As someone who bought and used those connectors, let me say this: 1) They are not as good as they advertise. 2) The connectors in this video were not installed properly. The solder ring inside the connector never reached melting point so it never flowed.
I agree, I have these and the ones in this video were not heated correctly. Solder did not melt. I also would not feel comfortable using FLAME around a fuel tank!! Hot air gun small tip.
The wires were visibly tarnished so the solder would never stick anyway. You can't solder tarnished wires! The wire needs to be dipped in acid type flux and pre tinned, then clean the acid off to prevent the wire from corrosion.
Solder wasn't hot enough and didn't properly melt. I use these connectors on boats and ships all the time. I use a torch, not a heat gun and melt the solder before going on to the shrink ends. Before these connectors I used crimp connectors but still soldered them. Most of the terminals I use are crimp. In marine use crimped connectors will in time have corrosion between the wire and connector. Once soldered they last forever. If I had logged all my time chasing owner caused crimp shorts it could be years. Many people doing crimps don't know how to fully crimp. I haven't done vehicles since 1970. Boats and ships outlast cars. So do their engines. Sorry to disagree. I enjoy your videos. You give out good, practical advice.
As a touch solder for Lucas Electronics for many years. You heat the copper wires to accept the solder. But as a belt and braces person, I do connector and heat it to run down a bit of solder, never had one fail yet.
Solder is mechanical. I personally crimp when wiring in a vehicle with open barrel B crimps (basically a cold weld). Solder does work fine though, as long as u do it right, and add strain relief beyond the wicking point of both sides of the connection.
Even open barrel uses 2. 1 for the conductor (connection) and 1 for the insulation (strain relief).. soldering: solder conductors and secure for strain relief. Lol wire nuts are even supposed to be taped actually n that's 2. Even a typical connector plug in a car connects the terminals and the 2nd connection is the clicky button dealio. Even in plumbing.. solder 2 pipe together and HOPE! 😂
I first used solder type heat shrink connecters in the 1960s when I worked for the phone company. If Bell Labs, AT&T and Western Electric used this type connector, the problem is not the connector, the problem is the untrained Tech. The heat shrink connector has been around for 50 plus years. I enjoy your videos.
I use those connectors. You are supposed to twist the wires together before soldering and that connector you pulled off wasn't even heated. You could see the solder was still big and not heated at all.
I twist the wires together and actually solder them with a soldering iron or a soldering gun, depending on the wire guage. I have been soldering since 1961 until I retired in 2012.
Those connectors weren't installed correctly. As these are heated, first the tubing shrinks to keep everything together. Second the adhesive melts to seal the connector. Finally, the solder ring melts to make the connection. You have to heat these until you see the solder ring melt. Properly installed, you'll break the wire before it comes apart. It's best to use a wrap-around tip on the heat gun with these connectors.
Correctly soldered connections in cars is the only way to ensure longevity of the connection, otherwise oxidization of the connection over time will occur & cause problems. Oxidization will occur over time with crimp, snap or whatever type of mechanical connection you use. The amount of these mechanical connections in cars has always amazed me being a retired electrical engineer.
I was a 2 way radio technician for nearly 40 years. Soldering physically secure connections without applying sufficient heat from a soldering iron is asking for trouble.
Not to mention its as strong as any other part of the harness, when soldered... and when done correctly, is nearly undetectable, with no resistance inducing lumps of dissimilar alloys changing signal reference voltages... And waterproof too.. idk lol. Solder, flux, die electric grease, and a long quality, properly sized heatshrink tube, heated correctly..is superior to most human installed crimp connectors. Just not as easy as crimping, IMHO..
Kenny you are absolutely correct, those heat gun solder connectors are complete garbage. As for regular old style non-heat shrink butt connectors and scotch locks still have their place, at least in my shop. I been splicing wires for the last 40 years. Great job on your diag. and repair!
The other thing about these connectors is the type of solder they use. It's not the same as normal solder, it has a lower melting point to allow it to melt before the plastic burns. Low melting point solder puts the connection at risk if you place them in an area subject to engine heat, since the solder may reflow and possibly lose some of the mechanical connection. These were fun to play with but for the most part I've gone back to what you're using here, marine grade shrink wrap around standard uninsulated butt connectors.
I’ve just used four of those connectors to make repairs on two different cars. We have had no issues. Based on what I am seeing, they didn’t heat them sufficiently for the solder to melt. You must have good lighting, and you need to watch the copper connections, making sure that the solder thoroughly penetrates both sides. My diagnosis is those connectors were not heated to the point that the solder melted. They are not easy to use correctly, but when used correctly are a reliable means of joining wires.
I used this type of connector when I rewired the instrument panel and avionics in my Beechcraft Debonair, but they were purchased from an aircraft parts supplier and were made by AMP, if I remember correctly. They were approved by the FAA inspector after installation. When I heated them up and the solder melted, you could actually see the solder wick into the wires giving a proper joint. Twenty years later, I have had no problems with any of the connections, and some carry the current for the landing gear motor and flap actuator which can draw over 20 amps. Most likely, the cheap solder tubes used had crappy solder and no flux, and/or were not properly installed, as it takes a lot of heat to get the solder to melt and flow properly. If they are heated only until the tube shrinks up, they will not provide a proper connection. I have no problem using this type of connector, IF they are a good quality connector and they are installed correctly. Any connector can fail if not suited for the particular application, and if not installed properly, whick in this case was not done.
Nice video Kenny. The computer only "sees" small changes in voltage to determine what's going on. You were correct that those connectors were interfearing with that. I solder wires to prevent moisture from corroding the connection. OEMs don't do it to save money.
Interesting that Eric O. at SMA just posted a video about connectors!. For over 40 years, I've used the compound "vise" like pliers to make ""pro" connections, which I would strongly advise others to do as well.
i saw that video also with dr o sma also have a look at northridgefix alex say dont use low melt solder to solder joints use good quality solder and flux which i cant see in those connecters a good idea that dont work
I do use them and have yet to have a failure, and have no plans to throw mine out.. As others have said, the key is to make sure the solder melts. Bonus if you twist the wires together, though that is not always practical. The reason OEM does not use solder is simply cost. I also use the glued & heat shrinked crimp connectors. But when there is room to apply them, I have more faith in the soldered connectors.
I’ve used these on several ocasionas and have noticed that it takes a decent amount of heat to melt the solder, to the point that the heat shrink is almost melted. I then have to use electrical tape or more heat shrink to strengthen up the connector. Once I use up my supply will go back to twisting and soldering without connectors. Good video.
Amen brother! Tossed mine out several months ago. Too many variables for a reliable connection with these things. Un-insulated crimp connectors with heat shrink for the win.
Excellent quality electrical repair brother Kenny. I'm always proud of you because you do what is right! Thank you for a great video. I just happened to get up late and was happy to see you posted this video.
I used the Mercedes Benz ones all the time, we never had problems with them, the trick was to span the wires then push them through each other then twist them together with clean washed hands then heat solder first, then heat the outer parts to the wire casing which seals up while shrinking. That is their only wire repair that was approved to join a harness to harness repair.
Who would have thought that using low melt temperature solder in an automotive application (possibly next to hot exhaust) would cause issues. I agree with you Kenny, these things are junk! Crimp and heat shrink as you did, or solder and heat shrink is the best option IMO.
I’ve used a type solder splice like you were showing on many aircraft. Those you showed were not properly heated. The solder was not melted. Properly melted on clean wiring and they are fantastic.
So as a ex car stereo installer (now a NICET certified low voltage commercial fire alarm guy), the best fix is to strip 3/4 inch off both wires and then twist them together, then use a pencil torch to solder them together. Yes, you did use the proper hot glue heat shrink. Only the factory duel curl type crimps like in Amphenol connectors is worthy, the barrel crimps are hit and miss where the wire can often also just pull out under tension. If it's gonna get wet, solder the wires so they can never just pull apart IMHO.
I gotta say.. those solder shrinks do work, but I wouldn't use em for anything but terminating a shield in my truck. However, I used em on a breakout box for my acoustic/electric drums.. I did a few tests though, til I found the best way to use em: 1) make sure ur wire conductors are CLEAN. 2) add flux to the wires before sticking the shrink on it. 3) for larger gauge wire, put the shrink on 1, get ur leads tied nicely, and wrap a bit of extra solder on the connection, then slide over ur solder shrink. 4) use a focused heat gun (not lighter, not a hair drier, and not the dinky heat gun from an auto store... Use a variable temperature and variable airflow gun) with high heat and low flow. 5) unlike doing a normal shrink tube, shrink the outside ends 1st, so the heat gets trapped in for that solder. 6) don't remove heat til the solder actually melts (if u think the tube will melt, back off, DONT aim the gun away). 7) heat 1 side then the other OR roll extremely fast until the solder melts in good. And 8) it's not melted in at all (the slightest bit) if u can't even see the strands through the solder!
The solder inside these connectors are low-melt solder. Low-melt solder take less heat to melt but they are very brittle and can break easily. Plus there's not enough of it in the connectors to make for a solid connection. Look at the size of the connectors and imagine how much solder is actually in them. I use them but I only use them as shrink wrap. I still do regular soldering. They actually perform well as shrink wrap because of their waterproofness. I think.
Marine grade shrink wrap is a more economical solution. Especially if you're taking the time to do the repair correctly. Thanks for your input & watching the channel. Keep wrenching 🔧
Yes. Manufacturers do solder some connectors. My 2017 Ford F150 radiator fans have soldered connections on its terminal strip. One of the fans was not running and I found a cold solder joint on that terminal board. It runs fine now after I reflowed the solder with a large 120watt solder gun.
My '95 VW Golf III has soldered battery terminals from factory. I believe they are the same on all the 90's VWs. Probably my favorite style of terminal, grabs on tight and there isn't any chance they will corrode away with how heavy duty they are thats for sure.
I keep these in my truck for emergency fixes. Whoever put these on did not heat them up enough to melt the solder properly. When I use them I make sure the wires are interlased if they're multi strand wire. Squeeze on the solder point so it touches the wires and squeezes them together. Then heat and make sure it wicks into the wires. After its fully shrunk down cover it with marine grade heat shrink to keep water out. They work fine if used right.
The solder is not there because they didn't use the right heat gun . They only shrunk the plastic. we use similar connector on aircraft but for grounding the shielded wires. Right heat gun makes the solder melt. they work great . They are FAA approved and called solder sleeves. I've also used the newer butt connectors that have the red, blue and yellow heat shrink sleeve right on them with great success on my 83 f100 on the trailer wires and tail light wires in place of the old connector that corroded. tail light work great an no more problems. And I live in MI. Salt belt and drove the truck in winter too.
As a graduate student at TH-cam Auto Tech, I can say that every professor who has spoken on the issue hates both the melted "solder" connectors and Scotch locks. The only divergence is whether actually soldering wires is better than crimp connections. The answer to that is obviously that crimp connections are perfectly fine, not because of science or testing, but because I hate soldering.
Hello kenny. If it weren't for people like that, we'd have nothing left to screw. These soldering connectors are not so bad if you use a heatgun and make everything very hot (360° Celsius) so that the solder runs well. I myself have used it successfull.
I totally agree with your opinion on Scotchloks. They're an absolute fire hazard regardless of who uses them! I 've seen too many horror stories of fire damage behind the dashboard because of them. I once forced a friend throw a used "Bargain" expensive car stereo head unit in the trash as EVERY wire had a Scotch lok connector on it.
As a NASA certified solder Technician, preparing the wires correctly means everything. Those solder connectors will work IF the wires were cleaned to the point the solder/flux does its job. Unfortunately some Techs want to do the quick and easy and don't bother to ensure the wires are free of contantaniments . I would prefer using soldered and heat shrink to ensure visual good flow of the solder. Bottom Line: Don't blame the product if it is used incorrectly.
It's o.k. just to twist the wires together, solder them then shrink wrap them as long as the bared ends are clean & free of corrosion as well as being etched which could be while soldering the 2 ends together with rosin cored solder. I did that as part of an exercise at tech 30 years ago when I was doing a small automotive course which was like an appetizer to the main course so I was doing a few trade courses to get a taste for what I wanted to do,I chose the electrical trade over the automotive trade because I had to flip a coin to choose. One of my automotive teachers were helping me make the decision by telling me that the department of education and training were closing that part of the campus down & running all the courses from another campus the year after which is further away & out of my high schools range since it was a joint initiative between the tech & my high school. We were also soldering copper plates together & soldering the bare ends of the wires onto the copper plates,the mating surfaces had to be sanded of any tarnish then etched so that the solder would take to the copper wire.& Copper plates. So if you're trained to straight solder the wires like I was then that's o.k., I have soldered together a Nissan R33 Skyline GTS wiring harness together so it fits into my Holden VL Commodore ,I used the original Holden power feeds, ground wires, the EFI & fuel pump signal wires by splicing that part of the original Holden VL Commodore wiring harness into the Nissan RB25DE EFI harness from the R33 Skyline by soldering the wires together. It was a 3 litre variant of that engine that I built which ran the original RB25DE ECU & I never had a problem with that EFI wiring harness which I soldered together. I know that Chrysler solder the ends of their crimp on connectors together probably to improve conductivity,I noticed that in my dads neighbours old Jeep Liberty !
I have never used those, I thought I would give them a try, until now. I know how to solder correctly, and those things will give you what they call a cold joint. It is low heat solder that melts when you heat the shrink tube. and who ever did that job didn't get that solder hot enough. To solder it correctly you have to get the wire hot enough to melt the solder, solder it and then put the heat shrink on. I agree, those connectors suck. A good crimping tool is way better. In a pinch if you have to just twist wires together, there is a way to do it well, it's called the western union. Can't really explain, but look it up. That's what they did a lot in the old telegraph days.
having used those connectors many times, i will say that they do in fact work well for their intended purpose BUT, you need to prepare your wires meticulously and verify that when you shrink down the sleeve and melt the adhesive, that you did in fact melt the solder as well. most people just shrink it and assume that the solder also melted
#crswro1690 I get jaded because I end up with the idiots versions all the time. I have to figure out where they screwed up the connection, how bad the connection was done & work with what little wire they left. People who don't know what they are doing should not use them. Period. Thanks for sharing your experience. Thanks for watching & keep wrenching 🔧 Kenny
These connectors cannot work properly, the design makes it impossible. The very first thing to learn about soldering is that you MUST heat the metal, not the solder. The solder will transfer some heat to the metal but not enough as the metal conducts the heat away so it never reaches the temp needed for proper fusion. The result is what is know as a cold joint. Obviously with these connectors you are heating the plastic to put heat into the solder and the wire inside is the very last to get the heat and as copper is a very good conductor of heat the rest of the wire will keep the copper colder than the solder. Keeping the heat on longer after the solder has melted may bring the copper up to temp but the insulation will melt long before the copper is hot enough for a proper connection, esp if using a gas torch or a heat gun. On a normal solder joint the iron is directly heating the wire so it can heat it up quickly without dumping too much heat into the adjacent wire/insulation but the plastic on these connectors make that physically impossible. These connectors use a low melt solder to stop the plastic getting as hot but low melt solder itself is not ideal and still requires the copper to reach a certain temperature for proper fusion. I think the best you can hope for from these connectors is that the solder will stop a securely twisted together wire from unravelling which is a step up from 'twist and tape'. At least these connectors fully/securely insulate the joint against shorting out and the glue will keep the water out. Tbh, I would prob use them in certain situations but not for anything important or high current. After spending hours this week doing lots of tiny crimps I can certainly see the appeal
Stranded wire with mechanical crimps and heat-shrink tubing to seal the joint is a better choice than soldered joints in applications where the wires might be subjected to repeated flexing because that configuration is less vulnerable to fatigue breakage. The worst configuration is solid wire with soldered joints. On boats I used tinned, stranded wire for the added corrosion resistance.
I was a weapon specialist solder person I know soldering and those are crap fitting maybe good for temporary test connection but wires get dirty, sn63 /37 solder at a minimum might need extra flux a RA or RMA flux and sometimes you need to replace the wire due to corrosion .
The wires in these cases were visibility overlapping, so that was not the issue. It appears who ever used them did not heat up the solder sufficiently, so it actually melted into the wires (their primary cause of failure). If you want to use solder, as Ivan at Pine Hollow Diagnostics does, physically solder them together so you can see the solder melting and use shrink tubing (marine is the best), otherwise use uninsulated butt connectors and shrink tubing. If you're in a pinch you can also use marine type butt crimp connectors insulated with shrink tubing.
Have seen them being used and sorry to you and others but if used properly and tested properly then guess what that are good not trash have seen the crimp ones not work properly my self i use heat srink and solder the joint properly never fails Cheers
I agree with you those things are crap. I usually just use the heat shrink butt connectors but you have to use the correct ratcheting crimping tool with them or else you can pierce the insulation & create a hole for water intrusion. If done right they seem to be the best.
Not enough heat, they work well and are not garbage if you use them properly. Crimp connectors, and butt splices tend to be more of a problem, as another commenter said. He used them in Marine environments.
Thank you for the very good tip I never used them and never will but here is a tip for you that you might like upgrade your scanner to the Zeus I have one and love it keep up the hard work making videos and have a blessed day today you and your family 🙏
The heat shrink with glue keeps the moisture out as does soldering after crimping will keep the moisture out. If I can then I do both. Whatever works for you. Happy Motoring.
Good automotive practice recommends against soldered connections in wiring since it makes the connection points rigid and subject to damage from vibration. As soon as I saw your crimping tool I knew this was not your first rodeo. Most shade tree types won't spend that much money on a simple crimp tool and the results usually are obvious. I prefer the nylon coated butt connectors though. Yes, they are bulkier but the nylon is more pliable than PVC. To compensate I stagger the lengths so the connectors aren't all together in a bundle and then I tape it. (Yes, tape. Went to a two hour seminar by 3M on the proper use of tape but, it turned out to be very helpful in my career. They even did a 20 minute presentation on hour to prevent "flagging", where the end of the tape pulls up, and how to prevent it.) Then the corrugated and heat resistant loom. And, of course, no automotive wiring job is complete until you put the last hundred zip ties in place.
I get it, you have a preference, and it might be better, but those weren't done properly. A guy could screw up your crimp connectors if they don't know what they're doing.
Having used those connectors, I learned to make sure the solder melts and flows. I always test my connections for volt, amp, resistance. no matter the connection used, test your wires.
As with many other components the quality of solder sleeve connectors vary widely. I used them manufacturing medical equipment. Never gave us any problems. I recently purchased a solder sleeve kit from Amazon. Absolute garbage. No matter what I used to apply the heat I could not get the solder melted. The sleeve shrunk, the glue melted and sealed the sleeve, but I could not get the solder to flow. The reason the sleeve is clear is so you can visibly see if the solder has melted/flowed. A quality solder sleeve can provide a great reliable solder connection. But they need to be sourced from a reliable vendor, such as Digikey, Mouser, etc.
Thirty years in military defense and we use these. You need to pre-tin the wires and overlap them. Then you have to make sure the saudi Solder ring is completely melted. If done correctly, you can see the physical connections. I'm sure that somebody's cheaper ones that you see.Have a very low temperature melting point for the solder. Now that would be a major problem
They work well if you buy professional ones like TE Connectivity Polyolefin Solder Sleeve and follow the manufactures guidance but they're x10 the price of Chinese ones. Solder sleeves are used in avionics so they can't be bad.
When the solder connectors are done right, they work well. If not done right, obviously they don't work. Same for crimp splices. I cannot tell you how many times I watch someone crimp a splice by squeezing it between the handles of a pair of wire cutter. No slice works if done improperly.
I never had an evap problem on my Japanese cars. But I noticed at Costco gas station that lots of people over fill their tanks. (Hear them pumping more gas after it was full).
The reason people keep pumping the handles on their fill nozzels is because they shut off premature to being full. The methanol doped fuels foam as the fuel under high pressure is released to atmospheric pressures as it exits the nozzle. Most stations serving fuel and have more than 4 pumps run their pumps at a higher than recommended pressure which causes the handles to trip prematurely and the cars to fill to quickly. This causes users to pump the handles to get more fuel in which wears the handles and air valves and makes the problem of early handle tripping to become worse. If you remember the old pumps they actually pumped fuel using large throated hoses and hardware and individual high volume low pressure pumps. Modern systems have gone the other way with high pressure systems and crank up the pressure to reach the needed volume at a service station with many filling points. Some one filling their car a large distance from you can cause your filling session to end early if they pump their handle attempting to top their tank because all the stations are running off central pumps and their actions create a "water hammer" in the fuel lines through the entire system. I use diesel these days so these problems are not as common for myself, but can be a problem at large truck fueling stations which are plagued by the same problems when everyone is pumping diesel.
I think its a misconception that car manufacturers use crimp connectors because they are a better connector, which is not necessarily true. All wire joining techniques have a failure point. Automotive manufacturers use crimp connections because they are much easier to facilitate in manufacturing and have a reasonably low failure rate, but soldering, which is used in most electronic devices also have a low failure rate, and are much less bulky. OTOH, solder connections have a higher failure rate when exposed to vibration. The problem with these self soldering connectors is they are held together by a low temp solder and shrink tubing; both requiring an optimal amount of heat; if the heat is insufficient (or the connection is exposed to high heat as in near the exhaust manifold, it can resulitify the solder) they can fail. With a crimp connector, especially with uninsulated butt connectors and shrink tubing, there is a more verifiable connection and the shrink tubing not only seals the connection (marine shrink tubing also has a sealer that liquifies with heat), but is also a secondary connecting factor. Eric O also points out when using standard insulated butt connectors, many use the uninsulated portion of the crimping tool, which can pierce the insulation. Rainman Ray does this, but he also used shrink tubing over the insulated connectors to seal them; this is most likely because he doesn't have any uninsulated connectors. This probably works just fine, but creates a more bulky wire connection and there is much less chance of salt corrosion in Florida.
They work it done properly. You MUST melt the solder in the middle first. I did a video on them not to long ago. They do work it’s operator error. South main auto just did a video also
I like the crimp with the built in heat shrink connectors. Soldering causes wire breakage on vibrating harnesses. There is NO solder in harnesses in any of the large off-highway equipment I've seen.
I solder the wires, cover with silicone than heat shrink. Never had a future failure. I did see one soldier connection on a Honda many years ago tapes up from the factory it was a failure point I found many times.
I'd say the main issue Kenny here is talking about with those style of connectors as he stated is how do you know FOR CERTAIN that you have a good connection with these connectors? They can become heat shrunk together at the same when trying to set the solder up.🤷♂ Best to have the soldering done first, test its penetration & mechanical holding ability, and once that's verified, then heat shrink it. I get the appeal of trying to do it all at once, but problems can arise in the real world (especially with inexperienced/DIYers) as many of us have found who work in auto repair.
I was looking for a small trailer. New ones and they had the scotch locks on the wiring. Took a closer look and they had some poor welding. Even had wire stuck to the welding. This was 5-6 years ago
The solder in those connectors never melted. User error. Mercedes recommends these connectors ( specific part numbers based on wire size supplied by their preferred supplier) be used when doing wiring repairs in all of their wiring repair information. They are clear so you can see inside and verify the repair. They solder the connection, contain their own flux to ensure wetting, seal each end of the wire and form a mechanical connection that is stronger than the wire WHEN USED PROPERLY. I've been using them since 2004. Never had a problem because I follow the directions and use a propane torch (not a lighter or soldering iron or hot air gun as was likely used here) and then verify visually that the solder has melted and flowed into both of the wire ends. The formulation of the solder was changed probably 14 years ago to not contain lead and that raises the temperature needed to melt the solder, those inexperienced will use a lighter which is fine for heat shrink, but not for this product. Like any other tool they can be used improperly. Even metal crimps can be done poorly by any of the yahoos that walk in off the street and get a bay in a dealership or small shop.
First rule of soldering - heat the metal, not the solder which is impossible with this type of connector. They are just a posh version of the old 'twist and tape'
Damn. Now I need to test mine, and see if they work or they don't. It looked to me like the guy didn't heat them up enough, but I'm damn curious now. Thanks for posting.
I have used them and had good luck, HOWEVER, I recognized their shortcomings. If the solder is old, and the flux is stale they wont flow. I add a dab of flux from my flux syringe, and i make sure it melts. Its not that the connectors are bad, Its that the installer is bad. These take skill. When use properly they are better than most. I clearly saw they werent melted . Cant blame the connector for that.
I have used them with no issues on good clean copper wires. Won’t work on black/green corroded or greasy copper wires. I use a MAP torch and quality connectors, it’s the guys using heat guns and lighters on them that have issues
I have had good luck so far on my own beaters..I dont like the Chinese kind like that..I go one size up from what I "need" twist the wires together then slide it over and I use a lighter or a torch and then put another sleeve of heat shrink around it.
Hard to see but to me it looks like they never heated it enough to melt the solder ring. I am an avionics tech and we routinely use a better quality product made by Raychem that is similar to these. But we use them as a shield ground on various types of data wires. Either way, you have to use a high temp heat gun, or a propane torch like what you have, to melt the solder completely….and it takes some heat. Not familiar with the ones you show here but the idea is similar. You are also correct that a mechanical and environmental splice is best for wire joints.
The copper looks oxidized and solder never penetrates oxidation. They have to be cut back or thoroughly cleaned first. Secondly, unless the joint is well supported, vibration can cause the soldered joint to crack because it removes the flexibility of the copper by hardening the strands. Thanks.
I fix them one of 2 ways, just like you did in awkward places, but if i have room I will solder and heat shrink. Never had an issue. The scotch lock guys have issues months later due to corroded connections. If I see them, I cut that garbage out and splice it correctly. Keep Wrenching
As everybody said there was not enough heat to melt the solder. I have seen people glob solder onto a wire without enough heat many times. Those connectors may work if installed correctly but it is hard to tell without destroying them.
you can see that the solder never flowed into the connection but i don't like them in tight spaces it is hard to melt connector with a heat gun or lighter I'd rather have crimp or solder with heat shrink out in and easy to get to spot it is ok since you could see if it flowed well. the military likes physically cleaned and mechanically connected wires which are twisted together then soldered and then heat shrink connected or covered with a sleeve for best conductivity
It takes just as long to solder a wire together as it does to use a connector like this that has such a low melting point with the solder. It’s worth it to just solder I’ve found less worries.
I use the marine grade self adhesive infused butt connectors and then apply heat! You must make sure you don't damage the heat shrink when compressing the connectors!
My experience is that it only works on absolutely pristine new condition wire. Anything else and it will not flow properly because the wire was not tinned first. Plus most of the time they never get the connection hot enough either.
I just use solder, flux, a dab of dielectric grease over the bare soldered connection...with a long piece of heat shrink... seems to work well enough. Idk...
I got suckered into buying those.Besides being very expensive, I will go back to solder and shrink tubing.I need some better tubing too,I have been buying cheap China heatshrink. Hard to solder up in that place especially without a lift.
The wire has to be clean Make a mechanical connection first, then solder holds it together not making the connection. I was certified to solder stuff going into space. We did have some crimped connections but matched connector and calibrated crimper. I solder everything I can then heat shrink everything. Insulation displacement connectors are equally as bad especially outside. Those solder seal connectors like so much else need to be used properly.
While I’m not a fan of those particular types of connectors, they weren’t heated up fully to melt whatever they’re claiming is “solder”. That will melt if heated up properly. I actually prefer the ones that have the sealant inside of them like SMA’s video yesterday about his. God bless~
There is no Flux in those low temp solder connectors. Even if it melted correctly there is no Flux to stick the solder to the wires! Totally agree, they are junk for anything auto/motorcycle. Everyone should know how to solder properly, it's a good skill to have. There are circumstances where crimp connectors are not appropriate.
Good job on finding the outstanding issue, But you should not put the blame on the product but the person that incorrectly installed the connectors. Definitely need to use a torch to get the solder hot enough to melt, the ones that you removed did not have the solder melted.
As someone who bought and used those connectors, let me say this:
1) They are not as good as they advertise.
2) The connectors in this video were not installed properly. The solder ring inside the connector never reached melting point so it never flowed.
I agree, I have these and the ones in this video were not heated correctly. Solder did not melt. I also would not feel comfortable using FLAME around a fuel tank!! Hot air gun small tip.
The wires were visibly tarnished so the solder would never stick anyway. You can't solder tarnished wires! The wire needs to be dipped in acid type flux and pre tinned, then clean the acid off to prevent the wire from corrosion.
Solder wasn't hot enough and didn't properly melt. I use these connectors on boats and ships all the time. I use a torch, not a heat gun and melt the solder before going on to the shrink ends. Before these connectors I used crimp connectors but still soldered them. Most of the terminals I use are crimp. In marine use crimped connectors will in time have corrosion between the wire and connector. Once soldered they last forever. If I had logged all my time chasing owner caused crimp shorts it could be years. Many people doing crimps don't know how to fully crimp. I haven't done vehicles since 1970. Boats and ships outlast cars. So do their engines. Sorry to disagree. I enjoy your videos. You give out good, practical advice.
As a touch solder for Lucas Electronics for many years.
You heat the copper wires to accept the solder.
But as a belt and braces person, I do connector and heat it to run down a bit of solder, never had one fail yet.
I was taught many years ago in a shop class, that you had to have a good mechanical connection to have a good electrical connection!
Solder is mechanical. I personally crimp when wiring in a vehicle with open barrel B crimps (basically a cold weld). Solder does work fine though, as long as u do it right, and add strain relief beyond the wicking point of both sides of the connection.
I think u were supposed to be taught to have 2 mechanical connections lol
Even open barrel uses 2. 1 for the conductor (connection) and 1 for the insulation (strain relief).. soldering: solder conductors and secure for strain relief. Lol wire nuts are even supposed to be taped actually n that's 2. Even a typical connector plug in a car connects the terminals and the 2nd connection is the clicky button dealio.
Even in plumbing.. solder 2 pipe together and HOPE! 😂
I first used solder type heat shrink connecters in the 1960s when I worked for the phone company. If Bell Labs, AT&T and Western Electric used this type connector, the problem is not the connector, the problem is the untrained Tech. The heat shrink connector has been around for 50 plus years. I enjoy your videos.
I worked for IBM and worked at Bell Labs in Holmdel. I left IBM and went to work for Lucent at the same Bell Labs. Those were the days.
I use those connectors. You are supposed to twist the wires together before soldering and that connector you pulled off wasn't even heated. You could see the solder was still big and not heated at all.
I twist the wires together and actually solder them with a soldering iron or a soldering gun, depending on the wire guage. I have been soldering since 1961 until I retired in 2012.
Works every time..
Those connectors weren't installed correctly. As these are heated, first the tubing shrinks to keep everything together. Second the adhesive melts to seal the connector. Finally, the solder ring melts to make the connection. You have to heat these until you see the solder ring melt. Properly installed, you'll break the wire before it comes apart. It's best to use a wrap-around tip on the heat gun with these connectors.
As is usual, a good mechanic can make a cheap connector work and a bad mechanic can screw up a great connector.
Correctly soldered connections in cars is the only way to ensure longevity of the connection, otherwise oxidization of the connection over time will occur & cause problems. Oxidization will occur over time with crimp, snap or whatever type of mechanical connection you use. The amount of these mechanical connections in cars has always amazed me being a retired electrical engineer.
Sorry bro but your nuts solder oxidize also all metal does.
I was a 2 way radio technician for nearly 40 years. Soldering physically secure connections without applying sufficient heat
from a soldering iron is asking for trouble.
Only way?
Not to mention its as strong as any other part of the harness, when soldered... and when done correctly, is nearly undetectable, with no resistance inducing lumps of dissimilar alloys changing signal reference voltages...
And waterproof too.. idk lol.
Solder, flux, die electric grease, and a long quality, properly sized heatshrink tube, heated correctly..is superior to most human installed crimp connectors.
Just not as easy as crimping,
IMHO..
Kenny you are absolutely correct, those heat gun solder connectors are complete garbage. As for regular old style non-heat shrink butt connectors and scotch locks still have their place, at least in my shop. I been splicing wires for the last 40 years. Great job on your diag. and repair!
The other thing about these connectors is the type of solder they use. It's not the same as normal solder, it has a lower melting point to allow it to melt before the plastic burns. Low melting point solder puts the connection at risk if you place them in an area subject to engine heat, since the solder may reflow and possibly lose some of the mechanical connection. These were fun to play with but for the most part I've gone back to what you're using here, marine grade shrink wrap around standard uninsulated butt connectors.
As always, you've hit the nail on the head !!
I’ve just used four of those connectors to make repairs on two different cars. We have had no issues. Based on what I am seeing, they didn’t heat them sufficiently for the solder to melt. You must have good lighting, and you need to watch the copper connections, making sure that the solder thoroughly penetrates both sides. My diagnosis is those connectors were not heated to the point that the solder melted. They are not easy to use correctly, but when used correctly are a reliable means of joining wires.
I used this type of connector when I rewired the instrument panel and avionics in my Beechcraft Debonair, but they were purchased from an aircraft parts supplier and were made by AMP, if I remember correctly. They were approved by the FAA inspector after installation. When I heated them up and the solder melted, you could actually see the solder wick into the wires giving a proper joint. Twenty years later, I have had no problems with any of the connections, and some carry the current for the landing gear motor and flap actuator which can draw over 20 amps.
Most likely, the cheap solder tubes used had crappy solder and no flux, and/or were not properly installed, as it takes a lot of heat to get the solder to melt and flow properly. If they are heated only until the tube shrinks up, they will not provide a proper connection.
I have no problem using this type of connector, IF they are a good quality connector and they are installed correctly. Any connector can fail if not suited for the particular application, and if not installed properly, whick in this case was not done.
Nice video Kenny. The computer only "sees" small changes in voltage to determine what's going on. You were correct that those connectors were interfearing with that. I solder wires to prevent moisture from corroding the connection. OEMs don't do it to save money.
Harness Multiwire Grounds are soldered. Good job!
Interesting that Eric O. at SMA just posted a video about connectors!. For over 40 years, I've used the compound "vise" like pliers to make ""pro" connections, which I would strongly advise others to do as well.
They don't work either when you get old and have arthritis in your hands and fingers ! time to retire!
i saw that video also with dr o sma also have a look at northridgefix alex say dont use low melt solder to solder joints use good quality solder and flux which i cant see in those connecters a good idea that dont work
I do use them and have yet to have a failure, and have no plans to throw mine out.. As others have said, the key is to make sure the solder melts. Bonus if you twist the wires together, though that is not always practical. The reason OEM does not use solder is simply cost.
I also use the glued & heat shrinked crimp connectors. But when there is room to apply them, I have more faith in the soldered connectors.
I’ve used these on several ocasionas and have noticed that it takes a decent amount of heat to melt the solder, to the point that the heat shrink is almost melted. I then have to use electrical tape or more heat shrink to strengthen up the connector. Once I use up my supply will go back to twisting and soldering without connectors. Good video.
Amen brother! Tossed mine out several months ago. Too many variables for a reliable connection with these things. Un-insulated crimp connectors with heat shrink for the win.
Excellent quality electrical repair brother Kenny. I'm always proud of you because you do what is right! Thank you for a great video. I just happened to get up late and was happy to see you posted this video.
I used the Mercedes Benz ones all the time, we never had problems with them, the trick was to span the wires then push them through each other then twist them together with clean washed hands then heat solder first, then heat the outer parts to the wire casing which seals up while shrinking. That is their only wire repair that was approved to join a harness to harness repair.
Who would have thought that using low melt temperature solder in an automotive application (possibly next to hot exhaust) would cause issues. I agree with you Kenny, these things are junk! Crimp and heat shrink as you did, or solder and heat shrink is the best option IMO.
Lol 😆
solder, shrinkmelt, crimps, nothing will work if you don't even do it right
I’ve used a type solder splice like you were showing on many aircraft. Those you showed were not properly heated. The solder was not melted. Properly melted on clean wiring and they are fantastic.
So as a ex car stereo installer (now a NICET certified low voltage commercial fire alarm guy), the best fix is to strip 3/4 inch off both wires and then twist them together, then use a pencil torch to solder them together. Yes, you did use the proper hot glue heat shrink. Only the factory duel curl type crimps like in Amphenol connectors is worthy, the barrel crimps are hit and miss where the wire can often also just pull out under tension. If it's gonna get wet, solder the wires so they can never just pull apart IMHO.
I gotta say.. those solder shrinks do work, but I wouldn't use em for anything but terminating a shield in my truck. However, I used em on a breakout box for my acoustic/electric drums.. I did a few tests though, til I found the best way to use em: 1) make sure ur wire conductors are CLEAN. 2) add flux to the wires before sticking the shrink on it. 3) for larger gauge wire, put the shrink on 1, get ur leads tied nicely, and wrap a bit of extra solder on the connection, then slide over ur solder shrink. 4) use a focused heat gun (not lighter, not a hair drier, and not the dinky heat gun from an auto store... Use a variable temperature and variable airflow gun) with high heat and low flow. 5) unlike doing a normal shrink tube, shrink the outside ends 1st, so the heat gets trapped in for that solder. 6) don't remove heat til the solder actually melts (if u think the tube will melt, back off, DONT aim the gun away). 7) heat 1 side then the other OR roll extremely fast until the solder melts in good. And 8) it's not melted in at all (the slightest bit) if u can't even see the strands through the solder!
The solder inside these connectors are low-melt solder. Low-melt solder take less heat to melt but they are very brittle and can break easily. Plus there's not enough of it in the connectors to make for a solid connection. Look at the size of the connectors and imagine how much solder is actually in them. I use them but I only use them as shrink wrap. I still do regular soldering. They actually perform well as shrink wrap because of their waterproofness. I think.
Marine grade shrink wrap is a more economical solution. Especially if you're taking the time to do the repair correctly. Thanks for your input & watching the channel. Keep wrenching 🔧
I'll be darn , you are the first one i see taking the time to do it proper, usually crimping damage insulation
Yes. Manufacturers do solder some connectors. My 2017 Ford F150 radiator fans have soldered connections on its terminal strip. One of the fans was not running and I found a cold solder joint on that terminal board. It runs fine now after I reflowed the solder with a large 120watt solder gun.
My '95 VW Golf III has soldered battery terminals from factory. I believe they are the same on all the 90's VWs. Probably my favorite style of terminal, grabs on tight and there isn't any chance they will corrode away with how heavy duty they are thats for sure.
I keep these in my truck for emergency fixes. Whoever put these on did not heat them up enough to melt the solder properly. When I use them I make sure the wires are interlased if they're multi strand wire. Squeeze on the solder point so it touches the wires and squeezes them together. Then heat and make sure it wicks into the wires. After its fully shrunk down cover it with marine grade heat shrink to keep water out. They work fine if used right.
The solder is not there because they didn't use the right heat gun . They only shrunk the plastic. we use similar connector on aircraft but for grounding the shielded wires. Right heat gun makes the solder melt. they work great . They are FAA approved and called solder sleeves. I've also used the newer butt connectors that have the red, blue and yellow heat shrink sleeve right on them with great success on my 83 f100 on the trailer wires and tail light wires in place of the old connector that corroded. tail light work great an no more problems. And I live in MI. Salt belt and drove the truck in winter too.
As a graduate student at TH-cam Auto Tech, I can say that every professor who has spoken on the issue hates both the melted "solder" connectors and Scotch locks. The only divergence is whether actually soldering wires is better than crimp connections. The answer to that is obviously that crimp connections are perfectly fine, not because of science or testing, but because I hate soldering.
😂 thanks for watching & keep wrenching 🔧
Hello kenny.
If it weren't for people like that, we'd have nothing left to screw.
These soldering connectors are not so bad if you use a heatgun and make everything very hot (360° Celsius) so that the solder runs well. I myself have used it successfull.
I totally agree with your opinion on Scotchloks. They're an absolute fire hazard regardless of who uses them! I 've seen too many horror stories of fire damage behind the dashboard because of them. I once forced a friend throw a used "Bargain" expensive car stereo head unit in the trash as EVERY wire had a Scotch lok connector on it.
You probably saved him from a 🔥 🔥🔥 He is lucky to have you as a friend. Thanks for watching & keep wrenching 🔧
As a NASA certified solder Technician, preparing the wires correctly means everything. Those solder connectors will work IF the wires were cleaned to the point the solder/flux does its job. Unfortunately some Techs want to do the quick and easy and don't bother to ensure the wires are free of contantaniments . I would prefer using soldered and heat shrink to ensure visual good flow of the solder.
Bottom Line: Don't blame the product if it is used incorrectly.
It's o.k. just to twist the wires together, solder them then shrink wrap them as long as the bared ends are clean & free of corrosion as well as being etched which could be while soldering the 2 ends together with rosin cored solder.
I did that as part of an exercise at tech 30 years ago when I was doing a small automotive course which was like an appetizer to the main course so I was doing a few trade courses to get a taste for what I wanted to do,I chose the electrical trade over the automotive trade because I had to flip a coin to choose.
One of my automotive teachers were helping me make the decision by telling me that the department of education and training were closing that part of the campus down & running all the courses from another campus the year after which is further away & out of my high schools range since it was a joint initiative between the tech & my high school.
We were also soldering copper plates together & soldering the bare ends of the wires onto the copper plates,the mating surfaces had to be sanded of any tarnish then etched so that the solder would take to the copper wire.& Copper plates.
So if you're trained to straight solder the wires like I was then that's o.k., I have soldered together a Nissan R33 Skyline GTS wiring harness together so it fits into my Holden VL Commodore ,I used the original Holden power feeds, ground wires, the EFI & fuel pump signal wires by splicing that part of the original Holden VL Commodore wiring harness into the Nissan RB25DE EFI harness from the R33 Skyline by soldering the wires together.
It was a 3 litre variant of that engine that I built which ran the original RB25DE ECU & I never had a problem with that EFI wiring harness which I soldered together.
I know that Chrysler solder the ends of their crimp on connectors together probably to improve conductivity,I noticed that in my dads neighbours old Jeep Liberty !
I have never used those, I thought I would give them a try, until now. I know how to solder correctly, and those things will give you what they call a cold joint. It is low heat solder that melts when you heat the shrink tube. and who ever did that job didn't get that solder hot enough. To solder it correctly you have to get the wire hot enough to melt the solder, solder it and then put the heat shrink on. I agree, those connectors suck. A good crimping tool is way better. In a pinch if you have to just twist wires together, there is a way to do it well, it's called the western union. Can't really explain, but look it up. That's what they did a lot in the old telegraph days.
having used those connectors many times, i will say that they do in fact work well for their intended purpose BUT, you need to prepare your wires meticulously and verify that when you shrink down the sleeve and melt the adhesive, that you did in fact melt the solder as well.
most people just shrink it and assume that the solder also melted
#crswro1690 I get jaded because I end up with the idiots versions all the time. I have to figure out where they screwed up the connection, how bad the connection was done & work with what little wire they left. People who don't know what they are doing should not use them. Period. Thanks for sharing your experience. Thanks for watching & keep wrenching 🔧 Kenny
These connectors cannot work properly, the design makes it impossible. The very first thing to learn about soldering is that you MUST heat the metal, not the solder.
The solder will transfer some heat to the metal but not enough as the metal conducts the heat away so it never reaches the temp needed for proper fusion. The result is what is know as a cold joint. Obviously with these connectors you are heating the plastic to put heat into the solder and the wire inside is the very last to get the heat and as copper is a very good conductor of heat the rest of the wire will keep the copper colder than the solder.
Keeping the heat on longer after the solder has melted may bring the copper up to temp but the insulation will melt long before the copper is hot enough for a proper connection, esp if using a gas torch or a heat gun.
On a normal solder joint the iron is directly heating the wire so it can heat it up quickly without dumping too much heat into the adjacent wire/insulation but the plastic on these connectors make that physically impossible. These connectors use a low melt solder to stop the plastic getting as hot but low melt solder itself is not ideal and still requires the copper to reach a certain temperature for proper fusion.
I think the best you can hope for from these connectors is that the solder will stop a securely twisted together wire from unravelling which is a step up from 'twist and tape'. At least these connectors fully/securely insulate the joint against shorting out and the glue will keep the water out. Tbh, I would prob use them in certain situations but not for anything important or high current. After spending hours this week doing lots of tiny crimps I can certainly see the appeal
We used them in military applications-if done properly, they work very well. They never heated them enough.
Stranded wire with mechanical crimps and heat-shrink tubing to seal the joint is a better choice than soldered joints in applications where the wires might be subjected to repeated flexing because that configuration is less vulnerable to fatigue breakage. The worst configuration is solid wire with soldered joints. On boats I used tinned, stranded wire for the added corrosion resistance.
I was a weapon specialist solder person I know soldering and those are crap fitting maybe good for temporary test connection but wires get dirty, sn63 /37 solder at a minimum might need extra flux a RA or RMA flux and sometimes you need to replace the wire due to corrosion .
Rainman Ray’s loves those connectors.
They are like a low heat solder. I've seen Ray use them too. He does make sure that the 2 wires are sticking into each other before he heats them.
The wires in these cases were visibility overlapping, so that was not the issue. It appears who ever used them did not heat up the solder sufficiently, so it actually melted into the wires (their primary cause of failure). If you want to use solder, as Ivan at Pine Hollow Diagnostics does, physically solder them together so you can see the solder melting and use shrink tubing (marine is the best), otherwise use uninsulated butt connectors and shrink tubing. If you're in a pinch you can also use marine type butt crimp connectors insulated with shrink tubing.
Have seen them being used and sorry to you and others but if used properly and tested properly then guess what that are good not trash have seen the crimp ones not work properly my self i use heat srink and solder the joint properly never fails Cheers
Ray just posted a wheel speed sensor using these connectors
I agree with you those things are crap. I usually just use the heat shrink butt connectors but you have to use the correct ratcheting crimping tool with them or else you can pierce the insulation & create a hole for water intrusion. If done right they seem to be the best.
Not enough heat, they work well and are not garbage if you use them properly. Crimp connectors, and butt splices tend to be more of a problem, as another commenter said. He used them in Marine environments.
Thank you for the very good tip I never used them and never will but here is a tip for you that you might like upgrade your scanner to the Zeus I have one and love it keep up the hard work making videos and have a blessed day today you and your family 🙏
Thanks for the recommendation & watching the channel. Keep wrenching 🔧
The heat shrink with glue keeps the moisture out as does soldering after crimping will keep the moisture out. If I can then I do both. Whatever works for you. Happy Motoring.
I use bare crimp connectors and put heat shrink over them seen those you showed with bad connection in past .
Good automotive practice recommends against soldered connections in wiring since it makes the connection points rigid and subject to damage from vibration. As soon as I saw your crimping tool I knew this was not your first rodeo. Most shade tree types won't spend that much money on a simple crimp tool and the results usually are obvious. I prefer the nylon coated butt connectors though. Yes, they are bulkier but the nylon is more pliable than PVC. To compensate I stagger the lengths so the connectors aren't all together in a bundle and then I tape it. (Yes, tape. Went to a two hour seminar by 3M on the proper use of tape but, it turned out to be very helpful in my career. They even did a 20 minute presentation on hour to prevent "flagging", where the end of the tape pulls up, and how to prevent it.) Then the corrugated and heat resistant loom. And, of course, no automotive wiring job is complete until you put the last hundred zip ties in place.
I get it, you have a preference, and it might be better, but those weren't done properly. A guy could screw up your crimp connectors if they don't know what they're doing.
Great video and could you put a link to the heat shrink tubing that you use? Thanks so much Kenny
Having used those connectors, I learned to make sure the solder melts and flows. I always test my connections for volt, amp, resistance. no matter the connection used, test your wires.
As with many other components the quality of solder sleeve connectors vary widely. I used them manufacturing medical equipment. Never gave us any problems. I recently purchased a solder sleeve kit from Amazon. Absolute garbage. No matter what I used to apply the heat I could not get the solder melted. The sleeve shrunk, the glue melted and sealed the sleeve, but I could not get the solder to flow. The reason the sleeve is clear is so you can visibly see if the solder has melted/flowed. A quality solder sleeve can provide a great reliable solder connection. But they need to be sourced from a reliable vendor, such as Digikey, Mouser, etc.
Thirty years in military defense and we use these. You need to pre-tin the wires and overlap them. Then you have to make sure the saudi Solder ring is completely melted. If done correctly, you can see the physical connections. I'm sure that somebody's cheaper ones that you see.Have a very low temperature melting point for the solder. Now that would be a major problem
They work well if you buy professional ones like TE Connectivity Polyolefin Solder Sleeve and follow the manufactures guidance but they're x10 the price of Chinese ones. Solder sleeves are used in avionics so they can't be bad.
When the solder connectors are done right, they work well. If not done right, obviously they don't work. Same for crimp splices. I cannot tell you how many times I watch someone crimp a splice by squeezing it between the handles of a pair of wire cutter. No slice works if done improperly.
I never had an evap problem on my Japanese cars. But I noticed at Costco gas station that lots of people over fill their tanks. (Hear them pumping more gas after it was full).
The reason people keep pumping the handles on their fill nozzels is because they shut off premature to being full.
The methanol doped fuels foam as the fuel under high pressure is released to atmospheric pressures as it exits the nozzle.
Most stations serving fuel and have more than 4 pumps run their pumps at a higher than recommended pressure which causes the handles to trip prematurely and the cars to fill to quickly.
This causes users to pump the handles to get more fuel in which wears the handles and air valves and makes the problem of early handle tripping to become worse.
If you remember the old pumps they actually pumped fuel using large throated hoses and hardware and individual high volume low pressure pumps. Modern systems have gone the other way with high pressure systems and crank up the pressure to reach the needed volume at a service station with many filling points.
Some one filling their car a large distance from you can cause your filling session to end early if they pump their handle attempting to top their tank because all the stations are running off central pumps and their actions create a "water hammer" in the fuel lines through the entire system.
I use diesel these days so these problems are not as common for myself, but can be a problem at large truck fueling stations which are plagued by the same problems when everyone is pumping diesel.
I think its a misconception that car manufacturers use crimp connectors because they are a better connector, which is not necessarily true. All wire joining techniques have a failure point. Automotive manufacturers use crimp connections because they are much easier to facilitate in manufacturing and have a reasonably low failure rate, but soldering, which is used in most electronic devices also have a low failure rate, and are much less bulky. OTOH, solder connections have a higher failure rate when exposed to vibration. The problem with these self soldering connectors is they are held together by a low temp solder and shrink tubing; both requiring an optimal amount of heat; if the heat is insufficient (or the connection is exposed to high heat as in near the exhaust manifold, it can resulitify the solder) they can fail. With a crimp connector, especially with uninsulated butt connectors and shrink tubing, there is a more verifiable connection and the shrink tubing not only seals the connection (marine shrink tubing also has a sealer that liquifies with heat), but is also a secondary connecting factor.
Eric O also points out when using standard insulated butt connectors, many use the uninsulated portion of the crimping tool, which can pierce the insulation. Rainman Ray does this, but he also used shrink tubing over the insulated connectors to seal them; this is most likely because he doesn't have any uninsulated connectors. This probably works just fine, but creates a more bulky wire connection and there is much less chance of salt corrosion in Florida.
They work it done properly. You MUST melt the solder in the middle first. I did a video on them not to long ago. They do work it’s operator error. South main auto just did a video also
I like the crimp with the built in heat shrink connectors.
Soldering causes wire breakage on vibrating harnesses. There is NO solder in harnesses in any of the large off-highway equipment I've seen.
If u look they did not get it to melt all the way so ya why would it connect got to know what u r doing to use them right
I solder the wires, cover with silicone than heat shrink. Never had a future failure. I did see one soldier connection on a Honda many years ago tapes up from the factory it was a failure point I found many times.
Should ignition coils be changed as a maintenance item or individually when they cause a Misfire?Thx
I'd say the main issue Kenny here is talking about with those style of connectors as he stated is how do you know FOR CERTAIN that you have a good connection with these connectors? They can become heat shrunk together at the same when trying to set the solder up.🤷♂ Best to have the soldering done first, test its penetration & mechanical holding ability, and once that's verified, then heat shrink it. I get the appeal of trying to do it all at once, but problems can arise in the real world (especially with inexperienced/DIYers) as many of us have found who work in auto repair.
Nailed it! Thanks for your reply. Keep wrenching 🔧
I was looking for a small trailer. New ones and they had the scotch locks on the wiring. Took a closer look and they had some poor welding. Even had wire stuck to the welding. This was 5-6 years ago
Solider connection in the car ok equinox driver side wiring harness
And that’s oem it goes to electric power steering
What are those crimp connectors you used called?
The solder in those connectors never melted. User error.
Mercedes recommends these connectors ( specific part numbers based on wire size supplied by their preferred supplier) be used when doing wiring repairs in all of their wiring repair information.
They are clear so you can see inside and verify the repair.
They solder the connection, contain their own flux to ensure wetting, seal each end of the wire and form a mechanical connection that is stronger than the wire WHEN USED PROPERLY.
I've been using them since 2004. Never had a problem because I follow the directions and use a propane torch (not a lighter or soldering iron or hot air gun as was likely used here) and then verify visually that the solder has melted and flowed into both of the wire ends.
The formulation of the solder was changed probably 14 years ago to not contain lead and that raises the temperature needed to melt the solder, those inexperienced will use a lighter which is fine for heat shrink, but not for this product.
Like any other tool they can be used improperly. Even metal crimps can be done poorly by any of the yahoos that walk in off the street and get a bay in a dealership or small shop.
First rule of soldering - heat the metal, not the solder which is impossible with this type of connector. They are just a posh version of the old 'twist and tape'
Damn. Now I need to test mine, and see if they work or they don't. It looked to me like the guy didn't heat them up enough, but I'm damn curious now. Thanks for posting.
I have seen can bus line splices sottered. But I do agree it's not necessary.
Yep I much prefer crimp and heat shrink myself. But I always test everything.
Thanks, Kenny for the video! I learned something !!
Yes I had those type of connectors leave me down on a tractor rewire job. I thought I was doing a quality job! never again.
Yup! Thanks for your reply. Keep wrenching 🔧
I have used them and had good luck, HOWEVER, I recognized their shortcomings. If the solder is old, and the flux is stale they wont flow. I add a dab of flux from my flux syringe, and i make sure it melts. Its not that the connectors are bad, Its that the installer is bad. These take skill. When use properly they are better than most. I clearly saw they werent melted . Cant blame the connector for that.
also always do the pull test, i had a remote start installed a car and they used scotch locks, it was nothing but problems.
I have used them with no issues on good clean copper wires. Won’t work on black/green corroded or greasy copper wires. I use a MAP torch and quality connectors, it’s the guys using heat guns and lighters on them that have issues
I have had good luck so far on my own beaters..I dont like the Chinese kind like that..I go one size up from what I "need" twist the wires together then slide it over and I use a lighter or a torch and then put another sleeve of heat shrink around it.
Hard to see but to me it looks like they never heated it enough to melt the solder ring. I am an avionics tech and we routinely use a better quality product made by Raychem that is similar to these. But we use them as a shield ground on various types of data wires. Either way, you have to use a high temp heat gun, or a propane torch like what you have, to melt the solder completely….and it takes some heat. Not familiar with the ones you show here but the idea is similar. You are also correct that a mechanical and environmental splice is best for wire joints.
One thing I was taught is don't use a cheap crimp tool. The longer Handel's give you more leverage for a better crimp.
True! Thanks for watching & keep wrenching 🔧
The copper looks oxidized and solder never penetrates oxidation. They have to be cut back or thoroughly cleaned first.
Secondly, unless the joint is well supported, vibration can cause the soldered joint to crack because it removes the flexibility of the copper by hardening the strands.
Thanks.
All very good points. Thanks for sharing & keep wrenching 🔧
I used those connectors on my car stereo and speakers. I use a regular heat gun and no issues so far
I fix them one of 2 ways, just like you did in awkward places, but if i have room I will solder and heat shrink. Never had an issue.
The scotch lock guys have issues months later due to corroded connections. If I see them, I cut that garbage out and splice it correctly. Keep Wrenching
As everybody said there was not enough heat to melt the solder. I have seen people glob solder onto a wire without enough heat many times. Those connectors may work if installed correctly but it is hard to tell without destroying them.
Crimp connections that are also soldered are superior. Prevents any possible corrosion.
Thanks again kenny
Where do you get those crimp connectors ?
you can see that the solder never flowed into the connection but i don't like them in tight spaces it is hard to melt connector with a heat gun or lighter I'd rather have crimp or solder with heat shrink out in and easy to get to spot it is ok since you could see if it flowed well.
the military likes physically cleaned and mechanically connected wires which are twisted together then soldered and then heat shrink connected or covered with a sleeve for best conductivity
It takes just as long to solder a wire together as it does to use a connector like this that has such a low melting point with the solder. It’s worth it to just solder I’ve found less worries.
I use the marine grade self adhesive infused butt connectors and then apply heat! You must make sure you don't damage the heat shrink when compressing the connectors!
Looks like the problem was operator error. They were never heated enough to melt the solder.
My experience is that it only works on absolutely pristine new condition wire. Anything else and it will not flow properly because the wire was not tinned first. Plus most of the time they never get the connection hot enough either.
All good points! Thanks for your reply. Keep wrenching 🔧
I just use solder, flux, a dab of dielectric grease over the bare soldered connection...with a long piece of heat shrink...
seems to work well enough. Idk...
You have to see that the solder wicks onto the two wires. When done correctly, these solder sleeves work fine. These are not for rugged environment.
Yes I've seen solder in wire looms, from GM.
I got suckered into buying those.Besides being very expensive, I will go back to solder and shrink tubing.I need some better tubing too,I have been buying cheap China heatshrink. Hard to solder up in that place especially without a lift.
The wire has to be clean
Make a mechanical connection first, then solder holds it together not making the connection.
I was certified to solder stuff going into space. We did have some crimped connections but matched connector and calibrated crimper.
I solder everything I can then heat shrink everything. Insulation displacement connectors are equally as bad especially outside.
Those solder seal connectors like so much else need to be used properly.
Kenny you forgot to mention wire nuts! My absolute favorite find. I know when I see one I'm in for an adventure!
While I’m not a fan of those particular types of connectors, they weren’t heated up fully to melt whatever they’re claiming is “solder”. That will melt if heated up properly.
I actually prefer the ones that have the sealant inside of them like SMA’s video yesterday about his.
God bless~
There is no Flux in those low temp solder connectors. Even if it melted correctly there is no Flux to stick the solder to the wires! Totally agree, they are junk for anything auto/motorcycle. Everyone should know how to solder properly, it's a good skill to have. There are circumstances where crimp connectors are not appropriate.
That one, the solder hadn't flowed. Someone didn't know what they were doing. I have used these. No issues.
Good job on finding the outstanding issue, But you should not put the blame on the product but the person that incorrectly installed the connectors. Definitely need to use a torch to get the solder hot enough to melt, the ones that you removed did not have the solder melted.