I’m starting to grow weary of progressive church and having to listen to a pastor talk about “social justice” or say things like “lord, savior, and redeemer” instead of the normal trinity.
@@ReadyToHarvest ...indeed ...you doeth all things well...but this episode, was in particular detailed and well done...hearing you quote liberal church"persons", making their most convincing arguments and apologia in their own words...is a rare theological treat...thanks
@@ninjason57Judge not, lest ye be judged. Never a bad thing to be humble about our own judgmental natures, we know so little in comparison to the judge that matters.
Seiten is fake chicken for vegans. Satan is fake inspiration for faking Christianity Maaaybe they should cease the cultural appropriation of Christian trappings and start a flying saucer cult ...
Actually started cackling when the whole video these ministers are dismissing biblical commandments left and right and then when it comes to tithing they are like "GOD WAS VERRRRRRY SERIOUS ABOUT THE PART WHERE YOU GIVE US 10% OF YOUR INCOME THO No exceptions ☝️😡!"
they like the money part of the bible. Unfortunately they skip the verses where it talks about that tithing was a covenant between God and the Israelites.
The united church is about the least 'money centric' religion there is. Certainly they don't rake in the money like these evangelical preachers who often live in mansions.
@@mikearchibald744 With all due respect, the UCC is about the least God-centric religion there is. I still have to laugh at what was pointed out to me decades ago: UCC = Unitarians Considering Christ.
@@Justanotherconsumer The Bible never says he turned them away. It does however say that after they left he told the woman to go and sin no more. (INTERESTING FACT: That portion of Scripture is absent from all of the oldest texts.)
@@tonyu5985they walked away because of what He told them. He did not celebrate prideful judgment of others as a sin, I guess you could say, and that offended people.
"But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ has not been raised; if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is in vain.... But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who have fallen asleep."
should've asked her who was right, her or God? Since the bible says that ALL have sinned. I used to think it was a Christian church, that was until the blinders fell off and saw it for what it was, an unbiblical "church".
Same here, I genuinely want to understand the beliefs of other supposed brothers and sisters but all this does is depress me. They took the good thing of being accepting and loving to all and somehow destroyed the whole meaning of Christianity in the process.
@@CaleMcGowan I heard many years ago (as a young believer) the best way to spot a fake is to known the genuine. I think often times in our quest to learn, it can lead our hearts to heaviness, and more grief. I’ve been shutting off a lot more of late, and just staying close to the Shepherd!
Reminds me of the Simpsons episode where the reverend is selling ice cream, Lisa comes up and says, “look at all these flavors! Blessed virgin berry.. command-mint” and the reverend says, “how about Unitarian ice cream” and hands Lisa a bowl. Lisa looks in and is surprised and says, “there’s nothing here!” And the reverend replies, “exactly”
@@therealstuffedzebra relying on the Holy Spirit for guidance rather than some central human authority. Not unique. “Hardshell” Baptists (aka Primitive Baptists) who actively reject the concept of a denomination to the point of not having clergy, not having seminaries, and so on are even more extreme, though they are by very intentional design not a formal denomination. The Religious Society of Friends (“Quakers”) are similar in some ways though they do have more structure even if it’s purely administrative rather than theological. Unprogrammed meetings for worship are a strange experience for those of us that spent time with the Book of Common Prayer.
@@joshuakarr-BibleMan because they choose not to be one. A denomination is not just a label applied to a group, it’s also an administrative structure that goes beyond the immediate local group. That’s not something that exists for many churches.
@@Justanotherconsumer I think one of their members is fighting with me on twitter right now. It's sort of an odd mode of conversation, just reasoning back at people instead of fighting them.
@@zelenisok So, the Early Church just made everything up, 2000 years of Christian teaching is wrong, and you're setting us right? Boy, that's prideful.
@@zelenisok A lot of people throughout history, from the Apostles, to modern times, people, tortured and killed. IF it was all a lie…… The truth is, that there was/ IS, something about [ true] Christianity that is different. There is a Power, and a PEACE, and Love, that goes FAR beyond any human understanding, [ including yours, sad, because you will never be truly at Peace with yourself. You will never be Content. You will always know there is something major missing from your life and heart.✝️🙏
@@zelenisokJesus told you to follow his apostles and the church he left to them... And they are the only reason you even have the scripture and know about Jesus. 😂😂
I can usually find something charitable to say about most denominations……but the UCC *really* makes that task excruciatingly hard. It’s the only time I’ve watched one of your videos and physically said “Lord, please forgive them”
They’re basically the anti-Catholicism in structure so that’s not surprising, though the Religious Society of Friends or “Hardshell” Baptists are arguably even more the antithesis of the strict hierarchy of Rome.
@@christopherflux6254I’m not so sure about good neighbors 😬 It would depend on how much they idolize their politics. (Which seems to be common with these sorts of liberal theology “Christians”.)
Say what you want, but I had a fine and normal experience growing up with a New England UCC church. I think Baptist theology has done more damage to our society, and Orthordoxy is the real Christianity anyway.
@@bencook6585 Being an epistemological evidentialist (meaning that I need valid evidence before I believe something is true) requires me to demand stronger evidence than "the Bible tells me so" that a man revivified, and then was taken up into the sky.
@RonJohn63 There is plenty of evidence. The gospel accounts themselves are evidence. The same evidence we have for anything in all ancient history, testimonial. We also have archeological evidence. No bones of Christ have ever been found (if they had we would know, Christians have always found and venerated saints' bones).
@@bencook6585 _The gospel accounts themselves are evidence._ Remember what I said about "because the Bible tells me so"? And as for "the same evidence we have for anything in all ancient history"... so what if Homer and Plato didn't exist? Their stories and philosophies exist, and that's what's important. OTOH, we're supposed to change our whole secular and eternal lives because Jesus is allegedly the creator of the universe. Put up the evidence or shut up.
No, UCC is American progressive zealotry, and WBC is just a straight misinterpretation of the way Christ calls us to deal with sin. Both are zealous and ‘innovate’ on God's word.
I was born and raised in a UCC church. Earlier this spring they voted to remove Evangelical from the name, because they associate it with conservatives. Last week our pastor gave a sermon about how being a good Christian means supporting abortion, and gay marriage. Yesterday I attended the Mass of Blessed Virgin Mary at a nearby Catholic Church and afterwards asked when can I sign up for RCIA classes. The church that I was raised in doesn’t believe in God anymore, they don’t really believe in anything. When I was a kid our weekly attendance was nearly a thousand. These days my small family makes up 3 of the 40 people or so who still attend. This video just hurts to watch.
As opposed to the ecclesiastic wing of political conservatism that the vast majority of Christians engage in? How dare like minded and spiritually aligned people gather!
Well rallying with roof launchers and larping around in their flags and ski masks clearly isnt thrilling enough, they have to cosplay in Noah's rainbow as well.
What communion though? People believing basically nothing of any substance, trying to appear vaguely nice by current media elite standards?@@BramptonAnglican
My family's tradition is UCC. My grandfather had been a pastor in the denomination, but they barely practiced by the time I was born. I became a believer as a young adult, and had a zeal to learn more about the faith. When I dug my grandfather's old seminary books out of the closet, I expected to find deep theology and thoughtful reflection on God. Instead, I found blatant heresy. Even as a new Christian, I knew the denomination was in apostasy. They completely reject the authority of the Bible and teach whatever the culture seems to like at the moment.
This probably won't surprise you, but my wife and I visited one of her aunts years ago. Her aunt got saved a couple of years back and said she had learned more of the Bible two years in an independent Baptist church than roughly 50 in the UCC.
@@WaterMelon-Cat It's a shame what happened to the UCC. The denomination developed out of a robust, devote Christian heritage. Now it's terrible. There may be a few people who believe the gospel in that denomination still, but most of the actual Christians have left. I know of one congregation that went independent when they saw what was happening. They did very well once they left the UCC and eventually joined the Evangelical Free Church.
I was struck by the many times they made stereotypical and two-dimensional characterizations of traditional and conservative Christians. Kinda strange that a denomination with a wide range of beliefs between moderate to liberal would be so accepting of such antagonist speech.
I go to a fairly conservative Methodist church and we never turn anybody away, regardless of what they may be struggling with in their life. Maybe there are some ultra fundamentalist churches that would refuse lgbtq people from even entering, but I think you would be hard-pressed to see that
@@scripturalcontexts I was raised in a Fundamentalist Southern Baptist Church, and we would let almost anyone in (that wasn’t a cause of danger or majorly disrupting service) That said, we wouldn’t let a proud LGBTQ person become a member of the congregation, just like we wouldn’t let a proud public adulterer become a member, but we would never turn them away from listening to a service. We did generally hold closed communion for the congregation so I guess we technically rejected them from communion by proxy if you want to nitpick.
Lots of controversies in the comments 😅 but I just want to say that as someone who wasn't raised Christian and has had a lot of difficulty understanding what people get out of the faith, the UCC is the only congregation where the pastors (and I've talked to a number!) have been willing to really sit with me, answer my questions, and help me understand the teachings of Jesus. Their acceptance and willingness to meet me where I am on my spiritual journey is one of the reasons I finally started reading the bible. I also really want to thank you for posting about and discussing Christian denominations in such a neutral, non-biased way. As someone who's still exploring Christianity, your videos have been immensely helpful in understanding the different ways people think about the Christian faith. I really appreciate all your hard work!
just know that these people really arent christian, its more so of a social club that talks about jesus then an actual church. as a stepping stone it works ig, but it treads a very fine line, and is borderline wrong with a lot of its theology. be careful, is all im saying.
It's good you are asking questions. I would ask those questions of the Holy Spirit and get into the bible for yourself. This church teaches blatent heresy and it would be more detriment to your spiritual walk with Jesus Christ to remain in that church. Especially if they affirm what is being described here. Follow Jesus, lean on the Holy Spirit and you will find the answers that you seek. God is more interested in your journey to him than you are and that is a very good thing!
For a split second, I thought this is about the United Church of Christ in Japan, the uniting church in Japan that was forcefully merged during Japan's war against the whole world and had to make a public statement about its support for fascism. Now it's the fastest shrinking church organization in Japan.
28:10 I started to laugh at this point. After almost 30 minutes of rather liberal theology, suddenly things went very biblical with tithing at 10% or at least aiming for it. I guess that when it comes to money, the liberal leaders do not want to pass up on the green backs.
@@stephanottawa7890 much like the Catholic and Lutheran Churches in Germany, extremely lax about nearly everything but if you try to get out of paying your yearly “church tax” ( in Germany the government takes a part of your taxes and gives it to the church you are registered in) they excommunicate you. Every year many people “deregister” with a church, not necessarily because they became unbelievers but to try to avoid the onerous tax. The German Church doesn’t care if you are a doctor who performs abortions, or if you are in a gay marriage or whatever, but if you don’t pay the teacher, they bring the hammer down on you.
I grew up in an UCC congregation. I didn’t realize it was different from more conservative churches until I went to college. I was invited to a Calvary Chapel and was convicted of my need for a Savior. I put my trust in Christ and truly became born again. I was never taught that I needed to be born again. I eventually joined a Baptist church.
Your testimony is great but it is time to retire the notions of 'conservative' and 'progressive'. The only measure should be 'Alignment with a rational understanding of the Will & Commands of God'. Look at how the secular media (and Atheist Rob Reiner) exploit this divide and pick their favorites, while calling the other 'a existential threat'. While both of these array of thoughts at the extreme are apostate in their practice , the wide middle is often derelict in their willingness to voice 'the standard reference' that all who proclaim themselves as Christian should align with - via 'functional outcomes' relative to the two key crises 1) A society that is increasingly vulnerable to the whims of secularism w/ expected human to human dysfunction and 2) The rolls of the church rapidly diminishing , with some former Christians cheering the fact that 'entrenched bigotry' failed to compel them to change to the present day preferences (for bread & circuses) that appeal to the mindset that they have engendered
“The UCC is continuing to explore further openness on sexuality” I shout at my phone while making my breakfast pancakes, “how much more open can you get!?” Gabriela de Golia, “hold my beer”
@@daviddabrowski01 Well, MAPs, zoophiles, and people attracted to inanimate objects don't have their own bands on the pride flag yet, so clearly there's work to be done and sexual minorities to be liberated.
@@Justanotherconsumer I’d love to respond but I’m not even sure where to begin so I’ll just say a prayer, “Lord Jesus Christ, Son of the ever living God, have mercy on us, sinners”
Q: What's the difference between the UCC and the Unitarians? A: The Unitarians are at least honest enough not to falsely claim they are "Christian" anymore...
While this church sounds objectively terrible, the most annoying thing is the arrogance: the supposition that they have some kind of special wisdom because they alone recognize the Bible was written a long time ago. I don't know any conservative theologian or church scholar who does not consider important the fact that the Bible reflects the time and place in which it was written. Any serious analysis of scripture always takes into consideration the cultural and historical context in which it was written.
If you are raise in the UCC like I was - I grew to apprecaite the fact of the social issues of the day is what jesus is calling us to. Slavery never would have ended had it not been for the congregational ministers preaching about how wrong it was. It was the congregational of the present day historical old south church thata deacon Samuel Adams from the floor of the old south meeting that started the american revolution . For those from a more conservative back ground of course you can not understand were and why we believe what we do. It was born of out the struggle of the marginized of today's society . So if you have a problem with the ucc views . It helps to know more about who and why there beliefs came into being. .......
@@ElasticGiraffe if they’re obsessing over the historical context, that isn’t very pop culture. Remember that traditionalism is simply another aspect of popular culture - the “ways of the world” as it were. The amount of lazy prooftexting that goes into a lot of theology these days is concerning from every direction. People citing Romans 1 without paying attention to Romans 2, for an easy example.
@@QuarioQuario54321 Their usual, but WBC is slowly winding down, as members age out, die out, or get kicked out, including for the last, one of Shirley Phelps-Roper's daughters. Maybe 30-40 total members at this point.
@@smokeydapot lmao! But seriously. No term and concept is more uncritically thrown around nowadays than the ubiquitous "we". But nobody ever defines what that is supposed to be/mean. The closest thing on offer is the opaque "society". This uncritical universalism is frustrating because nowadays every concept is hypercriticised but when people talk about the "we", "society" or "humaniy" everybody is supposed to know what it means and accept it. The truth probably is that there really is no "universal We" available. This was a religious concept anyway and it does not secularize particularly well. There are many "we"s and many "societies".
He said to them, “Why are you troubled, and why do doubts rise in your minds? Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have.” Luke 24:38-39 NIV ...but Luke doesnt mention the bodily resurrection of Jesus.
I’m not sure if this is the case with the Gospel of Luke, but maybe there is an early version that doesn’t include that verse? Kind of like the short and long versions of Mark? idk how else they would conclude that both Gospels don't talk of the Resurrection
UCC is not a Christian church if Christianity means anything. At best it's the "living Constitution" (we'll change it whenever we feel like it) denomination.
Puritans were always entertained with the concept of human rights in much of the English speaking world’s legal history, so not really that different. There’s a reason they fled to the Americas with their weird liberal (for the time) ideas.
Yall act like sodom and gomorrah didnt happen. “Guys its just a rabbinic law for rabbis!!!!!” As if there arent countless passages against lustful acts throughout the entirety of the text. Straight people arent immune from this, of course: lust is rampant in today’s society. But acting as if abandoning the natural process of childbirth, the process that allows us to mimic the creation of the world through christ, in order to maintain sexual intimacy with no possibility of childbirth is somehow “loving as jesus taught” is absurd. IF there is no sexual aspect of same sex marriage, why get married at all? Why not remain friends? Why the focus on loving a certain gender specifically? The idea is clearly self defeating
Your scholarship is always impressive. For someone who doesn't believe, yet in my desire to know my fellowman, study of religions of all sorts is extremely important to me. Thank you for your research and coherent presentation.
Wow! You hit it out of the park again. Thanks for sharing what undoubtedly took many hours of your time to research , compile and put into a presentation. I was aware the UCC was diverse in beliefs and practices, but your program has very much expanded my understanding. I learned so much.
My father is a casual fan of Jeremiah Wright. I told him I felt him being in the UCC compromised the gospel. My pops argues that those guys are basically motivational speakers and there use of scripture might lead people to actual truth.
Thats what Jesus said. He was asked how to be saved, he said do not kill, do not steal, do not cheat, do not testify falsely, honor your parents, and love your neighbor as yourself. Nothing about any belief there. Its not about saying Lord Lord (believing) but about doing the will of the Lord (doing, ie practicing love).
@@jec1ny There is no point. It's a progressive back-patting party. People can just as easily be left-wing political junkies without getting together every Sunday morning, which is why the liberal mainline denominations are bleeding members.
"13 “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it." Mathew 13-14.
The same thing is happening to the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America. Gone is the Word of God; in its place are gay/trans ‘clergy’, female ‘pastors’ and anything else the Bible commands us NOT to do. I left. Thankfully there are still some biblical Lutheran synods around and that is where I am now. God will have the final say…….
A god of their 'understanding' or is the term overstanding for these woke jokes? The catch being, we can't possibly understand God ... but the hubristic are gonna hubris ...
Caters to culture. Has no theology. Big expensive churches. Well fed minsters who can be anyone. You can show up, rep your politics, and believe whatever you want so long as the check clears. This is a prosperity gospel church in a shiny rainbow wrapper.
After I was saved over 40 years ago I went to church because I knew that was what Christians did. I went to the UCC church that I had been raised in. Early on I heard the pastor question the resurrection from the pulpit. I never went back.
@@mai_komagata well. I mean we aren’t in God’s position of deciding who is saved and who is not but I would say there are many very clear and severe errors in the ways of this denomination that have a high likelihood to lead to a variety of issues. Best case sinario these people have incredibly underdeveloped spiritual formation, worst case sinario they are intentionally subverting Christianity with the goal of destroying it from the “inside.”
Usually it's their more theologically orthodox forbearers' endowments that are doing that, and it's only a matter of one more generation until there are no more people to fill the pews. 💔
Yes, but they do offer a refund if you don’t see the promised blessings. I’ve never heard of a church doing that. I don’t agree with most of their doctrines but I do like that they encourage donating to other charities rather than just the church
People in the Old Testament gave 10% of their best harvest as an offering to God. That carried into the New Testament as an encouragement to give sacrificially and joyfully, though it’s not the key to heaven. There are plenty of churches that manage their congregations’ sacrificial offerings wisely
To take a page from something I heard attributed to Machiavelli saying that the Holy Roman Empire was neither holy, nor Roman nor an empire, the UCC is neither a church (Biblically speaking). united, and especially is not of Christ.
I am very fascinated by the mixture of primarily German Reformed and Congregationalist (Puritan) churches in the UCC, with that bit of Lutheranism thrown in. So many of their churches are absolutely beautiful. It is so sad to see what they have become. I have heard that many of their churches are still relatively conservative but still, this is some of the worst I have ever seen on a denominational level. Lord forgive them and lead them away from this evil.
An important question: Is it better to live as Jesus teaches or believe the correct theology? The United Church of Christ is by no means a perfect denominations (and none are). The video misses an important aspect of the United Church of Christ--What is the product of the entire ministry done in the name of Jesus? Again perhaps no greater than any other. On the other hand my local church, quite small, is known for its kindness and warmth, its generosity and caring. I am 72 and it is the congregation I had been looking for all of my life. It isn't their doctrine that fills me with praise for Jesus, it is their manifestation as the body of Christ in my town. I am grateful to God for the gift that it is. By the way, we talk about tithing (the biblical amount) and it is not required. I don't know of any UCC congregation the requires tithing. I know that many do talk about it. I think as a denomination, many others may do much better in member dollar support of their churches. Also all of the UCC churches I have attended, as member or visitor, read much more bible at a Sunday worship than non-lectionary churches. Every congregation of the UCC I have experienced takes the bible as seriously as any other congregation of any other denomination. I am certain that churches that follow the lectionary (through the bible in 3 years with 4 passages each week) are taking the bible seriously.
Have to consider the source. Our host is anything but neutral on the topic. Even if he’s pretty good about sticking to the facts in his videos, the facts chosen and how they’re chosen to be presented has to be considered. Everyone has biases.
@@JustanotherconsumerI can’t pin his biases. But even having no idea what he believes there is no physical way you could present this “Christian” denomination in a decent light.
I don't really have a position here one way or the other, but there is one of these churches very close to my childhood home, and many of the Google maps comments on it are some variation of "I like how progressive it is, even though I don't go here." I rarely saw anyone actually go to that church.
I'm a pastoral intern in a UCC church and will be attending seminary in 2026. If folks have respectful, actual questions about the general theology and polity of the average churches in the UCC, feel free to comment below and I'll do my best to answer. But the UCC is the only denomination that kept me being a Christian. Without it I don't know where I'd be spiritually. But it has helped me develop my relationship with the living God and my Savior Jesus Christ.
I took a look at Eden Seminary once. They had invited a special guest speaker named John Dominic Crossan. I recognized him from the History Channel for claiming Jesus' body was stolen by the disciples and eaten by dogs. If you believe in the gospel, I have no idea why you would stay in the UCC or go to one of their seminaries. I say this as someone raised in the UCC.
I'm a non-theist who occasionally attends a local UCC church. I'm trying to be respectful as a guest and welcome participant, and I feel as if I were to ask too deep and probing of questions, then I'm going to need to either accept the answers at face value or come across as an extremely rude guest. I'm not keen to do either, so I try to glean what I can of the underlying theology where I can. The pastor is great, a self-described bible nerd, agrees with much of what I know of current secular bible scholarship, and is very approachable. She might not mind at all if I were to approach her with deeper, possibly dismissive questions. So I'm not assuming she would have a problem with me being this probing when I'm not expecting to accept her answers as authoritative, but I am not looking to pick a fight with her, either. I would be more comfortable discussing these questions with someone in a less personal interaction. If you're up for that, I would love to pick your brain. I might challenge your positions, but I'd at least try to be polite about it. This video actually taught me more of UCC theology than I'd managed to glean off and on over the past few years. I understand the views presented in it are not universal within the organization (one of the features of the organization), but are they typical? Do they resemble your own?
@@grumpylibrarian Hi, my family's tradition is UCC, but they were inactive by the time I was born. I know a lot about what they believe, but I'm not a part of the UCC anymore. I'm a theologically conservative Baptist pastor and missionary. My ministry is mostly trying to disciple people from Muslim and Eastern Orthodox backgrounds in the Balkans. Please, unload any questions you want on me, and I'll try to answer as best I can.
@@andyontheinternet5777 I guess it depends on what you mean by "believe in the gospel." If you mean believe in the GOSPELS, i.e. Matthew/Mark/Luke/John, then it would be pretty hard to reconcile them to Jesus's body being stolen. If you mean believe in THE gospel, they can definitely be reconciled. 1 Corinthians 15 asserts that Jesus got a new body at resurrection; what happened to the old one would be fairly irrelevant. Nothing in Paul asserts Jesus's original body being raised, just his spiritual body. I'm not personally persuaded that Jesus was buried in an individually-recognizable place, which grave robbery would pretty much require, as Roman law and local custom would have at most allowed him to be buried in a mass trench grave by the Sanhedrin. But I've heard very congruent arguments that conclude his body was stolen, and the refutation of this in Matthew (and ONLY Matthew) kinda doth protest too much, and the author's changed details from the earlier story in Mark were pretty much entirely to support his narrative about the body not being stolen no sir. Such as Matthew is the only gospel where the stone is still there when the women arrive at the tomb, apparently to further eradicate any idea that perhaps someone snuck out the body right before they got there. The version I really liked was that Joseph of Arimathea was unknown to the disciples, was a member of the Sanhedrin per later gospel accounts (just a "bouleutēs" which could be a council member or a senator in Mark), and was observed messing with Jesus's body. They would have had no idea what the man intended to do with the body, but suspected he was up to no good with it, and stole the body after he left the tomb. Because grave robbery was a CRIME punishable by death, the author of Matthew was kind enough to cover for them. This hinges on A) there being a tomb at all and B) Joseph of Arimithea being a real person, both highly-dubious claims. But if both of those are true, then stealing the body seems almost likely. This wouldn't have involved dogs eating his body, but I suspect you get that mixed up; if the body had been left on the cross, which was typical of political executions, then it would have been eaten by wild animals. I don't know of a model that involves both stealing the body and having it eaten by animals; if it had been stolen, the most likely scenario would be that they would have buried it. So I expect that Crossan offered alternate scenarios, and you've conflated them into one. But I didn't see it, so maybe he really did assert both at the same time.
I have found some people desire the sense of community and belonging being a member of a church brings, but have little/no interest in faith or religion. Those people tend to be pretty happy being part of a UCC church. I don't know why they don't just drop the pretense and label themselves as a community organization first and foremost. I think membership rates would improve if they did that.
@@miss_naomi7377 in Mark 10:5-11, Jesus is pretty darned explicit that *man is to "join" with woman* and that divorce+ remarriage is adultery. I'm pretty skeptical that those gay-celebrating UCC people believe that part.
27:50 - You just pronounced "Tripoli" correctly and honestly, that's the only real positive thing I heard in the video. Thank you for this deep dive. I wonder just how many people don't really realize what their church believes.
I say this as respectfully as possible. I pray that the Lord would give honest souls the courage and strength to separate themselves from these synagogues of Satan
@@lavieestlenfer My friend, openly rejecting the resurrection of Christ as well as the virgin birth is outright denying the divinity of Christ. If we do not call out blasphemy, then we fail to do the work of the Lord. I encourage us to read Romans 16:17-18 together and ponder what Paul says! May the Lord bless you!
It remain hilarious how rationalists reject the "talking snake", whilst "The Serpent" (ha-Nakhash, 'the shiny one') remains an ancient title for a sapient spirit-being who reigns as "the god over this world". They risk spending eons under that being's vile rulership in the underworld.
That’s some good stuff right there although I’d like to point out it actually means the “burning ones” in reference to the cobras venom, the seraphim, depicted in ancient Egypt as winged cobras. In all likelihood it’s a fallen angel speaking to Eve or at this time she may have still just been called woman I think she was given the name eve after expulsion
@@kyler7917No not really. We may not understand everything and it's why we study it. Often leads to different interpretations. In fact the Bible warns of its words being twisted to justify wrongdoings. Just because you may not like parts of hearings doesn't mean it didn't happen.
@@thealienrobotanthropologist you are lying to yourself if you believe you are not interpreting the Bible. The conflation of Theology and science is exactly why Christ is becoming irrelevant in society.
@@trilight3597 Many of these things have no material or observable harm associated today - just as we don't paint our door frames with lamb's blood anymore, there is no reason to obey old law with no current relevance. Christianity has no competitors to differentiate itself from to require them. Today, it's more important to eliminate superstition based on the ideals of 2000 years ago. We have to focus on the current as it exists, and not as it once was. God is here and now, and we MUST represent Christ to continue the current, not be nostalgic over the context of ancient holy books.
@@kyler7917how do we represent Christ in this age without proclaiming the Gospel? Christ warned about Hell and the need to be born again through the Spirit by repentance and faith. We would be doing Christ a disservice by ignoring His command to make disciples of Christ. Otherwise, their sin is still condemning them.
When my uncle immigrated to the USA, he really wanted to be an American in all things (this was his concept). So he grabbed a set of the Encyclopedia Americana and read all the volumes. He was trying to find out what was the most American of churches. He decided that it was the UCC and presented himself. In those days, he had to be voted in. I am not sure if this is the practise today, but he was accepted. I remember him telling me that he was on the board when the first African-American presented herself and he thought himself very enlightened by voting for her acceptance. Does anyone know if this is the practise today? It seems a bit out of step with the liberal theology. Incidentally, this happened not so long ago. It was probably in the 1970's and it occurred in Buffalo, NY.
Mainline Protestants / Theological Liberals are more into structural unity over theological unity. ------ Ecumenical means interdenominational. All (theologically conservative) Evangelicals are and always have been ecumenical with each other, this is what differentiates Evangelicals from Fundamentalist within Theologically Conservative Protestant Christianity. On the topic of ecumenism, Evangelicals (Missional-Revivalist Evangelicals) more so than Mainline Protestants, have (almost always) had open communion with what most of them would describe as believing Christians across several denominations, denominational traditions, and independent non-denominational congregations (with very few exceptions within some Confessional Evangelical groups) even if they don’t have official full communion agreements on the books which most Mainline Protestants generally require because of their preferentially higher view of structural unity/church polity-governance over the concepts of “in essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; in all things, love” and “Primary and Secondary issues in Christian theology.” In other words while Evangelicals (Evangelicals proper - Revivalists) from the get-go have been very interdenominational/ecumenical and well known for open communion even though they’re theologically conservative while the Mainline Protestants are/were mostly closed communion with recent allowances through some official full communion agreements - they also happen to be largely theologically liberal. Evangelical believe in “in essentials unity, in nonessentials liberty, in all things charity” while Catholics, Orthodox, and Mormons (Mormons aren’t Christian but a separate Abrahamic religion like Islam or Rastafarianism) believe in the “one true church” doctrine. All Evangelicals, see themselves more as Christians first and their individual denominations second which especially makes sense when talking about Evangelicals because Evangelicals are an interdenominational/ecumenical community or movement who cooperate with each other and worship together due to largely similar theological beliefs but set boundaries because of distinctions or differences on issues of secondary and tertiary importance.
What exactly are they worshipping in their services? Aside from themselves, I guess. There's a UCC church near me that has been around so long they actually had Jonathan Edwards as their first pastor, albeit briefly. Same name, same location but I believe the church building was replaced sometime in the 19th century. Now proudly flying rainbow flags out front. The pastor is a man "married" to another man. From Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God to openly homosexual leading the faithful. Quite a ride from 1720 tp 2024, eh? Edit: Turns out Edwards wasn't technically the first pastor. He lived in the town in 1723-4 The parish wasn't organized by the state of CT until 1725 and by then Edwards was back at Yale. (Congregationalism was the Established church in CT until 1820 or so).
Some of their churches are also members of the Unitarian Universalist Association (a bunch of ancient heresies revived). That's all you need to know about them.
Interesting. I'm a member of the independent Christian churches and churches of Christ (very similar to Church of Christ, but with instrumental music in worship) and people always think I'm Mormon/Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints...
I am a Congregationalist. I was baptized at 52 years old. It was my choice. I wasn’t baptized as a baby. I also converted to Judaism before I had children. I spent 25 years as a Jew. This church fits me because of my own personal road choosing what works for me. Thank you for your respect.
"I don't want a church that moves with the world, I want a church that moves the world." G.K. Chesterton.
I’m starting to grow weary of progressive church and having to listen to a pastor talk about “social justice” or say things like “lord, savior, and redeemer” instead of the normal trinity.
Amen.
I love how this is presented - explaining the doctrine, positions and beliefs of the UCC using their own documents and quotes from their clergy.
Thanks Jason!
@@ReadyToHarvest ...indeed ...you doeth all things well...but this episode, was in particular detailed and well done...hearing you quote liberal church"persons", making their most convincing arguments and apologia in their own words...is a rare theological treat...thanks
Be not of the world and God speaks clearly about what is an abomination to Him
This guy's the best ever. Love, your fellow Catholic Christian
I'm sorry, but denying a literal resurrection is rank heresy.
Don't be sorry.
@@ninjason57Judge not, lest ye be judged.
Never a bad thing to be humble about our own judgmental natures, we know so little in comparison to the judge that matters.
No resurrection? No virgin birth? These sound like heresies that would have been denounced by the earliest of Church Fathers.
@@regurgitatedbucketofslime4518 1 Corinthians 15:14
Seiten is fake chicken for vegans.
Satan is fake inspiration for faking Christianity
Maaaybe they should cease the cultural appropriation of Christian trappings and start a flying saucer cult ...
Actually started cackling when the whole video these ministers are dismissing biblical commandments left and right and then when it comes to tithing they are like "GOD WAS VERRRRRRY SERIOUS ABOUT THE PART WHERE YOU GIVE US 10% OF YOUR INCOME THO No exceptions ☝️😡!"
they like the money part of the bible. Unfortunately they skip the verses where it talks about that tithing was a covenant between God and the Israelites.
Precisely. They give up the game.
They aren't Christians but they want their money and the clergy's prestige.
...and the BIble is absolutely clear that it's 10% of your *gross* income.
The united church is about the least 'money centric' religion there is. Certainly they don't rake in the money like these evangelical preachers who often live in mansions.
@@mikearchibald744 With all due respect, the UCC is about the least God-centric religion there is. I still have to laugh at what was pointed out to me decades ago: UCC = Unitarians Considering Christ.
Jesus turned no one away but he never blessed sin. He called for repentance.
He did turn some away - those that were eager to stone the woman for adultery, for example.
@@Justanotherconsumer He did not turn them away they walked away from him.
@@Justanotherconsumer The Bible never says he turned them away. It does however say that after they left he told the woman to go and sin no more.
(INTERESTING FACT: That portion of Scripture is absent from all of the oldest texts.)
@@tonyu5985they walked away because of what He told them.
He did not celebrate prideful judgment of others as a sin, I guess you could say, and that offended people.
@@Justanotherconsumer He called them to repetence. They turned themselves away.
"But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ has not been raised; if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is in vain.... But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who have fallen asleep."
For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
I grew up in this church. I had a pastor who said she did not sin. My mom had the courage to take us to a Bible believing church, thank God!
"These progressive Christians don't believe in the Bible!" I say eating my pork chop
I'm sorry that you've had to grow up in such a limiting environment. Best wishes. Bill Anthony
should've asked her who was right, her or God? Since the bible says that ALL have sinned. I used to think it was a Christian church, that was until the blinders fell off and saw it for what it was, an unbiblical "church".
@@BiblicalTeachings every churches is unbiblical. The point of my comment is that Christians reject the Bible as it suits them.
"I had a pastor who said she" Gotta stop you right there
It’s like a parody of what a conservative Christian thinks a progressive church is like. Except this time they would be right.
I know it's hard to believe, but essentially this is what all non-conservative congregations have become, in various stages.@@christopherflux6254
Why is this such a perfect analogy 😭
@@johngalt5166
Things have gotten really bad in many progressive churches.
The direction most Protestants are going these days, especially in the USA.
@@KandiKlover
There is Bible Reformation vs apostasy war in the church.
I anticipate the comments being measured and respectful.
Worthless retard comment
Suuuuuuuure
There is no hate quite like Christian love!
@@joemassaroni8962The only thing that rivals it is the intolerance of progressive tolerance.
@@joemassaroni8962🤦
I just couldn't finish watching this one. I'll be praying.
Honestly that’s such a mood fr.
Me too!
Same here, I genuinely want to understand the beliefs of other supposed brothers and sisters but all this does is depress me. They took the good thing of being accepting and loving to all and somehow destroyed the whole meaning of Christianity in the process.
@@CaleMcGowan I heard many years ago (as a young believer) the best way to spot a fake is to known the genuine. I think often times in our quest to learn, it can lead our hearts to heaviness, and more grief. I’ve been shutting off a lot more of late, and just staying close to the Shepherd!
Reminds me of the Simpsons episode where the reverend is selling ice cream, Lisa comes up and says, “look at all these flavors! Blessed virgin berry.. command-mint” and the reverend says, “how about Unitarian ice cream” and hands Lisa a bowl.
Lisa looks in and is surprised and says, “there’s nothing here!” And the reverend replies, “exactly”
My primary take-away is “that each (congregation) did what was right in its own eyes.”
@@therealstuffedzebra relying on the Holy Spirit for guidance rather than some central human authority.
Not unique. “Hardshell” Baptists (aka Primitive Baptists) who actively reject the concept of a denomination to the point of not having clergy, not having seminaries, and so on are even more extreme, though they are by very intentional design not a formal denomination.
The Religious Society of Friends (“Quakers”) are similar in some ways though they do have more structure even if it’s purely administrative rather than theological.
Unprogrammed meetings for worship are a strange experience for those of us that spent time with the Book of Common Prayer.
@@Justanotherconsumer
How are they not a denomination?
Seemed to me that thier doctrine is whatever the current Democrat platform is.
@@joshuakarr-BibleMan because they choose not to be one.
A denomination is not just a label applied to a group, it’s also an administrative structure that goes beyond the immediate local group. That’s not something that exists for many churches.
@@Justanotherconsumer
I think one of their members is fighting with me on twitter right now.
It's sort of an odd mode of conversation, just reasoning back at people instead of fighting them.
"Jesus Christ. The same yesterday, today and forever." Hebrews 13:8
Exactly, thats why us liberal Christians reject the traditional views people made up, and just follow Jesus.
@@zelenisok So, the Early Church just made everything up, 2000 years of Christian teaching is wrong, and you're setting us right? Boy, that's prideful.
@@zelenisok
A lot of people throughout history, from the Apostles, to modern times, people, tortured and killed. IF it was all a lie……
The truth is, that there was/ IS, something about [ true] Christianity that is different. There is a Power, and a PEACE, and Love, that goes FAR beyond any human understanding, [ including yours, sad, because you will never be truly at Peace with yourself. You will never be Content. You will always know there is something major missing from your life and heart.✝️🙏
@@zelenisokOh Zeleni. At least you are consistent.
@@zelenisokJesus told you to follow his apostles and the church he left to them... And they are the only reason you even have the scripture and know about Jesus. 😂😂
I can usually find something charitable to say about most denominations……but the UCC *really* makes that task excruciatingly hard. It’s the only time I’ve watched one of your videos and physically said “Lord, please forgive them”
They’re basically the anti-Catholicism in structure so that’s not surprising, though the Religious Society of Friends or “Hardshell” Baptists are arguably even more the antithesis of the strict hierarchy of Rome.
They do charitable work and would probably make pleasant neighbours. But their theology is shocking.
I wouldn't even call them a denomination. They're just straight-up blasphemous.
@@christopherflux6254I’m not so sure about good neighbors 😬
It would depend on how much they idolize their politics. (Which seems to be common with these sorts of liberal theology “Christians”.)
Say what you want, but I had a fine and normal experience growing up with a New England UCC church. I think Baptist theology has done more damage to our society, and Orthordoxy is the real Christianity anyway.
When talking about the resurrection, that pastor is no different than an atheist. Every argument is the same word for word
The woman who asked "why are we here?" was absolutely right.
@@RonJohn63 St. Paul says it best. If there is no resurrection from the dead, our faith is futile and we are still in our sins.
@@bencook6585 Being an epistemological evidentialist (meaning that I need valid evidence before I believe something is true) requires me to demand stronger evidence than "the Bible tells me so" that a man revivified, and then was taken up into the sky.
@RonJohn63 There is plenty of evidence. The gospel accounts themselves are evidence. The same evidence we have for anything in all ancient history, testimonial. We also have archeological evidence. No bones of Christ have ever been found (if they had we would know, Christians have always found and venerated saints' bones).
@@bencook6585 _The gospel accounts themselves are evidence._
Remember what I said about "because the Bible tells me so"?
And as for "the same evidence we have for anything in all ancient history"... so what if Homer and Plato didn't exist? Their stories and philosophies exist, and that's what's important.
OTOH, we're supposed to change our whole secular and eternal lives because Jesus is allegedly the creator of the universe.
Put up the evidence or shut up.
Like the anti-Westboro Baptist Church
No, UCC is American progressive zealotry, and WBC is just a straight misinterpretation of the way Christ calls us to deal with sin. Both are zealous and ‘innovate’ on God's word.
Both obsessed with homosexuality.
Both worthless
I was born and raised in a UCC church. Earlier this spring they voted to remove Evangelical from the name, because they associate it with conservatives. Last week our pastor gave a sermon about how being a good Christian means supporting abortion, and gay marriage.
Yesterday I attended the Mass of Blessed Virgin Mary at a nearby Catholic Church and afterwards asked when can I sign up for RCIA classes.
The church that I was raised in doesn’t believe in God anymore, they don’t really believe in anything. When I was a kid our weekly attendance was nearly a thousand. These days my small family makes up 3 of the 40 people or so who still attend.
This video just hurts to watch.
You absolutely made the right choice.
WELCOME HOME
welcome home
Welcome home.
Good choice.
It seems that UCC is progressive about everything except tithing, which is an inequitable flat-tax.
We've reached peak progressive social club/cafeteria Christianity.
As opposed to the ecclesiastic wing of political conservatism that the vast majority of Christians engage in? How dare like minded and spiritually aligned people gather!
This is unfortunately often the liberal version of the churches hosting conservative political events and preaching culture war nonsense.
Oh, that’s at about a middle. Consider the American churches that split over slavery, for example.
Well rallying with roof launchers and larping around in their flags and ski masks clearly isnt thrilling enough, they have to cosplay in Noah's rainbow as well.
It is not Christianity
They’re also in communion with the United Church Of Canada.
Seems like that is mentioned at 33:26
Non of these people are Christian, communion doesnt matter at that point
United Church of Canada is even more liberal - they even have an atheist pastor - which my brain is still trying to process.
What communion though? People believing basically nothing of any substance, trying to appear vaguely nice by current media elite standards?@@BramptonAnglican
@@JasonTaylor-po5xc same as the communists and their long march through the institutions. Destroy what they hate from within
My family's tradition is UCC. My grandfather had been a pastor in the denomination, but they barely practiced by the time I was born. I became a believer as a young adult, and had a zeal to learn more about the faith. When I dug my grandfather's old seminary books out of the closet, I expected to find deep theology and thoughtful reflection on God. Instead, I found blatant heresy. Even as a new Christian, I knew the denomination was in apostasy. They completely reject the authority of the Bible and teach whatever the culture seems to like at the moment.
They are cosplaying as Christians, they are not Christians themselves
This probably won't surprise you, but my wife and I visited one of her aunts years ago. Her aunt got saved a couple of years back and said she had learned more of the Bible two years in an independent Baptist church than roughly 50 in the UCC.
@@ScottPalmer-mp1we I'm glad your aunt found a church that believes and preaches God's word.
@@WaterMelon-Cat It's a shame what happened to the UCC. The denomination developed out of a robust, devote Christian heritage. Now it's terrible. There may be a few people who believe the gospel in that denomination still, but most of the actual Christians have left. I know of one congregation that went independent when they saw what was happening. They did very well once they left the UCC and eventually joined the Evangelical Free Church.
You mean we need to stay in the Iron Age? asking for a friend.
I was struck by the many times they made stereotypical and two-dimensional characterizations of traditional and conservative Christians. Kinda strange that a denomination with a wide range of beliefs between moderate to liberal would be so accepting of such antagonist speech.
I go to a fairly conservative Methodist church and we never turn anybody away, regardless of what they may be struggling with in their life. Maybe there are some ultra fundamentalist churches that would refuse lgbtq people from even entering, but I think you would be hard-pressed to see that
This may seem uncharitable, but, "strange"? This is par for the course, based upon my experiences.
@@scripturalcontexts I was raised in a Fundamentalist Southern Baptist Church, and we would let almost anyone in (that wasn’t a cause of danger or majorly disrupting service)
That said, we wouldn’t let a proud LGBTQ person become a member of the congregation, just like we wouldn’t let a proud public adulterer become a member, but we would never turn them away from listening to a service.
We did generally hold closed communion for the congregation so I guess we technically rejected them from communion by proxy if you want to nitpick.
Lots of controversies in the comments 😅 but I just want to say that as someone who wasn't raised Christian and has had a lot of difficulty understanding what people get out of the faith, the UCC is the only congregation where the pastors (and I've talked to a number!) have been willing to really sit with me, answer my questions, and help me understand the teachings of Jesus. Their acceptance and willingness to meet me where I am on my spiritual journey is one of the reasons I finally started reading the bible.
I also really want to thank you for posting about and discussing Christian denominations in such a neutral, non-biased way. As someone who's still exploring Christianity, your videos have been immensely helpful in understanding the different ways people think about the Christian faith. I really appreciate all your hard work!
just know that these people really arent christian, its more so of a social club that talks about jesus then an actual church. as a stepping stone it works ig, but it treads a very fine line, and is borderline wrong with a lot of its theology. be careful, is all im saying.
After learning about their singular immovable biblical principle of the tithe, I might have an answer for you as to why.
It's good you are asking questions. I would ask those questions of the Holy Spirit and get into the bible for yourself. This church teaches blatent heresy and it would be more detriment to your spiritual walk with Jesus Christ to remain in that church. Especially if they affirm what is being described here. Follow Jesus, lean on the Holy Spirit and you will find the answers that you seek. God is more interested in your journey to him than you are and that is a very good thing!
For a split second, I thought this is about the United Church of Christ in Japan, the uniting church in Japan that was forcefully merged during Japan's war against the whole world and had to make a public statement about its support for fascism. Now it's the fastest shrinking church organization in Japan.
That would be a very interesting video from this channel, I think.
Joshua mentioned that he reads each comment, so I wont @ him, but I shall show my support for this idea
I pray that Japan will become Orthodox. I think that Eastern Christianity fits their culture better
Japan is ripe for evangelism because they will listen but it's hard to actually talk to them
Major cities like Hiroshima and Nagasaki had many Catholics before the atomic bomb decimated most of the people.
28:10 I started to laugh at this point. After almost 30 minutes of rather liberal theology, suddenly things went very biblical with tithing at 10% or at least aiming for it. I guess that when it comes to money, the liberal leaders do not want to pass up on the green backs.
Same 🤣
@@stephanottawa7890 much like the Catholic and Lutheran Churches in Germany, extremely lax about nearly everything but if you try to get out of paying your yearly “church tax” ( in Germany the government takes a part of your taxes and gives it to the church you are registered in) they excommunicate you. Every year many people “deregister” with a church, not necessarily because they became unbelievers but to try to avoid the onerous tax. The German Church doesn’t care if you are a doctor who performs abortions, or if you are in a gay marriage or whatever, but if you don’t pay the teacher, they bring the hammer down on you.
Same 😄😏
Question your source then if something jumps out that suddenly seems out of place.
UCC church I grew up in said very little about tithing.
Now its not liberal to share wealth? Can the conservatives be any more incoherent..
I'm just here for the comments
About a 2 on the confrontational spectrum
Me too 😅
Lord Jesus Christ Have Mercy
Most Holy Theotokos Save Us. ☦️
I'm just here to juice the algorithm
That's okay--UCC members are in it for the entertainment too.
I grew up in an UCC congregation. I didn’t realize it was different from more conservative churches until I went to college. I was invited to a Calvary Chapel and was convicted of my need for a Savior. I put my trust in Christ and truly became born again. I was never taught that I needed to be born again. I eventually joined a Baptist church.
Your testimony is great but it is time to retire the notions of 'conservative' and 'progressive'. The only measure should be 'Alignment with a rational understanding of the Will & Commands of God'. Look at how the secular media (and Atheist Rob Reiner) exploit this divide and pick their favorites, while calling the other 'a existential threat'. While both of these array of thoughts at the extreme are apostate in their practice , the wide middle is often derelict in their willingness to voice 'the standard reference' that all who proclaim themselves as Christian should align with - via 'functional outcomes' relative to the two key crises 1) A society that is increasingly vulnerable to the whims of secularism w/ expected human to human dysfunction and 2) The rolls of the church rapidly diminishing , with some former Christians cheering the fact that 'entrenched bigotry' failed to compel them to change to the present day preferences (for bread & circuses) that appeal to the mindset that they have engendered
@@robertboroughs7824 Uh...Nope.
“The UCC is continuing to explore further openness on sexuality”
I shout at my phone while making my breakfast pancakes, “how much more open can you get!?”
Gabriela de Golia, “hold my beer”
Even other LGBT affirming denominations call the UCC “Unitarians Considering Christ)
How much more open? Maybe they can prove the old pagan accusations against the Christians true and start having orgies in church
@@daviddabrowski01 Well, MAPs, zoophiles, and people attracted to inanimate objects don't have their own bands on the pride flag yet, so clearly there's work to be done and sexual minorities to be liberated.
If worrying about other people’s sexuality is core to your faith, spend more time with the gospels.
@@Justanotherconsumer I’d love to respond but I’m not even sure where to begin so I’ll just say a prayer, “Lord Jesus Christ, Son of the ever living God, have mercy on us, sinners”
Thank you for this non-biased video covering the UCC!
Q: What's the difference between the UCC and the Unitarians?
A: The Unitarians are at least honest enough not to falsely claim they are "Christian" anymore...
Yeah, pretty much.
I don’t think the UCC will exist in 50 years, God willing.
@@Ditmike2235 when 67% of your churches have weekly attendance under 50 you are just living on borrowed time until the church coffers run out.
@@alexandriaelder5462agreed but we have to be careful to make sure the trend isn’t the same in real churches.
While this church sounds objectively terrible, the most annoying thing is the arrogance: the supposition that they have some kind of special wisdom because they alone recognize the Bible was written a long time ago. I don't know any conservative theologian or church scholar who does not consider important the fact that the Bible reflects the time and place in which it was written. Any serious analysis of scripture always takes into consideration the cultural and historical context in which it was written.
There’s a lot of not serious analysis that drives a lot of conservative churches that use completely ignorant readings as proof texts.
Only the serious ones, though, and far too much of conservative theology is pop culture nonsense.
If you are raise in the UCC like I was - I grew to apprecaite the fact of the social issues of the day is what jesus is calling us to. Slavery never would have ended had it not been for the congregational ministers preaching about how wrong it was. It was the congregational of the present day historical old south church thata deacon Samuel Adams from the floor of the old south meeting that started the american revolution . For those from a more conservative back ground of course you can not understand were and why we believe what we do. It was born of out the struggle of the marginized of today's society . So if you have a problem with the ucc views . It helps to know more about who and why there beliefs came into being. .......
@@Justanotherconsumer Is there any feature of UCC theology that isn't pop culture nonsense, though?
@@ElasticGiraffe if they’re obsessing over the historical context, that isn’t very pop culture.
Remember that traditionalism is simply another aspect of popular culture - the “ways of the world” as it were.
The amount of lazy prooftexting that goes into a lot of theology these days is concerning from every direction.
People citing Romans 1 without paying attention to Romans 2, for an easy example.
The Eastboro Baptist Church
Living two miles from WBC and having an in-law whose a UCC pastor, that's particularly funny
@@robertlehnert4148 Oh dear, what have they done lately?
@@QuarioQuario54321 Their usual, but WBC is slowly winding down, as members age out, die out, or get kicked out, including for the last, one of Shirley Phelps-Roper's daughters. Maybe 30-40 total members at this point.
God is still speaking. Coincidentally, he always agrees with the latest thing.
i mean if we are constantly working to make the world better, this would be what would happen.
@@mai_komagatawho is "We" and what is the world and what is "better".
@@Lolux1701 Dr. Peterson?
I get your point, but logically you could reverse it as a defense for the position: it is the current thing because God has agreed to let it be so.
@@smokeydapot lmao! But seriously. No term and concept is more uncritically thrown around nowadays than the ubiquitous "we". But nobody ever defines what that is supposed to be/mean.
The closest thing on offer is the opaque "society". This uncritical universalism is frustrating because nowadays every concept is hypercriticised but when people talk about the "we", "society" or "humaniy" everybody is supposed to know what it means and accept it.
The truth probably is that there really is no "universal We" available. This was a religious concept anyway and it does not secularize particularly well. There are many "we"s and many "societies".
He said to them, “Why are you troubled, and why do doubts rise in your minds? Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have.”
Luke 24:38-39 NIV
...but Luke doesnt mention the bodily resurrection of Jesus.
I’m not sure if this is the case with the Gospel of Luke, but maybe there is an early version that doesn’t include that verse? Kind of like the short and long versions of Mark? idk how else they would conclude that both Gospels don't talk of the Resurrection
UCC is not a Christian church if Christianity means anything. At best it's the "living Constitution" (we'll change it whenever we feel like it) denomination.
Sounds like a joke to me
How these guys came from the puritans is absolutely astounding to me
In a way I see the zeal of the puritans showing through, just not the faith.
Puritans were always entertained with the concept of human rights in much of the English speaking world’s legal history, so not really that different.
There’s a reason they fled to the Americas with their weird liberal (for the time) ideas.
@@Justanotherconsumer You need to read up on Cromwell dude.
It's called growth
@@Justanotherconsumer Yeah, you clearly haven't a clue what a Puritan was.
A church that uses Isaiah 5:20 and 2 Timothy 3:3-4 as proof texts. 🤦♂️
A church that uses Leviticus 20:13 and Romans 1:26-27 as proof texts. 🤦♂️
Yall act like sodom and gomorrah didnt happen. “Guys its just a rabbinic law for rabbis!!!!!” As if there arent countless passages against lustful acts throughout the entirety of the text. Straight people arent immune from this, of course: lust is rampant in today’s society. But acting as if abandoning the natural process of childbirth, the process that allows us to mimic the creation of the world through christ, in order to maintain sexual intimacy with no possibility of childbirth is somehow “loving as jesus taught” is absurd.
IF there is no sexual aspect of same sex marriage, why get married at all? Why not remain friends? Why the focus on loving a certain gender specifically? The idea is clearly self defeating
Your scholarship is always impressive. For someone who doesn't believe, yet in my desire to know my fellowman, study of religions of all sorts is extremely important to me. Thank you for your research and coherent presentation.
Wow! You hit it out of the park again. Thanks for sharing what undoubtedly took many hours of your time to research , compile and put into a presentation. I was aware the UCC was diverse in beliefs and practices, but your program has very much expanded my understanding. I learned so much.
My father is a casual fan of Jeremiah Wright. I told him I felt him being in the UCC compromised the gospel. My pops argues that those guys are basically motivational speakers and there use of scripture might lead people to actual truth.
Positives of the UCC:
1. They offer their spaces for a lot of 12 step groups.
2. [This space intentionally left blank]
@@senorsiro3748 another undisputable good thing is that they maintain some beautiful historic churches
😂😂😂
The UCC stands for NOTHING and falls for EVERYTHING........quoting G.K. Chesterton.
To each their own. Personally, I don't see the point of a religion that says believe whatever you want, it's no big deal. YMMV
Thats what Jesus said. He was asked how to be saved, he said do not kill, do not steal, do not cheat, do not testify falsely, honor your parents, and love your neighbor as yourself. Nothing about any belief there. Its not about saying Lord Lord (believing) but about doing the will of the Lord (doing, ie practicing love).
@@jec1ny There is no point. It's a progressive back-patting party. People can just as easily be left-wing political junkies without getting together every Sunday morning, which is why the liberal mainline denominations are bleeding members.
"13 “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it." Mathew 13-14.
The same thing is happening to the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America. Gone is the Word of God; in its place are gay/trans ‘clergy’, female ‘pastors’ and anything else the Bible commands us NOT to do. I left. Thankfully there are still some biblical Lutheran synods around and that is where I am now. God will have the final say…….
I left my ELCA church some years ago, after they spent more of April talking about "Earth Day" than Easter.
Some call this christianity .. I don't. And I never will.
"God is still speaking" may be the main thing they get right
And aapparently the only thing Xe has a problem with is conservatism.
the only one !
Even that is disputed.
If God is still speaking, then it needs to speak louder and more clearly.
A god of their 'understanding'
or is the term overstanding for these woke jokes? The catch being, we can't possibly understand God ... but the hubristic are gonna hubris ...
Caters to culture. Has no theology. Big expensive churches. Well fed minsters who can be anyone. You can show up, rep your politics, and believe whatever you want so long as the check clears. This is a prosperity gospel church in a shiny rainbow wrapper.
After I was saved over 40 years ago I went to church because I knew that was what Christians did. I went to the UCC church that I had been raised in. Early on I heard the pastor question the resurrection from the pulpit. I never went back.
The UCC is no longer a Christian group in my view. That's so unfortunate.
God revealed to me that the UCC is His one true church. Proverbs 3:5-6
@@theethanatorem Praying this is sarcasm fr 😅😭
i mean, your opinion doesn't determine christianity. Trinitarian baptism and belief in the trinity does. Which this church believes in.
@@mai_komagata well. I mean we aren’t in God’s position of deciding who is saved and who is not but I would say there are many very clear and severe errors in the ways of this denomination that have a high likelihood to lead to a variety of issues.
Best case sinario these people have incredibly underdeveloped spiritual formation, worst case sinario they are intentionally subverting Christianity with the goal of destroying it from the “inside.”
UCC is all over New England maintaining the historic churches at the heart of many a village, and I thank them for that
If only they maintained the theology
Usually it's their more theologically orthodox forbearers' endowments that are doing that, and it's only a matter of one more generation until there are no more people to fill the pews. 💔
A building is nothing
Such beautiful grounds to walk around!!
Lord Jesus Christ Son of God have mercy on us sinners and save us ☦️
Holy Theotokos pray for us
Funny that the UCC is opposed to the literal interpretation of the Bible, except when it comes to giving.
Lol, I thought the same thing myself xD
Seems the me one one thing most of these “churches” will firmly hold to and support is the tithe. That says a lot.
Yes, but they do offer a refund if you don’t see the promised blessings. I’ve never heard of a church doing that. I don’t agree with most of their doctrines but I do like that they encourage donating to other charities rather than just the church
People in the Old Testament gave 10% of their best harvest as an offering to God. That carried into the New Testament as an encouragement to give sacrificially and joyfully, though it’s not the key to heaven. There are plenty of churches that manage their congregations’ sacrificial offerings wisely
I imagine this was as hard for you to film as it was for us to watch. Thank you for your service.
To take a page from something I heard attributed to Machiavelli saying that the Holy Roman Empire was neither holy, nor Roman nor an empire, the UCC is neither a church (Biblically speaking). united, and especially is not of Christ.
That was Voltaire, not Machiavelli.
@@andrelegeant88 Thanks for the correction.
Hearing their doctrinal statements make me sick to my stomach
I don't think UCC even believes that Jesus would agree with what they say of him.
Jude wrote about this problem in the church. It’s worth reading and reflecting upon. The UCC simply has lost its way and needs prayer.
I am very fascinated by the mixture of primarily German Reformed and Congregationalist (Puritan) churches in the UCC, with that bit of Lutheranism thrown in. So many of their churches are absolutely beautiful. It is so sad to see what they have become. I have heard that many of their churches are still relatively conservative but still, this is some of the worst I have ever seen on a denominational level. Lord forgive them and lead them away from this evil.
These people are not Christians.
An important question: Is it better to live as Jesus teaches or believe the correct theology? The United Church of Christ is by no means a perfect denominations (and none are). The video misses an important aspect of the United Church of Christ--What is the product of the entire ministry done in the name of Jesus? Again perhaps no greater than any other. On the other hand my local church, quite small, is known for its kindness and warmth, its generosity and caring. I am 72 and it is the congregation I had been looking for all of my life. It isn't their doctrine that fills me with praise for Jesus, it is their manifestation as the body of Christ in my town. I am grateful to God for the gift that it is. By the way, we talk about tithing (the biblical amount) and it is not required. I don't know of any UCC congregation the requires tithing. I know that many do talk about it. I think as a denomination, many others may do much better in member dollar support of their churches. Also all of the UCC churches I have attended, as member or visitor, read much more bible at a Sunday worship than non-lectionary churches. Every congregation of the UCC I have experienced takes the bible as seriously as any other congregation of any other denomination. I am certain that churches that follow the lectionary (through the bible in 3 years with 4 passages each week) are taking the bible seriously.
I always just laugh and laugh when they discuss "historical context" and add an issue from 2010.
But then again, I do that for many denominations.
Have to consider the source.
Our host is anything but neutral on the topic. Even if he’s pretty good about sticking to the facts in his videos, the facts chosen and how they’re chosen to be presented has to be considered.
Everyone has biases.
@@JustanotherconsumerI can’t pin his biases.
But even having no idea what he believes there is no physical way you could present this “Christian” denomination in a decent light.
I’m sorry but this group is heretical! How can they profess to be Christians if they don’t believe in the resurrection?
I love to hear you trying to stay impartial while exposing this Luciferian Church.
I don't really have a position here one way or the other, but there is one of these churches very close to my childhood home, and many of the Google maps comments on it are some variation of "I like how progressive it is, even though I don't go here." I rarely saw anyone actually go to that church.
Turns out "Jesus maybe was a cool guy once" is not Christianity, and there are only so many ways to say "anything goes I guess".@@JoshuaFagan
Very thorough and respectful
I’m an old guy and my hearing is beginning to fail. Did you say United Church of Christ “denomination”, or United Church of Christ “abomination”?
Denomination. He wouldn't call any church an abomination since he keeps his videos polemically neutral.
@@brianwhite2104 You are absolutely correct. This young man does some remarkable research, editing, and presentation.
I am member of the PC USA and we are in full communion with the UCC.
The UCC church in my hometown is the oldest empty building on our circle 😂 so progressive everyone quit showing up.
thank you for your fair and balanced description
Notice that tithing is one Bible principle they take literally for the most part. Somehow I'm not surprised.
Excellent and well researched. Thanks.
cudos for staying calm through all this
Our host is a lot more rooted in scholarship and faith than most of the commenters on this channel, unsurprisingly.
Hahah great comment
I'm a pastoral intern in a UCC church and will be attending seminary in 2026. If folks have respectful, actual questions about the general theology and polity of the average churches in the UCC, feel free to comment below and I'll do my best to answer. But the UCC is the only denomination that kept me being a Christian. Without it I don't know where I'd be spiritually. But it has helped me develop my relationship with the living God and my Savior Jesus Christ.
So excited for your faith journey!! Which seminary are you hoping to attend?
I took a look at Eden Seminary once. They had invited a special guest speaker named John Dominic Crossan. I recognized him from the History Channel for claiming Jesus' body was stolen by the disciples and eaten by dogs. If you believe in the gospel, I have no idea why you would stay in the UCC or go to one of their seminaries. I say this as someone raised in the UCC.
I'm a non-theist who occasionally attends a local UCC church. I'm trying to be respectful as a guest and welcome participant, and I feel as if I were to ask too deep and probing of questions, then I'm going to need to either accept the answers at face value or come across as an extremely rude guest. I'm not keen to do either, so I try to glean what I can of the underlying theology where I can.
The pastor is great, a self-described bible nerd, agrees with much of what I know of current secular bible scholarship, and is very approachable. She might not mind at all if I were to approach her with deeper, possibly dismissive questions. So I'm not assuming she would have a problem with me being this probing when I'm not expecting to accept her answers as authoritative, but I am not looking to pick a fight with her, either. I would be more comfortable discussing these questions with someone in a less personal interaction.
If you're up for that, I would love to pick your brain. I might challenge your positions, but I'd at least try to be polite about it. This video actually taught me more of UCC theology than I'd managed to glean off and on over the past few years. I understand the views presented in it are not universal within the organization (one of the features of the organization), but are they typical? Do they resemble your own?
@@grumpylibrarian Hi, my family's tradition is UCC, but they were inactive by the time I was born. I know a lot about what they believe, but I'm not a part of the UCC anymore.
I'm a theologically conservative Baptist pastor and missionary. My ministry is mostly trying to disciple people from Muslim and Eastern Orthodox backgrounds in the Balkans. Please, unload any questions you want on me, and I'll try to answer as best I can.
@@andyontheinternet5777 I guess it depends on what you mean by "believe in the gospel." If you mean believe in the GOSPELS, i.e. Matthew/Mark/Luke/John, then it would be pretty hard to reconcile them to Jesus's body being stolen. If you mean believe in THE gospel, they can definitely be reconciled. 1 Corinthians 15 asserts that Jesus got a new body at resurrection; what happened to the old one would be fairly irrelevant. Nothing in Paul asserts Jesus's original body being raised, just his spiritual body.
I'm not personally persuaded that Jesus was buried in an individually-recognizable place, which grave robbery would pretty much require, as Roman law and local custom would have at most allowed him to be buried in a mass trench grave by the Sanhedrin. But I've heard very congruent arguments that conclude his body was stolen, and the refutation of this in Matthew (and ONLY Matthew) kinda doth protest too much, and the author's changed details from the earlier story in Mark were pretty much entirely to support his narrative about the body not being stolen no sir. Such as Matthew is the only gospel where the stone is still there when the women arrive at the tomb, apparently to further eradicate any idea that perhaps someone snuck out the body right before they got there.
The version I really liked was that Joseph of Arimathea was unknown to the disciples, was a member of the Sanhedrin per later gospel accounts (just a "bouleutēs" which could be a council member or a senator in Mark), and was observed messing with Jesus's body. They would have had no idea what the man intended to do with the body, but suspected he was up to no good with it, and stole the body after he left the tomb. Because grave robbery was a CRIME punishable by death, the author of Matthew was kind enough to cover for them. This hinges on A) there being a tomb at all and B) Joseph of Arimithea being a real person, both highly-dubious claims. But if both of those are true, then stealing the body seems almost likely. This wouldn't have involved dogs eating his body, but I suspect you get that mixed up; if the body had been left on the cross, which was typical of political executions, then it would have been eaten by wild animals. I don't know of a model that involves both stealing the body and having it eaten by animals; if it had been stolen, the most likely scenario would be that they would have buried it. So I expect that Crossan offered alternate scenarios, and you've conflated them into one. But I didn't see it, so maybe he really did assert both at the same time.
I'm sorry but the more I watch this video, I can't help but cringe on the UCC's stance on almost everything they believe. 😬
An excellent summation of the UCC!
I have found some people desire the sense of community and belonging being a member of a church brings, but have little/no interest in faith or religion. Those people tend to be pretty happy being part of a UCC church. I don't know why they don't just drop the pretense and label themselves as a community organization first and foremost. I think membership rates would improve if they did that.
It's the same as with the Unitarian Universalists: they want the "social" of religion without the doctrines that make a religion a religion.
Because they believe in the teachings of Jesus, and they enjoy the traditions .
@@miss_naomi7377 in Mark 10:5-11, Jesus is pretty darned explicit that *man is to "join" with woman* and that divorce+ remarriage is adultery.
I'm pretty skeptical that those gay-celebrating UCC people believe that part.
For tax reasons, if we are being generous.
27:50 - You just pronounced "Tripoli" correctly and honestly, that's the only real positive thing I heard in the video.
Thank you for this deep dive. I wonder just how many people don't really realize what their church believes.
How long do I microwave my popcorn?
Haha so witty and above it all so funny everyone likes you
2:30 and then stop it at 0:17
until there is 1-2 seconds between pops.
If you have a real popcorn button, just hit it. If the popcorn button asks for the weight of your package, wait until 1-2 seconds between pops.
This denomination is finally a place where I would belong.
Christians? Or apostates?
Have you done a video explaining the difference between the Mormon sects?
I say this as respectfully as possible. I pray that the Lord would give honest souls the courage and strength to separate themselves from these synagogues of Satan
Matt. 7:5
@@lavieestlenfer My friend, openly rejecting the resurrection of Christ as well as the virgin birth is outright denying the divinity of Christ. If we do not call out blasphemy, then we fail to do the work of the Lord.
I encourage us to read Romans 16:17-18 together and ponder what Paul says!
May the Lord bless you!
God revealed to me that the UCC is His one true church. Proverbs 3:5-6
@@theethanatoremyour actually a bot you have posted this everywhere and it’s meaningless 😭
I drive past this building every day on my way to church!!
It remain hilarious how rationalists reject the "talking snake", whilst "The Serpent" (ha-Nakhash, 'the shiny one') remains an ancient title for a sapient spirit-being who reigns as "the god over this world". They risk spending eons under that being's vile rulership in the underworld.
That’s some good stuff right there although I’d like to point out it actually means the “burning ones” in reference to the cobras venom, the seraphim, depicted in ancient Egypt as winged cobras. In all likelihood it’s a fallen angel speaking to Eve or at this time she may have still just been called woman I think she was given the name eve after expulsion
Meh, nitpicking the word of God to justify their wrongdoings.
Are they not allowed to just simply have a different interpretation?
@@kyler7917No not really. We may not understand everything and it's why we study it. Often leads to different interpretations. In fact the Bible warns of its words being twisted to justify wrongdoings. Just because you may not like parts of hearings doesn't mean it didn't happen.
@@thealienrobotanthropologist you are lying to yourself if you believe you are not interpreting the Bible. The conflation of Theology and science is exactly why Christ is becoming irrelevant in society.
@@trilight3597 Many of these things have no material or observable harm associated today - just as we don't paint our door frames with lamb's blood anymore, there is no reason to obey old law with no current relevance. Christianity has no competitors to differentiate itself from to require them. Today, it's more important to eliminate superstition based on the ideals of 2000 years ago. We have to focus on the current as it exists, and not as it once was. God is here and now, and we MUST represent Christ to continue the current, not be nostalgic over the context of ancient holy books.
@@kyler7917how do we represent Christ in this age without proclaiming the Gospel? Christ warned about Hell and the need to be born again through the Spirit by repentance and faith. We would be doing Christ a disservice by ignoring His command to make disciples of Christ. Otherwise, their sin is still condemning them.
When my uncle immigrated to the USA, he really wanted to be an American in all things (this was his concept). So he grabbed a set of the Encyclopedia Americana and read all the volumes. He was trying to find out what was the most American of churches. He decided that it was the UCC and presented himself. In those days, he had to be voted in. I am not sure if this is the practise today, but he was accepted. I remember him telling me that he was on the board when the first African-American presented herself and he thought himself very enlightened by voting for her acceptance. Does anyone know if this is the practise today? It seems a bit out of step with the liberal theology. Incidentally, this happened not so long ago. It was probably in the 1970's and it occurred in Buffalo, NY.
Mainline Protestants / Theological Liberals are more into structural unity over theological unity.
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Ecumenical means interdenominational. All (theologically conservative) Evangelicals are and always have been ecumenical with each other, this is what differentiates Evangelicals from Fundamentalist within Theologically Conservative Protestant Christianity. On the topic of ecumenism, Evangelicals (Missional-Revivalist Evangelicals) more so than Mainline Protestants, have (almost always) had open communion with what most of them would describe as believing Christians across several denominations, denominational traditions, and independent non-denominational congregations (with very few exceptions within some Confessional Evangelical groups) even if they don’t have official full communion agreements on the books which most Mainline Protestants generally require because of their preferentially higher view of structural unity/church polity-governance over the concepts of “in essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; in all things, love” and “Primary and Secondary issues in Christian theology.” In other words while Evangelicals (Evangelicals proper - Revivalists) from the get-go have been very interdenominational/ecumenical and well known for open communion even though they’re theologically conservative while the Mainline Protestants are/were mostly closed communion with recent allowances through some official full communion agreements - they also happen to be largely theologically liberal. Evangelical believe in “in essentials unity, in nonessentials liberty, in all things charity” while Catholics, Orthodox, and Mormons (Mormons aren’t Christian but a separate Abrahamic religion like Islam or Rastafarianism) believe in the “one true church” doctrine. All Evangelicals, see themselves more as Christians first and their individual denominations second which especially makes sense when talking about Evangelicals because Evangelicals are an interdenominational/ecumenical community or movement who cooperate with each other and worship together due to largely similar theological beliefs but set boundaries because of distinctions or differences on issues of secondary and tertiary importance.
I like this story. God bless you, your uncle, and your family.
The UCC I worked with was congregational polity, so… some of them? Depends on the congregation.
@@Sebman1113 Thanks, I appreciate your comment. My uncle died 7 years ago, but his children, my cousins, live still mainly in the area.
@@Justanotherconsumer Thanks, do you mean in reference to voting in members?
I consider myself a fairly progressive type with not an especially hard line on Christianity, but this church has managed to transgress this line.
“Our faith is 2,000 years old” No it’s not lmao
You don’t remember reading that psalm prophesying the queer messiah in Sunday school?
My disdain for a denomination has never been higher.
What exactly are they worshipping in their services? Aside from themselves, I guess.
There's a UCC church near me that has been around so long they actually had Jonathan Edwards as their first pastor, albeit briefly. Same name, same location but I believe the church building was replaced sometime in the 19th century. Now proudly flying rainbow flags out front. The pastor is a man "married" to another man. From Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God to openly homosexual leading the faithful. Quite a ride from 1720 tp 2024, eh?
Edit: Turns out Edwards wasn't technically the first pastor. He lived in the town in 1723-4 The parish wasn't organized by the state of CT until 1725 and by then Edwards was back at Yale. (Congregationalism was the Established church in CT until 1820 or so).
they seem to be on the wrong side of every issue
Some of their churches are also members of the Unitarian Universalist Association (a bunch of ancient heresies revived). That's all you need to know about them.
I am always grateful for your even and fair coverage, but never so much as for this. Thank you.
When going down the wrong road, "progress" means turning around.
To to use another word repent
I'm a member of the ordinary churches of Christ, and this is the group people always think I'm part of
Interesting. I'm a member of the independent Christian churches and churches of Christ (very similar to Church of Christ, but with instrumental music in worship) and people always think I'm Mormon/Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints...
I am a Congregationalist. I was baptized at 52 years old. It was my choice. I wasn’t baptized as a baby. I also converted to Judaism before I had children. I spent 25 years as a Jew. This church fits me because of my own personal road choosing what works for me. Thank you for your respect.
A broad church traveling a broad road
I don't even consider the "progressive Christian" to even be Christian 🤨