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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 มิ.ย. 2024
- Why Aynokoji VS Johan in overall outsmarting Isn't Close. They are both sly, manipulative, and cunning. They are the peaks of their verse in terms of intelligence and manipulation. But, who really is the smarter character? Ayanokoji from Classroom of the Elite or Johan from Monster. I have the TRUE answer to your question.
#classroomoftheelite #ayanokoji #monster #johan #anime #manga
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The video teaches you more about CLASSROOM OF THE ELITE AND MONSTER, Ayanokoji Kiyotaka Johan Liebert and other characters. Outsmarting, Intelligence, Manipulation and Psychology.
Not a review, not an analysis, not a video essay, but a discussion. Which has the best characters like Ayanokoji Kiyotaka, Johan Liebert, Tenma Kenzo, and Horikita Suzune. A video on CLASSROOM OF THE ELITE X MONSTER - Who's Smarter?
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Who do you think wins?
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koji tbh, he's just HIM
Johan is better than Ayanokoji. If you are talking about playing just mental chess within particular set of rules like in a game then it is my guy Ayanokoji. However if it is about making a plan to kill people then it goes to Johan.
To truly test intelligence you have to give the combatants a well defined hypothetical goal to think about a thought experiment. Ayanokoji is my favourite character but I give the edge to Johan because he was able to use or kill without showing many emotional repercussions. Ayanokoji maybe be able to treat people as tools but never did any of his actions ever resulted in anyone dying.
If however Ayanokoji uses Dr Tenma to end Johan then the win automatically goes to Ayanokoji.
Ayanokoji is not a murderer whereas Johan is a murderer and it is that difference in perspective, knowledge and view is what makes Johan better.
@@walnoemispoyt5604 what are you talking about? If anyone is able to kill without emotional repercussions it's Ayanokoji; if you'd read volume 0 you would know that his poker face and emotional numbness are as high as they get. He was able to maintain a steady heart rate after almost beating 6 professional fighters to death and when asked why he did this, he simply said that he was ordered to kill if he wanted, he just didn't see the need to. We can see from this that Ayanokoji is perfectly fine with killing people despite never directly killing anyone.
You can't call Johan better simply because he has killed someone before that's just stupid. There are more important factors such as intelligence, connections, and physical ability all of which undeniably go to Ayanokoji, meaning that he claps that nerd Johan any day.
@@cotefan It does look like Ayanokoji have the ability to beat up people but his first instinct even in that battle was not to kill. Johan would have chosen the knife not the baton if the mission was to kill vs not battle. Ayanokoji is not a murderer. Perfectly fighting has nothing to do with assassination techniques. Fighting techniques are related to killing techniques but they are different set of skills.
It does look like if Ayanokoji was in a CQC combat that he would wreck Johan but to kill is an intelligence game. Besides the video is asking who is more intelligent and all I am saying is that the thought experiment has to be well defined to actually examine ones intelligence.
On pure intelligence with respect to fabricating other people to kill without lifting a finger that is Johan. Ayanokoji was never able to control Koenji and although Ayanokoji mentioned that he fabricated his fight with Ryuen the author gave him plot armour to protect Ayanokoji's intelligence to make him seem smart when there was really no other way for Ayanokoji to handle the Kei situation.
Fighting ability does not equate to intelligence.
@@cotefan Ayanokoji would lose to Johan because he would allow Johan to try to instill fear in Ayanokoji and it is that lapse in judgment that would cost Ayanokoji his life. If there is anyone who can instill fear in Ayanokoji it is Johan hands down as he is known as the greatest villain in all of anime!
Johan is far ahead of Ayanokoji when it comes to intelligence and psychological warfare.
Just a friendly reminder the goat Koenji was benching 200kg for reps at the end of his workout.
While laughing as well. crazy
Bro was also carring a wild boar approx 400-450 kg .
@@Redhestle No boar weight mac 100 kg but still Chadenji was doing it like it was nothing truly perfect existence
7:46 in the manga anime Johan was capable of manipulate several psycos just by analyzing them based on their morals and wiev of society, not only, Johan had the capability of analizing the weakness of every adult in the kinderhim, if it wasn't so it would be untealistic that he conviced firstly the adulta to kill the director and then to kill each other, not to mention that Johan convinsed a PTSD to kill his family just by meeting him in a bar, for doing so you sould analyze the person in a psyco-analysis way then in the moral one and finaly the manipulation
I usually hate this kind of video… but you are a person full of knowledge and insane analytical skills. You are not just a regular anime reviewer. I like your reasoning, keep going ❤. You are on my top tear You-tuber list already with 1-3 videos I watched.
Thank you!
22:00 Johan is like Moriarty, he is a lord of crime, he strarted killing at young age to protect his siter and doing so he gained hundreds of victims and unaolved homicides, after the anime, Johan had killed twohundred people, and a hundrend people were suspected to be killed because of the lack of evidence, even Lunge said that the Johan's organization isnt human but devil, after his criminal scenes there was nothing else, the only proofs were hypotesis from the police and from the principal caratchers who analyzed Johan's crime career, like the professor Gillen.
4:15 No one of the kids knew Johan because he was kept in a secret place and he was always on drugs just for the fear that the monster could arise. So he didn't knew anyone exept some adult of the place.
Btw a couple very good feats for Johan's EP include, The Springer's killer, Kinderheim/Christoff, Anna, Tenma, The Doctor(killer), Blue Sophie etc. There are more but these are a few.
oo so these meant i am true that johan is better
This is just EP
Johan is better in eq not overall outsmarting@@Kamado_kualops
@@Kamado_kualopsit is interpretation based. Johan takes EQ, SQ, Manipulation, Planning, Deception and Foresight imo. The rest idrk
@@GeniusOfTomorrow okay i also thing the same but i do not cARE BECAUSE they are not coming to safe me in my life
35:05 it should have been “ The Monster or The Demon"
Very insightful video. Can you please explain to me what the difference between strategy and planning is?
Planning is the main preparation phase for the strategy and strategy is the execution of said plan
@@NuchaReviews Planning is coming up with an idea. Strategy is how exactly you'd go about putting that plan into action. Executing is doing said plan.
Epic video ❤
Bro got Ayanokoj analysis level☕🗿
Make a patrick jane video pls good vid btw
My Opinion
EQ: Johan Full Scale IQ: Koji
SQ: Johan Intelligence: Koji
Social skills: Johan Strategy: Koji
Reasoning: Johan Perception: Koji
Thinking: Johan Trap evasion: Koji
Planning: Johan Perception: Koji
Deception: Johan Knowledge: Koji
Manipulation: Johan Adaptibality: Koji
Setting up traps: Johan Trap evasion: Koji
Psychology: Johan
Foresight: Johan
Experience: Johan
Execution: Johan
Methods: Johan
Distribution is good but I don't think we have seen any reasoning or thinking feat by johan since we didn't see his pov
Koji takes Reasoning and Thinking
his psychological analysis on his victims is very impressive
@@Akiyama_33 fair
in what way does johan take thinking and reasoning?
they are on the same level and we are only at year 2 in cote, imagine year 3...end of series koji will no diff johan
We hope Kinugasa cooks in Y3
@@NuchaReviews just read my perspective
It wont be happen bro we need unıversity arc. What will koji do ıf johan pulls m249 to koji in order to kill kojigoat
Johan is so hard to scale for me
johan eats koji alive in a battle of wits
its not even remotely close
bro is the epitome of manipulation
in manipulation only johan wins he gets slammed in general outsmarting
@@mqurxhave you seen monster? Johan is just as smart as koji
@@tokiuchiha8845 nope his feats are offscreen and has only shown good manipulation
Nigga I can name 5 characters at minimum better than him in manipulation lmao
@@mqurx go watch that first bruv
I like your videos a lot keep making more videos
Thanks, more videos are coming for sure
Ruenheim, Munich library, hospital candy strategies not even mentioned properly. Koji doesnt even take strategy from Johan 😭. Just some intellect points at max
Dawg koji outdoes midhan in strategy by far lil bro, midhan overrated featless off-screen fodder
@@dislikebutton543 🤓 🤡☝️. Bro is stuck in early 2023
@@dislikebutton543 Cry more midkoji fanboy
People tend to overrate Johan a lot. He's just a big fish in a small pond
It's about how well written the character is
so is ayanokoji
You just describe Ayanakoji, as your verse takes place in high school
@batmann348 the pond of ANHS is bigger than the world of Monster. Literally, the average joe in COTE like Ryuen is smarter than anyone in Monster that is investigating Johan, heck, even Johan wouldn't even be number 2 at ANHS.
That's why people don't like COTE, it's because it's unrealistic, it's stupid, and people don't like that these high schoolers are smarter than the smartest characters in these better written, more realistic and more terrifying stories.
To be fair, Johan himself is as unrealistic as any COTE character, but he works only cuz of the mystery surrounding him, I bet you anything if we knew more about Johan, nobody would view him as that smart.
bro started an underground business at the age of 15 that converted illegal money to legal money convinced someone to kill them self brain washed multiple children and adults and left no traces of murders except for the ones to lure tenma to him for his mastermind plan
Patrick jane vs johan liebert please
Kaito Kid vs Shinichi kudo or Baku madarame vs Hal
Not even a big fan of Ayanokoji but he no diffs Johan Midbert. Johans only hype comes from the viewers imagination🤣 take that somewhere else.
Says a complete Ayotard😂
Overall Intelligence In Every Aspect Is By Far Ayanokoji
Linguistic, Social, Emotional, Interpersonal, Naturalistic, Existencial? I’m not attacking u or anything in this way, but imo Johan easily takes this points, and takes espacial Imo, but I understand the people who thinks Koji takes this one
@@AiMinhaVoiadaand Ayanokoji takes linguistic, crystallised, fluid, academial, intrapersonal, musical and bodily-kinesthetic.
@@jackthezodiac6136 why linguistic?
@@AiMinhaVoiada oops sorry not linguistic, that definitely goes to Johan. I was meant to say mathematical. My bad
@@jackthezodiac6136 chill man, W opinion btw 🔥
Koji simply better 🗿
I think Nucha You did not bring alot of Johan's feats. But I am kinda okay with answer but i think nor Koji nor johan draw their max abilities and the thing is that johan even strategizes the plan of his death. johan is killing which is different . Johan when in classroom of elite by his manipulation tactics he will take control of students and teachers and get ayanakoji expelled as we can see he did killed 50 people by just words (tell me is this sensible or not Nucha) one i noticed that the 2004 anime is still in hype what a character they made by only 30mins visible johan in this whole anime. i think if their second part of it johan will just kill koji.
johan is killing and koji is manipulating with higher schoolers while he has an adult kownledge it is different
just agnore this
Johan decimates this edgy teenager
Nah.
How is he edgy? (I’m genuinely curious because I see a lot of people say this)
@@Monsterhunter16 Haters who only watched the anime, or not even that and think that Koji is edgy for not having emotions, although he does have lmao
@@l4ut4r06 that’s what I was thinking because his upbringing literally explains why he is the way that he is, it’s pretty known in psychology that upbringings similar to ayanokoji’s result in psychological issues(there’s many paths the mind can take in these cases, but one of the more common ones is the route ayanokoji’s took)
@@Monsterhunter16 Yes, it's funny how so many people have no idea about Koji's writing and how he is the opposite of what they think, he's a tragic character lmao, he has emotions, he doesn't want to be the way he is, and all his psychology has an explanation
Koji underrated ngl
FSIQ (VCI debatable) - Koji
EP EE - Johan
EM EP - Koji
SQ - Johan
thinking - koji
reasoning - koji
planning - johan
strategy - Koji
Manipulation - Johan
Deception - Johan
Gardener's theory of multiple intelligences - Koji
Miscellaneous (Observation, Perception, Psychology knowledge) - Koji
Overall
FS - Koji
IRL + Influnce - Johan
NFS - Koji
Mind games - Johan
C&M - Koji
Outsmarting - Koji High diff (+)
NFS and C&M to Ayanokoji??☠️
Overrated 😂
Both are General Zod victims.
Alien fodder
'ENDLESS' victims ( the character i created in my dreams solos everything(not even joking)
Tell me you didn't read the johan doc without telling me you didn't read it
i have the entire johan doc with me
i still have koji high diffing him
people have opinions buddy
@@Gintoki-dg2nr Having the Johan doc and reading it are two entirely different things lil bro
@@X_ADI_how is that different he said he read it and has it but has koji high diffing your making no sense blud
@@Avery_casyrdark Alright? Let's debate then
@@Avery_casyrdark Alright, idk if you wanna debate or not but for just clarity, let me state johan's feats
FSIQ:
VCI- Tenma learns that Johan was taught French and English by
an older man. And by the time of his disappearance, Johan was already
fluent in these languages. Johan wrote to Jurgen's in a letter with exact instructions for the location of the basement, what he should do. He saw that the killer was experiencing strong emotions associated with the murder of the jopp family. This allowed him to figure out the nephew was the killer of the Yopps, and also found out the motivation of the killer. Lunge also later on reconstructed the scene where the body of the husband and wife lay and the patterns he had created. Schubart began to go blind therefore hired students from the university of Munich to read him books in Latin, and Johan decided to enter the university of Munich and began to read Schuvald's books on Fridays to establish a good connection with him. And also began to manipulate Faren so that he deceived Shuvald. Johan knew he wouldn't have a problem with Schuvald being depressed. Indeed, in the biography of Shuvald, Johan noticed that Shuvald
was bankrupt three times, and then disappeared
somewhere, after which he returned with a restored
state. He realized that the place (the Forest) gave him
peace. And he used this information to restore the
emotional state of Shuvald. He also took into account
the information that there were apples in the forest,
because it was through the apple that Johan convinced
Schuvald that the forest had not lost its beauty and
remained the same. Johan used the apple as evidence
that the forest has not lost its beauty, which means
that it can be evaluated as a visual solution to tasks in
order to control Schuvald's emotions and issue a
positive response. He created his strategies and learned
information through observation and surveillance of the
situation. For example, we saw that Johan, studying
information about Schuvald, for example, he took into
account the fact that in old age he begins to go blind, so he
hires students from the University of Munich to read him
books in Latin. Therefore, Johan entered the University of
Munich, and before that he had a lot of surgery in order to
enter there. He came up with a strategy (based on
information about his missing son) where Shuvald would
make him secretary. We also saw that Johan was very
careful in his strategy, for example he noticed that
Schuvald's acquaintance did not have a common connection between each other. So they can be killed and
presented to the police as different crimes and situations
that have no connection with each other. With the help of memorization of
information, he noticed that all of Johan's victims were
connected with Schuvald. After questioning the relatives of
the victims, he concluded that in fact the purpose of killing
these victims was the emotional isolation of Shuvald. + This
can also be attributed to non-standard thinking, because few
people will guess about it. Fingerprint forgery, which Johan paid attention to, is
responsible for non-verbal reasoning and visual problem
solving as evidence (for example, that Richard drank. And
Johan did it (fingerprint) with a broken bottle) (Johan
arranged everything so that Richard fell off the roof in a
drunken state (According to the police). If Richard had
committed suicide with a knife or in another way, it would
not have convinced the police. So Johan directed Richard to
the roofs). Teamwork with Roberto. And Johan gave him
instructions. Johan saw Grimmer killing Zeman. So yes, Johan took this into account too,
because he cured Jan's Mother (Temporarily). Now at this point, as you see, Grimmer and Tenma are reunited again. Ian is
taken to the hospital. And they show news about it on TV. But in Czech.
So they start talking about languages. Grimmer tells Tenma that he is from
Kinderheim 511 And that he studied world languages (English, French, Spanish
and Russian)
Grimmer's statement in VCI
I know that this is random but kid Koji loses to kid Koenji extreme diff
nah i think not so because nucha missed alot of feats
@@Kamado_kualops what do you mean I am talking about kid Koji.
This is a biased discussion since i saw your old takes on the same topic where you gave emotional intelligence abs emotional perception to koji which is a universal lie in the scd community which tells your know of this scaling community either you're just telling your opinions or are Just unknown to scd
No doubt Johan solos Koji. He just pulls his Glock and it's over
nah y'all really think koji has his hands tied or something??
Waar kom je vandaan
Japan
Johan vs koji isn't close !!
Johan simply no diffs koji
Just imagine johan was in anhs
Koji isn't even comparable to johan
Sure bud koji very high diffs koji
Saying no diff is pure biased
☠️ kid koji ( LN ) has statements which even PM Hal needs mid diff to beat and Hal no diffs Johan .
@@Redhestle Those are only CPI bullshit and comes nothing to anything
least dumb johan fan
@@yesbyeno1458 shut up dude I have his doc ready
Infact your dumb LN Kid koji mid diffs Johan at max .
As
Ayanokoji Kiyotaka DOC ( My own )
He has the same feat as PM Hal known as 4D chess and his WR training "( Beta curriculum )was dimensions harder than normal curriculum" this is a statement" ( so if Koji was in Death note he could see their life as he was able to pass WR Beta curriculum. Takuya and ichika passed 4 level in the normal curriculum and koji surpassed beta curriculum 10th level
His adaptability is so good that he solved many difficult games , memory games , he gets experience as he fought shiro and other smart PEOPLE over 5500 times ( diff PPL ). This statement alone puts kid koji 10* above Johan :
"Ayanokoji Kiyotaka, a top WR Student absorbs all the knowledge given to him as if his Intelligence ( ICQ ( intelligence capacity Quotient ) ) is bottomless" .
You yourself have to have so much intelligence to simply scale Kid koji every action he took has meaning. I myself took his quotes and analyzed them in Wikipedia and Books . His question to Chabashira at S1 Made Chabashira side with him later. The time gap here is 1yr , every thing and I mean everything that koji does has a meaning .
His emotional intelligence is also on a different level he manipulated nanese , hosen , Takuya , Chabashira, horikita , ryuuen , Ichinose , everyone in the verse even Arisu at WR he noticed her manipulated her into thinking he didn't have human warmth and got Arisu's sympathy .
Ayanokoji can perceive a whole dimension currently in LN and manga he is displaying only 4%% of his FP ☠️ .
He completed the Highest level of the beta curriculum and went above it where 1 level of beta curriculum is 10 levels of the normal curriculum Takuya got to peak 4 level in the normal curriculum and koji beat him with 4%% of his power and Johan extreme diffs Takuya .
And why are you using German and European influence? you do realize that it's stated that Koji would be able to rule continents right + the series was conducted in a school so talking about it is useless .
Kojis first memory is when he was 9 months and 10 days and Johan manipulated PPL who are basically idiots and koji manipulated many PPL whom Johan himself would need to get ( Mid - high diff )
Kid Koji alone wins against Johan .
He perceived a whole another dimension which a PM Hal noticeable feat and beta curious levels are different dimensions higher than normal curriculum . Don't debate when you haven't read LN. I watched Monster And right now Yuuichi beats him mid - high diff .
I wish Naoki shows Johan past experiences though, so we would know how Johan past is.
Manga.
Based on Manga, Johan’s academics and skills are equal/near equal to Koji. And 511 not only worked on creating better genetics but also smart people whereas white room only worked on creating smart people.
Johan can easily defeat Koji as his biggest move is making people believe he doesn't exist. He is also 10 steps earlier than his opponent
Johan>>>>>>>>Ayanokoji
🤡
Johan slams Mid diff
Johan controlled the whole Germany man😂
you can say Koji is predicted to do the same with Japan. He stated that his HS years will be the only normal years he will ever have in his life.
Without help from your father?? difficult koji controls cote alone🤣🤣🤣🤣
He didn't control Germany, he just made a plan that would let him control a company which was a major economic power and we never see how that plan would had turned out.
That's impressive and all but it's a plan that took multiple years
@@batmann348Ayanokoji is obviously smarter than his father so what's your point. Johan's plan also needed Schuwald, now Johan isn't an heir to Schuward but I don't see why Ayanokoji with multiple years of planning couldn't kill Schuward friends to isolate him and convince him of his abilities like Johan did
In fact, Johan does control Germany indirectly, Johan at the age of 15 controlled the European underworld, his influence goes further as he was chosen as a representative to be the extreme right leader, Johan never needed Schuwald, his plan was to become heir so could have access total economic control
well, to the story or background ayonokoji so smart for most of the anime universe but when this come to the practice cote just use the spaces of rules in exams to show ayonokoji smart or every important girls manipulated by ayonokoji just for his handsome.Dont be mistaken ı love cote and ı finished novel(novel in 22) but writers are not smart enough for their genius characters so that is not important. to the lore ayonokoji wins
tbh I wanted to argue with you that girls are not falling for his handsomeness, but then remembered CHABASHIRA, A GROWN ASS WOMAN, is feeling feelings for him so yup, this is just a dumb harem novel
the girls do not fall for his looks what are you on about 😭 u proved u r a fake reader by that single line
@@kanatatakonys5318 Lmao she doesn't have that type of feelings for koji. Read volume 10/11 carefully again. You seem to have low reading comprehension or maybe instead of reading u believed those baseless rumors you've seen in the internet.
@@kanatatakonys5318 I don´t remember chabashira love ayono she was in love with her old classmate.but nevermind this,actually all manipulations in cote is generally love for our mc and there is no other romantic relationship in anime(ı dont count ike shihonora)
@@mqurx pls read novel and come again.YES, ayonogoat actually did SOME plans for they fall for him( just kei, others love him for he is mc) but in reality this just a ridiculous thing that writer added.Example why ichinose and sakayanagi love him?espacially sakayanagi,this character is very clever so ı waited for her dont love kiyo.Yes sakayanagi already comfirmed she love him but she dont know after she beat ayono her love to him will continue or not.howewer nobody can change my thoughts ı think.
Johan badly slams the entire verse, so does Tenma and Lunge
🤡
Lol if Johan were in White room or the highschool, he would make everybody kill themselves including without lifting a finger. That is why Ayanokoji vs Johan is not even a debate :D
You really think Ayanokoji would give a fuck about Johan's words?
Ayanokoji won't but everybody else will. That is the point. Ayanokoji being not affected won't change anything. And, Johan would also give no fuck about Ayanokoji's words
@@koraydemirci9729thats not really a good feat. Its easy to let everyone kill themselves if you bully them. Imagine if you are in a whiteroom as a child force everyday in torturous activity. One little push and you can do what you. Johan did. Its not that impressive. Even normal people can do what johan did as long as you know as the person is suicidal and one word or joke would do the job. Stop overratinh johan
NAH LIL BRO SORRY BUT KOJI'S VERSE AINT NO DUMB DYSTOPIAN OLD AH WITH NO TECH WORLD 🤡
@@Ayanokoji-Senpai607 HE'S FROM THE 2022 11YO'S (YO-HAN) FANBASE SQUAD DONT WORRY