Great video. I'm wasn't a kid on real C64 era but I played with my dad's old C64 a lot in early 2000. I had a lot of old copied game disks on loan from my cousin, and also had one of those action replay carts. I remember how amazed I was of speed increase with that cart, it made 1541 drive load very quickly. I remember it was possible to freeze the game and save it to disk using some kind of action replay's own file format. That file was only possible to load with action replay, and it was blazing fast, a lot faster than loading regular prg file which was already satisfactory fast. I don't have experience with jiffydos, but I doubt it could be faster than that. Today C64 is still working and I use pi1541 as disk drive emulator, and have epyx fastload replica cart. I think old action replay was faster that epyx fastload I have now.
JiffyDos is also available for the Plus/4; I just installed it and it's great to now have all my machines using it! These benchmarks amaze me no matter how many times I see them, and to think how much slower they were back in the day not because of the limitations of technology but because C= messed up.
I was never aware the C64 was handicapped... explains why I could go grab a snack as a kid while I waited for a game to load off our 1541. Sometimes even restoring retro tech necessitates mixing in some newer tech.
Couldn't agree more all this plus the mentioned DOS wedge and no used prots make it a clear winner for me. Other carts that offer the same are useful but for other things
This channel deserves more views! ☺ BTW Why does one need to replace two chips in the C64 (and a 3rd one in the disk drive)? See 2:28 into your video. I always thought that the C64 kernal came on one singe ROM chip...?
Haha, thanks! I will keep making content and hopefully it will grow in time :) Great question. The reason there are two ROM chips in the video is because I reused footage from my C128 episode there. The 128 board pictured has separate ROMs for the 64 and 128 kernals.
I had Jiffy DOS installed on a 64c, 1541,1541-II, and a 1581 with a Super Snapshot Cart all connected to a blazing fast 1200 baud modem running a BBS in late 80,s/early 90's...I could boot up the BBS from power off to ready to take calls in 3 seconds flat! Sure miss those days of a super fast computer...Winblows by Microshaft is worse than a stock 1541 at times...I do remember some program loaders would read "Patients is a 1541 drive"...
The official user manual has good examples of each command and how they can also be used inside a basic program. They're available at the bottom of this page: www.go4retro.com/products/jiffydos/ A brief command reference can be found here as well: www.c64-wiki.com/wiki/JiffyDOS
I never knew about JiffyDOS back in the days. I had my C64 and my 1541 modded with SpeedDOS which uses a parallel cable in addition to the serial IEC one. It is a bit slow for a parallel speeder, about the same speed as Jiffy DOS manages over the serial connection, but since it came with a parallel cable, it had some other benefits like '15 sec Copy' which literally copied a disk in 15 seconds... not counting the time you needed for the disk swapping. And of course programs like Burst Nibbler which could copy quite a few copy protected disks back in the days. Back then I dreamed of getting a 'real' parallel speeder like 'Dolphin DOS' or 'Prologic DOS' which could probably beat the time you got loading from the SD2IEC with a real 1541. But they were much more expensive than SpeedDOS and I was a poor kid saving his money to get an Amiga. SpeedDOS was also quite compatible, but I had a switch in my C64 to switch back to the original kernal in case the disk would not work with SpeedDOS. Sadly I had no such swich in the disk drive which wasn't a problem back in the day, but is quite a pain nowadays, because the very popular speedloader from 'Nostalgia' seems to be incompatible with the SpeedDOS ROM in the 1541. I tried 2 different 1541 with SpeedDOS and neither of them seems to work, not even with the original kernal in the C64. Still have my original setup from back in the days and SpeedDOS was not an uncommon mod over here. I tried JiffyDOS in VICE and what drives me nuts is that the F-Keys are totally different from SpeedDOS. IIRC, with JiffyDOS you press F1 to load the directory and F3 to load a file, with SpeedDOS it's F7 for the directory and F5 to load. Doesn't sound like a big deal, but if you used SpeedDOS for over 30 years, it is hard to learn the new F-Keys ;-) But since I got a Pi1541 now, I think I have to mod one of my C64 with JiffyDOS and force myself to learn the different F-Keys since there is no way to use SpeedDOS with the Pi1541. And NOT having a fastloader is an even worse option than having one where the F-keys drive you nuts ;-)
I've never actually owned JiffyDOS. All my C64 disk speed increases came from cartridges I owned. Primarily the Final Cartridge 3, which I actually got because it was one of the few carts with a tape turbo (and I used tapes on my C64 for a very long time). Anyway, it might be interesting to see the speed differences between the various options. Are you planning on doing a benchmark for some of the standard cards (Final Cartridge 3, Action Replay, Epyx, etc) vs JiffyDOS?
I never even knew about JiffyDOS back when I was a kid! I really missed out :P My plan is to continue to benchmark hardware as I go, and maybe I'll do a fastloader shootout at some point. I believe Adrian's Digital Basement recently compared a whole bunch of fastloader carts as well.
The desk itself was a a cheap flat-pack deal from Amazon. I added the two top tiers using heavy duty shelving. The nice thing about it is that it's on casters so it's easy to roll out to work on cables in the back. Unfortunately it looks like they no longer sell it :(
7:06 71 seconds to 12 seconds is not 10x faster... it's about 6x faster, which is consistent with my own experience. Your SD2IEC seems to be faster than mine, which is strange. I got about 6KBps with mine. But you also have a newer model with an LCD. I wonder if that has something to do with it.
This is what happens when you write the script and record the voiceover before filming :/ I had assumed the 1541 would transfer around 300bytes/sec but that clearly turned out not to be the case! It might be worthwhile to check your firmware version and update to the latest, although there are a number of different SD2IEC implementations so it may just come down to the hardware inside.
This model used to be available on eBay, but I don't see any for sale right now. Someone is selling them on Amazon but the price is much higher than it was on eBay last year.
Thank! The A3000 is the only vintage machine I managed to hang on to for all these years. I plan to make a video about restoring it over this coming holiday weekend! The IIgs was a recent acquisition that I tossed an opening bid in on eBay and somehow won unopposed :)
@@retrobitstv Well, if you end up needing some parts for your IIgs, let me know. I have a parts machine, and some dead disk drives (although I think all that's wrong with the 5.25 drive is a transistor on the analog board, but I haven't gotten 'round to trying to fix it yet; however the mobo, case, and 3.5 drive are a lost cause, and ripe for parts picking). A monitor as well, which works fine, it's just that the plastic got super busted up in shipping.
@@Lee_Adamson_OCF Thanks for the offer :) I watched your IIgs battery leak videos and man that was probably the worst damage I've seen before! I recently had a nice monitor completely busted up in shipping including a whole bunch of breaks on the main board so I know what that's like :(
It has been my experience that JiffyDOS is highly compatible with almost all software I've used. In fact, I can't think of any exceptions off the top of my head. If software uses its own speedloading routines (such as GEOS) JD won't cause any conflict. It can also be disabled in software with an @ command or a poke, or disabled in hardware with a physical switch or switchless ROM that requires a key press at boot up.
I do recommend JiffyDOS with the use of any C64 emulator that supports it (retroarch's VICE does). Don't forget to setup both the Kernal *and* 1451 ROMs!
The need to type in a command to read the disk was impossible to justify; both the Apple ][ and the Atari 8-Bit family of computers had disk drives that would run on startup.
Awesome. Concise, informative and above all not bloated. The person doing the video is well versed in the subject.
I always used software fastloaders so the 1541 seemed fine to me even though I didn't own a fastload cart.
Great video. I'm wasn't a kid on real C64 era but I played with my dad's old C64 a lot in early 2000. I had a lot of old copied game disks on loan from my cousin, and also had one of those action replay carts. I remember how amazed I was of speed increase with that cart, it made 1541 drive load very quickly. I remember it was possible to freeze the game and save it to disk using some kind of action replay's own file format. That file was only possible to load with action replay, and it was blazing fast, a lot faster than loading regular prg file which was already satisfactory fast. I don't have experience with jiffydos, but I doubt it could be faster than that. Today C64 is still working and I use pi1541 as disk drive emulator, and have epyx fastload replica cart. I think old action replay was faster that epyx fastload I have now.
Well done Matt! I really like your style and content. Keep going :)
Glad you liked it and thanks for your support!
JiffyDos is also available for the Plus/4; I just installed it and it's great to now have all my machines using it!
These benchmarks amaze me no matter how many times I see them, and to think how much slower they were back in the day not because of the limitations of technology but because C= messed up.
He's the retro bird, yeah! And he's talking, talking about video games!
Love these Videos!
I was never aware the C64 was handicapped... explains why I could go grab a snack as a kid while I waited for a game to load off our 1541. Sometimes even restoring retro tech necessitates mixing in some newer tech.
Couldn't agree more all this plus the mentioned DOS wedge and no used prots make it a clear winner for me. Other carts that offer the same are useful but for other things
2:33 was that just a piggy back solder job? GReat video!
Thanks! That image is not of my drive so I can't say for sure, but it sure looks like "dualrom" is just a piggybacked/switchable setup alright.
This channel deserves more views! ☺
BTW Why does one need to replace two chips in the C64 (and a 3rd one in the disk drive)? See 2:28 into your video. I always thought that the C64 kernal came on one singe ROM chip...?
Haha, thanks! I will keep making content and hopefully it will grow in time :) Great question. The reason there are two ROM chips in the video is because I reused footage from my C128 episode there. The 128 board pictured has separate ROMs for the 64 and 128 kernals.
@@retrobitstv Thanks for the explanation: makes perfect sense! As you can see I've never gutted a real C64. ;-)
I had Jiffy DOS installed on a 64c, 1541,1541-II, and a 1581 with a Super Snapshot Cart all connected to a blazing fast 1200 baud modem running a BBS in late 80,s/early 90's...I could boot up the BBS from power off to ready to take calls in 3 seconds flat! Sure miss those days of a super fast computer...Winblows by Microshaft is worse than a stock 1541 at times...I do remember some program loaders would read "Patients is a 1541 drive"...
Love it!
Thanks, nice video! Good channel. I subscribed now. Keep up the good work!
Thanks, will do!
I am using a JD on my C64. JD is a great solution!:)
Cool! Is there a good resource for referencing all of the JiffyDOS commands and how to use them?
The official user manual has good examples of each command and how they can also be used inside a basic program. They're available at the bottom of this page:
www.go4retro.com/products/jiffydos/
A brief command reference can be found here as well:
www.c64-wiki.com/wiki/JiffyDOS
I never knew about JiffyDOS back in the days. I had my C64 and my 1541 modded with SpeedDOS which uses a parallel cable in addition to the serial IEC one.
It is a bit slow for a parallel speeder, about the same speed as Jiffy DOS manages over the serial connection, but since it came with a parallel cable, it had some other benefits like '15 sec Copy' which literally copied a disk in 15 seconds... not counting the time you needed for the disk swapping. And of course programs like Burst Nibbler which could copy quite a few copy protected disks back in the days.
Back then I dreamed of getting a 'real' parallel speeder like 'Dolphin DOS' or 'Prologic DOS' which could probably beat the time you got loading from the SD2IEC with a real 1541. But they were much more expensive than SpeedDOS and I was a poor kid saving his money to get an Amiga.
SpeedDOS was also quite compatible, but I had a switch in my C64 to switch back to the original kernal in case the disk would not work with SpeedDOS. Sadly I had no such swich in the disk drive which wasn't a problem back in the day, but is quite a pain nowadays, because the very popular speedloader from 'Nostalgia' seems to be incompatible with the SpeedDOS ROM in the 1541.
I tried 2 different 1541 with SpeedDOS and neither of them seems to work, not even with the original kernal in the C64.
Still have my original setup from back in the days and SpeedDOS was not an uncommon mod over here.
I tried JiffyDOS in VICE and what drives me nuts is that the F-Keys are totally different from SpeedDOS.
IIRC, with JiffyDOS you press F1 to load the directory and F3 to load a file, with SpeedDOS it's F7 for the directory and F5 to load.
Doesn't sound like a big deal, but if you used SpeedDOS for over 30 years, it is hard to learn the new F-Keys ;-)
But since I got a Pi1541 now, I think I have to mod one of my C64 with JiffyDOS and force myself to learn the different F-Keys since there is no way to use SpeedDOS with the Pi1541. And NOT having a fastloader is an even worse option than having one where the F-keys drive you nuts ;-)
As a compromise, take a look at JaffyDOS. It's lets you customize JiffyDOS and re-assign the F-keys to be whatever you want!
I've never actually owned JiffyDOS. All my C64 disk speed increases came from cartridges I owned. Primarily the Final Cartridge 3, which I actually got because it was one of the few carts with a tape turbo (and I used tapes on my C64 for a very long time).
Anyway, it might be interesting to see the speed differences between the various options. Are you planning on doing a benchmark for some of the standard cards (Final Cartridge 3, Action Replay, Epyx, etc) vs JiffyDOS?
I never even knew about JiffyDOS back when I was a kid! I really missed out :P
My plan is to continue to benchmark hardware as I go, and maybe I'll do a fastloader shootout at some point. I believe Adrian's Digital Basement recently compared a whole bunch of fastloader carts as well.
@@retrobitstv I'll be sure to check that out, I have a strange fascination with C64 utility cartridges :)
I like the look of your sd2iec, where did you get it?
I purchased mine a while back on eBay. It appears that someone is selling this model on Amazon but the price is much higher than I remember.
Found it here also! I have no experience with this vendor though. www.ncsystems.eu/en/10-commodore
I remember my father sold the c128 in our shop and the 1541-2 drive costed as much as the computer :(
Hi. Where did you buy this wonderful desk ? It carries a lot of computers, it's a great solution for space saving!
The desk itself was a a cheap flat-pack deal from Amazon. I added the two top tiers using heavy duty shelving. The nice thing about it is that it's on casters so it's easy to roll out to work on cables in the back. Unfortunately it looks like they no longer sell it :(
7:06 71 seconds to 12 seconds is not 10x faster... it's about 6x faster, which is consistent with my own experience.
Your SD2IEC seems to be faster than mine, which is strange. I got about 6KBps with mine. But you also have a newer model with an LCD. I wonder if that has something to do with it.
This is what happens when you write the script and record the voiceover before filming :/ I had assumed the 1541 would transfer around 300bytes/sec but that clearly turned out not to be the case! It might be worthwhile to check your firmware version and update to the latest, although there are a number of different SD2IEC implementations so it may just come down to the hardware inside.
Where did you get that SD2IEC device with the LCD display built in?
This model used to be available on eBay, but I don't see any for sale right now. Someone is selling them on Amazon but the price is much higher than it was on eBay last year.
Found it here also! I have no experience with this vendor though. www.ncsystems.eu/en/10-commodore
Nice 3000 there. I want one so bad. :3 I see some IIgs stuff there too, eh?
Thank! The A3000 is the only vintage machine I managed to hang on to for all these years. I plan to make a video about restoring it over this coming holiday weekend! The IIgs was a recent acquisition that I tossed an opening bid in on eBay and somehow won unopposed :)
@@retrobitstv Well, if you end up needing some parts for your IIgs, let me know. I have a parts machine, and some dead disk drives (although I think all that's wrong with the 5.25 drive is a transistor on the analog board, but I haven't gotten 'round to trying to fix it yet; however the mobo, case, and 3.5 drive are a lost cause, and ripe for parts picking). A monitor as well, which works fine, it's just that the plastic got super busted up in shipping.
@@Lee_Adamson_OCF Thanks for the offer :) I watched your IIgs battery leak videos and man that was probably the worst damage I've seen before! I recently had a nice monitor completely busted up in shipping including a whole bunch of breaks on the main board so I know what that's like :(
Who made your SD2IEC?
Mine's a slightly older model of the one sold here: www.ncsystems.eu/en/
With jiffydos installed your c64 stays fully compatible? everything continues to work, but just loads faster?
It has been my experience that JiffyDOS is highly compatible with almost all software I've used. In fact, I can't think of any exceptions off the top of my head. If software uses its own speedloading routines (such as GEOS) JD won't cause any conflict. It can also be disabled in software with an @ command or a poke, or disabled in hardware with a physical switch or switchless ROM that requires a key press at boot up.
do u reccomend jiffydos using vice on retroarch
I do recommend JiffyDOS with the use of any C64 emulator that supports it (retroarch's VICE does). Don't forget to setup both the Kernal *and* 1451 ROMs!
@@retrobitstv can u send me a zip of it and how to setup
@@retrobitstv can u send me them in a zip folder and how to use
The need to type in a command to read the disk was impossible to justify; both the Apple ][ and the Atari 8-Bit family of computers had disk drives that would run on startup.
Couldn't you have zoomed in on the display instead of making us hold our phone close to our face to read the commands?
Instructions unclear, put peanut butter in floppy drive. Pls send new bread board.
background music on videos with narration.. the TRUE hallmark of an amateur ..