Check out the other Steins;Gate episodes of Anime Science! PhoneWave: th-cam.com/video/66gogP7wibs/w-d-xo.html Time Leap Machine: th-cam.com/video/IMkFM6ye4UQ/w-d-xo.html
Truly _outstanding_ analysis. But you missed one crucial element to Steins;Gate time travel theory: attractor fields. Okabe doesn't fail to save Mayuri because he cannot change world lines. Through a combination of D-mails and time leaps he causes several significant world line divergences. However, all these many world lines still converge at the same point: Mayuri's death and the rise of CERN. The way attractors work in physics is they cause trajectories within a dynamic system to evolve conditionally given similar starting conditions. Probably the most famous attractor is the Lorenz attractor, which forms the basis of the "butterfly effect". Nudging the starting coordinates of a particle within a Lorenz system will cause its trajectory to loop back in a predicable manner again and again. But nudge it too far and eventually the trajectory will diverge onto a new, likely unpredictable path. That is what Okabe be needed to do at the end when he caused world lines to diverge over 1%, shifting himself from the Alpha attractor field to the Beta attractor field (the latter containing world lines that converge upon a new point: Kurisu's death and the start of WWIII).
Time machines don't go back in the same world line. They open a new one. It's just that whenever we see anyone use the time machine to go back to the past, they either can't change anything significant (so the characters we actually follow don't perceive a change and Reading Steiner isn't activated), or the characters we follow are actually *in* the time machine so we perceive the change with them. There are no paradoxes or stable time loops in Steins Gate. Even if Suzuha, say, killed Daru in SG0, it wouldn't be a paradox: the Suzuha who killed him was still born, just in the future of the previous world line. It only means that in the current world line, where Daru is dead, Suzuha won't be born again. In this sense, the world line we perceive in episode 1 isn't the same as the one we perceive in 24. It's an exact replica. The Okabe that we don't see in episode 1 (but who we now know is there) has already gone through what the Okabe we do follow in ep. 1 is about to go through. Same relations between those two in episode 24. Basically it's not a loop to the same world line, but an infinite continuation: in episode 1, one Okabe sends the d-mail and shifts to the alpha trajectory, while the Okabe who killed Kurisu jumps forward, skips the divergence, and lands in the beta trajectory. Go through the events of 0 again (that's a whole other explanation) and you eventually arrive in the second half of SG episode 23, where Mayuri slaps Okabe, operation Skuld is relayed to August Okabe and the exact same thing I described in the previous paragraph occurs, only this time, August Okabe jumps forward, skips the divergence, but lands in Steins Gate instead of beta. The Okabe that sent the d-mail and shifted to alpha will go through the show again, eventually ending in Steins Gate as well.
I'd like to know how much of this information you got from sources (game;anime;manga sequels and OVAs). About the 0 events, yes, and future Okabe tells him "the next three weeks will be the most difficult of your life", because he has to relive all the time travel events depicted in the original series, all the deaths of Mayuri again, because to deviate might trigger an unpredictable "Butterfly Effect". But this time he'll know there's a world-line where both Mayuri and Kurisu live, which hopefully makes it bearable. I remember them talking about avoiding paradoxes, perhaps it was in the movie. But the world-lines aren't totally separate. They form "attactor fields" which inter-relate and at times "leak" into one another. Suzuha might be able to kill Daru, but it would have reverberations throughout different world lines, and possibly unpredictably bad effects. At the least, Suzuha would have a chance of disappearing as starts to happen with Okabe in the movie. Some fans don't accept the movie as canon, but I don't think fans have the right to pick and choose like that.
@@squirlmy Oh wow lmao, this is an old comment😅 So this information isn't official, but it's the result of me watching both Steins;Gate and Zero (without the LN or the movie), and loving the show enough to form in my head a time travel theory that made sense with the events of the story. It's not official in any capacity and you can think what you want of course
Yeah this is what I thought too. I thought Steins;Gate had a linear approach to time travel, meaning there's no loops. If Suzuha killed Daru it wouldn't cause a paradox because that Suzuha comes from another timeline meaning yeah in that timeline Suzuha wouldn't be born but it wouldn't affect the Suzuha from the other timeline. But a problem with that is that during the show they mention multiple times that paradoxes can occur, which was my main gripe with the time-travel system cause it just didn't make sense to me at least in my interpretation of the timeline system.
@@opolo704 Anonymous;Code explained flat out how it works. It does indeed have a linear approach. But for very different reasons. They also make paradoxes impossible.
Absolute brainwaves :) I just love Steins;Gate, it's the best sci-fi piece of a culture ever! And probably the biggest reason, why I love it so much, is that believable, logical and realistic science introduced in that universe! Thanks, you deserve more views!
This is the best one that I have ever seen about the Steins gate. You really deserve more views man and I kind a feel really sad that u didn't get all the appreciation that you deserved.😟
basically if a real time machine can really travel you back to the past in the same word lines, it basically means you already did an time loop, meaning really if you decided to use the time travel machine to go back in time, then you already did in the past but you just didn't know it happened only your future self will know
@@WolfborggHey, let's say I now have the time machine with these black holes inside and have built a machine that basically ensures that I can travel to a certain time. How am I supposed to control it because I can't create a black hole that takes me exactly to that time, can I?
Steins;Gate truly is one of the most amazing masterpieces I have ever seen. You need to watch it twice and in order to fully understand and appreciate it
I like sci-fi anime that is very realistic in terms of scientific accuracy. I think the entire Science Adventure series does this a tad bit while sprinkling some of its really well made stories and horror sci-fi with a bit of scientific realism. If you liked Steins;Gate, you should check out Chaos;Head, Anonymous;Code (which hasn't released yet but you can read the synopsis on Wikipedia), and all the other Science Adventure Team games/anime. Speaking of which, the Steins;Gate visual novel game actually goes into a LOT and I mean A LOT more detail in its concepts of time travel, and you could be sitting there for 15 minutes on an interesting scientific explanation with the song titled "Explanation" playing in the background the whole time, lol.
This is a great video omg It just made me think back about how I binged the entire two seasons in three days. I want to do it again now, just for the holiday season c:
Thank you so freaking much for explaining this in an easy to understand way Im currently making a minecraft SMP called the "leaves from the vine SMP" (LFTV SMP for short) with a boatload of lore. Ive split the lore up into chapters, each chapter has storybeats that lead into one another even though each chapter lasts about 1-2 years, currently I'm working on chapters 3 and 4, which will not only have time travel but world line's aswell For instance, a small streamer who agreed to join my SMP, named Mev Bushwacker, is from a different worldline, a world completely different from the SMP world, so he's travelling through space when him and his mates get sucked into a black hole strangely different from the others theyve seen and thrown into the SMP world into chapter 3 On top of that, one of the characters in the SMP is the goddess of time, so im setting up different versions of the SMP world for her to time travel to and hopefully change something in the future to save everything from immanent doom
As an amateur physicist I find this video crazy interesting and inspiring. I've been trying to write out my own explanation to how time travel in steins gate works, and this brought out a few points I was hoping to develop. Thank you :D also, that whole spiel at the end about mozzarella sticks is... freaky relatable. I live on mozzarella sticks, and that's exactly the kind of way I would describe it to someone hahaha
I always wondered about that little sentence 'when you bend spacetime...' I immediately think - bending in what; even more space? You need space to bend something, anything. So the idea of bending space itself naturally raises some questions for me.
bends in and on itself... imagine a cube (3D), then imagine that all sides, angles and lines of it curves inside into the center of mass of it, Thats is the curvature of space created by the mass of the cube itself, gravity is what an observer on the surfarce of the cube will experience (falling and accelerating towards the center of mass of the cube).
time bending is because space and time are relative to each other, meaning that if you curve space and you travel through the curvature you will travel a longer distance than if it wasn´t bend (ie a straight line), as such, time has to run faster to keep relative and compesate for the extra distance you travel in that curved space.
@@chottomatekudasai-kun3887 Thank you. While reading your comments I remember this vagually from a book about Einstein's thought experiments that I've read a long time ago.
Wouldn’t time travel using a black hole prevent you from going back before the black hole was created? The way I thought of it was as follows: If you are using the gravitational warping effects of the event horizon to go back, you are dependent on its gravitational field existing in that time to keep going back. Like how for time dilation to occur near a black hole, you have to be in its gravitational field to keep going forward.
You forgot to mention the part in steins;gate how using an electron gun on a kerr black hole rips away the event horizion revealing the singularity. Half of this has already been theorized in science. If a kerr black hole spins faster than it's maximum velocity of .99, it's event horizon will rip away and reveal the singularity. This video talks about spinning black holes. th-cam.com/video/fu3645D4ZlI/w-d-xo.html
Yeah that stuff is a part of what I'm covering in the part 2 video for this topic, which talks about all of the info for how Steins;Gate uses the TV and microwave to do this. Also thanks for the video! Lots of useful info.
Yeah, i was just playing that part in the Steins Gate Elite and i must say science in Steins;Gate is pretty similar to the on in the real world, but the main divergence is the concept of naked singularity. In our world it can't exist because it would break the theory of relativity( Kurisu even says this in the VN). There is a formula to calculate the maximum speed of rotation of the black hole. As its spin increases the radius of event horizon decreases and radius of ring singularity increases. The black hole speed limit is reached when the radius of the event horizon is near or equal to the radius of the ring singularity, which prevents the singularity from becoming revealed or naked. This is my guess but the this maximum speed depends on the mass of the black holes because the radius of the event horizon depends on the mass. This is not only theoretical but was rather observer on many black holes that spin near their calculated speed limit. (th-cam.com/video/SMrwHnow3hk/w-d-xo.html) By the way all black holes are spinning black holes and should have ring singularity in them(i say should because we cant never measure nor see further than the event horizon), because all the stars from which these black holes originate have an angular momentum, therefore given the law of conservation of angular momentum it stands to reason that these black holes also rotate. Point singularity never actually forms due to strong centrifugal force of its spin(again this is due to conservation of angular momentum - where the smaller things get the faster they spin and black holes get pretty small). Of course if some theories like loop quantum gravity are proven correct( i don't know much about this theory though), naked singularity becomes possible in reality.
So. Good video, a lot of fun stuff going on but I have one issue with it. A lot of terminology that has nothing to do with eachother was thrown around together. Example: Wormholes and Ringularities, they have nothing to do with eachother, they are two separate entities and work in two different ways. So far the only known and calculated way to travel in time is by entering the event horizon of a ringularity in a trajectory that misses said ringularity. Causing you to move forwards in time at an extreme rate, or rather, your clock ticking 99.9% slower than the rest of the universe. I've never heard of any theory regarding two separate event horizons on a Ringularity, and things don't just "Flip" in the universe. I couldn't find anything on that in the sources you cite as well. Last but not least, things don't just FALL into a black hole, gravity doesn't disappear the moment you enter an event horizon, you can technically orbit the black hole AT the event horizon, you can also enter said event horizon at a specific trajectory (Mentioned above) and exit just fine (Bar anything happening that we don't know within the event horizon). I would've loved it if you mentioned more about Chaos Theory and the Butterfly Effect that the show heavily relies on as well, they are intrinsic parts of the Time Travel used in steins gate.
You here, are worthy of the Steins;Gate! Fwuhaha! I applaud your efforts as a Mad Scientist for sharing your thoughts on the brilliant theories and *mad* science of Thy Steins;Gate!
The idea of not being able to change the past with the time machine is just wrong, in the anime concept. Every time you time travel, you end up in a different worldline, though extremely similar. Suzuha in Beta retrieves the IBN 5100 in 1975 and prevents the Y2K in 2000 from happening (stuff that did happen on her worldline). You can make past events go differently so to change worldline and that's what Okabe too eventually does, so I miss your point. He makes Kurisu live and prevents Nakabachi from brining her papers to Russia. But he tricks his past self in a way that his past self can go on to experience all he originally has experienced, thus completing the loop of him saving her and changing worldlines. There will always be the timeline (inactive) where Kurisu dies killed by Okabe, meaning that past cannot be actually changed, but the active worldline can be shifted to one where it doesn't happen, effectively changing the perceived past. Okabe doesn't make it the first time because he doesn't have the resolve, the information, the knowledge he acquires after the event, but if he had them in the first place, he would've succeeded at the first try.
There's a large number of problems that the actual time machine presents, which I'm planning to talk about after my next video focusing on the time leap machine. Like you said, the main thing to understand when we talk about "changing the past" in terms of Steins;Gate is that we just mean to change worldlines, since the worldlines themselves cannot be altered. This means technically speaking none of the time machines actually change the events of a worldline, all they allow for is different modes of shifting through worldlines. While D-Mails can instantly shift worldlines, if he didn't have Okabe's Reading Steiner ability then the D-Mail would not seem to do anything in his perspective since his memories would change with the worldline. However with both the time leap machine and the actual time machine, we aren't changing worldlines but going into the past of the current worldline where we can make changes to it which from that point on make the worldline diverge from where we were before we used the devices. This is why when they use the actual time machine a second time to stop Kurisu's death they don't interact with themselves from when they went back the first time. As the show presents, the time leap machine doesn't allow for big enough changes to significantly change the worldline, such as preventing a death. This is something which apparently the actual time machine can do but only if Okabe tricks his past-self, which is where the logic of the show gets fuzzy. If in order to solidify this worldline shift then we had to change perception of events that day, sure this would be fine for Okabe being tricked but Kurisu's death would still be in place because Suzuha had brought the time machine to them in the first place because they recognized the events of Kurisu's death resulted in the start of the future war. Meaning the loop wouldn't be fixed with only Okabe being tricked but literally everyone from the future of this worldline as well. They would all have to believe Kurisu had died that day but hadn't really. For awhile I figured the solution to Kurisu's death at the end of the show would imply Kurisu never actually died before all the time travelling started and that she miraculously survives but because Okabe shifts worldlines at the beginning of the show with the D-Mail we never know for sure. However this kind of goes downhill after Okabe makes the choice to undo his D-Mail which saves Kurisu in order to save Mayuri, because after that Suzuha still appears with the actual time machine and says the events of Kurisu's death caused the war. To clarify, the actual time machine itself has a few things that make it distinct: 1. You can go forward or backwards along the current worldline 2. You aren't bound by your past existence in time 3. You can co-exist at the same time as your past-self None of these changes necessarily give it more power to shift worldlines than the time leap machine, as both require the user to make changes themselves which would shift the worldline. That means technically speaking there's no real reason the time leap machine couldn't accomplish the same results aside from any issues with how far back you can use it. That implies that the main factor for solidifying the worldline shift is perception of events, since you can't inhabit your past body, change events, and also perceive these new events as the old events. But then again the perception of everyone else involved would also affect it. And also where would the rules of perception end? What if a bug saw the original events of Kurisu's death, would that mean none of this works unless their perspective is changed as well? The fact that Suzuha says the events of Kurisu's death caused the war is the root of most problems with what happened in the end of Steins;Gate. And the main solution to that I can think of was that she never actually died from that event, although she may have died later while the events of the original day of her death still sparked the war. After all, what really starts the war is Nakabachi stealing Kurisu's time travel papers. But there's another issue with this entirely that doesn't get talked about as much: the metal upa. While we know the real reason the war starts, the papers only survive a plane accident because Kurisu had put Mayuri's metal upa into the envelope before it was stolen. In the final jump back in time, Okabe prevents the war by swapping the metal upa with a different one which will burn with the papers. This singular event, regardless of whether or not Kurisu actually dies, is what saves the lives of millions of people, which vastly alters the worldline and means when they go back Suzuha and the actual time machine will not be there. So technically speaking the actual time machine's existence is a paradox the moment the upas get swapped, since it shouldn't exist anymore, but the show makes it look like all the final changes aren't confirmed until they go back to the future. The logic with that is weird because what stops them from just never going back to the future? But I guess that's detracting from the point, which is that if these changes needs to be solidified through changing perception of events then the perception of everyone affected by those killed in the future war would need to also be changed. If we assume however that the perception of events recognized by those in the future of a prior worldline don't need to be changed, and only the perception of those while we're in the past changing events up until we use the actual time machine to go into the future, then ideally you would need to change an event, tricking the perceptions of those involved, and then immediately going back to the future to confirm the change. Meaning they could interacting with Kurisu to prevent the war and her death then using the actual time machine to confirm that change before Okabe in the past is supposed to perceive Kurisu dying in the first place. But again you still have the problem of where the idea of perception ends. Does a fly seeing the events ruin everything? What about the perceptions of those you're changing the events of? The main idea with the actual time machine is that it can travel along the current worldline, allow you to change events, then going to the future of that shifted worldline you just moved to through those new events. Problem is that in the show these time travel events still happen on that previous worldline, as we see at the very beginning where Kurisu has already interacted with future Okabe. If it actually worked, those events would only happen on the new worldline, so Kurisu wouldn't have interacted with future Okabe at the beginning of the story. Which implies the actual time machine works through closed timelike curves, which basically loops events to have always happened on that worldline. Which would mean the ending reveals Kurisu never died in the first place and the war never started, and that if Okabe never sent the D-mail at the beginning nothing would've happened. But as I said, even that idea causes issues with what the show presents. In the end, the only accurate conclusions I can come to when I think about all this is that Kurisu never died from the incident and the future war never actually starts, and that all the actual time machine did was change the future Okabe's understanding of what could've happened on that day so he'd know to not send the D-mail at the very beginning. Meaning nothing actually changed in the original worldline except for future Okabe's perception of events due to Reading Steiner. The future war starting despite the incident at the conference is likely just a plot hole meant to conclude the story while presenting messages about perception overall, which is fine by me. It's either all that or Okabe's perception loop never meant anything for changing worldlines with the actual time machine and they could've changed it without trying to trick past Okabe but just didn't, probably because of the limited uses they had on the actual time machine at that point. Although the message from Okabe in the far future implies that his past perception was important. So it's tough to tell but either way the actual time machine has a bunch of logical problems, mostly presented by conflicts with its use in the story. The main benefit of the actual time machine seems to be experiencing events in the past or future of the current worldline, but that it doesn't actually let you change events only fulfill time loops which you would always complete anyways. Anyways, the actual time machine is a much larger conversation than people think, especially if you take into account info outside of the original Steins;Gate anime. A lot of what I just covered here I'll probably explain better when my video for that gets done but it might be awhile. Hopefully I was able to accurately explain my views on that more, not just for you but for others that have brought up similar concerns. I do intend to talk about them all in the future video.
@@Wolfborgg I don't get your connection to "perception". In the first series, no one's perception except Okabe's matters. The reason why his past perception of Kurisu's death matters, is because the resulting first D-mail is intercepted by SERN. If Kurisu didn't die, SERN wouldn't be alerted that Okabe has a time machine, in fact the contrary, his wrong prediction indicates his D-mails didn't work. The limit of uses of the time machine are important, although one could argue that directly stopping SERN's spying might be more effective, although there might be a higher chance that SERN would figure out such an action. You might say in that case, the perceptions of SERN members matters, but I'd argue that's only because they themselves are documenting time travel. Would a fly's perception matter?- there's a remote chance that the fly might do something triggering a "Butterfly Effect", but the chances of that are very low. Normally the difference a fly's actions make are negligible, anyways. But consider after the events of Steins;Gate 0, Okabe will have to relive all the time travelling events of the first series, and he will do so as exactly as he can, because of the chance of Butterfly events happening if he doesn't. One of the fun things, is writing the story itself was like an exercise in time travel. The writer goes back, reviews his writing and then make changes. and this might effect later parts of the story, and the whole plot might be have to be re-written. Time travel serves as a metaphor for story writing, in fact I think it's much better to perceive it that way, than to make comparisons to "scientific" time travel possibilities. And that also happens when writing any fiction; flashbacks and connecting events of past to the present or future, it's not just time travel stories.
@@squirlmy The ending of Steins;Gate to save Kurisu was to "deceive the world" by keeping the perceived events the same as initally experienced but altering the result. As in Okabe originally thought he saw a dead Kurisu. The attractor field where she actually is dead is Beta. The one where she's alive but Mayuri dies is Alpha. And according to the ending of the story itself, the only way to correct this is by creating a new attractor field between the two where he believes Kurisu died but she actually didn't. My point above is how this logic is flawed because Okabe's perception wouldn't actually be the only determining factor of solidifying a change. He's the only one who can notice the changes because of Reading Steiner, but that does not mean only his perception matters, especially when making a change via the Actual Time Machine where the actions done after using it become solidified on the tineline unless overridden by another time machine. If I'm Okabe and I believe that I just have to fool my past self into seeing something and then I can change anything else entirely, then the point of attractor fields as a concept becomes a joke. There wouldn't actually be this worldline-related fate that prevents Kurisu or Mayuri from easily being saved. But according to the story we were presented, that's supposed to be a critical component of the attractor fields. So if you have to "deceive the world" to get it to work, then it would not just be past Okabe they need to convince. According to the story at least. I did a video on attractor fields a few months ago and most of this stuff I think would be far more easier to make changes than the show makes it out to be. Again, it's mostly just rules for a drama plot, which I don't mind. Also even if Kurisu didn't die, SERN would still have the first D-mail that was sent. In fact they SERN intercepting the D-mail about Kurisu's impending death is what shifts them to Alpha and therefore prevents her from dying. Which was why they needed the IBN to use it to delete it from SERN, which then shifts the worldline by making a change in the present.
@@squirlmy Think of it like this: if you believe Okabe's perception of Kurisu's death only mattered so he would send a D-mail for SERN to intercept, then why did they need to do anything related to Kurisu's death? All they'd have to do is send a D-mail for SERN to intercept. So obviously that's not what the story was trying to go for with that.
So about your CTC part. You are basically implying the Bootstrap paradox and it works for Okabe, but what about Suzuha? She came to the past using a time machine and changed it in such a way that WW3 doesn't exist and she doesn't have to travel back.... a grandfather paradox. Unlike Okabe, her original past and changed past contradicts each other. So what's the explanation for that? (I have been looking for answer all day)
The only answer I could come with that suzuha came from ww3 and altered the past to prevent ww3 thus resulting in different future where going back to past isn't necessary... Both the world exist, one with ww3 happening and another with not happening In fact, there are infinite possibilities therefore infinite worlds. I think steins gate's worldline system is kind of flawed... Only solution to a perfect time travel system is existence of infinite universe... You should see Rick and Morty, there time travel concept is perfect...
Remember before the WW3 crisis, there was the SERN dystopian crisis. I think it's likely some equally bad event might happen that would still motivate her to time travel. Mayuri's death isn't the only key event that cannot be changed, perhaps the time travel itself is inevitable. Also, they are travelling from world line to world line, and the time machine allows Suzuha to live in a separate world line. It even allows a traveller to co-exist with their past self, which is something that never comes up with D-mail consciousness travel. OTOH, Okabe's initial emotional breakdown at the futility of changing the future doesn't make much sense when Suzuha, who has decades more knowledge of how time travel can work, is standing in front of him with a time machine! She's the authority on how it might or might not work, not Okabe. In fact she has Okabe's specific knowledge from his future self when she leaves. How can he deny this?
It's coming! I've been busy and trying really hard to make sure the next parts make sense. I had the script for part 2 done and part 3 started before I got really busy. Now that I've returned to them I'm trying to really edit the part 2 script again so that it's better.
so what if i went back in time and i killed my past self? or at least the grandad paradox, if i went to kill my grandfather so then my father wouldn't of existed, so then i wouldn't either. woundt that just change timelines like steins gate, one where my grandad was never killed and another where he was killed and i never lived, meaning that i changed the timeline in the past and when i go to my original timeline, its the one where he didn't die.
In theory, an event like that would just result in a worldline wherein you were never born, yes. Through the lens of Steins;Gate, how this change is perceived depends on which device is used. If you use the Phonewave to do it and have Okabe's Reading Steiner ability, then you immediately shift into the worldline where you don't exist. If you don't have Reading Steiner, then you won't experience any change but if it worked then the existence of a worldline where your grandfather died early would be confirmed to exist. It wouldn't exactly create that worldline, it's more that it affected the worldline when it was supposed to, since technically infinite worldlines exist, it's just a matter of shifting into them. The Time Leap Machine wouldn't work for this experiment at all because you'd need to exist at the current time to transfer your memories into your past body. Meanwhile the Actual Time Machine might be able to accomplish this while not affecting you even without Reading Steiner, but there's actually a lot of problems with the Actual Time Machine which I plan to cover in a future video. Technically it travels along the current worldline, but you can jump anywhere in the past or future along it. But once you arrive, your actions begin to shift you into a different worldline. Ideally your actions shift the worldline, and then you use it to travel back to the future to see the results. However, the show implies with the ending operation that the device is subject to the rules of closed timelike loops. Meaning that your actions with the Actual Time Machine had always happened on that timeline to begin with. Which is confirmed with the beginning of the show where Kurisu reveals she had already met the future Okabe from the end of the show. Which implies your actions with the Actual Time Machine don't shift the worldline at all. So if it follows the rules of closed timelike loops, then it would be physically impossible to actually kill your grandfather in the past to prevent your birth, otherwise you never would've been able to go back and try to kill them. Meaning you can try it, but you will never actually be able to accomplish it. Really, the ending trick for Okabe to reach the Steins Gate worldline through tricking his past self doesn't actually make sense unless Kurisu was never going to die to begin with but everyone (not just Okabe) thought she did. So in the end, to kill your grandfather and prevent your birth, you'd want to use the Phonewave while having the Reading Steiner ability. But again this just means you instantly cease to exist. The other worldlines where you are born will still exist though, those are unaffected by this event (even the one you sent the D-Mail from).
@@Wolfborgg yes I agree, I also think that okabe shouldn't of tricked his past self, that was useless, because if he tried to save kuriusu from the murder instead of faking it, his past self woundt of thought he was in a timeline kuriusu died, which meant him not going back and killing kurisu, and he would also had mayuri alive, that would of been way easier of a solution but oh well
Spoiler Alert: So, the series starts with Steins; Gate ep 1 where Okabe and Daru trying to build a time machine. They send multiple D-mails in the past to check whether their machine is working or not, but each of them comes with a drastic consequence and in the end, Mayuri dies. So, to save her Okabe time leaps again and again but realizes that all timelines converge into the same end result. He figures out that the only thing that can save Mayuri is to undo the D-mails they sent in the past. So, he starts doing it, but the first D-mail he sent was the reason Kurisu being alive. So undoing it will end up in a world without Kurisu. This world line is called the BETA world line. In Steins; Gate 0 we have shown the Beta world line and how Okabe has the guilt of killing Kurisu and always remains depressed. But later, he realizes that Mayuri dies in this world too and WW3 is inevitable... The only way to achieve Steins; Gate is to save both Kurisu and Mayuri and prevent WW3. Okabe time leaps over 3000 times to reach the state where he had a choice of saving Mayuri and Suzuha from the terrorist attack and they manage to escape into the past where Okabe has a choice of trying again to save Kurisu..... Now, we came to ep 23 of Steins; Gate where he again goes to the crime scene and manages to save Kurisu and achieve Steins; Gate. In the movie, it is shown that in Steins; Gate world line Okabe's mind is not stable and shifts from one world to another because of the continuous journey of time traveling he had been through. As a result, he wiped out of the existence in Steins; Gate but everyone around him stays and has some glimpses of him. Kurisu from the future again built a time machine and send Suzuha to convince the present Kurisu to save Okabe from existence. Kurisu went to the past and kissed a young Okabe and introduce him to the concept of mad scientist Hyouin Kyouma, which had a great impact on his life.... In the end, we see Kurisu meeting Okabe in a new timeline and said she is here to take him to the Steins; Gate and he said who is he to decide now... So, we can assume that she managed to save Okabe from wiping out of existence in the Steins; Gate.. Now, if you want to watch this masterpiece follow this order : Steins; Gate (ep 1-22) Steins; Gate ep 23B (which leads us to Steins; Gate 0) Steins; Gate (ep 23-24) Steins; Gate Movie Steins; Gate OVA.... I personally like OVA to be the ending as it has everyone living happily in the Steins; Gate. So, it can be assumed as the ep after the movie....
About the ctc... if a future version of me met me and I just immediately kill myself, does that create a time paradox? Since somehow a version of me in a version of a future still comes back?
Using CTCs creates a loop which must be closed. There is physically nothing you can do to prevent this loop from closing. Essentially if you use a CTC to try to kill yourself in the past or prevent yourself from being born, you can try but it'll never work. Something will always prevent you from doing so. Basically CTCs don't let you actually change events of the worldline at all, your actions in the past through this just always happened. So time paradoxes like that can never happen in the first place through CTCs. It's kind of confusing to explain, but hopefully it makes sense.
I didn't get the gravity affecting time are you trying to say that the time/grid is moving forward but, when gravity is there it just turns slow like its going up a hill then when it gets off the hill/Gravity becomes normal again? Okay so pretty much okabe's conscious is going near a black hole then somehow being in the right location to exit the black hole???? Bruh.
Is it possible to travel to the past to change the future (same timeline no paradox) Planning to create a story where a character has this ability. Stabilization of reality where no paradox exist or whatsoever?
Check out the other Steins;Gate episodes of Anime Science!
PhoneWave: th-cam.com/video/66gogP7wibs/w-d-xo.html
Time Leap Machine: th-cam.com/video/IMkFM6ye4UQ/w-d-xo.html
it is called a RINGularity.
So don’t you die? But another person of the same you. Got the memory which can lead to misunderstanding of worked time machine in theory?..
Truly _outstanding_ analysis. But you missed one crucial element to Steins;Gate time travel theory: attractor fields. Okabe doesn't fail to save Mayuri because he cannot change world lines. Through a combination of D-mails and time leaps he causes several significant world line divergences. However, all these many world lines still converge at the same point: Mayuri's death and the rise of CERN. The way attractors work in physics is they cause trajectories within a dynamic system to evolve conditionally given similar starting conditions. Probably the most famous attractor is the Lorenz attractor, which forms the basis of the "butterfly effect". Nudging the starting coordinates of a particle within a Lorenz system will cause its trajectory to loop back in a predicable manner again and again. But nudge it too far and eventually the trajectory will diverge onto a new, likely unpredictable path. That is what Okabe be needed to do at the end when he caused world lines to diverge over 1%, shifting himself from the Alpha attractor field to the Beta attractor field (the latter containing world lines that converge upon a new point: Kurisu's death and the start of WWIII).
Dude, I'm super excited to see where you go with this series. This is fascinating af, great job
I HAVE AN IDEAAA
Time machines don't go back in the same world line. They open a new one. It's just that whenever we see anyone use the time machine to go back to the past, they either can't change anything significant (so the characters we actually follow don't perceive a change and Reading Steiner isn't activated), or the characters we follow are actually *in* the time machine so we perceive the change with them.
There are no paradoxes or stable time loops in Steins Gate. Even if Suzuha, say, killed Daru in SG0, it wouldn't be a paradox: the Suzuha who killed him was still born, just in the future of the previous world line. It only means that in the current world line, where Daru is dead, Suzuha won't be born again.
In this sense, the world line we perceive in episode 1 isn't the same as the one we perceive in 24. It's an exact replica. The Okabe that we don't see in episode 1 (but who we now know is there) has already gone through what the Okabe we do follow in ep. 1 is about to go through. Same relations between those two in episode 24.
Basically it's not a loop to the same world line, but an infinite continuation: in episode 1, one Okabe sends the d-mail and shifts to the alpha trajectory, while the Okabe who killed Kurisu jumps forward, skips the divergence, and lands in the beta trajectory.
Go through the events of 0 again (that's a whole other explanation) and you eventually arrive in the second half of SG episode 23, where Mayuri slaps Okabe, operation Skuld is relayed to August Okabe and the exact same thing I described in the previous paragraph occurs, only this time, August Okabe jumps forward, skips the divergence, but lands in Steins Gate instead of beta. The Okabe that sent the d-mail and shifted to alpha will go through the show again, eventually ending in Steins Gate as well.
I'd like to know how much of this information you got from sources (game;anime;manga sequels and OVAs). About the 0 events, yes, and future Okabe tells him "the next three weeks will be the most difficult of your life", because he has to relive all the time travel events depicted in the original series, all the deaths of Mayuri again, because to deviate might trigger an unpredictable "Butterfly Effect". But this time he'll know there's a world-line where both Mayuri and Kurisu live, which hopefully makes it bearable. I remember them talking about avoiding paradoxes, perhaps it was in the movie. But the world-lines aren't totally separate. They form "attactor fields" which inter-relate and at times "leak" into one another. Suzuha might be able to kill Daru, but it would have reverberations throughout different world lines, and possibly unpredictably bad effects. At the least, Suzuha would have a chance of disappearing as starts to happen with Okabe in the movie. Some fans don't accept the movie as canon, but I don't think fans have the right to pick and choose like that.
@@squirlmy
Oh wow lmao, this is an old comment😅
So this information isn't official, but it's the result of me watching both Steins;Gate and Zero (without the LN or the movie), and loving the show enough to form in my head a time travel theory that made sense with the events of the story. It's not official in any capacity and you can think what you want of course
Yeah this is what I thought too. I thought Steins;Gate had a linear approach to time travel, meaning there's no loops. If Suzuha killed Daru it wouldn't cause a paradox because that Suzuha comes from another timeline meaning yeah in that timeline Suzuha wouldn't be born but it wouldn't affect the Suzuha from the other timeline. But a problem with that is that during the show they mention multiple times that paradoxes can occur, which was my main gripe with the time-travel system cause it just didn't make sense to me at least in my interpretation of the timeline system.
@@opolo704 Anonymous;Code explained flat out how it works. It does indeed have a linear approach. But for very different reasons. They also make paradoxes impossible.
Absolute brainwaves :) I just love Steins;Gate, it's the best sci-fi piece of a culture ever! And probably the biggest reason, why I love it so much, is that believable, logical and realistic science introduced in that universe! Thanks, you deserve more views!
This is the best one that I have ever seen about the Steins gate. You really deserve more views man and I kind a feel really sad that u didn't get all the appreciation that you deserved.😟
3.987 How underrated this really is
This is so underrated dude. Amazing and really clear work. Congrats
Thanks so much! It takes a lot of work to make these videos so the next one is taking awhile but I'm glad with how they turn out in the ends.
@@Wolfborgg no hurries bro, just do what you can because we can wait for that amazing content!!
basically if a real time machine can really travel you back to the past in the same word lines, it basically means you already did an time loop, meaning really if you decided to use the time travel machine to go back in time, then you already did in the past but you just didn't know it happened only your future self will know
Yep yep, that's exactly right!
@@WolfborggHey, let's say I now have the time machine with these black holes inside and have built a machine that basically ensures that I can travel to a certain time. How am I supposed to control it because I can't create a black hole that takes me exactly to that time, can I?
This deserves way more views.
Steins;Gate truly is one of the most amazing masterpieces I have ever seen. You need to watch it twice and in order to fully understand and appreciate it
You my friend just earned a subscriber! El Psy Congroo
Steins;Gate is the best franchise i’ve ever watched, it made me cried my heart out from both sadness and happiness😭😭
Right? It's soooo good!!
I understanded-ish time travel, black holes, and white holes theories now. Thanks bro!
I like sci-fi anime that is very realistic in terms of scientific accuracy. I think the entire Science Adventure series does this a tad bit while sprinkling some of its really well made stories and horror sci-fi with a bit of scientific realism. If you liked Steins;Gate, you should check out Chaos;Head, Anonymous;Code (which hasn't released yet but you can read the synopsis on Wikipedia), and all the other Science Adventure Team games/anime. Speaking of which, the Steins;Gate visual novel game actually goes into a LOT and I mean A LOT more detail in its concepts of time travel, and you could be sitting there for 15 minutes on an interesting scientific explanation with the song titled "Explanation" playing in the background the whole time, lol.
This is a great video omg
It just made me think back about how I binged the entire two seasons in three days.
I want to do it again now, just for the holiday season c:
The Steins;gate suspensive backgrod music is great
The best sci-fi I ever watched
Are you kiddind that this canal exist? Very good to be real, congratulation for the explanations, than you!
Intro was cool
If you enjoyed this video, be sure to subscribe and check out the next video, which covers the PhoneWave: th-cam.com/video/66gogP7wibs/w-d-xo.html
You earn my subs by just featuring STEINS GATE
4 dislikes are from SERN
Thank you so freaking much for explaining this in an easy to understand way
Im currently making a minecraft SMP called the "leaves from the vine SMP" (LFTV SMP for short)
with a boatload of lore.
Ive split the lore up into chapters, each chapter has storybeats that lead into one another even though each chapter lasts about 1-2 years, currently I'm working on chapters 3 and 4, which will not only have time travel but world line's aswell
For instance, a small streamer who agreed to join my SMP, named Mev Bushwacker, is from a different worldline, a world completely different from the SMP world, so he's travelling through space when him and his mates get sucked into a black hole strangely different from the others theyve seen and thrown into the SMP world into chapter 3
On top of that, one of the characters in the SMP is the goddess of time, so im setting up different versions of the SMP world for her to time travel to and hopefully change something in the future to save everything from immanent doom
Glad this popped up. Now Gotta rewatch the show.
El Psy Kongroo
KONGROO YOU NON INTELLECTUAL, WITH A K DAMNIT!
@@0vomit0 instantly changed it
Thank you king
@@senbonkzakura7991 lmfo your welcome.
El psy kongroo
As an amateur physicist I find this video crazy interesting and inspiring. I've been trying to write out my own explanation to how time travel in steins gate works, and this brought out a few points I was hoping to develop. Thank you :D
also, that whole spiel at the end about mozzarella sticks is... freaky relatable. I live on mozzarella sticks, and that's exactly the kind of way I would describe it to someone hahaha
I'm surprised how you're not a big TH-camr till now! Your video is so good with great explanation.
Great video 🔝 👍
Yes we can! E=21c2 macdougall
I always wondered about that little sentence 'when you bend spacetime...'
I immediately think - bending in what; even more space? You need space to bend something, anything. So the idea of bending space itself naturally raises some questions for me.
bends in and on itself... imagine a cube (3D), then imagine that all sides, angles and lines of it curves inside into the center of mass of it, Thats is the curvature of space created by the mass of the cube itself, gravity is what an observer on the surfarce of the cube will experience (falling and accelerating towards the center of mass of the cube).
time bending is because space and time are relative to each other, meaning that if you curve space and you travel through the curvature you will travel a longer distance than if it wasn´t bend (ie a straight line), as such, time has to run faster to keep relative and compesate for the extra distance you travel in that curved space.
@@chottomatekudasai-kun3887 Thank you. While reading your comments I remember this vagually from a book about Einstein's thought experiments that I've read a long time ago.
you earned a sub. great video
still mind blowing
Wouldn’t time travel using a black hole prevent you from going back before the black hole was created? The way I thought of it was as follows: If you are using the gravitational warping effects of the event horizon to go back, you are dependent on its gravitational field existing in that time to keep going back. Like how for time dilation to occur near a black hole, you have to be in its gravitational field to keep going forward.
You forgot to mention the part in steins;gate how using an electron gun on a kerr black hole rips away the event horizion revealing the singularity. Half of this has already been theorized in science. If a kerr black hole spins faster than it's maximum velocity of .99, it's event horizon will rip away and reveal the singularity. This video talks about spinning black holes. th-cam.com/video/fu3645D4ZlI/w-d-xo.html
Yeah that stuff is a part of what I'm covering in the part 2 video for this topic, which talks about all of the info for how Steins;Gate uses the TV and microwave to do this. Also thanks for the video! Lots of useful info.
Yeah, i was just playing that part in the Steins Gate Elite and i must say science in Steins;Gate is pretty similar to the on in the real world, but the main divergence is the concept of naked singularity. In our world it can't exist because it would break the theory of relativity( Kurisu even says this in the VN). There is a formula to calculate the maximum speed of rotation of the black hole. As its spin increases the radius of event horizon decreases and radius of ring singularity increases. The black hole speed limit is reached when the radius of the event horizon is near or equal to the radius of the ring singularity, which prevents the singularity from becoming revealed or naked. This is my guess but the this maximum speed depends on the mass of the black holes because the radius of the event horizon depends on the mass.
This is not only theoretical but was rather observer on many black holes that spin near their calculated speed limit. (th-cam.com/video/SMrwHnow3hk/w-d-xo.html)
By the way all black holes are spinning black holes and should have ring singularity in them(i say should because we cant never measure nor see further than the event horizon), because all the stars from which these black holes originate have an angular momentum, therefore given the law of conservation of angular momentum it stands to reason that these black holes also rotate. Point singularity never actually forms due to strong centrifugal force of its spin(again this is due to conservation of angular momentum - where the smaller things get the faster they spin and black holes get pretty small).
Of course if some theories like loop quantum gravity are proven correct( i don't know much about this theory though), naked singularity becomes possible in reality.
Naked black holes are awesome.
The problem the event horizon is not a thing there is nothing to rip away.
Great video had fun ✨️🤘
So. Good video, a lot of fun stuff going on but I have one issue with it. A lot of terminology that has nothing to do with eachother was thrown around together.
Example: Wormholes and Ringularities, they have nothing to do with eachother, they are two separate entities and work in two different ways. So far the only known and calculated way to travel in time is by entering the event horizon of a ringularity in a trajectory that misses said ringularity. Causing you to move forwards in time at an extreme rate, or rather, your clock ticking 99.9% slower than the rest of the universe.
I've never heard of any theory regarding two separate event horizons on a Ringularity, and things don't just "Flip" in the universe. I couldn't find anything on that in the sources you cite as well.
Last but not least, things don't just FALL into a black hole, gravity doesn't disappear the moment you enter an event horizon, you can technically orbit the black hole AT the event horizon, you can also enter said event horizon at a specific trajectory (Mentioned above) and exit just fine (Bar anything happening that we don't know within the event horizon).
I would've loved it if you mentioned more about Chaos Theory and the Butterfly Effect that the show heavily relies on as well, they are intrinsic parts of the Time Travel used in steins gate.
9:51
Captions filled in the blank of what ya said
lmao yep, I think I tried to censor myself while recording but that's how I wrote the original script
Friend you're an expert in physics, you so good I think you're from the future🤔
Would you do a video on the Esper abilities/power curriculum program from A Certain Scientific Railgun?
Searching For Accelerator's Power??
Okabe is teenage Rick
And this is how Rick invents the portal gun
You here, are worthy of the Steins;Gate! Fwuhaha! I applaud your efforts as a Mad Scientist for sharing your thoughts on the brilliant theories and *mad* science of Thy Steins;Gate!
underrated video
Dude where is part 2! I need it yesterday
The idea of not being able to change the past with the time machine is just wrong, in the anime concept. Every time you time travel, you end up in a different worldline, though extremely similar. Suzuha in Beta retrieves the IBN 5100 in 1975 and prevents the Y2K in 2000 from happening (stuff that did happen on her worldline). You can make past events go differently so to change worldline and that's what Okabe too eventually does, so I miss your point. He makes Kurisu live and prevents Nakabachi from brining her papers to Russia. But he tricks his past self in a way that his past self can go on to experience all he originally has experienced, thus completing the loop of him saving her and changing worldlines. There will always be the timeline (inactive) where Kurisu dies killed by Okabe, meaning that past cannot be actually changed, but the active worldline can be shifted to one where it doesn't happen, effectively changing the perceived past. Okabe doesn't make it the first time because he doesn't have the resolve, the information, the knowledge he acquires after the event, but if he had them in the first place, he would've succeeded at the first try.
There's a large number of problems that the actual time machine presents, which I'm planning to talk about after my next video focusing on the time leap machine. Like you said, the main thing to understand when we talk about "changing the past" in terms of Steins;Gate is that we just mean to change worldlines, since the worldlines themselves cannot be altered. This means technically speaking none of the time machines actually change the events of a worldline, all they allow for is different modes of shifting through worldlines. While D-Mails can instantly shift worldlines, if he didn't have Okabe's Reading Steiner ability then the D-Mail would not seem to do anything in his perspective since his memories would change with the worldline. However with both the time leap machine and the actual time machine, we aren't changing worldlines but going into the past of the current worldline where we can make changes to it which from that point on make the worldline diverge from where we were before we used the devices. This is why when they use the actual time machine a second time to stop Kurisu's death they don't interact with themselves from when they went back the first time. As the show presents, the time leap machine doesn't allow for big enough changes to significantly change the worldline, such as preventing a death. This is something which apparently the actual time machine can do but only if Okabe tricks his past-self, which is where the logic of the show gets fuzzy.
If in order to solidify this worldline shift then we had to change perception of events that day, sure this would be fine for Okabe being tricked but Kurisu's death would still be in place because Suzuha had brought the time machine to them in the first place because they recognized the events of Kurisu's death resulted in the start of the future war. Meaning the loop wouldn't be fixed with only Okabe being tricked but literally everyone from the future of this worldline as well. They would all have to believe Kurisu had died that day but hadn't really. For awhile I figured the solution to Kurisu's death at the end of the show would imply Kurisu never actually died before all the time travelling started and that she miraculously survives but because Okabe shifts worldlines at the beginning of the show with the D-Mail we never know for sure. However this kind of goes downhill after Okabe makes the choice to undo his D-Mail which saves Kurisu in order to save Mayuri, because after that Suzuha still appears with the actual time machine and says the events of Kurisu's death caused the war.
To clarify, the actual time machine itself has a few things that make it distinct:
1. You can go forward or backwards along the current worldline
2. You aren't bound by your past existence in time
3. You can co-exist at the same time as your past-self
None of these changes necessarily give it more power to shift worldlines than the time leap machine, as both require the user to make changes themselves which would shift the worldline. That means technically speaking there's no real reason the time leap machine couldn't accomplish the same results aside from any issues with how far back you can use it. That implies that the main factor for solidifying the worldline shift is perception of events, since you can't inhabit your past body, change events, and also perceive these new events as the old events. But then again the perception of everyone else involved would also affect it. And also where would the rules of perception end? What if a bug saw the original events of Kurisu's death, would that mean none of this works unless their perspective is changed as well?
The fact that Suzuha says the events of Kurisu's death caused the war is the root of most problems with what happened in the end of Steins;Gate. And the main solution to that I can think of was that she never actually died from that event, although she may have died later while the events of the original day of her death still sparked the war. After all, what really starts the war is Nakabachi stealing Kurisu's time travel papers. But there's another issue with this entirely that doesn't get talked about as much: the metal upa. While we know the real reason the war starts, the papers only survive a plane accident because Kurisu had put Mayuri's metal upa into the envelope before it was stolen. In the final jump back in time, Okabe prevents the war by swapping the metal upa with a different one which will burn with the papers. This singular event, regardless of whether or not Kurisu actually dies, is what saves the lives of millions of people, which vastly alters the worldline and means when they go back Suzuha and the actual time machine will not be there. So technically speaking the actual time machine's existence is a paradox the moment the upas get swapped, since it shouldn't exist anymore, but the show makes it look like all the final changes aren't confirmed until they go back to the future. The logic with that is weird because what stops them from just never going back to the future? But I guess that's detracting from the point, which is that if these changes needs to be solidified through changing perception of events then the perception of everyone affected by those killed in the future war would need to also be changed.
If we assume however that the perception of events recognized by those in the future of a prior worldline don't need to be changed, and only the perception of those while we're in the past changing events up until we use the actual time machine to go into the future, then ideally you would need to change an event, tricking the perceptions of those involved, and then immediately going back to the future to confirm the change. Meaning they could interacting with Kurisu to prevent the war and her death then using the actual time machine to confirm that change before Okabe in the past is supposed to perceive Kurisu dying in the first place. But again you still have the problem of where the idea of perception ends. Does a fly seeing the events ruin everything? What about the perceptions of those you're changing the events of?
The main idea with the actual time machine is that it can travel along the current worldline, allow you to change events, then going to the future of that shifted worldline you just moved to through those new events. Problem is that in the show these time travel events still happen on that previous worldline, as we see at the very beginning where Kurisu has already interacted with future Okabe. If it actually worked, those events would only happen on the new worldline, so Kurisu wouldn't have interacted with future Okabe at the beginning of the story. Which implies the actual time machine works through closed timelike curves, which basically loops events to have always happened on that worldline. Which would mean the ending reveals Kurisu never died in the first place and the war never started, and that if Okabe never sent the D-mail at the beginning nothing would've happened. But as I said, even that idea causes issues with what the show presents.
In the end, the only accurate conclusions I can come to when I think about all this is that Kurisu never died from the incident and the future war never actually starts, and that all the actual time machine did was change the future Okabe's understanding of what could've happened on that day so he'd know to not send the D-mail at the very beginning. Meaning nothing actually changed in the original worldline except for future Okabe's perception of events due to Reading Steiner. The future war starting despite the incident at the conference is likely just a plot hole meant to conclude the story while presenting messages about perception overall, which is fine by me. It's either all that or Okabe's perception loop never meant anything for changing worldlines with the actual time machine and they could've changed it without trying to trick past Okabe but just didn't, probably because of the limited uses they had on the actual time machine at that point. Although the message from Okabe in the far future implies that his past perception was important.
So it's tough to tell but either way the actual time machine has a bunch of logical problems, mostly presented by conflicts with its use in the story. The main benefit of the actual time machine seems to be experiencing events in the past or future of the current worldline, but that it doesn't actually let you change events only fulfill time loops which you would always complete anyways.
Anyways, the actual time machine is a much larger conversation than people think, especially if you take into account info outside of the original Steins;Gate anime. A lot of what I just covered here I'll probably explain better when my video for that gets done but it might be awhile. Hopefully I was able to accurately explain my views on that more, not just for you but for others that have brought up similar concerns. I do intend to talk about them all in the future video.
@@Wolfborgg I don't get your connection to "perception". In the first series, no one's perception except Okabe's matters. The reason why his past perception of Kurisu's death matters, is because the resulting first D-mail is intercepted by SERN. If Kurisu didn't die, SERN wouldn't be alerted that Okabe has a time machine, in fact the contrary, his wrong prediction indicates his D-mails didn't work. The limit of uses of the time machine are important, although one could argue that directly stopping SERN's spying might be more effective, although there might be a higher chance that SERN would figure out such an action.
You might say in that case, the perceptions of SERN members matters, but I'd argue that's only because they themselves are documenting time travel. Would a fly's perception matter?- there's a remote chance that the fly might do something triggering a "Butterfly Effect", but the chances of that are very low. Normally the difference a fly's actions make are negligible, anyways. But consider after the events of Steins;Gate 0, Okabe will have to relive all the time travelling events of the first series, and he will do so as exactly as he can, because of the chance of Butterfly events happening if he doesn't.
One of the fun things, is writing the story itself was like an exercise in time travel. The writer goes back, reviews his writing and then make changes. and this might effect later parts of the story, and the whole plot might be have to be re-written. Time travel serves as a metaphor for story writing, in fact I think it's much better to perceive it that way, than to make comparisons to "scientific" time travel possibilities. And that also happens when writing any fiction; flashbacks and connecting events of past to the present or future, it's not just time travel stories.
@@squirlmy The ending of Steins;Gate to save Kurisu was to "deceive the world" by keeping the perceived events the same as initally experienced but altering the result. As in Okabe originally thought he saw a dead Kurisu. The attractor field where she actually is dead is Beta. The one where she's alive but Mayuri dies is Alpha. And according to the ending of the story itself, the only way to correct this is by creating a new attractor field between the two where he believes Kurisu died but she actually didn't. My point above is how this logic is flawed because Okabe's perception wouldn't actually be the only determining factor of solidifying a change. He's the only one who can notice the changes because of Reading Steiner, but that does not mean only his perception matters, especially when making a change via the Actual Time Machine where the actions done after using it become solidified on the tineline unless overridden by another time machine. If I'm Okabe and I believe that I just have to fool my past self into seeing something and then I can change anything else entirely, then the point of attractor fields as a concept becomes a joke. There wouldn't actually be this worldline-related fate that prevents Kurisu or Mayuri from easily being saved. But according to the story we were presented, that's supposed to be a critical component of the attractor fields. So if you have to "deceive the world" to get it to work, then it would not just be past Okabe they need to convince. According to the story at least. I did a video on attractor fields a few months ago and most of this stuff I think would be far more easier to make changes than the show makes it out to be. Again, it's mostly just rules for a drama plot, which I don't mind.
Also even if Kurisu didn't die, SERN would still have the first D-mail that was sent. In fact they SERN intercepting the D-mail about Kurisu's impending death is what shifts them to Alpha and therefore prevents her from dying. Which was why they needed the IBN to use it to delete it from SERN, which then shifts the worldline by making a change in the present.
@@squirlmy Think of it like this: if you believe Okabe's perception of Kurisu's death only mattered so he would send a D-mail for SERN to intercept, then why did they need to do anything related to Kurisu's death? All they'd have to do is send a D-mail for SERN to intercept. So obviously that's not what the story was trying to go for with that.
I really would love to see part 2 but can't find it, not on your channel and not in the description of this video. Can you link it, pls?
Hey there! Sorry, I actually haven't finished part 2 yet but it's one that I'm close to finishing and looking to upload soon!
@@Wolfborgg That's great to read. Is there any way I can get a notification when it's up?
@@Leto85 It's out now! th-cam.com/video/66gogP7wibs/w-d-xo.html
explained so nicely!
Very cool video, much appreciated.
Just had my first Dr Pepper today...
The Organization is hunting us take care. El Psy Congroo
Stay safe, friend
@@Wolfborgg Stay safe too!
This channel should get more views
This is great. I great investment in Time ha, ha.
Now I forced to subscribe for more since I love Steins Gate
So about your CTC part. You are basically implying the Bootstrap paradox and it works for Okabe, but what about Suzuha? She came to the past using a time machine and changed it in such a way that WW3 doesn't exist and she doesn't have to travel back.... a grandfather paradox. Unlike Okabe, her original past and changed past contradicts each other. So what's the explanation for that? (I have been looking for answer all day)
The only answer I could come with that suzuha came from ww3 and altered the past to prevent ww3 thus resulting in different future where going back to past isn't necessary...
Both the world exist, one with ww3 happening and another with not happening
In fact, there are infinite possibilities therefore infinite worlds.
I think steins gate's worldline system is kind of flawed...
Only solution to a perfect time travel system is existence of infinite universe...
You should see Rick and Morty, there time travel concept is perfect...
Remember before the WW3 crisis, there was the SERN dystopian crisis. I think it's likely some equally bad event might happen that would still motivate her to time travel. Mayuri's death isn't the only key event that cannot be changed, perhaps the time travel itself is inevitable. Also, they are travelling from world line to world line, and the time machine allows Suzuha to live in a separate world line. It even allows a traveller to co-exist with their past self, which is something that never comes up with D-mail consciousness travel. OTOH, Okabe's initial emotional breakdown at the futility of changing the future doesn't make much sense when Suzuha, who has decades more knowledge of how time travel can work, is standing in front of him with a time machine! She's the authority on how it might or might not work, not Okabe. In fact she has Okabe's specific knowledge from his future self when she leaves. How can he deny this?
The actual time machine can be explained like the harry potter prisoner of azkaban movie. Thats exactly how it works
this is amazing
This just proves that gargoyles tv show was even more ahead of its time.
?
The 7 dislike are probably people from CERN
this is a very good channel. dunno why it has less subs.
Why does this not have more views?
EDIT: what happened to part 2?
It's coming! I've been busy and trying really hard to make sure the next parts make sense. I had the script for part 2 done and part 3 started before I got really busy. Now that I've returned to them I'm trying to really edit the part 2 script again so that it's better.
@@Wolfborgg nice! That's good to hear
to sum steins up:
big brain
tutturu
true
so what if i went back in time and i killed my past self? or at least the grandad paradox, if i went to kill my grandfather so then my father wouldn't of existed, so then i wouldn't either. woundt that just change timelines like steins gate, one where my grandad was never killed and another where he was killed and i never lived, meaning that i changed the timeline in the past and when i go to my original timeline, its the one where he didn't die.
In theory, an event like that would just result in a worldline wherein you were never born, yes. Through the lens of Steins;Gate, how this change is perceived depends on which device is used.
If you use the Phonewave to do it and have Okabe's Reading Steiner ability, then you immediately shift into the worldline where you don't exist. If you don't have Reading Steiner, then you won't experience any change but if it worked then the existence of a worldline where your grandfather died early would be confirmed to exist. It wouldn't exactly create that worldline, it's more that it affected the worldline when it was supposed to, since technically infinite worldlines exist, it's just a matter of shifting into them.
The Time Leap Machine wouldn't work for this experiment at all because you'd need to exist at the current time to transfer your memories into your past body.
Meanwhile the Actual Time Machine might be able to accomplish this while not affecting you even without Reading Steiner, but there's actually a lot of problems with the Actual Time Machine which I plan to cover in a future video. Technically it travels along the current worldline, but you can jump anywhere in the past or future along it. But once you arrive, your actions begin to shift you into a different worldline. Ideally your actions shift the worldline, and then you use it to travel back to the future to see the results. However, the show implies with the ending operation that the device is subject to the rules of closed timelike loops. Meaning that your actions with the Actual Time Machine had always happened on that timeline to begin with. Which is confirmed with the beginning of the show where Kurisu reveals she had already met the future Okabe from the end of the show. Which implies your actions with the Actual Time Machine don't shift the worldline at all. So if it follows the rules of closed timelike loops, then it would be physically impossible to actually kill your grandfather in the past to prevent your birth, otherwise you never would've been able to go back and try to kill them. Meaning you can try it, but you will never actually be able to accomplish it. Really, the ending trick for Okabe to reach the Steins Gate worldline through tricking his past self doesn't actually make sense unless Kurisu was never going to die to begin with but everyone (not just Okabe) thought she did.
So in the end, to kill your grandfather and prevent your birth, you'd want to use the Phonewave while having the Reading Steiner ability. But again this just means you instantly cease to exist. The other worldlines where you are born will still exist though, those are unaffected by this event (even the one you sent the D-Mail from).
@@Wolfborgg yes I agree, I also think that okabe shouldn't of tricked his past self, that was useless, because if he tried to save kuriusu from the murder instead of faking it, his past self woundt of thought he was in a timeline kuriusu died, which meant him not going back and killing kurisu, and he would also had mayuri alive, that would of been way easier of a solution but oh well
Girls: Do you think guys talk about us when they are alone?
Boys:
You can be lab member number 012
Spoiler Alert:
So, the series starts with Steins; Gate ep 1 where Okabe and Daru trying to build a time machine. They send multiple D-mails in the past to check whether their machine is working or not, but each of them comes with a drastic consequence and in the end, Mayuri dies. So, to save her Okabe time leaps again and again but realizes that all timelines converge into the same end result. He figures out that the only thing that can save Mayuri is to undo the D-mails they sent in the past. So, he starts doing it, but the first D-mail he sent was the reason Kurisu being alive. So undoing it will end up in a world without Kurisu. This world line is called the BETA world line.
In Steins; Gate 0 we have shown the Beta world line and how Okabe has the guilt of killing Kurisu and always remains depressed. But later, he realizes that Mayuri dies in this world too and WW3 is inevitable...
The only way to achieve Steins; Gate is to save both Kurisu and Mayuri and prevent WW3. Okabe time leaps over 3000 times to reach the state where he had a choice of saving Mayuri and Suzuha from the terrorist attack and they manage to escape into the past where Okabe has a choice of trying again to save Kurisu.....
Now, we came to ep 23 of Steins; Gate where he again goes to the crime scene and manages to save Kurisu and achieve Steins; Gate.
In the movie, it is shown that in Steins; Gate world line Okabe's mind is not stable and shifts from one world to another because of the continuous journey of time traveling he had been through. As a result, he wiped out of the existence in Steins; Gate but everyone around him stays and has some glimpses of him. Kurisu from the future again built a time machine and send Suzuha to convince the present Kurisu to save Okabe from existence. Kurisu went to the past and kissed a young Okabe and introduce him to the concept of mad scientist Hyouin Kyouma, which had a great impact on his life....
In the end, we see Kurisu meeting Okabe in a new timeline and said she is here to take him to the Steins; Gate and he said who is he to decide now...
So, we can assume that she managed to save Okabe from wiping out of existence in the Steins; Gate..
Now, if you want to watch this masterpiece follow this order :
Steins; Gate (ep 1-22)
Steins; Gate ep 23B (which leads us to Steins; Gate 0)
Steins; Gate (ep 23-24)
Steins; Gate Movie
Steins; Gate OVA....
I personally like OVA to be the ending as it has everyone living happily in the Steins; Gate. So, it can be assumed as the ep after the movie....
About the ctc... if a future version of me met me and I just immediately kill myself, does that create a time paradox? Since somehow a version of me in a version of a future still comes back?
Using CTCs creates a loop which must be closed. There is physically nothing you can do to prevent this loop from closing. Essentially if you use a CTC to try to kill yourself in the past or prevent yourself from being born, you can try but it'll never work. Something will always prevent you from doing so. Basically CTCs don't let you actually change events of the worldline at all, your actions in the past through this just always happened. So time paradoxes like that can never happen in the first place through CTCs. It's kind of confusing to explain, but hopefully it makes sense.
Tuturu~!
Tuturu ♥️
12:08 is the funniest part.......sorry
Best anime !!
I didn't get the gravity affecting time are you trying to say that the time/grid is moving forward but,
when gravity is there it just turns slow like its going up a hill then when it gets off the hill/Gravity becomes normal again?
Okay so pretty much okabe's conscious is going near a black hole then somehow being in the right location to exit the black hole????
Bruh.
Is it possible to travel to the past to change the future (same timeline no paradox) Planning to create a story where a character has this ability. Stabilization of reality where no paradox exist or whatsoever?
El psy kongroo
Your explan needs an explan to get it
I subscribed
Good video bruh
Thanks so much, hope you like the next one too!
I’m not intelligent enough to understand this
Interstellar one of the saddest movies ever
OMG I STILL DONT UNDERSTAND
Black holes go brrrrr and data goes through it
Are you like... a theoretical physicist or something?
Nope, just a computer science grad that likes anime and researching stuff
Oh man my head hurts
Me too
Steins;Gate is the best franchise i’ve ever watched, it made me cried my heart out from both sadness and happiness 😭😭