Real vs Fake Financial Engineering Degrees
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 มิ.ย. 2024
- In a lot of my videos I discuss "real" and "fake" financial engineering degrees. This video covers in detail what I mean my real and fake. The main issue is that a lot of universities are cashing in on the "quant" popularity trends. Programs list their programs as financial engineering, risk management, computational finance, and etc. however the programs are really business analytics programs. This same issue is now shifting more to data science where TONS of programs are titling their program "data science" however they are general introduction style degrees.
"Real" programs are programs that I feel go into depth and specialize in one are. If a program diversifies their skills too much it is essentially an undergraduate degree and not a masters of PhD. These "fake" programs would have a lot better job placement if they listed their degree with the correct title. Students end up applying for jobs with similar titles however no one will hire them because they don't have the right skills. A lot of these students end up in business analytics because that is what their degree is designed for. I by no means want people to think that "fake" programs are bad. Many of them have very good academics however they are promising students careers that they can't deliver.
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This is really helpful. This is the best video about choosing financial degree I have seen in this year. Thank you very much.
It would be great If you could review the CQF program
I’m a PhD Computer Science student and I had an internship at a hedge fund in quant research. It’s is 100% possible- actually many other interns are from diverse backgrounds that get further into different teams which allows them to specialise further in an array of subtopics, one of which financial engineering. They look for people with a certain mindset. I might say it’s quite misleading when you say they only accept graduates from one programme . Regardless, I enjoy your videos! :D
Another great video. Thanks!
Great information!! Thank you for being honest! Finally someone who says the truth
Thanking you for your advise and insights.
This video is insanely accurate. DePaul University recently just got rid of their Computational Finance degree and posted on their website that they now recommended people apply for their masters in computer science major for something “similar” instead.
Thanks for the note. It's hard to keep track of all the programs but over the years there have been a fair amount that have opened, closed, and been renamed.
Do you play the guitar in the background? Any other instruments?
Yes, I've played the guitar for 17 years. I also used to play the clarinet and was a DJ.
It's cool to listen again what we already discussed.
I'd like to say something about degree names: it's ok that you can explain on the resume what subjects you studied, but it's also true that not always degree names represent what you studied very well, and universities should be more accurate about that. For example in my university (the greatest in Europe) I'm gonna study next year actuarial science msc and the degree name is "actuarial and financial science". The same degree name you get if you do a financial engineering program. The reason is that both actuarial science and financial engineering programs are taught at the faculty of statistics and both has some common courses such as mathematical models in finance, statistical methods, time series and stuff, but then every program has other specific subjects such as asset pricing for financial engineering and actuarial techniques for actuarial science. That said I just wanted to explain that some degrees could make some confusion about programs studied. Referring to real and fake financial engineering programs problem, the solution could just be defining categories of names and call them for example qualitative finance and Quantitative Finance, or just finance and financial engineering!
Hi Dimitri, what do you think about the Honors and Masters in Financial Engineering course at University of Pretoria, South Africa and the MPhil Mathematical Finance course at the University of Cape Town, South Africa? Their information is available online
What do you think about the Msc in Mathematical and Computational Finance of Oxford ?
Very clear!
Hello Dimitri, I’m math & econ double majors from a liberal arts college. I’m applying to Columbia but it seems like I can apply for two programs at most. For the MAFN, MFE, and MSOR, which two do you recommend? I planned to apply for MSOR cuz I knew the MFE is super competitive to get in. I heard MAFN and MSOR might be less practical than the MFE? Thanks!
It depends on what type of job you want after graduation. The MFE has the best job placement but you are right, it is very competitive. The MAFN looks to be very similar to the MFE but lacks career development/networking skills which would be my guess for the difference in job placement. The MSOR isn't as specialized in quantitative finance however the degree would help you diversify into other fields as a fall back. If you want to apply to the MFE and one other program, I would apply to the MSOR program. You might be able to use some electives to create a mixed MSOR and MFE.
I would also consider other programs outside of Columbia as back-ups.
How do you feel about the CFRM program at UW Seattle
What is your opinion on UIUC financial engineering program in terms of both quality of the program and placements?
How should we rank programs in this context where so many are popping up? Looking at applied economics, but wants to work in hedge fund macro research analyst. Using modelling econometrics etc. do we rank first by ranking or ? Also prestige ones tend to charge a lot and ROI seems not great. Does it matter if I go to lower ranked Uni ?
Hello Dimitri, thank you for your videos they're great! I've watched a couple so far and this is one I needed to hear. When you said, along the lines of, 'traders this isn't what you're looking for' I'd be very interested in hearing more. You see, I'm a commodity trader by day and am growing more and more interested in statistical probabilities every day. Random ideas of running back tests and figuring out what would be the safest way to trade, indicator development and financial planning. What would you suggest I look into?
Hello Dimitri! Could you explain in a video what are the rigorous maths tools a quant needs in business. For example, with something like Itô’s Lemma, is it just the knowledge of it and it’s application that is required or is it necessary to know the proof as well as the measure theoretic background of stochastic calculus? Thanks!
It all depends on what you are doing in the industry. If you are engineering derivative products or developing derivative pricing models you will have to fully understand exactly how the math works and how to apply it to different settings. I work in risk management away from derivative products however I do end up breaking down proofs mathematically to figure out why, how, and if we can violate statistical assumptions. Understanding the implications of breaking these assumptions is crucial when you have to explain to senior management why you failed a model that the bank/firm depends on.
That being said there are students who just understand the concepts and get jobs however they typically don't excel in the quant positions because they lack the skills.
Using Black Scholes Metron by itself it’s just plug in chucks. But understanding the actual equation in Stochastic Calc class to know how is it achieved takes a powerhouse brain work.
Dmitri, I have a question for you. For someone starting undergrad, what courses do you recommend they focus on? Calculus 1-3? Derivatives? Case studies? Several statistics classes? Research methods?
Calc 1-3, real analysis, and a few statistics courses. If you can take econometrics I would take that as it is statistics applied to finance and economic data.
Take all the advance probability and mathematical statistics courses specially the ones that use the book 📕 statistical inference by Casella
Take Time Series
Take stochastic Calc right after your finished your first course in probability
Take Optimization ( Comes handy when it comes to optimal portfolio theory )
Then you are completely equipped for financial Engineering advance courses such as two main ones.
Optimal Portfolio Theory
Quantitative Risk Management
And Financial Times Series which is a typical capstone course for any Graduate degree in Financial Engineering.
Bottom line Master Probability Course then all other courses are just based on that with a bit additional topics.
What is your opinion on Rutger's MQF program (Buisness department) in comparison to Stony Brook's Quantitative Finance masters (Applied math department)?
Hey Dimitri, what do you think of the WorldQuant Free online MScFE program? I have and undergrad in Accounting and another in Pure Mathematics and I'm thinking about applying to WQU but I'm worried they won't get accredited in September as expected and that the degree may not be respected in the industry.
It's hard to judge the program from just looking at their website but there are a lot of factors to consider which are stacked against WorldQuant.
1) Education: Getting a top notch financial engineering degree is important because these programs have industry practitioners teaching topics that aren't commonly found in textbooks. It IS possible to get a decent education online and through textbooks as long as you put in a LOT of work.
2) Hiring: From a hiring perspective it depends on what country you want to work in. If you want to work in a non-finance hub city then this degree could be enough because there won't be a lot of competition. However in these non-finance hubs there aren't a lot of quant jobs because it's not a finance hub. If you want to work in the US it would be VERY hard to find a job. There are a lot of financial engineering programs but lets just say there are 50 good ones. If each class has 30 graduates then there are 1,500 students looking for a quant finance job every year. There aren't that many new positions every year and to top it off you have other degrees competing for similar jobs such as Master's and PhD's in statistics, math, engineering, computer science, data science, and etc.
If you really want to work in quant finance and this is your only option then it might be worth it but realize it is risky in the sense that you might waste a bunch of time. On the flip side if you get a fancy degree and spend $70k you can also end up unemployed. I have seen a lot of financial engineering students end up in a variety of other fields because there just aren't an abundance of quant jobs out there (at least in the US).
My general advice is to follow what you truly love to do given it has a good potential to make money. If you love quant finance I would think hard about the trade-offs between degrees and try to make the best decision for you. I'm sure there have been students who have attended WorldQuant and got a great job but I can't imagine it's common.
Hi Dimitri, do you have an opinion on Berkeley's MFE? It is very highly ranked but is taught by the business school, which is a bit opposing.
I won't comment on their program specifically but one thing to do when looking at graduate schools is to see where the students are being placed. The rankings are not very accurate as they look at things like job placement rates and salaries which is not specific to quant finance. I'm not saying Berkeley is good or bad, but just do your homework and it will help you decide which program is best for you.
I also have a ranking here:
www.fancyquantnation.com/quant-finance-list
Really love your videos! Please do more.
Quick question, what are your thoughts on MSc in Quantitative Finance/Economics program by German Universities like Bonn, Goethe and Kiel?
Unfortunately I don't know too much about the universities in Germany.
Aslam walekum I have applied for the goethe and kiel university
@@hasanrazashaikh421 did u get in I want to ask how kiel university is? Is it good to study there
@@sanjeevjha8838 yes it is good but you need all credit to apply for it I don’t have many required credits so I didn’t got admission but if you are from commerce or any other finance field you will get admission don’t worry apply for it
You were right about the skills you think you get in a program vs what a recruiter is looking for. I watched this video bc I am thinking to enrol in a financial engineering master program at Technology School of KIT in germany. At the moment I am a commodity trader and I do not want to engineer products I just want to keep moving forward in the finance field, do you think a "fake engineering program" would be the right choice for me? Thank you
It could be a good decision if you are wanting more technical skills while remaining on the business side. You would also be able to communicate between the two sides.
Hi Dimitri thanks for sharing your thoughts. One quick question. Do you consider factor based active quant portfolio managing also a part of financial engineering? You seem to define FE very narrowly, mostly include only desk quants.
In case you're familiar with factor based quant programme, I wanna know if there's any degree that offers good training on these stuff.
Most programs cover factor investing. FE is technically just engineering financial products such as derivatives.
Hi Dimitry. I have to Bsc in Physics. I'm looking forward to taking the Masters in financial engineering alongside a masters in Physics. Do you think it's a great idea
To be honest the only reason I would get the physics masters if you want to work as a quant, would be a backup plan. I don't see people with physics degrees any better than other quants. Physics was more of a historic point where back in the day they had more relevant skills than other degrees for derivative pricing. These days there are specific degree for this including math PhDs and quant finance has expanded far beyond derivative pricing.
What are your thoughts on the MS in Quant Finance at NYU?
math finance at courant or mfe at tandon???
Personally I did an Honors Bachelor Degree in Economics and it gived me the chance to do a Master in Economics but focused on Financial Econometrics and Mathematical Finance... I am maybe the only one of my department doing this elective path, (they don't like stochastic calculus and econometrics lol) . I saw you did a master in applied economics with elective Financial Engineering courses. Its like what I am doing right now haha. Great Videos great channel. Well done!
I am in my third year of economic PhD I am doing the exact same thing. The only courses in my transcript are the 6 core courses that regardless of any field in Economic student has to take. All my field courses as well as electives are all in probability, statistical inference and financial mathematics courses.
And yes I am the only one in my department as well😉. With the graduate economic major after dealing with core courses which are actually mathematically rigorous subjects, it then becomes just like social science with data analytics tasks.
Financial Mathematics on the other hand it’s all doing probability, coding, statistical inference and stochastic calculus🙂🙂🙂🙂🙂🙂
@@stochasticdifferentialeq.1393 Haha I switched to Financial Engineering at the end 🤣
@@TheAvenger2012 I was contemplating to do the same thing but I already passed the tough micro and econometric qualifications that I could not possibly threw the entire effort into the nothing. I should have changed it before taking the qualification. But it is ok in my case because I went through a lot of getting approval to do financial Mathematics for my field of study in economics.
Have a look at the CUL CITY UNIVERSITY LONDON PROGRAMS in Mathematical Finance. That would make the argument more complex.
Could I know why do you say so? Is it because of the three different programs in QF? I'm just interested because I'm applying for a master this year and I was considering Cass as one of my options.
@@JorgeFrias1117 yes
Hi Dimitri. What are your thoughts on a couple online FE masters programs: 1) Stevens Institute is Technology, 2) John’s Hopkins mathematical finance? Thanks for this awesome video.
Most people in the industry are not a fan of online degrees even from top name schools. The reason is due to a lack of rigor in an online program vs a brick and mortar program. Working along side professors at a university really provides insights that wouldn't be seen from an online program. Now this isn't to say it isn't possible to get a good job with an online degree, it just makes your odds much worse.
Stevens Institute is good. I enjoyed the Stochastic class at their MFE program, the lecturer is very good and they are using Shreve book. Online classes is recorded lectures with writing on screens recorded.
Would you recommend a bachelor’s degree in econometrics and quantitative economics for a master’s in financial engineering?
Benjy Molina if they are math heavy, then yes. Top masters in financial engineering programs will be more math focused.
yes
Go to engineering
Thanks for the info. I am working on a Bachelor's in Engineering Management which is basically, as you said, Operations Research and Business Analytics.
What textbooks would you recommend to learn stochastic calculus and the other aspects you mentioned (volatility calculations etc.) in the amount of detail you learned it in ?
Below is a list of books but to really get a good understanding you need an industry practitioner as a teacher. I had a few classes with no textbooks as the professors taught from experience and were not academic professors. Below is a list of recommended books. The list could easily by twice the length depending on if you specialize in different areas (FX, credit, equity, volatility, computer science, structured finance, risk). The books with (*) are some of my favorites.
Quant:
Stochastic Calculus for Finance I: The Binomial Asset Pricing Model by Steven Shreve*
Stochastic Calculus for Finance II: Continuous-Time Models by Steven Shreve*
Statistical Analysis of Financial Data in S-Plus by Rene Carmona*
Options, Futures, and Other Derivatives by John C Hull
Derivatives by Sundaram and Das*
Stochastic Portfolio Theory by Robert Fernholz
Credit Risk Pricing Models: Theory and Practice by Bernd Schmid
Arbitrage Theory in Continuous Time by Thomas Bjork
C++ Design Patterns and Derivatives Pricing by Joshi
Volatility and Correlation by Riccardo Rebonato
The Analysis of Structured Securities by Raynes and Rutledge
Finance:
Fundamentals of Corporate Finance by Ross, Jordan, and Westerfield
Financial Modeling by Simon Benninga
Thanks !
The typical end result desired ,or object of a financial engineering exercise , is simply to build or create or recreate a financial structure. Derivatives are an example of such a structure .
Another broad class of financial structures are simply cash flows across a time line , with as desired various accumulations of node values at different point os that time line .
That is basically it - engineering premise for financial structures .
The concept is not difficult to grasp , what is challenging to many is the theoretical know how needed ( i.e. math , stats , finance concepts ,principles and theorems) to use as technical tools in arriving at a structural(analytical) or numerical(I.T. processing as a tool ) to arrive at a solution(solution equals the financial structure you were trying to end up with , create).
Perhaps one could describe the 'true' financial engineering program as one that has as its curriculum the use of those technical tools to achieve those end products - what you primarily referred to as derivatives..
What is the cost and compensation of the degree? Is it worth it? Does it matter which school you graduate from?
What do you make of the CFQ certification?
CFQ or CQF ?
Can a BS electrical engineering pursue MS financial engineering.? How connected would the 2 fields be?
Yes you can do that path. A friend of mine actually did that. The math you take as an engineer will help prepare you for the math in an MFE.
Hey Dimitri, would you recommed a BSc in industrial engineering to pursue MSc in financial engineering? And would this pave the way to work in banks?
Yes, it is common to get an engineering undergrad, including industrial engineering before a financial engineering masters. This path would lead to banking jobs.
Hello Dimitri,
A few questions:
(1):What are your thoughts on Washington University's Master's in Computational Finance & Risk Management and would you consider it a "real" financial engineering degree?
(2): What are your thoughts on Washington University's Quantitative Fundamentals of Computational Finance Certificate for people without math/stem undergraduate degrees? (personally, I have an econ degree and have taken all lower division math courses except differential equations).
(3): I am interested in learning mathematical/statistical techniques to apply to investment and research strategies but not really the programming/developer side. Do you think the above programs could help me land a role in quantitative investment research/analytics at a bank or fund? (the program is heavy on R). I work in a bank's portfolio management group as a credit analyst (corporate banking) and am interested in fixed income analytics opportunities in the bank's investment management division.
(4): Are there roles in investment research/analysis having a quantitative focus that require only R and Excel? I'm not fixed on being a "quant" necessarily but would like to have a career involving considerable financial math/stats and screen time (no client interfacing).
Thank you!
I don't typically comment on specific program unless they provide me with a lot of internal information. I don't want to miss characterize any programs from just reviewing their website.
You don't sound very interested in a lot of the quant materials but you might be interested in operational research or traditional finance. Operational research does more analytics than traditional finance and they use their analytics to help banks and other companies make financial decisions. Traditional finance would use excel and some R at an investment firm. For quant finance roles, we hardly ever do anything with excel unless a business person requests it.
Does anyone have a thought about university of Illinois or University of Washington’s programs? Illinois is joint program between the business and engineering while Washington’s is In applied math?
what backgrounds are good when doing a masters in financial engineering. will a mechanical engineering degree be a good match and what possible fields could i work in?
Hi, Dimitri. Happy to hear that kind of view.I am a student which studies in what you call fake financial engineering and I am little bit curious if I am interested in courses like financial math and engineering, are there any programs you would like to recommend? THX
I personally like Baruch, CMU, Columbia's Financial Engineeing, NYU, NYU Tandon, and University of Chicago. It is hard to keep up with the programs as they change over the years however these programs have placed and educated some good students.
@@DimitriBianco Thank you so much for detailed advises and videos. I am going to take courses in US next month. And again I really appreciate it for those information.
@@DimitriBianco I'm surprised you didn't put Cornell and princeton on the list, I've heard they have decent programs as well! Also I believe ucla and Berkeley also have relatively good ones too...
What do you think about UTD? It's consider STEM in the school of Business tho...
This question puts me in a tight spot but I'll give you an honest answer. I have actually worked with their program since it is also in Dallas and they were nice enough to have me come and speak on a few occasions. The positive aspects of their program is that they do try really hard to get job placement for their students. The negative is that they are really a business analytics program. Their goal is to try and create a blend of business and some quantitative skills however they are a lot more towards the business side than the quant side. UTD as a whole does have a relationship with a local bank here in Dallas however from what I've been hearing, most of their graduates are being placed in business analytic type of roles outside of finance.
Their program could be a good fit if you want to work in business analytics specifically in Dallas. If you are looking for a true financial engineering program that is under rated, check out Minnesota and Michigan's programs.
Hi Dimitri, how do you think of MSFE in USC? Many thanks.
Hello Dimitri, I hope you are doing well. I have a question for you. Currently I am pursuing my undergraduate degree with double major in Statistics and Finance. I have passed my CFA level 1. I wanted to ask what masters degree should I go for after my bachelors. Should it be a MS in Statistics or MFE?
It depends where you want to end up. If you want to end up on the buy side (investing) I would do an MFE. If you want to end up on the sell side (banking) both are good but I prefer statistics. Statistics also opens up more opportunities in other areas like tech.
@@DimitriBianco Thank you so so so much for your reply. I cannot express how valuable it is for me to get your opinion on this.
@@samirarora7293 you can apply for shoes stitching
@@eygs493. your comment shows what type of person you are. best of luck.
@@kaustoobh1 lol, dont talk like you are something or anything "intelligent", you are not, not at all. I dont have the privilege to share any of your lucks, you can have them all. its all for the type of things like you on the internet, do nothing but disturb people's appetite.
What do you think about NYU's financial engineering program engineering.nyu.edu/academics/programs/financial-engineering-ms ? Peter Carr is also the director of the program.
It's hard to tell from a website however NYU's MFE has had a good reputation over the years. I believe their core courses are rigorous and I do like their capstone requirement which can be a thesis, project, 2 additional courses, or 2 internships. The location also helps in finding good jobs. This was on my list of preferred programs when I applied for school many years ago.
Hi Dimitri,
What is your opinion of University of Southern California's MS in Financial Engineering?
Hi, have you entered that program? I have just recevied their admission, but I can't find information about employment after graduation.
Are there any certifications for Quants or Financial Engineers? Or which ones would be the closest ones? Cause it is a bit difficult to know which topics are the most important ones to be a financial engineer, can I say that the two main topics are Derivatives and Statistics in depth?
Rodrigo Avila there aren't really any certifications, at least not any that are respected in the industry. The closest certification would be the FRM but it is very soft compared to a quant masters. The video below has a basic outline of quant topics. I actually shot a video last week comparing the cfa to a quant masters which I think you'll like. Unfortunately it will be it will be a few weeks before it is published.
th-cam.com/video/qvFYzJ8-zbQ/w-d-xo.html
Dimitri Bianco thanks a lot, great video, waiting for the comparison between cfa and quant masters
Hey, would you recommend MFE in HEC Montréal, Canada.
It looks fairly good. I'd say it's a real program. I would try and take the more quantitative classes over the general finance classes.
@@DimitriBianco How about the financial engineering program at Université Laval in Quebec City ? I am hesitating between the two.. here is a link to the program specifics: www.ulaval.ca/les-etudes/programmes/repertoire/details/maitrise-en-sciences-de-ladministration-ingenierie-financiere-m-sc.html#description-officielle&structure-programme
Hey Dimitri,
What do you think of the financial Mathematics program at UMN?
I don't have any inside information to review them on. Keep an eye out for the Fancy Quant Honorable Mentions later this year. It should give you some insight on top programs.
Hi Dimitri
This is my first comment on a youtube video ever, lol. You are doing a great job, offering great advise. Please keep it up.
I have 2 questions for you.
1. What do you think about Fordham University - Masters in Quantitative finance program
2. I have a Bachelors in Global Business Admin, took alot of Finance courses when I found my interest. Also pursuing CFA. Currently applying to Masters in Quant Finance. Any thoughts or suggestions?
Fordham looks to be a good program and their director is working on making it better. I would apply there.
Study as much math and stats as possible. The cfa won't do much for you in the quant world and knowing finance is good but not the main skill for quants.
@@DimitriBianco much thanks!
Could you tell us which are(in your opinion) the best fin eng/quant fin/comp fin/fin maths masters in europe?
Sorry, but I don't have much exposure to Europe's programs.
I’m late to the party, but what are your thoughts on Montana States financial engineering program?
Here’s a link to program description
catalog.montana.edu/undergraduate/engineering/mechanical-industrial-engineering/financial-engineering/
For undergrad I would have a hard time sorting through the financial engineering degrees. All of the undergrad programs are new as they didn't exist when I was in school. It is really challenging to determine the rigor of a program just given the class names. To best prepare for a financial engineering masters degree you'll want to take as much math and statistics as possible with at least one programming course. Most financial engineering masters students when I was in school had math or engineering undergrads.
Hi may I ask for your comments on UIUC MSFE and NYU Tandon MFE programs? I am choosing between the two programs and I found your video extremely helpful! It seems like the UIUC program seems more “real” according to your TH-cam. Thank you so much sir!
Both programs are good programs. If I were trying to decide, I would think about location because a lot of companies like to hire locally. Would you rather work in Chicago or NYC?
Dear Mr. Bianco, thank you so much for your advice and help!!! I have decided to attend the UIUC program. I want to thank you again personally because your videos are so beneficial for the future MFE students! I am sorry for the late massage, and I am really excited to see your reply! Thank you sir again for everything!! :D
@@ninjasuper8 Hi, I am planning to join UIUC for MSFE and would like to know your opinion about the program and placements
What about the master in finance at princeton?
Hi Dimitri ,
I was wondering if you could comment about the MFE programs offered by NUS and NTU in Singapore..Are there good MFE programas offered by university apart from the ones in North America?
From what I can see these programs are fairly weak. NTU looks like the best program there but it's only 1 year which isn't enough time to be competitive with US schools. If you live in Singapore and want to stay there I would try and find their job placement rates. If you want to work in the US you almost have to go to school here.
Take a look at other's opinions here: quantnet.com/threads/ms-programs-in-singapore.9495/
@@DimitriBianco I hear its been updated. Could you please re-evaluate NUS as I am considering it. Also they have a Q&A session tomorrow, not sure what to ask them. Your point is very accurate and the misinformation perpetrated by universities in order to attract students from India/China is frankly making things worse. Here's the link for NUS rmi.nus.edu.sg/masters-program/curriculum.html and it seems to have added more math and left out the details of the curriculum. Perhaps you can take a look. thank you. I watch all your videos! :)
I saw someone else ask about UTD's MFE degree, and I understand that you think that it's more of a business analytics degree. I planned to pursue an undergraduate degree in UTD's applied mathematics or statistics track for a B.S. in mathematics before I attempt to enter it. Would this be a more acceptable track?
For quantitative finance, no. You need an undergrad and masters in a quantitative study. The market is extremely competitive and most of your competition will have a PhD from a top name school. It also doesn't look good to get your masters from the same school as your undergrad.
@@DimitriBianco uh, what? An undergraduate degree in either applied mathematics or statistics ARE in a quantitative field.
@@DimitriBianco Are you saying that UTD's MFE isn't a quantitative graduate degree? My first two choices after I finish my undergraduate degree in math are to continue on with a doctorate in applied mathematics or to pursue a different graduate degree and career in like finance or actuarial science.
Those are quantitative undergrad degrees but you'll need a quantitative masters or PhD on top of that. Most quants have something like applied mathematics undergrad and then a PhD in statistics.
UTD's mfe is the same as a business analytics degree. Just contact the program and ask where they are placing students. If you like the jobs then go for it but the majority if not all of them are going into business analytics. The program is great for business analytics but not quantitative finance.
People do care about pricing stocks.... especially in the market making world, since the mid price is not the real price.....so what im getting this is not a good degree to break into market making?
Do you advise get into financial engineering?
Hey Dimitri, would you recommend someone going straight into a quant masters program after undergrad, or working for two years and then getting a masters?
The video response will come out August 8th.
@@DimitriBianco waiting... :)
Go straight. Because financial Engineering is more of the mathematical side rather than practical of finance. Finish your FE then work.
@@stochasticdifferentialeq.1393 is software engineering a good undergard for FE?
@@hd-kd9tw software engineering is the most demanded in financial engineering field. If you are one then you are their main target to hire. 👍👍👍👍honestly a software engineer does not even need to get a financial engineering degree in order to enter the field for work. Because most software engineers already deal with a lot of abstract and advance stochastic courses. So I guess you are doing a much more smarter move hitting two target with one arrow 😉😉😉😉
how about the Georgia tech Ms QCF program? sorry if asked before
Overall I've had a good impression of their program.
So what do you think of UCLA MFE
hye im just about to finish my foundation in business and i intend to pursue in degree financial engineering. is my option is good or do anyone have some better suggestion for me. is it better if i take degree of financial/accounting/mathematics then after i finish the degree, i pursue for master of financial engineering. i hope i can hear opinions from others too :)
What interests you about quant finance? Who you enjoy sitting at a desk coding math and stats all day? I would try and figure out what skills you enjoy the most and then research jobs around those skills.
What about an online MFE? Like Johns Hopkins M.S in Financial Mathematics. It is offered through the engineering school.
Online is not viewed the same as a campus degree even if it was from the best rated program. There are a lot of issues with administering online exams to have the same rigor as on campus programs. Also, the quant finance market has been shrinking since 2015 and around that time the number of university programs exploded. This has resulted in an even more competitive job market. You can give an online degree a shot if you want to take a gamble but it makes yours odds of finding a job worse.
@@DimitriBianco Do you see already having experience in finance mitigating this? let's say 2 years + the M.S.
No. To be honest, a finance degree doesn't as much value. Quant finance is really math applied to finance. Making the transition from finance to quant finance is very challenging. I had 8 years of accounting and corporate finance experience and a finance undergrad. Neither helped in getting my masters.
@@DimitriBianco I think I will shoot for a coding job( python, and maybe web development, preferably in real estate), and complete my degree part time. Once I am done I will try to transition over with my Masters in Financial Math ( we cover stochastic differential equations, Monte Carlo methods, etc). Thank you.
sir i am pursuing BE in mechanical engineering and aiming to go canada for MS in financial engineering can you suggest me which university offers good course in canada and currently i am studying linear algebra and advanced excel
I don't know enough about Canada's school to make a recommendation.
Can you comment on the Masters in Quantitative Finance in ETH Zurich?
ETH Zurich's Quant. Finance program is notoriously known in Europe. People from ETH are among the smartest in higher Finance positions across European HF, Banks and Risk Management Firms
I've heard good things about it however I don't have a lot of information on their program.
This guy is the SCOTT HERMAN of the QUANT WORLD!
Hello Dimitri, What do you think about the Quantitative Finance Program at Fordham ??
I'm not a fan of their program. It seems to cover a lot of topics at a high level instead of focusing deeply on mathematics, statistics, and computer science. The fact that they have to advertise they are "STEM" program is also a red flag.
Yeah but the qcf at Georgia tech has similar courses if not the same . So why do you have a good impression on that ? . It's a business school too. Plus Fordham has good professors with a strong mathematical background
It comes from an industry perspective and personal interactions between Georgia Tech students and Fordham students. Also, course titles mean nothing which is why it's challenging to compare programs. Fordham might be good but it depends on what you want to do for a career.
What is your opinion about Risk Management and Financial Engineering program of Imperial College London?
From a quick overview it looks more like a "fake" program. The program focuses a lot more on business topics while trying to cover a little math here and there. If you have a business background and want to work with derivatives at a high level this could be an option however from a US perspective, it would be better to get an MBA as banks and other firms prefer them over a business style financial engineering and risk degree.
Can financial engineering be replicated by AI?
Dimitri Bianco Can you review the masters in Business Intelligence and data analytics program at St. Joseph’s university in Philadelphia?!?
Could a BSc in Econometrics and Operations Research (I just got accepted into my top university for this degree, I will be starting in August) plus most likely a MSc in Quantitative Finance and Actuarial Science be of good use to break into the quant industry? I know you recommend Financial Engineering but thats not really an option here in the Netherlands at least
It's possible with econometrics especially if the Netherlands doesn't have Financial Engineering. I would try to figure out where your program is placing students. If they are placing them in quant finance then it will be a good route.
Quant Finance and Actuarial can be a good route as well. This would most likely be equivalent to financial engineering.
Hello Vlad, are you still on TH-cam? I am deeply interested in taking your programme, can we talk? I am an aspiring student from Indonesia
Kenneth Theodore cool, there are quite a few indonesian students in the nl. Shoot me some questions
@@vladm.6859 can I contact you privately? if that's fine with you, it might be a bit lengthy hahaha
Kenneth Theodore sure, vlad.ioan.miron@gmail.com
What about Masters in Mathematics of finance?
It depends on the school. The name "Mathematics of Finance" is just another name for qunt programs just like "financial engineering" or "computational finance".
Hi dimitri, would you recommend financial engineering offered by Stevens institute of technology in NJ?
No, that school has terrible job placement, and a very weak program.
@@SurvivingAnotherDay quantnet financial engineering ranks it #20 overall. And it's placement is 50% at graduation and 82% 3 mos..after graduation... Did you go stevens ? Lol I wanna know more.
Deepak John Im just biased. Post your question on www.quantnet.com as well.
My advice is to comb through linkedin and network with Stevens MFE alums. Seeing what roles they're in will give you an idea on the different possible career paths.
It is hard to tell from a website and the programs are constantly changing. It is in a business school so I would be skeptical.
If i am taking econometrics and data analytics classes, what kind of jobs i should focus on (in quant finance degree)
It depends on your depth (Bachelor's, Master's, or PhD) and your general degree. If you have a deep focus at a graduate level on econometrics, I would look into market risk, trading, quant research, or CCAR model development or validation positions. Almost all of those positions require a graduate degree. If you are focusing on data analytics I would look for credit risk analyst, operations research, and data science though these aren't really quant finance positions.
Dimitri Bianco . Thank you for the reply. i m masters student of quant finance at Rensselaer
Hi Dimitri, when you say "graduate level econometrics" are you talking about time series or longitudinal metrics, or you're just lumping all metrics (incl bayesian metrics) into econometrics? thanks
In the response above I am referring to econometrics in the sense of all statistical and mathematical analysis in regards to economics. So yes, this can and does include bayesian which has been used in econometrics. There are actually econometrics books specifically written on bayesian analysis.
What about the CQF program?
That is a tough question many have asked. The CQF was originally designed to train industry veterans the quant skills they didn't have. Now would I hire someone who had the CQF instead of a grad degree in the US? No. I have a ton issues with online degrees which is why most firms don't consider them.
How is cmu’s mscf program?
I like it.
I don't understand why you're talking like your some sort of qualified mathematical professional. You did your undergrad in finance and dropped a financial engineering degree at a school not known for their financial engineering program. So how much math do you actually know? It seems you know all the punch lines and the fancy words but you are not trained in high-level mathematics to be making these assumptions. Your LinkedIn says your a risk officer; this is not exactly a quant and it does not seem you have ever been a quant.
You should do your homework before commenting.
1) I actually created an exotic option for a manufacturing firm using the option pricing framework or as you put it "high-level mathematics." Click the "see more" button on LinkedIn.
2) Risk Officers are quants at banks. Who do you think prices derivatives or other products? These people are called model developers which is a type of risk officer. Maybe you should read the document about quants from Mark Joshi.
3) You are right, I didn't finish the MFE.
4) Michigan's original program was a top 20 program before they closed it and opened a new one in a different department. Not to mention Michigan is one of the highest rated universities globally and my MAE program was ranked 2nd when I was in the program.
From a LinkedIn search it looks like you have an undergrad degree in actuarial sciences. You should get some experience before adding your two cents.
@@DimitriBianco I guess we're numbering our discussion points; I will follow your formatting.
1) I have not even finished my undergrad degree in actuarial mathematics. Clearly, my profile states the graduation year as 2021 which obviously has yet to happen.
2) You made an "exotic option for a manufacturing firm using option pricing framework." Really...? For a manufacturing firm..? I can't seem to find this on your Linkedin either. Is it DJ Mac Music? I could be wrong.
3) Risk officers are not quants at banks. Quants at banks are quants. I really am curious about the extent of your mathematical training. It appears on your Linkedin that you have taken business calculus and several 200-level statistic classes. Surely, even you are aware that quantitative researchers hold much greater training in mathematics and sciences to be qualified for such a position. What technical skills do you hold? You claim you model financial instruments. Did you do so in Python, R, MATLAB, or an object orientated programming language?
4) You are right. The University of Michigan is a great school and I believe you when you say their economics department is exceptional. All I am saying is that your educational background does not make you qualified to produce such information involving the quantitative finance industry. However, I believe we should disregard any such arguments about their financial engineering program since you did not complete its curriculum.
5) Your papers are rudimentary. You do not even bother compiling in LaTeX. I have yet to read an academic paper regarding mathematical finance not compiled in LaTeX.
6) I have read some of Joshi's work, but I prefer the work of Claude Shannon, Edward Thorp., and Hiroshi Toyoizumi.
@@sarveenrad7884 i agree with you Sarveen, It just shows his arrogance. Dimitri, go back to finish your Financial Engineering degree and stop knocking those that have completed theirs
Please I am MPhil students in statistics. Is it advisable to do Financial engineering
It depends. What is your long term goal?
i am shocked when I watched this video. thank you very much. I am disappointed with my degree
Is MFE in University of Birmingham real ? Please help me .
It's hard to tell from their website. It's good it's in a math department however with very general course names, It's hard to tell what is actually covered and at what depth.
Dimitri Bianco Thank you for the feedback. Would you recommend this course for being into quant business?
Hi Dimitri, I am a freshman ug student pursuing cs with a minor in econ...
I am very interested in investing..
I want to know which master's degree should I pursue to get into the field of investing
Please leave me a reply
It depends on the type of investing. Traditional finance is one path and quantitative finance is another.
As general advice, diversification of assets is very hard to beat. The markets can be beat however it takes a lot of money and resources (smart people, computers, servers, lawyers, and etc.) to do it.
It also depends what country you live in. Quant finance is somewhat focused in countries with highly developed markets which makes the scientific methods a bit more reliable. Other countries have more political hurdles which prevent it from taking root and being effective.
@@DimitriBianco I live in India. However, I will be doing my masters in US... Hope this info helps..
I am looking at different programs like MFE and Ms in Fin.
I will be learning more about these fields to understand which is better...
Thanks
Could you Suggest some good masters financial engineering programs in US and programs outside US that are comparable to these programs?
I can't make specific recommendations because the programs constantly change over the years and most won't provide me additional materials. Look for programs that are heavy in math, stats, and computer science and you should do fine at selecting a program.
Could you comment on the CQF ?
It is a really expensive designation. I would not consider it comparable to an MFE.
It was originally designed for experienced professionals who wanted to enhance their quant backgrounds. Many of them had been working in the industry while it was evolving. They were unlikely to go back for a full masters and already had a good portion of the skills so the CQF was created for them.
@@DimitriBianco thank you!
Hi DImitri, like you videos very much. I am planning to pursue MS in financial engineering in fall of 2019. Is there a way to get in touch with you to clarify some doubts? Can I get your mail id? Thanks anyways..
Why are you shouting? And what is Meconomics? Is that one of those "fake" degrees?
Hi, can anyone comment on Birkbeck MSc Mathematical Finance? Seems very solid but I would be happy to get some inputs from anyone who is experienced in the area...
Birbeck is an evening college. They were the first lead school to offer an MSc in Finance and Commodities. They have solid Economics, Math and Statistics Departments. But whether the degree commands respect among global employers? That is the big question mark.
SYED ADEEL HUSSAIN got it. Thank you for your inputs, Syed!
@@thedan2 try CUL programs in QF / MFT / FM
MFT PROGRAM IS ONE OF THE BEST IN THE UK!
SYED ADEEL HUSSAIN many many thanks for that! I will check it out. I hope they have a part time programme. I am constrained by a full time job hours
Hi Dimitri,
I am currently a rising junior in the BSFM (B.S. Financial Mathematics) program at Baruch and am also on the trading team under Dan Stefanica (President of Baruch MFE). While the program is well designed to prepare students for MFE programs, - requiring courses as "Introductory Financial Mathematics", the calc sequence, lin. alg., Numerical Methods for Differential Equations in Finance, Introduction to Stochastic Processes, mathematical probability, mathematical statistics (advanced), Stochastic Calculus for Finance - I have recently been accepted to study Computer science at Binghamton where i will have the opportunity to double major in math and comp. sci. I know i want to become a quant researcher/trader. Any opinions. Much appreciated.
You should think about what tasks you enjoy doing. With a computer science and math degree you'll most likely be a programmer. If you enjoy programming this could be a better route. If you want to work in financial markets doing trading or research you're better off in a specialized program like Baruch. Baruch has a good reputation in financial engineering however most people outside of the northeast have not heard of Binghamton. Also realize most firms hiring for research require a PhD.
@@DimitriBianco Thanks for the response. I will definitely stay Baruch. Already gaining relevant programming experience anyways from algorithmic trading competitions, and the last thing I want is to end up coding trading infrastructure for a living. Now I just have to get into MFE.
Does Stony Brook’s Quantitative Finance MS seem legit?
I don't like reviewing or recommending programs but I'll provide a few insights from their website. It is in the applied math and stats department which is a good sign of rigor. It also has 36 credits which is a good amount if they are taken between 1.5-2 years. The core courses are relevant topics for a quant masters and there are some interesting electives.
Did you ever get any insight? I am making that decision now.
@@jarrydscully8430 No, I have not. Currently an Applied Math/Economics Undergrad there. Its a good school, but still don't know how their program is compared to other schools.
@@jessefreitag5374 Since I commented that, I have spoke with many alumni and gotten good insight. SBUs program is definitely legit and cost significantly less than many of its competitors. Also, you can move straight into a PhD from the masters if you want.
@@jarrydscully8430 Hey I know it has been a minute... do you have any idea of the acceptance rate/ competitiveness to get into the Masters level? As a current undergrad at Stony, I have near 4.0 gpa and plenty of internship experience. Still looking into the program but have not heard anything about acceptance rate/competitiveness...
Hi Dimitri! This is very interesting. I would like to message you but I can’t find your email address.
Dimitri Bianco got it! Thank you very much
Hey, any thoughts on UNCC financial mathematics program?
I would not recommend their program as I would view it as a fake financial engineering degree. First, it is a business school. If you want to make good money in finance, just go get an MBA. I went on their website and they don't even list the actual courses you must take. You have to request information. To me this is a red flag that their program is weak and they are hiding something. I usually judge a program by the class list so by them hiding the list (or placing it somewhere challenging to find) it really prevents me from giving them a full review.
@@DimitriBianco they actually listed the courses on the program's website under curriculum >> course catalog. Take a look!
@@DimitriBianco That seems a little crazy to me. I did an applied math masters there before I moved on to a PhD elsewhere. That program definitely does at least a semester in stochastic calc out of the steve shreve book. I think you can take a full years worth of it if you care to. You could also take classes on PDE's and time series stuff. I didn't talk to people in the program about what else they took in depth, but I can't imagine what math beyond those topics you'd need. The curriculum was under a curriculum tab on the programs website, and another link after that. It's definitely in the business school, but I doubt being housed in that department hurts it that much.
Dimetri does not even have a Financial Engineering degree only a degree in Applied Economics, thats hardly the same thing. You don't have a leg to stand on in this topic. I'm unsubscribing 🤗
You sound bitter friend
Sounds like someone is salty they paid 40 grand for a QF degree from PragerU
Hey Dimitri, I wish to be a propriety equity options trader/value investor. Would a Master in Financial Econometrics help me in achieving the desired goal?
Would really appreciate if you could elaborate on your answer.
It depends on what type of firm you want to work at. Traditional finance firms like Masters in Finance and MBA's. Quantitative firms like Masters/PhDs in Financial Engineers, Statistics, Data Science, Computer Science, Math, and etc. Larger firms usually have traders specialized in specific asset classes/types whereas smaller firms might allow you to cover a few areas. In general value investing is a more traditional finance concept whereas derivatives for proprietary firms is a more quant finance area.
If you like traditional finance I would get an MBA and CFA. If you like math and programming then I would go for a quantitative masters or PhD. As for Financial Econometrics... it's hard for me to say if that degree would get you to where you want without seeing the program. If you cover topics such as stochastic calculus, derivative pricing (Black-Scholes, Black-Derman-Toy, etc.), numerical methods, optimization, and etc. then it would set you up to work in the quantitative finance realm. If the program covers valuation, financial modeling, financial analysis, equity markets, fixed income, and etc. then it is more focused on traditional finance and would be better suited for a traditional finance degree.
You should also consider your program's reputation and job placement. The reputation of the program will help in getting a better job faster. I went to an average school for my undergrad and found it nearly impossible to get a job I wanted. I ended up going back for a masters at a school with a great reputation and finding a job was much easier.
Do traditional value investing firms employ derivatives for hedging or for the portfolio optimization? if so do they employ principles of financial mathematics or financial econometrics? The issue that bothers me is how are these principals(Black -Scholes, ARMA, ARCH, GARCH, etc ..) used in practical scenarios. Are there any books or papers to guide me more about becoming a proprietary trader.
At present, I am enrolled in the following program would like your thoughts on it :
my.uq.edu.au/programs-courses/program_list.html?acad_prog=5573
@@indraneelyeole1238 for eg GARCH based volatility prediction could be used in adjusting portfolio weights because portfolio weights are calculated based on the volatility of the assets
@@yishusahil Thank you Sahil. That was really informative. It does make sense as Portfolio Managers usually de risk or take on risk based on future expected Values of VIX or any proprietary Volatility indexes.
Black Sholes is not correct. Neither are any other pricing models including what is taught in MFE.
Hi, I am going for MS in Financial engineering this fall. Please share you e-mail so I can ask some questions
hi, i am considering to study financial engineering for my master degree please keep in touch with me