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Where do you think Northrop came up with the XB-35 and YB-49 flying wing bombers, but like it is said in many comments the German flying wing was not a bomber but a fighter
@@SpaceyMonkey75 He actually had a large collection of artwork and museum pieces, one of the things he owned was an old Fokker D.VII which was one of the aircraft he flew in WWI. He was too fat to fit in it by the time of the Nazi regime.
NOT THIS CR*P AGAIN ! The Ho IX (Gotha 229) was a fighter design. V1 buried itself in the ground after one engine failed, and (due to lack of a tailfin) went into a flat spin due to asymmetric thrust. V2 was set on fire to avoid capture, and V3 was captured incomplete. Northrop couldn't have studied the wing planform from this prototype, because they were never fitted. Horten designs were Ho (Roman numeral), and went up to XVIII - most never left the drawing-board. V(ersuchs) is German for prototype, Arabic numerals were ALWAYS used for this. The Horten brothers sought aerodynamic efficiency (like every other flying wing in History) stealth being unknown at the time. Oh, and MK stands for Maschinkannone, (cf. MG/Maschingewehr = Machinegun) NOT mark. I don't expect you to learn German, but please do enough research to avoid such basic errors.
The fatal flaw of flying wings was that the nearer they came to supersonic speeds the more unstable they became. Computer assisted flying overcame that problem years later.
Lack of a empennage was the main cause of instability at high speeds, took many years to come up with computers that could compensate for these issues. Same reason the XB-35 and YB-49 failed, to early for their time. The F-117 nighthawk was the first A/C to address the instability issues, otherwise the hopeless diamond would have never been successful
@@timwhitten9918 hmm what ? ever heard of dassault mirage plane ? first one in production was in 1956... all those dassault aircrafts were /are tailless delta wing. or are we saying delta tailless aircraft are not flying wings because for all purposes they sure seem to be... certainly more of a lfying wing than the f117
@@bschwand None of the Mirages are tailless. They all have rudders. By your definition, all delta wing cars aircraft would be considered “ tailless”. F-92,F-102,F-106, F4D, F6D, B-58, SAAB Draken,,SAAB Viggen. The list goes on. None of these are thought of as tailless nor flying wings. A flying wing may have a rudder (B-35/B-49) but does not have a fuselage. The cockpit is built into the leading edge of the wing.
Disclaimer: the Ho 229 was not stealth, nor a bomber, it was an interceptor. Also there is insufficient evidence that the Northrop company had knowledge of the plane while they were building the B-2. There was a much larger bomber version called the Horton XVIII, but as that drawn up in early 1945 it never left the chalkboard.
Viewers who don't know their flying wings might not realize that a lot of the footage is of the Northrop XB-49, a *much* larger aircraft produced after the war. It was nice to see some footage of Horton wings, though.
Don't forget the Horten HO 228 jet fighter built by the Gotha Wagenfabrik. One of the soldiers taking part in salvaging the Roswell UFO in July, 1947, said that it looked like one of the new jet aircraft he had seen in Germany after the war. It could have been this one. V meaning Versuch, meaning experimental.
Although Berlin Tempelhof housed a plane factory in the cellars, the Horten brothers developed their planes near the Gothaer Waggonfabrik at Gotha. I've visited the smal airfield years ago. There isn't much left of the facility, but knowing that these mysterious planes were build and tested there, felt very special. After being hidden for decades, the HO 229 is on display in the main hall. It's a shame the wings aren't attached. Let's hope they will after restoration. Thanks for the video.
I first found out about this plane as a kid playing on my grandmothers 486 PC. While visiting she bought me “Secret Weapons of the Luftwaffe”. Good game and it’s game manual offered a lot of history and phots on the planes in the game. The Horton 229 became my favorite.
@@mozworthy 💯 Man, that manual was FANTASTIC. Easily worth the money all by itself. I once found it in PDF format and printed a looseleaf backup copy. Pretty sure I still have it in a thick binder somewhere.
This craft was not designed for stealth, however in today's parlance, it could be considered as such. Further, any airfoil has parasitic drag. That is the function of reality. To suggest it has no drag is ridiculous. It, at best, had greatly reduced drag, due to the absence of fuselage and empennage.
@@brokencreationlordmegatrol3037 You mean the Northrop Stealth Experts and they said it was Stealthy and 'Hello' a Flying Wing shape is stealth by the nature of it's shape.
If it was German, mysterious, and had a connection with nazis, it was a war-winning-wonder-weapon. If the nazis had a new design for a spatula we're supposed to thank God on bended knee that it never went into full scale production.
Lmao yeah. They started a war they couldn’t win and were just slapping shit together at the end, led by their mad tyrant of a fuhrer. Stupid reformer bullshit after the war leads people to believe this sort of nonsense, that they were somehow on the cusp of amazing futuristic weapons that would somehow have “won the war.” Never mind the US had not only equal or better equipment, but also had the ultimate weapon, the fucking nuclear bomb.
@@krazytroutcatcher I will, right after YOU point out where I said anything anywhere was saved. Or would you just like to admit straw men aren't your thing, and save some effort?
Russell Lee, chair of the Aeronautics Department at the National Air and Space Museum, reckons the Hortons knew this would never really work, but it looked and sounded cool, so the Reich Ministries kept giving them money to develop it, with the main effect being that the Hortons, and their workers, were kept in Germany instead of being sent to the Eastern Front.
Horten Brothers said it would of worked and the US used it's Jet Engines hidden in the Fuselage idea into the B2 Stealth Bomber. End of the day it worked as the B2 Stealth Bomber proves it.
It definitely has reduced radar cross section, and with the more primitive radar of the day it could have been classified as stealth. Semantics are fun aren't they.
The Northrop Grumman engineers that worked on the B-2 and F-35 test pilots made a a documentary about this and the conclusion of as that it was the first stealth plane and was 30 years ahead of his team and that was an inspiration for the B-2
@@spyran5839 yet they were motivated by Wolfram's death over Dunkirk which they blamed on British radar reaching across the channel. That damned machine, recapitulated today, has the radar image of a very small vehicle. I think some conclusions though not stated, might be considered obvious.
The shape of the aircraft had a naturally radar minimized return. Why do you think the B2 has no vertical stabilizer? The Horton flying wing is a well known predecessor of the B2. It’s common knowledge. Debunking is often a silly game
@@Odin197188 And yet surely the YB-49 and similar American designs, coincidentally, by the same company that manufactured the B2 was the true predecessor of the B2. Also while I can't confirm it it was said in the laserpig video that the Ho 229 design was tested by Northrop and and found to not be very stealthy. More so than other aircraft of the time due to its shape, but still likely to have been picked up on the British radar of the time, so if that isn't true, could you disprove that for me?
At about 7:15 we can see a Northrop YB-40 that flew for the first time on 22 October 1947 in Hawthorne California, USA. It is really misleading to show the YB-49 flying when talking about the Ho 229. These two types had nothing to do which each other!
Both are Flying Wings so had that in Common. The Germans had Jet Engines first and Northrop used old school prop engines, Germans were way advance back then for sure with there Jet Engines in a Flying Wing.
There’s an anecdote in Chuck Yeagers autobiography regarding Northrop's flying wing which was testing at Muroc, the test pilot was so fed up with repeatedly crashing due to various faults, the last time he did so he tried to stop the fire service from putting out the flaming wreckage.
Why does everyone keep talking about the Horten Bros. like they invented the flying wing? Everyone knows that Jack Northrop began his first flying wing prototypes in the early 1920's, and the YB-35 was ready to fly only a couple years after WWII. With exception to the failed turbine wing they tried to build, the Northrop YB-35 aircraft was far more advanced than anything the Horten Bros were working on. The Horten Bros. had virtually nothing to do with advanced flying wing designs that actually made it into production. In fact, it was called the YB-35, because Jack Northrop has the initial designs of it completed in 1935. Long before the Horten Bros. had anything remotely close to Northrop's designs.
@@flybobbie1449 Flying wings still experience drag, thrust-drag and lift-weight are constants in aircraft. Just because it looks funny doesn't change anything.
yeah you gotta take Dark Docs with a grain of salt... lots of incorrect pics, specs, information, blah blah... I wouldnt use these videos as hard facts on a research paper LOL!
@@chriscarbaugh3936 say what you will about Goering's weight, but the German leaders were all hardcore, combat hardened vets. Even Hitler. No draft dodging cowards there. All had been there and knew what their troops were dealing with. Their leaders led from the front. Its one of the contributors to what made their military so tough.
The aircraft is no longer at the Garber Restoration Center (which was closed) but was moved to the Smithsonian's National Air and Space Museum Udvar-Hazy Center in Chantilly VA.
I was just there and saw the V3 sitting covered under a thin plastic sheet. The wings were right behind it. As of July 2022 it’s sitting just behind the AR234 and the Arrow.
The stealth part was not in any period correspondence. It was mentioned in the 80s by the designer to make it seem better. Northrop had developed the flying wing independently and for the same reasons, as had a British engineer. If stealth was a reason, the air intakes would need to be buried deeper in the fuselage. That's basic design criteria. As far as the "Amerika Bomber", the capabilities of the mentioned He-177 should give a good indication of the technical feasibility of that, let alone the tactical impossibility of it. Really interesting aircraft, but way over hyped.
Northrop did build a full scale mock-up of the aircraft to the wartime specs and tested its radar signature it found it was partially stealth up until a a close distance away from the radar system. The mock-up was even given to the Smithsonian museum afterwards if I remember right. I do agree that the airplane was not completely stealth but it was still a world first at the time
@@skylerfox7663 kinda They built a mock up And it was sorta to specs, a lot of materials were changed due to cost/availability. Yes it did have a lower RCS, but so would the flying flapjack if it was made of wood, or numerous other examples that predate the Hortens. One of the "drawbacks" of the B-49, long before a thorough study of WW2 stuff could have been done was a low RCS. The wood was to save on aluminum due to Germany not doing so well, not unlike the He-162. The flying wing was because that's what the Hortens did. It was considered due to the range/ payload advantage of a flying wing. Like I said RCS was not mentioned in period documents about it. The reduced RCS is from the side, same as any other flying wing. From the front, those exposed intakes are as visible as any other jet of the period. Kinda important for attack vectors. And since range was of paramount importance, coming in at an oblique would be tactically irrelevant, if it was even feasible. For the Amerika Bomber, almost laughable as an argument.
@@AlexMarciniszyn-y1k umm Never said it was Just the He-177 was a "flying coffin" according to the pilots that flew it. Given the problems of the one 4 engine bomber the Germans managed to actually produce, the concept of the Amerika Bomber actually working is absurd
I've been to the Garber facility and have seen this aircraft. It's in several crates in the corner of one of the warehouses. I recommend a tour of this facility because you can interact with the people doing thecresteration work.
It's where the air and space museum restore it's aircraft. . It's in Washington dc but may be outside in Virginia. To me way more interesting than the air and space be museum.
Got up close to the 229 at Garber in 1996. The Garber facility is the hidden gem of Air and Space Museum. It is where all of the restoration work is done. They have a very limited tour schedule. Was there visiting an old friend, the little Windecker composite plane that my father had time with an helped donate to Smithsonian.
@@billveitch2100 Goering had 22 aerial victories, although there is some doubt about 2 of them ( kinda like "The Blue Max") but it was enough to get the "pour le Merite".
@@larryenglander8735 yeah there was a fire sometime in the 80's and lost some truly one of a kind aircraft, but after that fire, the area was rebuilt and the museum is currently in the old Ford building. This building allows for a larger area to display aircraft, as well as teach the history of aviation. They also have an annex over by Gillespie field where they have the workshop to repair other aircraft in thier collection and to display some aircraft and pieces that wouldn't fit in the current layout. Such as a Ryan Vertijet and an S-3 Viking that was used by Nasa.
@@666theninja a full size test was conducted by the US to see if the 229 was truly stealth or not. It did not have any stealth characteristics of any kind and was seen to be its original size on radar.
The larger prototype was bomber, capable to fly straight to USA from Germany. The smaller one was fighter. It also was stealth, this has been confirmed by engineers, they build the damn thing and tested it with modern radars. There are always prototypes before the produced jet, it was close to come to production. Not that it would have changed anything at that point anymore though.
@@duhni4551 the stealth was a side effect of building the plane out of wood and not a design feature and we are talking abt the 229 not abt other prototype cus the 229 actually flew and was tested and was closer to production, even if the bomber could fly to the us. germany wouldn't be able to build enough to make a difference
It wasn't a bomber, it was a fighter with serious stability problems and it's engine placement would have ruined its stealth characteristics It could be flown by a skilled pilot for test flights but in actual combat it would kill more of its pilots than it would enemy pilots
Agreed. But there are loads of TH-cam video makers who know excellent click-bait when they see it. And loads of closet Nazis who want to believe this nonsense.
At that time steathl was not a point Radar performances were so poor... Airborne radars range was about the same as the visual range. And also the screens were two osciloscopes the operator had to compute in his head... The ground stations were also poor.
In 1992, the center section of the Horten, was stored at Silver Hill, near the Arado AR 234, and the Convair POGO VTOL Fighter. At the very same time, JFK's Convair 240 sat along side that very same storage building/hangar. The Arado was awaiting Plexiglass work, but was very close to being completely restored, sadly, POGO and Caroline are apparently still in storage. I provided engineering support to an avionics manufacturer, who, at the time, donated restorative services for some of the avionics for the Enola Gay, and bummed a ride to Garber for one of the trips where instruments were hand carried back to Garber, and different instruments were taken back to Pennsylvania for cosmetic restoration.
Yeah, back in the day the channel was decent, but now it feels like he chooses material based on how clickbait it sounds and does the bare minimum of research to scrape by.
@@paulgeorge7557 the two that flew were an unarmed prototype and a glider. it was schemed up to be a fighter-bomber but never performed such actions. The rest were captured in production, so don’t even consider the V3 which I assume you’re familiar with
Ho 229 had 2 30mm cannons. It was a fighter...well interceptor...designed to destroy Bombers. The bomber...the Ho 18....would have been able to bomb the Eastern Seaboard of the US from Europe. And if the allies had not focused on wrecking the Norwegian Heavy Water facility...the Germans could have had a working Atomic Weapon in 1944. And combined with the A-9/A-10 2 stage first ever ICBM...New York, Washington DC, Philladelphia....joining London, Paris, Moscow, Leningrad, Stalingrad, Rome, Brussells, Amsterdam, Antwerp, Calais, Prague, Vienna, Kyiv, Sevastopol...probably Gibraltar, Alexandria, Malta...and if things went the way they did, Remagen, Arnhem, Warsaw,, Danzig, Strassborg and Berlin..would be radioactive wastelands.
In recent times a mock up of the HO229 was built to determine it's radar signature. The design was tested on the WWII radar technology level. The radar signature was much less. It could be detected but not as far away as conventional aircraft. The Germans had already began attacking England by flying low and fast across the channel to keep radar detection limited. The HO229 flying low and fast would be detected only a few minutes before crossing the English coastline. This would have been too early for the RAF to scramble fighters and intercept the HO229. The HO229 would be gone back across the channel before the fighters could get to them. The HO229 was to be configured as a ground attack aircraft as well as bomber interceptor. The English coastline facilities like radar stations would have been vulnerable.
@@JohnnyAFG81 this is actually false. according to the us airforce, after ww2 they were able to obtain the schematics of the ho229 and build a their own mock up for testing. some things to note about the mock up, it was made with both wood and steel. this made it more "stealthy" than the original design as if it were build fully out of wood, the radar signature would have been higher. the orginial designed also called for the aircraft to be coated in a charcoal based "radar absorbant" layer. when the mock up was fully built, they tested it and found that, in terms of radar signature, it provided no additional stealth compared to other aircraft at the time. however, it was here that the us realized to potential for the flying wing design as it was more efficent than other aircraft of its time. the idea that the h0229 was a steal aircraft simply stems from the fact that it looks like b2
@@patrickstewart3446England was the proposed target for the HO 229. The design call did not come out until sometime in 1943. The design specs called for a 2,200 lb load, a range of over 620 miles at 620 mph and a ceiling of 49,000 feet. The first prototype was flown as a glider in March 1944. A jet engine version flew in December 1944. The Horton brothers during the prototype trails had been diverted into the Amerika bomber program to build a large flying wing jet bomber that could bomb the east coast of the united states. Diverting them to this project was part of Hitlers dream of bombing New York City. If they had the resources to push the design progress or had announced the design call earlier they would have had a working semi-stealth jet fighter bomber.
Our version of this aircraft was the YB-35 in 1943 and later the YB-49 that was jet powered. Pilot Edwards, crashed the last YB-49 in an area now known as Edwards Air Force base.
I wouldn't go that far. The aerodynamic shape of the Horten suggests it had a smaller radar cross section than the Mosquito. Also, the plan was to use charcoal in the Horton's plywood to make it radar-absorbing. How well that would've worked in practice is unclear, but it wouldn't have hurt either.
@@peabase There is nothing to charcoal that absorbs radar. The maker of the Ho-229 likely just said that because the US stealth bombers were black and the only black thing he could think of was charcoal
Always the brit who has to comment on the "underrated" Mosquito in every god damn video involving ww2 aviation. Give it a rest for fuck's sake mate. What you said is shite anyway, one has a vertical stabilizer, the other doesn't. Shape determines RCS far more than materials.
the lack of vertical surfaces alone would have objectively reduced the aircrafts RCS, even against low-frequency radars. dont believe everything meme-lords tell you on TH-cam...
@@wyrmshadow4374 no, like the lack of vertical surfaces that would have objectively reduced the aircrafts RCS...exactly as i said. the "S-shaped inlets" that youre trying to insinuate is somehow the only, or even the most important, aspect of stealth, came afterwards.
"the American had almost seized western Germany" Um, so the British, French, Canadian, and other forces don't count in the liberation of Europe?? Ye gods, for a history channel that's bloody stupid not to mention incredibly insulting.
Yeah as an American, it’s historically inaccurate to not think other countries were there or participated. Almost as foolish as thinking a POS nazi wood plane would hold up to jet power!
"Drag was practically non existent" Huh!😅 this is a nonsense statement. Yes there is no fuselage drag but a wing still comes with significant drag which is the cost of creating lift.
5:20 Hermann Göring was not a WW2 ace pilot, but a WW1 ace pilot. I don't think he'd fit inside the cockpits of either a Me109 or a Fw190, even if he tried!
This has to be the most over-hyped German "what if" plane of the war, and no, Northrop did not copy this to build the YB 35. Jack Northrop had been working on flying wing designs for years before the Allies became aware of the 229.
@@666theninja Except the jet engines were of British origin, which dates back to the 30's in original prototyping. The _XB-49_ was an evolution from the _YB-35._ Which had scaled down prototypes like the _N-1M_ and _N-9M_ flying in 1940 and 1942 respectively. The Ho.IX project which spawned the _Go 229_ began in 1943...
This is the best of the many YT videos describe this aircraft. There is one other that has a brief video of the sole test flight of a jet powered HO-3 in flight but this one describes the design details, capabilities and development strategies best.
There's a reasonable amount of evidence to suggest they'd reached the designs independently without knowledge of each other. If you want to get technical I think the Hortons built their gliders first, but Northrop had powered flight on his a few years before the hortons did.
Flying wings were first proposed in the teens. They were an old idea by the time Horten and Northrop tried it. Check out the Westland-Hill Pterydactlys.
That top secret airplane facility actually had a much longer story. Boeing and other companies were surprised of what they found and the Germans were at the least 10 years ahead of the allies.
You say this unique but later say that Northrup was working on the idea in the 30's. The British and the Soviets also had inventors with such ideas. The only difference was that those governments did not invest. Also, in 1945 this could not have made a difference. Dare I say click bait?
It was in fact a very unique design. The fact that others were working on similar designs does not change the fact of its uniqueness. The other designs were unique as well.
I mean, considering it only started life in 1944, it's unlikely it could gave done anything at all; and as far as I know, its wooden frame was a result of a lack of metal, especially if you consider that all their new aircraft designs by this point were manufactured with mostly wood. Pretty sure the benefit of a low radar cross section was accidental as well, but that's sort of the thing they could have used back in 1940/41, not when the war had long since gone against their favor.
By 1944, Nazi Germany was defeated. Yes, there was still a great deal of hard fighting to be done, however the fact that Germany lacked Materiel, Oil, and Manufacturing Capacity to make good losses, let alone form new, fully capable units. The designs of the Wunderwaffe, while interesting, might have had an impact in 1943, especially against the Bombers of the RAF, and USAAF. By January 1944, Nazi Germany was simply fighting a Delaying Action against the end.
I would say no to your assessment. Not yet anyway. The Wehrmacht still had a lot of fight left. As an example let me cite a few battles it was able to fight that late in the conflict, 1) Huertgenforest, 2) Westerwald, 3) One Bridge too Far, 4) The Bulge, There are several more. The main fighting took place in the East. The West was just a side show for the Germans. Only 20% of its forces were in the west, and those forces were mainly old guys and troops not fit or trained enough to fight in the East. You may dispute all of it, but facts are facts. At the Huertgen forest the resistance by the Germans was so stiff an American unit broke and ran. Five star George Marshall himself flew from the U.S. to find out what was happening. Eisenhower visited a field hospital and found it full of malingerers and GI's too scared to get back to the front. The Germans did not have that problem. They died with their boots on.
@@thenevadadesertrat2713 Neither was really a sideshow given that they were losing land rapidly on both fronts and running out of material and manpower. Put any competent force in a defensive position and there is a chance they will do well. They were losing on a logistic and strategic level. Winning a small number of battles doesn't change that. Western bombing had severely weakened their industry by that point, and the Soviets were performing well in the east, with the western allies gaining land in Italy(Slowly to be fair) and in France, the Low countries and eventually Germany, having almost total air supremacy, as well as against Japan in the pacific. So I think you can say that the war was lost by 1944, and no amount of "stealth" planes(Wasn't stealthy and worked not very well, killing one of its test pilots I believe, like most other experimental German aircraft) or men dying with their boots could change that. But I guess we'll never know because they lost the war for many reasons and no amount of "but i-i-if they j-j-just ... " can change that. You may dispute all of it, but facts are facts.
@@thenevadadesertrat2713 I never said that Nazi Germany didn't have a lot of fight leg. What I said was that by January of 1944, the result of the was was a forgone conclusion. Germany did not possess the Petroleum to make sufficient Fuel; Raw Materials to produce enough to keep existing, let alone Jet Engine needs; nor the Industrial Manufacturing Methods and Capacity thar would allow them to make good Materiel losses, such as Panzers, let alone restore Units to full strength. The Luftwaffe did not even have sufficient Training Facilities to place capable Pilots in their planes. This is not saying that the Nazi Military had no fight left in it. They made brilliant use of what they had, and respect is due to the Officers and Men at the Front. However, just as the United States ability to produce extremely large amounts of Materiel (sufficient to equip our Allies in large measure), had all but assured a Victory in Europe, Nazi Germany never had sufficient of anything in terms of Capacity and Materiel to win once Barbarrosa was undertaken.
@@thenevadadesertrat2713 but yet they still lost and died with their boots on. The bulge finished them on the western front, they put up a good fight in Berlin but lost a battle of attrition with the Soviets
@@imperialinquisition6006 Industry was NOT severely weakened because of Allied mistakes. It bombed with explosives. Most German manufacturing survived the war. In fact, about 88% was till operational in 1945.
Because Germany was not allowed to have air force after WW1, the " real " military academy of aviation became the glider clubs. Unlike their name and the fact most of their members were children, they were serious aviation schools. Some children would spend their entire childhood in these clubs, making and flying gliders, mostly, made out of wood. Some of these children became top aces in WW2, others, designers, others, the two thereof. Thus, Americans must not think of the glider clubs as scout commands or gluing model airplanes. They were more serious than this. One of the competitions was who can make and fly a glider at the highest distance from the same hill. Similar, yet, not as popular, were the rocket clubs, where, one of the children making rockets was Werner von Braun.
@@sergejstankovic2388 As far as I know, there was no much stuff in Eastern Europe, except, in Eastern Germany. Generally, in Eastern Europe, there was a subject taught in High Schools, called " Military Education ". There, the children studied basic stuff, such as AK47 ( Kalashnikov ), disassembly and reassembly, basic theory of nuclear weapons, etcetera. The culmination was a week or two of " Military Field Education ", where, the children drove Lada's, shot BB guns and shot a few bullets with Kalashnikov from laying position with a reserve officer laying next to them and collecting cartridges with a hat. The end was a super show of an attack against a platoon of real soldiers with smoke, fire, fireworks, etcetera. Of course, everyone shot blanks. Real blanks, not " Rust " blanks. Now, Eastern Germany was more interesting. In order to counter every possibility of pro Nazi propaganda in the style of " Before Was Better " the East Germans organised similar military education like Hitler, but, much better. They made tiny tanks for children, which, looked like real tanks, just, very tiny, powered by a two cycle Trabant engine and children, 8 to 12 year old, drove them on a field. This was military education on steroids. Must have been exciting. All these were, really, very good and children liked them. However, a better approach is, probably, not to teach children any weapons. However, back then, weapons were strictly disallowed. No one had a weapon ( fire arm ), except the military and police. I do NOT know, but, suspect, the police kept their guns unloaded with a magazine next to them. In case of a need ( almost never ), they can pull their guns and put the magazine in. However, there were very strict regulation on police pulling guns. Basically, WW3 had to start for them to pull a gun. Also, unlike in the USA, there were immensely strict regulation on police firing a gun. Basically, a cop could fire a gun, only, after the cop was dead.
A few years ago a group of engineers from Northrop built a scale mockup of it using similar materials at the Northrop Skunk Works. They then placed it on the pedestal that was made to test the Have Blue craft's radar cross section in order to test it against radar. They were surprised to find that it would have had a very small radar cross section against the radars in use by the US and Great Britain during WW II. This was all on a Discovery Channel show about the HO 229.
Except the NG model lacked the steel frame of the original and had no engines. At the frequencies used by British EW radar there is little skin reflection and those two missing elements would have been major contributors to RCS.
@@timgosling3076 Probably right. I'm not a radar technician nor a scientist. Was just stating what I say on the Discovery Channel show. Thanks for the additional info though.
It's as if there were only the Germans or the Americans that developed aircraft without a tail, my dad, who was a teenager at the time, worked in a factory in Baginton near Coventry, making parts for Armstrong Whitley, he mentioned on a few occasions a bomber that was being developed that was a flying wing.
The Horten Ho-229 V3 was not the fighter/bomber the Nazis hoped it would be, it was an aeronautical Hail Mary at best and a death trap for pilots who would fly it. Empirical evidence already showed that any loss of thrust would send it into a death spiral, as with Northrup's YB-49 it would have possessed terrible stall characteristics and a lack of vertical control surfaces meant a spin would be unrecoverable. Going after bombers meant encountering allied fighters, and any heavy-handed handling would result in a fatal compressor stall, which also dogged the ME 262.
A voice of sanity. The Germans were always looking for the panacea weapon that would change the outcome of the war. Tiger, Panther, Jagdtiger, etc. Absent an economy strong enough to outproduce the Allies, the outcome of the war was nearly a foregone conclusion. The Horton never reached an operational test unit but Dark Skies claims it almost changed the outcome of the war. Let's surmise that the Horton actually reached operational combat units and lived up to its promise-- however doubtful that may be. All that changes is that a German city becomes the first nuclear target, not Hiroshima.
The HO229 would of been in time what they wanted it to be, Horten said it was designed with Stealth in mind as it's Flying Wing Shape is stealth to begin with and they added fine charcoal dust into the paint and the HO229 was nearly all wood. Radar dose not work on wood. HO229 did do test flights and one crashed due to a Jet engine failed at the test pilot was told not to take the HO229 out. The HO229 would of been a game changer had it been a few more years up it's sleeve.
@@666theninja Maybe. But you ignore a critical facet of information. Raw materials. The limiting factor for the Me 262 was specialty alloys for the engines. The Germans never had enough chrome for example or nickel. Exactly where was Germany going to acquire these alloys in 1945?
@@666theninja Jack Northrup was never able to engineer out the inherent flaws in his flying wing design, with the final model flying for the last time in 1950 and cancelled for solid technological reasons, only to resurface as the B-52 45 years later.
Btw this video is literally total bullshit, none of what the guy is saying here is remotely true about the Horton. It’s full of blatant falsehoods I thankfully know from being a really big aircraft nerd. If you want a more informative, actually-correct video, Lazerpig’s channel has a fantastic and funny video regarding this exact plane.
There's also a rumor going around that there was a charcoal infused resin used to glue the plane together that was radar absorbent. Funny that the actual report Gumman did on the 229 had no mention of this binding agent...
You are wrong on one thing... The '229' Designation was not given to the Horten aircraft. As the aircraft neared the prototype phase it was determined by the RLM that the aircraft would be constructed by the Gotha aircraft company as the Hortens had no mass production facilities. Gotha never built one but the typ number '229' was assigned by the RLM. This was common practice with aircraft being developed. Had one actually been made by Gotha it would have been called "G0-229" not "HO-229" since the first letters represented the manufacturer. The only exception was Kurt Tank who was actually given a series of numbers with his own initials since he was so highly respected by the Reich. They correct Designation for all Horten wing aircraft made were the Ho prefix followed by roman numerals.
If they had all the wonder weapons they were working a year sooner I don't see the US and Russia along with the other countries winning Enjoyed your video and I gave it a Thumbs Up
Interesting video - also interesting that you miss out the fact that it wasn't just the Americans liberating Western Europe or approaching Berlin. The British and Commonwealth forces played a huge part in the liberation of Western Europe and the Russians took Berlin. I generally find "The Allies" is a better descriptor than "The Americans" when it comes to WWII.
Yep. That stuck in my craw as well. There are no end of idiotic and destructive arguments about who could or should have done what, with or without help during the Second World War. But the truth of the matter is Britain did not defeat Germany. America did not defeat Germany either. _The Alliance of Britain and America_ defeated Germany with a massive amount of the heavy lifting being provided by the Red Army. I have noticed over the past year or so this guy is becoming more and more chauvinistic in his view of world events and American exceptionalism. He has also become increasingly outspoken and extreme with his American right-wing political views. It is starting to be very uncomfortable and comes out the most in the 'Dark Docs' presentations of supposed history. Blatant lies or at least embarrassing misunderstandings are presented as hard fact. It is a real shame because I have loved this channel for nearly ten years now.
@@britishrocklovingyank3491 Thank you for that statement which is very true. This thing was not a bomber, it was not stealthy. As Lazerpig says about "Wehr-a-boos..." sigh.
The one thing I find funny Jack Northrup and the Horten brothers had been working on flying wing designs independently of each other, yet people wish to believe the US had stolen the design.
@@AlexMarciniszyn-y1k The flying wing design had the inherent design flaw of stability, and it wasn't till the advent of fly by wire and advance computers did the flying wing become feasible. Jack Northrup was quoted as saying God allowed him to live long enough when shown the B-2 Spirit.
Could you imagine the expressions on the faces of the young men from the wheat belt and cities of America, and their officers when they walked into that hanger and saw the jet powered wings, talk about next level stuff - MAN THOSE THONGS ARE FROM A LEVEL THEY NEVER IMAGINED COULD EXIST!
@@justme.9711 It was Patton's forces steamrolling across Germany and they captured Gotha's workshop with the unfinished prototypes. They took some photos and handed work off to Army Intelligence.
Don't go bursting a blood vessel because he didn't mention the other 20+ nations involved. The same could be said for a lot of fronts, but the US was the one to capture the 229 which is why they're mentioned.
It was mostly wood and had carbon between layers, that does absorb radar, so it would have been harder to detects. Too bad the engines were not reliable due to inadequate metal alloys. Amazing aerodynamic design too.
ooo wood and carbon is all we need to beat radar huh? damm what are they spending trillions of dollars on all that wood and carbon (fiber I think you ment to say carbon fiber... because we are all made out of carbon pretty much everything is) what a fool
I purchased a model kit of the Ho 229 at an air show in the UK in the 1980s when I was child - evidently fascinated since. You used a rather interesting piece of music for the first 6 minutes or so of your presentation - are you able to share what that was - it was very good. Thank you
It would have been better if some editing had happened: multiple repetitions of footage of airplanes that were NOT the Horten planes. I saw Northrop flying wing, the Henschel jet fighter, and the Komet, for Pete’s sake! way too much filler, not enough footage of actual Horten flying machines. Tighten it up guys !
Both wrong, a stealth plane doesnt mean noz showing up it means being low observable aka spot but no track etc, technically Any night bomber was stealth, also it did have reduced rcs though no where near a dedicated stealth plane
FYI Herman Gouring was a WW1 ace not WW2 and this plane was hardly a stealth plane as the idea of stealth fighters as we know it was not yet conceived.
No, it was neither stealth, nor would it have changed WWII in any notable way whatsoever. Let’s pretend for arguments sake that the very moment the on-paper design is given the pass that it reaches instant readiness to produce. It still means NOTHING. the losers that were the Nazis have little means to produce a jet fighter in that stage of the war, let alone one that isn’t a total deathtrap for its pilots like the HO was. It was fragile, of flimsy construction at the best of times, and poorly designed for any endurance combat lacking multirole function or ability to carry more useful armaments. It certainly was not stealth, that’s a total reformer driven myth. Please do not perpetuate that. The only “stealth” natures of the plane was that it was hard to see- because it didn’t exist. The HO229, like many other latewar Nazi crackhead projects, are aesthetically pleasing failures; relegated to the annals of history for the failure of a side that made a failure of a plane.
1. Goering never flew in combat during WWII. 2. "drag was practically non-existent" is just plain wrong. Non-existent drag would imply unlimited speed. 3. Reduced radar cross section because of its design doesn't make it stealthy (for its time maybe, but radar technology advanced quickly)
It was not a stealth bomber, I repeat, not a stealth bomber. It was never intended to be. It was not made purposely with "stealthy" modern radar absorbing materials as they did not yet exist. It's shape might have been a little stealthy to radar technology of the time but that would been only due to happenstance. The radars of the time were not very good but were good enough to pick up a formation of aircraft but usually not a single aircraft. Early on in the Battle of Britain, the radar they used to detect the German formations was indeed quite good for the time. But the Germans would have had no fear of American radar to detect a plane very far away, and so would not have felt a need to develop stealth technology. Which they did not, nor did they attempt it. The ability to evade radar was not even one of the design requirements of the Horton flying wings. So get over it.
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Been waiting for you guys to release a Ho 229 vid keep it up!
how about you fix the misleading title?
Change that joke of a title.
Where do you think Northrop came up with the XB-35 and YB-49 flying wing bombers, but like it is said in many comments the German flying wing was not a bomber but a fighter
preferred the original thumbnail - new pic has nothing to do with a Ho 229
I believe Goering was primarily known as a WW1 fighter ace.
Had to rewind to make sure I heard him say that.
He replaced Richthofen as commander of the squadron.
@@foxygamer7176 You are correct, he did not.
@@SpaceyMonkey75 He actually had a large collection of artwork and museum pieces, one of the things he owned was an old Fokker D.VII which was one of the aircraft he flew in WWI. He was too fat to fit in it by the time of the Nazi regime.
And he assembled a collection aircraft.
NOT THIS CR*P AGAIN !
The Ho IX (Gotha 229) was a fighter design. V1 buried itself in the ground after one engine failed, and (due to lack of a tailfin) went into a flat spin due to asymmetric thrust. V2 was set on fire to avoid capture, and V3 was captured incomplete. Northrop couldn't have studied the wing planform from this prototype, because they were never fitted.
Horten designs were Ho (Roman numeral), and went up to XVIII - most never left the drawing-board.
V(ersuchs) is German for prototype, Arabic numerals were ALWAYS used for this.
The Horten brothers sought aerodynamic efficiency (like every other flying wing in History) stealth being unknown at the time.
Oh, and MK stands for Maschinkannone, (cf. MG/Maschingewehr = Machinegun) NOT mark. I don't expect you to learn German, but please do enough research to avoid such basic errors.
This dude doesn't do any research at all. No clue how he gets so many views
The Horten brothers insisted on developing absurd projects, especially to avoid being drafted into the army and sent to the frontline
He said Goering was a WW2 ace pilot lol
@@stonerjesus1990 WW1 ace pilot, but yeah
I’m glad you said this so I didn’t have too
The fatal flaw of flying wings was that the nearer they came to supersonic speeds the more unstable they became. Computer assisted flying overcame that problem years later.
Stalling in maneuver also a problem as pitch unstable.
Lack of a empennage was the main cause of instability at high speeds, took many years to come up with computers that could compensate for these issues. Same reason the XB-35 and YB-49 failed, to early for their time. The F-117 nighthawk was the first A/C to address the instability issues, otherwise the hopeless diamond would have never been successful
The us' first try at flying wings has the identical angle and span as the B2
@@timwhitten9918 hmm what ? ever heard of dassault mirage plane ? first one in production was in 1956...
all those dassault aircrafts were /are tailless delta wing.
or are we saying delta tailless aircraft are not flying wings because for all purposes they sure seem to be... certainly more of a lfying wing than the f117
@@bschwand None of the Mirages are tailless. They all have rudders. By your definition, all delta wing cars aircraft would be considered “ tailless”. F-92,F-102,F-106, F4D, F6D, B-58, SAAB Draken,,SAAB Viggen. The list goes on. None of these are thought of as tailless nor flying wings. A flying wing may have a rudder (B-35/B-49) but does not have a fuselage. The cockpit is built into the leading edge of the wing.
Disclaimer: the Ho 229 was not stealth, nor a bomber, it was an interceptor. Also there is insufficient evidence that the Northrop company had knowledge of the plane while they were building the B-2.
There was a much larger bomber version called the Horton XVIII, but as that drawn up in early 1945 it never left the chalkboard.
The Northrop company was on November 22 1941 been awarded a contract to build a flying wing type bomber, the XB-35.
Yes, the Northrop engineers knew of the Go-229 / Ho-IX. But Jack Northrop has also played with flying wings before YB-35 and YB-49.
@@DoctorCreepy the N9M as well.
Yea sure.
You are absolutely correct. Both of these projects were developed independently and simultaneously.
Viewers who don't know their flying wings might not realize that a lot of the footage is of the Northrop XB-49, a *much* larger aircraft produced after the war. It was nice to see some footage of Horton wings, though.
It was produced during the war. The program started in 1940 for the Northrop YB-49.
The XB-49 wasn’t a pure flying wing as it had 4 small tails the B-2 is a mix of a XB-49 with a 229
Amen brother…this guy is a fraud.
🙄🇨🇺🇺🇸
@@noprisoners8621yeah but it wasn’t finished till the late 50s I think
Don't forget the Horten HO 228 jet fighter built by the Gotha Wagenfabrik.
One of the soldiers taking part in salvaging the Roswell UFO in July, 1947, said that it looked like one of the new jet aircraft he had seen in Germany after the war. It could have been this one.
V meaning Versuch, meaning experimental.
Although Berlin Tempelhof housed a plane factory in the cellars, the Horten brothers developed their planes near the Gothaer Waggonfabrik at Gotha.
I've visited the smal airfield years ago. There isn't much left of the facility, but knowing that these mysterious planes were build and tested there, felt very special.
After being hidden for decades, the HO 229 is on display in the main hall. It's a shame the wings aren't attached. Let's hope they will after restoration.
Thanks for the video.
yes I'm sure that you felt very special lurking in dark spaces with the ghosts of Nazis
@@touristguy87 Wow, Troll much...?
Are the wings there to see also?
@@PanzerBuyer yes I believe they are - there’s a quick shot of them stacked near the fuselage towards the end of the video.
@@touristguy87
That sounds freakin’ awesome! Creepy, and educational at the same time, lol!
I first found out about this plane as a kid playing on my grandmothers 486 PC. While visiting she bought me “Secret Weapons of the Luftwaffe”. Good game and it’s game manual offered a lot of history and phots on the planes in the game. The Horton 229 became my favorite.
Great game, I loved it!
The manual was bloody incredible - it wasn't so much a manual, but was a history book in itself.
@@mozworthy 💯
Man, that manual was FANTASTIC. Easily worth the money all by itself. I once found it in PDF format and printed a looseleaf backup copy. Pretty sure I still have it in a thick binder somewhere.
Still got this game boxed somewhere ☺️
In the game it was called the Go229, it was my favorite plane!
THE HORTON BROTHERS
WERE FANTASTIC
ENGINEERS AND WAY AHEAD OF THEIR TIME !👍
This craft was not designed for stealth, however in today's parlance, it could be considered as such. Further, any airfoil has parasitic drag. That is the function of reality. To suggest it has no drag is ridiculous. It, at best, had greatly reduced drag, due to the absence of fuselage and empennage.
Jawohl mein Herr Homan Alles richtig
Flying Wing shape is Stealthy due to it's shape by nature, Stealth by Accident or by Design, still stealth.
@@666theninja That is exactly what I said.
@@666theninja didnt the yanks make a recreation of this aircraft and found out it was indeed not even close to stealthy?
@@brokencreationlordmegatrol3037 You mean the Northrop Stealth Experts and they said it was Stealthy and 'Hello' a Flying Wing shape is stealth by the nature of it's shape.
If it was German, mysterious, and had a connection with nazis, it was a war-winning-wonder-weapon. If the nazis had a new design for a spatula we're supposed to thank God on bended knee that it never went into full scale production.
Europe doesn’t look ‘saved’ to me, does it to you?
If so, please point out where.
Someone seems hangry
Lmao yeah. They started a war they couldn’t win and were just slapping shit together at the end, led by their mad tyrant of a fuhrer. Stupid reformer bullshit after the war leads people to believe this sort of nonsense, that they were somehow on the cusp of amazing futuristic weapons that would somehow have “won the war.” Never mind the US had not only equal or better equipment, but also had the ultimate weapon, the fucking nuclear bomb.
@@krazytroutcatcher I will, right after YOU point out where I said anything anywhere was saved. Or would you just like to admit straw men aren't your thing, and save some effort?
@@evanlarson1724 thanks for letting me know you have access to the internet,
Russell Lee, chair of the Aeronautics Department at the National Air and Space Museum, reckons the Hortons knew this would never really work, but it looked and sounded cool, so the Reich Ministries kept giving them money to develop it, with the main effect being that the Hortons, and their workers, were kept in Germany instead of being sent to the Eastern Front.
It takes modern flight computers to make them fly well. US test pilots found that out the hard way with Northrop's flying wings.
Horten Brothers said it would of worked and the US used it's Jet Engines hidden in the Fuselage idea into the B2 Stealth Bomber. End of the day it worked as the B2 Stealth Bomber proves it.
@@666theninja That is BS....
That sounds more likely!
@@WALTERBROADDUS No BS, look where the engines are on the B2 Stealth Bomber, 'Hello' straight from the Horten HO229 :)
correction: the Ho-229 did not indeed have any stealth capabilities, that was proven to be false
It does have a reduced RCS, but it's definitely not stealth.
It definitely has reduced radar cross section, and with the more primitive radar of the day it could have been classified as stealth. Semantics are fun aren't they.
@Tron Jockey Allies didn't need to intercept it, it would have fallen out of the sky all on it's own. The design was a massive failure.
@@Gorilla_Jones at least I can’t remember any primary sources saying they did it like they did because of the reduced rcs
The Northrop Grumman engineers that worked on the B-2 and F-35 test pilots made a a documentary about this and the conclusion of as that it was the first stealth plane and was 30 years ahead of his team and that was an inspiration for the B-2
LazerPig did a good video on this. Debunking it basically.
Well not the entire video, but he is debunking the stupidity of calling it a stealth bomber.
@@spyran5839 yet they were motivated by Wolfram's death over Dunkirk which they blamed on British radar reaching across the channel. That damned machine, recapitulated today, has the radar image of a very small vehicle. I think some conclusions though not stated, might be considered obvious.
@@spyran5839 Exactly
The shape of the aircraft had a naturally radar minimized return. Why do you think the B2 has no vertical stabilizer? The Horton flying wing is a well known predecessor of the B2. It’s common knowledge. Debunking is often a silly game
@@Odin197188 And yet surely the YB-49 and similar American designs, coincidentally, by the same company that manufactured the B2 was the true predecessor of the B2. Also while I can't confirm it it was said in the laserpig video that the Ho 229 design was tested by Northrop and and found to not be very stealthy. More so than other aircraft of the time due to its shape, but still likely to have been picked up on the British radar of the time, so if that isn't true, could you disprove that for me?
At about 7:15 we can see a Northrop YB-40 that flew for the first time on 22 October 1947 in Hawthorne California, USA.
It is really misleading to show the YB-49 flying when talking about the Ho 229. These two types had nothing to do which each other!
It sees there is a lack of videos of the Horton 229 flying. It's a shame as I would love to see it in action.
Dark Skies lies.
Both are Flying Wings so had that in Common. The Germans had Jet Engines first and Northrop used old school prop engines, Germans were way advance back then for sure with there Jet Engines in a Flying Wing.
@@666theninja actually the British and Germans were working on jet engines independently and at the same time.
There are quite a few shots of the yb-35 and yb-49 throughout the video including the northtrop n9m
There’s an anecdote in Chuck Yeagers autobiography regarding Northrop's flying wing which was testing at Muroc, the test pilot was so fed up with repeatedly crashing due to various faults, the last time he did so he tried to stop the fire service from putting out the flaming wreckage.
5:20 I think you meant ww1 ace. I don't think the ww2 Goring could even fit in a cockpit.
😂👌
Goering: Hey, Ernst, am I fat?
Udet: Dude, I know 5 fat guys and you are 4 of them!
thats what his huge shoehorns were for...
Morphine addiction stopped him up. While held for trial he slimmed down considerably.
Why does everyone keep talking about the Horten Bros. like they invented the flying wing? Everyone knows that Jack Northrop began his first flying wing prototypes in the early 1920's, and the YB-35 was ready to fly only a couple years after WWII. With exception to the failed turbine wing they tried to build, the Northrop YB-35 aircraft was far more advanced than anything the Horten Bros were working on. The Horten Bros. had virtually nothing to do with advanced flying wing designs that actually made it into production. In fact, it was called the YB-35, because Jack Northrop has the initial designs of it completed in 1935. Long before the Horten Bros. had anything remotely close to Northrop's designs.
Drag is never “nearly non-existent” on an aircraft, no matter the design. Where there is lift, there is drag. The two go hand-in-hand.
But you are removing tail and trim drag.
✅
Nothing 😁 you know nothing
@@flybobbie1449 Flying wings still experience drag, thrust-drag and lift-weight are constants in aircraft. Just because it looks funny doesn't change anything.
The Ho 229 was not stealth, nor a bomber, it was an interceptor.
Yep, This channel has a wealth is misinformation.
I think it's stealth was to come from wood construction like the Mosquito. Low radar signature.
Ye
@@flybobbie1449 Stealth wasn't even a concept in WWII, it only began to be understood in 1960s.
It was all of these.
As an update, the Ho 229 has been moved to the Udvar-Hazy Center near Dulles International Airport. It is on display, un-restored.
Yes! I stumbled across one there many years ago!
It’s under like a plastic tarp behind the hell diver though
5:18 Hermann Goering was a WW1 ace pilot. Pretty sure he did not personally participate in air combat during WW2.
He couldn't fit in a fighter cockpit by that time. He loved his strudel too much. 😄
Goering's bulk was due more to addiction to pain killers that bloated him. I seem to recall he had been shot in the groin?
yeah you gotta take Dark Docs with a grain of salt... lots of incorrect pics, specs, information, blah blah... I wouldnt use these videos as hard facts on a research paper LOL!
He would not, could not even fit in a 109!
@@chriscarbaugh3936 say what you will about Goering's weight, but the German leaders were all hardcore, combat hardened vets. Even Hitler. No draft dodging cowards there. All had been there and knew what their troops were dealing with. Their leaders led from the front. Its one of the contributors to what made their military so tough.
The aircraft is no longer at the Garber Restoration Center (which was closed) but was moved to the Smithsonian's National Air and Space Museum Udvar-Hazy Center in Chantilly VA.
I was just there and saw the V3 sitting covered under a thin plastic sheet. The wings were right behind it. As of July 2022 it’s sitting just behind the AR234 and the Arrow.
The stealth part was not in any period correspondence. It was mentioned in the 80s by the designer to make it seem better.
Northrop had developed the flying wing independently and for the same reasons, as had a British engineer. If stealth was a reason, the air intakes would need to be buried deeper in the fuselage. That's basic design criteria. As far as the "Amerika Bomber", the capabilities of the mentioned He-177 should give a good indication of the technical feasibility of that, let alone the tactical impossibility of it. Really interesting aircraft, but way over hyped.
Northrop did build a full scale mock-up of the aircraft to the wartime specs and tested its radar signature it found it was partially stealth up until a a close distance away from the radar system. The mock-up was even given to the Smithsonian museum afterwards if I remember right. I do agree that the airplane was not completely stealth but it was still a world first at the time
@@skylerfox7663 kinda
They built a mock up
And it was sorta to specs, a lot of materials were changed due to cost/availability.
Yes it did have a lower RCS, but so would the flying flapjack if it was made of wood, or numerous other examples that predate the Hortens.
One of the "drawbacks" of the B-49, long before a thorough study of WW2 stuff could have been done was a low RCS.
The wood was to save on aluminum due to Germany not doing so well, not unlike the He-162. The flying wing was because that's what the Hortens did. It was considered due to the range/ payload advantage of a flying wing. Like I said RCS was not mentioned in period documents about it.
The reduced RCS is from the side, same as any other flying wing. From the front, those exposed intakes are as visible as any other jet of the period. Kinda important for attack vectors. And since range was of paramount importance, coming in at an oblique would be tactically irrelevant, if it was even feasible.
For the Amerika Bomber, almost laughable as an argument.
False. The He 177 was not the Amerika bomber.
@@AlexMarciniszyn-y1k umm
Never said it was
Just the He-177 was a "flying coffin" according to the pilots that flew it.
Given the problems of the one 4 engine bomber the Germans managed to actually produce, the concept of the Amerika Bomber actually working is absurd
I've been to the Garber facility and have seen this aircraft. It's in several crates in the corner of one of the warehouses. I recommend a tour of this facility because you can interact with the people doing thecresteration work.
where is this garber facility? is it at the museum in virginia
It's where the air and space museum restore it's aircraft. . It's in Washington dc but may be outside in Virginia. To me way more interesting than the air and space be museum.
It’s been moved and is on display at the Udvar-Hazy facility at Dulles Airport now. Saw it a few years ago there.
The Garber facility, in Silver Hill MD was closed after the Udvar-Hazy Center was opened in Chantilly, VA.
Got up close to the 229 at Garber in 1996. The Garber facility is the hidden gem of Air and Space Museum. It is where all of the restoration work is done. They have a very limited tour schedule. Was there visiting an old friend, the little Windecker composite plane that my father had time with an helped donate to Smithsonian.
I think Göring may have been a WWI ace. During WWII he would have been hard pressed to fit in the cockpit of a fighter. 5:18
He'd make a great 1000kg bomb.
@@bondgabebond4907
See Hitler Rants Parodies channel.
@@billveitch2100 Goering had 22 aerial victories, although there is some doubt about 2 of them ( kinda like "The Blue Max") but it was enough to get the "pour le Merite".
He became the squadron leder of the famous Richthofen squadron and an Ace.
Name a more iconic duo, the Ho229 and being named a 'SECRET STEALTH NAZI BOMBER THAT COULD HAVE CHANGED THE WAR'. Bruh.
"A10 is better CAS aircraft then f35"
Ahh yes, the only stealth plane with a radar cross section exactly the size of itself...
Yes yes very interesting
crazy. this plane still looks modern even for 2022! makes you wonder how they reacted seeing this in 1945
Nowhere near a stealth aircraft...Lazerpig did hilarious video on Horton wing.
Yup your right and that video is just brilliant to watch!
Having a good relationship with Germany now, I think we should give it back. It's more a part of their history; not ours.
Yeah it’s just a flying wing, it wasn’t stealthy and it wasn’t a bomber. It was a fighter design
The Holy Roman Empire of aircraft.
It wasn’t a fighter. It was an interceptor, like most German jet designs of ww2.
It can be viewed at Smithsonian. A model has also been built to test the stealth on a stand. Nova on PBS did a show
The replica built for NOVA is currently on display at the San Diego Air and Space Museum in Balboa Park
@@avshutsach I went to that Museum almost 50 years ago…I seem to recall there was a fire sometime back
@@larryenglander8735 yeah there was a fire sometime in the 80's and lost some truly one of a kind aircraft, but after that fire, the area was rebuilt and the museum is currently in the old Ford building. This building allows for a larger area to display aircraft, as well as teach the history of aviation. They also have an annex over by Gillespie field where they have the workshop to repair other aircraft in thier collection and to display some aircraft and pieces that wouldn't fit in the current layout. Such as a Ryan Vertijet and an S-3 Viking that was used by Nasa.
It wasn’t stealth nor a bomber? It was designed to be an interceptor?
Flying Wing shape is stealthy by nature, so was stealth by accident or by design.
@@666theninja a full size test was conducted by the US to see if the 229 was truly stealth or not. It did not have any stealth characteristics of any kind and was seen to be its original size on radar.
@@-zedx lol what Rubbish, Northrop Stealth Expert said it was stealth and Flying Wing Shape is stealth in shape in nature.
What horseshit, Not a bomber, Not stealth, and barely got a few prototypes out
The larger prototype was bomber, capable to fly straight to USA from Germany. The smaller one was fighter. It also was stealth, this has been confirmed by engineers, they build the damn thing and tested it with modern radars.
There are always prototypes before the produced jet, it was close to come to production. Not that it would have changed anything at that point anymore though.
@@duhni4551 the stealth was a side effect of building the plane out of wood and not a design feature and we are talking abt the 229 not abt other prototype cus the 229 actually flew and was tested and was closer to production, even if the bomber could fly to the us. germany wouldn't be able to build enough to make a difference
It wasn't a bomber, it was a fighter with serious stability problems and it's engine placement would have ruined its stealth characteristics
It could be flown by a skilled pilot for test flights but in actual combat it would kill more of its pilots than it would enemy pilots
Agreed. But there are loads of TH-cam video makers who know excellent click-bait when they see it. And loads of closet Nazis who want to believe this nonsense.
At that time steathl was not a point
Radar performances were so poor...
Airborne radars range was about the same as the visual range.
And also the screens were two osciloscopes the operator had to compute in his head...
The ground stations were also poor.
@@tricosteryl ...why is it that you embody so many commenters on YT in that you are dead flat wrong on everything but your first sentence??
False. Entirely false.
In 1992, the center section of the Horten, was stored at Silver Hill, near the Arado AR 234, and the Convair POGO VTOL Fighter. At the very same time, JFK's Convair 240 sat along side that very same storage building/hangar. The Arado was awaiting Plexiglass work, but was very close to being completely restored, sadly, POGO and Caroline are apparently still in storage. I provided engineering support to an avionics manufacturer, who, at the time, donated restorative services for some of the avionics for the Enola Gay, and bummed a ride to Garber for one of the trips where instruments were hand carried back to Garber, and different instruments were taken back to Pennsylvania for cosmetic restoration.
Normally I can defend this channel, but when you start passing off Jack Northrop's work as Horton's? Oh ,let the hate mail fly.....
Yeah, back in the day the channel was decent, but now it feels like he chooses material based on how clickbait it sounds and does the bare minimum of research to scrape by.
@@pyronuke4768 I stood up for this guy a couple of times for his b-roll footage. But, I draw the line here.
This was just a flying wing, no stealth or bomb capabilities
It was supposed to be a bomber. But was too late
Wrong 😑
@@paulgeorge7557 too much WarThunder
@@paulgeorge7557 the two that flew were an unarmed prototype and a glider. it was schemed up to be a fighter-bomber but never performed such actions. The rest were captured in production, so don’t even consider the V3 which I assume you’re familiar with
Ho 229 had 2 30mm cannons. It was a fighter...well interceptor...designed to destroy Bombers.
The bomber...the Ho 18....would have been able to bomb the Eastern Seaboard of the US from Europe. And if the allies had not focused on wrecking the Norwegian Heavy Water facility...the Germans could have had a working Atomic Weapon in 1944. And combined with the A-9/A-10 2 stage first ever ICBM...New York, Washington DC, Philladelphia....joining London, Paris, Moscow, Leningrad, Stalingrad, Rome, Brussells, Amsterdam, Antwerp, Calais, Prague, Vienna, Kyiv, Sevastopol...probably Gibraltar, Alexandria, Malta...and if things went the way they did, Remagen, Arnhem, Warsaw,, Danzig, Strassborg and Berlin..would be radioactive wastelands.
In recent times a mock up of the HO229 was built to determine it's radar signature. The design was tested on the WWII radar technology level. The radar signature was much less. It could be detected but not as far away as conventional aircraft. The Germans had already began attacking England by flying low and fast across the channel to keep radar detection limited.
The HO229 flying low and fast would be detected only a few minutes before crossing the English coastline. This would have been too early for the RAF to scramble fighters and intercept the HO229. The HO229 would be gone back across the channel before the fighters could get to them.
The HO229 was to be configured as a ground attack aircraft as well as bomber interceptor. The English coastline facilities like radar stations would have been vulnerable.
I have seen this on Discovery channel. They rebuilt an exact replica at the Lockheed Martin SW.
@@JohnnyAFG81 this is actually false. according to the us airforce, after ww2 they were able to obtain the schematics of the ho229 and build a their own mock up for testing. some things to note about the mock up, it was made with both wood and steel. this made it more "stealthy" than the original design as if it were build fully out of wood, the radar signature would have been higher. the orginial designed also called for the aircraft to be coated in a charcoal based "radar absorbant" layer. when the mock up was fully built, they tested it and found that, in terms of radar signature, it provided no additional stealth compared to other aircraft at the time. however, it was here that the us realized to potential for the flying wing design as it was more efficent than other aircraft of its time. the idea that the h0229 was a steal aircraft simply stems from the fact that it looks like b2
And where would this hypothetical attack take place from in 1945?
@@patrickstewart3446England was the proposed target for the HO 229. The design call did not come out until sometime in 1943.
The design specs called for a 2,200 lb load, a range of over 620 miles at 620 mph and a ceiling of 49,000 feet. The first prototype was flown as a glider in March 1944. A jet engine version flew in December 1944.
The Horton brothers during the prototype trails had been diverted into the Amerika bomber program to build a large flying wing jet bomber that could bomb the east coast of the united states. Diverting them to this project was part of Hitlers dream of bombing New York City.
If they had the resources to push the design progress or had announced the design call earlier they would have had a working semi-stealth jet fighter bomber.
I can hear LazerPig having an aneurysm as soon as he read that title.
Yep. I can hear him scream in agony reading lots of titles on this channel
Our version of this aircraft was the YB-35 in 1943 and later the YB-49 that was jet powered.
Pilot Edwards, crashed the last YB-49 in an area now known as Edwards Air Force base.
Funny how most of the film showing the plane moving on the ground and flying are actually the YB-49???
Incline to believe this was a concept demonstrator, that's where you start then develop and purpose build from there. Definitely onto something.
Absolutely no offense meant, but this plane was exactly as stealthy as the Mossy and for the same reasons.
I wouldn't go that far. The aerodynamic shape of the Horten suggests it had a smaller radar cross section than the Mosquito. Also, the plan was to use charcoal in the Horton's plywood to make it radar-absorbing. How well that would've worked in practice is unclear, but it wouldn't have hurt either.
@@peabase I believe it was tested by the Americans post-war. It didn't help
@@internet_kaiser They tested a prototype that didn't have the charcoal.
@@peabase There is nothing to charcoal that absorbs radar. The maker of the Ho-229 likely just said that because the US stealth bombers were black and the only black thing he could think of was charcoal
Always the brit who has to comment on the "underrated" Mosquito in every god damn video involving ww2 aviation. Give it a rest for fuck's sake mate. What you said is shite anyway, one has a vertical stabilizer, the other doesn't. Shape determines RCS far more than materials.
Lazerpig buried any notion of stealth.
Cool plane though.
the lack of vertical surfaces alone would have objectively reduced the aircrafts RCS, even against low-frequency radars.
dont believe everything meme-lords tell you on TH-cam...
@@nikoc8968 flat surfaces like turbine blades?
@@wyrmshadow4374 no, like the lack of vertical surfaces that would have objectively reduced the aircrafts RCS...exactly as i said.
the "S-shaped inlets" that youre trying to insinuate is somehow the only, or even the most important, aspect of stealth, came afterwards.
"the American had almost seized western Germany" Um, so the British, French, Canadian, and other forces don't count in the liberation of Europe?? Ye gods, for a history channel that's bloody stupid not to mention incredibly insulting.
Yeah as an American, it’s historically inaccurate to not think other countries were there or participated. Almost as foolish as thinking a POS nazi wood plane would hold up to jet power!
I agreed with you until you mentioned canada
French?
“Western germany”
It was said for expediency in telling a story. There's literally nothing more to it. Perhaps "Allies" would have been more appropriate.
There’s a big difference between being a flying wing concept and being a stealth bomber. It’s like calling a bottle rocket a Falcon 9 rocket.
Ah yes, a stealth bomber.
A plane that was never designed for either but ok
"Drag was practically non existent" Huh!😅 this is a nonsense statement. Yes there is no fuselage drag but a wing still comes with significant drag which is the cost of creating lift.
The use of footage of the Northrop YB-35 and YB-49 with VOs for the Horton aircraft really takes away from an otherwise excellent production.
5:20 Hermann Göring was not a WW2 ace pilot, but a WW1 ace pilot. I don't think he'd fit inside the cockpits of either a Me109 or a Fw190, even if he tried!
Might could stuff him in the nose of an He111...
This has to be the most over-hyped German "what if" plane of the war, and no, Northrop did not copy this to build the YB 35. Jack Northrop had been working on flying wing designs for years before the Allies became aware of the 229.
lol Northrop copied the jet engines in the fuselage design straight off the Ho229, Blind Freddy can see that lol.
@@666theninja Except the jet engines were of British origin, which dates back to the 30's in original prototyping. The _XB-49_ was an evolution from the _YB-35._ Which had scaled down prototypes like the _N-1M_ and _N-9M_ flying in 1940 and 1942 respectively. The Ho.IX project which spawned the _Go 229_ began in 1943...
@@peterson7082 Prop Engines in the Northrop flying wings, Ho229 used Jet Engines. :)
@@666theninja where else could they go?
@@hammersandnails1458 To the Horten Brothers: who were ahead of Northrop way back when.
This is the best of the many YT videos describe this aircraft. There is one other that has a brief video of the sole test flight of a jet powered HO-3 in flight but this one describes the design details, capabilities and development strategies best.
what are you on about this video is awful
So was it the Horten Brothers or Jack Northrop that came up with the idea of a flying wing first?
Both were operating independently and simultaneously.
There's a reasonable amount of evidence to suggest they'd reached the designs independently without knowledge of each other. If you want to get technical I think the Hortons built their gliders first, but Northrop had powered flight on his a few years before the hortons did.
I think Northrop's design was released first, but not by a large enough margin to have influenced the Hortens.
Flying wings were first proposed in the teens. They were an old idea by the time Horten and Northrop tried it.
Check out the Westland-Hill Pterydactlys.
That top secret airplane facility actually had a much longer story. Boeing and other companies were surprised of what they found and the Germans were at the least 10 years ahead of the allies.
10 year defiantly not, a year at max, both sides had jets, advanced radar, similar prototypes in everything practically.
You say this unique but later say that Northrup was working on the idea in the 30's. The British and the Soviets also had inventors with such ideas. The only difference was that those governments did not invest. Also, in 1945 this could not have made a difference. Dare I say click bait?
But do we regret watching it? I don't. I don't mind click baot if the videos worth watching.
It was in fact a very unique design. The fact that others were working on similar designs does not change the fact of its uniqueness. The other designs were unique as well.
I mean, considering it only started life in 1944, it's unlikely it could gave done anything at all; and as far as I know, its wooden frame was a result of a lack of metal, especially if you consider that all their new aircraft designs by this point were manufactured with mostly wood. Pretty sure the benefit of a low radar cross section was accidental as well, but that's sort of the thing they could have used back in 1940/41, not when the war had long since gone against their favor.
It would not even be that much lower. It was still partially made of metal.
By 1944, Nazi Germany was defeated. Yes, there was still a great deal of hard fighting to be done, however the fact that Germany lacked Materiel, Oil, and Manufacturing Capacity to make good losses, let alone form new, fully capable units.
The designs of the Wunderwaffe, while interesting, might have had an impact in 1943, especially against the Bombers of the RAF, and USAAF. By January 1944, Nazi Germany was simply fighting a Delaying Action against the end.
I would say no to your assessment. Not yet anyway. The Wehrmacht still had a lot of fight left. As an example let me cite a few battles it was able to fight that late in the conflict, 1) Huertgenforest, 2) Westerwald, 3) One Bridge too Far, 4) The Bulge, There are several more. The main fighting took place in the East. The West was just a side show for the Germans. Only 20% of its forces were in the west, and those forces were mainly old guys and troops not fit or trained enough to fight in the East. You may dispute all of it, but facts are facts. At the Huertgen forest the resistance by the Germans was so stiff an American unit broke and ran. Five star George Marshall himself flew from the U.S. to find out what was happening. Eisenhower visited a field hospital and found it full of malingerers and GI's too scared to get back to the front. The Germans did not have that problem. They died with their boots on.
@@thenevadadesertrat2713 Neither was really a sideshow given that they were losing land rapidly on both fronts and running out of material and manpower. Put any competent force in a defensive position and there is a chance they will do well. They were losing on a logistic and strategic level. Winning a small number of battles doesn't change that. Western bombing had severely weakened their industry by that point, and the Soviets were performing well in the east, with the western allies gaining land in Italy(Slowly to be fair) and in France, the Low countries and eventually Germany, having almost total air supremacy, as well as against Japan in the pacific. So I think you can say that the war was lost by 1944, and no amount of "stealth" planes(Wasn't stealthy and worked not very well, killing one of its test pilots I believe, like most other experimental German aircraft) or men dying with their boots could change that. But I guess we'll never know because they lost the war for many reasons and no amount of "but i-i-if they j-j-just ... " can change that. You may dispute all of it, but facts are facts.
@@thenevadadesertrat2713 I never said that Nazi Germany didn't have a lot of fight leg. What I said was that by January of 1944, the result of the was was a forgone conclusion. Germany did not possess the Petroleum to make sufficient Fuel; Raw Materials to produce enough to keep existing, let alone Jet Engine needs; nor the Industrial Manufacturing Methods and Capacity thar would allow them to make good Materiel losses, such as Panzers, let alone restore Units to full strength. The Luftwaffe did not even have sufficient Training Facilities to place capable Pilots in their planes.
This is not saying that the Nazi Military had no fight left in it. They made brilliant use of what they had, and respect is due to the Officers and Men at the Front. However, just as the United States ability to produce extremely large amounts of Materiel (sufficient to equip our Allies in large measure), had all but assured a Victory in Europe, Nazi Germany never had sufficient of anything in terms of Capacity and Materiel to win once Barbarrosa was undertaken.
@@thenevadadesertrat2713 but yet they still lost and died with their boots on. The bulge finished them on the western front, they put up a good fight in Berlin but lost a battle of attrition with the Soviets
@@imperialinquisition6006 Industry was NOT severely weakened because of Allied mistakes. It bombed with explosives. Most German manufacturing survived the war. In fact, about 88% was till operational in 1945.
Call of War-Cor! Goring was a WWI Ace. He wasn't ace at much by WWII, except being a morphine addict.
Because Germany was not allowed to have air force after WW1, the " real " military academy of aviation became the glider clubs. Unlike their name and the fact most of their members were children, they were serious aviation schools. Some children would spend their entire childhood in these clubs, making and flying gliders, mostly, made out of wood. Some of these children became top aces in WW2, others, designers, others, the two thereof.
Thus, Americans must not think of the glider clubs as scout commands or gluing model airplanes. They were more serious than this. One of the competitions was who can make and fly a glider at the highest distance from the same hill.
Similar, yet, not as popular, were the rocket clubs, where, one of the children making rockets was Werner von Braun.
Great info...something similar existed in eastern block/sssr...hard to imagine number of experts that started from these clubs !
@@sergejstankovic2388 As far as I know, there was no much stuff in Eastern Europe, except, in Eastern Germany. Generally, in Eastern Europe, there was a subject taught in High Schools, called " Military Education ". There, the children studied basic stuff, such as AK47 ( Kalashnikov ), disassembly and reassembly, basic theory of nuclear weapons, etcetera. The culmination was a week or two of " Military Field Education ", where, the children drove Lada's, shot BB guns and shot a few bullets with Kalashnikov from laying position with a reserve officer laying next to them and collecting cartridges with a hat. The end was a super show of an attack against a platoon of real soldiers with smoke, fire, fireworks, etcetera. Of course, everyone shot blanks. Real blanks, not " Rust " blanks.
Now, Eastern Germany was more interesting. In order to counter every possibility of pro Nazi propaganda in the style of " Before Was Better " the East Germans organised similar military education like Hitler, but, much better. They made tiny tanks for children, which, looked like real tanks, just, very tiny, powered by a two cycle Trabant engine and children, 8 to 12 year old, drove them on a field. This was military education on steroids. Must have been exciting.
All these were, really, very good and children liked them. However, a better approach is, probably, not to teach children any weapons. However, back then, weapons were strictly disallowed. No one had a weapon ( fire arm ), except the military and police. I do NOT know, but, suspect, the police kept their guns unloaded with a magazine next to them. In case of a need ( almost never ), they can pull their guns and put the magazine in. However, there were very strict regulation on police pulling guns. Basically, WW3 had to start for them to pull a gun. Also, unlike in the USA, there were immensely strict regulation on police firing a gun. Basically, a cop could fire a gun, only, after the cop was dead.
Great video.
I just want to say...your narration has really improved since your early days. Well done!
Yes yes but half the footage wasn’t even of the HO229
And overly clickbait title
Thank goodness we had the Northrop Flying Wing. Otherwise we wouldn't have been able to nuke the Martians.
This “vaporplane” could have had no role in changing the war, any more than Buck Rogers’ spaceship.
Exactly.
False.
I don't care how wonky they were, my favorite wunderwaffe are the Ho 229, the "powdered egg," and the rocket winged Triebflugeljager interceptor.
I liked the ME-163 also, thought it was very interesting when I was a kid
A: The Horton wasn't a stealth bomber and B: It didn't almost change WW2!
Interesting that they moved to Canada after the war and opened a successful chain of coffee shops.
😂
Aren't these Horton brothers also known as the guys that heard a Who ?
Hermann Göring had been a WW1 fighter ace, NOT WW2 as you stated!
His fat ass couldn’t get In a WW2 fighter, maybe a in a bomb bay
just curious, what was the horn thing held in front of the eyes at 1:40 ? It looked like some kind of visual aid, but Googling it didn't help.
A few years ago a group of engineers from Northrop built a scale mockup of it using similar materials at the Northrop Skunk Works. They then placed it on the pedestal that was made to test the Have Blue craft's radar cross section in order to test it against radar. They were surprised to find that it would have had a very small radar cross section against the radars in use by the US and Great Britain during WW II. This was all on a Discovery Channel show about the HO 229.
Except the NG model lacked the steel frame of the original and had no engines. At the frequencies used by British EW radar there is little skin reflection and those two missing elements would have been major contributors to RCS.
@@timgosling3076 Probably right. I'm not a radar technician nor a scientist. Was just stating what I say on the Discovery Channel show. Thanks for the additional info though.
The test was fake.
It's as if there were only the Germans or the Americans that developed aircraft without a tail, my dad, who was a teenager at the time, worked in a factory in Baginton near Coventry, making parts for Armstrong Whitley, he mentioned on a few occasions a bomber that was being developed that was a flying wing.
The first reference to a flying wing I saw mentioned was a 19teens proposal for a flying wing airliner that went nowhere.
The Horten Ho-229 V3 was not the fighter/bomber the Nazis hoped it would be, it was an aeronautical Hail Mary at best and a death trap for pilots who would fly it. Empirical evidence already showed that any loss of thrust would send it into a death spiral, as with Northrup's YB-49 it would have possessed terrible stall characteristics and a lack of vertical control surfaces meant a spin would be unrecoverable. Going after bombers meant encountering allied fighters, and any heavy-handed handling would result in a fatal compressor stall, which also dogged the ME 262.
A voice of sanity. The Germans were always looking for the panacea weapon that would change the outcome of the war. Tiger, Panther, Jagdtiger, etc. Absent an economy strong enough to outproduce the Allies, the outcome of the war was nearly a foregone conclusion. The Horton never reached an operational test unit but Dark Skies claims it almost changed the outcome of the war. Let's surmise that the Horton actually reached operational combat units and lived up to its promise-- however doubtful that may be. All that changes is that a German city becomes the first nuclear target, not Hiroshima.
The HO229 would of been in time what they wanted it to be, Horten said it was designed with Stealth in mind as it's Flying Wing Shape is stealth to begin with and they added fine charcoal dust into the paint and the HO229 was nearly all wood. Radar dose not work on wood. HO229 did do test flights and one crashed due to a Jet engine failed at the test pilot was told not to take the HO229 out. The HO229 would of been a game changer had it been a few more years up it's sleeve.
@@666theninja Maybe. But you ignore a critical facet of information. Raw materials. The limiting factor for the Me 262 was specialty alloys for the engines. The Germans never had enough chrome for example or nickel. Exactly where was Germany going to acquire these alloys in 1945?
@@666theninja Jack Northrup was never able to engineer out the inherent flaws in his flying wing design, with the final model flying for the last time in 1950 and cancelled for solid technological reasons, only to resurface as the B-52 45 years later.
@@infantryattacks Wood was Stealth :)
The Dark Docs channels are among the best of all TH-cam has to offer. KEEP IT GOING BOYS!!
Btw this video is literally total bullshit, none of what the guy is saying here is remotely true about the Horton. It’s full of blatant falsehoods I thankfully know from being a really big aircraft nerd.
If you want a more informative, actually-correct video, Lazerpig’s channel has a fantastic and funny video regarding this exact plane.
Not really, there’s a LOT of wrong/innaccurate things in this video, 2 even in the title, the 229 was neither stealthy or a bomber
dark docs is in the pits of hell when it comes to historical videos on TH-cam
I saw a video about actual US radar testing of a fixed-up Horten... and they concluded that it was not very stealthy
Detected at 100km instead of 130km
There's also a rumor going around that there was a charcoal infused resin used to glue the plane together that was radar absorbent. Funny that the actual report Gumman did on the 229 had no mention of this binding agent...
That test was inaccurate.
There's a complete full scale replica of the Ho-229 hanging from the ceiling at the San Diego Air & Space Museum as well.
'almost changed WW2' - and we're off into the realm of fantasy.....
You are wrong on one thing... The '229' Designation was not given to the Horten aircraft. As the aircraft neared the prototype phase it was determined by the RLM that the aircraft would be constructed by the Gotha aircraft company as the Hortens had no mass production facilities. Gotha never built one but the typ number '229' was assigned by the RLM. This was common practice with aircraft being developed. Had one actually been made by Gotha it would have been called "G0-229" not "HO-229" since the first letters represented the manufacturer. The only exception was Kurt Tank who was actually given a series of numbers with his own initials since he was so highly respected by the Reich. They correct Designation for all Horten wing aircraft made were the Ho prefix followed by roman numerals.
If they had all the wonder weapons they were working a year sooner I don't see the US and Russia along with the other countries winning
Enjoyed your video and I gave it a Thumbs Up
Germany *makes several prototypes and new weapons development facilities*. American air power: “actually I don’t like that”
Interesting video - also interesting that you miss out the fact that it wasn't just the Americans liberating Western Europe or approaching Berlin. The British and Commonwealth forces played a huge part in the liberation of Western Europe and the Russians took Berlin. I generally find "The Allies" is a better descriptor than "The Americans" when it comes to WWII.
Yep. That stuck in my craw as well. There are no end of idiotic and destructive arguments about who could or should have done what, with or without help during the Second World War. But the truth of the matter is Britain did not defeat Germany. America did not defeat Germany either. _The Alliance of Britain and America_ defeated Germany with a massive amount of the heavy lifting being provided by the Red Army.
I have noticed over the past year or so this guy is becoming more and more chauvinistic in his view of world events and American exceptionalism. He has also become increasingly outspoken and extreme with his American right-wing political views. It is starting to be very uncomfortable and comes out the most in the 'Dark Docs' presentations of supposed history. Blatant lies or at least embarrassing misunderstandings are presented as hard fact. It is a real shame because I have loved this channel for nearly ten years now.
@5:18 Fat Herman was a ww1 ace, i can't imagine him in a bf109 with his 300 pounds !!!
The HO 229 was NOT stealthy. Where's Lazerpig when you need him?
The wooden construction reduced the radar cross section.
@@christopherrobinson7541 Not by much. There was still plenty of time to intercept.
@@britishrocklovingyank3491 Thank you for that statement which is very true. This thing was not a bomber, it was not stealthy. As Lazerpig says about "Wehr-a-boos..." sigh.
You're videos are fantastic I just can't get enough of them, I amazed you aren't directing movies in Hollywood.
😂😂😂
The one thing I find funny Jack Northrup and the Horten brothers had been working on flying wing designs independently of each other, yet people wish to believe the US had stolen the design.
The U.S. was aware of the Horten's work. If it was so bad, then why bring any to the United states?
@@AlexMarciniszyn-y1k The flying wing design had the inherent design flaw of stability, and it wasn't till the advent of fly by wire and advance computers did the flying wing become feasible.
Jack Northrup was quoted as saying God allowed him to live long enough when shown the B-2 Spirit.
Could you imagine the expressions on the faces of the young men from the wheat belt and cities of America, and their officers when they walked into that hanger and saw the jet powered wings, talk about next level stuff - MAN THOSE THONGS ARE FROM A LEVEL THEY NEVER IMAGINED COULD EXIST!
Well there was literally a similar american plane that existed before so maybe ig, but...
@@imperialinquisition6006 Wouldn't that have been TOP SECRET and not on the front page of Stars and Stripes for the men on the frontline to see?
@@justme.9711 It was Patton's forces steamrolling across Germany and they captured Gotha's workshop with the unfinished prototypes. They took some photos and handed work off to Army Intelligence.
0:06 Actually, Allied troops of many nations, "had almost seized Western Germany".
Don't go bursting a blood vessel because he didn't mention the other 20+ nations involved.
The same could be said for a lot of fronts, but the US was the one to capture the 229 which is why they're mentioned.
It was not stealth whatsoever , was never built to be stealthy lol
It was mostly wood and had carbon between layers, that does absorb radar, so it would have been harder to detects. Too bad the engines were not reliable due to inadequate metal alloys. Amazing aerodynamic design too.
To bad for who?
Too bad for who?
ooo wood and carbon is all we need to beat radar huh? damm what are they spending trillions of dollars on all that wood and carbon (fiber I think you ment to say carbon fiber... because we are all made out of carbon pretty much everything is) what a fool
I hear LazerPig malding inhumanly in the background
Goering was world war 1 ace, not WW2
I purchased a model kit of the Ho 229 at an air show in the UK in the 1980s when I was child - evidently fascinated since.
You used a rather interesting piece of music for the first 6 minutes or so of your presentation - are you able to share what that was - it was very good.
Thank you
In WW1, all planes were stealth... They still got shot down...
It would have been better if some editing had happened: multiple repetitions of footage of airplanes that were NOT the Horten planes. I saw Northrop flying wing, the Henschel jet fighter, and the Komet, for Pete’s sake! way too much filler, not enough footage of actual Horten flying machines. Tighten it up guys !
it not a Stealth Bomber the plane light up in radar
Not true.
@@AlexMarciniszyn-y1k ok show me
Both wrong, a stealth plane doesnt mean noz showing up it means being low observable aka spot but no track etc, technically Any night bomber was stealth, also it did have reduced rcs though no where near a dedicated stealth plane
FYI Herman Gouring was a WW1 ace not WW2 and this plane was hardly a stealth plane as the idea of stealth fighters as we know it was not yet conceived.
No, it was neither stealth, nor would it have changed WWII in any notable way whatsoever.
Let’s pretend for arguments sake that the very moment the on-paper design is given the pass that it reaches instant readiness to produce. It still means NOTHING. the losers that were the Nazis have little means to produce a jet fighter in that stage of the war, let alone one that isn’t a total deathtrap for its pilots like the HO was. It was fragile, of flimsy construction at the best of times, and poorly designed for any endurance combat lacking multirole function or ability to carry more useful armaments.
It certainly was not stealth, that’s a total reformer driven myth. Please do not perpetuate that. The only “stealth” natures of the plane was that it was hard to see- because it didn’t exist.
The HO229, like many other latewar Nazi crackhead projects, are aesthetically pleasing failures; relegated to the annals of history for the failure of a side that made a failure of a plane.
Just once thing, It was not a nazi project, it was a german project.
The nazis project was to control Europe.
1. Goering never flew in combat during WWII.
2. "drag was practically non-existent" is just plain wrong. Non-existent drag would imply unlimited speed.
3. Reduced radar cross section because of its design doesn't make it stealthy (for its time maybe, but radar technology advanced quickly)
It was not a stealth bomber, I repeat, not a stealth bomber. It was never intended to be. It was not made purposely with "stealthy" modern radar absorbing materials as they did not yet exist. It's shape might have been a little stealthy to radar technology of the time but that would been only due to happenstance. The radars of the time were not very good but were good enough to pick up a formation of aircraft but usually not a single aircraft. Early on in the Battle of Britain, the radar they used to detect the German formations was indeed quite good for the time. But the Germans would have had no fear of American radar to detect a plane very far away, and so would not have felt a need to develop stealth technology. Which they did not, nor did they attempt it. The ability to evade radar was not even one of the design requirements of the Horton flying wings. So get over it.
One of these German experimental aircraft is what crashed at Roswell.
Beautiful plane. I'd love to see it in flight someday.
I wish he had touched on the unique pressurized suit the pilot wore.
It’s unlikely to be flown considering the design wasn’t that good.