My group has adopted these and we love them so far. one point to suggest is that the basket is made of carbon steel and it WILL rust VERY quickly. painting it with something like rustoleum or gun blue will protect it well and also make it look much more interesting. As far as the ears go, the steel is robust enough for you to be able to practice blade trapping, and versus another blackfencer the blades actually fit into the ears quite well.
cool video, and good information. there is some trippy wavey stuff going on where the background is warping around your head and the sword O_o witchcraft!!
+anathamon Thanks. That oddity with the background is due to youtube auto-stabilisation on upload. It is now resolved and only appears on a couple of videos.
Hi there! :) I wonder how significantly changed point of balance affects swords handling, hence how hard is to adopt when switching to full-steel sword, being this sparring blunt replica, or sharp one for practice of cuts (as on tatami mats, for example). I assume that overall weight makes a difference in speed of a weapon, but this is not as hard to adopt to. But I suppose (I'm only theoretician so far) that significant change of point of balance can make "feel" of a blade totally different.
Point of balance can change handling quite a lot. Though how that balance is created through its mass distribution can be as significant as the balance itself. In terms of how it could be an issue. Well with the Black Fencer range, I have constantly pushed them to make the balance correct and typical of original steel swords. Same for weight. Of course originals can vary a lot, but the BF swords are within typical ranges of original steel for most of their swords. So there is nothing to adapt to.
Thank you. You've mentioned in the video, that point of balance is shifted towards the hilt when compared to original, historical sword would be. This would be 2" vs 4", so about 5 cm vs. 10 cm. As for a theoretician, it is hard to judge for me how noticeable impact this have on handling. :) Anyway, thx. for your answer. Best wishes! :)
Email or talk it over with them as they might order something in for you or hold it on the next order. It's not normal to be able to get BF stuff off the shelf. We buy direct and its about 12-14 weeks. The only way we can get them quicker is through a reseller like fait d'armes in France, which I suppose you could order from too.
There are many considerations as to why, some significant ones are manufacturing process. Sheet metal production methods really developed significantly in the very late 18th and early 19th century. Becoming common in the mid 19th century. Which finally allowed the cheap and easy production of bowls. Next is wearability/comfort. A sword spends most of its time in the sheath, on ones side, and not being used in combat. The larger the hilt, the more awkward and uncomfortable it is to wear. Bowl type guards are quite a nuisance to wear compared to say stirrup hilts, or even three bars where the primary protection is on the outside (not digging in to your side. Fashion is another factor. Fashion has played a major factor in sword design, and specifically sword hilt design for a long time, even in mass produced weapons of war sometimes. Various brass bowl and bowl like guards were used in the 18th century as brass casting techniques improved rapidly, but the problem is that they are comparatively weak compared to steel. A bowl guard also adds weight. If you compare a bowl guard to a simple stirrup guard, it is a lot heavier. That weight not only increases the total sword weight, but brings the balance closer to the hilt for equivalent blades, reducing the cutting power of the blade. In a military context, swords that can stack flat are also hugely beneficial to storage and transport in quantity.
Have you (or any others at the club) used the Windlass Eglinton basket hilt: (kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=501435) it meets the length/ weight/balance specs that Guy Windsor has in his pamphlets and the price is great (in the U.S. anyway). If not, what are some of the other Scottish broad/backsword options used?
No, but I have been meaning to buy one. Windlass quality can be really hit and miss though, and i suspect the blade won't hold up long term. They are pretty cheap here too, which is why I will get one anyway, and replace the blade if necessary. Weight wise it is certainly at the high end of what you'd want to use for a basket hilt. It is near 1.5kg, and whilst that is within the historical range, it is at the high end. There aren't a lot of good options for basket hilts. Some use Armourclass in Scotland, which are good for hilts, but their blades are a little whippy and soft for the HEMA types, and overly heavy for their re-enactment ones. Darkwood Armoury are good, though expensive. I use one of their basket hilts and have had it for years. Castille get a good rep, but are ugly and still expensive.
+fockmen Yes. We teach late 18th/early 19th century British military swordsmanship from the Roworth/Taylor manual, where the system was taught for the Scottish broadsword, the sabre and the spadroon. There are other treatise of course, including specific Scottish texts involving the Targe (round shield) as was common a little earlier on.
+Dan Ellis Yep, but the practical blunt model, and a sharp that we had blunted down. Back when they were less than half the price they are today, they weren't too bad an option, but at todays prices they just aren't work it. The edges take a lot of damage, the hilt isn't especially strong and the hilt rattles loose really quickly. Also, they are just too short and too light.
really? i think for a baskethilt broadsword its pretty damn nice looking. bh broadswords are among the ugliest looking types of swords though, as far as i'm concerned.
His attractiveness is bending light around him.
Respect, bro.
My group has adopted these and we love them so far. one point to suggest is that the basket is made of carbon steel and it WILL rust VERY quickly. painting it with something like rustoleum or gun blue will protect it well and also make it look much more interesting. As far as the ears go, the steel is robust enough for you to be able to practice blade trapping, and versus another blackfencer the blades actually fit into the ears quite well.
Is this true of the rapier models as well?
one review of your rapier of Danelli, please.
+Ezio De Nueva Galicia It's on the list to do. Coming soon.
cool video, and good information. there is some trippy wavey stuff going on where the background is warping around your head and the sword O_o witchcraft!!
+anathamon Thanks. That oddity with the background is due to youtube auto-stabilisation on upload. It is now resolved and only appears on a couple of videos.
Guys, please, please tell me, is it allowed to carry it with or as hand luggage during international flights? highly appreciate your help
No, only in the hold.
Hi there! :) I wonder how significantly changed point of balance affects swords handling, hence how hard is to adopt when switching to full-steel sword, being this sparring blunt replica, or sharp one for practice of cuts (as on tatami mats, for example). I assume that overall weight makes a difference in speed of a weapon, but this is not as hard to adopt to. But I suppose (I'm only theoretician so far) that significant change of point of balance can make "feel" of a blade totally different.
Point of balance can change handling quite a lot. Though how that balance is created through its mass distribution can be as significant as the balance itself. In terms of how it could be an issue. Well with the Black Fencer range, I have constantly pushed them to make the balance correct and typical of original steel swords. Same for weight. Of course originals can vary a lot, but the BF swords are within typical ranges of original steel for most of their swords. So there is nothing to adapt to.
Thank you. You've mentioned in the video, that point of balance is shifted towards the hilt when compared to original, historical sword would be. This would be 2" vs 4", so about 5 cm vs. 10 cm. As for a theoretician, it is hard to judge for me how noticeable impact this have on handling. :) Anyway, thx. for your answer. Best wishes! :)
I live in the states , so I go through south coast swords. However, they haven’t had any in stock for a few weeks. Any suggestions?
Email or talk it over with them as they might order something in for you or hold it on the next order. It's not normal to be able to get BF stuff off the shelf. We buy direct and its about 12-14 weeks. The only way we can get them quicker is through a reseller like fait d'armes in France, which I suppose you could order from too.
Why did people use hilts with bars instead of a bowl? Are there any pros and cons or did they just not think of it?
There are many considerations as to why, some significant ones are manufacturing process. Sheet metal production methods really developed significantly in the very late 18th and early 19th century. Becoming common in the mid 19th century. Which finally allowed the cheap and easy production of bowls.
Next is wearability/comfort. A sword spends most of its time in the sheath, on ones side, and not being used in combat. The larger the hilt, the more awkward and uncomfortable it is to wear. Bowl type guards are quite a nuisance to wear compared to say stirrup hilts, or even three bars where the primary protection is on the outside (not digging in to your side.
Fashion is another factor. Fashion has played a major factor in sword design, and specifically sword hilt design for a long time, even in mass produced weapons of war sometimes.
Various brass bowl and bowl like guards were used in the 18th century as brass casting techniques improved rapidly, but the problem is that they are comparatively weak compared to steel.
A bowl guard also adds weight. If you compare a bowl guard to a simple stirrup guard, it is a lot heavier. That weight not only increases the total sword weight, but brings the balance closer to the hilt for equivalent blades, reducing the cutting power of the blade.
In a military context, swords that can stack flat are also hugely beneficial to storage and transport in quantity.
Have you (or any others at the club) used the Windlass Eglinton basket hilt: (kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=501435)
it meets the length/ weight/balance specs that Guy Windsor has in his pamphlets and the price is great (in the U.S. anyway).
If not, what are some of the other Scottish broad/backsword options used?
No, but I have been meaning to buy one. Windlass quality can be really hit and miss though, and i suspect the blade won't hold up long term. They are pretty cheap here too, which is why I will get one anyway, and replace the blade if necessary.
Weight wise it is certainly at the high end of what you'd want to use for a basket hilt. It is near 1.5kg, and whilst that is within the historical range, it is at the high end.
There aren't a lot of good options for basket hilts. Some use Armourclass in Scotland, which are good for hilts, but their blades are a little whippy and soft for the HEMA types, and overly heavy for their re-enactment ones.
Darkwood Armoury are good, though expensive. I use one of their basket hilts and have had it for years. Castille get a good rep, but are ugly and still expensive.
do you use Scottish Basket Hilt Broadsword the same as a sabre?
+fockmen Yes. We teach late 18th/early 19th century British military swordsmanship from the Roworth/Taylor manual, where the system was taught for the Scottish broadsword, the sabre and the spadroon. There are other treatise of course, including specific Scottish texts involving the Targe (round shield) as was common a little earlier on.
Have you ever used a Hanwei Mortuary sword?
+Dan Ellis Yep, but the practical blunt model, and a sharp that we had blunted down. Back when they were less than half the price they are today, they weren't too bad an option, but at todays prices they just aren't work it. The edges take a lot of damage, the hilt isn't especially strong and the hilt rattles loose really quickly. Also, they are just too short and too light.
That's all well and good, but here, lemme show you my Scottish Basket Case Broadsword
I must admit that that is the most hideous BH sword ive ever seen!
Yeah, Scots were not known for their artistry.
really? i think for a baskethilt broadsword its pretty damn nice looking. bh broadswords are among the ugliest looking types of swords though, as far as i'm concerned.