He actually tested the adapter and not the throttle body. Proving the adapter does indeed restrict. Now I want to see a 92 mm TB vs. 102 mm TB on a FAST 102 manifold to see the real difference in TB power
No, it does infact give you a larger area. you must deduct the butterfly valve fro the 92mm, so a 102mm with the butterfly deducted would allow more flow. These throttles are far too big, a 65mm is a perfect size for that engine.
Finally some one who cut through the BS. I worked at a mechanic shop years ago and we had a VW pickup truck. My boss installed an upgraded TB on it and the gain in HP was really noticeable
removed the EGR venturi bulge from throttle body in my 77 rabbit. top speed went up nearly 20MPH, from 77 to 98. that's what makes me want to spend $$ on my LS6
Wouldn't the adapter still be a choke point even if running a 102mm throttle body? Wouldn't a more accurate test be to run a fast manifold with a 102mm then a smaller throttle body?
Correct, the point of this video is to highlight that breathing mods needs to be matched. If you check out some of our other LSXR videos, you can see comparisons between stock intakes (LS and truck style) and the LSXR intakes and throttle bodies.
But doesn't the point that you are making, that a larger throttle body doesn't increase power, become pointless if you still have the original 92mm restriction in place?
This would have been more interesting if they dynoed both throttle bodies on an intake manifold that could use both throttle bodies without an adaptor .
Absolutely correct! The setup of this video made me think they were going to prove the aftermarket intake made all the powers but using it and swapping TB’s, NOPE! They did the ole bait and switch on us😏
On a 3.8 litre Buick in our VP Commodore in Australia. I put a 65 mm TB, original was 60 mm. Took baffle out of manifold . Took it for a drive and went back to 60 mm. Took it for a drive. Did this a few times in a couple of hours just to make sure it wasn't in my head. Put the 65 mm. Oh joy!!!! Then IAT resistor mod, cai setup. Went very well that identical car with 2 young goons laughing at my VP Commodore wagon which is heavier than the sedan and full of power tools. We had a run and I was in front by half a car length up to 100 km. Cheers from Australia! Australia has worst engine rules. Eg; cold air induction is illegal in pod form!
True but the 102 does have a bit better runner design than the 92 also. A fast 102 with velocity ring and 90mm throttle will make a touch more than a 92mm intake with a 90mm throttle
Carbon fibre frame, carbon fibre body panels, high-grade aluminium engine, racing intakes and exhaust systems, light mags, slicks... Sigh... Are you with me?
As I understand, you were trying to make a point that a larger throttle body does not make a big difference. After watching your video, I feel this was a waste as you have an obvious failure that really required no testing to validate (much less a video to explain). If the upper intake mating to the throttle body is only open 92mm, no matter how you bolt up the 102mm throttle body, you are destined to see zero gains because you will never over come this bottle neck. Or the gains you see are a result of the throttle body having more room to work, compensating for the throttle plate and shaft (even at that, the difference is so so minor it would be as variable as ambient temp outside the engine). Why didn't you do a video with an upper intake that could accept the 102mm throttle body and adapt the factory throttle body to show the difference between the two?
This makes absolute sence!👍 I see there's a lot of people in the comments that have a comprehension level equal or lesser to that of a toad😂😂😂👍💡 It's like connecting a big fire hose to a garden sprinkler to TRY and get more water to flow through it, But once the high flow of water reaches the "intake" opening, the flow goes back to it's original slow flow because the holes opening size never changed😱 So to get more flow, you have to open the "intake" opening to make it bigger like the big hose👍👍👍
Port polish the adapter smooth ridges create boundry layer impede flow area smaller than smooth original t body. Try test on manifold that doesnt require adapter for larger throttle body Fast manifold etc.
HEMI motors react differently than the Chevy to throttle body upgrades perhaps because it is undersized from the factory regardless there is a gain on the low end only with HEMI motors
Well the adapter is the problem really you still limit the gains of the throttle body because the intake was maxed at 92 mm had it been larger maybe even bigger than the 102mm the difference may had been seen also I noticed the volume for the engine cam selection was medium compared basically think of the engine as a air compressor more area to fill vs a restricted area yes you might not can feel this but at the strip the right combo can achieve a better time
can you do a vid on a 4.3 v6 vortec please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... I really enjoy the 4.3 vortec v6 vids.... a 4.3 5.7 throttle body comparison???????
i beentrying to find parts, not allot out there.... been trying to find out whats compatible.... options... info on a marine intake swap possibly??????
Also you got to bring up drivability. For someone who drag races not a big deal. Somebody who road races and needs the throttle to be very linear. you only want to put the biggest throttle body in there that will match everything else. if that's a 60mm throttle body then that's the best choice.... did you know you can make over 700 horsepower on a 54 mm restrictor.
ehh, answers but contradicts. what I see is that v8 can only gain somuch by brute force. v6 i4 can gain a better margin because itll be going from somthing like 50-60 to 90 aswell as porting exhaust
Wonder what kind of gains I'll see on a 3.0l v6 with full exhaust, 90mm TB and a short runner intake with a 90mm bore. If it's anything like the camaro we used to drag race putting an offenhauser open plenum intake manifold dropped our 1/4 times by a second. By it self. Should see some decent gains on this high racing v6.
Start with a good tune . Get real parts to help your thirst for power . you can start by reducing valve train friction by putting in a decent set of roller rockers . Maybe move on to a better cam because they're out there . Bigger intake valves a set of headers . There's a lot of things you can do without pissing your money away on a throttle body .
This is easy to explain and I'll use less words. Horsepower is a byproduct of Torque and Engine Speed. Think about it. The LS engine is a perfect example of the factory manifold being designed by people that know what they are doing. The LS engine just flows so well in stock form. Each cylinder head can flow up to 450cfm without the aid of the aftermarket. It's the peripherals that make the difference in these engines. The throttle body doesnt make the horsepower. Think about it this way. Why would you put on a bigger aftermarket carburetor on an engine without upping the jet size? See what I mean?
It's going to be the same because of throttle body paper down to the factory 92 opening. Try your test with twin turbos on a cross ram with two throttle bodies versus a single.
Wow. I fackin knew it. All these damn companies saying a 90mm bbk to will increase hp on my mustang with no tune. Just plug and play. What a scam. Now my throttle randomly sticks when I'm slowly pulling into a parking spots or in stop and go traffic.
So many people have dynoed bigger numbers with a bigger tb this just doesn't make sense. You obviously port the manifold inlet to the bigger throttle body size. 30whp on a 300zx tt larger intake piping 60whp with larger intercooler. Its simple cars breath better they get more power. Your doing it all wrong. Nobody puts a bigger tb on and holds it back to stock inlet size like you just did lol.
This test does nothing but prove that common sense is not a myth😏. If you really wanted to prove that the gains in a fast intake/TB swap weren’t in the TB then you should be running the fast 102 intake and both TB’s.
This was kind of a waste of time it seems. Should have used a manifold with a 102mm opening - and adapt it to 92mm - instead of the opposite. Who in their right mind would buy a 102mm TB with an adapter down to 92mm and expect to get a power increase? Dumb.
A better flowing intake will definitely gain top end power, it depends on the engine setup and tuning quite a bit. The length of the runners inside the intake determine what your power curve looks like.
I know you are talking about GM engines, but, my experience in my Mustang 4.6 in this order: K&N intake. Not much difference. BBK throttle body 78mm. Notable difference. Ford Racing Intake Manifold. A huge difference. I can feel more power and acceleration. The combination of the three parts. One only not make a great difference.
It's all about balance! The combination of the larger throttle body, manifold, and more efficient air intake works together! Now all you need are some cams ;)
What is wrong with you bro? The Adapter killed the test. You should have ported the factory intake or did the test for the throttle body alone on an intake that would take both. Please step up your game bro you have so much ability to do so much better FFS
This test is so wrong and here's why. Look at airflow available vs airflow demand. If the opening and throat of the manifold has a maximum cfm flow of 1,200 and the maximum cfm needed for the maximum hp out of the engine is 1,000cfm and the smaller tb flow is 1,100cfm then going to larger TV that can flow on it's own 1,300cfm will do nothing because of 2 reasons. 1 the most the manifold can flow is 1,200cfm and 2 the max air the motor can use is 1,000cfm. We flow throttle bodies, heads and manifolds everyday and this is what we see.
A bigger throttle body on a small engine isn’t better. If you have the air flow from the heads/cam/stroke combo then yea. Big gains. But putting a big throttle body on a small engine isn’t gonna make it better. The air flow restrictions are gonna need to be addressed first before you throw a huge TB on it. So moral of the story. If you have a engine big enough to need more flow. Then a bigger TB will help. But if you don’t. Then don’t waste your money.
This dude is super animated. Love it. Play at 1.5X speed for extra fun.
Its true lol
0.5 is better with that slowmo
This made my day
@@Kilo_9 slow-mo was way better, had me 😂
0.75x is just as funny. Sounds like he’s baked lmao
He actually tested the adapter and not the throttle body. Proving the adapter does indeed restrict. Now I want to see a 92 mm TB vs. 102 mm TB on a FAST 102 manifold to see the real difference in TB power
No, it does infact give you a larger area. you must deduct the butterfly valve fro the 92mm, so a 102mm with the butterfly deducted would allow more flow. These throttles are far too big, a 65mm is a perfect size for that engine.
Finally some one who cut through the BS.
I worked at a mechanic shop years ago and we had a VW pickup truck. My boss installed an upgraded TB on it and the gain in HP was really noticeable
removed the EGR venturi bulge from throttle body in my 77 rabbit. top speed went up nearly 20MPH, from 77 to 98. that's what makes me want to spend $$ on my LS6
Wouldn't the adapter still be a choke point even if running a 102mm throttle body? Wouldn't a more accurate test be to run a fast manifold with a 102mm then a smaller throttle body?
Correct, the point of this video is to highlight that breathing mods needs to be matched. If you check out some of our other LSXR videos, you can see comparisons between stock intakes (LS and truck style) and the LSXR intakes and throttle bodies.
But doesn't the point that you are making, that a larger throttle body doesn't increase power, become pointless if you still have the original 92mm restriction in place?
This would have been more interesting if they dynoed both throttle bodies on an intake manifold that could use both throttle bodies without an adaptor .
Absolutely correct! The setup of this video made me think they were going to prove the aftermarket intake made all the powers but using it and swapping TB’s, NOPE! They did the ole bait and switch on us😏
That's because this guy doesn't do anything.
He just finds pics on Google and then acts like he's been there. Lol.
On a 3.8 litre Buick in our VP Commodore in Australia. I put a 65 mm TB, original was 60 mm. Took baffle out of manifold . Took it for a drive and went back to 60 mm. Took it for a drive. Did this a few times in a couple of hours just to make sure it wasn't in my head. Put the 65 mm. Oh joy!!!! Then IAT resistor mod, cai setup. Went very well that identical car with 2 young goons laughing at my VP Commodore wagon which is heavier than the sedan and full of power tools. We had a run and I was in front by half a car length up to 100 km. Cheers from Australia! Australia has worst engine rules. Eg; cold air induction is illegal in pod form!
This will answer a question I have about a build I'm doing right now. Now please ask Fast to make a L92 LSXRT for a street truck.
Comp if you make an L92 LSXRT I will buy it for my Trailblazer SS to match my cathedral port intake going on my build on an GMC Yukon.
The adapter basically made it back to a 92 mm
True but the 102 does have a bit better runner design than the 92 also. A fast 102 with velocity ring and 90mm throttle will make a touch more than a 92mm intake with a 90mm throttle
Lets enlarge the port on the stocker to use the 102 MM and re-run the test.
I ported my ls3 intake to fit a 102 and I picked up 15 hp
@@jmontign1 💡That was his whole point💡👍
@@eugenec4957yes from porting
I wish fast stuff wasn't so expensive...
Carbon fibre frame, carbon fibre body panels, high-grade aluminium engine, racing intakes and exhaust systems, light mags, slicks... Sigh... Are you with me?
Yeah we to
Good info thanks
As I understand, you were trying to make a point that a larger throttle body does not make a big difference. After watching your video, I feel this was a waste as you have an obvious failure that really required no testing to validate (much less a video to explain). If the upper intake mating to the throttle body is only open 92mm, no matter how you bolt up the 102mm throttle body, you are destined to see zero gains because you will never over come this bottle neck. Or the gains you see are a result of the throttle body having more room to work, compensating for the throttle plate and shaft (even at that, the difference is so so minor it would be as variable as ambient temp outside the engine).
Why didn't you do a video with an upper intake that could accept the 102mm throttle body and adapt the factory throttle body to show the difference between the two?
Lol, he said THATS ALL THE TIME I HAVE as they say on real TV.
This makes absolute sence!👍 I see there's a lot of people in the comments that have a comprehension level equal or lesser to that of a toad😂😂😂👍💡 It's like connecting a big fire hose to a garden sprinkler to TRY and get more water to flow through it, But once the high flow of water reaches the "intake" opening, the flow goes back to it's original slow flow because the holes opening size never changed😱 So to get more flow, you have to open the "intake" opening to make it bigger like the big hose👍👍👍
Catherine, your grammar and spelling are atrocious. You should not criticise other peoples comprehension levels if you cannot spell the word sense.
Thanks, you just saved me about $100 for a Throttle Body Spacer .
Port polish the adapter smooth ridges create boundry layer impede flow area smaller than smooth original t body. Try test on manifold that doesnt require adapter for larger throttle body Fast manifold etc.
This is not xrated. A bigger mouth doesn’t mean a bigger throat. Thanks Richard
Thanks 👍✌️🇨🇦
i’m guessing the opening has to match and not taper back down to 92
HEMI motors react differently than the Chevy to throttle body upgrades perhaps because it is undersized from the factory regardless there is a gain on the low end only with HEMI motors
Well the adapter is the problem really you still limit the gains of the throttle body because the intake was maxed at 92 mm had it been larger maybe even bigger than the 102mm the difference may had been seen also I noticed the volume for the engine cam selection was medium compared basically think of the engine as a air compressor more area to fill vs a restricted area yes you might not can feel this but at the strip the right combo can achieve a better time
For that engines displacement and rpm a 65mm Throttle would be fine. Most people and even factory go overboard.
Biggest gains with a throttle body are made with a twin screw when on the suction side. More boost.
What's he karate choppin lol
Love your videos. Incredibly helpful.
More LSX based Speed Secrets videos please. GM CEO Mary T. Barra hates LS/LT V8'S. 😼
Car intakes is were the power is at all day unless you have cathedral port you can use a tbss intake but still ls6 is king
If you think the LS6 intake is good, you should see the FAST LSXR 102 ;)
The rare Trailblazer SS manifold is very good too
Ty you answered my question: Looking for an Atomic airforce 103mm intake manifold and i was wondering if I should get the 103mm TB or bezel
Bought a ls3 throttle body, 102mm what would I need to combine this with? On a lm7
can you do a vid on a 4.3 v6 vortec please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... I really enjoy the 4.3 vortec v6 vids.... a 4.3 5.7 throttle body comparison???????
i beentrying to find parts, not allot out there.... been trying to find out whats compatible.... options... info on a marine intake swap possibly??????
Great vid!
Johnny Sins of the carporn
Just bought a bbk 95... looks like I should’ve gone with a Fast 92 lmao live and learn
Also you got to bring up drivability. For someone who drag races not a big deal. Somebody who road races and needs the throttle to be very linear. you only want to put the biggest throttle body in there that will match everything else. if that's a 60mm throttle body then that's the best choice.... did you know you can make over 700 horsepower on a 54 mm restrictor.
And that is why I do not believe in those 92 mm throttle body adapters that neck down to the 78 mm for the pick up intake
Exactly, the port size needs to match the throttle body size. Hence why we sell 92mm and 102mm intakes and throttle bodies :)
@@Compcams1976 thanks to yall and Richard we all pretty much have a good idea of what cams to use in a vehicle and what to expect with what upgrades
Do you lose horsepower when they have low rpm taper? The throtle bodies? And how much?
Engine Masters sent me
What if am running a supercharger that has a 90mm throttle body and go to a 103 throttle body with an adapter? Will i have gains
ehh, answers but contradicts. what I see is that v8 can only gain somuch by brute force. v6 i4 can gain a better margin because itll be going from somthing like 50-60 to 90 aswell as porting exhaust
Really Great Information!!!!! :)
Great video.
Hey I have this exact motor from heads, intake, cam everything but my throttle body is a factory ls1 throttle body how much would that be robbing me?
Wonder what kind of gains I'll see on a 3.0l v6 with full exhaust, 90mm TB and a short runner intake with a 90mm bore. If it's anything like the camaro we used to drag race putting an offenhauser open plenum intake manifold dropped our 1/4 times by a second. By it self. Should see some decent gains on this high racing v6.
HP wont increase when the adapter is reducing the opening.
what do u feel is the best over all ls intake on market
Thanks saved me $185.
Hell yes!😂👍👍
Would a TB upgrade help my Jeep SRT if it’s stock?
Start with a good tune . Get real parts to help your thirst for power . you can start by reducing valve train friction by putting in a decent set of roller rockers . Maybe move on to a better cam because they're out there . Bigger intake valves a set of headers . There's a lot of things you can do without pissing your money away on a throttle body .
Am I able to get custom cams???
what about twin 90mm
This is easy to explain and I'll use less words. Horsepower is a byproduct of Torque and Engine Speed. Think about it. The LS engine is a perfect example of the factory manifold being designed by people that know what they are doing. The LS engine just flows so well in stock form. Each cylinder head can flow up to 450cfm without the aid of the aftermarket. It's the peripherals that make the difference in these engines. The throttle body doesnt make the horsepower. Think about it this way. Why would you put on a bigger aftermarket carburetor on an engine without upping the jet size? See what I mean?
I follow you on your channel
Sir I want to order ported throttle bottle for my c7 Grandsport pure for the Hp. So I think I skip the idea ?
I always thought this ha great video
It's going to be the same because of throttle body paper down to the factory 92 opening.
Try your test with twin turbos on a cross ram with two throttle bodies versus a single.
Wow. I fackin knew it. All these damn companies saying a 90mm bbk to will increase hp on my mustang with no tune. Just plug and play. What a scam. Now my throttle randomly sticks when I'm slowly pulling into a parking spots or in stop and go traffic.
“We used an adapter..” which defeats the entire purpose of the video. Not very intelligent.
It's not the same modified engine and putting a throttle body on it then grabbing a stock engine and putting it throttle body on it
What about 90mm to 92mm any benefits?
Could I run ls3 intake with 92 mm throttle body with my 6.0 with 317 heads if not which intake would u recommend for some gains ?
good video smart man
So 546hp is obtained from a manifold, TB, and coil packs?
And a cam and likely a tune
Largest factory is 95mm from the zr1
larger throttle body dont mean shit unless you get bigger fuel injectors too
So many people have dynoed bigger numbers with a bigger tb this just doesn't make sense. You obviously port the manifold inlet to the bigger throttle body size. 30whp on a 300zx tt larger intake piping 60whp with larger intercooler. Its simple cars breath better they get more power. Your doing it all wrong. Nobody puts a bigger tb on and holds it back to stock inlet size like you just did lol.
Im going from a 75mm to a 90mm on a 6.2 truck intake with a 90mm hole. I bet l feel and get more power. Dude does great videos...just not this time
This test does nothing but prove that common sense is not a myth😏.
If you really wanted to prove that the gains in a fast intake/TB swap weren’t in the TB then you should be running the fast 102 intake and both TB’s.
This was kind of a waste of time it seems. Should have used a manifold with a 102mm opening - and adapt it to 92mm - instead of the opposite. Who in their right mind would buy a 102mm TB with an adapter down to 92mm and expect to get a power increase? Dumb.
Butt dyno I’d say I lost low end torque and gained high end( 4500 rpm +). As it’s a tow rig that was not good
A better flowing intake will definitely gain top end power, it depends on the engine setup and tuning quite a bit. The length of the runners inside the intake determine what your power curve looks like.
I know you are talking about GM engines, but, my experience in my Mustang 4.6 in this order:
K&N intake. Not much difference.
BBK throttle body 78mm. Notable difference.
Ford Racing Intake Manifold. A huge difference.
I can feel more power and acceleration. The combination of the three parts. One only not make a great difference.
It's all about balance! The combination of the larger throttle body, manifold, and more efficient air intake works together! Now all you need are some cams ;)
YEAH
So where's the video of you doing this? I'm confused?
All I see is pictures and you taking about it.. exit👉
This is a really dumb test. Test the two throttle bodies on a manifold with entry size properly sized for a 102 throttle body.
We have! Check out some of our other videos :)
What is wrong with you bro? The Adapter killed the test. You should have ported the factory intake or did the test for the throttle body alone on an intake that would take both. Please step up your game bro you have so much ability to do so much better FFS
This test is so wrong and here's why. Look at airflow available vs airflow demand. If the opening and throat of the manifold has a maximum cfm flow of 1,200 and the maximum cfm needed for the maximum hp out of the engine is 1,000cfm and the smaller tb flow is 1,100cfm then going to larger TV that can flow on it's own 1,300cfm will do nothing because of 2 reasons. 1 the most the manifold can flow is 1,200cfm and 2 the max air the motor can use is 1,000cfm. We flow throttle bodies, heads and manifolds everyday and this is what we see.
Need to run a stock engine! Not a modified! A modified does need more air! A stock one is differemt.
A bigger throttle body on a small engine isn’t better. If you have the air flow from the heads/cam/stroke combo then yea. Big gains. But putting a big throttle body on a small engine isn’t gonna make it better. The air flow restrictions are gonna need to be addressed first before you throw a huge TB on it. So moral of the story. If you have a engine big enough to need more flow. Then a bigger TB will help. But if you don’t. Then don’t waste your money.
And engine only flows as good as it’s biggest restriction.
agree
Personally I blame squirrels
Stop doing the things with your hands, and the bobbing up and down thing, yeah gotta stop that too man.
I need me a cam for my G8
it's a good thing you cannot use your feet for gestures. I get tired looking at your hands. if you were a public speaker, you'd be covered in eggs.
Somebodies drunk
It’s not the intake as a whole it’s the mouth of the I take. Home that intake mouth and see what happens