Despite some of the inconveniences, it’s the best, most efficient mode of transportation humanity got thus far. Thanks for sharing. I hope velomobile companies are listening. 🙂
Yeah, it's really odd to see cars which weigh 1500 kg carrying a useful load of about 80 kg around the place. If they go uphill, 95% of the energy is being used to move the box, not the contents.
@@karakondzula1388 It depends on the conditions. Starting and stopping a 205t diesel regional train every 5km is going to be very very inefficient to transport a load of 100 passenger (7.5t) with a awfully lot of energy lost in heat during braking. On the other end, an electric train on long distance will be much better as it will transform the kinetic energy back into electricity when slowing down/braking.
Have you ever tested the Orca velomobile by Flevobike? It is my daily commuter and it one up's almost all your downsides. Let me start with the only negative right out of the gate: it is not as fast as a milan or alfa. But: The seat is mesh (so no sweat buildup) but firm (so no hammock like most mesh seats) with adjustable seat angle (no sliding away). It is a 3 wheeler but quite stable due to the wheel placement, good steering geometry for great straight line stability and the joystick steering gives a lot more control, comfort and ventilation over the chest and armpits. It has quite large foot holes and the rain cover/roof is designed in a way that it allows more ventilation and visibility without letting more rain in. It also has good sideways view but I would like curved mirrors for a wider rear view. Getting in and out is a breeze with the large opening top and there is about 60L of (indeed awkward) storing space. Due to the sturdier, more padded, build, it is a lot quiter as well. Mountains are harder though, because it is heavier. I do have to admit, mine is equipped with e-assist to counteract the weight and aero penalty for all of the above comfort. So it is cheating/not really cycling. But it get's about 120km/kWh (or converted to gasoline just over 1000km/L) at a cruising speed of about 45-50km/h. I know this may not be your cup of tea but I think this might me the direction for the general public to accept and adopt super efficiënt velomobile like vehicles. Sadly the Orca is discontinued since it wasn't for the hard core velomobile rider and it was still too extreme for the general public. Sorry for the long comment but I really like your video's and I hope velomobiles will be adopted more broadly in the near future!
One thing that most velomobiles seem to ignore, is that when you pedal 3/4 of the energy you burn turns to heat and only 1/4 turns to pedal-energy which moves your forward. That means that you will sweat even in cold winter. That's why velomobiles should have much more air-intake and give you control about how much air comes in to which spots of your body. I built these into my Alleweder A4 myself, but even they are not enough for warm weather. When it's cold, I enjoy riding it without getting cold and with not fearing to become ill because of sweat with riding bike - a problem I allways had with my upright bike.
I just realised, that you missed the main issue: for velomobile, you need some sort of garage. Upright bike is quite normal to park at home, I park my tricycle at my flat too, but...it is already a bit problematic. Chances of me moving a velo through all those doors, elevator and another set of doors are...unlikely... 🙂
Besides the price, this is the biggest thing keeping me from getting a velomobile. My partner's Tern GSD barely fits on out apartment elevator and it's not that large of a bike, no way I could get a velomobile to fit... 🤣
The most bad for velomobile is the price. Its almost the price of used small car, for example zoe or twingo. If you combine it with the discomfort of sitting and quality become expensive toy.
A moped can go just as fast a velomobile for a fraction of the price of a velomobiles. I bought a folding trike with 2 suitcase wheels under it. So it can be taken on the train with me for the long distance. Brand: HP Velotechnik, type: Gekko 26 FX. Cost 50 % the price of a velomobile.
What the hell is inconvinient on Quattro's luggage space? 😀 You should see mee sqeezing my stuff into panniers on my tricycle! In terms of your neckpain, try to avoid headrest at all - I had it on my trike and eventually get to dismounting it, because I wasn't using it at all. Headrest tend to transmit all vibrations and bounces right to my head, which was rather uncomfortable. Natural way of carrying your head is to have it balanced on your spine and muscles just balanced it there so MAYBE your headrest is comfy, but not in a right place/position relative to rest of your body. Maybe try to put something between headrest any your head to lift it more, like a pillow or something, to get it into that natural position...
these and other HPVs are so interesting to me and id love to try one, but your point about climbing hills is one Ive felt would be a problem here. I live in Scotland, there are no flats and the hills are steep. everyone either has a super advanced road bike, or a mountain bike, because those are the only two that have the gearing to make riding possible. I have seen 1 trike and its been under a tarp in someones garden its whole life, no one rides cruisers, no one rides tall bikes, no one rides cargo bikes, you just cant. lot of E-bikes have been popping up though, unsurprisingly.
Great vid and u tell the truth! Not seeing and hearing enough are the reasons two and three that keep me from getting a velomobile. The main reason is security and wanting to stay alive - and as a former Pro-Level-Rider (on roadbikes) I wouldn´t have survived my hopefully worst and last accident in 2020 when a Volvo XC 80 hit me from behind after a curve with around 80 or 90 K. per hour. I flew backwards in his windscreen and had a lot of good luck and help that I survived this. Greetings from Germany and stay safe and sound!
In fact security with velomobiles is A LOT better than any upright bike, trike or even motorbike. Because first when crashing with one of these others, what happens most is that your body "flies" forward into some object, what means that your head risks getting hurt quite a lot, which obviously IS very dangerous. With a velomobile instead, you are always with your feet first (not your head), and even have a shell as an additional protection and a metal or carbon chassis that will absorb most of the crashing energy. What will also happen in many cases (especially when being hitten from the side) is that your velomobile will roll over and away (instead of being driven over with a normal bike). So security is a big advantage when talking about velomobiles.
Maintenance on Velomobiles can indeed be a pain in the neck. Sometimes, it requires three pepole do tighten a nut. One to see, one to hold on and one to tighten the actual nut. If you don't pull some kind of trick out of your sleeve. Particularly, if you acquire a pre-owned one and attempt to refurbish it. Depending on how maticulous the former owner(s) were with maintenance and how old the velomobile is or how much road has already been covered with it. Or if prior owners did some sloppy jobs. Furthermore, your local bike shop will probably refuse to touch them, although they are in essence just - if unusual - bikes.
A velomobile is basically just a fully enclosed recumbent trike. The question is, how would you compare it to an unenclosed, or partially enclosed recumbent trike. Recumbent trikes without the enclosure would have much of the same comfort, but easier access and better ventilation, at the cost of poorer aerodynamics (most a problem on long flat terrain, no so much in areas where you cannot develop the speed to make use of the aerodynamic efficiency), and inferior weather protection (but with better ventilation and better visibility). The question is, with a partially enclosed recumbent trike, to what degree can you draw a balance between the advantages and disadvantages of each (depending on the environment in which you are using the vehicle)?
When the video started, I saw the trees and heard the accent and thought, "Oh, I'm pretty sure this guy's in Finland" Then, I heard the metal bumper music, and it removed all doubt :-D subscribed!
I have both Quest and Quattrovelo. What I can say is: 1-Seat confort: I find the seats very confortable on both velomobile and have no problems. 2-Stability: I have problems with stability on Quest but none at all on the QV: very stable, never had problems. 3- Sweat: I sweat a lot too, I have ventist pad and I do not seat in a puddle despite my pad is wet. I almost always take off my shirt. 4-Raining: I stay mostly dry but I sweat more so that is the problem. 5-Visibility: Very good! The QV alien hood is the best because it has great visibility and pratical when it is raining because I just have to put the manhole cover. 6-Fog: yes I have fog issues on the visor of the QV , mostly in winter. 7-Airflow: Sure, not enough airflow on hills, and even on flat road in the summer because of the heat. 8-Brakes: I have lot of downhill in my area . if the downhill is long, the brakes overheat even with the additionial disk brakes on the QV. 9-Not convenient: Yes, sure! what is most difficult for me is do repair because of limited access. 10-Speed: I agree! real work condition are different. I notice that for me It depends mostly with the air density, the less dense, the more I am fast. in conclusion, my major concerns are brakes and airflow. All of theses are nothing compared of the limitless pleasure I have on riding my Quattrovelo. It is an awesome velomobile!
If you want to go realy fast you should also change your tyres. Since i swapped from conti contact speed+latex to schwalbe pro one tubeless i gained 8km/h. One important thing to get faster is to keep your tyrepressure on the right spot. If you got shitty roads or regular asphalt maximum is7 bars or 100psi, if you go over this it will slow you down(i was surprised by this). Tyres make a huge difference in comfort and speed.
I can't disagree with anything you say but the most important fact is that I have a good upright carbon road bike, a good upright MTB and 2 velomobiles and the only ones I ride are the velomobiles. I could see myself getting a recumbent 2 wheeler at some point and when I get old and have trouble getting in and out of the velomobiles I could see myself getting a recumbent trike, probably with e-assist, but I can't see myself buying another upright. My Strada now has e-assist and I think that overcomes the uphill speed issue which was always a big thing for me, living in a hilly area. I thought it was cheating when I did it but really it is just making the most of what is possible and really puts a smile on my face. I am now as fast as most uprights on the uphill sections of my normal loop, not been overtaken on the flat for a very long time and faster than anything downhill. The big issue for me is transportation, particularly to races. I carry my velomobiles on the roof of my car and it is difficult to get them up there. I built a ramp that allows me to do it on my own but it takes 3 people without the ramp. You can't carry them on a train like you can an upright.
I have two recumbent bikes with fairly upright seating position. I have more drag than something more reclined, but I have no comfort issues most of the time-and that's with direct steering. I did have to put fenders on one of them, but that's in part because the mesh seatback lets moisture through so well!
Nice that you also touch on the impracticalities of a velomobile. While the fanbaseay be happy with what is available, there are still way too many car drivers, who wouldnt touch these overpriced and impractical designs with a barge pole. I personally think that daily-use velomobiles need to be designed differently from the ground up. I'd start with easy entry and exit in rain and eye-height at least comparable with a compact car and strong electric pedal assist for climbing hills and reaching cruise speeds without sweating. At the same time, the electric drive train allows for less exotic materials, which will have a positive impact on cost.
Great video! Many thanks. I have put about 7500Km into a DF over the last year and am generally pleased. Sweating and ventilation is an issue. One minor mod/hack I have done is to recess the horn by about 2cm (with some longer bolts and plastic spacers) so that the hole it it works through can act as a bit of an air intake. It does seem to help. I have not the skills to build an air scoop to force more air. I have wondered about riding without the derailleur cover on so see if that draws air through the body of the velomobile on hot days. If that works, maybe someone could create a louvred derailleur cover?! Sweating - I seem to reach a certain level of sweatiness and no more, no matter what the temperature. I have found that a long sleeved base layer like a Helle Hansen Dry Stripe works well. Having fabric over the elbow prevents the elbow rest getting soaked and puddles below. Works for me. Racing hood - generally good. No room for helmet inside though. The fogging issue is greatly helped by fitting a Pinlock visor. Side windows fog up on cold mornings though. Am considering some Pinlock related hack - essentially double glazing them. Glasses fogging up - yes, it happens. It used to happen on cold days on my Cruzbike too as steam rose from me at the lights. Not much to do there. Fit and seat comfort - mine is about 90% right. Lots of compromises with just fitting into the darned thing. Manufacturers - more sophisticated seat adjustment would be appreciated. I find the seat not as comfortable as on my Cruzbike. Perhaps a custom fit service (like the F1 boys have where a carbon fibre seat is moulded for them... someone would buy it!) The seat supplied does not fit me that well. Lumps in the wrong places and I like to hang my shoulder blades over the edge of seats, as I could on the Cruzbike. This is not possible on the DF. Handling and stability - When I got it the steering felt very twitchy. I am used to it now. Relax and don't fight it. Stability - feels pretty planted to the road. I have only lifted a wheel once when (rashly) making a 90 degree left turn and close to 30kmph. And that was not a bad one - just a tiny lift. Maintenance - I am getting better! Next job to change the chain tubes for some PTFE ones (from ginkgo-veloteile.de) to try to reduce that huge drive train friction. We need Haynes Manuals or equivalent! Brakes overheating - have not really had an issue. Not dragging the breaks on a descent helps. ginkgo-veloteile.de make/modify Sturmey Archer drum brakes, fitting heat sinks etc if you are struggling. I have heard they are good. Overall comfort, luggage etc. It's not a car! But it's better than a bike. That's me done!
You got the wrong velomobile for finland. Should have gotten a DF XL instead with open wheels snow wont stuck inside your wheel arches and you will be able to ride in Winter pretty easy with 27.5 Tyres in rear. Cuz they have a lot of room for the snow to build up. If you have extreme weather conditions and bad roads lots of hilly roads DF XL will beat all other velos. You can also buy the radical design Cyclone IV Trekking Bicycle Trailer to transport all your shoping prey about 40kg of food. Get a DF XL and all your problems will be gonne right away.
On gearing: Velomobiles, recumbent trikes and quads have rather absurd gear requirements that stock bike components typically can't cover. This is less of a problem if you ride in mostly flat terrain and don't carry more than a light load of cargo. For example, I am a utility rider. My bike/trike is for getting me from A to Z with a heavy load and often towing a trailer. My trike turned quad has a low of 10 gear inches for getting those loads up the local 20% grades. But to get that low kills my top end, which maxes out at ~60 gear inches for about 10-12 mph. To get the low end I need and have a decent high would require a gear range of ~1,200%. Yes, about double the gear range of a Pinion C1.12. Note: that this can be done with a 10-50 cassette and Schlemph mountain drive. Though that has it's own problems.
Thanks for the awesome videos. Subscribed! Forgive my ignorance as a newbie, but if drum brakes are a concern then is there a reason people don't fit disc brakes? Thanks for explaining all this to someone who's never tried one before. 😊
As a newbie to the velo world, I would say compared to an upright bike, a velo is much better. Even in the hilly country of New Zealand. Less than 500 metres from my house are streets with >10% inclines. I just have to harden up for the hills. Braking down hill is not an issue, yet. One never brakes after slogging up a hill. A problem I do have is that the velo is hard to transport. At 2.5m in length. I need a trailer. Just a hassle. A major benefit is that on the Waikato roads of New Zealand one does not get covered in wet cow manure, on early morning road rides. The wheel arches collect it all. Clothing options are easier. Shorts and T-shirt for anything above 10 degrees celcius, and maybe a single for anything around 10 degrees celcius. and wet weather is not a major baddie. Much drier than an upright. Summer is almost here, and the last 30 plus degree celcius ride I did, it was warm in the velo, but still nicer than being stuck on an upright in the heat, getting fried. It wasn't as tiring. A velo is a great choice, despite the downsides. 😄
This was an eye opening clip 👍 I agree in many points. Velomobile is very comfortable and fast to ride on fresh asphalt, but where do we have those kind of roads haha... The usual roads and cycle paths are filled with holes, seams and cracks. Quite uncomfortable with the tires like 32 front and 42 rear (DFXL) and the speed slows significantly, like Saukki stated. So, the watt discussion is really pure theory. On the other hand, I usually pass all the other cyclists very easily, even on uphill. My butt gets tired on long distances too. Still, there's no "balls in hydraulic press" feel as with most upright bikes. I have never experienced slipping forward on the seat. My seat front end rises slightly up, don't yours? Plus, the seat is fastened with bolts to the wheel arches, so it's quite safe, too My solution with the visibility is sunroof that DF offers as an option. Great visibility to the sides and no fogging on the windscreen. Maybe not as efficient aerodynamically as the hood, but close 😊
So don't bike so hard then, if you get so sweaty! 😀 Just kidding, I can't bike a normal speed even on normal bokes, I somehow always bike as fast as I possibly can. I think it's from my childhood, where you of course never were biking to enjoy the biking, you were always going somewhere, and you wanted to get there fast. 🙂 I wish someone would make velomobiles directly aimed at biking to work. Comfy, convenient, not that fast, and space for some fan inside for hot days. Ooohhh, and an electric drivetrain for going up hills. I'd get that.
I think you cover it very well. I would also add that some places to ride are not so good with a velomobile. Bike paths are not so good because you have to slow down for people and other cyclists. Cities are also not so good because it can be hard to see around parked cars, lots of starting and stopping with a heavy bike. But, on a good route, a velomobile is a lot of fun. I ride a lot more now that I have my Quest XS. Once I adjusted the front wheel alignment with my bodyweight in the quest, the handling is very good and I’m much faster for lesson effort.
Your biggest problem seems to be that you are too much in a hurry and/or too fond of physical excercise. Thats not the velomobile manufacturers fault! 😁😁😁 On the serious side; My ride is not by far as fast an speedy as any of yours but still we share some of the issues; My experience is that even VERY small adjustments in body position affects ass numbness astonishingly much! I have also experienced big differences from different shoes and feet position on the pedal. Thanks for sharing! 👍Useful as always, keep up the good work! 👍
The biggest disadvantage is the danger of rear wheel loss of traction and blowouts. The potential of a horrific crash scares me all the time. When it's raining you are indeed still wet but much warmer and I feel more comfortable- I am able to maintain 50km/hr in my Milan SL on 165 Watts easily and did a 25 mile road loop with 177 watts average for a sub 3 hour century. 33.4mph ave on 177 watts - I did optimize with just a tiny rear mirror. Latex tubes in Gran Prix LTD tires and a 100 tooth chainring to reduce chain friction! - Good video!
I agree with all of those issues, I live in Michigan and ride my Strada when weather is below 60 degrees F to be comfortable. It keeps me warm down into the 20s with no problems with a windshield and side windows installed. I've ridden over 10,000 miles this way, loads of fun!
I have seen other velonauts talk about the hassles of owning velos, but they have all said that they will NEVER go back to "Diamond Frames" or drive motor vehicles if they can absolutely avoid it. I am still thinking about the EQ Hawk and waiting on info about it, a fully enclosed two-person velo.
I can agree that I would never go back to upright (or upwrong) bike. But unfortunately the weather conditions here in the north do get so bad sometimes, that velomobile just isn’t feasible only mode of transportation. That’s why I still have to own a car.
Just a remark, that "velo" means bicycle in french... So, abbreviations are nice and cool and all (I guess), till u end up using an abbreviation that means something totally else...
@@klausbrinck2137, I know that velo means "bike" and that mobile means "to move" and at one time meant "car" . I am using terms that are now common within the velomobile community and are used by many riders and some builders.
@@MSSmith1022 I know why u do it, I´m just questioning the sense of it. using a word that means something familiar (bike is familiar to velomobile), but also clearly different, is a slippery path.
I agree. Even though these vehicles have elements from other “machines?”, they deserve a clever and trendy name all to themselves, despite the fact that it’s been used for years. “Velomobiles” is awkward. We’re a clever bunch. If we were to brainstorm about it, we could come up with something better. And shorter. And unique. And universal(language/culture, etc).
My MTB commuter is better because I'm not at bumper height. I can see over cars and see road hazards better. I'm more visible to cars driving beside me. I can maneuver much, much, much better. I can ride between cars or jump a curb to ride or walk on the sidewalk when it's safer or faster to do so. I can always find a parking space. I can ride a bus. I have exactly the right amount of aerodynamics and speed needed for city commuting. I can stop and add or remove a shirt or rain gear in a few seconds. I can easily hitch up my trailer and pull heavy or bulky loads that impress onlookers. My big trailer is 7 feet x 3 feet. I can walk up or down hills when needed. And I can replace it for $200. Velos are expensive toys. And they look like a penis.
Thank you for your excellent videos: I am thinking of the Katanga waw E for some occasional holiday travelling as worried that quattromobile too heavy, I am 189xm and 91kg, any thoughts ? Many Thanks
Thank you for giving me actuall information about these. I am planning on making an all weather pedal powered vehical and velo's seemed the way to go. I am going to focus a bit more on internal comfort and stability over speed.
You missed two pretty major points: usability in urban space and cost. If I mainly drove around in villages or quiet suburbs AND had a garage to properly store a velomobile and do some of the service myself, it might be a good idea to have one. Urban traffic with its frequent stops, however, is not where they shine. Parking one in the city centre will be interesting, too - they're too bulky for the sidewalk but will probably be crushed when parked between cars. Then, there is the cost issue. Yes, they're cheaper to operate a car... but is that an honest benchmark? With what you said about sweating, velomobiles are no viable option for a commute to the office as most offices do not have suitable off-street parking, a shower and a wardrobe. So they are a hobby, and quite an expensive one. I love the idea of highly efficient cycling, so I really want to like velomobiles - but these two really are deal breakers to me.
With limited space within the velomobile, I am confident several mechanical advantages could be up graded in it's design to increase comfort and reduce excessive jarring from road conditions. The changes don't have to necessarily add weight.
I learned a lot about velomobiles. I actually did not know anything about them but they are a covered bike. You did not mention how inconvenient it is to get the velomobile to a place you want to ride, if you are not starting from your home on it. It is not fitting in my Leaf trunk. Another major terror is trying to ride this in the bike lanes in USA cities. The bike lanes are narrow and these velomobiles would just barely fit.
I'm just back home from Malmö with a Leiba Cargo (1200 km trip) and I must say that ventilation is pretty good (even in hot days), much better than on a standard bike but not as good as an AC car, of course. This specific model has a passenger seat that offer a lot of storage space, which I love. Entering and getting out of it is also very easy, and it even has a small passenger door (which is lovely!). I'm debating whether I should cut round holes in my driver seat, to help with ventilation (the mesh would cover it). Or maybe add a layer of breathable cotton to the mesh? This specific model has most parts visible and accessible, as well. So, it's less sporty but quite functional when service is needed. I'll need to change the front light, though (not powerful enough). Any recommendation? Thanks again for providing such valuable information on the velomobile topic!
Still wish I’d bought one a decade or more before I did. I’ve found that I stay pretty dry with the race hood on - but I clearly don’t put out as much power as you do 🤪
Of course, the main problem with velomobiles is their rarity, especially outside Europe. Here in North America they would simply be an oddity, like riding a unicycle to work. (In fact, unicycles are more common.) I think there was one little store here in Toronto that sold them, but it appears to have shut down. This means that even if someone was interested, there's nowhere to go to even try one out. It also means they are overpriced - if they were less than $8K then MAYBE you'd start to get more interest. Maybe sticking a lithium battery in there to help with climbs, and more powerful brakes or some sort of governor for downhills which would also charge the batteries. As for sweating - dress for the cold weather like you would for cycling. (But Finns would know all about this). In the warm weather, perhaps make the shell removable - just held on by some latches so you could take it off. Most people would be happy to trade a bit of speed for comfort, and not be locked into a claustrophobic little shell when the weather is nice. Plus it would be a lot easier for servicing the mechanism down below.
Yes, velomobiles are quite expensive and are only sold to the die hard fans. I had a velomobile, but I returned to cycling trikes. Cheaper at roughly 50 % of the price of a velomobile. Cooler then a velomobiles, due to the wind. Easier to get on and off. Less weight uphill. Easy maintenance. Trikes can be folded, so easy transport in cars, or planes, or busses, or trains. Trikes can be fitted with a motor, I cycled 132 km/ 82 miles with 25 kg/ 55 lbs luggage with my motorized trike last summer. Do not get me wrong, velomobiles are excellent for travelling extreme long distance in the flat countryside, at high speed.
For dirt biking we use something called "spit" that works pretty good for anti-fogging the plastic/glass lenses on your helmet, I imagine it'd work really well for the visors on these, you do have to reapply it every few hours but it's certainly better than nothing!
Turning radius is worse than an upright but is rarely an issue. I have had issues where there are barriers at the start of cycle paths that mean I have to get out and manually manoeuvre through the gap but that is rare and is mainly an issue that town planners have a blinkered picture of what a cycle looks like. I am comfortable riding my velomobiles on the road so it rarely a problem. My Strada has open wheel wells and so a tighter turning circle so is easier than the Milan but I have been able to do a u-turn in the road in the Milan without getting out before, just. The Strada has open foot holes so reversing is easy. I don't agree about the maintenance. Your mechanical components are protected from dirt so should last longer. Maintenance can be more difficult, as Saukki mentioned, but I don't think you need to do it more often. The design on most new velos is currently to put a hatch in the front that makes it a lot easier to get to the front mech and my Milan GT also has storage bins in the front which is a real bonus.
@@surrey-velo2419 I should’ve mentioned I live in a city where streets are narrow and not a lot of well built or designed cycle paths. The maintenance issue for me was things like chain drops, lights didn’t work properly after 2 years of riding, chain tubes did not held in place and got chewed and also the idler broke off, gear tuning…I’m quite happy with my DF, but wished the components were more robust. Or after all is the rider’s issues hahaha.
Agree with all of your points. Velomobiles are great machines but have their drawbacks. Biggest issue i had with my velomobile was 90 degree turns and reaching the buttons for bicycle traffic lights. Other than that they are easily the best bicycles there are for most journeys except for steep climbs. I usually rode around 35-40km/h with my velomobile (mango) with the same effort i ride an upright bike at 25km/h and with much more comfort and protection from the weather. I don't have mine anymore (nowhere to store it) but do want to buy another one in the future.
You need to test the M9, it has real room and is extremely comfortable. I have one, I'm 6 foot and weight 220 pounds and this is without a doubt the best bike for those of us who have large frames. My DFXL is a great bike, but it doesn't have the room and comfort the M9 has.
Yeah, well, I think I'll just stick with my E-Bike and some good rain gear. And as they seem to be limited to roads mostly, I'd surely miss my way back from work through the woods.
I strongly believe that Velomobiles with 2 horsepower electric motors and people with solar panels would do a lot of the work towards cleaning up the environment. Most people drive 3,000 pound cars to move a person that weighs less than 200 pounds. That is very wasteful.
It's Called RAINX A windshield water repailent I used on motorcycle helmets face shield and car windshield good stuff water just rolls off. You actually can see the road.
Can velomobile makers implant heat-resistive defoggers into the windshields, connectable to a battery? Overall, velomobiles to me look like very good DIYs, even though they cost more than a small car. That rare drivetrain suspension: put an anodized coating on it at least, to make it look more professional.
i wonder if ul get demonetized for the cursing 6:26 hahaha. i seriously love ur english accent bro, even though i had to slow down the speed to 1.25 from my usual avg 1.75 because ur english sounds like ur speaking so fucking fast, like another language. heeheehee
Thanks man I was contemplating getting to build a mark t ford life the Finland one on you tube but sounds like a push bike and a year drop camper trailer might be better?
i think it is very interesting transportation device, but extremely dangerous on roads with cars. where i live motorcycle, bicycle and pedestrians get killed on the side of the road. Velopod are only 50cm tall so it seems to be ALOT more dangerous than other modes of transportation.
a question for you if you don’t mind: Some day I WILL do a round the world record attempt in a human powered vehicle (probably a velomobile) and want to work out roughly what speed i will achieve at 150 watts on the flat? What do you think in your experience?
I didn't have the issue with the sweat pools, and the sliding down the seat wasn't as bad as yours. But yeah, the maintenance! When your chain falls off the gear, and it's almost totally enclosed, you are fu##ed.
Thinking back to a winter commuting in a Kingcycle Quattro (prototype 4 wheel front wheel drive) velomobile the biggest advantage I found was even when it was really cold outside I was warm and cozy inside, stayed sweaty dry and could carry loads of work kit int he big boot. 👍🏻
When climbing, open up your hood (unless it's sunny). On downhills, a parachute can be convenient. Also, Ginkgo Veloteile supplies XL-SD drums (90mm) with cooling fins, which can be very useful in FINland ;)
Try installing a Zero Breeze 2 battery powered air conditioner! It could reduce the sweating a lot and would be a nice experiment that would gain a lot of views.
Upright bikes have more versatility and are easy to transport or store in small spaces. They are much safer due to the agility and better visibility. I would choose upright bike any day.
Why not put a 49cc water cooled engine in the back or an electric one at this point? The next step for motorcycles is cockpits because imo they have reached the limit when it comes to speed and safety, past that it just becomes stupid and ineficient. I know it has been done already but a smoll electric/combustion engine + the great aerodynamics might make it a cool all year commuter, and if u keep it below 50cc and keep the pedals u can drive/ride it whitout a license.
Consider some turning lessons with these things. One of these ran into me head on around a corner due to speed and loss of control. Sent me to ER. Could’ve killed me, but I have a hard head. Warning: hard to turn around corners. Slow down at corners until you see your exit and maintain traction. Otherwise, you can kill somebody.
I would prefer a bicycle or recumbent trike as want the wind in my hair. I don't like my turbo trainer for the same reason wouldn't like a velomobile, no airflow
Too bad we can't ride a velomobile here. First, it's hot here most of the year. Second, the streets and roads are not prepared to accommodate these vehicles. I can barely ride a bike on the bike lanes. But I remain a huge fan of this vehicle.
I would look at getting pinlock inserts from motorcycle helmet visors as even when in heavy rain and cold (fogging weather) the visor stays completely clear even when fully closed. 👍🏻
A couple of years ago, I bought a hard back seat to replace the mesh seat on my trike. I always felt like I was going to slide out of it so I went back to the OEM seat. I recently had a friend fabricate some "wings" or bolsters from aluminum plate (1/4") to help hold me more securely. Waiting for my wife to heal (she cut her thumb badly) so she can make some covers for them. I will then install them and remount the seat for testing. It felt good sitting on the garage floor, but have to see how it feels in actual use.
do you have some wattage numbers in the same conditions as a upright bicycle then? since manufacturers claim certains speeds at certain wattage, the more interesting thing would be to point to the improvement from other alternatives of travel
Honest claims, metal soundtrack, drone footages, Saukki has it all ! Thanks again for your channel !
Despite some of the inconveniences, it’s the best, most efficient mode of transportation humanity got thus far. Thanks for sharing. I hope velomobile companies are listening. 🙂
That’s true!
Yeah, it's really odd to see cars which weigh 1500 kg carrying a useful load of about 80 kg around the place. If they go uphill, 95% of the energy is being used to move the box, not the contents.
The most efficient mode of transportation of men and load is train. Always been and always will be.
Outside The Catholic Church there is no Salvation. th-cam.com/play/PLUcjoO2Bj8AsiGYdzfqZyXae1lhMw_p2s.html
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@@karakondzula1388 It depends on the conditions. Starting and stopping a 205t diesel regional train every 5km is going to be very very inefficient to transport a load of 100 passenger (7.5t) with a awfully lot of energy lost in heat during braking. On the other end, an electric train on long distance will be much better as it will transform the kinetic energy back into electricity when slowing down/braking.
Really Appreciate the Bald Honesty, and Love Your Sense of Humor. You are a Great Resource for Prospective Velomobile Owners. Keep it Up!
I could imagine that velo mobiles would make a rider tremendously hot inside the tight, airless, body.
Have you ever tested the Orca velomobile by Flevobike? It is my daily commuter and it one up's almost all your downsides. Let me start with the only negative right out of the gate: it is not as fast as a milan or alfa. But: The seat is mesh (so no sweat buildup) but firm (so no hammock like most mesh seats) with adjustable seat angle (no sliding away). It is a 3 wheeler but quite stable due to the wheel placement, good steering geometry for great straight line stability and the joystick steering gives a lot more control, comfort and ventilation over the chest and armpits. It has quite large foot holes and the rain cover/roof is designed in a way that it allows more ventilation and visibility without letting more rain in. It also has good sideways view but I would like curved mirrors for a wider rear view. Getting in and out is a breeze with the large opening top and there is about 60L of (indeed awkward) storing space. Due to the sturdier, more padded, build, it is a lot quiter as well. Mountains are harder though, because it is heavier. I do have to admit, mine is equipped with e-assist to counteract the weight and aero penalty for all of the above comfort. So it is cheating/not really cycling. But it get's about 120km/kWh (or converted to gasoline just over 1000km/L) at a cruising speed of about 45-50km/h. I know this may not be your cup of tea but I think this might me the direction for the general public to accept and adopt super efficiënt velomobile like vehicles. Sadly the Orca is discontinued since it wasn't for the hard core velomobile rider and it was still too extreme for the general public. Sorry for the long comment but I really like your video's and I hope velomobiles will be adopted more broadly in the near future!
One thing that most velomobiles seem to ignore, is that when you pedal 3/4 of the energy you burn turns to heat and only 1/4 turns to pedal-energy which moves your forward. That means that you will sweat even in cold winter. That's why velomobiles should have much more air-intake and give you control about how much air comes in to which spots of your body. I built these into my Alleweder A4 myself, but even they are not enough for warm weather. When it's cold, I enjoy riding it without getting cold and with not fearing to become ill because of sweat with riding bike - a problem I allways had with my upright bike.
I just realised, that you missed the main issue: for velomobile, you need some sort of garage.
Upright bike is quite normal to park at home, I park my tricycle at my flat too, but...it is already a bit problematic. Chances of me moving a velo through all those doors, elevator and another set of doors are...unlikely... 🙂
Besides the price, this is the biggest thing keeping me from getting a velomobile. My partner's Tern GSD barely fits on out apartment elevator and it's not that large of a bike, no way I could get a velomobile to fit... 🤣
Stand it on end?
Lock it up outside?
@@ghz24 good luck with that, at least in my country.
@@tri-seeker2753 How so, should be more weather resistant than a regular bike.
Theft?
The most bad for velomobile is the price. Its almost the price of used small car, for example zoe or twingo. If you combine it with the discomfort of sitting and quality become expensive toy.
A moped can go just as fast a velomobile for a fraction of the price of a velomobiles. I bought a folding trike with 2 suitcase wheels under it. So it can be taken on the train with me for the long distance. Brand: HP Velotechnik, type: Gekko 26 FX. Cost 50 % the price of a velomobile.
And what about the turning circle?
Both times I've been in Finland, it was extremely hot 🥵 I guess we were lucky...sort of. I'm seriously considering a Velomobile.
What the hell is inconvinient on Quattro's luggage space? 😀 You should see mee sqeezing my stuff into panniers on my tricycle!
In terms of your neckpain, try to avoid headrest at all - I had it on my trike and eventually get to dismounting it, because I wasn't using it at all. Headrest tend to transmit all vibrations and bounces right to my head, which was rather uncomfortable.
Natural way of carrying your head is to have it balanced on your spine and muscles just balanced it there so MAYBE your headrest is comfy, but not in a right place/position relative to rest of your body. Maybe try to put something between headrest any your head to lift it more, like a pillow or something, to get it into that natural position...
these and other HPVs are so interesting to me and id love to try one, but your point about climbing hills is one Ive felt would be a problem here. I live in Scotland, there are no flats and the hills are steep. everyone either has a super advanced road bike, or a mountain bike, because those are the only two that have the gearing to make riding possible. I have seen 1 trike and its been under a tarp in someones garden its whole life, no one rides cruisers, no one rides tall bikes, no one rides cargo bikes, you just cant. lot of E-bikes have been popping up though, unsurprisingly.
Great vid and u tell the truth! Not seeing and hearing enough are the reasons two and three that keep me from getting a velomobile. The main reason is security and wanting to stay alive - and as a former Pro-Level-Rider (on roadbikes) I wouldn´t have survived my hopefully worst and last accident in 2020 when a Volvo XC 80 hit me from behind after a curve with around 80 or 90 K. per hour. I flew backwards in his windscreen and had a lot of good luck and help that I survived this. Greetings from Germany and stay safe and sound!
In fact security with velomobiles is A LOT better than any upright bike, trike or even motorbike.
Because first when crashing with one of these others, what happens most is that your body "flies" forward into some object, what means that your head risks getting hurt quite a lot, which obviously IS very dangerous. With a velomobile instead, you are always with your feet first (not your head), and even have a shell as an additional protection and a metal or carbon chassis that will absorb most of the crashing energy. What will also happen in many cases (especially when being hitten from the side) is that your velomobile will roll over and away (instead of being driven over with a normal bike).
So security is a big advantage when talking about velomobiles.
Maintenance on Velomobiles can indeed be a pain in the neck. Sometimes, it requires three pepole do tighten a nut. One to see, one to hold on and one to tighten the actual nut. If you don't pull some kind of trick out of your sleeve. Particularly, if you acquire a pre-owned one and attempt to refurbish it. Depending on how maticulous the former owner(s) were with maintenance and how old the velomobile is or how much road has already been covered with it. Or if prior owners did some sloppy jobs. Furthermore, your local bike shop will probably refuse to touch them, although they are in essence just - if unusual - bikes.
a sauna on wheels 😀
A velomobile is basically just a fully enclosed recumbent trike. The question is, how would you compare it to an unenclosed, or partially enclosed recumbent trike. Recumbent trikes without the enclosure would have much of the same comfort, but easier access and better ventilation, at the cost of poorer aerodynamics (most a problem on long flat terrain, no so much in areas where you cannot develop the speed to make use of the aerodynamic efficiency), and inferior weather protection (but with better ventilation and better visibility). The question is, with a partially enclosed recumbent trike, to what degree can you draw a balance between the advantages and disadvantages of each (depending on the environment in which you are using the vehicle)?
When the video started, I saw the trees and heard the accent and thought, "Oh, I'm pretty sure this guy's in Finland" Then, I heard the metal bumper music, and it removed all doubt :-D subscribed!
for 10 thousand € they should at least include a 10 € pc fan for clearing the hood at a standstill, operated from the lights' electric circuit
I have both Quest and Quattrovelo. What I can say is:
1-Seat confort: I find the seats very confortable on both velomobile and have no problems.
2-Stability: I have problems with stability on Quest but none at all on the QV: very stable, never had problems.
3- Sweat: I sweat a lot too, I have ventist pad and I do not seat in a puddle despite my pad is wet. I almost always take off my shirt.
4-Raining: I stay mostly dry but I sweat more so that is the problem.
5-Visibility: Very good! The QV alien hood is the best because it has great visibility and pratical when it is raining because I just have to put the manhole cover.
6-Fog: yes I have fog issues on the visor of the QV , mostly in winter.
7-Airflow: Sure, not enough airflow on hills, and even on flat road in the summer because of the heat.
8-Brakes: I have lot of downhill in my area . if the downhill is long, the brakes overheat even with the additionial disk brakes on the QV.
9-Not convenient: Yes, sure! what is most difficult for me is do repair because of limited access.
10-Speed: I agree! real work condition are different. I notice that for me It depends mostly with the air density, the less dense, the more I am fast.
in conclusion, my major concerns are brakes and airflow.
All of theses are nothing compared of the limitless pleasure I have on riding my Quattrovelo. It is an awesome velomobile!
The main issue with velomobiles is they cost more than buying a used car.
it‘s an experiment … there is a lot of space for improvement … thanks for the footage
If you want to go realy fast you should also change your tyres. Since i swapped from conti contact speed+latex to schwalbe pro one tubeless i gained 8km/h. One important thing to get faster is to keep your tyrepressure on the right spot. If you got shitty roads or regular asphalt maximum is7 bars or 100psi, if you go over this it will slow you down(i was surprised by this). Tyres make a huge difference in comfort and speed.
I can't disagree with anything you say but the most important fact is that I have a good upright carbon road bike, a good upright MTB and 2 velomobiles and the only ones I ride are the velomobiles. I could see myself getting a recumbent 2 wheeler at some point and when I get old and have trouble getting in and out of the velomobiles I could see myself getting a recumbent trike, probably with e-assist, but I can't see myself buying another upright. My Strada now has e-assist and I think that overcomes the uphill speed issue which was always a big thing for me, living in a hilly area. I thought it was cheating when I did it but really it is just making the most of what is possible and really puts a smile on my face. I am now as fast as most uprights on the uphill sections of my normal loop, not been overtaken on the flat for a very long time and faster than anything downhill. The big issue for me is transportation, particularly to races. I carry my velomobiles on the roof of my car and it is difficult to get them up there. I built a ramp that allows me to do it on my own but it takes 3 people without the ramp. You can't carry them on a train like you can an upright.
I have two recumbent bikes with fairly upright seating position. I have more drag than something more reclined, but I have no comfort issues most of the time-and that's with direct steering. I did have to put fenders on one of them, but that's in part because the mesh seatback lets moisture through so well!
ya forgot to add that I'd need to sell both kidneys n my liver to afford one!
No need for a sauna after riding then an other advantage.
Nice that you also touch on the impracticalities of a velomobile. While the fanbaseay be happy with what is available, there are still way too many car drivers, who wouldnt touch these overpriced and impractical designs with a barge pole.
I personally think that daily-use velomobiles need to be designed differently from the ground up.
I'd start with easy entry and exit in rain and eye-height at least comparable with a compact car and strong electric pedal assist for climbing hills and reaching cruise speeds without sweating. At the same time, the electric drive train allows for less exotic materials, which will have a positive impact on cost.
Great video! Many thanks. I have put about 7500Km into a DF over the last year and am generally pleased. Sweating and ventilation is an issue. One minor mod/hack I have done is to recess the horn by about 2cm (with some longer bolts and plastic spacers) so that the hole it it works through can act as a bit of an air intake. It does seem to help. I have not the skills to build an air scoop to force more air. I have wondered about riding without the derailleur cover on so see if that draws air through the body of the velomobile on hot days. If that works, maybe someone could create a louvred derailleur cover?! Sweating - I seem to reach a certain level of sweatiness and no more, no matter what the temperature. I have found that a long sleeved base layer like a Helle Hansen Dry Stripe works well. Having fabric over the elbow prevents the elbow rest getting soaked and puddles below. Works for me. Racing hood - generally good. No room for helmet inside though. The fogging issue is greatly helped by fitting a Pinlock visor. Side windows fog up on cold mornings though. Am considering some Pinlock related hack - essentially double glazing them. Glasses fogging up - yes, it happens. It used to happen on cold days on my Cruzbike too as steam rose from me at the lights. Not much to do there. Fit and seat comfort - mine is about 90% right. Lots of compromises with just fitting into the darned thing. Manufacturers - more sophisticated seat adjustment would be appreciated. I find the seat not as comfortable as on my Cruzbike. Perhaps a custom fit service (like the F1 boys have where a carbon fibre seat is moulded for them... someone would buy it!) The seat supplied does not fit me that well. Lumps in the wrong places and I like to hang my shoulder blades over the edge of seats, as I could on the Cruzbike. This is not possible on the DF. Handling and stability - When I got it the steering felt very twitchy. I am used to it now. Relax and don't fight it. Stability - feels pretty planted to the road. I have only lifted a wheel once when (rashly) making a 90 degree left turn and close to 30kmph. And that was not a bad one - just a tiny lift. Maintenance - I am getting better! Next job to change the chain tubes for some PTFE ones (from ginkgo-veloteile.de) to try to reduce that huge drive train friction. We need Haynes Manuals or equivalent! Brakes overheating - have not really had an issue. Not dragging the breaks on a descent helps. ginkgo-veloteile.de make/modify Sturmey Archer drum brakes, fitting heat sinks etc if you are struggling. I have heard they are good. Overall comfort, luggage etc. It's not a car! But it's better than a bike. That's me done!
IMHO Sturmey Archer can easily add some fins around their drums if they have the necessary machining allowance on their raw parts
You got the wrong velomobile for finland. Should have gotten a DF XL instead with open wheels snow wont stuck inside your wheel arches and you will be able to ride in Winter pretty easy with 27.5 Tyres in rear. Cuz they have a lot of room for the snow to build up. If you have extreme weather conditions and bad roads lots of hilly roads DF XL will beat all other velos. You can also buy the radical design Cyclone IV Trekking Bicycle Trailer to transport all your shoping prey about 40kg of food. Get a DF XL and all your problems will be gonne right away.
The hill problems make it a non starter for me. Shame, I've always dreamed of a 4-wheeled bicycle.
Electric assist should solve the problem
On gearing:
Velomobiles, recumbent trikes and quads have rather absurd gear requirements that stock bike components typically can't cover. This is less of a problem if you ride in mostly flat terrain and don't carry more than a light load of cargo.
For example, I am a utility rider. My bike/trike is for getting me from A to Z with a heavy load and often towing a trailer. My trike turned quad has a low of 10 gear inches for getting those loads up the local 20% grades. But to get that low kills my top end, which maxes out at ~60 gear inches for about 10-12 mph.
To get the low end I need and have a decent high would require a gear range of ~1,200%. Yes, about double the gear range of a Pinion C1.12.
Note: that this can be done with a 10-50 cassette and Schlemph mountain drive. Though that has it's own problems.
thanks Mr Heavy Metal for taking on the heavy task of speaking the inconveniant truth, so mankind can learn how to do mobility better :) ✌😎👍🌻
I personally think that daily-use velomobiles need to be designed differently from the ground up.
We really need to have velomobile dealerships.
Thanks for the awesome videos. Subscribed!
Forgive my ignorance as a newbie, but if drum brakes are a concern then is there a reason people don't fit disc brakes?
Thanks for explaining all this to someone who's never tried one before. 😊
As a newbie to the velo world, I would say compared to an upright bike, a velo is much better. Even in the hilly country of New Zealand. Less than 500 metres from my house are streets with >10% inclines. I just have to harden up for the hills. Braking down hill is not an issue, yet. One never brakes after slogging up a hill.
A problem I do have is that the velo is hard to transport. At 2.5m in length. I need a trailer. Just a hassle.
A major benefit is that on the Waikato roads of New Zealand one does not get covered in wet cow manure, on early morning road rides. The wheel arches collect it all.
Clothing options are easier. Shorts and T-shirt for anything above 10 degrees celcius, and maybe a single for anything around 10 degrees celcius. and wet weather is not a major baddie. Much drier than an upright.
Summer is almost here, and the last 30 plus degree celcius ride I did, it was warm in the velo, but still nicer than being stuck on an upright in the heat, getting fried. It wasn't as tiring.
A velo is a great choice, despite the downsides. 😄
This was an eye opening clip 👍 I agree in many points. Velomobile is very comfortable and fast to ride on fresh asphalt, but where do we have those kind of roads haha... The usual roads and cycle paths are filled with holes, seams and cracks. Quite uncomfortable with the tires like 32 front and 42 rear (DFXL) and the speed slows significantly, like Saukki stated. So, the watt discussion is really pure theory. On the other hand, I usually pass all the other cyclists very easily, even on uphill.
My butt gets tired on long distances too. Still, there's no "balls in hydraulic press" feel as with most upright bikes. I have never experienced slipping forward on the seat. My seat front end rises slightly up, don't yours? Plus, the seat is fastened with bolts to the wheel arches, so it's quite safe, too
My solution with the visibility is sunroof that DF offers as an option. Great visibility to the sides and no fogging on the windscreen. Maybe not as efficient aerodynamically as the hood, but close 😊
So don't bike so hard then, if you get so sweaty! 😀
Just kidding, I can't bike a normal speed even on normal bokes, I somehow always bike as fast as I possibly can. I think it's from my childhood, where you of course never were biking to enjoy the biking, you were always going somewhere, and you wanted to get there fast. 🙂
I wish someone would make velomobiles directly aimed at biking to work. Comfy, convenient, not that fast, and space for some fan inside for hot days.
Ooohhh, and an electric drivetrain for going up hills. I'd get that.
I think you cover it very well. I would also add that some places to ride are not so good with a velomobile. Bike paths are not so good because you have to slow down for people and other cyclists. Cities are also not so good because it can be hard to see around parked cars, lots of starting and stopping with a heavy bike. But, on a good route, a velomobile is a lot of fun. I ride a lot more now that I have my Quest XS. Once I adjusted the front wheel alignment with my bodyweight in the quest, the handling is very good and I’m much faster for lesson effort.
Your biggest problem seems to be that you are too much in a hurry and/or too fond of physical excercise. Thats not the velomobile manufacturers fault! 😁😁😁
On the serious side; My ride is not by far as fast an speedy as any of yours but still we share some of the issues; My experience is that even VERY small adjustments in body position affects ass numbness astonishingly much! I have also experienced big differences from different shoes and feet position on the pedal.
Thanks for sharing! 👍Useful as always, keep up the good work! 👍
This bike is Very expensives but this is beautifuly machine for traveling! Very interesting youtube canal!Good job!
The biggest disadvantage is the danger of rear wheel loss of traction and blowouts. The potential of a horrific crash scares me all the time.
When it's raining you are indeed still wet but much warmer and I feel more comfortable- I am able to maintain 50km/hr in my Milan SL on 165 Watts easily and did a 25 mile road loop with 177 watts average for a sub 3 hour century. 33.4mph ave on 177 watts - I did optimize with just a tiny rear mirror. Latex tubes in Gran Prix LTD tires and a 100 tooth chainring to reduce chain friction!
- Good video!
The ugly truth, literally, is that a motorcycle is so much more affordable and convenient. Just saying.
I agree with all of those issues, I live in Michigan and ride my Strada when weather is below 60 degrees F to be comfortable. It keeps me warm down into the 20s with no problems with a windshield and side windows installed. I've ridden over 10,000 miles this way, loads of fun!
I have seen other velonauts talk about the hassles of owning velos, but they have all said that they will NEVER go back to "Diamond Frames" or drive motor vehicles if they can absolutely avoid it. I am still thinking about the EQ Hawk and waiting on info about it, a fully enclosed two-person velo.
I can agree that I would never go back to upright (or upwrong) bike. But unfortunately the weather conditions here in the north do get so bad sometimes, that velomobile just isn’t feasible only mode of transportation. That’s why I still have to own a car.
Just a remark, that "velo" means bicycle in french... So, abbreviations are nice and cool and all (I guess), till u end up using an abbreviation that means something totally else...
@@klausbrinck2137, I know that velo means "bike" and that mobile means "to move" and at one time meant "car" . I am using terms that are now common within the velomobile community and are used by many riders and some builders.
@@MSSmith1022 I know why u do it, I´m just questioning the sense of it. using a word that means something familiar (bike is familiar to velomobile), but also clearly different, is a slippery path.
I agree.
Even though these vehicles have elements from other “machines?”, they deserve a clever and trendy name all to themselves, despite the fact that it’s been used for years.
“Velomobiles” is awkward.
We’re a clever bunch. If we were to brainstorm about it, we could come up with something better. And shorter. And unique. And universal(language/culture, etc).
My MTB commuter is better because I'm not at bumper height. I can see over cars and see road hazards better. I'm more visible to cars driving beside me. I can maneuver much, much, much better. I can ride between cars or jump a curb to ride or walk on the sidewalk when it's safer or faster to do so. I can always find a parking space. I can ride a bus. I have exactly the right amount of aerodynamics and speed needed for city commuting. I can stop and add or remove a shirt or rain gear in a few seconds. I can easily hitch up my trailer and pull heavy or bulky loads that impress onlookers. My big trailer is 7 feet x 3 feet. I can walk up or down hills when needed. And I can replace it for $200. Velos are expensive toys. And they look like a penis.
Thank you for your excellent videos: I am thinking of the Katanga waw E for some occasional holiday travelling as worried that quattromobile too heavy, I am 189xm and 91kg, any thoughts ? Many Thanks
Thank you for giving me actuall information about these. I am planning on making an all weather pedal powered vehical and velo's seemed the way to go. I am going to focus a bit more on internal comfort and stability over speed.
You missed two pretty major points: usability in urban space and cost.
If I mainly drove around in villages or quiet suburbs AND had a garage to properly store a velomobile and do some of the service myself, it might be a good idea to have one.
Urban traffic with its frequent stops, however, is not where they shine. Parking one in the city centre will be interesting, too - they're too bulky for the sidewalk but will probably be crushed when parked between cars.
Then, there is the cost issue.
Yes, they're cheaper to operate a car... but is that an honest benchmark? With what you said about sweating, velomobiles are no viable option for a commute to the office as most offices do not have suitable off-street parking, a shower and a wardrobe.
So they are a hobby, and quite an expensive one.
I love the idea of highly efficient cycling, so I really want to like velomobiles - but these two really are deal breakers to me.
With limited space within the velomobile, I am confident several mechanical advantages could be up graded in it's design to increase comfort and reduce excessive jarring from road conditions. The changes don't have to necessarily add weight.
Saukki? I haven't spoke to you in quite a while...What is your favorite bike right now? Gearing set up? Etc...
Since you are a velomobile expert, and have personally ridden many different models, which model would you recommend to a first-time owner???
Thanks
I learned a lot about velomobiles. I actually did not know anything about them but they are a covered bike. You did not mention how inconvenient it is to get the velomobile to a place you want to ride, if you are not starting from your home on it. It is not fitting in my Leaf trunk. Another major terror is trying to ride this in the bike lanes in USA cities. The bike lanes are narrow and these velomobiles would just barely fit.
You're basically riding around grinding and impacting your lower back while you exert yourself. What could go wrong?
I'm just back home from Malmö with a Leiba Cargo (1200 km trip) and I must say that ventilation is pretty good (even in hot days), much better than on a standard bike but not as good as an AC car, of course.
This specific model has a passenger seat that offer a lot of storage space, which I love.
Entering and getting out of it is also very easy, and it even has a small passenger door (which is lovely!).
I'm debating whether I should cut round holes in my driver seat, to help with ventilation (the mesh would cover it). Or maybe add a layer of breathable cotton to the mesh?
This specific model has most parts visible and accessible, as well. So, it's less sporty but quite functional when service is needed.
I'll need to change the front light, though (not powerful enough). Any recommendation?
Thanks again for providing such valuable information on the velomobile topic!
Lot's of nice heavy music in this one, nice.
However with heavy music there should be flames on the hood and smoke on the road.
Not all these colors..
Still wish I’d bought one a decade or more before I did.
I’ve found that I stay pretty dry with the race hood on - but I clearly don’t put out as much power as you do 🤪
Well, if lived in Europe, I'd definitely get one. But on North American eight-lane city streets, I'm not so sure...
Of course, the main problem with velomobiles is their rarity, especially outside Europe. Here in North America they would simply be an oddity, like riding a unicycle to work. (In fact, unicycles are more common.) I think there was one little store here in Toronto that sold them, but it appears to have shut down. This means that even if someone was interested, there's nowhere to go to even try one out. It also means they are overpriced - if they were less than $8K then MAYBE you'd start to get more interest. Maybe sticking a lithium battery in there to help with climbs, and more powerful brakes or some sort of governor for downhills which would also charge the batteries.
As for sweating - dress for the cold weather like you would for cycling. (But Finns would know all about this). In the warm weather, perhaps make the shell removable - just held on by some latches so you could take it off. Most people would be happy to trade a bit of speed for comfort, and not be locked into a claustrophobic little shell when the weather is nice. Plus it would be a lot easier for servicing the mechanism down below.
Yes, velomobiles are quite expensive and are only sold to the die hard fans. I had a velomobile, but I returned to cycling trikes.
Cheaper at roughly 50 % of the price of a velomobile.
Cooler then a velomobiles, due to the wind.
Easier to get on and off.
Less weight uphill.
Easy maintenance.
Trikes can be folded, so easy transport in cars, or planes, or busses, or trains.
Trikes can be fitted with a motor, I cycled 132 km/ 82 miles with 25 kg/ 55 lbs luggage with my motorized trike last summer.
Do not get me wrong, velomobiles are excellent for travelling extreme long distance in the flat countryside, at high speed.
For dirt biking we use something called "spit" that works pretty good for anti-fogging the plastic/glass lenses on your helmet, I imagine it'd work really well for the visors on these, you do have to reapply it every few hours but it's certainly better than nothing!
Turning radius, cannot reverse easily, need more maintenance than normal upright bikes…
Turning radius is worse than an upright but is rarely an issue. I have had issues where there are barriers at the start of cycle paths that mean I have to get out and manually manoeuvre through the gap but that is rare and is mainly an issue that town planners have a blinkered picture of what a cycle looks like. I am comfortable riding my velomobiles on the road so it rarely a problem. My Strada has open wheel wells and so a tighter turning circle so is easier than the Milan but I have been able to do a u-turn in the road in the Milan without getting out before, just. The Strada has open foot holes so reversing is easy. I don't agree about the maintenance. Your mechanical components are protected from dirt so should last longer. Maintenance can be more difficult, as Saukki mentioned, but I don't think you need to do it more often. The design on most new velos is currently to put a hatch in the front that makes it a lot easier to get to the front mech and my Milan GT also has storage bins in the front which is a real bonus.
@@surrey-velo2419 I should’ve mentioned I live in a city where streets are narrow and not a lot of well built or designed cycle paths. The maintenance issue for me was things like chain drops, lights didn’t work properly after 2 years of riding, chain tubes did not held in place and got chewed and also the idler broke off, gear tuning…I’m quite happy with my DF, but wished the components were more robust. Or after all is the rider’s issues hahaha.
Agree with all of your points. Velomobiles are great machines but have their drawbacks. Biggest issue i had with my velomobile was 90 degree turns and reaching the buttons for bicycle traffic lights. Other than that they are easily the best bicycles there are for most journeys except for steep climbs. I usually rode around 35-40km/h with my velomobile (mango) with the same effort i ride an upright bike at 25km/h and with much more comfort and protection from the weather. I don't have mine anymore (nowhere to store it) but do want to buy another one in the future.
You need to test the M9, it has real room and is extremely comfortable. I have one, I'm 6 foot and weight 220 pounds and this is without a doubt the best bike for those of us who have large frames. My DFXL is a great bike, but it doesn't have the room and comfort the M9 has.
Yeah, well, I think I'll just stick with my E-Bike and some good rain gear. And as they seem to be limited to roads mostly, I'd surely miss my way back from work through the woods.
Here's an idea for carrying stuff: see if Quattrovelo will make a Quattrotrailer with onboard braking, solar charging and power assist...?
You would think that the addition of heated visors/mirrors and solar powered fans would drastically improve the rider experience.
I strongly believe that Velomobiles with 2 horsepower electric motors and people with solar panels would do a lot of the work towards cleaning up the environment. Most people drive 3,000 pound cars to move a person that weighs less than 200 pounds. That is very wasteful.
It's Called RAINX A windshield water repailent I used on motorcycle helmets face shield and car windshield good stuff water just rolls off. You actually can see the road.
The main problem with a velomobile is you can't have sex (except with yourself) in the back seat.
Can velomobile makers implant heat-resistive defoggers into the windshields, connectable to a battery?
Overall, velomobiles to me look like very good DIYs, even though they cost more than a small car. That rare drivetrain suspension: put an anodized coating on it at least, to make it look more professional.
i wonder if ul get demonetized for the cursing 6:26 hahaha. i seriously love ur english accent bro, even though i had to slow down the speed to 1.25 from my usual avg 1.75 because ur english sounds like ur speaking so fucking fast, like another language. heeheehee
I´m reminded of some pizza sauce spilled in one of your velomobike videos which indicates yet another disadvantage :)
Thanks man I was contemplating getting to build a mark t ford life the Finland one on you tube but sounds like a push bike and a year drop camper trailer might be better?
**still want one 😂🔥🏴🙏
i think it is very interesting transportation device, but extremely dangerous on roads with cars. where i live motorcycle, bicycle and pedestrians get killed on the side of the road. Velopod are only 50cm tall so it seems to be ALOT more dangerous than other modes of transportation.
a question for you if you don’t mind:
Some day I WILL do a round the world record attempt in a human powered vehicle (probably a velomobile) and want to work out roughly what speed i will achieve at 150 watts on the flat? What do you think in your experience?
Well there’s so many things effecting to the speed. But you can try to use Kreuzotter speed & power calculator to estimate roughly what it could be.
@@TheVelomobileChannel thanks!
I didn't have the issue with the sweat pools, and the sliding down the seat wasn't as bad as yours.
But yeah, the maintenance! When your chain falls off the gear, and it's almost totally enclosed, you are fu##ed.
Finally the truth.
Here in Athens I suspect a velonauts life would be measured in minutes in the summer
Thinking back to a winter commuting in a Kingcycle Quattro (prototype 4 wheel front wheel drive) velomobile the biggest advantage I found was even when it was really cold outside I was warm and cozy inside, stayed sweaty dry and could carry loads of work kit int he big boot. 👍🏻
Thanks to the Hydraulic Press Channel I can easily recognize a Finnish accent.
I am looking at getting a velomobiles for 7 mile trip to store for food which would you recomend i ride a upright bike 25 miles a day at 70 years old
When climbing, open up your hood (unless it's sunny). On downhills, a parachute can be convenient. Also, Ginkgo Veloteile supplies XL-SD drums (90mm) with cooling fins, which can be very useful in FINland ;)
Why not have a 4inch hole at the front and the back for ventilation?
Probably wouldn’t effect the Cd too much.
Try installing a Zero Breeze 2 battery powered air conditioner! It could reduce the sweating a lot and would be a nice experiment that would gain a lot of views.
Upright bikes have more versatility and are easy to transport or store in small spaces. They are much safer due to the agility and better visibility. I would choose upright bike any day.
Why not put a 49cc water cooled engine in the back or an electric one at this point?
The next step for motorcycles is cockpits because imo they have reached the limit when it comes to speed and safety, past that it just becomes stupid and ineficient.
I know it has been done already but a smoll electric/combustion engine + the great aerodynamics might make it a cool all year commuter, and if u keep it below 50cc and keep the pedals u can drive/ride it whitout a license.
What would your dream velomobile be like, which you would like to build yourself?
Consider some turning lessons with these things. One of these ran into me head on around a corner due to speed and loss of control. Sent me to ER. Could’ve killed me, but I have a hard head. Warning: hard to turn around corners. Slow down at corners until you see your exit and maintain traction. Otherwise, you can kill somebody.
Design wise this has been what is putting me off - postural alignment is a hazard to rider for prolonged use. We evolved to be upright…
I would prefer a bicycle or recumbent trike as want the wind in my hair. I don't like my turbo trainer for the same reason wouldn't like a velomobile, no airflow
Came for the strange looking dry salt lake speed run without a motor vehicle, stayed for the metal and the fun accent.
Hi Saukki. Are there any clubs or events in Finland for recumbent bikes?
Too bad we can't ride a velomobile here. First, it's hot here most of the year. Second, the streets and roads are not prepared to accommodate these vehicles. I can barely ride a bike on the bike lanes. But I remain a huge fan of this vehicle.
While I would love to use one, they are clearly not yet a practical transportation solution.
Thanks for a realistic view of using one.
I would look at getting pinlock inserts from motorcycle helmet visors as even when in heavy rain and cold (fogging weather) the visor stays completely clear even when fully closed. 👍🏻
Why woulnt they put some sort of fan inside.. i can thjnk of at least 3 ways to run it off of the existing equipment.
For your neck pain, wear a neck brace like F1 drive cuz you are one with pedals
I assume you have no suspension, the ergonomics is always key.
I think that "looking down" like you are doing in that position causes the strain. Just as looking up can cause strain in upright.
I love this video. It is an invitation to the industry and newcomers to take the things that are great about velomobiles and address the shortcomings.
A couple of years ago, I bought a hard back seat to replace the mesh seat on my trike. I always felt like I was going to slide out of it so I went back to the OEM seat. I recently had a friend fabricate some "wings" or bolsters from aluminum plate (1/4") to help hold me more securely. Waiting for my wife to heal (she cut her thumb badly) so she can make some covers for them. I will then install them and remount the seat for testing. It felt good sitting on the garage floor, but have to see how it feels in actual use.
do you have some wattage numbers in the same conditions as a upright bicycle then? since manufacturers claim certains speeds at certain wattage, the more interesting thing would be to point to the improvement from other alternatives of travel