Panasonic x1500 x2000 CX10 Low Light at the Pier Rewiew
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ต.ค. 2024
- #hc-x1500 #cx10 #hc-x2000 #panasonic #camcorder
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Hi ROB, excellent insight review! What's the reference monitor ?
Thanks for the review. I found out setting the LCD Monitor Backlight to +2 makes a huge difference in the brightness, and works well, even on a bright sunny day. After watching your video, I considered an external monitor, but after checking settings, and adjusting the Backlight, it is quite usable, especially when trying to keep the smallest footprint.
Grazie Rob, segurò i tuoi preziosi consigli.
You're very welcome. Thank you for watching, and I hope the video helps you.
I'm starting a new live streaming a video company. I love my Panasonic gear and you give honest opinion and insight into a lot of the gear I'm seeing available used. Thanks for helping so much.
Happy to help. Good luck.
Thanks for doing this... I can't believe how little information and videos I find on this great camera. I have the x1500.
I'm glad you found it helpful.
Very thankfull with your honest video! I have one question, what or how is the thing called between your camera and the table? So your camera is not directly standing on the table.
Ps. I bought this camera today and i am totally new with this kind of ‘professional’ camera’s. Can you give me some advice for filming fireworks at daylight and eveninglight?
Thanks in advance!
I hope it serves you well, and thanks for your comment. The thing you asked about is called a monopod. It's helpful for stabilization, and not as stable as a tripod, but it's easier to carry around. Cheers!
hey! Do you notice a low back background noise (noisy preamp) when you plug in your mic into the 3.5 socket? It sounds more like cars on a highway from a distance. Even if just the cable is plugged into the socket (without the mic), i can hear this noise. Do you have the same problem?
November 2023 and considering this camcorder, your vids are very helpful. What about the IR option?
I haven't used the IR mode very much. From what I can tell, the camera does not have an IR flood light. However, it seems to do a good job at picking up IR from the environment. It can see in the "dark" without an external IR flood light. The footage is clear and detailed. It would likely do even better with an IR flood light.
hi, do you have any idea about about low light noise. I just bout this new camera cx10 but all my footage have too much noise. plz can you share your camera settings?
Yes, I can try to help. you need spill and ambient light in the scene. Stay as wide as possible with the lens. this will keep your aperture wide open. When you zoom, the aperture will close down darkening your image. Any gain boosted past 6Dbl is noticable, and past 15-18 it is mostly unusable. If im recording sometyhing on stage, i don't mid zooming in as long as the stage lights are bright enough to keep the scene lit. You can use the auto exposure feature to help keep your exposure bright while zooming. Just turn it on and set it up how you like it. I would suggest +1 stop. Also, use the shutter synchro scan feature, this will let you use a shiutter speed that matches your framerate. So choose 24 or 25 fps and choose suncro shutter at 24/25 fps. If you can add light.. add it. Cheers.
I need to replace my old Sony HD handy Cam and I'm considering a Panasonic WXF1K, X1500 or other. What would you recommend in the $800 to $1600 price range for an eighty-year-old nerd who wants to learn something new?
80-year-old-nerd. I hope I'm that lucky. I would buy used first of all. Then, I would decide if I wanted a camera or a camcorder. Very different applications between the two, and very different quality results. Generally, a camera is more useful because it'll fo photos and video.
If you decide on a camera, I would suggest an Olympus EM5iii, Panasonic G9, or Fujifilm XT2. All of them will have about the same photo AF, the Fujifilm will have the best low light capability, and the Panasonic will have the best video out of the bunch. Any one would be a great choice. I like the Olympus for so many other reasons, image quality is awesome with them all.
As for camcorder- I feel it's Panasonic all the way. With camcorders, size and sensor type go hand in hand. You want at least a 1/2" sensor. The Panasonic X1500/2000 have a 1/2.5" sensor which is a little smaller, but that's fine in all situations except low light. Then it becomes a struggle.
Camcorders are a bit more expensive for their price than cameras, so you will likely spend on the mid-top end of your budget for a camcorder, but you would also need to buy a camera and lens, so it kind of equals out.
The X1500 series is a great small camcorder with a lot of features. You can go even smaller with Panasonic's WF980 series (which the 1500/2000 built upon). It gets a lot smaller and becomes more of a palm corder than a small camcorder.
I would also consider the Canon XA series, Luke the 60, 50, 70.. all of these are 1/2" sensors. They sit between the size of the Panasonic x1500 and the Panasonic AGCx350/HCX2 and HCX20. All of those are 1" cameras. Moving to the Xanon XA65/75 series will bump up the sensor to a 1" sensor while keeping the body pretty much the same size.
I think Panasonic gives a better value than Canon. Again, buy used to save money and get into a better camera bracket. Good luck and let me know how it goes.
@@RobertHamm I have a nice Nikon camera that works well and I'd like to go with a camcorder for the convenience of not having to carry extra lenses. One additional question, what do you think of the Sony AX700 now that it's being sold for $1,400 ($500 discount).
It's a good camcorder with solid performance that still holds up today. Being several sensor generations old, I feel like it's a lot of money for fewer benefits.
The lens is only 12x optical, an HCX1 of the same generation of sensors and camcorder era is 20x optical. The frame rate in 4k is only up to 30fps, while the HCX1 is 60fps. The bitrate is 8bit 420 internal at 100mbps max in XAVCs, while the HCX1 is 150Mbps 420 internal and 422 external (both 8bit). Iage quality is handily on the side of the HCX1 in this case, although the Sony has a much better LCD than the HCX1. The Sony is also about 1/3 smaller.
Given those choices, for the couple of hundred dollars more on the HCX1, it would be a better value depending on your use case. The HCX1 can be has between 16-1800 USD in good condition. However, the AX700 won't let you down.
When I had the choice between the two, I choose the Panasonic HCX1.
But the real question is are you willing to spend just a little more and get a 1" newer/current generation sensor. 10bit is a big deal with color, but the newer chips are much better in low light than older generations. That's where I think the biggest question hides. If you want an easier time with low light, get a newer sensor. Otherwise, save the money and work within the lighting conditions given and the constraints of an older chip.
The only thing that really matters is that you enjoy what you're doing. Any of the options I have discussed, and you have seen while researching this decision will provide a great image. There is almost no way to buy a bad camera/camcorder made within the past 7/8 years or newer. Cheers.
Solid review. Beautiful footage from the beach. I've read reviews where people ssy this is absolutely terrible in low light, but I think they are probably boosting gain and not paying attention to aperture and shutter settings. Your video and some others I've seen look pretty good in low light situations
Hi Michael, thanks for your comment. I have a hard time wrapping my head around how good this camera is in low light when I think about the sensor size. It shouldn't perform as well as it does. At least that's what I tell myslef. Of course the low light performance is not anywhere close to that of full frame... but... looking at the footage from this video, and in all my testing, it's not bad at all. I believe the key is in the set-up. If you pay attention to your settings, your footage will turn out great.
Panasonic is also doing some good thigs with the lens- it's an f1.9 at the wide end. So, if you don't zoom, then you are using a pretty bright aperture for low light. When thinking about it that way, it's not so different than using a prime 1.8 lens for photogaphy. Even at f4, it's not horrible. I use an f4 70-200 for reception shots often annd the images come out great. Yes, the sensor size plays a role, and if you were comparing the sensors you would want to convert the crop to full frame to see the physical differences, but the lens designed for the camera is an f1.9-4, and on that camera it performs as such. I also believe that the sensor is a dual ISO sensor. My tests show two different responses at the 18dB mark. Below it and it performs like you would expect. Above it and it performs like the Gain is set to a higher base sensitivity. This is complete speculation, and Panasonic hasn't stated this, but I am noticing some difference in the image past the 18dB mark.
I think the last part to getting good low light video is knowing the scene and staying within the look you wnat for the capabilities of the camera. Sunsets, carnivals, busy town streets all seem to be good settings for this camera. Probably because of the abundant spill light. Maybe a night forrest scene wouldn't do so well. And don't forget you can always use a denoiser like neat video. I didn't apply any noise reduction in that video, but imagine the posabilities.
It's a great camera. I have been shooting a piece for a local go-kart park and did some dusk to night shooting and it was beautiful. this is just a good all around camera. It isn't good with bokeh, but thats fine by me.
Cheers.
@@RobertHamm Thank you again for your video and thanks for the reply. This camera may solve a problem I've been having shooting weddings which is having too much equipment to carry. Right now my main camera is a Sony a6400 and a 18-105mm f4 lens on a gimbal most of the day. But for the ceremony and early part of the reception I have a c100 markii with a 24-105mm on a tripod. The c100 markii is big and heavy and I much rather have a smaller camcorder for those shots but the ones I've used in the past are not that great in low light and some others i didn't like for other reasons. I might scoop this one up
I understand completely. When I switched to pro camcorders for my wedding ceremonies my live for instantly easier. You will immediately appreciate the 24x zoom, ease of use, and upgraded audio quality and inputs. The Panny records audio at 48k sample 24 bit data rate. It will remove the need for an external recorder (unless you need more than two channels).
I use the Sennheiser XSWD system with two wireless lavaliere microphones and one handheld mic as needed. I mic the Groom and Pastor and that is all ran through the Panny. When I need an additional wireless handheld mic I can use my zoom H6 and run all the mics into it and then send a line out to the Panny, or I can do plu add a splitter to one of the inputs (usually the groom) so that I can have three mics going into the two channels. I wouldn't suggest doing it that way all the time, but since the groom doesn't speak as much as the pastor, and any additional speakers won't be speaking at the same time as the groom, then it generally works out alright.
Good luck.
We bought 4 x1500 to record classes in well lit classrooms, they are garbage. We are using Logitech c920's instead which are way better in low light and cost 1/10th of the price (and lecturers can operate themselves.
We also use the X1500 side by side with two Pana's ag-cx350 for live events and the difference in noise level is ridiculous.
The four cameras are now in a closet because there is no use for them.
I have 22 years experience with film and video production, I went through every single setting of the camera to try and improve the image quality. There isn't a solution.
It's either heavy noise reduction or a lot of noise except filming under sunlight.
The images in the video above have A LOT of NR going on, looks almost cartoonish.
@@ioliveira You may not like the video but you are dead wrong about the noise reduction. I did not use any noise reduction. None in post and that the standard setting for the spark profile. I used the settings exactly as explained in the video. I further showed the edit process using LumaFusion on an iPad pro. Again- no noise reduction.
If you really have 22 years of video production experience and have actually used these cameras, then you should be able to get the results I get when in a similar situation. If not, then it's probably not the camera.
Many Thanks, Robert, my Bro!! :)
You are very welcome
How does it compare to Sony RX10, will both of them going to have successors soon at maybe CES 2024 since it's about 4 years of release for both of them
A bigger sensor will always let in more light in low light situations. Smaller sensors usually offer longer zooms in a similar or smaller package. The reality is you can't buy a bad camera/camcorder today. You are simply buying different features and ergonomics. You could buy a camcorder that is 8years old, save some money, and be happy with the output in most cases. So, in this instance, if you want photos and video, go with the Song. If you want to focus on video and in a video formfactor, choose the Panasonic. Cheers.
How does the DB setting work is that like ISO? Also what picture profiles are available and any idea what is the Max Dynamic range on this camera? This Video is a year old, do you still feel good about this camera :)
Yes, video cameras express sensitivity to light in Decibels while cameras express this sensitivity as ISO. That's an old standard from physical film days, but it works as a basis of comparison within camera brands. It has become less of a standard today as compared to print film days. I would say that the max dynamic range of this camera in the flattest profile is around 12-12.5 stops. Maybe 13max, but that's not how anyone should approach this camera. The small sensor means you must make compromises. However, those compromises look a lot larger on paper than in real world experience. Camcorders are niche tools, and this one is especially so. Low light.. that is the big deal with this camera. I stand by my video and say that a careful user looking for ambient night scenes/sunsets will be happy using this camera if they understand spill and environmental light. If not, add external light via a torch.
As For use with people in low light (think a dark wedding reception), I would say a some trial and error would do most people well, but a videographer would understand the limitations and get the most out of it: don't zoom in low light, keep your aperture wide open, look for front lit subjects, avoid backlighting unless it's for an effect, find and use spill light, make the best use of environmental light, get your exposure as close as you can to perfect in the camera, don't rely on post production to make the shot brighter (the image will fall apart).
How do I feel about it today.. I love to hate the camera. The buttons still annoy me and I wish they had given it a little larger sensor, BUT I love this camera. I love its size, portability, image quality, even in low light, and I love the audio controls and inputs. The camera is a great camera and I'm tough on it.. but it's tough love. I really do hate the buttons, though. I hope this helps.
Hi Robert, at which level did you set the NOISE REDUCTION CONTROL on profile scene?
Hello. I left the noise reduction on the default settings for the camera profile of the recording. I was using the flat profile, I think that is CineD like on the camcorder. I believe the default settings for that profile is 0 or 1. I edited the files in LumaFuaion on the iPad. LumaFusion did not have noise correction as an option at the time of production. I did perform edits to the clip which you can see demonstrated in the video.
@@RobertHamm Did you use 0 DB?
All of the settings are listed as text on the video. Just give it a watch and you'll see. I believe I also talk about the settings while the video plays. So you'll hear and see everything about the video from edit to final and more.
14:37 - Minor slip up you made, actually by going from 1/48th shutter to 1/24th shutter you gain an entire stop of light (100% more exposure time per frame), not just 50% more light. I totally agree though, sometimes it's worth breaking the 180 degree rule :)
Yes. Good catch. I think I got my point across that dropping the shutter will give more light, but it is 100% more light, not 50%. Thanks.
I'm looking and filming outdoors more than indoors. Would you be able to tell me if this camera would be better than the Canon XA20? And keep in mind that I am not going to be filming in 4k. I film in mp4 1080p
Yes. The Panasonic would be better than the Canon XA20. That's a 9 year old camera, too. Technology has come such a far way.. it's not even about the technology of the sensor alone. The lens technology has improved. Everything about the Panasonic would be better. Good luck.
Great video. Thank you!
You're welcome.
камера снимает в LOG?
Hi Robert, how are you ?
Since I only follow YT and you have been away for a while I wondered, are you more into video nowadays or are these some experiences with some new gear.
How about the box camera, since you suddenly stopped updating on YT I am wondering, did it finish and was it to your satisfaction.
I have no sensible comment on this video about video camera's and the outcome cause I am not in that market but your comments sound solid.
But always nice to see some contribution from you side.
Have a nice weekend and catch you later.
Rob
Hey Rob. Thanks for the comment. TH-cam is an outlet that generates financial reward from views and marketing, even affiliate links. It also fosters a community setting and is a great way to share information. I have always thought about the content that I put on TH-cam and consider it mainly a photography channel. For me, photography and videography are one in the same. I have always created videos with my cameras for TH-cam and for clients. I also think of TH-cam as a way to share the business of a small photography studio owner or wedding photography business. So, my content generally revolves around those themes. Every now and again I like to put something different on my channel as a way to show my audience something they may never go looking for. Like the Ninja Foodi XL video. I made the video because I bought that oven and am really impressed with it. I put the Amazon affiliate links on it so that it will hopefully pay for the time producing the video, but mainly because affiliate links are better for SEO. At the same time, people will see that video at some point that aren't into photography, and maybe they will device to get into photography after viewing some of my other videos. As for the project, I have had some setbacks. Working on correcting them is what caused the majority of my absence posting videos. The absence of videos cost some TH-cam revenue. That didn't really matter until Covid hit my business, and that lost revenue from TH-cam and affiliate marketing really shown through. It's not much, but when you have 18 months of 90% of weddings cancelled, anything I'd better than nothing. It has been a costly couple of years. I'm not a video only channel, I'm just making videos about my experiences with the gear I use. Covid hit my business hard, very hard, and I had to adapt. I started working on live events, funerals at first, and then corporate video and weddings now. In order to do the job I wanted to do at the quality I wanted to give, I had to make some changes. The biggest change was from camera to camcorder. Everything became easier. So, the majority of my current content has been about live streaming, equipment, and camcorders. However, interspersed within that I have made a lot of videos about polaroid and instant cameras. So, it's kind of a mixed bag of what I post, but it all makes sense to me.
Cheers!
All profiles have default "NR Control" set to 0, which means there's still some noise reduction if you left it at 0 while you recorded your test footage in the Spark profile. NR Control goes from -7 (minimal noise reduction) to 7 for maximum noise reduction. However the camera really doesn't do much noise reduction until you hit around 18 dB of gain (as you noticed), then it starts becoming substantial. Overall the footage you shot looked really nice in low light (for the sensor size). It's a really good camera. I agree that the buttons are tiny and fiddly but the more I have used it, the more I've adapted to it :)
Thanks. Yeah. At 18Db the noise reduction really ramps up. Prior to that, even when noise is introduced the camera still records a lot of detail. It is impressive for the sensor size.
@@RobertHamm It's the best footage I've seen out of such a small sensor. I'm personally okay with AGC set to 12 dB, though I try to keep gain as low as possible of course :)
I recorded a bunch of clips with the HC-X2000 camcorder at the zoo, all handheld, full manual settings including fiddling with the tiny dial to control gain. Results aren't bad: th-cam.com/video/0RxWFH8QoR8/w-d-xo.html
Great video. I'm a long time GH5 user looking to shift over to camcorders, and found this helpful. I'm located in Chesapeake and would love to collaborate sometime.
Sounds good. Email me sometime.
The only benefits the camcorder will give you is all in one zoom lens, built in great audio controls, pretty good AF, and a form factor better suited for video. Those are big considerations and advantages but also are best suited for specific needs. The GH5 is fills many more roles. You will loose the low light capap ility, ability to change lenses, more codecs, and high output to a recorder (like ninja 5), and photography. Those are big advantages.
I believe the real consideration is between long zooms on the camcorder, and low light capability of the camera. GH5 is great at low light compared to a 1" sensor camcorder but has relatively short focal lengths compared to the camcorder. A camcorder will let you zoom to around 400-600 mm equivalent, but at the expense of low light performance.
Good luck.
Could you compare it to CX350?
I don't have that on hand so I wouldn't want to talk about it without using it. But maybe some other 10bit camcorder. I'm currently looking at the JVC GY-HC500u. Less money, similar features, more codec's and... check this out... face detect autofocus even in manual mode. Something that Panny doesn't have except for in full auto mode. So, stay tuned and you'll know as soon as I know what's next. Cheers.
@@RobertHamm cool, thanks!
@@RobertHamm Thanks for pointing at the JVC - did not have it on my radar before.
7:33 That is a deal breaker, sure for a wide audience/customer base. Since you are a Panasonic shooter and you never ever experienced any even remotely decent AF from your cameras, I think you can live with that. No 10-bit to me can compensate excellent autofocus. Canon recently released its $4500 camera the XF605, it has brilliant autofocus, 1" sensor and 10-bit, but there you have to pay big money. It's too hefty price, and the bulk of that camera is humongous, so I think the Sony AX700/NX80/Z90 is the sweet spot, they are in the same price range as the X1500/X2000/CX10 but all have1" sensor, fantastic touch to track video AF with phase detect, and LOG recording. My experience is 8-bit HLG and LOG gives about the same result as 10-bit no log as for dynamic range. 10-bit video editing is not supported by any free editor while 8-bit log is.
Thank's, but you have it wrong. I'm not a Panasonic shooter. I'm not a sony shooter. I have used all the brands over the years. I have experienced excellent autofocus, generally from sony. For my line of work. Panasonic fits in just fine. I have also found that on the previouus generation of Panasonic Camcorders, the AF worked great. This generation of AF is a little different. That's what I was talking about here. Phase detect would help Panasonic, but the AF is not a readon to discount any camera, let alone Panasonic. Plus, there are many benefits of the smaller sensor size. Zero jello, longer 35mm zoom equivelant (i get 600m before eveen thinking about intelligent zoom which gets me to 900mm in 4k and 1200mm in 1080p. Search the channel for my shots of the moon with this camera and the HCX1, you wont find anything like that in the Sony range), and those are just a few benefits. I didn't even mention that the video wig with this camer is on a Crane 3s with fly by wire zoom and focus. That's one hell of a filmmaking package right there. Plus I can live stream directly from the camera over my cellphone if I want. I believe in a tool for the job. The Panasonic camcorder does great for what it was designed. I like it for that reason. Cheers.
10:12 I believe you, but I simply cannot believe this giga error was implemented in this camera by the engineers of a company that has enormous reputation in video camera manufacturing. The consumer/prosumer Sony AX100 from 2014 has absolutely fantastic buttons and operability for exposure settings: so, freaking great, that I simply don't understand where the hell those excellent engineers disappeared from Sony, because the menu system, the screen UI from Sony made after 2014 in the Alpha line mirrorless cameras are total crap, I know I have three of them. Maybe the same happened to Panasonic, too.
Yeah, it's disapointing that Panasonic didn't impliment the entire button layout better (from menue to tactile feel) better with this series of cameras. I have made an updated video where I talk about all that.
6:40 Here you are totally right X1500 has the lowest quality EVF possible today. Pretty darn unusable, but this camera is not alone: Canon GX10, XA50 both has exactly this crappy small EVF. The consumer Panasonic VXF1 has exactly the same EVF. It's a shame the all mirrorless cameras have much better EVFs even the Sony A6xxx cameras.
5:56 interesting that you mention that the screen is not bright. The only thing that shines on this camera is the screen, it is a 3.5" 2.76M panel. The more expensive Canon XA10 has only a 3" 0.46M total crap screen. Even the excellent Sony Z90 has only 1.5M on its 3.5" screen. No cameras of this style have better screen. DSLRs/Mirrorless (Especially Sony/Canon/Nikon/Fuji) cameras cannot come even close. Only Blackmagic cameras have better screens. I just wanted to put this screen thing into perspective. I love your videos, anyhow.
Thanks for another comment. Yes, the screen has a nice resolution, but it isn't bright enoiuugh for me in live streaming a wedding on the beach in the July sun. It's better that most, but I think Panasonic should have done more. As much as I like it the camera still has a small for its class sensor. I understand the reason for this, it has benefits. So, since they are selling a small sensor camera at a premium price... north of 2500 for the CX10, I just feel like they should have done a lot more with the build and components. I would kabe liked some backlit buttons, a brighter screen buttons that are more tactile, a proper 3 ring setup, or a better feel to the rings it has, and maybe some ruberization of the most touched parts. Cheers.
How about a real low light review, i.e. after sunset?
How about really watching the video, i.e. watch the sunset?