The image used at 8:48 is of an 11 speed SRAM Rival crankset, which looks significantly less modern than the Rival AXS that you are talking about in the video. The Rival AXS crank looks quite a lot like the 105 Di2 crankset in reality.
June 2023 and the Shimano105 set is now USD 1,190, just picked a set up yesterday. Not that hard to find at this price range, that price I stated includes taxes, so it's less than the Rival and you get the added benefit of reliability, durability. I've heard negatives about SRAM ...
Nope. Outrageously expensive. Anyone buying bikes on 105 budget would be MUCH BETTER served investing that money on a superior pair of wheels or lighter carbon parts. 105 should IMO have remain completely mechanic. Ultegra should have had both options and Durace only DI2.
The aftermarket price has nothing to do with the equation imo.. the value is mainly on prebuilt OEM bikes where you're not paying the MSRP tag for the 105. Also I'd say the high MSRP is an attempt to make it less demanded by those looking for an upgrade and to push people over to Ultegra as an upgrade because of the similar price.
I ride the 105 mec. group set and feel the brakes are good for my riding so that is not a deterrent to me. I also would rather have the 11-36 rear cog option as the hills here can be taxing. The price is the biggest issue for me as I like my 11 sp 105 enough not to dump that amount of money simply for the added speed of shifting gears. If I wasn't 74 years old and was competing I would think Di2 was the way to go but I would more than likely bite the bullet and move to one of the two top-tier options. I think at this price point 105 is not a good move for someone in my situation.
I was looking forward to treating myself on retiring in 18 months to a new bike with Ultegra Di2, but the prices have gone mad. My current Emonda SL6 cost £2k two years ago, you won't get anywhere near that level now. So now I think I'll either: a. get 105 instead now and just buy an Ultegra cassette as I'm sure I can do without the hood buttons; let's be honest, most folk just control their head unit with those anyway. b. just buy some blingier wheels and a power meter for the SL6. And a holiday.
I got a 2023 emonda sl6 pro with 105 di2 i did switch the rear cassette to ultegra and it actually shifts better up and down. The 105 cassette felt clunky also replaced my chain to kmc and had it waxed and im loving my bike. My first di2. I have a 2020 domane sl6 with ultegra mechanical and i will be switching them to sram rival nxt week do i can do a comparison
I have 105 mech. Hyperglide+ should have been included. Even super cheap Deore has Hyperglide+. This isn't a cost cutting measure. The groupset is too expensive too, compared to mechanical 105, and Rival.
@Charles Man The price will decrease substantially when the market settles and it goes on sale. It's only close to Ultegra now because it's so new. It'll reduce by 20% in due course.
Having grown up Campag then spending more than a couple of decades in the shimano ecosystem , I’m quite content with being in and remaining in the Sram family
This year I downgraded from an Ultegra Di2 equipped bike to a Rival AXS one. Honestly, I can't tell it's a lower tear groupset. It feels great, I love the simpler approach to shifting gears and it has a powermeter. It also works with my Karoo 2, which I hear Shimano is having some issues with. So, my advice would be - forget about the marketing **** and go with what makes you feel good and what you can afford. That's all that matters.
I'd say it's not, I'm riding a mixed rival/force setup now after switching from 11s Ultegra di2 and it did take some weight off the bike as well as the brakes feel better imo on the AXS hydraulic than old 11s di2 hydraulic. It's just more sturdy in the lever and the modulation feels more linear (?)
I’m riding the new 105 di2 with upgraded MT800 discs on my Kinesis GTDv2. Love it. Very reliable and intuitive. Tend to ride on semi synchronised mode with a lot of steep climbs around here. It’s nice to have full control of the front derailleur. Expensive yes, enjoyable yes, regret buying…. Absolutely not! Bravo Shimano. 👏🏻
I had 105 since mid 80¨ties up to 2017 where I finally changed to Ultegra, when it comes to electronic, i now change to SRAM, better looking and wireless, something Shimano could learn something about, in my humble opinion
Even if Shimano wanted to they can't really. Look at Campy and their crappy design. Sram patented the groupset design using the same battery standard for both FD and RD, hence Campy had to resort to using two different styles.
If you look new Cube agree shimano 105 di2 is 300€ cheaper then rival one. Shimano groupset are cheaper if you buy them with the bike. If the price was the same I would take rival. Between force and ultegra di2 I would pick ultegra.
Any electronic group set isn't worth for sportive cyclist, unless you are racing at some highest level. I have two bikes on ultegra and one on 11s Campy, and each one costs at about new 105 gruppo alone. And, no, they're not old, when bikes was cheaper, I've built them during last one and half year.
That is true and reasonable, but worth/value are relative to every single one of us. If a peace of gear makes us feel good and ride more, we should just enjoy the ride :)
@@NemanjaPantelic Yes, if somebody can afford enjoyment of clicking buttons instead of shifting, the problem is that you will have no choice, all higher level group sets are only electronic and super expensive. High end but affordable gruppo means mechanical.
@@romanpramuka2703 That's a good point. Times are changing, so is cycling I guess. Somewhere we win, somewhere we get screwed. It took me eight years of trading up before I was lucky enough to buy my dream bike. What I'm trying to say is: there are ways to get what we want, if we really want it. But, how to go on about it is different for everyone.
@@NemanjaPantelic that's a poetic answer 😉. For that reason I've recently built three bikes for me, all with 11s mechanical shifting (while it's available and affordable). One with disc brakes, one lightweight with rim brakes, and one gravel bike. They will serve me for ages.
If you put that 400 pound difference into substituting the rival crank for a red crank then sram would be significantly lighter than 105 for the same money and look more premium too.
To be real the only people riding full 105 di2 will be with bikes which came stock with it at a lower price than any other electronic alternative, that's clearly its target market
I wish dia compe still made a rear derailleur. If they still made the dia compe gran compe they could carve themselves out a nice section of the mkt for mechanical groupsets
just a reminder to the sram goupies that keep harping on the new 105's price point; its still a less expensive system than Rival when built onto a bike. The stand alone "groupset cost" isn't the metric you think it is.
1:34 one can clearly see Shimano just used the same stamping tool for charings on all three groupset. That is why chainring fit perfectly to the 9200, but looks like a bodge on 8100 and 7150. Just to save a a bit money? What a disgrace to a Japanese company, who recently celebrated it's 100th year. And none of the so-called cycling channels are mentioning this. Either they are blind or sell outs. BTW I have a 8100 crankset. I hope Shimano in thr near future makes up for their mistake, and tool proper charings like in their last two generation groupset.
Same thing I always tell my buddies… I’ve got enough batteries to charge and enough wireless connectivity issues in other aspects of my life. I want cycling to be an escape from all that
I haven’t used it, but I don’t know why you would buy it when you can still buy 8070. This is geared better though than 9200 and 8100, 11-30 12 speed is pointless to me. It’s only for those who are strangely obsessed with having a 16t cog.
I first bought the sram rival with 46 chainring and just hated it and switched immediately for 105 di with a 52 chainring. 46 is too soft, dunno how it would be the 48, didn't want to prove it. I'm really happy with my 105.
I got older model DI2 in Ultegra tbh it’s not worth the upgrade for that one 16t sprocket. As for usage Shimano is more intuitive to use than SRAM ( well for me that is ) it may simple like paddle shifts on a car ( one side up the other down ) but I could never get the shift both together to change the front rings always bodied this and dropped chain hated this white SRAM so it was always Shimano for me as it makes more sense Right for back and Left for the front then you have your respective hi/lo levers more akin to the days of cable shift 105 etc
Fun fact: Campagnolo Chorus Disc 12 mechanical to be had at approx 1.100£ currently… 😅 On a serious note, more relevant comparison would be how much is a 105 Di2 Bike? Seems you get some choice online at 3.000£ or even below that. CUBE Agree C:62 being one.
"The other really noticeable thing about them is that they don't have any cooling things like..." As it pans over a shot of brake pads with fins and slotted rotors 🙄
It's funny wiggle emailed to say the last gen 105 rim brake on sale @ £300, just shows what a joke the price is on this new groupset. If they could not of created di2 cheaper they should of left a mechanical option. To be honest with the price you may as well pay the couple of hundred and get ultegra. Also the new generation rim brake ultegra is the same price as this 105. I cannot believe you did not mention this as its essentially priced itself out you may as well get ultegra now, only a little bit more and it has all the newest features.
The price of 105 di2 is dropping quite a bit, now being similar or even cheaper than rival in some cases. However, I still found 105 di2 hardly attractive, it stil has stupid power cables running in your frame, a much slower FD, and you cannot use satellite buttons. It is even harder to image shimano has cut down so many features on a groupset that is priced this expensive.
I think Shimano have shot themselves in the foot. This mid range groupset is no longer mid range in price. Chinese manufacturers are already making some decent mechanical offerings for a lot less and it's only a matter of time before they make an electronic groupset for less money also. There is still gonna be a demand for a mid range mechanical groupset and my guess is, China will fill that void.
Given we are paying an extra grand I wouldn't say the same braking power as mech 105 is acceptable. I'd want it to have at least servo wave and better rotors. Speaking from experience, those poverty spec ones are crap and warp so easily
Mechanical 105 rim/disc brake groupsets are selling for seriously low prices, £300 and £500 respectively. Why waste money on overpriced and overhyped 105 di2???
Why put an overpriced and overweight hydro/electro groupset on a road bike? I hope Shimano will offer an Ultegra mechanical groupset soon or I will have to switch to Capagnolo.
@@mjames2295 Reminds me of presenters who have the standard phrase of "In a nutshell" which may make you believe they are coming to the end, but they are just finishing this nut. I would disagree that it is succinct, as to do so it would talk about the product, list the pros and cons, and then summarise. This presentation meanders with the over use of "however", which disengages the recipient from the content. Could be better, 3 stars
For £1700, I’d rather buy a new bike with a mechanical groupset! Wiggle had 105 mechanical on offer for £299 (rim brake admittedly) THAT is groupset of the people money!
I’ve just bought a 105 12 speed chainset on line the finish on it is awful my older style 105 is way better to the point I’m thinking of taking the chainrings off and putting them on the older model if that’s possible
The image used at 8:48 is of an 11 speed SRAM Rival crankset, which looks significantly less modern than the Rival AXS that you are talking about in the video. The Rival AXS crank looks quite a lot like the 105 Di2 crankset in reality.
June 2023 and the Shimano105 set is now USD 1,190, just picked a set up yesterday. Not that hard to find at this price range, that price I stated includes taxes, so it's less than the Rival and you get the added benefit of reliability, durability. I've heard negatives about SRAM ...
Never buy a SRAM with FD. Their 1bys are solid and Transmissions are cool, but they can't seem to nail FD.
Nope. Outrageously expensive. Anyone buying bikes on 105 budget would be MUCH BETTER served investing that money on a superior pair of wheels or lighter carbon parts. 105 should IMO have remain completely mechanic. Ultegra should have had both options and Durace only DI2.
Totally agree 👍
The aftermarket price has nothing to do with the equation imo.. the value is mainly on prebuilt OEM bikes where you're not paying the MSRP tag for the 105. Also I'd say the high MSRP is an attempt to make it less demanded by those looking for an upgrade and to push people over to Ultegra as an upgrade because of the similar price.
This guy gets it 💯
Good news, they now have 12 speed mechanical 105!
I ride the 105 mec. group set and feel the brakes are good for my riding so that is not a deterrent to me. I also would rather have the 11-36 rear cog option as the hills here can be taxing. The price is the biggest issue for me as I like my 11 sp 105 enough not to dump that amount of money simply for the added speed of shifting gears. If I wasn't 74 years old and was competing I would think Di2 was the way to go but I would more than likely bite the bullet and move to one of the two top-tier options. I think at this price point 105 is not a good move for someone in my situation.
Says "long term review" in the title, states absolutely nothing about the longevity of the groupset at all 👍
What about the longevity of di2 and Rival front and rear derailleurs vs. mechanical ?
I was looking forward to treating myself on retiring in 18 months to a new bike with Ultegra Di2, but the prices have gone mad. My current Emonda SL6 cost £2k two years ago, you won't get anywhere near that level now.
So now I think I'll either:
a. get 105 instead now and just buy an Ultegra cassette as I'm sure I can do without the hood buttons; let's be honest, most folk just control their head unit with those anyway.
b. just buy some blingier wheels and a power meter for the SL6. And a holiday.
Retiring in 18 months. Outstanding.
I got a 2023 emonda sl6 pro with 105 di2 i did switch the rear cassette to ultegra and it actually shifts better up and down. The 105 cassette felt clunky also replaced my chain to kmc and had it waxed and im loving my bike. My first di2. I have a 2020 domane sl6 with ultegra mechanical and i will be switching them to sram rival nxt week do i can do a comparison
I have 105 mech. Hyperglide+ should have been included. Even super cheap Deore has Hyperglide+. This isn't a cost cutting measure. The groupset is too expensive too, compared to mechanical 105, and Rival.
Just buy Ultegra casette when you will change them and now you have HyperGlide+.
@Charles Man The price will decrease substantially when the market settles and it goes on sale. It's only close to Ultegra now because it's so new. It'll reduce by 20% in due course.
@Charles Man i agree with all you’ve said. I’m a campy guy from way back - it’s finicky though.
Currently 105 di2 is around $1200 in my place
Having grown up Campag then spending more than a couple of decades in the shimano ecosystem , I’m quite content with being in and remaining in the Sram family
Is the 12 spd 105 di2 compatible with other 12spd di2 components? (eg. Ultegra shifters but 105 rear n front derailleur vice versa…)
Yes it is
If you set up synchro shift on 105 and program the shifters, it’s actually even simpler than SRAM
This year I downgraded from an Ultegra Di2 equipped bike to a Rival AXS one. Honestly, I can't tell it's a lower tear groupset. It feels great, I love the simpler approach to shifting gears and it has a powermeter. It also works with my Karoo 2, which I hear Shimano is having some issues with. So, my advice would be - forget about the marketing **** and go with what makes you feel good and what you can afford. That's all that matters.
I'd say it's not, I'm riding a mixed rival/force setup now after switching from 11s Ultegra di2 and it did take some weight off the bike as well as the brakes feel better imo on the AXS hydraulic than old 11s di2 hydraulic. It's just more sturdy in the lever and the modulation feels more linear (?)
Rival AXS looks heavy,
Bikes look like motorbikes,
ABS brakes coming soon 😄
@@laurentduval7025 Whats your weight
I’m riding the new 105 di2 with upgraded MT800 discs on my Kinesis GTDv2. Love it. Very reliable and intuitive. Tend to ride on semi synchronised mode with a lot of steep climbs around here. It’s nice to have full control of the front derailleur. Expensive yes, enjoyable yes, regret buying…. Absolutely not! Bravo Shimano. 👏🏻
Im about to buy the same group, my question to you is, are you happy with the performance of it ?
@@AngeloG999 I do. It's not cheap but if you can afford it, don't hesitate
This presenter is really good in my eyes. Really enjoy his presentation style and manner
Naah, don't like him. Looks like a midget.
I had 105 since mid 80¨ties up to 2017 where I finally changed to Ultegra, when it comes to electronic, i now change to SRAM, better looking and wireless, something Shimano could learn something about, in my humble opinion
Even if Shimano wanted to they can't really. Look at Campy and their crappy design. Sram patented the groupset design using the same battery standard for both FD and RD, hence Campy had to resort to using two different styles.
Still love mechanical Ultegra 🤩👍🚴
Always been a great option. But the newer high end frames are designed for electric only. Sucks.
That's what I'm looking at, on 105 now. Will do the jump to Ultegra when the pocket permits 😁
I thought so too, but the FD is finicky and throws chains. Nowhere near as good as electronic shifting.
If you look new Cube agree shimano 105 di2 is 300€ cheaper then rival one. Shimano groupset are cheaper if you buy them with the bike. If the price was the same I would take rival. Between force and ultegra di2 I would pick ultegra.
Just proving that they are selling 105 di2 oem cheap to bike manufacturers but ripping off the public with expensive groupsets off the shelf.
Online you can buy it for 1300€ now, wait 6 months and you could get it close to 1000€.
@@SebastianTominec not in the Uk it isn’t more like £1400 upwards with SRAM Rival about £1300.
its never worth it to buy separate. crazy premium dollars.
@@SebastianTominec True. 4 months on and a groupset is 1095€
What is schram rival ?
Hi, the 105 di2 working with Shimano Shimano Dura Ace Di2 Sw-r9150?
If you change the chain rings, cassete and chain to Ultegra's, it will be very smooth. No more metalic noise and the durability is increased.
Any electronic group set isn't worth for sportive cyclist, unless you are racing at some highest level. I have two bikes on ultegra and one on 11s Campy, and each one costs at about new 105 gruppo alone. And, no, they're not old, when bikes was cheaper, I've built them during last one and half year.
That is true and reasonable, but worth/value are relative to every single one of us. If a peace of gear makes us feel good and ride more, we should just enjoy the ride :)
It’s a luxury item. No it’s certainly not needed, but nice to have if you can afford it
@@NemanjaPantelic Yes, if somebody can afford enjoyment of clicking buttons instead of shifting, the problem is that you will have no choice, all higher level group sets are only electronic and super expensive. High end but affordable gruppo means mechanical.
@@romanpramuka2703 That's a good point. Times are changing, so is cycling I guess. Somewhere we win, somewhere we get screwed. It took me eight years of trading up before I was lucky enough to buy my dream bike. What I'm trying to say is: there are ways to get what we want, if we really want it. But, how to go on about it is different for everyone.
@@NemanjaPantelic that's a poetic answer 😉. For that reason I've recently built three bikes for me, all with 11s mechanical shifting (while it's available and affordable). One with disc brakes, one lightweight with rim brakes, and one gravel bike. They will serve me for ages.
If you put that 400 pound difference into substituting the rival crank for a red crank then sram would be significantly lighter than 105 for the same money and look more premium too.
You have a great point. I’ll add that at this level, I think most buyers aren’t too concerned about weight. Maybe at ultegra level sure.
Don’t forget the shockingly affordable rival power meter option which the 105 lacks
To be real the only people riding full 105 di2 will be with bikes which came stock with it at a lower price than any other electronic alternative, that's clearly its target market
I wish dia compe still made a rear derailleur. If they still made the dia compe gran compe they could carve themselves out a nice section of the mkt for mechanical groupsets
If you change only rotors on a 105di2 groupset with disc ultegra ICE tech freeza, Can you have the same brake than ultegra. Thanks
Yes its work perfectly
Which helmet do you use?
개인적 그래블 자전거에 di2구동계 한번 해보고 싶었는데 105도 나왔네요^^ 캠핑용 트레일러 달고 다닐때 괜찮을거 같아서 보네요^^👍
Fair review and comparison c👍🏾
just a reminder to the sram goupies that keep harping on the new 105's price point;
its still a less expensive system than Rival when built onto a bike.
The stand alone "groupset cost" isn't the metric you think it is.
1:34 one can clearly see Shimano just used the same stamping tool for charings on all three groupset. That is why chainring fit perfectly to the 9200, but looks like a bodge on 8100 and 7150. Just to save a a bit money? What a disgrace to a Japanese company, who recently celebrated it's 100th year.
And none of the so-called cycling channels are mentioning this. Either they are blind or sell outs.
BTW I have a 8100 crankset. I hope Shimano in thr near future makes up for their mistake, and tool proper charings like in their last two generation groupset.
I hope this becomes available in India in near future.
Until then, Sora Zindabad!!
I rather go with Ultegra mech.
How is this a long term review of 105? All you do is talk about the differences between 105/Ultegra/Dura-Ace.
good video, but the shot at 05:30 was unnecessary!
I'll stick to my 105 mechanical it works just fine; all I need is more electronics in my life, not!
Same thing I always tell my buddies… I’ve got enough batteries to charge and enough wireless connectivity issues in other aspects of my life. I want cycling to be an escape from all that
Agree. No thanks to Electronic shifting. 105 mech is good as is.
Mech any day.
I bought SRAM Red with a power meter for £1550 🤷♂️
Waiting for the 52-36 chainset then I’ll be upgrading. Any idea when this is being released??
11 speed crankset are listed as compatible by shimano in the meantime 👍
I haven’t used it, but I don’t know why you would buy it when you can still buy 8070. This is geared better though than 9200 and 8100, 11-30 12 speed is pointless to me. It’s only for those who are strangely obsessed with having a 16t cog.
I first bought the sram rival with 46 chainring and just hated it and switched immediately for 105 di with a 52 chainring. 46 is too soft, dunno how it would be the 48, didn't want to prove it. I'm really happy with my 105.
I got older model DI2 in Ultegra tbh it’s not worth the upgrade for that one 16t sprocket. As for usage Shimano is more intuitive to use than SRAM ( well for me that is ) it may simple like paddle shifts on a car ( one side up the other down ) but I could never get the shift both together to change the front rings always bodied this and dropped chain hated this white SRAM so it was always Shimano for me as it makes more sense Right for back and Left for the front then you have your respective hi/lo levers more akin to the days of cable shift 105 etc
Fun fact: Campagnolo Chorus Disc 12 mechanical to be had at approx 1.100£ currently… 😅 On a serious note, more relevant comparison would be how much is a 105 Di2 Bike? Seems you get some choice online at 3.000£ or even below that. CUBE Agree C:62 being one.
Yep, that was ‘fun’ fact.
"The other really noticeable thing about them is that they don't have any cooling things like..." As it pans over a shot of brake pads with fins and slotted rotors 🙄
It's funny wiggle emailed to say the last gen 105 rim brake on sale @ £300, just shows what a joke the price is on this new groupset. If they could not of created di2 cheaper they should of left a mechanical option. To be honest with the price you may as well pay the couple of hundred and get ultegra. Also the new generation rim brake ultegra is the same price as this 105. I cannot believe you did not mention this as its essentially priced itself out you may as well get ultegra now, only a little bit more and it has all the newest features.
If you think that Sram is better, you dont know what youre talking about.
The price of 105 di2 is dropping quite a bit, now being similar or even cheaper than rival in some cases.
However, I still found 105 di2 hardly attractive, it stil has stupid power cables running in your frame, a much slower FD, and you cannot use satellite buttons.
It is even harder to image shimano has cut down so many features on a groupset that is priced this expensive.
I think Shimano have shot themselves in the foot. This mid range groupset is no longer mid range in price. Chinese manufacturers are already making some decent mechanical offerings for a lot less and it's only a matter of time before they make an electronic groupset for less money also. There is still gonna be a demand for a mid range mechanical groupset and my guess is, China will fill that void.
Good review. Terrible value. I just don’t see it. If you have the budget, the Shimano option is the clear winner.
Given we are paying an extra grand I wouldn't say the same braking power as mech 105 is acceptable. I'd want it to have at least servo wave and better rotors. Speaking from experience, those poverty spec ones are crap and warp so easily
People love Di2. Just the price tag that hold me back. 😢
Bikes at similar specs with rival groups are actually more expensive, weird.
Shimano reliability over SRAM every day.
Let's say I'm a millionaire, so "whether it's worth the money or not" is moot. So, price no option, is the electronic shifter worth it?
$ 3000 for shifting gears?
1730 for 105?? that must be a typo. this suppose to be the cheap groupset.
Claris is the cheap groupset.
Mechanical 105 rim/disc brake groupsets are selling for seriously low prices, £300 and £500 respectively. Why waste money on overpriced and overhyped 105 di2???
Way to expensive & no rim version, BIG mistake.
Yes, this is better!
Who else here running a Shimano 600?
I recently serviced my sons bike and was disappointed with the ridges on the inside of the chainring,stupid design which attracts dirt.
It’s s ram. Not shram 🤦🏻♂️ after Scott ray and Stan.
Or up grade to a 70s Suntour bar end friction cable shifter.. Any wheel 5 6 7 8 910 11 . keep it simple.. :0.
Too expensive…. Tiagra is fine
Why put an overpriced and overweight hydro/electro groupset on a road bike?
I hope Shimano will offer an Ultegra mechanical groupset soon or I will have to switch to Capagnolo.
shall we play a drinking game, for everyone he says "however"
Agreed, however, his presentation is detailed, well presented and succinct so 👍 from me
@@mjames2295 Reminds me of presenters who have the standard phrase of "In a nutshell" which may make you believe they are coming to the end, but they are just finishing this nut. I would disagree that it is succinct, as to do so it would talk about the product, list the pros and cons, and then summarise. This presentation meanders with the over use of "however", which disengages the recipient from the content. Could be better, 3 stars
@@davidthornley4375 relative term not absolute. Still detailed and well presented. Told me all the info I needed to know.
No rim version so no interest
HOWEVER
Annoying music in background
I can get a campag super record mechanical groupset for the same price and save a ton of weight. 105 di2 is a joke.
who care about 100g ... vs 400P ... go for sram
For £1700, I’d rather buy a new bike with a mechanical groupset!
Wiggle had 105 mechanical on offer for £299 (rim brake admittedly) THAT is groupset of the people money!
Really, however
Wireless wins
Ugggh. That super long cage looks ugly Looks like a MTB derailleur.. Bring back the short cage! There are zillions of us who do not need granny gears.
is a shame, see the enduro/DH zee have SS cage and pass 36t cogs, and all road groupset use longer GS/SGS cages to shift 34t. is ridiculous
@@KyriaxWitch bruh, DH riders probably take chairlift to go up. Not a good comparison
@@binshuo i talk about cage and capacity of zee/saint derailleurs not the groupset at all.
noice!
I’ve just bought a 105 12 speed chainset on line the finish on it is awful my older style 105 is way better to the point I’m thinking of taking the chainrings off and putting them on the older model if that’s possible
The contours won't match, despite both cranksets using the same asymmetrical 4-bolt 110 mm BCD bolt pattern.