I don't know squat about MX racing from the time I was a kid, back in the 70's & 80's, to today... during that time, to me it was always Honda XL or XR (not that I had one), but this was these were the bikes I dreamed of owning and riding. I have seen many iterations of bike models and designs over the decades, but I still gravitate back to the 83-85 XL's & XR's for off-roading. I just love the look and design of those older bikes. ANYWAY, I just wonder if bikes are getting better, and to the riders who have been around long enough to truly understand bike design, have bike really gotten better with each year, or of these seasoned expert riders, have bikes in MX peaked, and where (what year)? If given the choice, instead of getting a new bike each year to race, is there a bike from the past (in one's career) that is still better than a newer bike. Given if set up right, is there an older bike that could be better than the new bikes coming out... if so, what makes that older bike better in competition, and what is it about some new bikes that just don't compare to the older bike in performance? I personally feel many manufacturers are just trying too hard to create new designs that are not better, but just simply a compromise to build costs and sales. I know that some bikes are designed well, but I also feel that riders often make the bike rather than the bike making the rider -- but this too is joint effort -- what era would any of you say was the best all-around bikes (reliability & performance)?
This man is responsible for my love of sx/mx hands down. I remember watching my first sx race in 91 and told my parents this is the coolest ahit ever!!! And I wanna be that guy! The king!!!
All hale King Jeremy!!!!🫅my favorite rider of all time!! Got to meet him a couple years at High Point and he genuinely cared enough to talk to u and listen and answer questions!!! 😎💪🙏🇺🇸
I think liability was the main factor behind over-building those frames. If they wanted to race/R&D them in the US they had to sell them to the public. Not a good look to have people dying due to snapped frames but super-stiff frames causing big get-offs can always be blamed on rider error lol...
It was great to hear Jeremy talk about why he left Honda. My memories of him are always on the Honda...It's always been strange to me seeing him on anything but a Honda...
i know... when he left i was just like... what? i've always rode hondas, literally since i was 2 years old. never had a bad experience with one, and never had a great experience with anything else. and i was a HUGE fan of his. but i couldn't really blame him then, and definitely not now. i never liked the aluminum frames, even just seeing them when they first came out and nobody knew they sucked yet. super bike aluminum works, but for dirt... i'll stick with the old steelies.
Best times ever were watching hi every Saturday night. Carmichael and Stewart were fun to watch too, such a shame Stewart never came back. Malcolm did well, but he wasn't his brother that would find lines no one else could...
IF he would have trained and got into the MOTOCROSS as good as he did SUPERCROSS. He would BE THE GOAT RIGHT NOW HANDS DOWN. I SAY MORE OFTEN THAN NOT THAT JETT IS A KID FROM ANOTHER PLANET AND WILL BE THE GOAT WHEN HIS CAREER IS OVER. I DO BELIEVE HE IS THE PERSON THAT MOTOCROSS HAS NEVER SEEN BEFORE. FASTER AND BETTER THAN CARMICHAEL AND EVERYONE THAT'S EVER DONE MOTOCROSS. FLASH BACK THO. NOBODY WILL EVER PASS JEREMY MCGRATH AS THE GOAT OF SUPERCROSS. JEREMY WAS AND ISTHE BEST SUPERCROSS RIDER EVER AND WILL NOT BE SURPASSED EVER THAT I SEE. 59 MYSELF AND IF I LIVE TO BE 100 JEREMY WILL STILL BE THE KING OF SUPERCROSS. BECAUSE HE HAD A WAY TO PUT HIS BIKE BACK ON THE WHEELS THAT TO THIS DAY HAS NOT BEEN REPLICATED. KING OF SUPERCROSS FOREVER IS JEREMY MCGRATH, HANDS DOWN. HOW MANY YEARS NOW. MAN JUST FOREVER AGO AND NOBODY AS EVEN GOTTEN CLOSE TO HIM. DIDN'T MATTER HOW SLICK, RUTTED, STICKY, OR ANYTHING ELSE IT GOT, JEREMY WAS WINNING.
The footage from Des Nations 96 is forever imprinted in my mind. McGrath was untouchable on his iconic CR250 in the red and blue Fox 360 gear, what a ride!
Sounds like McGrath went through what Mick Doohan was constantly fighting against at Repsol Honda in the 90s 500cc Grand Prix championship; the engineers kept wanting to advance the NSR500 road racer forward and Mick kept insisting they leave it alone. Given that dirtbikes are a lot less sophisticated than road racers, it makes sense why drastic chassis changes and fork changes wouldn't be worth it.
Had the opportunity to grow up around MC and his parents. One of my biggest heroes hands down and the fact I’ve gotten to hangout with him and his family a few times when I was a young kid still blows my mind. Absolutely great family.
@@swedish_sadhguru3854 Ask Honda. He had contracts with them and who knows who else from bike parts to clothing manufacturers and sponsors. Bonuses for each win, bonus for being CHAMP, he was unstoppable...
@@atcmadness4351 his parents live up the freeway from me. Used to have MC’s personal supercross track there. Jack (Jeremy’s dad) has a hot rod shop not far either.
Thank God I rode a 97 CR250 before I went and bought the "Revolutionary Frame" It was a arm pump machine disguised as a dirtbike. I have no idea how Lusk rode that beast. MC was and still is my favorite rider of all time.
I was too young to witness MC’s Honda days live, but McGrath is the reason I bought a Yamaha YZ80. A few years later Carmichael and Stewart inspired me to get a Kawasaki KX125.
yeah it was, i had a 97 cr125. great bike. always wanted a 94-96 250. he must be thinking of 98, cause that bike was perfect. of course my dad took it out, flipped it backwards and wrecked it before i even saw the damn thing, so it had a permanently tweeked handlebar. on the left side. til i finally got a set of bars like 10 years later.
I was in my mid to late teen years when McGrath was racing I lived and breather moto. He was plastered all over my walls in those days to me. He is legendary in my mind he is always will be the king of supercross.
Is same here I was Is born in 1980. I've been obsessed with motorcycles my whole life. Mcgrath was the king through the Mid nineties. All of my friends had frosted tips and hoops through their Ears
@@kenandrieling5885 haha me too I’m 1980. I had the under cut hair like McGrath had as well no frosted tips though. You were probably watching all the time stuff I was we lived in era that started freestyle with the crusty series and many other moto movies. Good times man!
The first aluminum frame CR 125 was 1998. The 1997 CR 250 was aluminum but the 125 didn’t get it until the next year in 1998. McGrath is the man! Also, the aluminum frame concept was 75% driven by marketing. It was the new cool “thing” that was going to sell more.
I saw Jeremy in Anaheim when he was starting out in Supercross. He was on a KX125 with 125 number plates. He was still a privateer. I think that I have seen him ride live at 6 different races. He's my all-time favorite rider.
I had a 98 cr125 as my first bike, that nice big polished aluminum frame coming down the side, it just looks so sexy compared to the other steel 125s of same year.
This is 100% correct. 97 CR250 - First year of the aluminum frame for any mainstream motocross bike. 97 CR125 - Last year of the steel frame CR125, as in 98 Honda made the CR125 an aluminum frame bike like they did to the CR250 the year prior. I think that the next mainstream bikes (other than the Honda 4 strokes) to go aluminum frame were the 05 YZ125 and YZ250. Then in 06 I believe the KX450F and RMZ450 were introduced as aluminum framed bikes, as were the 06 YZF bikes. The original KX250F and RMZ250 were I believe introduced in 04, and were steel framed, and basically identical bikes minus plastics, and graphics.
Bike manufatures take as much input from the marketing teams as they do from engineering, procurment and riders. I'd say the switch to aluminium frames was a marketing move - sounds new and high tech (for the mid-90's) compared to steel frames.
They should have definitely given him the option to ride the bike he wanted not only for his safety but for being a winning rider. J Mac is one of the best and a super cool guy.
I was riding Yamahas in 1998, which they were probably the best bikes out there, as an intermediate rider. My friend bought a '98 CR 125 and asked me at a track in San Jacinto if i wanted to try it, so I said sure. Keeping in mind that it wasnt set up for me, I wasnt really pushing it that hard but damn! That thing was soooooooo freakin stiff. I ended up crashing on it and broke my foot (and bought him a new set of plastics). Those early aluminum frames were so bad. They LOOKED cool and cutting edge, but they didnt track for shyte
I remember hearing in the late 90s the aluminum was cheaper to procure in Japan whereas steel was expensive and harder to get for them. Thats why I heard they had to switch otherwise it wasn't feasible to run steel for them
SUBBED!! The KING will never see this, but so many of us hated to see him on the Suzuki (or anything aside from a Honda because he was so good on them), and we all could see that it wasn't working for him. Not only the handling, it just didn't seem to have the same power the CR's did, other machines would pull away from him. In 96 Supercross got kind of boring, Jeremy would holeshot, check out, and the whole main event would be just watching the guys behind him, rarely did someone even come close to catching up because of his training and physical conditioning. We did hear and read many rumors about his dislike of the aluminum frame being to stiff, now confirmed thanks to this video!! It does make you wonder why Honda changed, what influenced that? They had such an amazing bike. I had a 94 CR250 and although I was a no one, that bike felt so good. I truly feel that the best racing was back in the 90's, although later on it was super fun to watch Stewart and Carmichael as well but watching Jeremy was always a blast. Your subs would all love to hear the James Stewart story as we never got any closure. WTF and WHY did he never come back after that small incident?? There were rumors every year, for like 6 years, that he would be coming back, but it was like he lost his flame. Please get him on your show!!
I'll never forget the editor of Dirt Bike Magazine Ron Lawson helping Rodger Decoster learn how to write a monthly column. It was great to hear from Decoster because this was the time of Jeremy McGrath when nobody could touch him. Who else could speak on this phenomena other than Decoster. I believe he used the example of the athletic achievement of running a sub 4 min mile. This intimidating barrier that for decades Olympic athletes got close to but never achieved. Until someone finally DID break through the psychological barrier then several other runners quickly followed. Decoster goes on- The same will be true on the track. Once riders realize that it is all in their head. That it is not an unattainable goal to beat the seemingly untouchable Jeremy McGrath. Says Rodger-eventually someone is going to beat him and when that happens others will soon follow. Quite a compliment to Jeremy I think. When YOU ARE that psychological barrier, however long it lasts. That's the greatest impression one could ever leave in their field of competition.
I totally agree with MC! Todays motocross frames are way too stiff. I had -99 CR125 and it was the worst handling bike I have ever owned and currently own vintage -86 CR125 with old steel frame the bike corners like a dream and doesn't punish the rider in square edge edge bumps like the modern bikes
I bought a 98 CR250 new and raced it that year. Guess that explains why I was so slow and on the edge of crashing hard. It wasn't me after all. I feel better now.😂👍
the headshake part was true for the steel framed hondas, but yeah i got the impression they thought the 97 125 was aluminum too, which as you said it's not
Fax the the 125 didn’t come out with the aluminum frame until 98 and like 97 was the first year for the 250 then came the 125 aluminum frame which no one like because of the way you sit on the bike it wasn’t built like a normal bike
All this time I thought Honda dropped him because he bought a jet ski, that was the story in Motocross Journal ( or maybe Dirt Rider / Motocross Action, one of those)
Honda didn’t want a rider that didn’t show up to practice and was into the party scene. They knew his time was limited and no racing outdoors…bye Felicia he had talent but no heart.
Great video Gypsy and MC 🤴 . Bought an 97 CR250. Thing looked cool but went to a hard pack track in Jersey and woke up on the ground with a broken scalula 😂 Damn that bike
I’ll never forget the first time meeting MC in 91 at Loretta Lynn’s when he was on Team Peak Honda 125 and Brian Swink awesome memories and then 92 till he retired I met him every year at Atlanta Supercross and always was a KING on and off the bike he always would talk to me and sign everything I had for him to sign and I had a chance to buy the 97 RM 250 the one he used to ride in the Steel Roots Video it was at The Troy Shop in Dayton Ohio it was awesome and he will always be my hero and the greatest memories Thank You Showtime #JeremyMcgrath #GypsyTales
McGrath states that riders aren’t familiar with the engineering world but at the same time I must say the engineers aren’t familiar with the riders world. The engineers themselves need to be able to ride what they create.
Those same engineers design vehicles that need the cab lifted to replace the exhaust manifold, or other small repairs. They pay no mind to us peasants...
I was in Baja at the sand dunes in Rosarito Beach. There was a bunch of the top Jet Ski and moto people down there. I am thinking this was one of Jeremy's first rides on that Honda. That thing was so awesome looking! I was bummed to hear him say that he hated it. I did go home and buy one though, just because it was so awesome looking, worst bike I have ever owned!
LOL, Yamaha engineers ask Jeremy McGrath “what do you want in a bike?” He wheels in a 1993 Honda CR250R “I want you to get some modern Yamaha Plastics & make them fit this!!”
I bought a brand new 1997 cr250 because of the king, then he bailed and everyone told me my bike was s**t… 😂 Didn’t matter because I was to young and didn’t race at the time.
The only bike I kept for 2 years was my 97 CR125 when I tried riding a friends 98 CR125 (1st year aluminum for 125) it was so terrible all it wanted to do was stand up in corners and the vibration, not to mention it wasn't getting enough air so it was slowwww. I went to Yamaha in 99 and never looked back. Honda destroyed some great bikes
I don't remember the the source so don't quote me, but I want to say the reason the switch was made to aluminum was the ability to reduce the count of the components making up the frame by using castings rather than individual stampings and bent tubes, which reduces the amount of fixturing and welding. Engineers have to contend with manufacturing costs and often have a cost target that forces some compromises to the design.
@@crf80fdarkdays Maybe today, but definitely not in 96. Honda dirtbikes literally pioneered the way for modern suspension. In 2000, Kawasaki literally copied their design ideas and applied them to Supersport bikes on the J model Ninja. That's why a mildly modded J model Ninja with a swingarm swap keeps up or is faster than many modern bikes.
The reason the first aluminum frames were so stiff is because the engineers knew aluminum is a weaker material than steel, so they over built the frame. They were worried the aluminum would stress and break, so they made sure that wouldn’t happen by building the crap out of the frame.
I was bummed when he left honda...but it was for good reason...I've got a 1988 honda trx 250r mainly because of this guy and how he ripped the cr250 in late 90s.
jack had his bmx free agent bike dialed in lol. they use to help me with setup with my bikes at temecula bmx aba expert class but i was a few years behind him. i really enjoyed practicing with them it made me so much faster. i was so happy for him when he got to motocross, as it was all the bmx kids dreams we all used to sit on the bleachers talking about going pro lol. good times
I bought the 97 CR 250. It was extremely stiff. Headshake king. Arm pump central. Bought the 2002 next. Suzuki was twitchy too but the CR was something else.
@@rcpilot179 I had a 95, did the factory blue kit like Emig"s bike. Then the 96 came out, better ergos like the Honda. I sold it to buy my first house, then bought the 97 Honda lol 😆 oops 😬
Thank you Jeremy for the honest interview. OMG: I was an up and coming amateur MXer in my twenties. Then bought the 97 Honda 250. I guess I was a victim of marketing. That bike hurt me so many times I gave up MX for 20 years. Then it was steel frame KTM's. Now 17 years after that I'm still kickin it on MX and offroad. GD Honda, Much hate. Although I did like the three 2007 Hondas I bought.
That honda head shake was brutal. I went from a cr80 to a brand new 2001 cr250 and thought i was going to die every time i rode it. Ended up selling it after a while then bought a new 2003 cr 250 and it was soooo much better. Still have it to this very day
@@julianlaustsen1991 5th gear wide open and hit a rut and it was almost guaranteed to do it. My 03 has never done it to me. My buddys old 99 used to do it as well
@@julianlaustsen1991 my 01 was alright on trails on low to mid range and I remember how much the frame used to vibrate like it was really tinny even just idling compared to my 03 frame
I went from a 95 CR 250 to the 97 The 97 was absolutely junk. I broke more bones on that 97 than any other bike. In fact that was the last year I raced because of the injurys...
The reason why the Honda was so stiff in the beginning is because you would never wanna under build a frame and risk detrimental, cracking and lawsuits from Frank cracking and injury. Overbuilding is a safe bet in the beginning which equals stiff. They knew they wanted to go aluminum, they probably knew that they were over building the frame, but they also knew it would not break and crack and injure people due to frame breaking in half. It’s that simple.
i had cr500af done on a 2001 cr250 chassis. it shook so much that while standing, my feet would vibrate off the pegs. it was wicked. where ever i took it people acted like i had shown up with a dragon. but I secretly hated it. the only day happier than the day i bought it is the day it left.
I think the first aluminum frames were way over built due to concerns about lawsuits should a new technology have issues and failures. Also, I think they made the aluminum frames to be similar to the MotoGP bikes of the time, connecting the steering stem to the swingarm pivot with a straight beam. It was the same thing with the MotoGP bikes of the era. They were too stiff laterally when leaned over. It's taken much engineering to get the incredible machines we have access to these days.
2002 cr250r best 250. Has the RC valve, newer frame, and last of the green sticker. Can ride all year in California. Now if you live in a free state, im sure theres a lot more options.
Saw him on the suzuki in houston that year. Every lap over the grandstand, he was spinning the adjuster like crazy. He looked miserable while signing autographs. The Honda teams weren't happy either. The Yamaha boys were all smiles that year.
I came along before McGrath's time. New CR's and RM 250's. It amazes me that with Jeremy's ability, you would think Honda would build for him what would win for them. But you know executives, they think they know whats best to do. They clearly dont.
The reason I was told for the switch from steel to aluminum is that Japan was going through a steel shortage. Starting around mid 96 and Honda decided to switch to the aluminum frame for the 250 for 97 and then the 125 in 98. After that, it was the cost of steel that drove the other Japanese manufacturers to switch over to aluminum.
So he left Honda for the same reason everyone leaves Honda: HRC believes with their entire corporate soul that the rider doesn’t matter and engineering is infallible.
The first bike I bought for myself was a 1998 CR250. Headshaking monster. I rode it tons and thought it was great until I rode a friend's 1995 CR250. It was so good! Ultra smooth, very forgiving, jumped flat no matter how bad you screw it up on the approach. I traded my '98 for a 1995 CR500 two weeks later. That '98 CR250 was absolutely miserable. Ridiculously rigid frame, pipe that resembles suspension, and a huge frame that makes maintenance very difficult. Good riddance.
I had a 94 CR250 and that bike was amazing, nearly killed me but that was because of me, not the bike. The aluminum framed bikes looked nice, but they were just too stiff...
97 125 was last year for steel sounds like you were thinking of a 98 i know this beouse i had one and it was my favorite it did have head shake but it was only bad if you got lazy or stupid tired.
I bought the 97 CR 250R.. was excited as hell ! Took it to the track that weekend, and was like W.T.F. did i do !? Big disappointment. I still have that bike. Sitting in my man cave.
Because Suzuki was smart enough to realize their buyers were not factory pros. Those forks at that time were amazing vs. upside down forks at the time. I moved up 2 classes riding my 96 and 97 RM250. But when I hit pro class you did notice the flex in them especially diving hard into flat corners. By then they were getting the dealership bikes upside down forks figured out hence the switch back in 99. McGrath's Showas were nothing you could come close to getting on a dealership bike. Also no matter how much you had someone work on them you cant beat the factory finesse. Upside down forks really didn't get amazing until the KYB's that were on the stock Yamaha's in 06.
Those bikes were allowed to make chassis changes not allowed in the usa. The Europeans were still mostly works bikes. All honda had to do was keep the look of the chassis in Europe but could change a lot about it.
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I don't know squat about MX racing from the time I was a kid, back in the 70's & 80's, to today... during that time, to me it was always Honda XL or XR (not that I had one), but this was these were the bikes I dreamed of owning and riding. I have seen many iterations of bike models and designs over the decades, but I still gravitate back to the 83-85 XL's & XR's for off-roading. I just love the look and design of those older bikes. ANYWAY, I just wonder if bikes are getting better, and to the riders who have been around long enough to truly understand bike design, have bike really gotten better with each year, or of these seasoned expert riders, have bikes in MX peaked, and where (what year)? If given the choice, instead of getting a new bike each year to race, is there a bike from the past (in one's career) that is still better than a newer bike. Given if set up right, is there an older bike that could be better than the new bikes coming out... if so, what makes that older bike better in competition, and what is it about some new bikes that just don't compare to the older bike in performance? I personally feel many manufacturers are just trying too hard to create new designs that are not better, but just simply a compromise to build costs and sales. I know that some bikes are designed well, but I also feel that riders often make the bike rather than the bike making the rider -- but this too is joint effort -- what era would any of you say was the best all-around bikes (reliability & performance)?
This man is responsible for my love of sx/mx hands down. I remember watching my first sx race in 91 and told my parents this is the coolest ahit ever!!! And I wanna be that guy! The king!!!
Jeremy is such a great guy still today after all his fame, remembering watching he and Emig/larocco in those years. great times....
I'm 38 now. Those definitely were the golden years. Like 90s NBA.
All hale King Jeremy!!!!🫅my favorite rider of all time!! Got to meet him a couple years at High Point and he genuinely cared enough to talk to u and listen and answer questions!!! 😎💪🙏🇺🇸
The frame designers were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't didn't stop to think if they should.
I think liability was the main factor behind over-building those frames. If they wanted to race/R&D them in the US they had to sell them to the public. Not a good look to have people dying due to snapped frames but super-stiff frames causing big get-offs can always be blamed on rider error lol...
Jurassic park 😂
Was his bike steel framed?
@@CraigHenry-zq8jz Jeremy quit Honda when they switched from steel to alloy
@CraigHenry-zq8jz 96 CR250 was steel frame. Honda switched to the ultra-rigid aluminum frame in 97(the first to do so) and Jeremy said sionara.
It was great to hear Jeremy talk about why he left Honda. My memories of him are always on the Honda...It's always been strange to me seeing him on anything but a Honda...
i know... when he left i was just like... what? i've always rode hondas, literally since i was 2 years old. never had a bad experience with one, and never had a great experience with anything else. and i was a HUGE fan of his. but i couldn't really blame him then, and definitely not now. i never liked the aluminum frames, even just seeing them when they first came out and nobody knew they sucked yet. super bike aluminum works, but for dirt... i'll stick with the old steelies.
I grew up watching him ride for Yamaha
Best times ever were watching hi every Saturday night. Carmichael and Stewart were fun to watch too, such a shame Stewart never came back. Malcolm did well, but he wasn't his brother that would find lines no one else could...
Those were the days! No doubt...Bubba kept things exciting!@@atcmadness4351
Favorite rider ever, so cool to hear his perspective on this stuff
IF he would have trained and got into the MOTOCROSS as good as he did SUPERCROSS. He would BE THE GOAT RIGHT NOW HANDS DOWN. I SAY MORE OFTEN THAN NOT THAT JETT IS A KID FROM ANOTHER PLANET AND WILL BE THE GOAT WHEN HIS CAREER IS OVER. I DO BELIEVE HE IS THE PERSON THAT MOTOCROSS HAS NEVER SEEN BEFORE. FASTER AND BETTER THAN CARMICHAEL AND EVERYONE THAT'S EVER DONE MOTOCROSS. FLASH BACK THO. NOBODY WILL EVER PASS JEREMY MCGRATH AS THE GOAT OF SUPERCROSS. JEREMY WAS AND ISTHE BEST SUPERCROSS RIDER EVER AND WILL NOT BE SURPASSED EVER THAT I SEE. 59 MYSELF AND IF I LIVE TO BE 100 JEREMY WILL STILL BE THE KING OF SUPERCROSS. BECAUSE HE HAD A WAY TO PUT HIS BIKE BACK ON THE WHEELS THAT TO THIS DAY HAS NOT BEEN REPLICATED. KING OF SUPERCROSS FOREVER IS JEREMY MCGRATH, HANDS DOWN. HOW MANY YEARS NOW. MAN JUST FOREVER AGO AND NOBODY AS EVEN GOTTEN CLOSE TO HIM. DIDN'T MATTER HOW SLICK, RUTTED, STICKY, OR ANYTHING ELSE IT GOT, JEREMY WAS WINNING.
The footage from Des Nations 96 is forever imprinted in my mind.
McGrath was untouchable on his iconic CR250 in the red and blue Fox 360 gear, what a ride!
10:46 But the 97 CR125 still had the steel frame. it changed a year after the 250 in 98.
That's true must have ment 98 lol
Sounds like McGrath went through what Mick Doohan was constantly fighting against at Repsol Honda in the 90s 500cc Grand Prix championship; the engineers kept wanting to advance the NSR500 road racer forward and Mick kept insisting they leave it alone. Given that dirtbikes are a lot less sophisticated than road racers, it makes sense why drastic chassis changes and fork changes wouldn't be worth it.
Had the opportunity to grow up around MC and his parents. One of my biggest heroes hands down and the fact I’ve gotten to hangout with him and his family a few times when I was a young kid still blows my mind. Absolutely great family.
I can imagine. How much money was he making in the 90s?
Lucky you bro!! He always seemed like a great dude...
@@swedish_sadhguru3854 Ask Honda. He had contracts with them and who knows who else from bike parts to clothing manufacturers and sponsors. Bonuses for each win, bonus for being CHAMP, he was unstoppable...
@@atcmadness4351 his parents live up the freeway from me. Used to have MC’s personal supercross track there. Jack (Jeremy’s dad) has a hot rod shop not far either.
Thank God I rode a 97 CR250 before I went and bought the "Revolutionary Frame" It was a arm pump machine disguised as a dirtbike. I have no idea how Lusk rode that beast.
MC was and still is my favorite rider of all time.
It's so freaking funny and cool listening to MC talk about the Honda switch back in the day.... he's very transparent which is so refreshing.
I was too young to witness MC’s Honda days live, but McGrath is the reason I bought a Yamaha YZ80. A few years later Carmichael and Stewart inspired me to get a Kawasaki KX125.
I never understood people like you, never heard of sponsorships…
@@Rubeless Who cares what inspired him to ride..... What a sad person you are.
@@Rubeless yes that’s exactly why I got them. The riders promoted the bikes I wanted.
@@JPW328 same reason Nike sponsors athletes. Dummy tried so hard to be cool.
If memory serves, the 1997 CR125 was steel frame. It was a year behind the 250 in switching to aluminum.
yeah it was, i had a 97 cr125. great bike. always wanted a 94-96 250. he must be thinking of 98, cause that bike was perfect. of course my dad took it out, flipped it backwards and wrecked it before i even saw the damn thing, so it had a permanently tweeked handlebar. on the left side. til i finally got a set of bars like 10 years later.
@@salvadordollyparton666i loved my 97. So did a lot of the guys i raced with that had a 98
I was in my mid to late teen years when McGrath was racing I lived and breather moto. He was plastered all over my walls in those days to me. He is legendary in my mind he is always will be the king of supercross.
Is same here I was Is born in 1980. I've been obsessed with motorcycles my whole life. Mcgrath was the king through the Mid nineties. All of my friends had frosted tips and hoops through their Ears
@@kenandrieling5885 haha me too I’m 1980. I had the under cut hair like McGrath had as well no frosted tips though. You were probably watching all the time stuff I was we lived in era that started freestyle with the crusty series and many other moto movies. Good times man!
He was my hero growing up. As soon as i watched steel roots i was hooked
The first aluminum frame CR 125 was 1998. The 1997 CR 250 was aluminum but the 125 didn’t get it until the next year in 1998.
McGrath is the man!
Also, the aluminum frame concept was 75% driven by marketing. It was the new cool “thing” that was going to sell more.
I saw Jeremy in Anaheim when he was starting out in Supercross. He was on a KX125 with 125 number plates. He was still a privateer. I think that I have seen him ride live at 6 different races. He's my all-time favorite rider.
I had a 98 cr125 as my first bike, that nice big polished aluminum frame coming down the side, it just looks so sexy compared to the other steel 125s of same year.
@@tylerpela5758while its behind the steel frame in 5th gear and not 6th
This is 100% correct.
97 CR250 - First year of the aluminum frame for any mainstream motocross bike.
97 CR125 - Last year of the steel frame CR125, as in 98 Honda made the CR125 an aluminum frame bike like they did to the CR250 the year prior.
I think that the next mainstream bikes (other than the Honda 4 strokes) to go aluminum frame were the 05 YZ125 and YZ250. Then in 06 I believe the KX450F and RMZ450 were introduced as aluminum framed bikes, as were the 06 YZF bikes. The original KX250F and RMZ250 were I believe introduced in 04, and were steel framed, and basically identical bikes minus plastics, and graphics.
That’s exactly what I was thinking but I had to look it up to be for sure.
Bike manufatures take as much input from the marketing teams as they do from engineering, procurment and riders. I'd say the switch to aluminium frames was a marketing move - sounds new and high tech (for the mid-90's) compared to steel frames.
A stupid move at that!!
They should have definitely given him the option to ride the bike he wanted not only for his safety but for being a winning rider. J Mac is one of the best and a super cool guy.
My first 2 stroke was a 96 cr125. So glad I had the privilege of being able to have that experience.
I was riding Yamahas in 1998, which they were probably the best bikes out there, as an intermediate rider. My friend bought a '98 CR 125 and asked me at a track in San Jacinto if i wanted to try it, so I said sure. Keeping in mind that it wasnt set up for me, I wasnt really pushing it that hard but damn! That thing was soooooooo freakin stiff. I ended up crashing on it and broke my foot (and bought him a new set of plastics). Those early aluminum frames were so bad. They LOOKED cool and cutting edge, but they didnt track for shyte
My favorite rider ever. I met him while he was testing suspension at Edwards Air Force Base in the early 90's with Steve Lamson, and Doug Henry.
Met Jeremy at a Bell Helmet ride day in Hollister Calif. Can honestly say he is a genuine person and an all around nice guy 😎👍
Wow!! That was so cool...."no, don't hold back...how do you really feel"
My first real bike was a 1976 Honda MR250 second bike was a 1998 CR 250 and I felt like it was the best bike ever made.
MC is my favorite rider. I could listen to his story all day.
I could listen to his stories all day
I remember hearing in the late 90s the aluminum was cheaper to procure in Japan whereas steel was expensive and harder to get for them. Thats why I heard they had to switch otherwise it wasn't feasible to run steel for them
SUBBED!! The KING will never see this, but so many of us hated to see him on the Suzuki (or anything aside from a Honda because he was so good on them), and we all could see that it wasn't working for him. Not only the handling, it just didn't seem to have the same power the CR's did, other machines would pull away from him. In 96 Supercross got kind of boring, Jeremy would holeshot, check out, and the whole main event would be just watching the guys behind him, rarely did someone even come close to catching up because of his training and physical conditioning. We did hear and read many rumors about his dislike of the aluminum frame being to stiff, now confirmed thanks to this video!! It does make you wonder why Honda changed, what influenced that? They had such an amazing bike. I had a 94 CR250 and although I was a no one, that bike felt so good. I truly feel that the best racing was back in the 90's, although later on it was super fun to watch Stewart and Carmichael as well but watching Jeremy was always a blast. Your subs would all love to hear the James Stewart story as we never got any closure. WTF and WHY did he never come back after that small incident?? There were rumors every year, for like 6 years, that he would be coming back, but it was like he lost his flame. Please get him on your show!!
McGrath rode a 93 chassis all the way til 96 when they switched to aluminum.
Yep
Truth that 99% of fans still do not know. Jeremy was no dummy. What works, works!
What a great topic for an interview. I’ve been waiting to hear this for a long time. Thank you so much bro.
Love this show man always like hearing from the king 🤴 the story's are awesome love it
Keep it up
I'll never forget the editor of Dirt Bike Magazine Ron Lawson helping Rodger Decoster learn how to write a monthly column. It was great to hear from Decoster because this was the time of Jeremy McGrath when nobody could touch him. Who else could speak on this phenomena other than Decoster. I believe he used the example of the athletic achievement of running a sub 4 min mile. This intimidating barrier that for decades Olympic athletes got close to but never achieved. Until someone finally DID break through the psychological barrier then several other runners quickly followed. Decoster goes on- The same will be true on the track. Once riders realize that it is all in their head. That it is not an unattainable goal to beat the seemingly untouchable Jeremy McGrath. Says Rodger-eventually someone is going to beat him and when that happens others will soon follow. Quite a compliment to Jeremy I think. When YOU ARE that psychological barrier, however long it lasts. That's the greatest impression one could ever leave in their field of competition.
I totally agree with MC! Todays motocross frames are way too stiff. I had -99 CR125 and it was the worst handling bike I have ever owned and currently own vintage -86 CR125 with old steel frame the bike corners like a dream and doesn't punish the rider in square edge edge bumps like the modern bikes
I bought a 98 CR250 new and raced it that year. Guess that explains why I was so slow and on the edge of crashing hard. It wasn't me after all. I feel better now.😂👍
I have been riding a 1998 CR125 for 5 years now and the frame is absolutely brutal, I had to put 2003 and 1996 parts on it to make it tolerable.
My favorite bike I ever had was an 1989 RM125. That thing was a tank. I loved riding in woods. That I think could get up any Hill through any train.
97 cr125 is still the steel frame, the 98 is the aluminum frame. The 97 cr125 is a great bike.
the headshake part was true for the steel framed hondas, but yeah i got the impression they thought the 97 125 was aluminum too, which as you said it's not
I was thinking the same thing.
He rode 250'z in 97', why the 125 talk??
Any idea what the 1997 KX125 frame was? I was able to whip on that bike pretty good
Fax the the 125 didn’t come out with the aluminum frame until 98 and like 97 was the first year for the 250 then came the 125 aluminum frame which no one like because of the way you sit on the bike it wasn’t built like a normal bike
All this time I thought Honda dropped him because he bought a jet ski, that was the story in Motocross Journal ( or maybe Dirt Rider / Motocross Action, one of those)
I remember that same story..
And Honda didn't want him doing Crusty etc vids.
That story was put out to protect the image of the Bike.
Honda didn’t want a rider that didn’t show up to practice and was into the party scene. They knew his time was limited and no racing outdoors…bye Felicia he had talent but no heart.
@@Rubeless you clearly have no idea of what you're talking about. Cool made up story bro.
He reminded me of a horse racer the way he gracefully galloped around the track 🔥🔥🔥
MC is the reason I started watching super cross in 96 and I’ve been a fan ever since! He’s the King and the 🐐
Great video Gypsy and MC 🤴 . Bought an 97 CR250. Thing looked cool but went to a hard pack track in Jersey and woke up on the ground with a broken scalula 😂 Damn that bike
Ahh,the old broken scalula will get us every time
I’ll never forget the first time meeting MC in 91 at Loretta Lynn’s when he was on Team Peak Honda 125 and Brian Swink awesome memories and then 92 till he retired I met him every year at Atlanta Supercross and always was a KING on and off the bike he always would talk to me and sign everything I had for him to sign and I had a chance to buy the 97 RM 250 the one he used to ride in the Steel Roots Video it was at The Troy Shop in Dayton Ohio it was awesome and he will always be my hero and the greatest memories Thank You Showtime #JeremyMcgrath #GypsyTales
McGrath states that riders aren’t familiar with the engineering world but at the same time I must say the engineers aren’t familiar with the riders world. The engineers themselves need to be able to ride what they create.
Those same engineers design vehicles that need the cab lifted to replace the exhaust manifold, or other small repairs. They pay no mind to us peasants...
Not the bike… definitely the rider 🦅💨💨💨💨
So awesome to hear Jeremy talk about all this
I was in Baja at the sand dunes in Rosarito Beach. There was a bunch of the top Jet Ski and moto people down there. I am thinking this was one of Jeremy's first rides on that Honda. That thing was so awesome looking! I was bummed to hear him say that he hated it. I did go home and buy one though, just because it was so awesome looking, worst bike I have ever owned!
LOL, Yamaha engineers ask Jeremy McGrath “what do you want in a bike?” He wheels in a 1993 Honda CR250R “I want you to get some modern Yamaha Plastics & make them fit this!!”
😂😂😂😂
I bought a brand new 1997 cr250 because of the king, then he bailed and everyone told me my bike was s**t… 😂 Didn’t matter because I was to young and didn’t race at the time.
The '97 was horrible.
The Cr250 was awesome
Your friends
Didn't know shit
First aluminum frame no
What a rube.
My 98 broke me off. The thing bottomed when u took it off the trailer.
The only bike I kept for 2 years was my 97 CR125 when I tried riding a friends 98 CR125 (1st year aluminum for 125) it was so terrible all it wanted to do was stand up in corners and the vibration, not to mention it wasn't getting enough air so it was slowwww. I went to Yamaha in 99 and never looked back. Honda destroyed some great bikes
Ya 1st year for Af was 98 for cr125 and I think they meant that the 98 was the worst since the 97 was the same Ole steel framed honda known and loved
I liked my 01 cr125. Not many people liked it but I had that thing set up perfectly for me I could do anything with it handling wise
I don't remember the the source so don't quote me, but I want to say the reason the switch was made to aluminum was the ability to reduce the count of the components making up the frame by using castings rather than individual stampings and bent tubes, which reduces the amount of fixturing and welding. Engineers have to contend with manufacturing costs and often have a cost target that forces some compromises to the design.
The last version of the steel frame cr125 is still one of the fastest 125's I've ever ridden. They were like giant BMX bikes with decent power.
Rm125 still has better power
@@crf80fdarkdays Yeah, but if it can't effectively put it down, what does it matter?
@@BeardMan01 there a better handling bike then the cr so I don't see why it wouldn't.
@@crf80fdarkdays Maybe today, but definitely not in 96. Honda dirtbikes literally pioneered the way for modern suspension. In 2000, Kawasaki literally copied their design ideas and applied them to Supersport bikes on the J model Ninja. That's why a mildly modded J model Ninja with a swingarm swap keeps up or is faster than many modern bikes.
Had the 1996 CR250R and from first second it "klicked".
Followed to blue in 1999 and it was a good choice.
Thank you Jeremy!
Did you try ktm and now on kawi?
Bikes don’t matter at your level.
@@Rubeless I tried!
I crashed less, that simple.
My bill matter a lot for my fun and safety! ;-)
Don't talk about others level you don't know!
The reason the first aluminum frames were so stiff is because the engineers knew aluminum is a weaker material than steel, so they over built the frame. They were worried the aluminum would stress and break, so they made sure that wouldn’t happen by building the crap out of the frame.
Absolutely loved the insight and honesty
I was bummed when he left honda...but it was for good reason...I've got a 1988 honda trx 250r mainly because of this guy and how he ripped the cr250 in late 90s.
My 1996 cr 250 was one of my favorite bikes. Then 2008 was awesome too.
jack had his bmx free agent bike dialed in lol. they use to help me with setup with my bikes at temecula bmx aba expert class but i was a few years behind him. i really enjoyed practicing with them it made me so much faster. i was so happy for him when he got to motocross, as it was all the bmx kids dreams we all used to sit on the bleachers talking about going pro lol. good times
I bought the 97 CR 250. It was extremely stiff. Headshake king. Arm pump central. Bought the 2002 next. Suzuki was twitchy too but the CR was something else.
I had a 96 YZ. My buddy, who had one also bought the 97 CR250. He was happy that he didn't sell his YZ. He didn't keep the CR very long.
@@rcpilot179 I had the 96 YZ 250 too, fantastic bike! Felt like a stable Honda. Loved it.
@@davespin9034 yep. I had the 94 before it. The 96 was a great bike!
@@rcpilot179 I had a 95, did the factory blue kit like Emig"s bike. Then the 96 came out, better ergos like the Honda. I sold it to buy my first house, then bought the 97 Honda lol 😆 oops 😬
@@davespin9034 hahaha. It happens to the best of us. Lol.
Good interview. He wasn't twitching and sniffing. Good job both of you!
Great interview. Would love some round table interviews...
Thank you Jeremy for the honest interview. OMG: I was an up and coming amateur MXer in my twenties. Then bought the 97 Honda 250. I guess I was a victim of marketing. That bike hurt me so many times I gave up MX for 20 years. Then it was steel frame KTM's. Now 17 years after that I'm still kickin it on MX and offroad. GD Honda, Much hate. Although I did like the three 2007 Hondas I bought.
That honda head shake was brutal. I went from a cr80 to a brand new 2001 cr250 and thought i was going to die every time i rode it. Ended up selling it after a while then bought a new 2003 cr 250 and it was soooo much better. Still have it to this very day
I don't get how people are saying they get headshake on it, I have a 99 and it doesn't headshake.
@@julianlaustsen1991 5th gear wide open and hit a rut and it was almost guaranteed to do it. My 03 has never done it to me. My buddys old 99 used to do it as well
@@MJMAC hmm the tracks I ride arent big enough to hold 5th gear wide open so I wouldn't know bout that, but when I ride it on trials it doesn't do it.
@@julianlaustsen1991 my 01 was alright on trails on low to mid range and I remember how much the frame used to vibrate like it was really tinny even just idling compared to my 03 frame
I went from a 95 CR 250 to the 97 The 97 was absolutely junk. I broke more bones on that 97 than any other bike. In fact that was the last year I raced because of the injurys...
Jeremy’s always a great interview
The reason why the Honda was so stiff in the beginning is because you would never wanna under build a frame and risk detrimental, cracking and lawsuits from Frank cracking and injury. Overbuilding is a safe bet in the beginning which equals stiff.
They knew they wanted to go aluminum, they probably knew that they were over building the frame, but they also knew it would not break and crack and injure people due to frame breaking in half. It’s that simple.
Jeremy is badass all the way around. Finally here the truth about why he left Honda from the Goats mouth.
You said you had a 1997 CR 125 than a 1998 CR250 for parts for the 96?.....Im confused...Great to see Jeremy, met him in person here in Ga,Great dude!
I bought a cr250 because of McGrath. Still loved to watch him race after he left Honda.
i had cr500af done on a 2001 cr250 chassis. it shook so much that while standing, my feet would vibrate off the pegs. it was wicked. where ever i took it people acted like i had shown up with a dragon. but I secretly hated it. the only day happier than the day i bought it is the day it left.
I think the first aluminum frames were way over built due to concerns about lawsuits should a new technology have issues and failures. Also, I think they made the aluminum frames to be similar to the MotoGP bikes of the time, connecting the steering stem to the swingarm pivot with a straight beam. It was the same thing with the MotoGP bikes of the era. They were too stiff laterally when leaned over. It's taken much engineering to get the incredible machines we have access to these days.
2002 cr250r best 250. Has the RC valve, newer frame, and last of the green sticker. Can ride all year in California. Now if you live in a free state, im sure theres a lot more options.
Saw him on the suzuki in houston that year. Every lap over the grandstand, he was spinning the adjuster like crazy. He looked miserable while signing autographs. The Honda teams weren't happy either. The Yamaha boys were all smiles that year.
My 98 CR125 was amazing. Pro Action engine & suspension. Worked great
This is a great interview with the king.
Great interview , thanks for sharing
I came along before McGrath's time. New CR's and RM 250's. It amazes me that with Jeremy's ability, you would think Honda would build for him what would win for them. But you know executives, they think they know whats best to do. They clearly dont.
Got my very first job at Chapparal in 1998, everyone that got hired that year used to joke that we were hired with Jeremy 😂😂
And thats why my 2005 kxf250 is still one of the best bikes iven ever had. The steel frame on that bike was perfectly tuned
Thanks for the info, I did not know that 1997 to 2001 CR250 engine and frame is a trash...thanks Jeremy McGrath for this insight.👍
The reason I was told for the switch from steel to aluminum is that Japan was going through a steel shortage. Starting around mid 96 and Honda decided to switch to the aluminum frame for the 250 for 97 and then the 125 in 98. After that, it was the cost of steel that drove the other Japanese manufacturers to switch over to aluminum.
thanks for this info 👍
Doubtful. They pumped out thousands upon thousands of cars and trucks. There isn't much steel in a dirtbike frame
I had one of the last chrome molly CR 250s. 1994 or 96 IIRC. Had it a long time. Excellent bike.....
I’m still riding a 2000 YZ250! #steelframegang
So he left Honda for the same reason everyone leaves Honda: HRC believes with their entire corporate soul that the rider doesn’t matter and engineering is infallible.
Game changer interview!
The first bike I bought for myself was a 1998 CR250. Headshaking monster. I rode it tons and thought it was great until I rode a friend's 1995 CR250. It was so good! Ultra smooth, very forgiving, jumped flat no matter how bad you screw it up on the approach. I traded my '98 for a 1995 CR500 two weeks later. That '98 CR250 was absolutely miserable. Ridiculously rigid frame, pipe that resembles suspension, and a huge frame that makes maintenance very difficult. Good riddance.
I had a 94 CR250 and that bike was amazing, nearly killed me but that was because of me, not the bike. The aluminum framed bikes looked nice, but they were just too stiff...
97 125 was last year for steel sounds like you were thinking of a 98 i know this beouse i had one and it was my favorite it did have head shake but it was only bad if you got lazy or stupid tired.
Great episode, love it McGrath is the man
growing up in murrieta everyone always talked about the house he lived in rite across from the new hospital off to the side of the 215
I bought the 97 CR 250R.. was excited as hell ! Took it to the track that weekend, and was like W.T.F. did i do !? Big disappointment. I still have that bike. Sitting in my man cave.
1998 cr12fat was my first new (86 cr80 was my first bike) bike all polished out black plastics full metal militia🤘
Why did Suzuki go back to conventional forks for 96-98!? So weird. Another Banger Gypsy Tales!
he just explained it ma man
Because Suzuki was smart enough to realize their buyers were not factory pros. Those forks at that time were amazing vs. upside down forks at the time. I moved up 2 classes riding my 96 and 97 RM250. But when I hit pro class you did notice the flex in them especially diving hard into flat corners. By then they were getting the dealership bikes upside down forks figured out hence the switch back in 99. McGrath's Showas were nothing you could come close to getting on a dealership bike. Also no matter how much you had someone work on them you cant beat the factory finesse. Upside down forks really didn't get amazing until the KYB's that were on the stock Yamaha's in 06.
@@Meditech509 Thank you for the explanation. That makes a lot of sense.
@@bertamusprime618 very welcome
Moved up two classes? Here we go
Had a 00' CR125, VIN-Date code was 9/99! One of the best bikes I've ever had! Rode a bone stock 02'YZ and was way faster and smoother! 👍
MC laying down the facts of the matter. Thank you for the truth 👍
I want to hear Sexton and Webb's version of this with Honda and KTM
97 cr 125 had a steel frame and the 250 I believe had the first generation aluminum chasis
The 97 cr125 was still a steel frame, thing was probably bad ass
1997 S. Everts became World Champion 250cc like 1996 on steel frame.
They used a longer swingarm at HRC 1997.
Why he could win with both frames?
Because it’s the rider, not the bike that wins.
Those bikes were allowed to make chassis changes not allowed in the usa. The Europeans were still mostly works bikes. All honda had to do was keep the look of the chassis in Europe but could change a lot about it.