I've been getting comments about when I said 'topres aren't as sharp or strong as cherry mx browns. Let me explain.... It was a weird wording that got misunderstood (and I can completely see why, whoops, I'm sorry about that) I also didn't know Cherry MX Browns aren't tactile though, I've always seen the marketing for those that always advertised them as such aha... So when I said that browns were sharper/stronger than topres, I was talking about the bump feeling. Browns feel very linear to me, but the bump at the bottom feels... sharp, a strong feedback, it feels like it's trying to poke you back with the springs. I think the sudden force bottoming out is why I commented that they're sharp and strong compared to topres. Which is the opposite, the tactile bump of topres is in the middle and feels more drawn out, not to mention that they're rubber domes, which is 'mushier' (not in a bad way) and gentler. Topres definitely have a stronger bump than browns, it's just the 'strong sharpness' of that bump isn't as powerful as cherry mx browns (at least to me, personally). I find browns pretty unpleasant to type or play with because it feels like they're out to stab my fingers. That's all!
Yeah that was me. Just wanted to make a joke out of it because I knew people would find it funny. I understand what you mean now though and I am very sorry!!!
I don't think that is any fault of your own. Cherry browns are tactile but there is a stigma/running joke that they aren't tactile at all and that's in no way your fault or true. People go into them expecting a super tactile switch and are disappointed when that isn't what they are. As you said though, contrary to what people say, browns do have a sharp bump when they actuate. After using both, Topre is definitely more rounded compared to browns and isn't as sharp as you had said. I still think you are in the right and it is more so the people who haven't tried alternatives who are mistaken.
0:32 actually the spring barely causes any tactility and is just used to sense keypresses together with the PCB. 7:30 I found Topre switches to be bad for rhythm games because they are actually pretty heavy. While they have a peak force of around 45g, that tactile bump is very drawn out and thus you have to use quite a bit of force to get over it.
The tactile feel of topre actually comes from the rubber domes, not the springs. The springs in topre keyboards are purely an electrical component used for recognizing key presses.
A correction. The tactility of Topre switch or any rubber dome is not from the springs. The tactility comes from the rubber dome itself. There is a modification to improve tactility for topre switch. It is the BKE Redux domes.
This is a mechanical keyboard, there is no membrane layer than is used for the actuation, as you mention, it actuates before bottoming-out which membranes cant do. Just because it uses a rubber dome doesn't make it a membrane keyboard, and I also don't understand how you're gonna say that it doesn't actuate reliably- these are meant to be one of the most reliable key switches of all time. I just feel like you really didn't do your research before making the review which seems common for your channel.
Topre switches are mechanical. Just because the use rubber domes for the tactility and return force does not mean that they're not mechanical. Topre boards have a PCB and are capacitive, making a standard membrane rubber dome look like a joke in comparison
It's somewhat incorrect to describe this as 'not being a mechanical keyboard' when most people refer to mechanical keyboards as something that isn't limited by cheap printer circuits that are limited to 2-3 key rollover. The HHKB uses a capacitive PCB & conical spring combination which has inherent N-Key Rollover and can accurately be described as being mechanical. It is not merely 'just a rubber dome' The conical spring also provides absolutely no feeling to the board - that is solely the work of the weighted rubber dome and smooth sliders.
I couldn't find the words to put it, cherry mx browns feel linear to me until the end of the press which would be this... sharp? sudden? weird bump like you're pushing against this bump that wants to poke you back. Hence 'sharp'
Topre is probably one of the most controversial switches. It uses rubber domes, which are almost always attributed to membrane keyboards. However, Buckling Spring (which is considered to be a mech switch) uses a membrane as well.
Previously on r/mk: Cars and KEyboards tokaku: "There's definitely a tactile feedback but it's not as sharp or strong as let's say... cherry mx browns" r/mk ah yes the next trend will be memes about tokaku
I bought rubber bump on feet for my HHKB, I don't like the HHKB layout for gaming, I like the Realforce TKL more for gaming. If you really love the Topre Switches you can always order the MX conversion kit so you can use normal keycaps, but you do have to order a special stabilizer for the spacebar which is pretty spendy, but I do love being able to use any keyset I want, but I wouldn't recommend doing that unless you love the HHKB and plan on sticking with it. I did it because it is my keeb I take to work. I can link if interested.
I have the same opinion on this. I prefer typing on Topre (I use realforce 30g) rather than mx red any day in a week. However, I would pick cherry keyboard for music game. Topre has a high actuation/release point so jackhammer is hard to do on them. You have to release almost all the way to press them again.
i wrote a review about topre switches for the etterna subreddit and i like that my conclusions are the same as yours. good for typing but horrid for rhythm games. it should be noted that the HHKB has a polling rate of 125hz with the stock controller - you can buy an aftermarket one but it doesn't amend the problem very well. also, release timings are messed up because of the way the topre switch works, which means LNs in o!m or minedodge in etterna will not work with a topre keyboard.
That's a pretty interesting sponsor for once! Edit: I mean compared to VPNs/audible/online courses and such, your other sponsors are very cool as well of course :p
agreed with everything you said about topre and OSU, actually really interested too use the knock off topre now, or change my domes for my topre to a different weight to see how that would go
I have the exact board Squashy used for his test. It is my favorite keyboard to use and is 100% better than original topre boards. Topre keyboards aren't designed to make you a fast typist and are notoriously bad for gaming. This is because they're designed to make typing easier not necessarily faster. I can easily type faster on MX, Opticals, hell even membranes. However I do not enjoy the typing experience and my hands fatigue quickly. With practice you can get faster with Topre switches but you'll still be faster on nearly anything else.
The cable actually is mini USB, not micro USB. That's because the keyboard can also be used as a USB hub :) Also, the keyboard Squashy talked about (Niz Plum) is *not* a "knock-off". It's just another electro capacitive keyboard, but I wouldn't call it a clone or something, since it is pretty different from the HHKB/Topre switches.
I actually think blues are better than speed because the tactile bump gives you a more clear area of where to stream without bottoming out. Just my opinion tho.
Just a warning for any US buyee customers, EMS international shipping is down meaning the only other available shipping method is either DHL or seamail. These are significantly more expensive and will take much longer to arrive at your door.
I have the same feeling with topres when it comes to osu I just noticed not really feeling slower, but accuracy just dropped to the roof and and a lot of "fingerlocking" or late taps happen but yeah they feel godlike for typing
i have multiple topre keyboards and 2 topre clone keyboards and i can say 100% that topre clones are nowhere near as good as real topre my ranking (best to worst) would be this: 1. leopold fc980c 2. realforce 87u 55g 3. realforce hipro 104ug 4. hhkb 5. topre knock off switches in my opinion, topre clones feel pretty garbage in comparison to actual topre and are really nothing like the real thing.. topre knock offs feel a bit mushy and overall feel way less solid to type on and are a bit awkward feeling in comparison with real topre. do i hate the topre knock offs? no, but i would take an actual topre keyboard any day
does mechanical keyboard under 30$ exist? i really need a better keyboard but my parents wont really buy me stuffs becuase they think this keyboard (membrane) is fine and its still not broken. I cant even get a decent score on osu TwT
You could probably get used to the weird actuation with some practice, but then again there's not much reason to use these over linear switches for rhythm games
I'm Brazilian..and my english is a little bad *She talking about the keyboard and the functions* Me:👁👄👁 yeah..i didn't understand nothing,but good video!
I cannot do spinners because my desk is SHAKY and also my desk is too high so it hurts my back when I play kbm games so I kinda give up on playing osu until I get a different desk life is pain
I've been getting comments about when I said 'topres aren't as sharp or strong as cherry mx browns. Let me explain.... It was a weird wording that got misunderstood (and I can completely see why, whoops, I'm sorry about that) I also didn't know Cherry MX Browns aren't tactile though, I've always seen the marketing for those that always advertised them as such aha...
So when I said that browns were sharper/stronger than topres, I was talking about the bump feeling. Browns feel very linear to me, but the bump at the bottom feels... sharp, a strong feedback, it feels like it's trying to poke you back with the springs. I think the sudden force bottoming out is why I commented that they're sharp and strong compared to topres. Which is the opposite, the tactile bump of topres is in the middle and feels more drawn out, not to mention that they're rubber domes, which is 'mushier' (not in a bad way) and gentler.
Topres definitely have a stronger bump than browns, it's just the 'strong sharpness' of that bump isn't as powerful as cherry mx browns (at least to me, personally). I find browns pretty unpleasant to type or play with because it feels like they're out to stab my fingers.
That's all!
Thanks for clearing it up, was a bit confused when you said cherry mx browns
Thank you makes it a lot clearer
Yeah that was me. Just wanted to make a joke out of it because I knew people would find it funny. I understand what you mean now though and I am very sorry!!!
browns are marketed as tactile but are just sandy reds
I don't think that is any fault of your own. Cherry browns are tactile but there is a stigma/running joke that they aren't tactile at all and that's in no way your fault or true. People go into them expecting a super tactile switch and are disappointed when that isn't what they are.
As you said though, contrary to what people say, browns do have a sharp bump when they actuate. After using both, Topre is definitely more rounded compared to browns and isn't as sharp as you had said. I still think you are in the right and it is more so the people who haven't tried alternatives who are mistaken.
ah, i love it when you say 'sample text' at the beginning of every video! makes me feel so at home
I FORGOT OKAY
@@tokaku imagine editing text in 2020 😤🙄🙄🙄
Add a public reply...
@@tokaku it's okay, it's a meme now! 😂
Besides, we know that you would otherwise put "hewwo everybody ^_^"
Yes
tokaku: "There's definitely a tactile feedback but it's not as sharp or strong as let's say... cherry mx browns"
r/mk: oh no
Wait Cherry MX Browns are tactile?
Lol Mx browns
@@Gornius yeah but they suck if you want tactile.
Browns are my favourite linear switches!
@@Frugelel joke
2:55
"There's definitely a tactile feedback but it's not as sharp or strong as let's say... cherry mx browns"
r/mk: *loads gun*
Have used cherry mx browns, can confirm that they're linear switches
Yeah was she joking or what
ow no. "hewwo everbody" got replaced with sample text.
QwQ
Sample text
Sample text
Add a public reply...
BOTTOM TEXT
@@Inn0IWNL
Lube the sliders and stabs it will make a huge difference for typing feel.
yeah, have fun doin that
have fun lubing electrocapacitive switches lmao gonna take you a few weeks
2:55 More importantly what is that alien mouse you have?!?
idk but the one in front is the logitech g302 daedalus prime *dont buy it its 5 years old*
some cheap chinese mouse maybe Rexus
@@CJSKB *don't buy it because second hand it's pricey
@@CJSKB The G302 is a great mouse even today. It has an amazing shape for claw grip users.
@@marshi4683 It is, but there are many more options that are better and cheaper
0:32 actually the spring barely causes any tactility and is just used to sense keypresses together with the PCB.
7:30 I found Topre switches to be bad for rhythm games because they are actually pretty heavy. While they have a peak force of around 45g, that tactile bump is very drawn out and thus you have to use quite a bit of force to get over it.
oh right, I forgot to edit that part of the video. I realised afterwards that the spring doesn't cause it, it's the domes themselves. I think?
@@tokaku Yep! It's the domes themselves. People have even made replacement domes for Topre keyboards that have different tactility.
3:20
Me typing an essay right befire it's due
Yeah i would assume that you would be typing if you're writing an essay
"tactile feedback is not as sharp as, lets say cherry mx browns"
Dafuq when i tried mx browns i thought:"why is this red switch so scratchy?"
The tactile feel of topre actually comes from the rubber domes, not the springs. The springs in topre keyboards are purely an electrical component used for recognizing key presses.
A correction. The tactility of Topre switch or any rubber dome is not from the springs. The tactility comes from the rubber dome itself. There is a modification to improve tactility for topre switch. It is the BKE Redux domes.
I love the more frequent uploadsss
This is a mechanical keyboard, there is no membrane layer than is used for the actuation, as you mention, it actuates before bottoming-out which membranes cant do. Just because it uses a rubber dome doesn't make it a membrane keyboard, and I also don't understand how you're gonna say that it doesn't actuate reliably- these are meant to be one of the most reliable key switches of all time. I just feel like you really didn't do your research before making the review which seems common for your channel.
Topre switches are mechanical. Just because the use rubber domes for the tactility and return force does not mean that they're not mechanical. Topre boards have a PCB and are capacitive, making a standard membrane rubber dome look like a joke in comparison
It's somewhat incorrect to describe this as 'not being a mechanical keyboard' when most people refer to mechanical keyboards as something that isn't limited by cheap printer circuits that are limited to 2-3 key rollover.
The HHKB uses a capacitive PCB & conical spring combination which has inherent N-Key Rollover and can accurately be described as being mechanical.
It is not merely 'just a rubber dome'
The conical spring also provides absolutely no feeling to the board - that is solely the work of the weighted rubber dome and smooth sliders.
Oh no tokaku really didn't just say "a tactile feedback thats not as strong as let's say cherry mx browns"
which is definitely not true lmao
I couldn't find the words to put it, cherry mx browns feel linear to me until the end of the press which would be this... sharp? sudden? weird bump like you're pushing against this bump that wants to poke you back. Hence 'sharp'
tokaku i personally cannot feel any sense of tactility and browns, ig topre has tainted me
@@tokaku I'm about to blow up
3:30 love that editing for the screen.
3:36, me at 11: 59 when the essay is due tomorrow
_s_*a*_m_*p*_l_*e* _t_*e*_x_*t* s on the subtitle always get me offguard 😂
You mistyping so much at 3:37 made me so happy to know I’m not the only one who has no idea where my number keys are
Topre is probably one of the most controversial switches.
It uses rubber domes, which are almost always attributed to membrane keyboards. However, Buckling Spring (which is considered to be a mech switch) uses a membrane as well.
Buckling Springs aren't considered mechanical. It's just most people thought it was
Previously on r/mk: Cars and KEyboards
tokaku: "There's definitely a tactile feedback but it's not as sharp or strong as let's say... cherry mx browns"
r/mk ah yes the next trend will be memes about tokaku
I bought rubber bump on feet for my HHKB, I don't like the HHKB layout for gaming, I like the Realforce TKL more for gaming. If you really love the Topre Switches you can always order the MX conversion kit so you can use normal keycaps, but you do have to order a special stabilizer for the spacebar which is pretty spendy, but I do love being able to use any keyset I want, but I wouldn't recommend doing that unless you love the HHKB and plan on sticking with it. I did it because it is my keeb I take to work. I can link if interested.
I have the same opinion on this. I prefer typing on Topre (I use realforce 30g) rather than mx red any day in a week. However, I would pick cherry keyboard for music game. Topre has a high actuation/release point so jackhammer is hard to do on them. You have to release almost all the way to press them again.
I like how the name implies malicious uses however tokaku jus be playing Osu! With it lol
i wrote a review about topre switches for the etterna subreddit and i like that my conclusions are the same as yours. good for typing but horrid for rhythm games.
it should be noted that the HHKB has a polling rate of 125hz with the stock controller - you can buy an aftermarket one but it doesn't amend the problem very well. also, release timings are messed up because of the way the topre switch works, which means LNs in o!m or minedodge in etterna will not work with a topre keyboard.
0:00 “sample text”
Me: nice
For anyone still wondering, yes this is geohot's keyboard.
That's a pretty interesting sponsor for once!
Edit: I mean compared to VPNs/audible/online courses and such, your other sponsors are very cool as well of course :p
“Sample text”
I love your videos totaku
2:36 YOOO IT'S AN ALCATROZ MOUSE. I bought one for like 2 dollars and it has survived 7 years
Ah yes youtube gods bless me. I open yt and the first thing i see is tokaku video
agreed with everything you said about topre and OSU, actually really interested too use the knock off topre now, or change my domes for my topre to a different weight to see how that would go
i like the sample text that reoccurs in videos once in a while
I have the exact board Squashy used for his test. It is my favorite keyboard to use and is 100% better than original topre boards.
Topre keyboards aren't designed to make you a fast typist and are notoriously bad for gaming. This is because they're designed to make typing easier not necessarily faster. I can easily type faster on MX, Opticals, hell even membranes. However I do not enjoy the typing experience and my hands fatigue quickly. With practice you can get faster with Topre switches but you'll still be faster on nearly anything else.
every time tokaku mentions not being paid for a sponsorship I die a little inside...bro you deserve so much more
Good review
while they have all these modern keyboards
i have a normal keyboard
but a gaming mouse! (i got it in Christmas 2016, AND IT'S STILL PERFECT OMFG)
I have the hhkb hybrid type-s. It doesn't even come with a cable! It's definitely an improvement in many factors over the previous generation
tokaku's typing speed : freedom dive level
The cable actually is mini USB, not micro USB. That's because the keyboard can also be used as a USB hub :)
Also, the keyboard Squashy talked about (Niz Plum) is *not* a "knock-off". It's just another electro capacitive keyboard, but I wouldn't call it a clone or something, since it is pretty different from the HHKB/Topre switches.
interesting! never knew, I had an idea it was inspired and their switches are similar but not the 'original'
I actually think blues are better than speed because the tactile bump gives you a more clear area of where to stream without bottoming out. Just my opinion tho.
Membrane keyboard, laptop, or mechanical/clicky keyboard?
laptops are better because they use scissor switches, although some of them have terrible N key roll over so please test and watch out
shell out for gateron boards they feel really nice
@@tokaku wait scissor switches are better than mechanical? Also that explains why i am faster in my laptop
Just a warning for any US buyee customers, EMS international shipping is down meaning the only other available shipping method is either DHL or seamail. These are significantly more expensive and will take much longer to arrive at your door.
Holy shit that thumbnail is unbelievably good
that typing test was just a fat flex in disguise
wow i'm early for tokaku's video for once
Good video my man
Hey tokaku if you really want good things for rhythm games, get a mechanical keypad with switches of your choosing. Just a small recommendation
Every time I see the videos on HHKB it sounds like something fit to me, but the price is just, so high even for a used ones 😂
the plum switches (knockoff ones) are very light and feel linear (theyre like cherry speed silents basically), whereas topre has a hard bump
I have the same feeling with topres when it comes to osu
I just noticed not really feeling slower, but accuracy just dropped to the roof and and a lot of "fingerlocking" or late taps happen
but yeah they feel godlike for typing
i'm happy i'm one of the first 2 viewers on this video
Me too
If torre switches are less tactile than my browns like she says then they're linear with no tactile bump
i have multiple topre keyboards and 2 topre clone keyboards and i can say 100% that topre clones are nowhere near as good as real topre
my ranking (best to worst) would be this:
1. leopold fc980c
2. realforce 87u 55g
3. realforce hipro 104ug
4. hhkb
5. topre knock off switches
in my opinion, topre clones feel pretty garbage in comparison to actual topre and are really nothing like the real thing.. topre knock offs feel a bit mushy and overall feel way less solid to type on and are a bit awkward feeling in comparison with real topre. do i hate the topre knock offs? no, but i would take an actual topre keyboard any day
does mechanical keyboard under 30$ exist? i really need a better keyboard but my parents wont really buy me stuffs becuase they think this keyboard (membrane) is fine and its still not broken. I cant even get a decent score on osu TwT
The sound test is the most satisfying portion
wait, they removed some keys and upped the price?
Have you tried hitting your keyboard properly and not slapping it on an angle so it slides all over your desk?
Prepare for endless discussions on whether or not this is 'mechanical'!~
Is it just me or have i only now noticed joylene's pinky finger (when doing the test with sound voltex)
The motospeed keyboard seems nice, do you know what the product name is called?
Another Squashy and Tokaku collab???
rubbre domay~
Rubbreh domeh!
i love the new hewwo everybody text at the bottom
Why would people use the delete key more than the backspace key?
bruh i have to use cherry silent reds cause roomates complain about sound, and it feels so mushy
what is that thing above the keyboard with the knob at 0:27 ?
0:00 *sample text*
the happy keyboard kinda sounds like my gateron brown switches on my keyboard
what kind of mouse is that the one with the nucleus one?
ah yes sample text what a great way to start the video😎😎
bro cherry mx browns are so t a c t i l e
3:20 hackerman
You could probably get used to the weird actuation with some practice, but then again there's not much reason to use these over linear switches for rhythm games
"not mechanical"
But... They are mechanical :(
most expensive rubber domes on the planet
no they're not
You really got tzechi to play speed of link on taiko lol
Nice im early btw love ur content
What font do you use for your subtitles??
Does anyone else watch Tokaku even thought they don’t really play any rhythm games?
You should try ordering super cheap gaming keyboards from taobao and see what you get
I also have an HHKB Pro 2, and I also find that it's difficult to play osu with. Not sure exactly why.
Discord mods while watching the typeracer part :
"that's all you can do ?"
can I play sdvx on my notebook? can I have the link for that?
every single video starts with hewo ewibodi
"My acc dropped a lot Madge"
also tokaku: singletaps streams
those bursts on the singletap review are slow though, like it's slow enough to be singletapped by tkk
I'm Brazilian..and my english is a little bad
*She talking about the keyboard and the functions*
Me:👁👄👁
yeah..i didn't understand nothing,but good video!
wheres the arrow keys???
you kind of really want arrow keys if youre using something that doesnt take mouse inputs (all linux terminal emulators)
faster writing but no arrow keys?
watch my face drop as i try to undo using this and instead feel my pinky hitting solid plastic
2:56 MX Browns XD
I cannot do spinners because my desk is SHAKY and also my desk is too high so it hurts my back when I play kbm games so I kinda give up on playing osu until I get a different desk life is pain
And well whos is best keyboard "not mechanical or mecanical keyboard"?
2:37 is that a shidenkai? lets goo
I have no clue what this means but i’ll like it anyway.
I saw Gandadore Mira-chan on quaver gameplay there
buyee seems like samurai buyer
Can you help me
My quaver wont open idk why