The Web That Never Was - Dylan Beattie

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 ต.ค. 2024

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  • @richardellard
    @richardellard 2 ปีที่แล้ว +62

    As a 36 year old mathematician, I can confirm that the idea of LaTeX being antiquated is against the natural order of things.

    • @justafriend5361
      @justafriend5361 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      I might sound odd to all things that are natural, but:
      When I got introduced to LaTex by a fellow student in my engineering studies, I was like "Finally!".
      It blew my mind a bit that there was a type of editing a document which you can throw together in a text editor, refer to images in relative paths, zip all together, send it to godknowswhere, it gets typeset in the compiler or what it is called and they see the same as you did.
      And all stays in the same place forever if done correctly.
      Ever tried to do this in Word?
      Ever tried to fix section break (next page) after having a section break (continuous) deleted at the end?
      That's Dantes tenth, I tell you.
      You will go up the whole document deleting every section break just to set them new...and on a small mistake, the whole work of sysiphos starts new...
      Sorry, I needed to place this rant...

    • @fluffpuckot
      @fluffpuckot ปีที่แล้ว +1

      LaTeX rules! It takes a while to get used to, and trying to get pictures where you want them is a challenge. I found one bloke who a lot of macros and other neat tooling, so he could take lecture notes in LaTeX, that was impressive!

    • @justafriend5361
      @justafriend5361 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@fluffpuckot Yeah, placing pictures is a challenge you only want to take once. And only need to take once since the solution you have found is adoptable with just some lines of typesetting. And smart programms let you input them like macros in word, but easier.
      And if someone reads this and wants to start with latex: stackoverflow and stackexchange are your friends...
      Oh, and template, template, template!

  • @steveyuhas9278
    @steveyuhas9278 2 ปีที่แล้ว +19

    I love that this is basically a "what if...." comic for even bigger nerds than comic book readers.

  • @JaccovanSchaik
    @JaccovanSchaik 2 ปีที่แล้ว +45

    Until about twenty minutes in I'm thinking "that's not how I remember it..." Then the penny dropped.

    • @hhhsp951
      @hhhsp951 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Duuude.

    • @256k_
      @256k_ 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      i realized something was off when i saw GEM / 95 :D

  • @skamithi
    @skamithi 2 ปีที่แล้ว +28

    Dude you got some seriously good presentation skills for a techie.

  • @SpiritmanProductions
    @SpiritmanProductions 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Imagine how much more secure and less error-prone JavaScript would be if the inventor had had time to make it strongly typed.

  • @guai9632
    @guai9632 6 ปีที่แล้ว +21

    why is there "~html(lang:en)" with colon but "~code(type=text/hyperlisp)" with equal sign?

  • @moofymoo
    @moofymoo 4 ปีที่แล้ว +41

    plot twist: this guy is from parallel universe and are telling how things played out there.

  • @hakier_
    @hakier_ 2 ปีที่แล้ว +8

    Thank you Dylan Beattie for this great talk!
    Your talks are always fascinating and spoken in a way that is a big pleasure to listen.
    Great job! Please do more.

  • @striker865
    @striker865 6 ปีที่แล้ว +9

    What a fascinating talk, keep me at my seats edge the whole way through.

  • @user-nj1qc7uc9c
    @user-nj1qc7uc9c 2 ปีที่แล้ว +16

    damn, such a shame that html wasnt based off of LaTeX

  • @ericmememan4632
    @ericmememan4632 2 ปีที่แล้ว +14

    god if javascript never existed i would be so much happier lmao

  • @ekkiplicht7283
    @ekkiplicht7283 ปีที่แล้ว

    This is one of the best f****ing history of the web. Absolutely great. Thanks!

  • @TheGreeeen
    @TheGreeeen 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    I love how fact and fiction is mixed ... it's kind of Perfect (Digital :) :) )

  • @JohnDlugosz
    @JohnDlugosz ปีที่แล้ว +2

    HTML wasn't just made up out of thin air and a few bright ideas. It is a specific configuration of SGLM, which was used heavily not for scientific papers but for government documents.
    I think an alternative notation would have used curly braces not for tags but for scope, based on TeX and a superset of the LaTeX macro set -- just add hrefs, but you already have rich formatting.

  • @kenzijeanis
    @kenzijeanis 2 ปีที่แล้ว +10

    I desperately need an implementation of this theoretical GEM, along with an implementation of that HTML+HyperLisp. It would be so much fun to play with.
    A transpiler from this alternative HTML to HTML5 and from this HyperLisp to JS/Wasm is doable, but I have no idea what GEM95 would look like.

    • @JTCF
      @JTCF 2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      the alternative html looks so pretty, I want to use it instead of an incest result that current html is

    • @parnikkapore
      @parnikkapore 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      GEM95 would probably be just a rebranded W95
      I'm honestly surprised that a parser/transpiler for this syntax has not already been written. People write entire pages in Pug fgs

    • @trijezdci4588
      @trijezdci4588 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      GEM isn't hypothetical. GEM really existed. It ran on MS-DOS and on Atari computers, where it was the default GUI.

  • @cmdr_thrudd
    @cmdr_thrudd 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    That was really fun. Thanks :)

  • @JohnDlugosz
    @JohnDlugosz ปีที่แล้ว +1

    I think some of these ideas would be great for use in a science fiction story that's not quite our world; besides the differences essential for the plot, I like to toss out references to show that this really is a different world rather than the details of the setting simply being "wrong".

  • @joemucchiello4542
    @joemucchiello4542 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Not only do I wish this was the web, I wish BeOS had gotten somewhere.

  • @IsxaaqAcademy
    @IsxaaqAcademy ปีที่แล้ว

    Great and interesting

  • @christianemden7637
    @christianemden7637 ปีที่แล้ว

    this thing has seen far too few likes, for the completely fun this was giving me.

  • @kireitonsi
    @kireitonsi 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    This is why I was so suspicious of the Metaverse! Nintendo warned us!!!

  • @soyitiel
    @soyitiel 2 ปีที่แล้ว +8

    4:37 bruh, did this guy predict the metaverse?

    • @thaumly
      @thaumly 2 ปีที่แล้ว +9

      No, he didn't. There and Second Life both predate that, and the term "metaverse" was even used to describe them as far back as 2006.

    • @marcocapacchietti6753
      @marcocapacchietti6753 2 ปีที่แล้ว +8

      William Gibson's book Neuromancer (which Dylan mentions) narrates its story in a metaverse in 1989.

    • @sefirotsama
      @sefirotsama 2 ปีที่แล้ว +4

      Humanity dreams the metaverse since the Neuromancer sci-fi books were written. 1970s if I recall it correcrly

    • @____uncompetative
      @____uncompetative 2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      Metaverse - Neal Stephenson (1992) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snow_Crash#Plot_summary "Commercial real-estate on a single VR street populated by Avatars like in an MMO"
      Cyberspace - William Gibson (1981) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burning_Chrome#Reception "A consensual hallucination"

  • @4cps777
    @4cps777 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    22:10 X11 witnessed the end of the dinosaurs and will probably also witness the end of Wayland

  • @januszkszczotek8587
    @januszkszczotek8587 ปีที่แล้ว

    Hilarious. Thank you!

  • @seriouscat2231
    @seriouscat2231 ปีที่แล้ว

    He pronounces X11 like XL-even at 22:14. Had to do some retakes before I understood it.

  • @____uncompetative
    @____uncompetative 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Interesting to imagine another alternative where we have Ted Nelson's XANADU original Hypertext which operated on a system of "transclusion" rather than hyperlinks.
    Transclusion is the including, with attribution, some selection from another document which also knows where its transclusions were taken from. This operates like a "quote" by such-and-such where clicking on the "quote" takes you to the context of the quote in such-and-such's document. So, to provide an example of what this would be like: rather than falsely claim Donald Trump said something racist in a quote, provide no way to jump to the context from which that was taken, as there is no requirement for a quote to actually be a real quote someone has authoritatively said with full surrounding context, and Google could be used with "surrounding quotes" in the hopes of finding its web crawler had the address of a page in which that text appeared, but it could be that this text was said by someone else, or by a site also falsely claiming the President said something racist, providing no official corroboration of its sources like an unedited video clip from the official White House TH-cam channel, but a lot of links to more examples of racist things the President had said, each leading down a rabbit hole into a warren of ultimately uncorroborated links, in the hope that some of the smears would stick, and you would walk away thinking that "there is no smoke without fire" therefore all this "smoke" implies "fire" even though you have yet to see any proof positive of "fire", and even if you are quite opposed to what amounts to multiple sites cross-referencing dubious uncorroborated sources which amount to little more than unsubstantiated innuendo, you end up too exhausted to keep diving down into the seemingly endless rabbit warren of false factoids that aren't even presented as allegations - this was the primary "gaslighting" technique used by the #GamerGate movement, which was associated with toxic misogyny from its very inception, when actor Adam Baldwin embedded a video by the anonymous wannabe journalist The Internet Aristocrat in a now long since deleted tweet he sent out to his many Libertarian followers on Twitter along with the hashtag #GamerGate in which false and subsequently investigated and disproven allegations were made about Nathan Grayson reviewing a game by a female developer in exchange for sex with her, the fact is that the game was reviewed instead by Patricia Hernandez:
    archive.ph/RhYoC
    Here is what Kotaku's Editor, Stephen Totilo had to say about the alleged controversy that turned out to be an empty smear perpetrated by an anonymous wannabe journalist and circulated far and wide by a D-list actor from a cancelled sci-fi show some people liked:
    kotaku.com/in-recent-days-ive-been-asked-several-times-about-a-pos-1624707346
    and because Adam Baldwin is a coward and Jack Dorsey is a Postmodern Neo Marxist who supports the suppression of journalism (from the oldest newspaper in the United States) and rewriting of history (as does the Mirriam-Webster dictionary support the redefinition of language - a postmodern trick to promote Neo Marxism in the form of Critical Race Theory and Gender Theory and Globalised Eco-Socialism such as that promoted by the World Economic Forum), Dorsey allows for tweets to be deleted rather than to have them to have click-through notice that disavows the original tweet, but when clicked on reveals the original tweet and when it was posted, with anyone's personal addresses redacted from public view (but not from private law enforcement and legal prosecution and defense attorney's, such as in the case of a death threat), so all I have to show is this image (and then get reasonable claims that I have fabricated it in _Photoshop_ which I didn't do, but frustratingly can't prove isn't the case as the World Wide Web is excrement):
    twitter.com/crabcrawler1/status/1563260229634048000/photo/1
    So, in summary you have a whole self righteous movement for ethics in game journalism grow up around a catchy hashtag coined by Adam Baldwin in a now since deleted tweet which associated #GamerGate with toxic misogyny from an anonymous coward wannabe journalist, subsequently deleted by a coward actor (who only _plays_ tough guys), and is supported in that endeavour by Jack Dorsey who swayed the outcome of the unconstitutional 2020 Presidential Election and is, therefore, a traitor to the United States, along with the FBI, who sat on the Hunter Biden laptop for a year when acting on it would have compelled Joe Biden to step out of the rigged Democrat Primaries, and we might not have got a second term of Trump, but we would have got Bernie Sanders as he was in the lead, and only stood aside for Joe when Obama called him up.

    • @____uncompetative
      @____uncompetative 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      Continued...
      Transclusion would help stop the "good people on both sides" quote being taken out of context as condoning Neo-Nazis. It would stop Dr Fauci claiming he is "the science" when science is a process, a debate, a discourse, based by evidence, not the diktat of some Emperor of some Deep State organisation like the NIAID. The attribution that the Hunter Biden laptop wasn't hacked, but the legal property of the Mac Repair shop owner as 90 days had elapsed and he freely shared it, should not be countered by the FBI meeting with Mark Zuckerberg to "gaslight" him about a wave of Russian disinformation, when the Russian disinformation tied to Trump's 2016 election was disproven by the Mueller investigation, and those who claimed there was shenanigans initially, went silent when it came time to testify as they would have perjured themselves, and the 2nd impeachment would have got to meaningful answers about what Pelosi knew on the 6th but she stopped the impeachment going ahead further as it implicated her role in the death of Ashli Babbitt (using it as an excuse to suspend the constitutional process of government, and then "gaslight" those Senators that they couldn't resume their prior claims of irregularity as something terrible had happened - when there was more reason than ever to ensure that the constitution was followed, even if it went to court like the whole "hanging chad" thing with Bush / Gore, and remember Hillary didn't accept Trump won in 2016, so this "no decision on the day" is normal for the United States). It would mean that _The New York Post_ would have a XANADU compliant website correctly attributing the Mac Repair shop owner as the source of the Hunter Biden laptop photos, and with Hunter Biden as the creator of those photos, and the "Big Guy" or "Pedo Peter" as being correctly identified as Joe Biden, because transclusion would extend to phones.
      It would also be nice to see no Microsoft spyware OSes and no Microsoft Office bloatware, with the Wang wordprocessor being faster in operation than _Word 6.0_ was at the time on slower hardware, the reason being that Wang had a RAM resident filing system (the secretaries would say it occasionally lost work, but coming from mechanical typewriters it was a huge productivity boost over having to retype a page for a single typo), and in time, with the invention of Flash, these dedicated wordprocessors could have been flash based and non volatile in their storage. The XANADU system could link resources from a local server into a group of wordprocessors on a LAN, or WiFi network, and then this could connect to the internet to Cloud Compute / Libraries, to support Groupware Authoring and Streaming of resources that were published outside of "Walled Gardens" (like Netflix, and Hulu, and Amazon Prime, and HBO MAX, and Disney+) because the transclusion-attribution system would also monetise content per rental, or per purchase, with there being no subscription models for these services and therefore no bloatware dross filler that you ended up watching as there wasn't anything else to watch and you were paying monthly for the service. You would rent/buy a movie and watch it once/multiple-times. That way only good movies would get money, along with good TV shows and isolated documentaries on one topic. No one would have to subscribe to five or ten streaming services to not miss out on _Star Wars_ as well as _Star Trek_ as well as _Stargate SG-1._ However, I don't think you need Bitcoin to do the payments stuff for this unless your name is Hunter Biden and you want to rent child pornography, which is evidenced by some of what he searched for in his internet web history.
      It is important that everyone leaves a digital footprint behind.
      So, the argument for anonymity on Twitter (i.e. the Arab Spring protestors) could be countered by having an "underground" anonymous account and an accountable "your real name" account, so that celebrities could make their posts viewable by everyone (who could opt-in to follow them), and then not deal with death threats (like J.K.Rowling and have this be normalised by being seen to be public when the person making the threat is not using their real verified name). This doesn't mean anonymous threats aren't a problem that shouldn't be investigated by the police (they should). However, the toxic echo chambers of Twitter would become self contained and less pollutive of general well mannered discourse (which included disagreements, but not death threats) by those who chose only to see tweets by people who used their real verified name. Therefore, there would be more checkmarked accounts (which you would have to verify by Facial Recognition on your smartphone or via your computer's webcam, so that every time you wrote a tweet it would know from your biometric login that it was you - there would be no passwords or 2FA nuisance, indeed the computer would turn on when you sat in front of the desktop, the phone would illuminate when you picked it up to look at it, the laptop when it was opened up or sat down in front of, and there would be no "It has to reboot" / "It is installing an update come back later" shenanigans as it would run two OSes, one of which it could patch in the background and then swap over to).

    • @____uncompetative
      @____uncompetative 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      Continued...
      I do think the Web could be reinvented from within. Not as a Web 3.0 or Web 4.0 that was backwards compatible with legacy content, but a new system more like XANADU that ran on computers more like the Wang, and initially did LESS but did that LESS properly and well considered in all use cases without operational compromise on people's precious productivity. Maybe they can't flow text around an embedded chart, and can only print out the chart on a page by itself, it doesn't matter... the main thing is that the Wordprocessor isn't distracting you with red squiggly lines, alert boxes, Notification pings, contextual ribbons where numerous features are grouped seemingly arbitrarily into tabs that don't even look like tabs, all of which takes up space for your text, whenever that isn't being occluded by Clippy asking you if you want some help with what it thinks you are trying to write (a feature that has already come back with a vengeance on GitHub).
      In the US the police need to get a judge to issue a search warrant to justify them entering your home to find something that could incriminate you. This legal protection inhibits law enforcement from being able to just turn up at people's homes, demand entry and search them until they find something they can arrest them for. Applied to the context of a digital footprint this would mean that the law should prevent any law enforcement agency from accessing your digital footprint in a way that what is found can be used to bring you to court. So, in a sense your web browser history should be protected from an illegal search. Reason to perform that search should be obtained first, to legitimate that search. An AI can glean patterns in your browser history which aren't criminal, so an online shop doesn't publicly recommend "You may also like" Cocaine 1 kg even though it knows you ordered a couple of grams off the Dark Web, nor does it alert law enforcement, with the DEA needing reason to investigate you, before a judge can grant the DEA access to your browser history, etc.
      Some compromise is needed between free online services that see patterns in anonymised data mining (not you specifically but middle class white computer geeks like you), running their servers and remaining free, and gaining everyone as a customer because of that (so poor people aren't priced out by a subscription system), and criminal liability, or the social credit system operating in China which denies basic services to citizens who are deemed troublesome to the CCP. An Ethereum CBDC WEF based global economy of 'smart contracts' would entail this citizen tracking at the very least, and Trudeau bank account suspending for donating to legitimate peaceful protestors as another form of political overreach. Hopefully, the pendulum swings back this November, and no one need worry about a rise of Fascism as Trump is basically an Independent, who stirred up the white underclass over their feeling that their jobs were being taken by outsourcing to Mexico, etc. and some within that community were like Richard Spencer, and despite Trump condemning them, the media didn't report that and framing this man with Jewish grandchildren a Neo-Nazi.

  • @Vespansis
    @Vespansis 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

    What a troll 😅

  • @blackhorse8427
    @blackhorse8427 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    What was the point of telling such of made up stories? Pointless and dumb

    • @mjouwbuis
      @mjouwbuis 2 ปีที่แล้ว +14

      So because YOU didn't get the point, you call the narrator pointless and dumb, instead of yourself? That's a bit stupid, don't you think? At the risk you still won't understand and think I'm also dumb, I'll help you get started anyway. Several points are mentioned in the last few minutes and in the video description. Amongst others, it's about highlighting turning points where decisions are made that shape the future. He does so by having those turning points have different outcomes and exploring what happens next.

    • @steveyuhas9278
      @steveyuhas9278 2 ปีที่แล้ว +9

      If you didn't get the point, I'm not sure why you're even here. It was to show that minute changes to small details could have had vast impact in how we view and think about the macrocosm of the internet and computer technology. And the effect on society in general. It's to highlight just how big these seemingly small decisions and outcomes ended up being. Don't be an asshat, this was a cool talk.

    • @arthurdent8086
      @arthurdent8086 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      This guy is insightful and brilliant, and I learn something every time I see him talk (maybe one day in person). He's a rock star! I stumbled on this talk and decided to invest the time just because I had seen other talks he has done. I am glad I did. Sorry you didn't feel the same.

    • @TNH91
      @TNH91 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@arthurdent8086 He's even a rockstar programmer!

  • @youtubesuresuckscock
    @youtubesuresuckscock 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    What a lame uninformed presentation.