ไม่สามารถเล่นวิดีโอนี้
ขออภัยในความไม่สะดวก
Why Darth Plagueis Absolutely HATED "Grey"Jedi - Star Wars Explained
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ก.ย. 2024
- For all sponsorship and business inquiries please contact:
Business: tmarvelouswave@gmail.com
Twitter: @StupendousWave
I believe all content used falls under the remits of Fair Use, but if any content owners would like to dispute this I will not hesitate to immediately remove said content. It is not my intent to in any way infringe on their content ownership. If you happen to find your art or images in the video please let me know and I will be glad to credit you.
End Space footage: • Free to Use Space Foot...
• Abstract Black Motion ...
End Song By WhiteSand "Eternity" • Whitesand - Eternity (...
Composer: Whitesand (Martynas Lau)
Year: 2017
Title: Eternity
Additional Music by WhiteSand: / @whitesandcomposer
Spotify: open.spotify.c...
Bandicam: whitesand.band...
Composer: Whitesand (Martynas Lau)
Year: 2023
Title: Olympus
This is a remixed version of the previously released track "Olympus".
--
Mixed and Mastered by - Dovydas Lazdinis
/ dovydaslazdinis. .
www.studija104.lt/
studija104@gmail.com
Composer: Whitesand (Martynas Lau)
Year: 2019
Title: Honor
Album: Fragments Of Darkness
: • "Honor" - Epic Sad Emo...
Additional Music Terminus by: Scott Buckley
Released under CC-BY 4.0.
www.scottbuckley.com.au
Terminus: • 'Terminus' [Epic Cinem...
Additional Music: • Dark Choir Music | (Do...
FACEBOOK PAGE:
/ mattiacupellicomposer
► SPOTIFY: open.spotify.c....
► ITUNES STORE: goo.gl/s9VhCQ
►OFFICIAL WEBSITE: www.mattiacupel...
►SOUNDCLOUD:
/ mattiacupelli
►INSTAGRAM:
/ mattiacupelli_
►BANDCAMP: mattiacupelli....
►OFFICIAL SHEET MUSIC: goo.gl/csI8Gk
Plagueis: Fucking fence sitters
Death Plagueis in the thumbnail:
It’s coming home!
This is why in KOTOR games, if you are on the light side path, you can still use the dark side abilities but it will cost double the force point and vice versa. The Force always works with trade off and even though I like the jedi outcast game, I always thought Kyle Katarn (and even Jolee Bindo) a bit ignorant, thinking they were using the dark side but in reality, just using the very tip of the dark side iceberg. The only exception being Luke and Anakin but they are of course apart from the normal logic.
Jacen? I mean yes he fell. But it was the reasons he fell, he saw a constant danger in the future and the only way forward for everyone was for him to become what he feared most as a child.
@@jamesrocco7701 To be honest, I don’t know much about Jacen other than he became Darth Caedus and killed Mara Jade but his story is compelling for sure !
@Althar9809 He knew what he was doing was wrong. But he was a firm practioner of the cosmic force. Granted his year of torture and manipulation at the hands of Vergere changed him, he was still a good person. Jaina his twin, who killed him, even said he died as Jacen Solo and not Cadeus. He sent a mental warning to the mother of his daughter about a bio weapon to kill them. Thus allowing his sister to decapitate him . Sorry grew up reading legends, Disney pissed me off.
@@jamesrocco7701 I agree, Jacen is 100000000x better, if even comparable to Kylo Ren. I have some of the Legacy comics and it’s pretty good. Darth Krayt is definitely one of my favourite sith with Legend Plagueis and Vectivus. Who’s your favourite?
@@Althar9809 not really, im like 15 years behind on my lore lol
Have you guys ever heard the Tragedy of Darth Plagueis the Wise?
"No"
"I thought not. Its not a story the Jedi would tell you. It's a sith legend."
@@Ravenfanatic5 Na Acolyte turn our beloved Plagueis into A Perv, I felt insulted and to bad shows dead, so no way to say if that was truly him in the short scene.
Plagueis was one who right about the Force and theory while Revan was the closest to true balance in the Force they were ever going to get, for in a way the Force as whole wants the Jedi to be the "good guys" but standing center.
The theory is mostly wrong but there some weight to it that could not be ingnored, Kyle for example more or less proved it unlike mean who fallow he accept unlike the light and dark sides but uses for good.
@@thomasparque7834 darkside cant be used for good
I think finding balance in the force is like finding a stone to stand on in the middle of two raging rivers going opposite directions, you may use it now and be able to hold on to it for an unspecified amount of time, but if you dip into either side just a little too much you will be swept away, and even if you don’t particularly partake of either this stone will still at some unforeseen time be swallowed up by the rising rivers, and it being at the nexus between both speeding in opposite but equally raging rivers means that if you don’t hop in one side or the other to be carried down the rapids and try staying on it as it’s swallowed you will find yourself in a whirlpool that will suck you straight to the bottom with zero hope of escape .
Darth Plagueis the wise, in his refutation, foolishly forgets the concept of steam, of matter that changes state depending on it circumstances. In his dogma, he is shackled in the same manner he accuses the jedi of being. The wielder is responsible for themself and their own choice, but they are still flowing with the force. When you listen to the force, the whole force, and CHOOSE which current to flow with, you are not fighting the force, you are dancing with it, neither the user, nor the force itself leading, but 2 in harmony moving as one.
"Big talk for a fool in force choking range." - Darth Plagueis probably
A slave by any other name is still a slave. Control and bend the force as you will it. A sheep does not tell a lion how to eat
So what you are saying a Sith Lord has a Steam account?
@@kaidorade1317 Yes. Who do you think is keeping the Jedi Academy multiplayer servers going.
@@FattyMcFox ... its still alive ??
The Force is created and sustained by life. Too much life without death consumes all then collapses, ending the Force. Too much death without new life also ends the Force. This is why it needs agents of both life and death to maintain itself. There is a balance, which must lean slightly towards life to continue on.
the light side = compationate slavery by the jedi on the rest
Tge dark side = free will absolutism
which is why i liked the dark side more
I agree the force is neither dark or light
Life exists and the use of the power is in the intent of the user. Balance.
I want to say potentium is the atheism of the force; but I feel like that might be a gross oversimplification/ misnomer. But I can certainly appreciate the "there's no good or evil space magic; there's just the intent of the user" philosophy.
Didn't actually know this was a thing in the star wars universe; is actually exactly what I always described would be my mindset if I got magic space wizard powers. Follow your own moral compass and do what you think is right; not because some dogma told you something is correct. Be capable of thinking for yourself and coming to your own conclusions.
“Good is a point of view Random-Unbreaded-Commenter” Palpatine
It sounds a lot like Taoism to me, the Yin and Yang symbol is supposed to represent the inherent value of both light and dark forces. (Which Taoists don't view as good or evil)
Bro’s my favorite youtuber n he’s my go to person in regard to horror, starwars, and marvel. Love you man ❤❤❤
One could say that most iterations of Jedi are already balanced in itself. They are selfless and help others, but they do have their own identities, ideas, and even desires. I also heard that balance in the force means the eradication of evil from it.
The Jedi aren't living lavish lifestyles of course, but most of their reasonable needs are met. They also have the respect of the galaxy, friendships, and purpose. No, they are not living in luxury, but would such things really make the Jedi better or happier? I once heard of research that says that when you no longer have to worry about the future financially speaking, more money doesn't help you. And seeing as Jedi need discipline to harness the force safely, it might be in their own interest to live soberly.
Also, the Jedi are more than willing to fight and kill to protect the galaxy and themselves, so they aren't exactly unwilling to hurt others. They also see death as natural apparently.
My point is that the Jedi are in a way already balanced between selfish and selfless, and the Sith are therefor not needed.
why would we need the sith, other than they are cooler.
So power doesn't corrupt? just corrupt people seeking power.
Think of it like this
Unless the power in of itself is unholy evil
As in it’s so bad no one in their right mind should use it
Examples being the ring of power of Sauron
Or dark energon from say transformers prime
These powers go against the natural world they transform the person if they let it
The darkside in Star Wars however is apart of the natural world and necessary
Hence the idea of balance
The issue is people abuse the darkside because of the benefits
Think of it like using steroids
As a medication from time to time to help and individual or help them get through pain or injury if not excell
It’s not good to use all the time to try and bust yourself
As the side effects are ugly and cause issues
Hence why sith are seen as they are
The darkside isn’t the cause it’s the abuse of it
As it will exist even after all the sith are killed off
Someone will eventually use the darkside again
Whether it’s for the right reasons or not
Unless someone abuses it will imbalance come again
power does corrupt.
@@jmgonzales7701 I'm just saying it is people that are responsible for their own actions power has no consciousness so it cannot influence anyone.
@rollingpingamers2785 depending on what universe and what power.
@@rollingpingamers2785 You are correct.
So, I know you do enjoy questions from us from time to time as video ideas.
That being said, do you believe that darth tenebrous had a vision of how plagueis would die? Before plagueis ends his master, tenebrous said a couple things of interest that would be later proven. He would go on to tell his apprentice that he would succeed in the grand plan, telling him that immense power does not mean he is unbeatable and he should always be on guard (which served as a warning that his student later should have taken much more seriously) and ended with saying "better to die like this, than at your hand" it is my personal thought that in that moment, he was actually talking to what he believed would become darth sidious and saying he would much rather be killed by his apprentice whom he may have still challenged, had his power in the force not become weaker(as the dark side was already betraying him) than what the awesome might of darth sidious could wield would have ultimately done to the dark master.
Essentially, i believe he could have had a vision of his apprentices death and realized how he would stand no chance against the future pupil of his student, and that was the final gift the dark side bestowed upon him before his spirit was sent to the void.
It makes me think of the Mu No-Ken and the Satsui No Hadou from Street Fighter.
True
If we assume there are "sides" of the force, such as the Light and the Dark, is it so much of a stretch there are other sides? Even a coin has three sides in three-dimensional space. The head, the tail, and the edge.
And even then, who is to say there aren't even more? Like a multi-sided dice, there could be MANY aspects of the Force that the Sith AND the Jedi simply refuse to look at.
I don't think the issue is with the number of sides there are to the force, but that there needs to be a more nuanced understanding of their nature away from the generic good vs evil.
@@gaebi exactly
with the force there is balance or imbalance. the dark side is imbalance. the goal for force use is be in balance with the force but that harder than the using the dark side because you have be in control of your emotions.
Actually that can be argued Stupendous Wave, there is the Potentium, then there is the Unifying Force as well.
The flaw over all does not stem from the will to balance both, but instead that to even Gray Jedi, that the absolute perception or absolution of the Force be Jedi or Sith has stirred feuds between the orders.
To the jedi attachments bring restraint from the full potential. Be it emotional, family, or even material can strain a jedi.
For the sith passion is the drive, passion for power, revenge, even dominance over that which binds them to achieve freedom.
But at what cost? Loss, destruction, death and the cycle repeats itself. How man generations, centuries did either side try to bring order, or chaos, only to leave the galaxy in near ruin over light and dark.
This is why those like Jolee Bindo, Ashoka Tano, even Kyle Katarn or even Vergie in the Yuuzhan Vong War proved invaluable. Truly showing with Jacen Solo what the Unifying Force can achieve at it's fullest potential. It was said that Jacen Solo in his confrontation radiated with the Force like a star.
A fact few forget even in Legends.
Read the novel, The Unifying Force.
I’m a simple man: I see a Darth Plagueis novel, I click play
Him and his master Darth Tenebrous are my favorite.so short-sighted and though intellectual, they are out of balance which is expected of short-sighted evil doers. Ironic they wanted to achieve eternal life
Do a video on how powerful were anakin solo and kyp durrun
Wait, so Kyle Katarn successfully used both the light and the dark without being drawn too far into either side and that was how he demonstrated his philosophy. Plagueis goes "Nuh uh!". Strong argument. Lol.
Plaugeis disagreed on the philosophy, but on the practical side, he probably meant that those who try to "use both sides of the Force" will be weak in both since the two are kind of opposites of eachother. Versitility at the cost of speciality and power.
At least that's my best guess...
@@herbalyzoltan409 But he'd be wrong again because Kyle Katarn was an extremely powerful Jedi. 👀
Let's talk about Force Alchemy next
The way I hear the force being spoken about, it seems the force is viewed as 2 sperate entities, can it not be a single conscience with two "Sides", like living beings no one is wholely good or bad, they simply are as they need to be depending on the situation, perhaps the flaw is not specifically in trying to use both sides, but in trying to turn them into something they're not, perhaps the force needs to be wholely embraced without regards for moral alignment to achieve true mastery, whilst choosing which side needs to be let out or in depending on the goal at hand, in this way the force is not necessarily bent to ones will, but benefits on both ends through a single being
I believe this concept too it’s the way u use the force for your intentions . Just as much as you can use force lightening to dominate a opponent u could use lightening to charge a generator to keep a home warm threw the winter for a family
I agree with Kyle I hate the name grey Jedi tho but powers like force lightning are only evil really if you use it to kill an unarmed opponent or torture someone but force lightning could also be used to power generators and stun people rather than kill them
I tend to agree with the petentium (not sure if I spelled that right) theory.
One thing never really mentioned in Star Wars are more relevant items from psychiatric medicine and psychology in general.
A lot of that has to do with the popular thinking of the time when Lucas came out with Star Wars (the 70's).
During the 70's you'd see things on the six o'clock news about reports of things like possessions, haunted houses, etc.
The various churches here in the United States were very much so, at a high time of influence.
People for the most part believed in "evil" being a real force that made people do things.
Versus, the more objective observation that a person's disposition and actions are the result of sometimes influence from their environment (like being heavily bullied) and a series of dominos based on personal choices over time.
In the professional fields pertaining to psychology. Evil and good are subjective concepts. Not holding any reality, but merely a judgmental opinion.
That said, it makes sense that the force is just, the force. That has a will to maintain the chaotic balance of everything. But, in an of itself doesn't manipulate people.
The actions of a person. Which psychological observation has noted that habits, are formed by doing repeated actions.
(Not referring to chemical dependency here)
But, as example: a person discovered that they elicited an outcome by certain actions.
Like a bully, getting what they wanted by being intimidating.
Or a force wielder, like Ezra Bridger using the dark side to control an imperial walker to kill a group of stormtroopers...
Both the bully and Ezra, recognized their aggression influenced something that they liked the outcome.
So, it's easier for either to do so again.
And the more they do it. The easier the emotions needed to do such, become easier over time.
So, in Ezra's case. His master and friends made it a point of focus. Once Ezra realized he was frightening his friends, and didn't want to lose them. He decided to stop using the dark side.
Another example, when Anakin fell to the dark side. While it seems illogical for him to force choke Padme, from a psychological perspective it makes sense.
Anakin was obsessed with not losing Padme. He falsely believed he could gain the power to stop death. He also had the jealousy of seeing Obi Wan come out of the ship following her.
So rage was a natural response.
For a war hero, who already was filled with the common emotions that yield from fighting and killing.
His drop into using dark side techniques was far easier and faster.
And his obsession with saving his wife, made him easily controllable.
So, from my perspective. Sticking to the light or sticking to the dark is a matter of preferences derived from personal choices and created habits.
Star wars would do well to incorporate that into the writings.
Star Wars is a fairy tale for kids, not some deep psychological essay. That's why adult fans are always unsatisfied with it.
@@Hello-bi1pm and by that definition, so is other works like Batman. Yet it's targeted for a much broader audiences. And some very excellent writers have done wonders with it like Frank Miller.
The point isn't so much a matter of this audience vs that audience. As much as incorporating some realism into the writing to add depth to the stories. And to help address plot holes.
Kids also aren't stupid, and many find greater interest in fictional depth like that.
Another nice thing about elements of realism in fictional writing for younger audiences. Is that having some realism helps with understanding of different things also serving as a preparatory for learning and adulthood.
Tbh, there's nothing wrong with such shades of realism.
Well, nothing wrong for "most" people.
Probably not-so-ok for uninvolved parents and guardians, ngl.
For being supposedly so logical and rejecting of superstition, Plagueis was hypocritically as dogmatic as the Jedi in some respects. It goes beyond merely intent. Such things as righteous anger and "power with" rather than "power over" exist. Being ambitious does not necessarily lead to evil. It's become fashionable to dump on this simple, realist perspective based on either Lucas' notions of the moral underpinnings or just the rising tide of contrarians who think themselves enlightened - ironically - for staking so much of the Force on a simple black/white binary. I say ironically because many of the people who trash the idea of drawing on both will in the next breath critique others for being "reductionist" and "lacking nuance". Hypocrisy is not in short supply among Sith or among a good many of the fanbase.
Placing so much agency on the Force itself is a newfangled concept which dismisses the simple truth that lacking Light, there is no Dark. If all were Dark, what would the shadows whirl and rise up against? One largely depends on the other. It's narrow-minded to reject the idea that a being could straddle that line. Because for the calming of the Light and seductive whispers of the Dark, they only gain true agency when channeled through a vessel. That puts the proverbial ball in the individual's court in more ways than it doesn't.
As much as the sith claim the dark side is meant to bend to their will, its always the sith that sacrifice for it, save Exar who was more a dark jedi than sith
that being said the sith ideology in itself is cool and liberating, its like nietzche will to power.
Here’s my view on what balance in the force means as we see in revenge of the Sith. Obi-Wan states he cut up. Anakin was the chosen one. It was said you would destroy the safe not bring to the force not leaving in darkness.
Here is what I think is stupid about that Obi-Wan said that he would. DESTROY the 6th to bring balance to the force now that doesn’t make sense because balance is both if you destroy one side it can’t be balanced because there’s only one left the only way there to be balanced is there to be too and what I think they should do is kill all the Seth but then use Darkside abilities as well. Have the Jedi start using dark side abilities and light side abilities, have all of the Jedi become grey Jedi then there will be true balance because if the Sith are gone there won’t be balanced because there will only be Jedi but if the Sith are gone but the Jedi become grey Jedi and start using Darkside abilities then they will be true balance because it’s one group using both sides true balance is having both sides in one group
The Potentia theory is the Only true Way. If the Force is all things then the force is You . If the Force has Duality, so Do You. It is then encumbent upon the indidvidual connected to the Force whether the can manipulated it or not must , to be your best , be aware of you duality of yourself and thus the force . There can be no other journey than but back to that of wholeness and balance. Tilt to far in any direction and you will fall.
One of the eastern philosophers and spiritual adepts’ biggest criticisms of western philosophy and spirituality is the West’s binary dualistic thinking, and its categorical separation between the Light (Yang) and the Dark (Yin), which the likes of Taoists deride as simplistic, since the Tao encompasses both, and neither can exist without the other. Which is symbolized by the sphere composed of two halves representing both aspects of the Tao, coming together and merging to form one whole circle, the circle symbolizing oneness, wholeness, completion and perfection, that which is without beginning nor end, the Alpha and the Omega. Although Taoism does recognize the existence of both sides, and their differences, as it recognizes the existence of good and evil. Taoism is not a relativistic philosophy. But it recognizes that they are all part of one whole.
Whereas Star Wars is fundamentally predicated upon this binary dualistic western thinking which forms the basis of its philosophy, Lucas having stated that the Dark Side is a corruption and imbalance of the Force, one which has to be rooted out, while the Light Side is the Force in its pure and balanced state. According to Taoism, this binary dualistic thinking is not only deeply flawed, but fundamentally wrong, and the Jedi order embodied this flawed thinking with its rejection and repression of the Dark or the Yin, which is associated with femininity, emotions and chaos, which ultimately led to their destruction, at the hands of Anakin. Their order was wholly imbalanced, embracing only one half of the Force, while rejecting and suppressing and even trying to destroy the other half entirely. This could only lead to trouble in the long run.
The philosophy of the original Je’daii from Legends was much more akin to the philosophy of the East and that of the Taoists, the Je’daii having been a ’grey’ order which strived to achieve balance between the Light and the Dark, before their order was torn apart during the great initial schism between the Jedi and Sith, which tore the order apart with their clashing dualistic philosophies and which plunged the galaxy into a war which raged for millennia and claimed countless of lives, both being limited by their one-sided ideologies and neither being able to perceive the bigger picture. But the Je’daii weren’t created by Lucas and part of his original vision, being part of Legends.
I don't know dude, based on what I know on Eastern philosophy the force seems heavily based on it.
The two most popular are Buddism and Taoism. Both promote inner peace, calmness, serenity and compassion as virtues of emotional balance witch is represented by The Light side in star wars.
Buddhism is very similar to what the Jedi already believe. Giving up on attachment and learning to let go of strong emotions (especially negative ones) so they can gain enlightenment.
Taoism believe in using opposing emotions to stay centered. So good emotions vs bad emotions = neutral emotions. They believe in embracing bad emotion maybe even expressing it, but not using or acting on them. The main goal is to go back to the center.
If a Taoist was a force user they would be a lightsider, because the force isn't a direct copy of Taoism. It isn't good vs bad emotions, it's neutral vs bad emotions.
@@joshuaharewood1089 The Force is no doubt in part based on eastern philosophy, particularly Buddhism since Lucas is a Buddhist himself, aswell as Taoism, the concept of the Force being very similar to that of the Taoist Chi or lifeforce, and clearly derived from it. But it is in part based on western philosophy aswell, since Lucas is also a Christian, Christianity being fundamentally dualistic in nature. Star Wars has a lot of Christian themes. Star Wars is this weird blend of western Christian and eastern Buddhist/Taoist philosophy.
But it is interesting that even Christianity declares certain negative emotions like hatred to be good and righteous in some cases, notably the hatred of evil, contrary to Star Wars and Lucas’ claim that hatred is categorically bad, in all of its forms. And as another commenter pointed out on here, righteous anger does exist.
I'm the only one who think than the name of "grey Jedi" it's as stupid as "gray Sith"?, they are NOT Jedis!, they should have they own order name.
I agree. Maybe something like Potentiates like the theory mentioned here, or Bendus after the being introduced in Rebels
@@rustyshackleford2950I like the idea of them being named after the Bendu. However I'm pretty sure that the Bendu wasn't a dark sider. I think he was talking about the Jedi and Sith orders and that he is neither. But I'm pretty sure he is still not using both sides. I saw a video that explained this really well but I forgot who made it unfortunately.
Hear me out... Jedys.
Maybe kar-o
Or benju or ben-lie
You have said in the channel before that a Light Side Sith is impossible. One cannot follow the Code of the Sith and be of the Light. I would wonder then how you would view a soldier of the Empire in TOR who is steeped in the Light (consistently makes “light side” choices, regardless of motivation or outcome) and rises to the level of holding a Darth title and being recognized as the Emperor’s Wrath by the conclusion of the origin story. Similarly, we see Jedi who can be entirely dark. That is a clear instance of a fall to the dark side that has maybe not been recognized yet (e.g., Atris). However, it seems that there are few (if any) instances of a dark sider falling to the Light side…
Jedi and Sith are religions adherent to dogma. It seems any Force wielded can be of any alignment, but the labeling becomes confusing when the choice is binary
that being said the sith ideology in itself is cool and liberating, its like nietzche will to power. g for dominance, control, and achievement.
Sith: The Sith ideology emphasizes the pursuit of power above all else. Sith Lords believe in harnessing their emotions, especially anger and hatred, to gain strength and assert their will over others. This relentless quest for power aligns closely with Nietzsche’s idea of the "Will to Power."
Master-Slave Morality:
Nietzsche: He proposed the dichotomy of master-slave morality. Master morality values pride, strength, and nobility, whereas slave morality values things like kindness, empathy, and humility. Nietzsche criticized the latter as a morality of the weak.
Sith: The Sith embody a master morality, valuing strength, ambition, and dominance. They reject the values of the Jedi, which could be seen as aligning with slave morality, emphasizing selflessness, peace, and restraint.
Overcoming the Self:
Nietzsche: He spoke of the Übermensch (Overman or Superman), an individual who transcends conventional morality to create their own values. This involves overcoming one’s limitations and societal constraints.
Sith: Sith training focuses on overcoming personal limitations, often through harsh and challenging trials. Sith apprentices are taught to reject societal norms (like those of the Jedi) and to carve their own path through strength and power.
Eternal Recurrence:
Nietzsche: He introduced the concept of eternal recurrence, the idea that one should live as though they would have to relive their life infinitely. This idea pushes individuals to live authentically and powerfully.
Sith: While not directly aligned with eternal recurrence, the Sith's emphasis on living fully through the pursuit of power and rejecting limitations resonates with the idea of making the most of one's existence.
it binary because what gorge Lucas said. there is balance or imbalance. the dark side is imbalance. the Jedi dogma how ever can be off and prevent Jedi achieving true balance with the force. it how gray Jedi become to be because they do not fallow the dogma of the Jedi order.
The light and dark sides are both wrong. True balance is the grey. Accepting both light and dark inside you. Both the Jedi and the Sith see the yin and Yang symbol and ignore it at their cost of their own destruction
I have always looked at this as yin yang. An that most force users could only handle one or the other because of the will of the force to maintan a balance. So a true grey would be extremely powerful or a being that has no control over either. So maybe a non force user?
That is something i have thought about. Force lightning is pretty mmuch a darkside power, at least regarding the six movies under George's flag. But let say that a hospital and there is a power failure and the life support systems start to fail. But a focr user use a controlled force lighting to keep the hospital going until reparis are done, is it still an evil power?
And yes i have played Jedi Academy and remeber that Kyle used a lot of dakr side powers. I sadistic as I am loved to push the storm troopers into the abyss. Or in cases that I maxed out all light side powers and stil had skill ponts for some dark, I could choose force choke. But instrad of choking them I lifted them up and let dem down into the abyss of a gas giant for example. ^^
The force just reflects the soul that's why the "dark side of the force" whispers to them because their soul is dark
I've always hated the notion of gray jedi. I used to like the idea of a balanced person encompassing both sides of the force but after diving deeper into the Star Wars lore my perspective on that has changed. The idea and concept sound great on paper but highly flawed in execution.
I feel gray jedi are just people who don't want to choose a side, which is fine but they miss out on the abilities of choosing one side or the other grants though full commitment to that side. So I agree completely with plagueis and his viewpoint here.
Gray jedi fans just want to claim to value peace and righteousness but use dark jedi powers at their whims or they solely don't want to be a part of the forever ongoing argument that the jedi are heretic boy scouts, so they don't just strictly choose liking the jedi side but end up loving this grey jedi idea because liking boy scout peaceful people is generally boring to the masses.
Everyone can't be a powerful fallen hero turned bad that deserves everyone's sympathy or a good guy that dances on the dark side just for the sake of making him an interesting character.
There is no great revelation only you.
Kyle is still my favorite character. A shame disney discarded him
Anything/anyone worth writing or putting in future projects, you should pray Disney has no interest in them…
@@JB-nj5hn true, it just feels like a waste
Gray jedi did exists but they were either against the jedi idea the very reare few that could active balance were rarely happened like Revan or legend luke and yes their is a light and dark side became their is always a light side ability to counter a dark side ability
Ya gray jedi should be possible and I think reven was the first to almost get there maybe if he was the chosen one he could have done it I say this because we have the character the father who is the embodiment of both sides of the force and anakin bending the brother and sister maybe means that u have to be the chosen one to be a gray jedi. I would also mention the bedu but he is not cannon to me f disney starwars
*The following are the musings of a Salty SEAGULL named EARL who just shows up in my posts whenever he feels like it!*
[EARL the Salty SEAGULL:] 0:28 - "So The Legend of Zelda mythos was right! The true path to balance is a combination of POWER, WISDOM, & COURAGE! Guess that's why its called the... TRI-FORCE! Unfortunately the FORCE of Star Wars only has two sides, LIGHT & DARK! Also of course DARTH PLAGUIES HATES Grey Jedi, after all he's a SITH and HATING things fuels the DARK SIDE!" 1:09 - "Ah, Plaguies' first on-screen televised appearance! To bad it was just a fan service cameo in the final episode of the Acolyte! There now anyone who hasn't watched it or a review like I did (I ain't paying for no streaming) is aware his appearance is brief and doesn't really amount to anything save for the small possibility of him returning in Season 2!" 3:45 - "I've come to believe it is the very existence of the DARK SIDE which supports my view that the FORCE is kind of a DICK! I mean the DARK SIDE would eventually betray Plagueis when it temped Palpatine into killing him which I believe was cause his actions lead to the FORCE creating the CHOSEN ONE and since the DARK SIDE represents HATRED and other dark emotions, it turned on Plagueis, denying him of the role of fulfilling the SITH GRAND PLAN & handing it over to PALPATINE who would seduce ANAKIN to the DARK SIDE! Ultimately the DARK SIDE is heartless and is why the FORCE at times feels like an uncaring GOD! The FORCE may be alive, but the DARK SIDE corrupts and twists life by feeding off the negative emotions of those who tap into it!" 5:08 - "So basically SITH want to make the DARK SIDE their B!TCH, so the FORCE can't do the same to them! This just further supports my philosophy of the FORCE being kind of a DICK (just look at what happened to Shimi Skywalker, knocked up by Midiclorians cause Plagueis ticked off the FORCE by trying to play GOD, without any benefit to herself as she apparently wasn't force sensitive and the only mercy it provided was her not living to see the SITH LORD he became, which is why I say its kinda a dick but that was probably the Light Side's doing as mercy is more of a LIGHT SIDE thing)!" 5:18 - "So HOTH is the opposite of MALACOR! Makes sense, as it would explain why Obi-Wan's FORCE GHOST was able to get a decent LIGHT SIDE signal before the IMPERIAL INVASION!"
Of course a sith would refute the idea that your actions are the result of your choices and ultimately your responsibility. Show me an example of one sith who was pure in their dedication that wouldn't constantly point fingers at other people. The sith will blame everyone else for their shit and never themselves.
Also, I agree there are two distinct sides to the force. However while the force has a will it would be a reflection of the untold number of living beings connected to it that shape its will. The will of the force would probably be something like the collective unconsciousness of everything living being it is connected to. As for the light and the dark, they do not make you something you are not as the Bendu stated only you can change yourself. The light and the dark are mirrors and focuses of what is is already inside of us. I think Kyle was so good at it was because he was unconsciously accepting both the light and the dark and any force user utilizing the potentia theory does so because it requires accepting the light and the dark within yourself.
why cant we get kyle in cannon already? such a well written character
Will require and implies intelligence. If the Force has intelligence and a will, then it is a livmg being, not just energy alone.
Either this being is evil and picks favorites and plays with everyone's life just because (giving the sith abilities, and the jedi as well Jedi for kicks)
Or there are two beings, who seem to be equal in power for the most part.
In either case, the Force abilities are not just something learned by study but are granted by the beings.
You can't just study about a being then all of a sudden have that beings abilities, not without some kind of tech that mimics it...but the abilities are mystical not just some scientific or technological advancement.
If the Force is only an energy then light and dark become so by ones intent ans how it is used. Thus balance is proper understand and moral use of any ability.
(This says nothing about how morality is decided in the star wars universe without a supreme diety who justifies and defines morality).
Personally, and I do not have a masters in starwars lore, I think the Force is just an energy that those who are more sensitive to preternatual realities have learned ro tap into. Force users ought to be able to use most abilities but of course will only use more deadly abilities in rare cases of need. With some abilities having no justification to use, not that those abilities are of some seperate energy that is called dark but rather they would be abusing there abilities. Once again if it's energy, the energy is does not make up some list of abilities l. It just is and who ever uses the energy csn use it to do whatever that power source is capable of, how it is used and why makes it evil. Thus self mastery is required before learning many things.
Grey Jedi in that form don’t exist as to truely master the dark side you have to give yourself over to it in its entirety. However as proven by several Jedi including Revan. Being in balance makes you immensely powerful. When Revan turned back to the light several dark side abilities including force lightning were closed off to him but his understanding of it meant he didn’t need it as anyone using it against him would simply revitalise him before he turned it back on you with infinity more strength. Revan realised the force isn’t light or dark. It is simply the force. Using the force in purest form made him immensely powerful something also done by legends Luke skywalker. The baran doe sages also fall into this category of simply using the force. The Jedi and sith both failed in the end this way was always the way.
The light and dark side are different roads that lead to the same destination
Whole idea of middle ground feels and allways felt like a poor excuse for bad writers who got themselves in the corner and needed to boost power of their hero ... while keeping them perfectly stainless.
i believe that the force does have 2 sides especially with all the lore about the ashla and bogan
I really wonder, if it is possible, as a dark side user, to follow the will of the force (or the will of the dark side) rather than bending the force to one's own will.
Momin story
*”Is* the Dark Side stronger?”
“No, no stronger, Quicker, easier.”
Hmm I wonder. I thought that balance was the same conclusion that Yoda came to after his battle with Sidious. Wasn't that exactly what Anakin Skywalker was a person who could utilize both sides equally. Had he not been so freaking easily manipulated and arrogant he could have utilized both the light and dark with equal strength. I question if the Dark side is truly corrupting its users or are they simply allowing themselves to fall further and further into evil. Perhaps it is the darkness in them that makes them attracted to the Dark side and not the other way around. If you look at those who became truly powerful in the Dark they were all sadistic bastards from the start, which the possible exception of Anakin/Vader.
I know many don't like even the term "Grey Jedi", but in true balance there can be no other perspective. Evil destroys everything, and good always becomes complacent.
Grey Jedi means they aren't sure whether to be a Jedi or a Sith.
No it simply means they use the force as if it’s one thing regardless of the 2 sides
I would be soley on the light side i dont think the dark side offers anything of vaule plus force heal is a light side ablity
Weakness in both sides if you are a proponent of Potentium is just weird. If that was the case, than why became Revan so powerful after coming back to the light side with all his abilities in the dark side? All in all the force is just the force. light and dark side are just the 2 sides of one and the same coin, that is the force itself. Revan himself is proof of that!
Consider three to five points of the force light,dark, grey and chaos and cosmic
Have you heard of the tragedy of Plagueis the Wise? He was taught to use The Thread to create life.
Some fans will argue there is no light or dark, it's the intention on how it is used. Others will say its like yin and yang counterbalancing each other. Closest we got to grey jedi are the ancient "Je'daii order". Didn't work out so well for them.
Life with only peace, cannot evolve and grow. Life with only passion leads to self destruction
i'm sure many would agree with all sides
The Gray Jedi is a concept that cannot exist as the Light and Dark Sides are too antagonist to each other and they will often seek to destroy each or at the very least to be the dominant to the other, but that means that all living creatures will choose a side no matter how small to budge to it and that small advantage is more than enough to be able to stay in a singular side.
I disagree. Society is about balance. Push too far or hard in one direction and the system pushes harder back in the opposite direction. The force is a representation of society. There has to be an equilibrium. We’ve seen examples of the Jedi doing questionable things under the justification that they are “protecting” the greater good. Force users who understand this can achieve balance if they embrace both sides.
@@chrisburton3571 George Lucas clearly defines the force/struggle between the two sides as good vs evil. The jedi making a mistake, being a bit too strict on a rule, or being manipulated into a wrong doing isn't anything like a sith deliberately and knowingly killing innocents and children for their own gain or amusement. Someone may achieve balance in the force but never be as powerful in the light as a Jedi who's spent much of their life meditating on it, or as strong in the dark side as a sith who's truly given Themself to it. If a gray force user were to fight a true jedi or sith: If They're not particularly gifted in the force or some sort of prodigy They'd likely be steam rolled because You're either using the side of the force They're better trained than You in, or using the side of the force They've trained to reject, fight, and destroy. You can use the dark side for good or the light side for ill but it's difficult to do either of those as Your power in both sides is linked to Your emotions and desires. To do so is to squander the true potential You could reach if You were just decisive enough to pick one or the other. To do so, is to choose mediocrity.
@chrisburton3571 what are u saying exactly? Do you think they would do less or more questionable things by embracing both sides?
Says someone who has to ignore characters in canon or even legend
Ashoka the father the bendu, Cal so on
To say they don’t use the darkside or the light interchangeably
And don’t exactly use both all the time
Heck even Anakin in the world between worlds
Using the light and dark appearing as both Anakin and Vader
Not just using the light but also the dark to train Ashoka
That’s not to mention the examples in legends
Proves the concept does exist even in canon
So this idea the concept doesn’t or never existed
Are people who like to think in black and white
Guess what good and evil isn’t black and white
It’s the old saying grey doesn’t mean white and black dont exist or that the respective colors represent good and evil or someone are inbetween
only to figure out what is what takes more then just a first glazes and a use of positive or negative power doesn’t actually tell you if something is good or bad in of themselves
It’s the how why and result behind it
@@joshuarichard1892the very problem is GL didn’t actually know what he was doing or saying
Heck he made the mordius arc to explain the force better
He says they Jedi should be the father not the son or daughter
Kinda saying the idea the Jedi needing to be in the light like the daughter doesn’t solve the problem
Revan is always the answer. :)
Was there any king of Jedi Palpatine didn’t hate?
I'm all for balance between the light and dark, but to claim there is no light or dark side is foolish. You can very clearly see the difference between the two based on how they affect the people and places around them.
well gray Jedi are all about the balance of the force and following the forces. the dark side is imbalance of the force. the light side is only part of the force not using emotions. it take lots training for Jedi to control there emotions to achieve balance.
The ancient jedi had it right but lukes outlook on balance is valid
Whom amongst us appreciates getting grey hairs
why is plagueis doin an ermac cosplay in the thumbnail
Would not be possible for somebody to use both sides if they had split personalities, or better yet two souls in one body?
Gray Jedi is for fans who want to wank to the idea of being a morally good force user who can shoot lightning from their fingies.
What makes the force - - as wielded by sentient beings - narratively interesting is how uncontrollable it really is. The Jedi aren’t detached smashless monks for the fun of it - but because the slope is so slippery ya gotta stay on top or just fall all the way down.
Like sure it’s not perfectly cut and dry, and since this does make for less relatable protagonists we see an increasing amount of “gray-ness” pop up… it’s all just very silly since it removes what makes these space wizards interesting in the first place.
Being able to casually “be” gray makes everything seem absurd - why would anyone choose binary absolutes on either end? Why would they have done this for thousands of years? The only rational explanation is that these binary extremes are actually in-universe necessary.
Only Sith deal in absolute (moralities).
@@Smhallways and? not sure you’ve even understood what I wrote.
@@xtrafunk You presented an absolute morality. Either/or. You don't allow for in between and consider "grey" absurd, and a traditional view of the universe a necessity. Therefore, you are a Sith, no denying it.
@@Smhallways oh good grief. First of all, sith aren’t real. Secondly, I’m not even speaking about morality but about the binary dynamic that makes the force as a magical supernatural force interesting. Without the light / dark absolutism - which is abundantly supported in canon - it’s just uninteresting space wizardry.
It’s about the tradeoff that comes with immense power in this fictional universe. Power without sacrifice - here, having to give up lots of cool stuff lest succumbing to the dark side - is narratively boring.
Now, I’ve explained this concept twice and if you’re too simple to pick up what I’m putting down that’s on you.
Why does Plagueis have ST Georges Cross on his face in the thumbnail maybe that Euro Final is what caused his fall to the Darkside 😂
"Why Darth Plaugeis hated the g@y Jedi"
Then Disney stole and perverted this idea in The Acolyte, with obviously dark side witches using a more nonsensical take as an excuse.
NNNNNNOOOOOOO
Grey jedi weren't sexy enough
I thought Disney got rid of grey jedi, like they did with the meaning of colored lightsabers?
You cant compare fire and water to the Force lol. They are two completely different objects, whereas the Force is One. It all comes down to the person. Example, Jedi don't kill a person witha weapon. Under what context? After a heated battle or duel, Jedi would have never been effective during the Galactic Wars if they were truly a stickler to this rule. However, the more one engages in undisciplined behavior and acts, the more one will tilt to the dark, no different than a regular person who has learned to discriminate everything as they age due to an unresolved conflict in their past.
I’m here!
Day 553 of asking for a part 3 of what if anakin was trained by qui gon
There is no such thing as "Grey Jedi".
Yes there is lol
@derekfreeman1942 No there isn't. It doesn't work with George Lucas' idea of the force. Plus it was only introduced as a video game mechanic for Kotor that was slipped into the novels.
@@chrisclarke4665 idc about George Lucas he's not even the best writer in his own universe. Kotors writing was much better.
Says someone who has to ignore characters in canon or even legend
Ashoka the father the bendu, Cal so on
To say they don’t use the darkside or the light interchangeably
And don’t exactly use both all the time
Heck even Anakin in the world between worlds
Using the light and dark appearing as both Anakin and Vader
Not just using the light but also the dark to train Ashoka
That’s not to mention the examples in legends
Proves the concept does exist even in canon
So this idea the concept doesn’t or never existed
Are people who like to think in black and white
Guess what good and evil isn’t black and white
It’s the old saying grey doesn’t mean white and black dont exist or that the respective colors represent good and evil or someone are inbetween
only to figure out what is what takes more then just a first glazes and a use of positive or negative power doesn’t actually tell you if something is good or bad in of themselves
It’s the how why and result behind it
man i would love if you made a video about the canon lore that is not on the movies
Because Grey jedi are lame and the existence of Grey jedi contradicts the concept of a jedi.
Says someone who has to ignore characters in canon or even legend
Also Jedi aren’t good guys let alone follow the mission they preach
Which is following the will of the force
Which they do not in most eras
Ashoka the father the bendu, Cal so on
To say they don’t use the darkside or the light interchangeably
And don’t exactly use both all the time
Heck even Anakin in the world between worlds
Using the light and dark appearing as both Anakin and Vader
Not just using the light but also the dark to train Ashoka
That’s not to mention the examples in legends
Proves the concept does exist even in canon
So this idea the concept doesn’t or never existed
Are people who like to think in black and white
Guess what good and evil isn’t black and white
It’s the old saying grey doesn’t mean white and black dont exist or that the respective colors represent good and evil or someone are inbetween
only to figure out what is what takes more then just a first glazes and a use of positive or negative power doesn’t actually tell you if something is good or bad in of themselves
It’s the how why and result behind it
He knew Grey Jedi were a stupid idea.
Says someone who has to ignore characters in canon or even legend
Ashoka the father the bendu, Cal so on
To say they don’t use the darkside or the light interchangeably
And don’t exactly use both all the time
Heck even Anakin in the world between worlds
Using the light and dark appearing as both Anakin and Vader
Not just using the light but also the dark to train Ashoka
That’s not to mention the examples in legends
Proves the concept does exist even in canon
So this idea the concept doesn’t or never existed
Are people who like to think in black and white
Guess what good and evil isn’t black and white
It’s the old saying grey doesn’t mean white and black dont exist or that the respective colors represent good and evil or someone are inbetween
only to figure out what is what takes more then just a first glazes and a use of positive or negative power doesn’t actually tell you if something is good or bad in of themselves
It’s the how why and result behind it
Plagueis could not accept the grey jedis theory, bc he was already completely comitted to the dark, too selfish and too arrogant to accept he could have been even partially wrong. Plagueis the Ignorant would have been the better title xD
I don't agree with Kyle. It depends how you use powers of light and dark. Potentium is wrong. Though I can use Force Lighting in Kotor. You have to stay moderated with light and dark. You can use both sometimes. But I think Plagueis is right. May the Force be with you too😊
Welcome to the study of God and the devil....this is as close as it gets to real spiritual understanding
E
Grey Jedi as a concept do not exist. The light and dark are too antagonistic to eavh other and the force user will quickly be "forced" to pick a side
Plagueis in the book wasnt talkong about "grey jedi" he was specifically talking about "dark jedi" or fallen Jedi, who have turned away from the light side towards a darker path.
Says someone who has to ignore characters in canon or even legend
Ashoka the father the bendu, Cal so on
To say they don’t use the darkside or the light interchangeably
And don’t exactly use both all the time
Heck even Anakin in the world between worlds
Using the light and dark appearing as both Anakin and Vader
Not just using the light but also the dark to train Ashoka
That’s not to mention the examples in legends
Proves the concept does exist even in canon
So this idea the concept doesn’t or never existed
Are people who like to think in black and white
Guess what good and evil isn’t black and white
It’s the old saying grey doesn’t mean white and black dont exist or that the respective colors represent good and evil or someone are inbetween
only to figure out what is what takes more then just a first glazes and a use of positive or negative power doesn’t actually tell you if something is good or bad in of themselves
It’s the how why and result behind it
Grey jedi is not a thing. A gay jedi is though.
Yeah, I'd be a Gray Jedi or a Coffee Shop owner catering for them. 🙂
Lmao the "grey jedi" aren't even real in the SW universe, it's a BS concept of an edgy 13 y.o. who think they're very smart
Says someone who has to ignore characters in canon or even legend
Ashoka the father the bendu, Cal so on
To say they don’t use the darkside or the light interchangeably
And don’t exactly use both all the time
Heck even Anakin in the world between worlds
Using the light and dark appearing as both Anakin and Vader
Not just using the light but also the dark to train Ashoka
That’s not to mention the examples in legends
Proves the concept does exist even in canon
So this idea the concept doesn’t or never existed
Are people who like to think in black and white
Guess what good and evil isn’t black and white
It’s the old saying grey doesn’t mean white and black dont exist or that the respective colors represent good and evil or someone are inbetween
only to figure out what is what takes more then just a first glazes and a use of positive or negative power doesn’t actually tell you if something is good or bad in of themselves
It’s the how why and result behind it
Grey Jedi was ONLY brought up so they could sell Ahsoka as a protagonist.
You joking? It existed way before Ahsoka got created
Sound like Plageueis is a snake oil salesman. Like some cult guru spewing word salads. Yeah, Revan did it, but no he didn't do it. Yeah Revan was the most powerful force user because he used both sides, but he was actually weak because he used both sides. Yeah... need you to pick one there chief.
Lucas himself said there's no such thing as a Grey Jedi...
Says someone who has to ignore characters in canon or even legend
Ashoka the father the bendu, Cal so on
To say they don’t use the darkside or the light interchangeably
And don’t exactly use both all the time
Heck even Anakin in the world between worlds
Using the light and dark appearing as both Anakin and Vader
Not just using the light but also the dark to train Ashoka
That’s not to mention the examples in legends
Proves the concept does exist even in canon
So this idea the concept doesn’t or never existed
Are people who like to think in black and white
Guess what good and evil isn’t black and white
It’s the old saying grey doesn’t mean white and black dont exist or that the respective colors represent good and evil or someone are inbetween
only to figure out what is what takes more then just a first glazes and a use of positive or negative power doesn’t actually tell you if something is good or bad in of themselves
It’s the how why and result behind it
GL created the ones the father son and daughter
The light the dark and the one in balance
Saying everyone should be like the father not the son or daughter
So being in the light like the daughter doesn’t solve the problem nor the answer
Same as the son
The father was and js where you should be if you want to serve the force
Why do you guys keeping talking about grey Jedi!? There is no such thing.
The term "grey Jedi" is fan made and has never been mentioned in any comic, novel, movie or show.
Wrong
lol grey jedi shouldn’t exist lol either jedi or sith lol no middle ground lol
Says someone who has to ignore characters in canon or even legend
Ashoka the father the bendu, Cal so on
To say they don’t use the darkside or the light interchangeably
And don’t exactly use both all the time
Heck even Anakin in the world between worlds
Using the light and dark appearing as both Anakin and Vader
Not just using the light but also the dark to train Ashoka
That’s not to mention the examples in legends
Proves the concept does exist even in canon
So this idea the concept doesn’t or never existed
Are people who like to think in black and white
Guess what good and evil isn’t black and white
It’s the old saying grey doesn’t mean white and black dont exist or that the respective colors represent good and evil or someone are inbetween
only to figure out what is what takes more then just a first glazes and a use of positive or negative power doesn’t actually tell you if something is good or bad in of themselves
It’s the how why and result behind it
@@ATalesTruth- needledick
The Force is a neutral energy, except when Disney corrupts it. Even the Sith have some ideals. Disney is just poison.
And you’re just a fool
Easy, there are no Gray Jedi.