Stihl MS500i Fuel Injection vs M-Tronic vs Standard carburetor... why I do a hybrid 500i build
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 มิ.ย. 2022
- There may very well be errors in what I say in this video and I honestly have been sitting on this video for a good while but I am completely dry on content so here it is... I will say some things people may disagree with and I may be mistaken when it comes to the "secret still EFI sauce"... but I am willing to put myself out there to get a real discussion going... it's how we learn... I really appreciate all the support and kind words guys... take it from me... never take your health for granted guys!!! I have been a lean mean machine my entire life not do much as a sore back and I got a genuine punch in the gut that has thrown me for a loop... just appreciate what you got good in your life 💯
Thanks for watching!!!
No John, You are just that Good at what Youre doing...Keep it going my Friend....Love My 500i...
Thanks John, info is good for a novice that does not own newer saws! Excellent explanation of how fuel delivery is achieved in each! Than you
I now know why my hot starts have been such an issue. 👍. Very solid information and thank you for sharing this.
Bless This video is what I love to see cause it’s excellent in just understanding what makes them tic. Keep ‘em coming. Thanks 😊
I still love my saw man runs like an absolute unit and impresses everyone on any job I’ve been on
This information is helpful to someone like myself who works production and works on their own saws. 👍
Great video, thoroughly enjoyed it! 👍
Great video. Lots of information. I love my 500i...would love one of yours more I think.
Keep getting better, man. And when you're sick, don't worry about "staying relevant" .... We'll be here.
Very good info thank u so much for sharing it with us sir. Have a good weekend!.
Get better soon man. Love the content.
Awesome Info and explanations, Thank you
Always great videos feel better soon
Very good video, thanks for sharing!
Good idea!
First vid I’ve watched of yours in a while
Excel video and priceless information.thank you
Thank you so much for this. Perfect info.
Very interesting video!
Thank you!
Good stuff, I learned a few things. Get well soon.
made it to the end very interesting!
Thanks for the video, cool stuff. Pretty sure that’s a MAP (manifold absolute pressure sensor)/ Baro sensor, it’s got the o-ring and you can see the hole into the crankcase on the saw, and there’s wires on the back not a pickup.
Great info
Cool video. Get to feeling better soon.
Thanks, great video btw!
Good video buddy!!
Looks like fun thank s.
Great video
Interesting stuff, wish you were taking customers, you obviously have it figured out!
Great video!!! Keep it up please!!!!
GET WELL SOON MAN 🙏
Your videos are never boring you are very smart and knowledgeable person Who know what they are talking about thanks for sharing and spending time to put these videos everyone to view keep up the good work 👏👏
thank you - your explaining the other types was informative
the 500i is very similar to my Vortec in the my GMC - the brain box adjusts to what it wants
I do like the primer/purge valve as I see that would be a help. but on a car engine I turn on the power to let the pump run a bit before starting [that helps it on cold starts]
I had only thought the efi type saws would be similar and unless you reprogram that box, it will adjust things to what it is set for. [nice & easy when you replace the distributor (a car thing) ]
all these run great as long as you let the box do what it wants.
yes as long as you add a (chip or prgamme device you get to change it to your liking]
WOW your hybride build I see would be a great thing.
perhaps in time the stihl folks might change it up?
but I see the car engines havnt changed as that setup [box] allows for more error in their assembly.
so even a robot can slap those subpar parts in And the box makes it run in a way it is happy.
*That will make your builds necessary :)
great Job.
THANK YOU
I’m adhd too, so following every word 🤣👍🏾
... my brain just explode. Lmao I'll be building my first 500i here shortly. Totally looking fwd to it.
If I were to dig into the port timing. First would be deck height. (Back up) first would be getting the bearing to fit. Two ways. Use the 500i bearing with shim stock on each side. Or mill the 660 piston wider. Now back to deck height and doming the piston. Next would be scribing the piston through the intake and exhaust for additional piston work.
I would love to be your intern! You’re doing it John 🤘🏽
Like you, I've been a gear head from birth. I love this saw stuff! I wish I had the money to play around with some of the snowmobile tech that is working on modern 2 smokes. Stay rowdy and heal quick!
Nice. Thanks. I'm still with ya and Subscribed too. - N Idaho -
I have ONE QUESTION- HOW do mods affect LONGEVITY????
Im just building one watching this
Loved this video, tons of great info, one of your best videos yet thank you so much.
Hey John what’s the best way to get a hold of you if I want to purchase one of your 500i builds?
Me also I would love to own a frankinstine 500i
Great video. Technically the brain on this system is a ECM.
Added a second ignition pickup to a 2 stroke tugger a friend had for moving his airplane around. With an electric start it was easy to start it in either direction. ADHD is a great way to keep you working only on the projects you find interesting.
The benefits of adhd! For me ocd.yess.
Are there visible magnets in/on the crank lobe? I'm assuming the "crank sensor" is a hall effect sensor that keys off of magnets or possibly different density metals to tell the computer the position of the crank.
👍👍 wow
You should pick the brains/books on ole dirtbike 2 stroke mechanics, particularly the factory race mechanics, itd be awesome to see 450 4-stroke from a Honda Yamaha Suzuki race bike with a bar an chain fabricated together
would love to see a double cylinder 500i
Thank you for making this video. I learned more than any other video I’ve enjoyed watching in quite some time. Keep doing what you are doing. There is a lot of ignorance and confusion anytime something new or revolutionary comes to the masses. And as always has been the case this scares certain individuals and they can’t help themselves to act out in all the ways you have had to endure.
wiesco makes a pop up for the 500i, it's not a direct drop in unless they retooled it.
Amazing. This wouldn't cause a longevity issue would it? At this point what's the longest running saw with that longer piston? Almost feel with a stihl 660 piston what you're doing would almost last longer making the saw even better.
Hey John, are the 500I bearings from any of the older series saws?
My 500i was crushed with less than an hour on it. I worked at a dealership at the time and rebuilt it with one new crankcase half and most all the plastics. I learned a lot about the assembly of it. I also recalibrated it after I reassembled it.
So on the m-tronic saws, the H/L-solenoid is working real-time - adjusting every few milliseconds while cutting?
Quick question, I know the 500i has an auto tune. But I just picked up a west coast bark box, is there anything I need to do to get the most out if it?
The high idle drops with the trigger pull once on run..
Definitely a valuable video, for anyone wanting to hot up a 500i you've made a lot of the mistakes for them, and shared it, that's pretty generous, good on you 👍
I’m working in a MS661c and I cannot figure out why it goes ballistic after having started fine..idling good and then as soon as you squeeze the trigger, it goes full throttle by itself.
I have put in a new kit (solenoid, ignition and air filter) and tried doing a reset but I think it doesn’t do it right.
It goes through the 30-40 sec, then I squeeze the trigger all the way, then it goes down to a lower than the full throttle but not like I’ve seen in some videos. But I shut it down anyway then restart and it goes crazy fast. And that is what it was doing before the kit.
Do you know what is causing this?
Thank you for you videos.
John can my 261c be converted to a regular carburetor? Would otherarts need changed also? If possible to do can I get the part #s?
Very cool video ! The electrical on the 500i sounds like the automotive version of early OBD1 , I bet in the near future people will be putting wide band o2 sensors , writing tuning programs and selling for big $ and hacking that little ecm to adjust everything from injector pulse , ignition timing, and this and that to blow shit up......thanks again for making this and all your videos I for 1 enjoy all of them as a new subscriber
That crank position sensor looks like it's also a map sensor. You may want to try to use an microsquirt ecu and use turner studio to tune the saw. Get rid of the 500i ecu all together. And add coil and plug like on a 2 stroke dirtbike. The hardest part will be figuring out the parameters of of that crank position/map sensor.
Or maybe look at using a power commander
The stop switch is a combined ambient temp sensor, probably why it wouldn’t run
Ok TWO QUESTIONS!! When you blow up a saw.... What gives first? The rod? IE: what is the weakest link?????
How do I get you to do porting on my 500i. I just got a brand new one and I want to open her up. Please get back with me on the info
Would like to know how you deal with the needle bearing width. I mean there’s more then one way to skin a animal but would like to know what
You do. Think its cool that you share your stuff rather then hold secrets as that’s why your channel is cool. Plenty of show and gloat channels.
Hi John. I think it's about time all Saw's are fuel injected. Fuel injection motorcycles and snowmobiles 2 Strokes are amazing. The way the power comes on is totally different. It's new technology it's going to be interesting can't wait to see what's next. Fuel-injected husky Saks Dahmer or jonsered maybe Echo. Keep up the good work I love it!!!!👊💪👍
Nice video John. I suspect that because the 500i does not have a throttle position sensor it limits what one could do with a potentiameter unlike with injection systems on engines with a TPS. It is nuts how inconsistent the pistons are in these saws. I too have noticed the difference in the sound in Jack's 500i builds and yours as well. Have you run a 500i up to the rpm that you consider it 4 stroking for any length of time and then pulled and inspected the plug? I considered this theory in the testing I did with the 592xp, the plug was snow white in that saw when run that way limbing. My Stihl rep says the 500i works off the rev limiter, that at full throttle it runs up to the max rpm and corrects itself constantly. I would like to hear one of your hybrid saws run while limbing (something alot of users comment on), I suspect yours will run and sound different than a stock saw. I have noticed some saws are worse than others perhaps the inconsistentcy in the stock pistons and its effect on port timing is part of the issue, I don't believe it's the ECM myself I am glad it takes well to piston and cylinder mods. My tach does not read the 500i well, I need to get a different tach to be able to monitor the rpms in the 500i while limbing for example so I can better understand what is going on. Curious on your thoughts.
I hope stihl offers you a Job in their research & Engineering dep.
Wisco used to make a piston that would drop right in to the 660 back in the 80's to 9o's if I can find part numbers for standard and over size ( I have a 101cc 660 big bore ) I will post them to you here..
thanks for doing the blog, I'll be sticking with what I've got.
I haven't had a 500i in the shop yet but have had the ms 441 c in .there is 3 to 4 things that are a problem , 1 is , some dealers are not familliar with them and dont set them up for their customers, and there is a set up process that has to be done or they run like crap ! There is a very high vibration in them that will loosen the spark plugs , groove the top of the spark plug as well as grind out rubber on the spark plug boot !!!! I just pulled a plug a couple days ago on one and found the porcelain on the plug had totally came loose and was spinning around inside of the steel housing of the plug !!!! The saw was brought in for sharpening. This leads me to the last thing thats a problem, and i think most people like to fine tune the saw their self , but with the M- tronics it does it for you . But this is a problem in my opinion because it will compensate for these problems such as the plug coming out ( but still by or in the hole ) the porcelain vibrating loose , and the saw still runs ! I had to heli coil two spark plug holes , and if the porcelain had broke or shattered , you could kiss that motor goodbye! Power is no problem, but there is definitely a problem with the saw as far as the high vibration.
hello
a want to ask you if you know sthil 362 piston she work on husqvarna 455.
she have same 47 mm piston.
can you do video.
thank you.
Sup bro glad to hear some knowledge getting dropped out by yourself the man the myth the legend 👊🏽🪓🪓🪓🪓🪓
Would welding on some extra steel on the crank counterweight advance timing? That way the sensor picks up the crank earlier in the rotation
Is it a waste of money to port and polish a 311 or 362 cm?
How much do you sell one of the monsters for :)
I have a 500i but no spark is it the coil?
Really want you to pimp my first 500i
stihl just call it " sensor " this is from parts diagram and workshop manual ,
😵💫😵💫😵💫
stihls so secretive about the 500i just like you are on porting
Wtf no autotune? Thanks for the old ass vid, good stuff... get better buddy
M tronic and autotune is more or less the same
I guess I'm at a loss as to what difference the length of the piston skirt makes.
I'm sorry but there are 2 magnets on the flywheel, why did you miss this?
😅😅
this dude said he made a 500i run backwards lmaoooooo
I want a 066 Stihl. Artic. Ported.yes.piped yes. 36 inch. 404 chain. Full comped. Yes sawdust citg. Give me four footers at the stump yes Husqvarna imjun ha ha 😊😊😊😊
Someone needs to Sponser Your work...
The 500i sounds like a nightmare; couldn't /wouldn't touch it. I'll stick to my old 034av super; does the job with no problems/hassles.
Ok we get it.
Good stuff, I learned a few things. Get well soon.