Paul Finebaum, Michigan hater extraordinaire even came out and said no asterisk, Michigan was the best team this year period. Didn't need to cheat to slap Penn State, Ohio State, Iowa, Alabama, or Washington. And it's 3 str8 against Ohio.
This is a moot point. The NCAA has come out and said that Michigan won the NC “fair and square”. Before October 20, Michigan played mediocre teams that it destroyed and could not have beaten Michigan, with our without signs. After October 20, all the teams were alerted and changed their sighs, and Michigan beat them anyway. All those complaints are sour grapes.
Sign stealing isn't even against the rules. The alleged violation just had to do with the way they got the signs, not that they had them. (You can steal signs from watching on TV, but can't attend the game in person.) The rule has to do with costs, not competitive balance.
Not to mention most college teams change their signs weekly so the only time advanced scouting might give you a slight advantage is if you’re scouting them the week before you play. If you’re doing it weeks ahead of time it’s basically a waste of energy.
Offenses do NOT change signals weekly. Go listen to the several real coaches whove come out and discribed the nightmare that it is and why they dont changes@jackpackage4278
What great timing. Just this morning the NCAA president said Michigans win have been found as “Fair and Square” and an asterisk on the national championship would not be necessary. I’m glad to see Michigan is being vindicated nationally as true non cheating national champs. They deserve it.
He’s actually just validating why they presented evidence early. He’s saying that the wins afterwards are legitimate. Which I agree to. But he’s not absolving Michigan of guilt. They’re still going to finish their investigation and punish them for the illegal activity. There are those who will still say the cheating occurred this season and Michigan shouldn’t have been in the playoffs.
You remember when Ryan Day was suspended for sharing Michigan signals with Iowa and Purdue? Nah? Me either. Buckeye tears taste even better as a national fkn champions. 🤣🤣
Indeed they do! And he had connections to the people that accused Michigan of sign stealing in the first place. Ohio State is trying to cheat Michigan, all the while accusing them of being the cheaters.
The NCAA has come out officially and publicly via a letter to Michigan President Santo Ono that Michigan’s win is legitimate, as was the season. Go Blue.
Did you read the whole letter? They said that there was clear evidence of cheating at the start of the season and they felt like they couldn't sit on what they learned so they told B10 and UM. Things were changed after that and that made it fair. So yes, they won the game fair but they should have never been allowed to play due to the evidence that was given to them.
@@corylove1321 actually it just shows you how screwed up the NCAA really is at the core of the situation. They say there’s evidence, but then they said there wasn’t any evidence. Then they said that they were going to suspend our coach for so many games to “protect the safety of his players”, which makes no sense. Then they said that they did not see that there was any reason to come forward and say that they didn’t have evidence as they were told they would be given evidence??? Then they weren’t then they said they had something.. then they said they didn’t. I think this pretty much says all we need to hear doesn’t it? If this was something that you or I did say we were being investigated for murder, that’s not having charges brought against you. That’s not being found guilty, and they are heh back-and-forth so much. I think that they are embarrassed. They were told they had this perfect case against us, and now they realize that we’ve done no more than what every other team is allowed to do and they have egg on their face. So they can pound sand.
NCAA is screwed up and in my opinion they are ruining college sports. But that is a topic for a different time. I read the letter multiple times and it pretty much said that the investigation is still ongoing and they are trying to speed it up but Michigan won the game fairly. I agree that they won fairly and Blake is an amazing RB and that was defense is legit. They shared the information with the schools because they wanted a fair season. That being said, they have evidence from the 3rd party that goes supports the theory that UM had an advantage. It will probably be 1 - 3 years before we have all the information on this scandal. I don't mind UM at all. I just want a fair season and myself along with many other fans think that letting a team that cheated at the start of the season in the championship is wrong. @@elishavarivka8923
In all these comments and interviews, I rarely see anyone blaming college football for either of Michigan’s “horrendous” violations that Harbaugh did end up serving a six game suspension for. #1, he bought a potential recruit a hamburger and drink during a recruiting visit then didn’t fully cooperate with the witch hunt over it. Other teams have recruits showing up in thousand dollar wardrobes, thousands of dollars in jewelry and expensive sports cars but we don’t investigate that. #2, the NCAA could easily approve of and provide a couple of helmet speakers and comm systems to each team so the varied ways of signaling plays to the players in the field become null and void, hence no signs to steal. But they won’t do it. They want to keep drama in the game because it gives a level of involvement to non fans who talk about the controversies and amps up the involvement of the fans. Bottom line is, sign stealing is legal. Right after it hit the fan for Michigan and Stallions, a tv broadcast joked that they were involved in a sign stealing scandal when they showed a team signaling in signs to the players on their national broadcast. Like no team could record a basic tv broadcast, review the tapes and say “they used these signals and ran this play”. It’s completely stupid.
They know they just do not care if it's an opportunity to stain michigan fair or not they push that agenda. I will add Michigan is not innocent but just not a big enough violation when you look at the big picture. I guess Ohio state should have waited a few more games to hand over hard drives lol
Well if IF Michigan actually "cheated" then the news got out every team in the playoffs would've change their sings... and even without Harbaugh there Michigan still won it all... So fr people hating on this title are just dumb to do so anyway 🤷🏻♂️ (Not a Michigan fan btw)
The thing is it has NEVER been illegal to steal signs, figure out signals, or anything like that. What was illegal was sending someone to "advance scout", which is a rule meant to keep Division 3 tennis squads and such from using money to gain an advantage over opponents... A minor rule violation in my opinion. I never understood the big to-do. Bill Burr makes the point better, of course: You can literally hire the coordinator or coach who came up with the signs and schemes from his old team to yours, the guy who knows it inside and out, right in the middle of the season, and that's not against the rules. Because knowing the opponent's stuff is not a bad thing.
I'm a diehard Buckeye fan but also a bit objective, the games that Mattered this season I do feel they won fair n square and the players Earned the Natty regardless of what happens!!!!
THIS IS JUST BS SENT BY LESSER COACHES WHO WERE TIRED OF GETTING THEIR BUTTS KICKED BY MICHIGAN!!! THIS IS A STUPID WITCH HUNT TO TARNISH OUR NAME BUT GUESS WHAT WE ARE NATIONAL CHAMPS PERIOD〽️〽️〽️🏈🏈🏈〽️〽️〽️🏆🏆🏆🏆 TEAM 144 ARE LEGENDS PERIOD AND MICHIGAN WILL ALWAYS BE LEGENDARY!!! GO BLUE FOREVA 〽️〽️〽️🏈🏈🏈🏆🏆🏆🏆
THE Michigan Wolverines have not only PRODUCED THE GREATEST QUARTERBACK OF ALL TIME TOM BRADY 💪 but also THE Michigan Wolverines have THE best fight song AND helmet logo in the country hands down 🫳🎤
Ask Washington, Alabama, Iowa in Ohio State and Penn State if the title is tainted. There's your answer. Look at those bodies that got beat up while Michigan was being accused.
And it was never even proven they'd been sign stealing; it was just rumors and hearsay, and the people that leaked the claim had ties to Ryan Day. Says everything you need to know in my opinion.
Signs should be changed often anyways. How are coaches and assistants being paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to just make stalwart and old signals? Even if you think the other team cannot figure out your signal, you should STILL change them because FILM exists for other teams to study and match up.
Guess we will have to question all of the recent championships. You don't think there were improprieties with other teams like Georgia, Bama, Clemson and ohio???? Your kidding yourself...
After Stallions left, Michigan beat Penn State in Happy Valley, Maryland at Maryland, #2 Ohio State, Alabama & Nick Saban, & Washington in the National Championship game. Oh, and Purdue & Iowa too. People want to argue from the Viewpoint of a paradox. "The first nine games of the Season were a cupcake schedule against nobody teams. Michigan had a weak schedule." So, Connor stallions didn't really matter and wouldn't have really helped them, because the games weren't really games after all. But, apparently counter stallions was the magic trick that gave Michigan the ability to defeat all those cupcake opponents. So, now they are arguing simultaneously that the games didn't really count towards making Michigan a great team but that they really did matter towards making Michigan a great team. In the end the team with the better coaches & the better players & the better game plans won.
Come on Dan, you and everyone else knows there are waaaaaaayyyyyy more egregious things going on in college football than some low level employee stealing signs. Anyone who knows football has dismissed this by now, even Fienbaum has fallen on his sword. When other teams are clearly tampering when kids are leaving "X" program to join theirs driving in a brand new Bentley or Mercedes, but you want to hammer Michigan for something that is pretty clear now after facing 5 tough foes in the last part of the season and handling them just fine.........come on man. Stop making a mountain out of a mole hill just because you seem to have a personal vendetta against Michigan.....there are much bigger "affenders" in CFB than Michigan's low level employee stealing signs. But please, continue to spend time on "Burgergate" and "Signgate". Go ahead and ask the Patriots how they liked their banners taken down due to "Deflategate", oh wait, no one took those down.....because it wasn't a factor, just like this "signgate" is only a big deal because of jokers like you and other Michigan haters.
Let The Haters Hate. Ohio state amongst other Teams had their fair share of Scandals etc. Its Just like the way the Government works is, If they choose to wield their power and crush you because they don’t like you they will or they will turn a blind eye and drown out the screams of injustice. There is never a fair or even handed punishment for all.
If the scandal came out AFTER the season, then it should be vacated. However, it wasn't and Harbough was suspended multiple times. The fact they beat PSU and OSU without their head coach is nuts. Grats to Michigan. Go Tigers!
U of M has AI intelligence where they can read the minds of the other coaches. Yeah, seriously, they are cheating because they can read the signals as the opposing coaches think of them and call them into the players. 😂😂😂
In the days of the internet and social networks that tends to amplify everyone's opinions, there will always be doubters throwing their opinions on the National Championship title won by schools. Just go back to any year's Natty and you will find contrarians commenting the said Natty was illegitimate or won unfairly. So, Michigan's Natty is no exception and there will always be noise to any Natty. Go back and read the comments to prior Nattys and you will always find it. For example, Georgia's back to back Nattys are challenged by those who don't like Georgia. Welcome to the club, Michigan. You will always hear there will be an "*" next to your Natty - so just don't let it bother you. That will never go away.
He quit fighting it in court so the big ten and NCAA would leave AA. Media runs with rumors and lies but ignore facts. Big ten/ Ncaa told JH theyd leave AA and quit interviewing players if JH agreed to suspension. JH was sick of players missing practice and classes FACTS. They left immediately after he agreed
Also because they were asking judges to make an extremely unusual ruling on their holidays. It's typically a big no no to be doing such a thing, especially over something like sports.
Any person that would whine about Michigan cheating by stealing signs is a total idiot. If they feel that their team got cheated by that situation then they should be blaming their own coach for allowing that to happen. If they were on the ball they would realize their signs have been stolen & turn the situation around on the team that stole them by giving false signs & then take advantage of Michigan !!!
Champions win everything. Winners admire champions and aspire to become champions. Losers whine about cheating and refs. There has never been a person or team who whined and excused their way to a national championship. What is the hypothesis here? That Michigan would have lost to low level teams without their sign photos but beat Alabama and Ohio State and Washington by luck? Which sideline photo is responsible for Donovan Edwards’ 45 yard TD run? And the second one? It’s silly. Go up to some Alabama fan and tell them that all their success was because they ran into the kicker in week 3 and got away with it. Hey man, that’s breaking the rules and your wins don’t count!
They can take away whatever they want. Put an asterisk, who cares. Losers and haters that's who. All Michigan fans know and watched the games. I for one know what transpired on the field. I saw it all unfold. That can and will never be taken away. Michigan against Everybody til death do us part. Suck It!!!
During the whole sign stealing episode, a former Big Ten coach came out with documentation showing other Big Ten teams were involved in sign stealing, including Ohio State. What ever happened to that story? And why were they going only after Harbaugh in all of this?
Dan, please stop talking about the 2020 pandemic season like it was a normal season. Michigan went 2- 4 without a full team. Just like this year's Orange Bowl. Also, the NCAA said "vindicated" end of story. Let's talk about FSU buying players. This story broke two days ago and you are still talking about Michigan.
It is very disappointing that Dan Patrick is still talking about BS. Dan, as an ex-coach I can tell you that EVERYBODY tries to steal sign AT EVERY LEVEL OF FOOTBALL and it is USELESS. It may give you a bit less than 1 % of an advantage. Stalions was there for the Georgia and TCU games. How influential was his 'genius' then? Get off your stupid high-horse.
Dan grew up an Ohio State and Notre Dame fan. Therefore he has hated Michigan his whole life. He is very biased. DP still thinks Tom Brady, Michigan Man, deflated balls. That has been totally disproven. Haters gonna hate!
It's just funny how ko one else gets this bad talk. But if the NCAA looked into any other team they'd find something. It was clear that no one wanted Michigan to be as successful as they were.
We should appreciate teams that win the right way above all. That’s why some championships are more respected than others. The championship this year will be forgotten about because it’s that tarnished. A forgotten season really.
It won't be forgotten. The NFL didn't forget as they drafted more Michigan players from that championship team than any other college. Popular culture wont' forget since Michigan's running back is on the cover of EA colllege football '25. You won't forget because you are on this message board. And history won't forget since it will be on the books FOREVER. Pucker up buttercup.
The main issue is people are incorrectly combining two things: Connor Stallions and Michigan winning the 2023 season championship. They really need to be split. Consider: 1) If rules were broken, Michigan should pay penalty. It's no different than if a team holds too many weightlifting sessions, has illegal recruiting discussions, hold practices beyond the NCAA time limit. For example, this year Ohio State, Arizona State, etc. reported recruiting violations. They pay a penalty (they can't do as many recruiting visits, etc.). So if it is found Connor Stallions broke rules, they should pay a penalty. 2) SEPARATELY is Michigan the best team in the nation? Yes, hands down. We don't even know if what Connor Stallions did was consequential, but even so teams changed signs, etc. - and let's face it, signs don't in themselves win a game. ANYWAY Michigan beat Ohio State, Penn State, Big Ten championship (SHUTOUT), Alabama, and Washington. CONSIDER THIS: Coaches poll (including Ryan Day, James Franklin, Nick Saban): All of them voted Michigan the champion at the end of the season AP Writer's Poll: They all voted Michigan the champion CFP (made up of former college football AD's and players): They all voted Michigan the championship. So, anyone who knows anything about football knows Michigan is the champion hands down. Really, the only people who keep saying MIchigan is not a champion are Michigan State or Ohio State fans. There is a Q-anon feel to this- they all say "WAIT, THE DAY IS COMING, THE NCAA WILL TAKE THE CHAMPIONSHIP AWAY!" It's like a cult. I got news for you. It's not happening. So in conclusion- if they broke rules they should pay a penalty. However, it has nothing to with them winning the championship. And all the experts in college football, including all the opposing coaches, agree.
By the way, this talk about "asterisk" is insanity. It's a punctuation mark. I frankly don't care if people want to put an asterisk, parentheses, ampersand or any other punctuation mark. They can add a million. Doesn't change the outcome in (2) above.
The NCAA president has Ohio, MSU, Penn State, and so many other haters freaking out and it’s glorious!!! The pain they must feel has to be monumental 😂😂😂😂
Michigan didn't cheat, sign stealing is not illegal. Michigan is accused of breaking a rule by the NCAA pertaining to in-person scouting. But the rule was put in place as a financial matter not an performance advantage. So I believe no wins will be vacated, but there will be fines, scholarships taken and possible game suspension.
It's fine they Won everyone knows they cheated and cheated in recruiting. How does a coach get suspended two times but the University that employs him did nothing BS
were there ineligible players on any of the last 3 Michigan teams? If not then the NCAA won't vacate wins. Michigan won't escape punishment, but the national championship and their last 3 seasons are still going to stand.
Michigan's players won a national championship out on the field, their coaches and their institution undermined that by spending three years engaged in illegal activity. That Michigan fans, like Rich, are having a hard time wrapping their minds around both facts simultaneously, maybe it shouldn't be surprising, but it's surprising. The NCAA is coming.
Hahaha, put an asterisk by our win over OSU, we don’t care! We beat Ryan Day without sign stealing or deflated balls or blown referee calls. It counts. Ask OSU fans.
I hate how people don't understand how this is a big deal and that they should be seriously punished. It was not one year, it was 2 and a half years. It was a policy of cheating. Harbaugh hovered between 7 and 10 wins until they started cheating. 2021:11 wins, 2022:12, 2023:14. And if you really wanted to know what that 2021 team actually looked like, look at the time they played Nebraska. Nebraska ran a hurry up offense unlike most other Big 10 teams, so sign stealing had less of an advantage. That game was won by a field goal, when they were crushing better teams. Yeah, they probably would have won most of those games anyway, but if you can put a game away earlier, you can rest your starters and give your 2nd and 3rd string meaningful playing time. Which keeps your starters healthier and helps develop your younger players. The improved record and a promise that you will get playing time gets them better recuits and transfers. This is why that record improved year after year. This team is legit, and they won the second half of their season legitimately, but that team does not exist with the roster and health without cheating. It's equivalent to USC blatantly buying players. Their championship team's roster don't exist without it. If Michigan walks away from this with a slap on the wrist, it's because Harbaugh knows something.
@bk6555 no sleep lost here my friend. I am not a student athlete that dedicated my life and health to a sport and then have someone cheapen my sacrifice. michigan are national champions and so is usc. Nobody can take that away.
I guess all the connor stallions stuff also resulted in MIchigan having the most players (13) drafted by the NFL this year. JUST FACE IT DUDE MICHIGAN HAD BETTER PLAYERS THAN ANYONE And that doesn't count projected 2025 FIRST round draft picks Graham, Grant, Loveland, Will Johnson. MICHIGAN WAS PLAYING WITH 17 NFL PLAYERS ON THE FIELD. That's why they won. People want to obsess about some guys friends videotaping stuff (which frankly happens all over the place). We won because the players were at a level unparalled by others.
@garyashburn okay "gary" with your one yr old account... nfl draft stock is built on players stats and if the stats are built, atleast partially, from cheating means they are pushed up in value. I have no doubt they are still talented athletes but only time will tell their actual value. Let's talk in 5 yrs.
All coaches (including Ryan Day, Nick Saban, James Franklin) voted Michigan champions in the end of season coaches poll. All AP writers in the writers poll voted Michigan champions at the end of the season. The CFP (former players and AD's) voted Michigan champions at the end of the season. They are champions and we feel GREAT about it. I agree to clean up the game. Let's get all emails and all cel phones (like the NCAA did for all Michigan coaches) from all programs and see what we find. As I mentioned above, if rules were broken by connor or anyone else, pay a penalty, just like a recruiting violation or practicing too much. That is normal business for college football teams. But there's no evidence that they're not the best team in football.
Paul Finebaum, Michigan hater extraordinaire even came out and said no asterisk, Michigan was the best team this year period. Didn't need to cheat to slap Penn State, Ohio State, Iowa, Alabama, or Washington. And it's 3 str8 against Ohio.
This is a moot point. The NCAA has come out and said that Michigan won the NC “fair and square”. Before October 20, Michigan played mediocre teams that it destroyed and could not have beaten Michigan, with our without signs. After October 20, all the teams were alerted and changed their sighs, and Michigan beat them anyway. All those complaints are sour grapes.
Sign stealing isn't even against the rules. The alleged violation just had to do with the way they got the signs, not that they had them. (You can steal signs from watching on TV, but can't attend the game in person.) The rule has to do with costs, not competitive balance.
@@edmerc92In addition, the NCAA coaches routinely reject helmet electronics, like the NFL has. They WANT to steal signs. It's all a joke.
Not to mention most college teams change their signs weekly so the only time advanced scouting might give you a slight advantage is if you’re scouting them the week before you play. If you’re doing it weeks ahead of time it’s basically a waste of energy.
Offenses do NOT change signals weekly. Go listen to the several real coaches whove come out and discribed the nightmare that it is and why they dont changes@jackpackage4278
I am a diehard Badger fan. Michigan won the national championship, on the field period. Congratulations to Jim Harbough and the Wolverines.
Thanks Badger! Coolest mascot in 🏈
And when I was at Michigan and Wisconsin fans came to Ann Arbor, they were the most fun fans EVER! Loved having them on campus.
Wiscy plays the same style of football as the wolverines dude the backs Wisconsin has produced ron Dayne, Montee Ball, just to name a few. Go blue
Michigan is trying to be vintage Wisconsin squads with even more talent
What great timing. Just this morning the NCAA president said Michigans win have been found as “Fair and Square” and an asterisk on the national championship would not be necessary. I’m glad to see Michigan is being vindicated nationally as true non cheating national champs. They deserve it.
Let's see people like Dan Patrick, who've called Michigan cheaters, to publicly acknowledge that Michigan didn't cheat.
He’s actually just validating why they presented evidence early. He’s saying that the wins afterwards are legitimate. Which I agree to. But he’s not absolving Michigan of guilt. They’re still going to finish their investigation and punish them for the illegal activity. There are those who will still say the cheating occurred this season and Michigan shouldn’t have been in the playoffs.
Noones absolving Michigan of cheating. They’re saying they prevented them from cheating the final six games.
@@joshuasaltzman1992 a non apology apology
@@jimj2839I mean good news for Michigan guys. In my opinion. Sounds like he’s justifying punishing Michigan without touching national championship
You remember when Ryan Day was suspended for sharing Michigan signals with Iowa and Purdue? Nah?
Me either.
Buckeye tears taste even better as a national fkn champions. 🤣🤣
************************************************************************************************************************
Indeed they do! And he had connections to the people that accused Michigan of sign stealing in the first place. Ohio State is trying to cheat Michigan, all the while accusing them of being the cheaters.
@@j.kellybrown8600OSU and Catapult. Look it up.
The NCAA has come out officially and publicly via a letter to Michigan President Santo Ono that Michigan’s win is legitimate, as was the season.
Go Blue.
Yes and they used the term “fair and square”
Did you read the whole letter? They said that there was clear evidence of cheating at the start of the season and they felt like they couldn't sit on what they learned so they told B10 and UM. Things were changed after that and that made it fair. So yes, they won the game fair but they should have never been allowed to play due to the evidence that was given to them.
@@corylove1321 actually it just shows you how screwed up the NCAA really is at the core of the situation. They say there’s evidence, but then they said there wasn’t any evidence. Then they said that they were going to suspend our coach for so many games to “protect the safety of his players”, which makes no sense. Then they said that they did not see that there was any reason to come forward and say that they didn’t have evidence as they were told they would be given evidence??? Then they weren’t then they said they had something.. then they said they didn’t. I think this pretty much says all we need to hear doesn’t it? If this was something that you or I did say we were being investigated for murder, that’s not having charges brought against you. That’s not being found guilty, and they are heh back-and-forth so much. I think that they are embarrassed. They were told they had this perfect case against us, and now they realize that we’ve done no more than what every other team is allowed to do and they have egg on their face. So they can pound sand.
NCAA is screwed up and in my opinion they are ruining college sports. But that is a topic for a different time.
I read the letter multiple times and it pretty much said that the investigation is still ongoing and they are trying to speed it up but Michigan won the game fairly. I agree that they won fairly and Blake is an amazing RB and that was defense is legit. They shared the information with the schools because they wanted a fair season.
That being said, they have evidence from the 3rd party that goes supports the theory that UM had an advantage. It will probably be 1 - 3 years before we have all the information on this scandal.
I don't mind UM at all. I just want a fair season and myself along with many other fans think that letting a team that cheated at the start of the season in the championship is wrong. @@elishavarivka8923
@@corylove1321 based on what? Bowling Green game?? Hate away.
In all these comments and interviews, I rarely see anyone blaming college football for either of Michigan’s “horrendous” violations that Harbaugh did end up serving a six game suspension for. #1, he bought a potential recruit a hamburger and drink during a recruiting visit then didn’t fully cooperate with the witch hunt over it. Other teams have recruits showing up in thousand dollar wardrobes, thousands of dollars in jewelry and expensive sports cars but we don’t investigate that. #2, the NCAA could easily approve of and provide a couple of helmet speakers and comm systems to each team so the varied ways of signaling plays to the players in the field become null and void, hence no signs to steal. But they won’t do it. They want to keep drama in the game because it gives a level of involvement to non fans who talk about the controversies and amps up the involvement of the fans.
Bottom line is, sign stealing is legal. Right after it hit the fan for Michigan and Stallions, a tv broadcast joked that they were involved in a sign stealing scandal when they showed a team signaling in signs to the players on their national broadcast. Like no team could record a basic tv broadcast, review the tapes and say “they used these signals and ran this play”. It’s completely stupid.
breaking, google it "NCAA president says Michigan earned football national title 'fair and square'" say it with me say it.
Michigan is #1. Period.
Who is here after the NCAA prez said Michigan won it “fair and square?”
Really Dan they beat every team put in front of them after the nonsense came out so take the asterisk and shove it where the sun don’t shine
Anyone calling for an asterisk, knows nothing about football. Stfu and move on.
They know they just do not care if it's an opportunity to stain michigan fair or not they push that agenda. I will add Michigan is not innocent but just not a big enough violation when you look at the big picture. I guess Ohio state should have waited a few more games to hand over hard drives lol
I think people need to remember one very important thing. Sign stealing is not illegal...PERIOD
Well if IF Michigan actually "cheated" then the news got out every team in the playoffs would've change their sings... and even without Harbaugh there Michigan still won it all...
So fr people hating on this title are just dumb to do so anyway 🤷🏻♂️
(Not a Michigan fan btw)
The thing is it has NEVER been illegal to steal signs, figure out signals, or anything like that. What was illegal was sending someone to "advance scout", which is a rule meant to keep Division 3 tennis squads and such from using money to gain an advantage over opponents... A minor rule violation in my opinion. I never understood the big to-do.
Bill Burr makes the point better, of course: You can literally hire the coordinator or coach who came up with the signs and schemes from his old team to yours, the guy who knows it inside and out, right in the middle of the season, and that's not against the rules. Because knowing the opponent's stuff is not a bad thing.
I'm a diehard Buckeye fan but also a bit objective, the games that Mattered this season I do feel they won fair n square and the players Earned the Natty regardless of what happens!!!!
God bless you man.
Go BLUE !!!
$EC SUCKS !!!
THIS IS JUST BS SENT BY LESSER COACHES WHO WERE TIRED OF GETTING THEIR BUTTS KICKED BY MICHIGAN!!! THIS IS A STUPID WITCH HUNT TO TARNISH OUR NAME BUT GUESS WHAT WE ARE NATIONAL CHAMPS PERIOD〽️〽️〽️🏈🏈🏈〽️〽️〽️🏆🏆🏆🏆 TEAM 144 ARE LEGENDS PERIOD AND MICHIGAN WILL ALWAYS BE LEGENDARY!!! GO BLUE FOREVA 〽️〽️〽️🏈🏈🏈🏆🏆🏆🏆
Great take down Rich! 🎉
Well said Rich. Go Blue!
THE Michigan Wolverines have not only PRODUCED THE GREATEST QUARTERBACK OF ALL TIME TOM BRADY 💪 but also THE Michigan Wolverines have THE best fight song AND helmet logo in the country hands down 🫳🎤
Ask Washington, Alabama, Iowa in Ohio State and Penn State if the title is tainted. There's your answer. Look at those bodies that got beat up while Michigan was being accused.
When the story broke about sign stealing was mid season….all the teams changed their signs and Michigan still won moving forward so….yea
And it was never even proven they'd been sign stealing; it was just rumors and hearsay, and the people that leaked the claim had ties to Ryan Day. Says everything you need to know in my opinion.
@@hotwax9376 I agree but let’s say it happened. My comment puts all the BS to bed.
@@MultiPizzapizza That it does.
Signs should be changed often anyways. How are coaches and assistants being paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to just make stalwart and old signals? Even if you think the other team cannot figure out your signal, you should STILL change them because FILM exists for other teams to study and match up.
Guess we will have to question all of the recent championships. You don't think there were improprieties with other teams like Georgia, Bama, Clemson and ohio???? Your kidding yourself...
After Stallions left, Michigan beat Penn State in Happy Valley, Maryland at Maryland, #2 Ohio State, Alabama & Nick Saban, & Washington in the National Championship game. Oh, and Purdue & Iowa too. People want to argue from the Viewpoint of a paradox. "The first nine games of the Season were a cupcake schedule against nobody teams. Michigan had a weak schedule." So, Connor stallions didn't really matter and wouldn't have really helped them, because the games weren't really games after all. But, apparently counter stallions was the magic trick that gave Michigan the ability to defeat all those cupcake opponents. So, now they are arguing simultaneously that the games didn't really count towards making Michigan a great team but that they really did matter towards making Michigan a great team. In the end the team with the better coaches & the better players & the better game plans won.
Lol not until Astros have an asterisk. This is a joke. Michigan won despite that bs
Or the Lakers team that faced the Sacramento Kings and lost to the refs handing it to LA?
@@MoctezumasRevenge1 maybe ya. Idk about that one lol
@@amonrodriguez3518 The ref confessed and the league said he went rogue
Tim Donaghy 2002 WCF if you wish to read more about it
@@MoctezumasRevenge1 oh nvm ya I remember that guy. Ya you’re right
The first suspension was over hamburgers. That one wasn’t serious
Come on Dan, you and everyone else knows there are waaaaaaayyyyyy more egregious things going on in college football than some low level employee stealing signs. Anyone who knows football has dismissed this by now, even Fienbaum has fallen on his sword. When other teams are clearly tampering when kids are leaving "X" program to join theirs driving in a brand new Bentley or Mercedes, but you want to hammer Michigan for something that is pretty clear now after facing 5 tough foes in the last part of the season and handling them just fine.........come on man. Stop making a mountain out of a mole hill just because you seem to have a personal vendetta against Michigan.....there are much bigger "affenders" in CFB than Michigan's low level employee stealing signs. But please, continue to spend time on "Burgergate" and "Signgate". Go ahead and ask the Patriots how they liked their banners taken down due to "Deflategate", oh wait, no one took those down.....because it wasn't a factor, just like this "signgate" is only a big deal because of jokers like you and other Michigan haters.
NCAA said they won it fairly
F the baggage 💩, NCAA just stated Michigan win it fair and square !
Let The Haters Hate. Ohio state amongst other Teams had their fair share of Scandals etc. Its Just like the way the Government works is, If they choose to wield their power and crush you because they don’t like you they will or they will turn a blind eye and drown out the screams of injustice. There is never a fair or even handed punishment for all.
Brigs back memories watching these two at sports center.
National Champions. Michigan Wolverines. Go Blue. I hope Harbaugh stays at Michigan. He is a true Michigan man
Well said Rich - Go Blue
Go Blue! Enough said.
If the scandal came out AFTER the season, then it should be vacated. However, it wasn't and Harbough was suspended multiple times. The fact they beat PSU and OSU without their head coach is nuts. Grats to Michigan. Go Tigers!
U of M has AI intelligence where they can read the minds of the other coaches. Yeah, seriously, they are cheating because they can read the signals as the opposing coaches think of them and call them into the players. 😂😂😂
In the days of the internet and social networks that tends to amplify everyone's opinions, there will always be doubters throwing their opinions on the National Championship title won by schools. Just go back to any year's Natty and you will find contrarians commenting the said Natty was illegitimate or won unfairly. So, Michigan's Natty is no exception and there will always be noise to any Natty. Go back and read the comments to prior Nattys and you will always find it. For example, Georgia's back to back Nattys are challenged by those who don't like Georgia. Welcome to the club, Michigan. You will always hear there will be an "*" next to your Natty - so just don't let it bother you. That will never go away.
Get him rich
He quit fighting it in court so the big ten and NCAA would leave AA. Media runs with rumors and lies but ignore facts. Big ten/ Ncaa told JH theyd leave AA and quit interviewing players if JH agreed to suspension. JH was sick of players missing practice and classes FACTS. They left immediately after he agreed
Also because they were asking judges to make an extremely unusual ruling on their holidays. It's typically a big no no to be doing such a thing, especially over something like sports.
The best part about all this is OSU and Bama fans really believe their school is the moral compass of the NCAA
Rich got the paddle out and spanked them DP and them haters 😅
NCAA head said it was earned fair and square. Game Over! Go Blue!
Any person that would whine about Michigan cheating by stealing signs is a total idiot. If they feel that their team got cheated by that situation then they should be blaming their own coach for allowing that to happen. If they were on the ball they would realize their signs have been stolen & turn the situation around on the team that stole them by giving false signs & then take advantage of Michigan !!!
Champions win everything. Winners admire champions and aspire to become champions. Losers whine about cheating and refs. There has never been a person or team who whined and excused their way to a national championship. What is the hypothesis here? That Michigan would have lost to low level teams without their sign photos but beat Alabama and Ohio State and Washington by luck? Which sideline photo is responsible for Donovan Edwards’ 45 yard TD run? And the second one? It’s silly. Go up to some Alabama fan and tell them that all their success was because they ran into the kicker in week 3 and got away with it. Hey man, that’s breaking the rules and your wins don’t count!
Rich will have to invite DP to discuss Catapult soon 😂
Rich, Michigan won this natty period. You and Big Blue should be proud.
You are both the greatest! So insightful! Go Blue!
They can take away whatever they want. Put an asterisk, who cares. Losers and haters that's who. All Michigan fans know and watched the games. I for one know what transpired on the field. I saw it all unfold. That can and will never be taken away. Michigan against Everybody til death do us part. Suck It!!!
During the whole sign stealing episode, a former Big Ten coach came out with documentation showing other Big Ten teams were involved in sign stealing, including Ohio State. What ever happened to that story? And why were they going only after Harbaugh in all of this?
#GoBlue 😎〽️
Real Michigan fans will not entertain or address this bs GO BLUE!!!! 2024 National Champs
Great job Rich! Dan, I have been a fan and listener for years, no asterisk and you know that. Cryin Ryan better buy you a beer for keeping this going
Dan, please stop talking about the 2020 pandemic season like it was a normal season. Michigan went 2- 4 without a full team. Just like this year's Orange Bowl. Also, the NCAA said "vindicated" end of story. Let's talk about FSU buying players. This story broke two days ago and you are still talking about Michigan.
Dan Patrick is still alive?
GO BLUE 〽️🏆
😂😂😂 salute to Patrick Roy. That’s a great line.
Suck it! behind the glass 😂
It is very disappointing that Dan Patrick is still talking about BS. Dan, as an ex-coach I can tell you that EVERYBODY tries to steal sign AT EVERY LEVEL OF FOOTBALL and it is USELESS. It may give you a bit less than 1 % of an advantage. Stalions was there for the Georgia and TCU games. How influential was his 'genius' then? Get off your stupid high-horse.
Dan grew up an Ohio State and Notre Dame fan. Therefore he has hated Michigan his whole life. He is very biased. DP still thinks Tom Brady, Michigan Man, deflated balls. That has been totally disproven. Haters gonna hate!
NCAA just decided to sweep it under the rug.
As a Michigan fan, I can honestly say that I wouldn’t care at all if this was Ohio State instead. I’m not vindictive, spiteful, or petty like that
Rich doesn't know! He doesn't "have a crystal ball" because it "is what it is" and he can only "talk about the game that was played"! Lol
BS.... DAN...BS....GO BLUE !!
Great Job by Michigan. Nobody who seriously follows the sport discounts the title, even us Buckeye fans. See you next year
"Those people", oh, you mean ohio state fans?
HAHAHA!!! Losers be Haters.
It's just funny how ko one else gets this bad talk. But if the NCAA looked into any other team they'd find something. It was clear that no one wanted Michigan to be as successful as they were.
We should appreciate teams that win the right way above all. That’s why some championships are more respected than others. The championship this year will be forgotten about because it’s that tarnished. A forgotten season really.
Whatever to help you sleep at night, LMAO
It won't be forgotten. The NFL didn't forget as they drafted more Michigan players from that championship team than any other college. Popular culture wont' forget since Michigan's running back is on the cover of EA colllege football '25. You won't forget because you are on this message board. And history won't forget since it will be on the books FOREVER. Pucker up buttercup.
Only asterisk is James Franklin and Ryan Day lost to our OC 😂
and at the end of the season both bent over and voted Michigan champion (it's in the coaches poll and their votes are public information)
The main issue is people are incorrectly combining two things: Connor Stallions and Michigan winning the 2023 season championship. They really need to be split. Consider:
1) If rules were broken, Michigan should pay penalty. It's no different than if a team holds too many weightlifting sessions, has illegal recruiting discussions, hold practices beyond the NCAA time limit. For example, this year Ohio State, Arizona State, etc. reported recruiting violations. They pay a penalty (they can't do as many recruiting visits, etc.). So if it is found Connor Stallions broke rules, they should pay a penalty.
2) SEPARATELY is Michigan the best team in the nation? Yes, hands down. We don't even know if what Connor Stallions did was consequential, but even so teams changed signs, etc. - and let's face it, signs don't in themselves win a game. ANYWAY Michigan beat Ohio State, Penn State, Big Ten championship (SHUTOUT), Alabama, and Washington. CONSIDER THIS: Coaches poll (including Ryan Day, James Franklin, Nick Saban): All of them voted Michigan the champion at the end of the season AP Writer's Poll: They all voted Michigan the champion CFP (made up of former college football AD's and players): They all voted Michigan the championship. So, anyone who knows anything about football knows Michigan is the champion hands down.
Really, the only people who keep saying MIchigan is not a champion are Michigan State or Ohio State fans. There is a Q-anon feel to this- they all say "WAIT, THE DAY IS COMING, THE NCAA WILL TAKE THE CHAMPIONSHIP AWAY!" It's like a cult. I got news for you. It's not happening.
So in conclusion- if they broke rules they should pay a penalty. However, it has nothing to with them winning the championship. And all the experts in college football, including all the opposing coaches, agree.
By the way, this talk about "asterisk" is insanity. It's a punctuation mark. I frankly don't care if people want to put an asterisk, parentheses, ampersand or any other punctuation mark. They can add a million. Doesn't change the outcome in (2) above.
WE ARE THE CHAMPIONS, NO TIME FOR BOOHOOS COUSE WE ARE THE CHAMPIONS “ GO BLUE〽️
The NCAA president has Ohio, MSU, Penn State, and so many other haters freaking out and it’s glorious!!! The pain they must feel has to be monumental 😂😂😂😂
it has an asterisk because these were not playoffs and Georgia would have easily beaten all 4 by double digits.
Then why didn't Georgia beat Alabama?
@@zachschimmel6511 it was one game, georgia beats bama 99 out of 100 times.
Your mom has an asterisk
If you cry cheeters they have not seen this team play all season. They earned it. 💛💙〽️👍😎💪
Michigan didn't cheat, sign stealing is not illegal. Michigan is accused of breaking a rule by the NCAA pertaining to in-person scouting. But the rule was put in place as a financial matter not an performance advantage. So I believe no wins will be vacated, but there will be fines, scholarships taken and possible game suspension.
I mean, at least michigan played the games against teams in other conferences so we knew they earned it, unlike an All-SEC title game.
The NCAA prez already came out and made the comment, they won every game fair and square
2nd title in 75 seasons…what a “legacy”.
Michigan talks like Alabama but produces like Auburn.
Still Champions though so stick it.
If it’s not the NCAA title I.e. their names no where on it, how can they vacate it???
It's fine they Won everyone knows they cheated and cheated in recruiting. How does a coach get suspended two times but the University that employs him did nothing BS
I will say it again. In ‘97 that Michigan team matched up to Nebraska so well. M would have easily beaten them. Even with their backup QB!
Look, the sign stealing biz is key-rap. Blue was just the better team all year. Straight up Buckeye lifer here.
were there ineligible players on any of the last 3 Michigan teams? If not then the NCAA won't vacate wins. Michigan won't escape punishment, but the national championship and their last 3 seasons are still going to stand.
Everyone is trying to steal signs, thats why you see big banners and flags next to the coaches,DA!
One and done....go Dawgs
It is an invitational outside the NCAA's jurisdiction, no, or is this just a subjective suggestion to take away their national championship?
Michigan's players won a national championship out on the field, their coaches and their institution undermined that by spending three years engaged in illegal activity. That Michigan fans, like Rich, are having a hard time wrapping their minds around both facts simultaneously, maybe it shouldn't be surprising, but it's surprising. The NCAA is coming.
The head of The NCAA said they won it end of story.
🏆
His brother about to win a superbowl again in Baltimore
Hahaha, put an asterisk by our win over OSU, we don’t care! We beat Ryan Day without sign stealing or deflated balls or blown referee calls. It counts. Ask OSU fans.
I hate how people don't understand how this is a big deal and that they should be seriously punished. It was not one year, it was 2 and a half years. It was a policy of cheating. Harbaugh hovered between 7 and 10 wins until they started cheating. 2021:11 wins, 2022:12, 2023:14. And if you really wanted to know what that 2021 team actually looked like, look at the time they played Nebraska. Nebraska ran a hurry up offense unlike most other Big 10 teams, so sign stealing had less of an advantage. That game was won by a field goal, when they were crushing better teams.
Yeah, they probably would have won most of those games anyway, but if you can put a game away earlier, you can rest your starters and give your 2nd and 3rd string meaningful playing time. Which keeps your starters healthier and helps develop your younger players. The improved record and a promise that you will get playing time gets them better recuits and transfers. This is why that record improved year after year. This team is legit, and they won the second half of their season legitimately, but that team does not exist with the roster and health without cheating. It's equivalent to USC blatantly buying players. Their championship team's roster don't exist without it.
If Michigan walks away from this with a slap on the wrist, it's because Harbaugh knows something.
Whatever keeps you up at night! MICHIGAN WOLVERINES ARE THE NATIONAL CHAMPIONS!!!
@bk6555 no sleep lost here my friend. I am not a student athlete that dedicated my life and health to a sport and then have someone cheapen my sacrifice.
michigan are national champions and so is usc. Nobody can take that away.
I guess all the connor stallions stuff also resulted in MIchigan having the most players (13) drafted by the NFL this year. JUST FACE IT DUDE MICHIGAN HAD BETTER PLAYERS THAN ANYONE And that doesn't count projected 2025 FIRST round draft picks Graham, Grant, Loveland, Will Johnson. MICHIGAN WAS PLAYING WITH 17 NFL PLAYERS ON THE FIELD. That's why they won. People want to obsess about some guys friends videotaping stuff (which frankly happens all over the place). We won because the players were at a level unparalled by others.
@garyashburn okay "gary" with your one yr old account... nfl draft stock is built on players stats and if the stats are built, atleast partially, from cheating means they are pushed up in value. I have no doubt they are still talented athletes but only time will tell their actual value. Let's talk in 5 yrs.
Haters? They can kiss my asterisk
When did Dan Patrick become get off my lawn guy?
Go Blue
Haters ? The NCAA should take the championship away . They cheated for three years . How can they feel good about this season ?
All coaches (including Ryan Day, Nick Saban, James Franklin) voted Michigan champions in the end of season coaches poll.
All AP writers in the writers poll voted Michigan champions at the end of the season.
The CFP (former players and AD's) voted Michigan champions at the end of the season.
They are champions and we feel GREAT about it.
I agree to clean up the game. Let's get all emails and all cel phones (like the NCAA did for all Michigan coaches) from all programs and see what we find.
As I mentioned above, if rules were broken by connor or anyone else, pay a penalty, just like a recruiting violation or practicing too much. That is normal business for college football teams.
But there's no evidence that they're not the best team in football.
Guilty 💯
Vacant 3 years and the National Title
Wow, Dan is looking old and acting more like a geezer for only being 66.
If you think its tainted your so delusional. I played CFB at Miami(OH) and that is a joke.
You cheat! If you cheat, you stained the game.