’s business folks are plotting out their spatial agglomeration.
I can get cards graded by PSA for $25 Canadian. That's $14 plus tax American. In my short experience PSA definitely sells for more. Slower turnaround time is a very minor experience. To me, the only issue with PSA is the duty possibility (13%)
PSA- Apple -SGC- Samsung I do like my Samsung phone, though. It's dropped, plenty of times, but it still works! PSA is; however, paying for the brand. Whether we like it or not, they our the Apple brand in our hobby. And maybe Apple product stinks. Maybe they don't. They still garner higher prices than most. On Google, I read that as of September, 2024. 57.3 percent use a Apple phone. Where as, 23.3 percent (myself in that group) have a Samsung device. Make of that data or information. As you will.
Question; Is it ok to wear a midlife t shirt if I’m older than midlife?
I'm poor. 43 and wear hoodies. Don't care what people think
Yes. It's encouraged. Sorta like how I wear superman shirts, but I can't fly. :-)
I am retired and I wear t-shirts with team logos on them. Never played organized sports past about the age of 12. Nobody questions it
@@MidLifeCards😂😂😂
I was once a PSA only guy. I am now a SGC guy. The reasons are simple. Waiting 3 or 4 months to get my cards back is a deal breaker. I'm old and I don't wait to think that I may live long enough to see my cards again. Customer service at PSA is terrible. My last submission with them they sent two of my cards with labels mixed up so the card of one had the label of other and visa versa. I showed them video of their mistake and asked for two vouchers to refund my expenses and they refused. PSA has gone completely off the rails in their grading. I had been a 35 year customer of PSA and the standards have changed so much that grades are getting in some cases 2 grades lower than before. I have sent in a dozen or so PSA cards that were clearly under graded and sent to SGC for a real grade. Only one card got the same grade and all the others were higher. They say the definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different result. Once an only PSA guy to now a never a PSA guy.
It would be nice if PSA did something, to show, their appreciation for long-time PSA submitters, without doing up charges, and any other additional membership tiers (more money) for it.
Agreed, Coach. PSA grading is now completely insane. WAY off
I buy PSA 95%, SGC 5% mostly on vintage pre 80's
Great video and question, straight to the point. This is where my observations stand:
PSA:
Focus: Some P.C. Collector Realm.
Main Realm: Consumer/ Seller Realm(Fast Money).
**This is why the value of the cards are high.**
SGC/Others:
Main Realm: P.C. Collectors who want Quality/ Generational Appreciation(Investment Money)
Secondary: Seller/Consumer market.
**Quality/ Prestige/ Long-term Value**
So that's why I try to stay w/ SGC mainly, besides their Turn Around time. On
Fair points.
I like SGC because of faster turn around time and the cards look nicer in their slabs . I think that they grade vintage cards better.
Turnaround time is a big deal for me, too.
Agree 100%, and will never pay for a PSA premium over a similar grade in SGC!
I buy cards graded by both SGC and PSA. I’d consider cards graded by other companies as well, but I rarely see any around here. I make a submission to SGC once or twice a year. I have no interest submitting to any other company at this time
Another fine episode. As for this week’s question, it depends. I know, I know. It depends on if I’m buying a graded card or if I’m sending it in to be graded. If I’m buying, I’m slabnostic. I don’t care about the slab as much as the card, or even perceived value of the “deal”. If I’m sending them in, I’m SGC all day every day. This past year I sent orders for both to the same group submitter in the same shipment. The SGC was back before the PSA order had even moved out of their research phase. The icing on the cake was when the modern cards in my PSA order were back a month before my vintage cards, and one of the vintage slabs came back damaged and was another two months wait while they reslabbed it. My vintage cards were gone 4 months. That is why I’m SGC all day every day.
My question is: What happens if/when Peter leaves SGC? What if he goes to CSG, or Beckett? Do those companies instantly get a bump because of the vintage collectors assuming that he will get whichever one following the SGC playbook that was successful?
Thanks again for the video and opportunity to participate.
If Peter leaves SGC, they're doomed.
... will it hurt psa enough to take market shares away from PSA? PSA is all about PSA and only bought SGC to buy out the true competition. They're keeping them down, while still adding their customers' money into PSA's pocket.
What if Peter moves to PSA? 🤔 Would that be a promotion or demotion? 🤣
I think if I were Mr. Turner, I would be asking Ryan why we are buying out PSA’s competition at all. If SGC is truly competitive with PSA without having an eBay deal, without having a set registry, and now without doing on site grading at the National , there is something wrong with the business model/culture at PSA. I would have been finding out why SGC was gaining market share, why SGC has a much faster turnaround time, and after the purchase I think I would have elevated Peter since he’s the one leading the rise of our biggest competitor. Just my opinion.
I am currently frustrated with grading. I have not submitted to PSA since the massive slowdown during COVID. I am not young and I cannot stand waiting months for my cards to return plus none of my cards are worth spending the high prices for a quick turnaround. They also are too inconsistent in their grades. In the last few years I have only submitted to SGC for my vintage card collection from the 1880s- 1960s. I like how the older cards look in the SGC holder. I also plan to send some of my cards from my 1958 autograph set to be authenticated but will use Beckett. I really want Beckett to survive. The tendency toward monopoly in the hobby is very troubling.
GRAIG - First time commenting. I am submitting predominantly to SGC these days. I love the way the black slabs frame vintage cards. Additionally, I collect with my 9 year old daughter who tracks the progress of our submissions on almost a daily basis. The long wait at PSA simply doesn’t hold her attention. We collect largely for the joy of the chase so the current difference in ultimate value of a PSA slab versus an SGC slab is not that important to us. Yours in the hobby - Jason
I appreciate you touching on my prediction. I believe you are correct with the rare items increasing in value. The more common stuff regular collectors buys.. I'm holding to my position. The wind will go out of the hobby sale for much of it.
Great Q&A. I can't wait for this upcoming PSA/SGC video. Looking very forward. Feel better Graig! 🤒😮💨
Another great video Graig. Thanks for sharing your thoughts, much appreciated
Graig - Great video! I always appreciate your direct approach and honesty in what is going on with the hobby. In regards to PSA vs. SGC, I prefer SGC by a long shot. I prefer the look of an SGC slab, prefer how they grade (although they seem to be even tougher lately), and of course their pricing and turnaround is superior to PSA. In looking at VCP lately, it appears as SGC is bringing even more $ in some vintage cards. As a collector of mostly vintage, I have no reason to prefer PSA over SGC.
I almost wonder if Collectors would be better off with a combined registry as you've mentioned previously and then marketing SGC as the "vintage" grading arm and PSA for everything post-1980. Allow each group to play to their strengths. My fear is that PSA will just poach the good vintage graders from SGC (as you mentioned) and then allow SGC to just go away.
Man! A bunch of interesting takes. The grading thing is very frustrating to me. They were way better at it when they were way cheaper. I’ve been dealing with grading since the beginning and they are completely insane now. It’s kind of ruined it for me.
great discussions, Graig!
Thanks. It was a fun one.
I will answer your question, but first some context. I have been experimenting with grading for a few years. I currently have cards in 10 different companies slabs. I have personally sent several orders to both PSA and SGC. After some experimenting, I decided to use PSA for some items I planned to sell. Generally, I don’t like PSA slabs, so I don’t want PC Cards in them. I don’t care about re-sale value for my PC because I plan to keep PC pretty much forever. Also, I prefer raw, but do like some slabs for displaying purposes.
About 6 months ago I started to see a very bad trend with PSA. They seemed to be under grading most cards, and some by several grades. I am not a grader by trade, so that was just my opinion. Since these were cards I planned to sell, I took a sample and cracked them out and sent them to SGC. All of them came back with higher grades in line more with my expectations. After that I decided that I am done with PSA. I don’t have any more gradable cards I am looking to sell now, but if I did I would send them to SGC.
More context - based on yours, and a few other content creators videos I did a search for some low grade PSA vintage football cards recently graded appearing too severely rated. I found two and bought them. Don’t have them in hand yet, but plan to free them from their PSA shells immediately. Probably keep them raw. If I get them graded, my preferred slab for vintage is CGC. In my opinion CGC just presents the card the best.
I have been considering a search for a 1953 Topps Mickey Mantle. I would probably only buy one in an SGC slab. Normally I would consider buying PSA miss graded to crack and sub to SGC, but the card cost too much so I would only buy one in an SGC slab.
Thanks for another interesting and educational video!!!
To me PSA vs SGC is no contest. PSA jacked up the price of their membership, and their turnaround times have gotten ridiculous. They've had a ticket stub of mine since early November, it's been in "Assembly" for several weeks and I have zero indication from them when it will be ready other than an estimated finish date of APRIL 14! That means they could have my stub for over five months. That's not an acceptable timeline for me. They only cater to the Skenes RPA-pullers of the world who can afford same-day service. The speed with which SGC grades, the consistency of their grading, the look of especially vintage cards in the tuxes, and their lightning-fast and courteous customer service puts them head and shoulders above PSA. The only question is how long that continues as SGC gets more and more integrated into the Collectors Cinematic Universe.
Great video Thank you
Thank you graig! Hope u feel better my man! Smh my whole household had this nasty cold going around! 😔
Also Spot on about sgc & Psa 👏🏻💪🏻💯
Thanks. I hope your family feels better soon.
Getting cards graded is a real dilemma, in my opinion. I've never sent a card in to be graded. I realize that it would be beneficial for a few reasons but I am not impressed with the abilities of the grading companies. A lot of horror stories on you tube.
Great videos Graig, thank you
BTW, Jackie Was Safe...
I am so glad you asked this question for next week; I have in the past been an exclusively BVG/BGS submitter due to their subgrades and good customer service which has since declined. When SGC went to the Tuxedo look, I just loved how the cards looked in those slabs and I immediately went to SGC for all my current and future grading. I have never ever used PSA and never will due to their high prices, lame tight slabs, extremely slow return times, horrible customer service, and often times poor grading abilities, especially when it comes to centering. SGC is a far superior product with great customer service and much better return times and prices. I just wish Collectors Universe would not have purchased SGC. I fear Collectors will faze out SGC and monopolize the industry with PSA. In my opinion PSA sucks and I wish another company could gain traction to compete and eventually overtake them.
Did some recent SGC submissions (my first!)…they will be approaching their 1 millionth order. Pretty big accomplishment.
I was under the impression, you can send your SGC cards to the PSA vault (just change the shipping address to your vault number/address OR mail them there yourself) and you can sell your SGC cards from the PSA vault on EBay, no? So you can do it from what I can tell, just one different step that’s not automated. 🤔 Correct me if I’m wrong, folks.
I was just thinking about my perspective on both PSA and SGC. Here goes: I buy cards in slabs from both companies (generally a vintage and 80s-90s collector). I have graded with both companies, and have had successes and failures with both companies. PSA: I just tried their grading to eBay service and I do have to say it was fantastic. My cards sold for at or above cops using 7 day auctions, the fee wasn't too bad compared to what I already pay selling myself on eBay, and it was very seamless. PSA's "premium" on sale prices- I am not sure I will ever totally understand it, given their general delays in processing cards versus SGC and perception that they are less consistent than SGC. I can wrap my head around why some people don't like the SGC slab, but I wonder if SGC made their slab look more similar to PSA if that would appease collectors/sellers who don't like current SGC slabs. SGC's turn around time and cost are hard to beat, especially for low to mid end cards I want slabbed. I'd choose SGC for those cards all day and save myself the $10 between grading companies (I am not a PSA Collector Club member). I also understand that people like PSA for the registry, but I don't think modern collectors/flippers care much about that at all. If SGC offered a registry, or if there was a shared registry with both grading companies' data, I could see a scenario where the gap in sale price on certain cards would close (likely vintage). In closing, I try my best to buy the card, not the slab, and don't mind having cards in different slabs in my collection. I have found great looking cards in SGC slabs at significant discounts, so I also wouldn't mind if that price gap continues!
There are so many bells and whistles with psa...and the customer has to pay for those overhead costs. Sgc is simpler and keeps grading costs low. I just want a nice slab with consistent and rational grading...which is what i get with sgc
Hey Graig! Hope you feel better soon! Your right older dudes like MLN battle thru and not like some wussy 20 something year old calling out sick 3 times a month!! Ok… my response now… PRO SGC
- Consistent grading on vintage, and in most cases a bump for higher eye Appel cards.
- Turn around time for cards, if I just bought cards at a shows & send them off just after having them I want them back quick. This is generally when I submit depending on how many raw cards I pickup.
- Black boarders make vintage stand out/POP!!
- Overall feel of the SGC slab compared to PSA, only 1 better in my opinion, I have 1 GMA slab and I think the clarity is amazing!
- Cheaper to grade
- Picked SGC after coming back from the BVG years, never like PSA’s slab look then and I don’t now! Ha so consistency 🤣
- A few downsides to Sgc below …massive grade # on the front. I hope one day all slab companies put the grade AND sub grades on the Back! Let the card speak!😊
- SGC not having a set registry, this feature I’m not sure I would use but you never know. This would push some collectors to complete/compete and bring the value closer to PSA. I’m not fully convinced on PSA vs. SGC in pricing, I think we all know the card will determine a lot, I’d hope.
For those that collect like I do 50’s -70’s for the most part… you can be patient to find the SGC card that fits your eye instead of a PSA if you have have issues like I do on continuity and vice versa for the PSA only collectors. Pre-war buy the card!
Thanks Graig! This might be my most long winded response🤪
On many levels I’m slabnostic, but I still tend to favor PSA and that’s where I do most of my grading. The Registry is a part of the reason, even though I’m not trying to really compete at a high level. It’s just nice to see my cars in the Registry app. That being said, I literally just left my LCS with my latest SGC order. I was able to grade my Exhibits and Topps Giants without paying a huge premium. I also graded cards that PSA said were min size, but SGC had no issues assigning a number. SGC has a lot going for it and I love the company, but there is no denying that PSA is King of the Hill.
Hi Graig. Another interesting video with many excellent thoughts. I hope you start feeling better. Thanks for sharing my friend, talk soon pal.
Great Q&A. Thank you for using my comment. Good points all around. Looking forward to your upcoming “experiment” video. I use both…but I do not submit myself. I buy already graded. I love the look of SGC in the 50s and earlier, but would exclude anything from 60s and up just because it was SGC. I wish there were more options. I mean, there are a few other companies, but I just don’t believe that they can compete. I don’t sell cards, so I should not care about who grades the card as long as it’s in my collection. The problem is, I do care. I may consider a Beckett, but honestly, it’s all a risk, right? Ten years ago, Beckett was the top notch grader. Then, poof! Now it’s on many people’s pay no mind list. Thanks for the video!
I get newer cards in PSA but vintage always in SCG . I just have graded cards for the information after I am gone since not everyone in my house knows cards . Heck my wife watched the 1950 World Series episode on TH-cam with me and started laughing because of Yogi Berras name . So she needs all the help !
As a collector who dabbles in both vintage baseball photographs and vintage cards, I have a unique distaste for PSA. Being the only game in town for photos means they get to set the rules for photography authentication. I believe their system is broken and even their authenticator(s) can't get it right far too often. It is probably harder to see on the card side of things at such a grand scale, but it seems like AH houses that submit photos get a bit more leeway and definitely quicker turn around times. I have big problems with any authentication service that has financial incentive to grade higher (or authenticate vs not authenticate) in the form of up charging.
Don't let PSA\Collectors become the monopoly that Fanatics is becoming. SGC is great for now and I could see myself submitting on-card vintage autos to CGC/JSA. Their new slabs look great.
They should just merge psa and sgc and buyer can choose the card holder design.
If SGC goes away then we can all send our cards to PSA and get them back a year later. Wouldn't that be great! 😂
Here's a dark horse long term prediction.....sgc slabs will gain in popularity. They are solid consistent graders, slabs look good and the psa premium is a bit overblown. If psa retires the sgc brand, maybe the sgc slabs become unique and sought after
GRAIG great question I use only SGC AND CGC I use them both because of price and turn around time but mostly because both have great customer care…I use CGC for my lesser value cards that I want slabbed as it cost me 8.80 per card and I take advantage of the monthly specials that SGC offer and live both of those companies slab…I’ve never liked PSA and will never use them they take too long and charge too much and their customer service is the worst and really Nate needs to wake up and realize just cause your the standard doesn’t mean you can treat your customers like crap and have horrible turn around times it’s unacceptable period .,.
Being a vintage/prewar collector i do not like that they have the same parent company. There are far too many possible negative outcomes that can occur in the corporate world for me to trust it. It seems to already be happening that sgc will get tripped at every opportunity. No set registry? No onsite grading? No autos? I cant see any reason for the parent company to increase innovation at sgc and have it have any chance to effect any bit of PSAs bottom line. For instance SGC really could use another oversize holder, and maybe 2 or 3. Its a terrible situation for us as collectors. Do we find ourselves 5 or 10 or 20 years from now having to re-grade everything to sell our collections when the time comes because SGC has long since been put out to pasture in the name of the bottom line? By then has psa hiked their costs up to a completely unfair % of value for the privilege?
SGC all day every day
never graded with PSA
But most of my collection is raw
The price and times are important and should be for everyone.
People always say PSA gets more value,well yes if your paying more to grade a card,you should ask for more and the time it takes to get them back is just crazy crap.
Hopefully status quo for SGC
Just like GMC and Chevy,same company but different brands.
Oh man! There was a lot going on this week! My thoughts tie into this week's question! I may do a video on this at some point because I have a lot of thoughts!
To this week's question. Part of me thinks that SGC has to feel like the redheaded stepchild at Collectors! And PSA is the favorite. Another part of me thinks that SGC is the annoying little brother who wants to follow big brother around and gets on big brother's nerves. But in a lot of ways is already better than big brother in some aspects. Big brother may feel threatened with little brother's potential because he doesn't want little brother to be better than him. I hope I didn't lose you. The SGC vs PSA argument reminds me of the old Millerlite commercials! Tastes great! Less filling! Most of us fall into one of those camps. In my opinion, most people who adamantly prefer PSA are sellers who are looking for the most value, or are set registry guys, or are sliding more toward the investor side of the scale. I think a lot of collectors prefer SGC. I think I tend to slide more toward the collector side of the scale. It seems like a lot of people who collect in this way tend to prefer SGC. I think SGC is the collectors grading company to a certain extent, and I think it will continue that way moving forward. I think PSA is known for value, the set registry, and the investment grading company to a certain extent and will stay that way moving forward. I think I just wrote my first novel! I have more thoughts.....
Red headed step child indeed!
I agree that people who buy tens collect the grade not the card. Any time you see what the highest cards sell for its always tens. How many people have tens, especially when PSA uses high power technology that detects flaws that the human eye can't see. If i can't see the flaw, with my eyes, its not there.
I think sgc values will get closer and closer to psa, as they should.
I look at PSA and SGC as two completely different companies. Traditionally when a company buys a company that is already in their current space, the newly acquired company is stripped of its assets and used to line the pockets of the new owners while strengthening the new ownership company. I think longer term Collectors is going to use SGC as a niche or lesser grading company while PSA still holds the flagship. I also think Collectors understands the actual value of the SGC company and understood the financials on the company and bought SGC for a good value with upside for the Collectors brand. Let's not forget these are businessmen who work in the collectables space, they may have PCs but they also have degrees in business and finance and will do what makes sense financially.
As someone who grades cards i value resale value more than anything else, even cards I keep in my PC. Eventually they will leave me, and i want maximum value for whomever gets my collection. When i grade i send a large majority to PSA as the market has spoken and the values PSA bring across the board are higher than SGC. I know many people discuss midgrade vintage as SGC being equal but most of the stuff I see PSA is still slightly outselling SGC. With PSA bulk being $18.99 (before the $1 price increase) and SGC being $15 a card the extra $4 per card to grade is worth spending as the resale value is worth it. For what i am grading i can wait the extra couple months as I am not trying to time the market or flip prospects. What i do send to SGC are autographed cards from 1997 and previous as PSA will only grade those through PSA/DNA which is $25 bulk and takes 3-4 months whereas SGC will grade them for $15 in a couple weeks.
I actually think SGC could lose some share of the market to CGC this year as CGC bulk is around $9 per card with a membership, and memberships come with a grading credit equal to the value of the membership i believe. I think the market has shown there is a demand for a grading company around the $10 range and CGC being at $10 and SGC being at $15, that difference can add up to casual collectors not with the priority of reselling the cards.
Great comment.
You better not be able to tell the difference between a 10 and a 9. The difference is so minute that you can't tell through glass
Thanks for discussing my comment Graig! As you point out, the choice is slowly being made for us by Collector’s Universe. PSA all the way for high value cards. SGC is becoming a niche brand for vintage cards under $500 in value. I still own SGC slabs but I’ve stopped submitting there. The $4-$5 difference in grading cost is more than made up for by the extra value and liquidity for PSA slabs. Moreover, I’m certain PSA will still exist in 10 years as that is clearly Collector’s preferred brand. I’m a lot less certain SGC will exist in 10 years.
PSA announced they have a backlog, and then they announce a price increase. Smells fishy to me! Add to that, the Paul Skenes debut patch card that people were hunting for was announced as having been pulled last week. Turns out the card was pulled by a kid on Christmas day. The day after the announcement came about the card being pulled, it was announced that the card had already been graded! It was graded as (I kid you not!) A PSA 10! How the hell did PSA, known for slow turnaround times, grade it that quickly! Regarding SGC vs PSA, it seems to me that Collectors Universe doesn't give a damn about SGC.
I'm more of a SGC guy than a PSA guy. SGC has better customer service and faster turnaround times. PSA's customers service sucks and so does their turnaround time. Further, the way Collectors favors PSA over SGC despite owning both is shady!
How interesting is this video,, as an experiment I have sent 20 vintage Baseball Cards to Australia’s best Grading site,, I know that’s “counter to “ common wisdom, but I see how it goes
I really wish people would stop talking in circles about grading, it’s getting very tiresome. With that said, people need to repeat the following to themselves ad nauseum:
“SGC is owned by Collectors, PSA does not own SGC”
It has been stated numerous times by the heads of each company, including everybody’s beloved Peter, that the companies are run almost exclusively independent of each other. What is done by PSA does not have to be done by SGC, and vice versa. Regarding the ebay example, maybe the financial agreement between them and PSA isn’t feasible for SGC, or that they might lack the back end systems to implement it. Nat and PSA have devoted a ton of resources to things that aren’t directly related to the act of grading cards, and it is not a difficult argument to make that it has made them slower. It isn’t a stretch at all that Peter might not want to divert resources away from their card grading efficiency, which is the greatest attraction of that company, in order to catch up to some of the outside things that PSA does.
They are different companies, I wish more people could appreciate them as such without tearing down the other
I could never find the 84 donruss mattingly at shows in 89-90 never and had the goods griffey jrrc’s to trade
I never had one until about 3 months ago.
I begrudgingly use SGC. But would NEVER use PSA. They are preposterously slow, they cost too much, their grades are horribly inconsistent, and the cards look like crap in their ugly holders. Prefer raw cards, but if I grade, it’s SGC or nothing.
I love your comments, Mark. Well I respect the consistency of them. 😅
The industry advantages that PSA has are equal to and as blatant as those given to the Chiefs over the Bills & I’m a Packers fan as you know Graig 🤨😉
I avoid all the grading debate now & just but PSA-slabbed cards
Hi Graig, Where do I stand on PSA vs SGC ?
I prefer raw in commons and semi stars. But on larger value cards, it makes no difference what holder it’s in. I pay little attention to what their opinion is on assigned grade. I regrade the card to what I see to determine if it’s good enough for my collection and what I’m willing to pay. That being said, if I ever was going to pay to grade any cards. I would definitely go SGC for any or all of the reasons you’ve discussed in the past. To me it looks like PSA has grown so large they have become “ The Evil Empire “ of the hobby. Or to tamp it down a bit, they add a touch of “ Hollywood “ to the hobby. I like what Mangini has done with his collection using slabs and his personal label. But, due to so many other collectors thoughts on having all the same holders or the registry sets, PSA will stay on top. They will continue to hold SGC down.
It’s all ego on their part. They know they are number one in the hobby, so egotistically they also have captured number 2 and want to keep them there. They will only make adjustments to SGC if someone else threatens number 2 spot.
Classic business buyout. No mystery here, however it was a sad day in the hobby when PSA bought SGC. The whole topic is like, if you owned an awesome classic car and the discussion becomes, it’s no longer about the car, but the garage you park it in.
Hard to argue with any of this, Don. Great comment.
I love sgc’s customer service. I once had an issue with a 57 Ernie banks that was damaged during encapsulation and they went as far as calling me to resolve the issue. PSA would never call me… I’ll still send some mid level cards to sgc. However, I’ve been making less and less submissions to sgc. I’ve been feeding the beast (psa) with my recent submissions. There hasn’t been a lot of innovation with SGC recently. I feel like they are being ‘tamed’ by collectors so that the first born (psa) can take the glory. It was inevitable that sgc would be engulfed by collectors/psa. Where do I stand? I prefer psa. Sgc won’t exist in the next couple years. Psa’s hierarchy will get layered.. nat will be at the top.. peter will lead a sports division and maybe another counterpart to lead tcg/comics. This was all part of collectors plans when they bought sgc. Psa just needs headcount to alleviate the backlog issues, thus buying sgc. They also conveniently opened an office next to a dying Beckett brand out in Texas.. collectors didn’t need to buy BGS. Bgs employees will come to them. Psa’s business folks are plotting out their spatial agglomeration.
Great comment. Will be interesting to see how things play out. I hope SGC sticks around, but only time will tell.
Graig, you MUST get Nat Turner on one of your broadcasts! It would be the most viewed show in TH-cam history!!!
I'd love to.
I can get cards graded by PSA for $25 Canadian. That's $14 plus tax American. In my short experience PSA definitely sells for more. Slower turnaround time is a very minor experience. To me, the only issue with PSA is the duty possibility (13%)
PSA- Apple
-SGC- Samsung
I do like my Samsung phone, though. It's dropped, plenty of times, but it still works! PSA is; however, paying for the brand. Whether we like it or not, they our the Apple brand in our hobby. And maybe Apple product stinks. Maybe they don't. They still garner higher prices than most.
On Google, I read that as of September, 2024. 57.3 percent use a Apple phone. Where as, 23.3 percent (myself in that group) have a Samsung device. Make of that data or information. As you will.