Tintagel was my first introduction to Bax, followed by Fingerhut's contribution in the Winter Legends. Glorious music. Looks as though Baxia might invade Earth and subsume it and put it out of its misery.
Yes indeed -- I bought the Naxos disc on the strength of your CT review, and vividly remember first hearing Tintagel. It gave me Tinta Chills. So huge and thrilling and evocative -- I'd be surprised if it hasn't been used in some splashy movie somewhere.
Dave - greetings from the Penal Colonies and the spiral arms of Baxia, of which I am a loyal subject. I swear by the Thomson & Ulster recording of Tintagel. My other great loves, Bax-wise, are the Fifth Symphony (with that stupendous chorale in the finale) and Spring Fire. Bravo on the advocacy! Best wishes, B
Many thanks for that wonderful review. I loooove Tintagel and of course its fabulous opening. I discovered the music with Barbirolli and still come back to him after having listened to Boult, Lloyd Jones, Handley and Thomson. Waiting for your next visit to our planet.
I fell in love with Tintagel as soon as I heard it. So colorful and enchanting. Even though I am a thoroughgoing Baxian and fan of the symphonies, Tintagel might be Sir Arnold’s finest work.
I must be a Baxian, because I don’t have any Rubbra! I listen to Bax and usually to Tintagel on Bax’s birthday when I remember it-that is, when I have nothing better to do-and agree that Barbirolli is unbeatable in this music, though I also own the Handley set which was “gifted” to me. I was fortunate about 40 years ago to visit Tintagel (but in Cornwall, UK and not on Baxia) and the view was breathtaking!
'Click' - the sound of the safety of my zapper quietly sliding back in place as finally Sir ACB got his dues! Although Bob O'Reilly (he actually was called that by the irish oboe player, when he as a youngster performed his service as military bandmaster) can be our man too, I'll issue a fair warning and say this only once: we Boultians are not to be messed with! Even when - or maybe especially when standing Bax and standing by! 😎
The "Glorious John" (Barbirolli) version of this most evocative tone poem is in my own collection. A superb piece which - like this entertaining reviewer - I think would make a great "opener" in any concert programme; In a box set of British orchestral works by the Munich SO, issued by a small label, I have another version, so it has been recorded by a non-UK orchestra, though not so impressively as by Barbirolli and the LSO. I too have visited the venue on the Cornish coast and it's easy to understand how it would have inspired this work - surely the English equivalent of the more famous "The Hebrides" Overture.
I bought the Bryden Thomson cd in the 90's. Wonderful music from Arnold Bax! Although November Woods is near brilliant...I must say from symphonic pieces about the sea is 'Tintagel' my favorite together with Debussy's 'La Mer' and ' Four sea interludes' from Britten.
Although I wouldn't consider Rubbra as one of my favorite 20th century British composers, I like his music very much, and wasn't aware, as a Bax enthusiast, that having regard for Rubbra was somehow incompatible with my love for Bax, lol. Would love to see you cover the Eire trilogy, Spring Fire, and In Memoriam, which has become one of my favorite of the tone poems. Don't know how you feel about the music of Dyson, but I love the symphony, violin concerto, the Children's Suite, The Canterbury Pilgrims, Hierusalem, and Quo Vadis, and would love to see you do a video on any of those as well. But a lot of Anglophiles don't share my enthusiasm for Dyson's music, so🤷.
I paid some attention to both Bax and Rubbra a bit over 20 years ago, and also had never realized there was an interplanetary war between their respective planets. In my case neither composer really stuck with me in the long term, though back then I leaned a bit more towards the music of Rubbra. HOWEVER, I have to add that to this day I have Bax’ concertos for violin and for cello on my iPod, whereas I haven’t listened to a note of Rubbra in 15 years or more
@@pauldavidartistclub6723 I think it's a great loss that Bax's tone poems, in particular Tintagel, November Woods, and the Garden of Fand, as well as the 2nd, 5th, and 6th symphonies, are not part of the standard repertory. I believe the best of Bax's music is infinitely superior to much 20th century music that has gained much wider currency.
@@nb2816 Tastes differ between everyone of course, though it’s nice when mutual interests are found….but in that particular line of thinking I’m afraid that I couldn’t agree with you.
Next time you should visit the garden of Fand on Baxia to understand better, what is it all about and do a report. It was the favourite poem of Sir Arnold Bax.
I like that you bother listening to some of the more obscure British stuff. I think you'd really enjoy Kenneth Leighton's Sinfonia Mistica - a very moving choral symphony.
My only disappointment with these RSNO recordings (which I love) is that it didn't lead to live performances of them at the time or since. Bax is so under-performed. At least when Deneve did his Roussel cycle he performed most of the pieces live. Incidentally there's a beautiful place in the far west highlands of Scotland called Morar, full of rugged treeless mountains, miles of white sand beaches, coves, green seas and mountainous islands off its coast where Bax would spend the gray, dark, windy winters in a small hotel room for many years, where he wrote his later symphonies. I'm not sure if the hotel is still open due to Covid but when I was last there I was told the Bax room of the Morar hotel was still being used for visitors. Perhaps its a portal to Baxia.
Tintagel. The birthplace of somebody who didn't exist. Nice place though with an excellent pasty shop. Sir John is still the best in this beautiful piece. Subjective opinion of course.
The coastline is stunning at Tintagel but very little remains of the castle - just a few crumbling walls - very little to give an idea what it once looked like.
Perhaps you can start a peace mission with a talk about Rubbras greatest composer, which is by official means not Michael Tippett but Edmund Rubbra. I heard that the folk tunes of the Rubbrians are always drown in thick counterpoint from which Edmund Rubbra got his ideas. Great stuff about Tintagel - I think, it's Bax's best work, because it's short and one doesn't loose the overview. And the sea-music is great. I heard it first (without knowing what it was) in the TV-serie "The Onedin Line", which always worked with classical music, as you know, of course. And then, I heard "Tintagel" from the Boult-recording, and before my eyes I had great clippers with blown sails.
@@lilydog1000 This was just the tune for the credits at the beginning and at the end and, sometimes, in the middle. But there was plenty of classical stuff besides the Bax; one storm was underlined by Britten's Bridge-Variations, then there have been bits from Vaughan Williams, I think one original Bridge (from "The Sea") was used aso. The pity was that the pieces are nowhere mentioned. I used it sometimes as a quiz "who wrote the tune?".
The Lyrita labels’ wonderful LPs introduced me to the British Musical Renascence and Arnold Bax. Is Bax the earliest representative of this genre? It seems that quite a few of the composers of this school lost their lives in the First World War. Please, more of the aforementioned Renaissance.
It's The Scherzo Thing, that ongoing dispute between Rubbrarians and Baxians. Rubbrarians prefer a long, repetitive, mid-symphony diversion, even if it isn't called a scherzo and has next to nothing to do with the rest of the work. Baxians are allergic to scherzos, or scherzi, three movements are quite enough thank you and we're not looking for a break from highland grandeur, seascapes, mist and legends. I'm a Bax junkie, still like much of Rubbra, but take his scherzi-style movements as a cue to hit the fridge for a beer.
As Baxian Ambassador to YouTubia, I must emphasise that Sir Arnold did not just write magnificent evocations of the natural and supernatural world, but could hold his own against those composers of ‘Pomp, Circumstance, Crowns and Sceptres’ (know who I mean 😉). Try and find a recording of ‘London Pageant’ (I know there was one on Chandos, which I have) - he out-Waltons Walton by a mile!
In my opinion, Chandos has never managed their reissue catalog well and has been a source of frustration for me for years. When they reissue at all, they tend to recouple things and so you end up missing out on some works still. They also do not often do box sets like the other companies do. Not sure what their deal is (do they want to sell product and stay in business?). They seem to bite off more than they can chew when it comes to some projects.
Chandos's Bax reissues really have been a joke and a disaster. If you go looking for their "Orchestral Music" series, you'll find there are actually two series of the same name, with the same recordings differently programmed. As for why they don't reissue stuff in box sets, I think that like most small labels they think they will ultimately make more money selling expensive singles rather than cheap boxes. They only really box stuff that isn't good enough to sell well as singles.
@@ThreadBomb Yes, but when much of your catalog is completely out of print there is no reason not to box it up. I believe all of their out of print material is available for download, and perhaps they are okay with that, but it seems like they are literally selling themselves short
You really seem to know your Baxian cosmology, even down to the planet’s recording arm. Has this built up from research over time, or quickly compiled for this video series? Fascinating as another space faring being would say. You really should think of scribing it all down and getting it published as a book series or graphic novel
As a devoted Rubbrarion, i am pleased to announce an alliance with Brucknaria. Our brothers, and sisters in Wodan will drive Baxia from the amazon belt of on line ordering.
Anti-Baxxers 😂 They’re probably funded by QAnon. Tintagel is such a wonderful work. I do like the widescreen distant perspective of Handley, but then some days I want the sea spray right in my face. For that I listen to Lloyd-Jones and his band of Selts/Chelts/Sveltes/Gaschtelts. I didn’t know about Boult/Lyrita. Thanks for the heads-up. I’ll have a rummage. You know, I lived just a few miles down the coast from Tintagel in the beautiful fishing village of Padstow. Bax stayed there for a while when he wrote it (not in Padstow itself). The word is that the ardour and passion in that piece wasn’t just about the sea as he was very friendly with a pianist there. Also, Malcom Arnold lived just two miles further down in the next village of St. Merryn. An old friend of mine used to be a pub landlord in Padstow and said Malcolm had a unique way of clearing the pub after last orders. He’d stand up on the bar and drop his trousers 😂
Yes, Arnold went with his family to Tintagel because his love, Harriet Cohen was on holiday there. They met in secret every few days. He was also a writer and penned a poem to her, ‘Tintagel Castle’
The one with Rachmaninoff Third? It's OK, but frankly not distinctive enough to matter. As I mentioned, most performances are pretty similar and I think it's splitting hairs to spend too much time making detailed comparisons.
My community orchestra did Tintagel (I was the program committee, essentially). We thought that was pretty major, although I guess not the way you meant it.
Three of the seven Bax symphonies were premiered by major American orchestras but a major American orchestra hasn't played a Bax symphony since the 1950s. The tone poems have done better with infrequent performances of Tintagel and Garden of Fand over the years in New York, Boston, Pittsburgh and Chicago. The CSO played Spring Fire in 2000 and that performance is on TH-cam. IT was conducted by Sir Mark Elder.
I've been a Baxian for quite some time - back when you could only find him dir. by Norman Del Mar. His symphonies i.e.the raw power and expressiveness hold me in suspense until the last note of those Baxian epilogues conclude.
Tintagel... beauty harnessed to power doesn't come any better than this.
My word what a beautiful piece Tintagel is.
Yes! That disc was my introduction, too. Barbirolli is brilliant. Third Symphony next, please!
Thanks Dave for excellent, humorous Bax series. Bryden Thomson with his 4 tone poems made me lifelong fan of Baxia!
Markku (my friend) greetings from the Penal Colonies. We need some Balrogs of Bax !!!
@@bernardohanlon3498 Greetings, friend! I am sure Ambassadors of Baxia can arrange them!
Tintagel was my first introduction to Bax, followed by Fingerhut's contribution in the Winter Legends. Glorious music. Looks as though Baxia might invade Earth and subsume it and put it out of its misery.
Yes indeed -- I bought the Naxos disc on the strength of your CT review, and vividly remember first hearing Tintagel. It gave me Tinta Chills. So huge and thrilling and evocative -- I'd be surprised if it hasn't been used in some splashy movie somewhere.
Dave - greetings from the Penal Colonies and the spiral arms of Baxia, of which I am a loyal subject. I swear by the Thomson & Ulster recording of Tintagel. My other great loves, Bax-wise, are the Fifth Symphony (with that stupendous chorale in the finale) and Spring Fire. Bravo on the advocacy! Best wishes, B
The chamber music is also great in my opinion (the piano quintet is the highlight), as well as the piano sonatas (2 is just wonderful).
Many thanks for that wonderful review. I loooove Tintagel and of course its fabulous opening. I discovered the music with Barbirolli and still come back to him after having listened to Boult, Lloyd Jones, Handley and Thomson. Waiting for your next visit to our planet.
I love your reviews whether I love the work or not. In this case, I love both.
I fell in love with Tintagel as soon as I heard it. So colorful and enchanting. Even though I am a thoroughgoing Baxian and fan of the symphonies, Tintagel might be Sir Arnold’s finest work.
I really enjoyed this.
I must be a Baxian, because I don’t have any Rubbra! I listen to Bax and usually to Tintagel on Bax’s birthday when I remember it-that is, when I have nothing better to do-and agree that Barbirolli is unbeatable in this music, though I also own the Handley set which was “gifted” to me. I was fortunate about 40 years ago to visit Tintagel (but in Cornwall, UK and not on Baxia) and the view was breathtaking!
'Click' - the sound of the safety of my zapper quietly sliding back in place as finally Sir ACB got his dues! Although Bob O'Reilly (he actually was called that by the irish oboe player, when he as a youngster performed his service as military bandmaster) can be our man too, I'll issue a fair warning and say this only once: we Boultians are not to be messed with! Even when - or maybe especially when standing Bax and standing by! 😎
The "Glorious John" (Barbirolli) version of this most evocative tone poem is in my own
collection. A superb piece which - like this entertaining reviewer - I think would make a
great "opener" in any concert programme; In a box set of British orchestral works by the Munich SO, issued by a small label, I have another version, so it has been recorded by a
non-UK orchestra, though not so impressively as by Barbirolli and the LSO. I too have
visited the venue on the Cornish coast and it's easy to understand how it would have
inspired this work - surely the English equivalent of the more famous "The Hebrides" Overture.
King Arthur's favorite tone poem from Bax.
I bought the Bryden Thomson cd in the 90's. Wonderful music from Arnold Bax! Although November Woods is near brilliant...I must say from symphonic pieces about the sea is 'Tintagel' my favorite together with Debussy's 'La Mer' and ' Four sea interludes' from Britten.
I have Tintagel with JoAnn Falleta and Virginia Symphony.
Their Mahler 8 is really, really good! (Falleta/Virginia).
There is a wonderful Bax film bio by Ken Russell with Glrnda Jackson as pianist, Harriet Cohen, - great watch if you can get it. Viva Bax!
I have the Boult recording and love it👍
I love both Rubbra 6 and Tintagel - is there something wrong with me?
No, there's something right with you.
I'm quite fond of his ostinato piano piece "Paean"
Am I fond of this work? My license plate says “Tintagel.”
Really? That's cool!
Although I wouldn't consider Rubbra as one of my favorite 20th century British composers, I like his music very much, and wasn't aware, as a Bax enthusiast, that having regard for Rubbra was somehow incompatible with my love for Bax, lol. Would love to see you cover the Eire trilogy, Spring Fire, and In Memoriam, which has become one of my favorite of the tone poems. Don't know how you feel about the music of Dyson, but I love the symphony, violin concerto, the Children's Suite, The Canterbury Pilgrims, Hierusalem, and Quo Vadis, and would love to see you do a video on any of those as well. But a lot of Anglophiles don't share my enthusiasm for Dyson's music, so🤷.
I paid some attention to both Bax and Rubbra a bit over 20 years ago, and also had never realized there was an interplanetary war between their respective planets. In my case neither composer really stuck with me in the long term, though back then I leaned a bit more towards the music of Rubbra. HOWEVER, I have to add that to this day I have Bax’ concertos for violin and for cello on my iPod, whereas I haven’t listened to a note of Rubbra in 15 years or more
@@pauldavidartistclub6723 I think it's a great loss that Bax's tone poems, in particular Tintagel, November Woods, and the Garden of Fand, as well as the 2nd, 5th, and 6th symphonies, are not part of the standard repertory. I believe the best of Bax's music is infinitely superior to much 20th century music that has gained much wider currency.
@@nb2816 Tastes differ between everyone of course, though it’s nice when mutual interests are found….but in that particular line of thinking I’m afraid that I couldn’t agree with you.
Next time you should visit the garden of Fand on Baxia to understand better, what is it all about and do a report. It was the favourite poem of Sir Arnold Bax.
I like that you bother listening to some of the more obscure British stuff. I think you'd really enjoy Kenneth Leighton's Sinfonia Mistica - a very moving choral symphony.
My only disappointment with these RSNO recordings (which I love) is that it didn't lead to live performances of them at the time or since. Bax is so under-performed. At least when Deneve did his Roussel cycle he performed most of the pieces live. Incidentally there's a beautiful place in the far west highlands of Scotland called Morar, full of rugged treeless mountains, miles of white sand beaches, coves, green seas and mountainous islands off its coast where Bax would spend the gray, dark, windy winters in a small hotel room for many years, where he wrote his later symphonies. I'm not sure if the hotel is still open due to Covid but when I was last there I was told the Bax room of the Morar hotel was still being used for visitors. Perhaps its a portal to Baxia.
Tintagel. The birthplace of somebody who didn't exist. Nice place though with an excellent pasty shop. Sir John is still the best in this beautiful piece. Subjective opinion of course.
Anti-Baxxer is a fantastic turn of phrase. (also just a note from a Brit - the first vowel in Rubbra is like the 'u' in rubber)
I've heard that the denizens of Rubbra 6 pronounce it "Roobra", but that might just be a rummour... sorry, rumour ;)
I pronounced it like that until I heard it done as "Roobra" from British colleagues. Happy to go back to the original, if I remember.
Garden of Fand next? Symphony no. 3?
The coastline is stunning at Tintagel but very little remains of the castle - just a few crumbling walls - very little to give an idea what it once looked like.
Perhaps you can start a peace mission with a talk about Rubbras greatest composer, which is by official means not Michael Tippett but Edmund Rubbra. I heard that the folk tunes of the Rubbrians are always drown in thick counterpoint from which Edmund Rubbra got his ideas.
Great stuff about Tintagel - I think, it's Bax's best work, because it's short and one doesn't loose the overview. And the sea-music is great. I heard it first (without knowing what it was) in the TV-serie "The Onedin Line", which always worked with classical music, as you know, of course. And then, I heard "Tintagel" from the Boult-recording, and before my eyes I had great clippers with blown sails.
I think you will find that the music used in the Onedin line was from Spartacus by Khachaturian. Khachaturia is friendly with Baxia.
@@lilydog1000 This was just the tune for the credits at the beginning and at the end and, sometimes, in the middle. But there was plenty of classical stuff besides the Bax; one storm was underlined by Britten's Bridge-Variations, then there have been bits from Vaughan Williams, I think one original Bridge (from "The Sea") was used aso. The pity was that the pieces are nowhere mentioned. I used it sometimes as a quiz "who wrote the tune?".
The Lyrita labels’ wonderful LPs introduced me to the British Musical Renascence and Arnold Bax. Is Bax the earliest representative of this genre? It seems that quite a few of the composers of this school lost their lives in the First World War. Please, more of the aforementioned Renaissance.
It's The Scherzo Thing, that ongoing dispute between Rubbrarians and Baxians. Rubbrarians prefer a long, repetitive, mid-symphony diversion, even if it isn't called a scherzo and has next to nothing to do with the rest of the work. Baxians are allergic to scherzos, or scherzi, three movements are quite enough thank you and we're not looking for a break from highland grandeur, seascapes, mist and legends. I'm a Bax junkie, still like much of Rubbra, but take his scherzi-style movements as a cue to hit the fridge for a beer.
Or hit the fridge with a beer...
As Baxian Ambassador to YouTubia, I must emphasise that Sir Arnold did not just write magnificent evocations of the natural and supernatural world, but could hold his own against those composers of ‘Pomp, Circumstance, Crowns and Sceptres’ (know who I mean 😉). Try and find a recording of ‘London Pageant’ (I know there was one on Chandos, which I have) - he out-Waltons Walton by a mile!
As always - great presentation of a sadly all too infrequently performed composer. Any chance of a Britten violin and/or piano concerto talk?
There's a chance of everything, eventually.
In my opinion, Chandos has never managed their reissue catalog well and has been a source of frustration for me for years. When they reissue at all, they tend to recouple things and so you end up missing out on some works still. They also do not often do box sets like the other companies do. Not sure what their deal is (do they want to sell product and stay in business?). They seem to bite off more than they can chew when it comes to some projects.
The residents of the planets Prokofia and Waltonia agree with you.
Chandos's Bax reissues really have been a joke and a disaster. If you go looking for their "Orchestral Music" series, you'll find there are actually two series of the same name, with the same recordings differently programmed.
As for why they don't reissue stuff in box sets, I think that like most small labels they think they will ultimately make more money selling expensive singles rather than cheap boxes. They only really box stuff that isn't good enough to sell well as singles.
@@ThreadBomb Yes, but when much of your catalog is completely out of print there is no reason not to box it up. I believe all of their out of print material is available for download, and perhaps they are okay with that, but it seems like they are literally selling themselves short
You really seem to know your Baxian cosmology, even down to the planet’s recording arm. Has this built up from research over time, or quickly compiled for this video series? Fascinating as another space faring being would say. You really should think of scribing it all down and getting it published as a book series or graphic novel
I was abducted to planet Baxia a few decades ago. It was unforgettable.
I was mistaken about Bax being the first in the line of renascence British composers, I think it was Hubert Perry (?)
@@ThomasTVP Thanks
Hey Dave...
If Baxia is at war, why not load Bax symphony no 1 into the guns?
listening to Rubbra is like watching a wall of beige paint dry
But do you like it?
@@DavesClassicalGuide . NO boring boring boring
In the spirit of interplanetary cooperation, will we have a video on Rubbra? Maybe Rubbra 6. Chandos need to put their Bax into it.
Indeed.
As a devoted Rubbrarion, i am pleased to announce an alliance with Brucknaria. Our brothers, and sisters in Wodan will drive Baxia from the amazon belt of on line ordering.
You do have to do Delius one day.....
I already did Brigg Fair.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Forgot that one. You must be close to 400.
Anti-Baxxers 😂
They’re probably funded by QAnon.
Tintagel is such a wonderful work. I do like the widescreen distant perspective of Handley, but then some days I want the sea spray right in my face. For that I listen to Lloyd-Jones and his band of Selts/Chelts/Sveltes/Gaschtelts.
I didn’t know about Boult/Lyrita. Thanks for the heads-up. I’ll have a rummage.
You know, I lived just a few miles down the coast from Tintagel in the beautiful fishing village of Padstow. Bax stayed there for a while when he wrote it (not in Padstow itself). The word is that the ardour and passion in that piece wasn’t just about the sea as he was very friendly with a pianist there.
Also, Malcom Arnold lived just two miles further down in the next village of St. Merryn. An old friend of mine used to be a pub landlord in Padstow and said Malcolm had a unique way of clearing the pub after last orders. He’d stand up on the bar and drop his trousers 😂
That's the kind of news only a true native could share! Thank you.
You know, to see the rest of this post, I had to hit "read more." By the last line, I was happy to hit "show less." 😁
@@davidrowe3356 I’m glad to have made you happy 😉
@@DavesClassicalGuide You’re welcome.
Yes, Arnold went with his family to Tintagel because his love, Harriet Cohen was on holiday there. They met in secret every few days. He was also a writer and penned a poem to her, ‘Tintagel Castle’
I have 9 performances. Have you heard the Vanska on LPO? Nic performance, good sound. My go to version for many years was the Barbirolli.
The one with Rachmaninoff Third? It's OK, but frankly not distinctive enough to matter. As I mentioned, most performances are pretty similar and I think it's splitting hairs to spend too much time making detailed comparisons.
I would venture to guess that Bax has never been performed live by a major American orchestra ever.................
My community orchestra did Tintagel (I was the program committee, essentially). We thought that was pretty major, although I guess not the way you meant it.
Three of the seven Bax symphonies were premiered by major American orchestras but a major American orchestra hasn't played a Bax symphony since the 1950s. The tone poems have done better with infrequent performances of Tintagel and Garden of Fand over the years in New York, Boston, Pittsburgh and Chicago. The CSO played Spring Fire in 2000 and that performance is on TH-cam. IT was conducted by Sir Mark Elder.
I've been a Baxian for quite some time - back when you could only find him dir. by Norman Del Mar. His symphonies i.e.the raw power and expressiveness hold me in suspense until the last note of those Baxian epilogues conclude.