"you can call it whatever you want"... Amen to that. No need to quibble semantics over 2 endeavors that are very similar. It's all bike travel. No need to over-think it.
My first tour, in 1974 through Europe and North Africa was done on an old Cinelli racing frame that had eyelets for fenders (which I used to put a rack). I used 700 c tires, which took me across the Moroccan Sahara. It had two chain rings, of course as triples had yet to be invented. So, was I bike touring or bike racing with packs?
Interesting question and great answer. A friend and myself are planning to cross the alps by bike this summer - and it looks like we both have a slightly different idea on how to go about it equipment wise; I'll just say, I will be on an OPEN U.P. with bike packing bags and he'll be on a Trek 920 with a full workshop attached…
There is now something called "Tripodding" it's two panniers on the front wheel a large seat bag and a frame bag . . .Adventure Cycling Association recommends butting 60 percent of your weight on the front wheel . . .so "Tripodding" is the best of both worlds bikepacking and bicycle touring . . .I am a " Tripodding " bicycle touring kind of a person...
I think bikepacking or bike touring don't exclude each other. One can, sometimes, ride with front and rear panniers while other times go with the full bikepacking way. And also there's no problem riding or travelling geared with a mix of both kinds of equipment. It's just a matter of what you intend to do in said ride or travel.
It’s the same thing. Both are touring with packs strapped to your bike. Bikepacking is just ultra lite or minimalist which allows for more off-roading than traditional panniers can take. I would rather call bikepacking, “minimalist” touring because riders take the minimum amount of equipment and weight. “Heavy” touring isn’t as concerned with that with the relatively large racks, bags, and the use of trailers. Both are very light forms of travel, so the comparisons are relative to each other.
I am definitely a “biketour” fanatic, having begun my World on Wheels over 30 years ago, using racks fore &aft, panniers, on touring uprights. My current bicycle is a Doublevision (18+ years!), with racks, panniers, a separate parachute bag (for gear-no chute), a tool bag, MSR 10-liter water buffalo, and lots of other equipment I deem essential to survival on the open road. It is HEAVY; this quarter ton ‘pickup’ weighs 460 lbs/208kgs (I am slightly less than half if I’m), as weighed ar the JOBE Ned Finney Quarry, (15:30), 15JAN2018.
Thanks for the video, pretty well thought out answer, but, What about those of us who prefer trailers? I have done the Pacific Coast with my Litespeed and a B.O.B. Yak, and the Great Divide Mountain Bike Route with my Schwinn S20 and a B.O.B. Ibex. IMHO the weight is down low, the setup fits anywhere the bike will, the bike does not have that heavier feel of a weighted down bike with panniers. The only con I have found with a trailer is on a steep sideslope and you try to go slow the trailer will slide down the fall line, because you are not "pulling" it. Another observation I have seen from lots of Bikepacking videos is that usually they are not more than 3 days duration. Your opinion may vary! ;^)
Definitely true, many people are bike packing bag die hards but for many trips, it's nice to have the extra room for more of the comforts of home. There are some people who do huge rides with just bikepacking bags of course but most people use them for 3 days to 2 weeks. I think that trailers are a great option, both on and off road. Personally I think you can be bikepacking or bike touring with a trailer to me it depends on where you are riding.
The term Bikepacking goes all the way back to the 1920s ...there was a book called Bikepacking from the 1970s on its cover was to road bicycles with two Panniers on the back wheel and a handle bar bag...this book was written before the mountain bike was designed and put on the market...the modern Bikepacking bags used today where also used in the 1920's...
Thanks for the insights, always great to learn a little more. It's rare these days for anything to really be new. 650b and 29ers are not new wheel sizes, in fact they go back several decades. Just like those wheels though this is likely first time the term bikepacking has been this widespread and used the way it's being used now. (Though I could be wrong) The bags on the other hand seem new only because they fell out of mass popularity for a long time. It does seem that they were the standard for quite some time. This video really just touched solely on the very modern usage of the terms but Id really like to do a video on the history of bikepacking someday. I need to do a lot more research before I try to tackle that one.
I swear, humans are getting so smart that they are actually getting dumber. Too much semantics, too much classifying... Bicycle travel is traveling via bicycle. You sit on a two wheeled piece of metal and strap your shit to it and ride. The rest is just debate over dimensions and specs of the bike and other small details. People are so eager to come up with fancy terms and names for shit that has always existed. All it does is curb innovation and imagination. Instead of people trying new things and learning on their own, they are more likely to just google a how to and do exactly as it says.
I agree, while terminology exists to communicate accurately, it becomes somewhat less useful when every rider has their own style and every route has its own demands. Tons of people are using both panniers and frame bags on the same bike and both types of bike luggage are being used for both road and off road travel. Manufacturers love it when we all use the same terms to describe what they sell, it makes it easier for us to find their product and easier to sell the same bag to more people. On the one hand following industry trends will likely make your trip easier, but on the other hand like you said you won't be learning near as much, which is part of the fun of bike travel.
LOL funny. Anyway, I think it doesn't matter what bicycle you're using. If you're using soft bags no racks, you're bikepacking, even if you're on a carbon racer. If you're on a BMX and are using panniers, then you're touring. If you're using a combo of soft packs and panniers, then you're doing a combo bike packing and bike touring. It's not about the bikes or terrain, it's about the packs and racks (or lack of em). I think with your 4 friends, the 1 was bike packing with the 3 who were bike touring, you can be bike packing with people who are bike touring.
So, what if you (I) use a rack, with panniers, front and back, with a handlebar bag too, like touring bikes, but, on a gravel bike, with expectations of possibly ending up off pavement, AND carrying ultralight camping gear like a backpacker would?? Does that make me weird??
It has come to my attention that the last 20 seconds or so are getting cut off for some viewers using Microsoft Edge. If this is happening to you please let me know.
Bikepacking is the evolution of Cycle touring .... i.e.cycle touring is old way.. example years ago you need to have 4 big panniers and a handle bar bag and a strong steel frame to support the weight , the reason was gear at the time was bulky and heavy.. and needed a lot of space. but now gear material is much lighter and more compact thats Bikepacking Evolution of cycle touring i.e. the future
I would definitely have to disagree in part. Traditional rack and pannier set ups are still very relevant in today's touring world. They offer many advantages over bikepacking bags in certain situations. Bikepacking setups certainly are an improvement and even an evolution in purely off road travel. Light gear has been available for a very long time but it has become less expensive and mountain biking itself has become much more prevalent. Back in the day people made their own bags out of necessity when crossing the early bikepacking routes, now those bags have evolved and are available commercially. It's like saying snowboarding is an evolution of skiiing. They are two different things each with their own pros and cons depending on the trip you're taking and the style of travel you want to partake in. There has been and will continue to be a great deal of innovation in rack and pannier set ups as well as soft bags. Don't expect either to go away anytime soon. I think you are very correct though, the softbags have added a lot of versatility to the types of trips people can take and how much fun they can have. I've seen a lot of hybrid set ups lately and I think lighter simpler setups will definitely become more common.
I'd say the main benefit of cycle tour panniers is more space, easier and quicker to attach, and easier to pack. Bike packing bags are great for packing light and keeping the weight in line with the rider which mitigates the negative effects the weight has on handling which is particularity important when going off road.
Could be the other way around too. How do you pack food for more than a few days on a bikepacking setup? I once had food for 50 days plus five litre of gasoline and winter equipment on my bike-touring set up... I would say bikepacking is great until it comes to expedition-level.
![Warhammer 40k: Space Marine 2 | เพื่อจักรพรรดิ ! [ตอนเดียวจบ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4M0ckYMA4-U/mqdefault.jpg)
Bike packing is what people under 30 have reinvented bicycle touring as because bike touring isn't "cool".
"you can call it whatever you want"...
Amen to that. No need to quibble semantics over 2 endeavors that are very similar. It's all bike travel. No need to over-think it.
No kidding, I think it's unfortunate when people get overly concerned about labels, it takes away from the joy of the trip.
My first tour, in 1974 through Europe and North Africa was done on an old Cinelli racing frame that had eyelets for fenders (which I used to put a rack). I used 700 c tires, which took me across the Moroccan Sahara. It had two chain rings, of course as triples had yet to be invented. So, was I bike touring or bike racing with packs?
Interesting question and great answer. A friend and myself are planning to cross the alps by bike this summer - and it looks like we both have a slightly different idea on how to go about it equipment wise; I'll just say, I will be on an OPEN U.P. with bike packing bags and he'll be on a Trek 920 with a full workshop attached…
As long as your on your bike and enjoying life call it what you like. Happy biking folks
There is now something called "Tripodding" it's two panniers on the front wheel a large seat bag and a frame bag . . .Adventure Cycling Association recommends butting 60 percent of your weight on the front wheel . . .so "Tripodding" is the best of both worlds bikepacking and bicycle touring . . .I am a " Tripodding " bicycle touring kind of a person...
I think bikepacking or bike touring don't exclude each other. One can, sometimes, ride with front and rear panniers while other times go with the full bikepacking way. And also there's no problem riding or travelling geared with a mix of both kinds of equipment.
It's just a matter of what you intend to do in said ride or travel.
It’s the same thing. Both are touring with packs strapped to your bike. Bikepacking is just ultra lite or minimalist which allows for more off-roading than traditional panniers can take. I would rather call bikepacking, “minimalist” touring because riders take the minimum amount of equipment and weight. “Heavy” touring isn’t as concerned with that with the relatively large racks, bags, and the use of trailers. Both are very light forms of travel, so the comparisons are relative to each other.
I am definitely a “biketour” fanatic, having begun my World on Wheels over 30 years ago, using racks fore &aft, panniers, on touring uprights. My current bicycle is a Doublevision (18+ years!), with racks, panniers, a separate parachute bag (for gear-no chute), a tool bag, MSR 10-liter water buffalo, and lots of other equipment I deem essential to survival on the open road. It is HEAVY; this quarter ton ‘pickup’ weighs 460 lbs/208kgs (I am slightly less than half if I’m), as weighed ar the JOBE Ned Finney Quarry, (15:30), 15JAN2018.
Thanks for the video, pretty well thought out answer, but, What about those of us who prefer trailers? I have done the Pacific Coast with my Litespeed and a B.O.B. Yak, and the Great Divide Mountain Bike Route with my Schwinn S20 and a B.O.B. Ibex. IMHO the weight is down low, the setup fits anywhere the bike will, the bike does not have that heavier feel of a weighted down bike with panniers. The only con I have found with a trailer is on a steep sideslope and you try to go slow the trailer will slide down the fall line, because you are not "pulling" it. Another observation I have seen from lots of Bikepacking videos is that usually they are not more than 3 days duration. Your opinion may vary! ;^)
Definitely true, many people are bike packing bag die hards but for many trips, it's nice to have the extra room for more of the comforts of home. There are some people who do huge rides with just bikepacking bags of course but most people use them for 3 days to 2 weeks. I think that trailers are a great option, both on and off road. Personally I think you can be bikepacking or bike touring with a trailer to me it depends on where you are riding.
Great overview, I've noticed many people don't know the differences either. Will you be doing a video on the pro's and con's of each set up?
LOOK forward to the video...
Cool
The term Bikepacking goes all the way back to the 1920s ...there was a book called Bikepacking from the 1970s on its cover was to road bicycles with two Panniers on the back wheel and a handle bar bag...this book was written before the mountain bike was designed and put on the market...the modern Bikepacking bags used today where also used in the 1920's...
Thanks for the insights, always great to learn a little more. It's rare these days for anything to really be new. 650b and 29ers are not new wheel sizes, in fact they go back several decades. Just like those wheels though this is likely first time the term bikepacking has been this widespread and used the way it's being used now. (Though I could be wrong)
The bags on the other hand seem new only because they fell out of mass popularity for a long time. It does seem that they were the standard for quite some time.
This video really just touched solely on the very modern usage of the terms but Id really like to do a video on the history of bikepacking someday. I need to do a lot more research before I try to tackle that one.
I swear, humans are getting so smart that they are actually getting dumber. Too much semantics, too much classifying... Bicycle travel is traveling via bicycle. You sit on a two wheeled piece of metal and strap your shit to it and ride. The rest is just debate over dimensions and specs of the bike and other small details. People are so eager to come up with fancy terms and names for shit that has always existed. All it does is curb innovation and imagination. Instead of people trying new things and learning on their own, they are more likely to just google a how to and do exactly as it says.
I agree, while terminology exists to communicate accurately, it becomes somewhat less useful when every rider has their own style and every route has its own demands. Tons of people are using both panniers and frame bags on the same bike and both types of bike luggage are being used for both road and off road travel. Manufacturers love it when we all use the same terms to describe what they sell, it makes it easier for us to find their product and easier to sell the same bag to more people. On the one hand following industry trends will likely make your trip easier, but on the other hand like you said you won't be learning near as much, which is part of the fun of bike travel.
Labeling helps sell merchandise. Wait till BikeOverlanding craze hits.
Just go ride!!!!!
Big difference is that traditional frame racks do not work with suspension.
A bike some bags to put your stuff in, some distance.....it's just a marketing wheeze.
LOL funny. Anyway, I think it doesn't matter what bicycle you're using. If you're using soft bags no racks, you're bikepacking, even if you're on a carbon racer. If you're on a BMX and are using panniers, then you're touring. If you're using a combo of soft packs and panniers, then you're doing a combo bike packing and bike touring. It's not about the bikes or terrain, it's about the packs and racks (or lack of em).
I think with your 4 friends, the 1 was bike packing with the 3 who were bike touring, you can be bike packing with people who are bike touring.
So, what if you (I) use a rack, with panniers, front and back, with a handlebar bag too, like touring bikes, but, on a gravel bike, with expectations of possibly ending up off pavement, AND carrying ultralight camping gear like a backpacker would?? Does that make me weird??
Absolutely, and your weirdness is totally welcome here!
sub'ed! thanks for the vids!
Thanks!
It has come to my attention that the last 20 seconds or so are getting cut off for some viewers using Microsoft Edge. If this is happening to you please let me know.
Just put them both together and call it bike camping and get over it.
What are those blue shoes behind you in this video? I like those
5.10 Free Rider Contacts. Those particular ones are in the women's colorway.
There both bicycle travel
Exactly!
Bikepacking is the evolution of Cycle touring .... i.e.cycle touring is old way.. example years ago you need to have 4 big panniers and a handle bar bag and a strong steel frame to support the weight , the reason was gear at the time was bulky and heavy.. and needed a lot of space. but now gear material is much lighter and more compact thats Bikepacking Evolution of cycle touring i.e. the future
I would definitely have to disagree in part. Traditional rack and pannier set ups are still very relevant in today's touring world. They offer many advantages over bikepacking bags in certain situations. Bikepacking setups certainly are an improvement and even an evolution in purely off road travel. Light gear has been available for a very long time but it has become less expensive and mountain biking itself has become much more prevalent.
Back in the day people made their own bags out of necessity when crossing the early bikepacking routes, now those bags have evolved and are available commercially. It's like saying snowboarding is an evolution of skiiing. They are two different things each with their own pros and cons depending on the trip you're taking and the style of travel you want to partake in. There has been and will continue to be a great deal of innovation in rack and pannier set ups as well as soft bags. Don't expect either to go away anytime soon.
I think you are very correct though, the softbags have added a lot of versatility to the types of trips people can take and how much fun they can have. I've seen a lot of hybrid set ups lately and I think lighter simpler setups will definitely become more common.
BTW I have seen a few of your videos as well. It's definitely fun following your adventures.
Thanks for your comment i don't see any benefit in using the old pannier system at all ..
I'd say the main benefit of cycle tour panniers is more space, easier and quicker to attach, and easier to pack. Bike packing bags are great for packing light and keeping the weight in line with the rider which mitigates the negative effects the weight has on handling which is particularity important when going off road.
good point
I'd say bikepacking gets you away from civilization and bike-touring keeps you in more or less populated areas.
mrbadguysan make se se
Serkan Ister sense?
Could be the other way around too. How do you pack food for more than a few days on a bikepacking setup? I once had food for 50 days plus five litre of gasoline and winter equipment on my bike-touring set up... I would say bikepacking is great until it comes to expedition-level.
mrbadguysan lol something like that