@@leonchang7596 I think they're fresh as fuck dude ❤️🤙🏽 Very New York 🥂 One of my biggest inspirations skateboarding was it Ricky oyola... I know he's Philly but still... East cost. Love the raw style and expression. Keep on killing it 🤘🏽 Subscribed... Maybe hook my channel up yo 😅 I'll be rocking trails this summer.. GT rider
I have one board that I VESC'd a few months back. Out of principle, I don't buy anything from FM because they don't care about their consumers, and have proven time and time again that they own the product, not you. The community's end goal with VESC is to establish an independent source of boards for everyone to ride. While this is still a dream in the making, I believe we have already reached the point where VESCs are far superior to any FM board. FM really does not try very hard to make their boards nice. Have you wondered how is it that an XR with the stock motor, stock battery, and just a VESC slid in as the controller, can have more torque than a GT? and no motor crunch anymore? How can that be? the GT's battery certainly can provide more power to the larger motor, so what's the big idea? On an FM board, if you lean just a bit too hard, or expect a bump to be just a bit smaller, you may be saying happy birthday to the ground. On a VESC, the amount of torque you have at all speeds is almost unbelievable, I feel WAAYYY safer on my VESC compared to any FM board. At this point, I couldn't daily drive an FM board, they just feel so sluggish and weak. Some people stand on my VESC and say they don't like how it feels. NO PROBLEM, you could tune your VESC to feel exactly like mission or highline, somewhere in between, whatever you want. My VESC never randomly stops working for any reason. There are a lot of smart people who have put in a lot of work to make the VESC's behavior extremely predictable. This did not use to be the case, but in recent months they have done a fantastic job improving the user experience. If you are encountering issues with your VESC, you should ask for help on the discord or take a look at your wiring job. --- The only point you made that I concede to is headlights. While there are efforts to make simple, CAN integrated headlights (myself included), this is one thing that has not been flushed out for VESCs. Auto shut off: Some VESCs do have auto shutoff, iirc surfdado said it was one of the Trampa boards, probably in the near future more VESCs will get this feature. But leaving your board on overnight would really not be bad at all. The app: The VESC Tool app is really pretty good, it's super comprehensive and has a wonderful RT Data page. The Float Control app adds a lot of QoL features and safety features as well. Other apps are in development too. Charging to 90%: I can easily do this on my board. You say this is not possible with a charge-only BMS, but that's the opposite of the truth, a charge-only BMS is in the perfect position to control the... charge of your board. I can just program my BMS to stop at 90%, 80% 84.56%, whatever I want. Preset shaping: There are lots of community-made tune cards available online. While tuning a VESC can seem daunting at first, every firmware update it just gets easier and easier, and once you start playing with it, you can learn a lot about how your board works and really dial it in to exactly how you want it to feel. Does the GT have custom shaping yet? --- I implore people to VESC their boards, it will only get easier as time goes on. And the reward is absolutely worth it.
oh i did not know charging to 90% is possible! Thanks for the correction. Vesctool and float control is great too. Tune cards I think have not been a thing ever since float pkg, and loading xml files is not something I’d like to do on the road vs swiping between shaping in the OW app. Performance wise I’ve been blown away by my vesc even with a stock pack, and at this point I feel more at home riding my vesc than my GT. The point of this video is not to say one is better than the other, but that both have merits. I cannot imagine what this community would be like if FM ceases to exist. RFTR will no longer happen, no one will sponsor advertisements and promotional material to get new people into the sport, new riders cannot simply buy something and be happy about it, to some people even upgrading a tire/battery is too much commitment. As much as I adore my vesc and ride it every chance I have, let’s not be so quick to dismiss that many people are still super happy on the GT. Every rider that gets hooked on a GT and experience how freeing it is to bomb down a trail at speed is potentially a new vesc builder. Another point I’m trying to make is that yes it’s possible to go thru the trouble to configure a vesc to have these quality of life features, but a GT has it out of the box and it works great. I love tinkering to get my board dialed dialed dialed but not everyone, even top riders, are like that.
Good reply. Guys like this just don’t understand that if FM goes under they are toast 😂 they are like children rioting and saying they don’t need their parents lol.
@@dezh2544 how are they toast? The only thing useful on a stock FM board is the motor and footpad. And there are a gazillion FM pints to cannibalize for that on the market. It's only a matter of time until we get a third party motor comparable to the hypercore, and footpad sensors will be plentiful again once FM goes under because the C&Ds will stop. Third party vendors have already shown that they can do rails, batteries, control and BMS modules, footpads, tires, printed sensorpads, and misc. Better than FM can. Not really sure why you still "need them".
@@zanderwitaz Correction. You do need them, right now. You admit to it. Still waiting on other companies to pick up the pace. And once they other companies do, let’s hope they permit all this. Listen, you have a cool hobby and what not but your little Vesc board wouldn’t survive as an actual product. Stay in the garage…
This video hammers home a ton of points I've been trying to make. Can't stand when I see a potentially new rider prospect asking questions/recommendations about Onewheel to the community, and then seeing some VESC techie just dismissedly tell them "FM boards are trash, just get VESC instead, they're better in every way" There are so many reasons NOT to go that route (definitely NOT saying nobody should) and to just get the simple, ready to use out of box, fun stoke machine experience we all love & enjoy
Great video, rode my GT stock for a year and loved it, just finished upgrading pretty much every part of the board and it’s insanely sick now. Even die-hard XR riders are loving my GT now when they try it on group rides.
Ok, so after years of wanting a OW I finally gave in and bought a new GT less than two weeks ago and it’s been an absolute blast since I got it. If I ever got a second board (I wasn’t planning on it at all tbh, at least not anytime soon) I’d certainly get a VESC but would you recommend SELLING my GT now or sometime soon so I can get the most amount of money back and then buying a VESC? Yall certainly know more than me when it comes to the sport and the products so I’d like to know what yall think. ------ I definitely fall into the casual rider category for now and I don’t think I’ll ever be doing crazy tricks so that’s something to take into consideration as well. As of know I just like to ride and cruise around. I live in central texas so the terrain is a decent mix of paved and unpaved country roads and street side walk riding when I’m in College station. Some off roading too. Can be super sandy out where I live
Congrats and welcome to the fam! If you dig around in the comment section you're gonna find people who have had a suuuper good experience with vesc. My journey is rough, which is why I give a lot of warnings. First of all I think it's worth it to hold onto the GT. I don't recommend building a vesc as your only board, at least not initially. If your vesc is known to be working for months without issues, then think about selling the GT. I recommend at least spending 2000+ miles on your GT before thinking about vesc. Also you don't "buy" a vesc. You build it. If you go into it with the mindset that as long as you spend money, you get a good board, you're gonna have a not-so-fun time with this project. Vescing is certainly not any cheaper than buying a onewheel, but you need to put in a lot more than money. This decision really comes down to if you are willing to tinker, and how much you care about onewheeling. I just spent the better part of last month working every day fixing my broken vesc, and was able to get it ridable for 1 hour, before it fried itself due to a single bad solder joint. If you're not a handy person and am not willing to put up with some really frustrating days just to get a working board, and you're not willing to put your body at risk to go 20mph on some experimental hardware, then it's gonna be more headache than it's worth. If you are like me and would do anything to build your dream board, or you're really familiar with messing with electronics and trust your own craftsmanship, willing to sacrifice some blood to the vesc god, then it's gonna be a super rewarding process, and you're gonna walk away with a board that's exactly how you like it. Also, vesc is great for tricks and trails and sending down crazy stuff, but don't feel like you owe it to the board to do that. I love cruising on my vesc, nothing wrong with that!
I think it totally depends on what style of riding you have. For freestyle the out of the box XR is great! Even the Vega is a killer on the freestyle tricks. For cruising the streets a GT is definitely a better buy out of the box but no comparison to an XR platform when upgraded. In trails I would definitely choose an upgraded XR platform. Yet to discover the VESC capabilities but since this comes in an XR platform I would probably stick to VESC. Especially when looking at the price point of a GTS to get somewhat close to VESC performance.
The rails on an XR act as a heat sink. The GT is powder coated so it cannot cool that way. If you have to remove the battery for travelling, you are out of luck, has to go to manufacturer. The ADV is a better price, better made and less expensive.
Factual error in this video collected from the comment section: - 90% charging is possible with a charge only bms/vesc, you can even customize the threashold to be whatever you want - You can swipe between shaping modes if you use the iOS float control app - one of the trampa boards have auto shut off
This is a GREAT video! Had my GT for just over 120miles now with treaded tire and a fender. needed in the UK as it rains a lot. Got around 20mph and BOY its scary and don't NEED any more. You are so right that if you just want to get a board and ride, the GT is the best. Love it. Love the flow, the float and the switch of brain part of the ride. Thank you for making this.
This video is a fucking joke. It claims to discuss advantages of the GT over a VESC board, Abs then COMPLETELY ignores the subject and discuss GT vs XR! And it's points about even that are almost all completing wrong.
Thanks! My personal fav board from the day i made this video to now have always been my vesc. The point of this vid is to show some merit of the GT and how that might appeal to some people. I still feel like GT is a great board for its target audience, it’s just not for me
I'm as excited about it as the rest of the community, but I'd hold off on any opinions until I get to extensively try one, which probably won't happen since I'm not getting one.
I'm going to be moving to Boston, MA, and want to combine my commuting through the transit line system and a one-wheel. But man these are some tough decisions. I am really unsure wether to buy a XR used and slowly invest into it, or grab a pintX.
I bought a PintX, and it was an amazing start. But same as I told everyone, you will outgrow it. I am about 170cm tall and it felt a little small for me. Eventually you will want more speed, and it will not feel safe. But it is compact and easy to carry
I never recommend anyone to get a vesc as a first or second board, but the only thing FM boards are good for is number one, works out of the box, and two a racing standard to see who is the better racer. But anyone who has ridden both an FM OW and a vesc will tell u that VESC is better in every way. Theres a learning curve to the app but it has everything the GT has and more. Its the ultimate mod, and as u said, the modified board is always going to be better. Wouldnt you like ur board to know if ur going up or downhill and lift or lower the nose for u? Wanna change the voltage on ur battery? Wanna put leds in ur footpads that run off ur internal battery? How about a 2000w motor instead of FM 750w? Theres build services, budget parts, online support, and all from riders. I cant think of too many reasons to own an FM board, except for budget issues and wanting to compete in ORL.
Great content, nail all those points home. enjoyed the vid. Did u talked about Enduro? I run the stock treaded right now I want to change the tire so much but is it really worth it? I have the Kush wide, I like your comment on them. I hope they really helps with going faster, it's more comfortable though not sure how much. Although I weighted the Kush Wide they're definitely lot heavier. Any effect on the ride/range for enduro/kushwide combo.
Thanks! I'd argue that rail upgrade is the most significant upgrade for GT. The lower kit changes everything about the ride feel. Tire being the second most important upgrade. Enduro is a bit wider than stock treaded and the shape difference isn't significant. However what makes enduro great is 1: the sidewalls compress when you turn so the contact patch for carving is super wide, and 2: the ability to run the enduro at both super high and super low PSI for both situations where you wanna squeeze range / get suspension for trails. 3: no speed wobbles when going fast. Kush wide should not affect range. That extra chicken nugget you eat before going out far outweighs the weight difference between kush and stock. If you want max range then stock GT slick is probably the way to go, otherwise run enduro >20psi and the range is also great. I am 200lbs and run my GT at 18psi for a good balance between street/trail. Enduro will fit with the OEM carbon fiber fender. Lower kit will not.
@@leonchang7596 Thank you for a detailed write up on this Leon I appreciate it. Are you looking to upgrade to WTF rail from float life? I will not get the lower kit because I need fender. I see that the latest update of TFL, they are coming out with slick tire. Might wait for that if I cannot get Enduro. I am outside the state so availability/shipping is scarce.
@@leonchang7596 Well, let's see, how about a video that actually gave 10 reasons why a GT is better than a VESC (as opposed to comparing a GT to an out of the box or modded XR, which is what over 90% of this video discusses)? Not sure that's even possible, seeing as how the VESC builds very quickly expose the issues with the GT in specific and FM in general, but at least it would match the video title.
@@leonchang7596 Is not about VESC vs.…. It's about the fact that this video barely touched on the VESC builds at all. Other than a brief mention at the beginning, the majority of the video was about the GT vs. various XR mods and configurations.
Vesc can be anything so if you really wanna argue about this then it can have no drawbacks. I think it’s more useful to assume most builds will be on the XR system so most of the XR traits are also a VESC trait. Also, waterproofing vesc systems (which is more of an issue when I made the video vs now with so many box options) and LEDs, no auto shut off and many other non-performance features which I touched on in this video, are definitely vesc specific. Of course with all of these drawbacks you can point to a vesc hardware that addresses this, but that’s not in most people’s vescs yet
I don't run surestart, just posi it. You basically get no mount of shame when it's posi-ed because MoS usually happens when your heel isn't activating the heel side sensor. There are some features that I really like about the surestart, like the drop detection, but I don't do enough drop to justify that. I also just adore the simplicity of a posi-ed footpad. If your foot is on the footpad, it activates. No need to think about how many seconds after activation it turns into two zone, etc. Besides, beginners use simplestop and advanced riders quickstop, neither case requires a two zone sensor, for the few rare cases you have to heel lift (like riding indoors or in populated areas), you can just pivot your foot completely off the footpad and heel lift. IMO most people don't need a two zone sensor. Even on my vesc, which I can turn on surestart with a press of a button, I still keep it on posi.
CBGT is currently being beta tested by top GT mileage riders. Rewheel can bypass the battery/BMS lock by flashing the firmware after a battery swap (from what I understand).
There are 2 ways to do it Method #1 is temporary, you break apart a cable and take out a single strand of wire, cut to about 1cm, and stick it between these two ports: i.imgur.io/aHKw3LF_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium This is what I did. Method #2 is more permanent. On the footpad, you take a heat gun and remove the glue holding the cable down, then solder a wire between the two wires, then glue it back on.
@@leonchang7596 hi Leon, new rider of OW gt having front pad engagement issues, is this wire posi solution reliable? The surestart kit allows perma posi as well with 16+ taps on sensor, but it is not cheap with $100+ base model. Would love to hear your comment, appreciated your thoughts for newbies.
@@harryj1081 hi harry, posi-ing is pretty reliable, especially if you take apart the hot glue on the under side of the footpad and solder a wire. Everything is sealed and i don’t see how it can fail. In fact it’s probably the safest way to fix a bad GT sensor. Taking off the plastic layer makes it exactly the same as a pre recall GT ffootpad that can easily ghost; adding furniture pads also involves sticking things to the sensor which might cause uneven forces. I think surestart is great if you do drops, deactivation delays and g force detections are really great features, but spending that much money + voiding your warranty is overkill if all you want is to fix a bad sensor.
@@leonchang7596 hi Leon thanks for the insights. I am currently using a couple of copper wires and inserted into the footpad plug holes. I thought you did this too in one of the comments, are those reliable? So far so good for me, been 100 miles only tho!
Yep that’s what I’ve been doing. It’s not the most reliable thing but running it for a couple of months should be good. every few months or so the wire might fall out and you lose posi until you re-insert another wire (had that happen once), as long as you make sure the footpad barrel plug collar is locked in properly, nothing catastrophic should happen. In the long term im definitely gonna solder my footpad and bridge the cables the permanent way.
@@leonchang7596 I tried the gt on some of my local trails and it's too bouncy had my legs working overtime trying to stay on the trail then switched to my xr and was significantly faster than the other gt on the trail. I really think it's personal preference cause speed isn't what makes these boards amazing. I've gone down on pavement at 27mph and even with a helmet I still had a concussion for 2 weeks, and you know about concussions you would know how unsafe getting multiples can be.
Pint OVERALL if you are REAL. Reality Check if you can ride it doesn't matter what model unless you are actually pushing these wheels on trails not just a commute to the brunch spot downtown. The GT SUCKS for tricks. Thanks for coming to my TED TALK. NICE enduro after market tire on that GT
1/2in lower represents 10% loss in clearance but equals to infinitely more stability. If you only ride street, clearance will never be an issue. On trails for steep climbs and descends the clearance loss is definitely noticeable. I don't care about my GT losing clearance because I have my wtf vesc if I wanna do anything too crazy, but if the GT is my only board I'd want something like landsurf's VRH which allows me to switch between lowered for street and regular for trails. What people don't realize about lower kits is that it actually makes nudges easier, since the intersect angle between the front bumper and the tire is a lot more blunt, the tire likes to roll over curbs instead of stopping dead. Lower kit also makes clearing rock gardens or other uneven terrain easier on trails since the added stability makes the board as stable as a pendulum. Also the added stability gained from lowering the rails means you can run higher PSI for the same ride feel.
SO there is a way you can say fuck you to future motion with no repair bullshit and overpriced accesories is by getting a VESC, they brought that on themself with user abusif policies. Go Pirate!
I completely agree that VESC should never be recommended to a beginner, and that the XR is great and the best bang for your buck. However, everything else in this video is just cherry-picking or highly anecdotal. The title is straight up farse as well. As others have mentioned, the OP is relying heavily on the prospective viewer to be new or new-ish to onewheeling, which just isn't the case. 1. The first point he tries to make is really a GT vs XR thing, strictly "out of the box" which is a VERY specific argument. Its not even a VESC thing. (people VESC pints and even GTs, too.) If anything. A bone stock XR is a far better board to learn on than a stock GT, and since your target audience is new riders, it makes the point even more vaild. Furthermore, a stock GT also rides like shit. Everyone knows the stock slick is bad, the treaded even worse. A tire change isn't that hard to do, and tire options are exponentially better for the XR than the GT. Your own video has an Enduro with Rim savers....so clearly people find a way. (In fact, most used XRS have an Enduro or a burris treaded of some kind on them nowadays.) For the Battery, the stock XR pack in a VESC still KILLS a GT in everything except range. You already admitted the XR is a better value proposition so no need to go deeper there. Lastly: "Especially for beginners.....who wont have the time nor patience to take apart a onewheel and figure out which screw goes in where, they just want to unbox the onewheel and ride" Maybe on the first few days, but most people tinker with their boards. More importantly though, a beginner wont have the time or patience for modding an XR, but they will have the money to spend on a ~2700 onewheel? I dont really find that a convincing argument. Most beginners buy a pint.
2. "The stock GT is probably the safest board" if you are fortunate enough to get one without footpad issues, I could agree on this one. However, many people (well after the recall, btw) are still on their 3rd or 4th footpad with ghosting issues. Definitely not safe. The other boards never had these issues. As for a VESC safety comparison, it would depend on the builder's workmanship and what battery they used. A bit harder to compare, but on average I'd give this win to the GT.
3. "The GT is a finished product." Certainly. but so is the pint... and the surfwheel.... Ergo, are those "better" boards than a VESC? Obviously, there are trade-offs you are ignoring. Water resistance - Also disagree there. None of the onewheels are particularly water resistant. (Though from my understanding, the pint is the best so far) If you consistently ride a onewheel (or VESC) through the rain, it will fail prematurely. Catastrophic failure aside, Lots of people have experienced a water-related design flaw only specific to the GT. Apparently, it doesn't take much water exposure to get water into the two channels of the front sensor pad (The tiny openings at the corner) This is the gap between the sectioned off areas of the sensor pad designed to relieve bending strain on the sensor pad due to the concave shape. Problem is the grip tape goes right over it and is never sealed. If water wicks its way down there, it shorts the 3 sensor channels and the onewheel ghosts. Headlights- included directional headlights are a nice plus on factory onewheels, but with VESC, since you're doing a custom controller box your options are unlimited. Auto shut-off: definitely nice to have on a factory FM board, but anyone who has built a vesc is either monitoring their voltages or knows better frankly. Have never heard of anyone running their battery down to damaging levels, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
4: GT vs VESC as an only board. Again, like the "straight out of the box argument" I find this to be a cherry-picking argument. Most VESC builders have or have had multiple boards. Usually these are experienced riders that are very familiar with the onewheel and want to take it to the next level. Not saying that the one board example is impossible, and in that case you'd be right and I agree with you that VESCing your only board is a bad idea. My point is simply that this is likely in the vast minority of scenarios. As far as reliability, it depends on the builder. As far as reparability, clear clear win to the VESC. What GT owners always omit is all of the (deserved) scrutiny and hate for FM's "repair" and customer service practices. The GT has already proven itself to be less reliable than previous boards, even footpad issues aside. Everything for the VESC can be replaced on the open market. The GT is completely locked down and FM is hot garbage when it comes to parts/repair.
5. The App. Personally, I don't use it much but a lot of people might. I just use it for the trip distance to measure against my battery life on new boards/builds. But yes, that will be gone. Hard to say if it is missed, though. On the flip size, the VESC lets you customize literally everything (Another omitted tidbit in this video outside of pushback limits) and is constantly evolving. the FM app its "locked", and if anything, FM is known for rolling back features, not adding them. Furthermore, the tilt remote capablity for the VESC is absolutely game changing. I think every single rider would trade the OW app for tilt remote capability and unlimited and growing settings/customization if they could. As for the 90% battery charging, it is a nice feature but we did fine without it on all of the previous OWs. Additionally, charging past 90% is not nearly as bad for the battery as people make it out to be. In fact, lots of people end up with unbalanced cells because they don't understand the battery mechanics and don't do an overnight charge once in a while. The main thing that kill batteries are heat, charge cycles, and leaving the battery (or single unbalanced cells) very high or very low for extended periods of time. Charging your battery to 90 percent vs 100 percent makes zero difference if it is ridden shortly after.
6. Group rides will of course vary, but to say that they are overwhelmingly GT riders is (currently) false. You might see 50-70% GT riders at a group ride, but "basically everyone is riding GTs" is 100% false. The only time chargers have been an issue is that one guy (we've all seen it happen) that shows up with a stock pint even though the flier says not to. Then they burn their battery and need to borrow a charger, but almost no one brings a pint, or more specifically a pint hypercharger. As for the VESC builder, by that point nearly every vesc builder has a higher capacity battery or knows to bring their own charger. They aint noobs off the street. losing your backpack sucks and I'm sorry it happened, but that is another extreme case. The "swap" charger example is another extreme case, and is frankly a weak argument. Anyone who is dumb enough to grab a strangers charger without asking (A charger that will not look the same as a factory charger, mind you) and simply starts using it deserves to have their board damaged. Furthermore, if your previous point were true "basically everyone is riding a stock GT" then they wouldn't be able to use the charger, as the charger most likely will be proprietary to the vesc builders preference, or more likely an XR port.... so it wouldnt be able to be used on "basically everyone"s board. It was clear that you were reeeeeally reaching for an extreme hypothetical situation that wouldn't even be able to happen and unfortunately highlights some significant technical misunderstanding.
now I ride a VESC I can't go to GT, I feel like i'am riding a seek board lol, no torque, no power... I really don't liked it... and it is 3000 €.... :( It is true sometimes you need to fix your vesc, but- you can do it by yourself, if your GT get bad, you need to send it to USA, i am ion europe, I did it once for my old XR, it is really expenseive... and FM is a sharks's company, I never will give them more money than what I already did...
I absolutely LOVE my new GT!!!.... and I don't care what anybody says!!! However,.. Can anyone tell me which Smart Watch to buy so I can keep an eye on my speed? I'm trying to establish a crushing speed around 18mph but my App showed 23mph on my last ride... so I really want to get a Smart Watch that works with my GT.
A GT is NOT great out of the box because the tire is SHIT! I was regretting buying mine until I put an enduro tire on it. And the stock tire was so hard I had to cut it off with a grinder. WTF is FM thinking shipping that tire?
Future motion is amazing. They respond quickly and build a good product, unlike everyone else whose board falls apart. And you have to modify vesc just to keep it together.vesc falls apart so fast. Also, if you have a problem, you can mail a gt to fm and have it back within a week. It's the only board you can buy and have 0 problems out of the box. And be riding on your 1st day.vesc Super sucks to try and buy it, and it is nearly impossible to trust vesc on any level
That's true. If you want hardcore info on vesc I'm not the guy, I'm a newbie who got thrown into the deep end and had to google how to use a multimeter halfway thru the vesc conversion because I was watching more advanced builders and they made it sound wayyyy easier than it actually is. Also since you can make a vesc into anything you want, it's hard to draw comparisons so I had to generalize a bit (example: waterproofing), otherwise there will be asterisks all over the video. Please also point out specifically what I said that was incorrect! I'd love to know if I'm just missing something and can make my vesc experience better than it already is.
@@leonchang7596 i don't own a GT, keep that in mind (but have ridden a few) -My VESC is way safer then any FM onewheel -Vesc is way harder to push the nose down, to the point that people who like to fang drag has to change settings to do that (obviously it is very dependent on the settings you ride) but VESC has the ability to provide more torque then any FM board, even with the vesc running a 63v battery -GT is only almost water resistant, you need to watertighten around the plugs on the controller -you can simply put a heavy pushback (un-ridable pushback) on a Vesc to prevent to drain the batteries to a dangerous level....you can also chose not to -if you are capable, having a Vesc as the only board is just fine -sure, if you plug a higher voltage charger in to your board, bad shit happens.....to every board, GT has a propitiatory plug with a chip in it = not serviceable -you can make concave front footpad for Vesc....that actually detects pressure, but without ghosting -if you use iphone, and use float controll, you can make all the custom shaping s you want, even with sliders....but admittedly it is currently missing from the regular Vesc app
1. awesome! mine isn't 2. very true 3. some silicone around the barrel plugs and it's basically water tight. Can't say the same thing about vesc builds. I'd like to believe that enclosures such as torque box and elm box are super robust because it's built by people who care, but what they lack is the sheer amount of milage in the real world. Because GTs are made in mass numbers, we have basically encountered all the possible failure points. When you unbox a fresh GT, you know exactly how it will fail. You know where the rail will bend, which screw will strip, and where water leaks in. You know exactly how much margin you have when you hit pushback. Although a vesc can be made to be much safer or more dangerous than a GT, I think a safe option is always the one where you know what you're up against. 4. I can only speak from my experience but I've been having a super rough time with my vesc. I've run through 3 escs and 1 motor in 2023 alone. The board has been in repairs for longer than it's been in service. I am happy to read about everyone's fantastic experience with not having any issues with their vescs and it kinda makes me jealous. 5. Not having standardized plugs suck, and is horrible for RTR, but there is no mistaking a GT charger with any other charger. 6. Yes, but I'm saying I specifically like the harsh corners on the GT footpad for trails. Yes I'm aware I can 3d print my own. As someone who has had my GT ghost on me >5 times, I have not encountered a single ghost in the post recall footpad. 7. Admittedly I haven't messed with float control much until after I made this video, I didn't know we have shaping presets already! These things are just moving too fast
@@leonchang7596 Well number 3 is kind of like saying a roof isn't watertight, it all depends on the materials chosen and the craftsmanship you put into the construction My Vesc is build around the aluminium floatboxx and the torquepack, so it is more watertight then any FM board (out of the box) but non of the things comes free And in my case, i know way better what I'm up against in a Vesc, then a GT 🤷🏼♂️ 5. You can chose any standard you like, you can keep all of the XR plugs, they even come prepackaged in a bundle, personally i started out with that, but upgraded a few of them to something better 6. I don't know what footpad you run on your Vesc, but i can recommend the one fungineers make (called the stompies) it is hands down the best footpad i have ever used, but yes, it requires you either 3d print or make something out if plywood. A few of my fellow riders that have the upgraded GT footpad have problems engaging it, so now thy are "forced" to buy that surestart (little electronic module you put in the controller to trick it to worked properly) but great to hear some doesn't have that problem the shape is very much a personal preference, i haven't ridden the GT far enough that the corners annoyed me Don't get me wrong, i don't recommend people who haven't got any onewheel experience to dive in and build a VESC, but people with let's say 2K km behind them, who are looking to upgrade should definitely consider it, especially it they don't have 10 thumbs, and maybe already know how to solder It pretty much sums up to the old famous spiderman quote "with great power comes great responsibility" and if you are not up to that responsible, and tinkering, then chose something that is prebuild, with both the advantages and weaknesses it offers
Video should be titled "Why the GT is probably a better choice for people new to Onewheel". Not sure why you would compare a GT to VESC in this particular way. Anyone technically inclined enough is going to ditch the GT, every time.
Anyone technically inclined enough is going to ditch the GT, absolutely. But not everyone is and not everyone wants to be. I have a custom built PC, it's super powerful and cheaper than any equivalent prebuilt on the market. Prebuilts still exist. Same thing goes for fpv drones, you can build one but DJI also sells FPV drones now. I also built my own keyboard, specifically designed for the way I type. In whichever market, the custom built route will always be outperforming the mass market route, and in this case when I have the choice to take my vesc or my GT out, I always pick my vesc because I care about the performance and the tuning dialed to the way I ride, and performance is one reason i will be addressing in the next video. But not everyone are like us who are willing to tinker and take spills just to build the ultimate performance board. which is why it's titled this way. In these 10 ways, GT is better than vesc.
I am technically inclined. But I am not interested enough to fiddle with settings and give up quality of life features. Everyone who has worked on their own electronics parts are not 100% confident in failures they could have overlooked. I would trust factory tested boards more than boards I assembled together myself by hand without toolings that factories do have unless I’m looking at spending thousands in equipments alone.
@@skoolynugenator1802 no I said anybody technically inclined enough will ditch the GT. I did not say every GT rider is technically inclined. Who cares anyway
"Probably going to get extended battery for GT" Not if Future Motion can help it... They already blocked XR's from having extended batteries with a firmware update. Guessing they'll do the same with GTs if they haven't already. And *that's* why none of the other gibberish in this video matters, the reason for VESC is because Future Motion can't be trusted. I regret that I have but one downvote to give to this goofy video.
None of this explains the MC Hammer pants. 😳
those are aero pants!
😂
@@leonchang7596 I think they're fresh as fuck dude ❤️🤙🏽
Very New York 🥂
One of my biggest inspirations skateboarding was it Ricky oyola... I know he's Philly but still... East cost.
Love the raw style and expression.
Keep on killing it 🤘🏽
Subscribed... Maybe hook my channel up yo 😅
I'll be rocking trails this summer.. GT rider
I have one board that I VESC'd a few months back. Out of principle, I don't buy anything from FM because they don't care about their consumers, and have proven time and time again that they own the product, not you. The community's end goal with VESC is to establish an independent source of boards for everyone to ride. While this is still a dream in the making, I believe we have already reached the point where VESCs are far superior to any FM board.
FM really does not try very hard to make their boards nice. Have you wondered how is it that an XR with the stock motor, stock battery, and just a VESC slid in as the controller, can have more torque than a GT? and no motor crunch anymore? How can that be? the GT's battery certainly can provide more power to the larger motor, so what's the big idea?
On an FM board, if you lean just a bit too hard, or expect a bump to be just a bit smaller, you may be saying happy birthday to the ground. On a VESC, the amount of torque you have at all speeds is almost unbelievable, I feel WAAYYY safer on my VESC compared to any FM board. At this point, I couldn't daily drive an FM board, they just feel so sluggish and weak.
Some people stand on my VESC and say they don't like how it feels. NO PROBLEM, you could tune your VESC to feel exactly like mission or highline, somewhere in between, whatever you want.
My VESC never randomly stops working for any reason. There are a lot of smart people who have put in a lot of work to make the VESC's behavior extremely predictable. This did not use to be the case, but in recent months they have done a fantastic job improving the user experience. If you are encountering issues with your VESC, you should ask for help on the discord or take a look at your wiring job.
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The only point you made that I concede to is headlights. While there are efforts to make simple, CAN integrated headlights (myself included), this is one thing that has not been flushed out for VESCs.
Auto shut off: Some VESCs do have auto shutoff, iirc surfdado said it was one of the Trampa boards, probably in the near future more VESCs will get this feature. But leaving your board on overnight would really not be bad at all.
The app: The VESC Tool app is really pretty good, it's super comprehensive and has a wonderful RT Data page. The Float Control app adds a lot of QoL features and safety features as well. Other apps are in development too.
Charging to 90%: I can easily do this on my board. You say this is not possible with a charge-only BMS, but that's the opposite of the truth, a charge-only BMS is in the perfect position to control the... charge of your board. I can just program my BMS to stop at 90%, 80% 84.56%, whatever I want.
Preset shaping: There are lots of community-made tune cards available online. While tuning a VESC can seem daunting at first, every firmware update it just gets easier and easier, and once you start playing with it, you can learn a lot about how your board works and really dial it in to exactly how you want it to feel. Does the GT have custom shaping yet?
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I implore people to VESC their boards, it will only get easier as time goes on. And the reward is absolutely worth it.
oh i did not know charging to 90% is possible! Thanks for the correction. Vesctool and float control is great too. Tune cards I think have not been a thing ever since float pkg, and loading xml files is not something I’d like to do on the road vs swiping between shaping in the OW app.
Performance wise I’ve been blown away by my vesc even with a stock pack, and at this point I feel more at home riding my vesc than my GT. The point of this video is not to say one is better than the other, but that both have merits. I cannot imagine what this community would be like if FM ceases to exist. RFTR will no longer happen, no one will sponsor advertisements and promotional material to get new people into the sport, new riders cannot simply buy something and be happy about it, to some people even upgrading a tire/battery is too much commitment. As much as I adore my vesc and ride it every chance I have, let’s not be so quick to dismiss that many people are still super happy on the GT.
Every rider that gets hooked on a GT and experience how freeing it is to bomb down a trail at speed is potentially a new vesc builder.
Another point I’m trying to make is that yes it’s possible to go thru the trouble to configure a vesc to have these quality of life features, but a GT has it out of the box and it works great. I love tinkering to get my board dialed dialed dialed but not everyone, even top riders, are like that.
Good reply. Guys like this just don’t understand that if FM goes under they are toast 😂 they are like children rioting and saying they don’t need their parents lol.
Be careful you're going to have a bunch of people coming for you now
@@dezh2544 how are they toast?
The only thing useful on a stock FM board is the motor and footpad. And there are a gazillion FM pints to cannibalize for that on the market. It's only a matter of time until we get a third party motor comparable to the hypercore, and footpad sensors will be plentiful again once FM goes under because the C&Ds will stop.
Third party vendors have already shown that they can do rails, batteries, control and BMS modules, footpads, tires, printed sensorpads, and misc. Better than FM can. Not really sure why you still "need them".
@@zanderwitaz Correction. You do need them, right now. You admit to it. Still waiting on other companies to pick up the pace. And once they other companies do, let’s hope they permit all this. Listen, you have a cool hobby and what not but your little Vesc board wouldn’t survive as an actual product. Stay in the garage…
This video hammers home a ton of points I've been trying to make. Can't stand when I see a potentially new rider prospect asking questions/recommendations about Onewheel to the community, and then seeing some VESC techie just dismissedly tell them "FM boards are trash, just get VESC instead, they're better in every way"
There are so many reasons NOT to go that route (definitely NOT saying nobody should) and to just get the simple, ready to use out of box, fun stoke machine experience we all love & enjoy
exactly :)
Customer service is a good reason to go with vesc
Excited about the floatwheel
Oh i cannot wait
Damn that would be the dream. I can’t imagine how that could be a bad idea
Great video, rode my GT stock for a year and loved it, just finished upgrading pretty much every part of the board and it’s insanely sick now. Even die-hard XR riders are loving my GT now when they try it on group rides.
right?? a modded GT (especially after rail upgrades) is awesome!
Yeah and to fully upgrade a GT the total cost is only like $5000
@1:25, so you're just gonna damage someone's property and keep going? That's crazy.
Yea I know, like what?!
Ok, so after years of wanting a OW I finally gave in and bought a new GT less than two weeks ago and it’s been an absolute blast since I got it. If I ever got a second board (I wasn’t planning on it at all tbh, at least not anytime soon) I’d certainly get a VESC but would you recommend SELLING my GT now or sometime soon so I can get the most amount of money back and then buying a VESC?
Yall certainly know more than me when it comes to the sport and the products so I’d like to know what yall think.
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I definitely fall into the casual rider category for now and I don’t think I’ll ever be doing crazy tricks so that’s something to take into consideration as well. As of know I just like to ride and cruise around. I live in central texas so the terrain is a decent mix of paved and unpaved country roads and street side walk riding when I’m in College station. Some off roading too. Can be super sandy out where I live
Congrats and welcome to the fam!
If you dig around in the comment section you're gonna find people who have had a suuuper good experience with vesc. My journey is rough, which is why I give a lot of warnings.
First of all I think it's worth it to hold onto the GT. I don't recommend building a vesc as your only board, at least not initially. If your vesc is known to be working for months without issues, then think about selling the GT.
I recommend at least spending 2000+ miles on your GT before thinking about vesc. Also you don't "buy" a vesc. You build it. If you go into it with the mindset that as long as you spend money, you get a good board, you're gonna have a not-so-fun time with this project. Vescing is certainly not any cheaper than buying a onewheel, but you need to put in a lot more than money.
This decision really comes down to if you are willing to tinker, and how much you care about onewheeling. I just spent the better part of last month working every day fixing my broken vesc, and was able to get it ridable for 1 hour, before it fried itself due to a single bad solder joint. If you're not a handy person and am not willing to put up with some really frustrating days just to get a working board, and you're not willing to put your body at risk to go 20mph on some experimental hardware, then it's gonna be more headache than it's worth. If you are like me and would do anything to build your dream board, or you're really familiar with messing with electronics and trust your own craftsmanship, willing to sacrifice some blood to the vesc god, then it's gonna be a super rewarding process, and you're gonna walk away with a board that's exactly how you like it.
Also, vesc is great for tricks and trails and sending down crazy stuff, but don't feel like you owe it to the board to do that. I love cruising on my vesc, nothing wrong with that!
You ride so well pls consider making tutorials on that
aw thank you! will be making some in the future
I think it totally depends on what style of riding you have. For freestyle the out of the box XR is great! Even the Vega is a killer on the freestyle tricks. For cruising the streets a GT is definitely a better buy out of the box but no comparison to an XR platform when upgraded. In trails I would definitely choose an upgraded XR platform. Yet to discover the VESC capabilities but since this comes in an XR platform I would probably stick to VESC. Especially when looking at the price point of a GTS to get somewhat close to VESC performance.
The rails on an XR act as a heat sink. The GT is powder coated so it cannot cool that way. If you have to remove the battery for travelling, you are out of luck, has to go to manufacturer. The ADV is a better price, better made and less expensive.
Factual error in this video collected from the comment section:
- 90% charging is possible with a charge only bms/vesc, you can even customize the threashold to be whatever you want
- You can swipe between shaping modes if you use the iOS float control app
- one of the trampa boards have auto shut off
This is a GREAT video! Had my GT for just over 120miles now with treaded tire and a fender. needed in the UK as it rains a lot. Got around 20mph and BOY its scary and don't NEED any more. You are so right that if you just want to get a board and ride, the GT is the best. Love it. Love the flow, the float and the switch of brain part of the ride. Thank you for making this.
That’s what I’m talking about!!
You need more
🤣
This video is a fucking joke. It claims to discuss advantages of the GT over a VESC board, Abs then COMPLETELY ignores the subject and discuss GT vs XR!
And it's points about even that are almost all completing wrong.
do you still feel this way? great video.
Thanks! My personal fav board from the day i made this video to now have always been my vesc. The point of this vid is to show some merit of the GT and how that might appeal to some people. I still feel like GT is a great board for its target audience, it’s just not for me
As a guy who had to send my Gt in for water damage. I am calling water proof out of the box BS.
How about the new Floatwheel?
This is what I want to know. It looks good.
I'm as excited about it as the rest of the community, but I'd hold off on any opinions until I get to extensively try one, which probably won't happen since I'm not getting one.
I ride my XR in the custom shaping 99% of the time. Change them up depending on terrain and what feels best that day.
I'm going to be moving to Boston, MA, and want to combine my commuting through the transit line system and a one-wheel. But man these are some tough decisions. I am really unsure wether to buy a XR used and slowly invest into it, or grab a pintX.
I love the XR platform a lot more personally, but they’re all great options. Onewheels are fun no matter which board you’re riding!
I bought a PintX, and it was an amazing start. But same as I told everyone, you will outgrow it. I am about 170cm tall and it felt a little small for me. Eventually you will want more speed, and it will not feel safe. But it is compact and easy to carry
I never recommend anyone to get a vesc as a first or second board, but the only thing FM boards are good for is number one, works out of the box, and two a racing standard to see who is the better racer. But anyone who has ridden both an FM OW and a vesc will tell u that VESC is better in every way. Theres a learning curve to the app but it has everything the GT has and more. Its the ultimate mod, and as u said, the modified board is always going to be better.
Wouldnt you like ur board to know if ur going up or downhill and lift or lower the nose for u? Wanna change the voltage on ur battery? Wanna put leds in ur footpads that run off ur internal battery? How about a 2000w motor instead of FM 750w?
Theres build services, budget parts, online support, and all from riders. I cant think of too many reasons to own an FM board, except for budget issues and wanting to compete in ORL.
True. But I have a cbxr and don’t find as useful even tho I’ve dumped loads of money into it. I prefer my gt all the way 😅
Great content, nail all those points home. enjoyed the vid. Did u talked about Enduro? I run the stock treaded right now I want to change the tire so much but is it really worth it? I have the Kush wide, I like your comment on them. I hope they really helps with going faster, it's more comfortable though not sure how much. Although I weighted the Kush Wide they're definitely lot heavier. Any effect on the ride/range for enduro/kushwide combo.
I want to be able to use the enduro with original FM carbon fender it's a must for me. Will the fender it fit okay?
Thanks! I'd argue that rail upgrade is the most significant upgrade for GT. The lower kit changes everything about the ride feel. Tire being the second most important upgrade.
Enduro is a bit wider than stock treaded and the shape difference isn't significant. However what makes enduro great is 1: the sidewalls compress when you turn so the contact patch for carving is super wide, and 2: the ability to run the enduro at both super high and super low PSI for both situations where you wanna squeeze range / get suspension for trails. 3: no speed wobbles when going fast.
Kush wide should not affect range. That extra chicken nugget you eat before going out far outweighs the weight difference between kush and stock. If you want max range then stock GT slick is probably the way to go, otherwise run enduro >20psi and the range is also great. I am 200lbs and run my GT at 18psi for a good balance between street/trail.
Enduro will fit with the OEM carbon fiber fender. Lower kit will not.
Ours fit nice. No issues.
@@leonchang7596 Thank you for a detailed write up on this Leon I appreciate it. Are you looking to upgrade to WTF rail from float life? I will not get the lower kit because I need fender. I see that the latest update of TFL, they are coming out with slick tire. Might wait for that if I cannot get Enduro. I am outside the state so availability/shipping is scarce.
@@borillasnaps Nice one! Glad to hear they fits great if I decide to change to it.
I'm so sorry for that guy's car
That's parking ticket in NY
All depends on what type of rider you are. City, smooth trail go for GT. Tough trail, require mobile extended charging go with vesc.
Vesc is no doubt the performance king, gt is the most user friendly board that’ll get new people into the sport🤙
So, do we have to wait for the part 2 video for the actual GT vs VESC comparisons?
what topics do you wanna see discussed?
@@leonchang7596 Well, let's see, how about a video that actually gave 10 reasons why a GT is better than a VESC (as opposed to comparing a GT to an out of the box or modded XR, which is what over 90% of this video discusses)? Not sure that's even possible, seeing as how the VESC builds very quickly expose the issues with the GT in specific and FM in general, but at least it would match the video title.
If you’re team vesc then you might like every other video I’ve made
@@leonchang7596 Is not about VESC vs.…. It's about the fact that this video barely touched on the VESC builds at all. Other than a brief mention at the beginning, the majority of the video was about the GT vs. various XR mods and configurations.
Vesc can be anything so if you really wanna argue about this then it can have no drawbacks. I think it’s more useful to assume most builds will be on the XR system so most of the XR traits are also a VESC trait. Also, waterproofing vesc systems (which is more of an issue when I made the video vs now with so many box options) and LEDs, no auto shut off and many other non-performance features which I touched on in this video, are definitely vesc specific. Of course with all of these drawbacks you can point to a vesc hardware that addresses this, but that’s not in most people’s vescs yet
Cool riding and cool board. How have you modded it (rails, bumpers etc)? - love the colour combo.
Thanks! My specs are in the description
What are you using to record video? Does every Onewheel rider have the selfie stick for videos? Ty!
An old gopro and a long stick. The trick is to sandwich your color grade with two aces transforms in resolve to get the colors looking right ;)
Do you have the sure start at all? Saw you hope on with ease a couple times and I feel like my GT is harder to activate then my pint was
I don't run surestart, just posi it. You basically get no mount of shame when it's posi-ed because MoS usually happens when your heel isn't activating the heel side sensor. There are some features that I really like about the surestart, like the drop detection, but I don't do enough drop to justify that. I also just adore the simplicity of a posi-ed footpad. If your foot is on the footpad, it activates. No need to think about how many seconds after activation it turns into two zone, etc. Besides, beginners use simplestop and advanced riders quickstop, neither case requires a two zone sensor, for the few rare cases you have to heel lift (like riding indoors or in populated areas), you can just pivot your foot completely off the footpad and heel lift. IMO most people don't need a two zone sensor. Even on my vesc, which I can turn on surestart with a press of a button, I still keep it on posi.
I don't think we will ever get a CBGT cuz if you unplug the battery it bricks the board
CBGT is currently being beta tested by top GT mileage riders. Rewheel can bypass the battery/BMS lock by flashing the firmware after a battery swap (from what I understand).
What tutorial did you follow for the Posi-ed footpad
There are 2 ways to do it
Method #1 is temporary, you break apart a cable and take out a single strand of wire, cut to about 1cm, and stick it between these two ports:
i.imgur.io/aHKw3LF_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium
This is what I did.
Method #2 is more permanent. On the footpad, you take a heat gun and remove the glue holding the cable down, then solder a wire between the two wires, then glue it back on.
@@leonchang7596 hi Leon, new rider of OW gt having front pad engagement issues, is this wire posi solution reliable? The surestart kit allows perma posi as well with 16+ taps on sensor, but it is not cheap with $100+ base model. Would love to hear your comment, appreciated your thoughts for newbies.
@@harryj1081 hi harry, posi-ing is pretty reliable, especially if you take apart the hot glue on the under side of the footpad and solder a wire. Everything is sealed and i don’t see how it can fail. In fact it’s probably the safest way to fix a bad GT sensor. Taking off the plastic layer makes it exactly the same as a pre recall GT ffootpad that can easily ghost; adding furniture pads also involves sticking things to the sensor which might cause uneven forces. I think surestart is great if you do drops, deactivation delays and g force detections are really great features, but spending that much money + voiding your warranty is overkill if all you want is to fix a bad sensor.
@@leonchang7596 hi Leon thanks for the insights. I am currently using a couple of copper wires and inserted into the footpad plug holes. I thought you did this too in one of the comments, are those reliable? So far so good for me, been 100 miles only tho!
Yep that’s what I’ve been doing. It’s not the most reliable thing but running it for a couple of months should be good. every few months or so the wire might fall out and you lose posi until you re-insert another wire (had that happen once), as long as you make sure the footpad barrel plug collar is locked in properly, nothing catastrophic should happen. In the long term im definitely gonna solder my footpad and bridge the cables the permanent way.
I do badly wish I could ride like this person!!!!
I Can Not hop a curb. Driving me crazy!!!
point your nose and send it!
Yes bro I have a cbxr and use my stock gt way often 😅
Hows the shaping on the gt compared to the xr?
I think it’s personal preference, mission feels like flying an X wing, highline feels like driving an SUV
@@leonchang7596 I must've worded that wrong what I ment was hows the custom shaping on the gt?
@@leonchang7596 I tried the gt on some of my local trails and it's too bouncy had my legs working overtime trying to stay on the trail then switched to my xr and was significantly faster than the other gt on the trail. I really think it's personal preference cause speed isn't what makes these boards amazing. I've gone down on pavement at 27mph and even with a helmet I still had a concussion for 2 weeks, and you know about concussions you would know how unsafe getting multiples can be.
How has this aged? Lol vesc is the GT killer
Pint OVERALL if you are REAL. Reality Check if you can ride it doesn't matter what model unless you are actually pushing these wheels on trails not just a commute to the brunch spot downtown. The GT SUCKS for tricks. Thanks for coming to my TED TALK. NICE enduro after market tire on that GT
Tricking on vesc is amazing, the sensor lands it every. Single. Time. But yes I really enjoy cruising downtown to get brunch. It’s relaxing for me
it is not :) coming from 6k on the GT and after getting a vesc I just never look back
I love it man.. you know what's up 🎷✌🏽
Is this a lowered GT?
Yep, just read the description
yeah 1/2in lowered and I love it for street riding!
@@leonchang7596 Does it fair well doing trail and going uphill? Any problem of losing the clearnace?
@@breezeey9113 land and surf has an adjustable one. You can go back and forth between lowered and raised.
1/2in lower represents 10% loss in clearance but equals to infinitely more stability. If you only ride street, clearance will never be an issue. On trails for steep climbs and descends the clearance loss is definitely noticeable. I don't care about my GT losing clearance because I have my wtf vesc if I wanna do anything too crazy, but if the GT is my only board I'd want something like landsurf's VRH which allows me to switch between lowered for street and regular for trails.
What people don't realize about lower kits is that it actually makes nudges easier, since the intersect angle between the front bumper and the tire is a lot more blunt, the tire likes to roll over curbs instead of stopping dead. Lower kit also makes clearing rock gardens or other uneven terrain easier on trails since the added stability makes the board as stable as a pendulum. Also the added stability gained from lowering the rails means you can run higher PSI for the same ride feel.
SO there is a way you can say fuck you to future motion with no repair bullshit and overpriced accesories is by getting a VESC, they brought that on themself with user abusif policies. Go Pirate!
I completely agree that VESC should never be recommended to a beginner, and that the XR is great and the best bang for your buck.
However, everything else in this video is just cherry-picking or highly anecdotal. The title is straight up farse as well. As others have mentioned, the OP is relying heavily on the prospective viewer to be new or new-ish to onewheeling, which just isn't the case.
1. The first point he tries to make is really a GT vs XR thing, strictly "out of the box" which is a VERY specific argument. Its not even a VESC thing. (people VESC pints and even GTs, too.) If anything. A bone stock XR is a far better board to learn on than a stock GT, and since your target audience is new riders, it makes the point even more vaild. Furthermore, a stock GT also rides like shit. Everyone knows the stock slick is bad, the treaded even worse. A tire change isn't that hard to do, and tire options are exponentially better for the XR than the GT. Your own video has an Enduro with Rim savers....so clearly people find a way. (In fact, most used XRS have an Enduro or a burris treaded of some kind on them nowadays.) For the Battery, the stock XR pack in a VESC still KILLS a GT in everything except range. You already admitted the XR is a better value proposition so no need to go deeper there. Lastly: "Especially for beginners.....who wont have the time nor patience to take apart a onewheel and figure out which screw goes in where, they just want to unbox the onewheel and ride" Maybe on the first few days, but most people tinker with their boards. More importantly though, a beginner wont have the time or patience for modding an XR, but they will have the money to spend on a ~2700 onewheel? I dont really find that a convincing argument. Most beginners buy a pint.
2. "The stock GT is probably the safest board" if you are fortunate enough to get one without footpad issues, I could agree on this one. However, many people (well after the recall, btw) are still on their 3rd or 4th footpad with ghosting issues. Definitely not safe. The other boards never had these issues. As for a VESC safety comparison, it would depend on the builder's workmanship and what battery they used. A bit harder to compare, but on average I'd give this win to the GT.
3. "The GT is a finished product." Certainly. but so is the pint... and the surfwheel.... Ergo, are those "better" boards than a VESC? Obviously, there are trade-offs you are ignoring. Water resistance - Also disagree there. None of the onewheels are particularly water resistant. (Though from my understanding, the pint is the best so far) If you consistently ride a onewheel (or VESC) through the rain, it will fail prematurely. Catastrophic failure aside, Lots of people have experienced a water-related design flaw only specific to the GT. Apparently, it doesn't take much water exposure to get water into the two channels of the front sensor pad (The tiny openings at the corner) This is the gap between the sectioned off areas of the sensor pad designed to relieve bending strain on the sensor pad due to the concave shape. Problem is the grip tape goes right over it and is never sealed. If water wicks its way down there, it shorts the 3 sensor channels and the onewheel ghosts. Headlights- included directional headlights are a nice plus on factory onewheels, but with VESC, since you're doing a custom controller box your options are unlimited. Auto shut-off: definitely nice to have on a factory FM board, but anyone who has built a vesc is either monitoring their voltages or knows better frankly. Have never heard of anyone running their battery down to damaging levels, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
4: GT vs VESC as an only board. Again, like the "straight out of the box argument" I find this to be a cherry-picking argument. Most VESC builders have or have had multiple boards. Usually these are experienced riders that are very familiar with the onewheel and want to take it to the next level. Not saying that the one board example is impossible, and in that case you'd be right and I agree with you that VESCing your only board is a bad idea. My point is simply that this is likely in the vast minority of scenarios. As far as reliability, it depends on the builder. As far as reparability, clear clear win to the VESC. What GT owners always omit is all of the (deserved) scrutiny and hate for FM's "repair" and customer service practices. The GT has already proven itself to be less reliable than previous boards, even footpad issues aside. Everything for the VESC can be replaced on the open market. The GT is completely locked down and FM is hot garbage when it comes to parts/repair.
5. The App. Personally, I don't use it much but a lot of people might. I just use it for the trip distance to measure against my battery life on new boards/builds. But yes, that will be gone. Hard to say if it is missed, though. On the flip size, the VESC lets you customize literally everything (Another omitted tidbit in this video outside of pushback limits) and is constantly evolving. the FM app its "locked", and if anything, FM is known for rolling back features, not adding them. Furthermore, the tilt remote capablity for the VESC is absolutely game changing. I think every single rider would trade the OW app for tilt remote capability and unlimited and growing settings/customization if they could. As for the 90% battery charging, it is a nice feature but we did fine without it on all of the previous OWs. Additionally, charging past 90% is not nearly as bad for the battery as people make it out to be. In fact, lots of people end up with unbalanced cells because they don't understand the battery mechanics and don't do an overnight charge once in a while. The main thing that kill batteries are heat, charge cycles, and leaving the battery (or single unbalanced cells) very high or very low for extended periods of time. Charging your battery to 90 percent vs 100 percent makes zero difference if it is ridden shortly after.
6. Group rides will of course vary, but to say that they are overwhelmingly GT riders is (currently) false. You might see 50-70% GT riders at a group ride, but "basically everyone is riding GTs" is 100% false. The only time chargers have been an issue is that one guy (we've all seen it happen) that shows up with a stock pint even though the flier says not to. Then they burn their battery and need to borrow a charger, but almost no one brings a pint, or more specifically a pint hypercharger. As for the VESC builder, by that point nearly every vesc builder has a higher capacity battery or knows to bring their own charger. They aint noobs off the street. losing your backpack sucks and I'm sorry it happened, but that is another extreme case.
The "swap" charger example is another extreme case, and is frankly a weak argument. Anyone who is dumb enough to grab a strangers charger without asking (A charger that will not look the same as a factory charger, mind you) and simply starts using it deserves to have their board damaged. Furthermore, if your previous point were true "basically everyone is riding a stock GT" then they wouldn't be able to use the charger, as the charger most likely will be proprietary to the vesc builders preference, or more likely an XR port.... so it wouldnt be able to be used on "basically everyone"s board. It was clear that you were reeeeeally reaching for an extreme hypothetical situation that wouldn't even be able to happen and unfortunately highlights some significant technical misunderstanding.
Stock gt tire is terrible. Even the xr stock Vega is better.
I hated the slick soooo much! The treaded seems soild to me tho
now I ride a VESC I can't go to GT, I feel like i'am riding a seek board lol, no torque, no power... I really don't liked it... and it is 3000 €.... :(
It is true sometimes you need to fix your vesc, but- you can do it by yourself, if your GT get bad, you need to send it to USA, i am ion europe, I did it once for my old XR, it is really expenseive... and FM is a sharks's company, I never will give them more money than what I already did...
Damn that’s low tire pressure
That’s 18psi…
I absolutely LOVE my new GT!!!.... and I don't care what anybody says!!!
However,..
Can anyone tell me which Smart Watch to buy so I can keep an eye on my speed?
I'm trying to establish a crushing speed around 18mph but my App showed 23mph on my last ride... so I really want to get a Smart Watch that works with my GT.
GT is awesome! FM OW app works with apple watch
A GT is NOT great out of the box because the tire is SHIT! I was regretting buying mine until I put an enduro tire on it. And the stock tire was so hard I had to cut it off with a grinder. WTF is FM thinking shipping that tire?
Future motion is amazing. They respond quickly and build a good product, unlike everyone else whose board falls apart. And you have to modify vesc just to keep it together.vesc falls apart so fast. Also, if you have a problem, you can mail a gt to fm and have it back within a week. It's the only board you can buy and have 0 problems out of the box. And be riding on your 1st day.vesc Super sucks to try and buy it, and it is nearly impossible to trust vesc on any level
Lol yes you can compare a modded XR to a GT because the price is the same
Gt-s isnt even as good as float wheel or vesc much less gt.
Wow this video got out of date lol
技术真好 😳
嘿嘿
1:25 😭
Some of the things you are absolutely right in, but your actual knowledge of VESC is limited.....as in very limited and incorrect
That's true. If you want hardcore info on vesc I'm not the guy, I'm a newbie who got thrown into the deep end and had to google how to use a multimeter halfway thru the vesc conversion because I was watching more advanced builders and they made it sound wayyyy easier than it actually is.
Also since you can make a vesc into anything you want, it's hard to draw comparisons so I had to generalize a bit (example: waterproofing), otherwise there will be asterisks all over the video.
Please also point out specifically what I said that was incorrect! I'd love to know if I'm just missing something and can make my vesc experience better than it already is.
@@leonchang7596 i don't own a GT, keep that in mind (but have ridden a few)
-My VESC is way safer then any FM onewheel
-Vesc is way harder to push the nose down, to the point that people who like to fang drag has to change settings to do that (obviously it is very dependent on the settings you ride) but VESC has the ability to provide more torque then any FM board, even with the vesc running a 63v battery
-GT is only almost water resistant, you need to watertighten around the plugs on the controller
-you can simply put a heavy pushback (un-ridable pushback) on a Vesc to prevent to drain the batteries to a dangerous level....you can also chose not to
-if you are capable, having a Vesc as the only board is just fine
-sure, if you plug a higher voltage charger in to your board, bad shit happens.....to every board, GT has a propitiatory plug with a chip in it = not serviceable
-you can make concave front footpad for Vesc....that actually detects pressure, but without ghosting
-if you use iphone, and use float controll, you can make all the custom shaping s you want, even with sliders....but admittedly it is currently missing from the regular Vesc app
Guess he didn’t have anything to actually call you out on…
1. awesome! mine isn't
2. very true
3. some silicone around the barrel plugs and it's basically water tight. Can't say the same thing about vesc builds. I'd like to believe that enclosures such as torque box and elm box are super robust because it's built by people who care, but what they lack is the sheer amount of milage in the real world. Because GTs are made in mass numbers, we have basically encountered all the possible failure points. When you unbox a fresh GT, you know exactly how it will fail. You know where the rail will bend, which screw will strip, and where water leaks in. You know exactly how much margin you have when you hit pushback. Although a vesc can be made to be much safer or more dangerous than a GT, I think a safe option is always the one where you know what you're up against.
4. I can only speak from my experience but I've been having a super rough time with my vesc. I've run through 3 escs and 1 motor in 2023 alone. The board has been in repairs for longer than it's been in service. I am happy to read about everyone's fantastic experience with not having any issues with their vescs and it kinda makes me jealous.
5. Not having standardized plugs suck, and is horrible for RTR, but there is no mistaking a GT charger with any other charger.
6. Yes, but I'm saying I specifically like the harsh corners on the GT footpad for trails. Yes I'm aware I can 3d print my own. As someone who has had my GT ghost on me >5 times, I have not encountered a single ghost in the post recall footpad.
7. Admittedly I haven't messed with float control much until after I made this video, I didn't know we have shaping presets already! These things are just moving too fast
@@leonchang7596
Well number 3 is kind of like saying a roof isn't watertight, it all depends on the materials chosen and the craftsmanship you put into the construction
My Vesc is build around the aluminium floatboxx and the torquepack, so it is more watertight then any FM board (out of the box) but non of the things comes free
And in my case, i know way better what I'm up against in a Vesc, then a GT 🤷🏼♂️
5. You can chose any standard you like, you can keep all of the XR plugs, they even come prepackaged in a bundle, personally i started out with that, but upgraded a few of them to something better
6. I don't know what footpad you run on your Vesc, but i can recommend the one fungineers make (called the stompies) it is hands down the best footpad i have ever used, but yes, it requires you either 3d print or make something out if plywood. A few of my fellow riders that have the upgraded GT footpad have problems engaging it, so now thy are "forced" to buy that surestart (little electronic module you put in the controller to trick it to worked properly) but great to hear some doesn't have that problem
the shape is very much a personal preference, i haven't ridden the GT far enough that the corners annoyed me
Don't get me wrong, i don't recommend people who haven't got any onewheel experience to dive in and build a VESC, but people with let's say 2K km behind them, who are looking to upgrade should definitely consider it, especially it they don't have 10 thumbs, and maybe already know how to solder
It pretty much sums up to the old famous spiderman quote "with great power comes great responsibility" and if you are not up to that responsible, and tinkering, then chose something that is prebuild, with both the advantages and weaknesses it offers
Video should be titled "Why the GT is probably a better choice for people new to Onewheel". Not sure why you would compare a GT to VESC in this particular way. Anyone technically inclined enough is going to ditch the GT, every time.
Anyone technically inclined enough is going to ditch the GT, absolutely. But not everyone is and not everyone wants to be.
I have a custom built PC, it's super powerful and cheaper than any equivalent prebuilt on the market. Prebuilts still exist. Same thing goes for fpv drones, you can build one but DJI also sells FPV drones now. I also built my own keyboard, specifically designed for the way I type. In whichever market, the custom built route will always be outperforming the mass market route, and in this case when I have the choice to take my vesc or my GT out, I always pick my vesc because I care about the performance and the tuning dialed to the way I ride, and performance is one reason i will be addressing in the next video. But not everyone are like us who are willing to tinker and take spills just to build the ultimate performance board. which is why it's titled this way. In these 10 ways, GT is better than vesc.
You think everyone that rides is technically inclined?
I am technically inclined. But I am not interested enough to fiddle with settings and give up quality of life features. Everyone who has worked on their own electronics parts are not 100% confident in failures they could have overlooked. I would trust factory tested boards more than boards I assembled together myself by hand without toolings that factories do have unless I’m looking at spending thousands in equipments alone.
@@skoolynugenator1802 no I said anybody technically inclined enough will ditch the GT. I did not say every GT rider is technically inclined. Who cares anyway
Yeah you straight up twisted his words and it isn't working.
"Probably going to get extended battery for GT"
Not if Future Motion can help it... They already blocked XR's from having extended batteries with a firmware update. Guessing they'll do the same with GTs if they haven't already. And *that's* why none of the other gibberish in this video matters, the reason for VESC is because Future Motion can't be trusted. I regret that I have but one downvote to give to this goofy video.
Its not. Bye bye.
10 reasons why a GT is better than a VESC = "i dont' think it's fair to compare stock boards to modded boards".... lost me, bud